Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:12 AM - mag (cjpilot710@aol.com)
2. 06:51 AM - Re: air show compensation (Ron Davis)
3. 07:06 AM - Re: Air Show Money (Ron Davis)
4. 07:22 AM - Re: air show (Ron Davis)
5. 07:31 AM - Airshow and fly-in attendance fees (John Alber)
6. 09:13 AM - Re: Air Show Money (Rick Basiliere)
Message 1
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--> Yak-List message posted by: cjpilot710@aol.com
Gang,
I need a M-9 Russian magneto. I'd prefer to purchase a very good used one.
Of course I need this ASAP. Please contact me off list or at 386-467-3313.
My fax # is 386-467-3193.
Jim
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little safety,
deserve neither liberty nor safety"
Benjamin Franklin 1759
"With my shield, or on it"
Trojan Warriors BC
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: e: Yak-List:air show compensation |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" <l39parts@hotmail.com>
There was never, that I know of, any such regulation. You can not carry
persons or property for hire, but that is different than charging people to
watch you fly. Virtually all airshow acts are in experimental planes.
>From: "Mike Plecenik" <nanchang@zipnet.us>
>Reply-To: yak-list@matronics.com
>To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Yak-List:air show compensation
>Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:07:39 -0600
>
>--> Yak-List message posted by: "Mike Plecenik" <nanchang@zipnet.us>
>
>Whatever happened to the FAA reg. about Experimental aircraft not being
>allowed to be used in any commercial endeavor nor allowed compensation for
>use of that aircraft.? Has it been superceded? I need to know what you
>know.
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Air Show Money |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" <l39parts@hotmail.com>
The reg doesn't say anything about "needing" a chute. If you sit on it
("have it available for use") it has to be a TSO'd chute, have a card, and
be in date.
91.307 Parachutes and parachuting.
(a) No pilot of a civil aircraft may allow a parachute that is available for
emergency use to be carried in that aircraft unless it is an approved type
and --
(1) If a chair type (canopy in back), it has been packed by a certificated
and appropriately rated parachute rigger within the preceding 120 days; or
(2) If any other type, it has been packed by a certificated and
appropriately rated parachute rigger --
(i) Within the preceding 120 days...
>From: cpayne@mc.net
>Reply-To: yak-list@matronics.com
>To: yak-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Yak-List: Air Show Money
>Date: Wed Feb 26 10:39:03 2003
>
>--> Yak-List message posted by: cpayne@mc.net
>
>I have noticed an airshow trend in the last few years in the area where I
>live: cash compensation for ancillary players, as in
>those not covered under contract for a performance. Other trend consists of
>all fuel being billed to a single account, lunch
>and dinner tickets/buttons handed out to key volunteers, performers, and
>guests rather than being logged on a "list" for
>the FAA.
>
>Another trend, and a negative one, is the local FSDO maintenance guys want
>all kinds of paperwork on the aircraft,
>including details that have no relevance for a static display. One of our
>'listers got busted for his parachute being out
>of pack date....even though he had no actual need for a 'chute, as he was
>NOT flying formation or aerobatics. More
>than one pilot has walked away from briefings when this stuff started.
>
>My compensation? Don't ask and I won't tell.
>
>Craig Payne
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: e: Yak-List:air show |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" <l39parts@hotmail.com>
This is very interesting. Does that meanthat in the FAA's eyes the aircraft
in a museum that charges admission have to have airworthiness certificates,
annual inspections, and be owned by commercial/ATP with a current medical?
>From: AirshowPilot1@aol.com
>Reply-To: yak-list@matronics.com
>To: yak-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Yak-List:air show
>Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 15:34:07 -0500
>
>--> Yak-List message posted by: AirshowPilot1@aol.com
>
>As a professional air show performer (and attorney licensed in Georgia and
>Ohio)in a YAK-55M, it is perfectly fine to charge for the presence of your
>aircraft - static or performance based provided you have a commercial
>license. Your aircraft limitations should only proscribe passenger,
>freight carrying, banner towing etc - there is an "exception" for carrying
>media in experimental aircraft but even there, the gas must be paid for out
>of your own pocket. If you charge for static display you are in fact
>engaging in a commercial activity "for compensation or hire" and this
>extends to ereceiving a free room. I worked on this issue several years
>ago with the air show industry and the FAA, I have represented several
>pilots caught in this jam with the FAA. Will you get caught - maybe - but
>the real question should be is this a prohibited practice - not will I get
>caught at it. If you do not hold a commercial (or ATP) with appropriate
>medical (Class II to exercise the privile!
>ges of a commercial pilot - class I for ATP privileges) you in fact run the
>risk of certificate action by the FAA if you accept compensation (free gas,
>hotel room and certainly money) for displaying your aircraft. Having been
>inspected by hundreds of different FAA inspectors at air show sites
>throughout the U.S. I can also tell you that there are certain inspectors
>who walk around the static display area and casually ask to see your
>license - if it said private - I have watched them go to the show producer
>and find out what the financial arrangements were for the static. What
>happened to the pilts I do not know but they were not there the next year
>on display . . . .
