Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:03 AM - YAK 52 Compass (Aubrey Price)
2. 04:34 AM - Re: YAK 52 Compass (Gus Fraser)
3. 05:05 AM - Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. (A. Dennis Savarese)
4. 05:41 AM - Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. (Frank Haertlein)
5. 05:57 AM - Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. (A. Dennis Savarese)
6. 07:20 AM - Re: YAK 52 Compass (KevLCo@aol.com)
7. 08:29 AM - Team Red (Barry Hancock)
8. 08:34 AM - There are TWO crazies amongst us??? (Barry Hancock)
9. 08:50 AM - Re: YAK 52 Compass (D Zeman)
10. 10:34 AM - Re: Re: YAK 52 Compass (Boyd Braem)
11. 11:07 AM - Compass Fluid (jay reiter)
12. 11:32 AM - Re: Compass Fluid (Doug Sapp)
13. 11:53 AM - Re: Re: YAK 52 Compass (Jorgen Nielsen @ Mweb)
14. 11:58 AM - Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. (Jorgen Nielsen @ Mweb)
15. 01:19 PM - Re: Batteries (was: Alternators for the M14P) (Ron Davis)
16. 01:59 PM - Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. (Doug Sapp)
17. 02:19 PM - Re: Compass Fluid (Jim Ivey)
18. 02:52 PM - Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. (jay reiter)
19. 03:44 PM - Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. (Gus Fraser)
20. 04:20 PM - Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. (Jim Duffy)
21. 07:55 PM - Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. (Walt Lannon)
22. 08:06 PM - Re: Alternators for the M14P (Brian Lloyd)
23. 08:07 PM - Re:batteries (Brian Lloyd)
Message 1
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--> Yak-List message posted by: Aubrey Price <aprice@vartec.net>
Does anyone know of a compass that will replace the existing YAK52 compass.
Mine is bad, but even a new one wouldn't be my first choice.
Message 2
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
I take it you mean the mag compass ? I replaced mine as I fitted my angle of
attack indicator in the standard location. I moved the compass location to
the peak of the front canopy section on a bracket I fabricated.
Gus
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Aubrey Price
Subject: Yak-List: YAK 52 Compass
--> Yak-List message posted by: Aubrey Price <aprice@vartec.net>
Does anyone know of a compass that will replace the existing YAK52 compass.
Mine is bad, but even a new one wouldn't be my first choice.
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Just curious Bruce who you bought the airplane from? Although they are not
in Northern CA, Carl or Jill Hays in San Diego are a good bet to get it
fixed. 858-292-7222 is their telephone number.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Campbell" <baruch@intelligentflight.com>
Subject: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bruce Campbell"
<baruch@intelligentflight.com>
>
> I had to leave my YAK 52 in CIC during its ferry flight from HWD to
> Arlington, WA. I live in WA.
>
> The prop started surging badly. No problem with oil press according to the
> gauges. But the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the run way
> (*very* careful power application, BTW).
>
> Does anyone know anyone local to Northern California that I could
coordinate
> with to get this thing flying again?
>
> Bruce Campbell
> Yak 52 N82623
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> >
> > I have a stock 52 electrical system. I do have some 12V devices I use a
> > voltage converter which I got from aircraft spruce it is good for 4 amps
> > which is good for most small appliances, cameras etc. If you need more
> than
> > that then get an ex military one they are about 200 bucks used.
> >
> > Gus
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of N13472@aol.com
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
> >
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
> >
> > For a home built / experimental I would defiantly go with a 24 Vdc
system.
> > The
> > savings in weight / cost due to the smaller wire size is worth the
effort.
> > But the
> > main reason is cost of used avionics, stobes, pumps, etc. As most home
> > builder
> > use 12 Vdc systems the demand for 24 Vdc equip is low, check the prices
at
> > the
> > salvage yards.
> >
> > Tom Elliott
> > N63727
> >
> >
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Frank Haertlein" <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
Bruce;
Have whatever mechanic you get check the tightness if all intake
fittings including the carburetor. It may be as simple as needing to
tighten things up.
Frank
N9110M
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Campbell
Subject: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Bruce Campbell"
--> <baruch@intelligentflight.com>
I had to leave my YAK 52 in CIC during its ferry flight from HWD to
Arlington, WA. I live in WA.
The prop started surging badly. No problem with oil press according to
the gauges. But the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the run
way
(*very* careful power application, BTW).
Does anyone know anyone local to Northern California that I could
coordinate with to get this thing flying again?
Bruce Campbell
Yak 52 N82623
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
>
> I have a stock 52 electrical system. I do have some 12V devices I use
> a voltage converter which I got from aircraft spruce it is good for 4
> amps which is good for most small appliances, cameras etc. If you need
> more
than
> that then get an ex military one they are about 200 bucks used.
>
> Gus
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> N13472@aol.com
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
>
> For a home built / experimental I would defiantly go with a 24 Vdc
> system. The savings in weight / cost due to the smaller wire size is
> worth the effort. But the
> main reason is cost of used avionics, stobes, pumps, etc. As most home
> builder
> use 12 Vdc systems the demand for 24 Vdc equip is low, check the
prices at
> the
> salvage yards.
>
> Tom Elliott
> N63727
>
>
=
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Prop surging (..."the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the
runway") is changes in prop pitch and is typically not caused by intake
leaks Frank. With good oil pressure as Bruce states, I'd suggest the prop
governor first.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank Haertlein" <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Frank Haertlein"
<yak52driver@earthlink.net>
>
> Bruce;
> Have whatever mechanic you get check the tightness if all intake
> fittings including the carburetor. It may be as simple as needing to
> tighten things up.
> Frank
> N9110M
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Campbell
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bruce Campbell"
> --> <baruch@intelligentflight.com>
>
> I had to leave my YAK 52 in CIC during its ferry flight from HWD to
> Arlington, WA. I live in WA.
>
> The prop started surging badly. No problem with oil press according to
> the gauges. But the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the run
> way
> (*very* careful power application, BTW).
>
> Does anyone know anyone local to Northern California that I could
> coordinate with to get this thing flying again?
>
> Bruce Campbell
> Yak 52 N82623
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> >
> > I have a stock 52 electrical system. I do have some 12V devices I use
> > a voltage converter which I got from aircraft spruce it is good for 4
> > amps which is good for most small appliances, cameras etc. If you need
>
> > more
> than
> > that then get an ex military one they are about 200 bucks used.
> >
> > Gus
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> > N13472@aol.com
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
> >
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
> >
> > For a home built / experimental I would defiantly go with a 24 Vdc
> > system. The savings in weight / cost due to the smaller wire size is
> > worth the effort. But the
> > main reason is cost of used avionics, stobes, pumps, etc. As most home
> > builder
> > use 12 Vdc systems the demand for 24 Vdc equip is low, check the
> prices at
> > the
> > salvage yards.
> >
> > Tom Elliott
> > N63727
> >
> >
>
>
> > ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: YAK 52 Compass |