>
>Walt Addison Linscott
>Paramount Aerobatics
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Airshow and fly-in attendance fees |
--> Yak-List message posted by: John Alber <john@johnalber.com>
I want to second Ron's point and add some reality to all this talk of attendance
fees for static displays of Yaks and CJs. We run an event much like Ron's, the
AIRstravaganza at GRE in Illinois, the first weekend in October every year.
We get very little funding and don't charge a gate admission. Our aim is to promote
aviation, not make money. If we break even, we are THRILLED.
So talk of $500 attendance fees is, at least in our context, not realistic. We
can afford to pay fees to some marquis aircraft--for example, last year we had
a passenger carrying DC-3 from the Prairie Aviation Museum (we try to offer the
public as many ways to get in the air as possible). We paid for that, and for
a passenger-carrying Beech 18 and for some others. We also offer some breaks
on fuel and I've been known to spring for lunch myself. But that's about it.
I know something of the finances of some bigger airshows around here as well, and
they too just don't have the money to pay appearance fees for Yaks, CJs, L-19s,
L-4s, and all the other wonderful warbirds that add hugely to such events.
It's just not possible.
I'm sure the people talking about bigger fees have some factual basis for their
assertions, but based on my experience, most events in our area are too thinly
capitalized to offer much, if anything.
By the way, if you care to migrate to GRE the first weekend in October, we'd love
to have you. It's a fun event and you can fly in some very interesting aircraft
and see lots of cool cars (we also have a car show). We'll lighten the fuel
cost and I'll pick up lunch and dinner for YPA members.
John Alber
Time: 11:05:42 PM PST US
From: jackron@att.net
Subject: Re: Yak-List:air show compensation
--> Yak-List message posted by: jackron@att.net
Mike,
Again, you paint with too wide a brush. I admit I don't know how they
do it in
Ohio, or anywhere else for that matter, but I can tell you that not all
airshows are big business. Every two years we put on an airshow here
in
Juneau. There are about 15 of us that work our tails off, without any
compansation. We have raffles, accept donations from local hotels,
rental
cars, etc. We don't pay anybody anything. We give them a room, a car
and some
gas. We had over 100 airplanes at our last show including the
Snowbirds. We
had t-28s, T-6s, A military Goose, a AN-2, my CJ, etc, etc. Everybody
had a
great time. It's not always about money. There are some great prople
in the
warbird community, and the aviation community as a whole. Most of them
are
generous to a fault, thank goodness!!
Ron Swanson
--
John Alber
john@johnalber.com
Home 618-675-3553
Work 314-259-2144
Message 6
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Rick Basiliere" <discrab@earthlink.net>
Folks, Read on to 91.307(c) the IAC has always interpreted this to mean
that if you are solo and you wish to do aerobatics -you- the "crew" doesn't
even need to wear or have a 'chute. Not smart, for sure, but legal. Gosh
even when I x/c I'm strapped in it. Respectfully, Rick
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ron Davis
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air Show Money
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" <l39parts@hotmail.com>
The reg doesn't say anything about "needing" a chute. If you sit on it
("have it available for use") it has to be a TSO'd chute, have a card, and
be in date.
91.307 Parachutes and parachuting.
(a) No pilot of a civil aircraft may allow a parachute that is available for
emergency use to be carried in that aircraft unless it is an approved type
and --
(1) If a chair type (canopy in back), it has been packed by a certificated
and appropriately rated parachute rigger within the preceding 120 days; or
(2) If any other type, it has been packed by a certificated and
appropriately rated parachute rigger --
(i) Within the preceding 120 days...
>From: cpayne@mc.net
>Reply-To: yak-list@matronics.com
>To: yak-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Yak-List: Air Show Money
>Date: Wed Feb 26 10:39:03 2003
>
>--> Yak-List message posted by: cpayne@mc.net
>
>I have noticed an airshow trend in the last few years in the area where I
>live: cash compensation for ancillary players, as in
>those not covered under contract for a performance. Other trend consists of
>all fuel being billed to a single account, lunch
>and dinner tickets/buttons handed out to key volunteers, performers, and
>guests rather than being logged on a "list" for
>the FAA.
>
>Another trend, and a negative one, is the local FSDO maintenance guys want
>all kinds of paperwork on the aircraft,
>including details that have no relevance for a static display. One of our
>'listers got busted for his parachute being out
>of pack date....even though he had no actual need for a 'chute, as he was
>NOT flying formation or aerobatics. More
>than one pilot has walked away from briefings when this stuff started.
>
>My compensation? Don't ask and I won't tell.
>
>Craig Payne
>
>
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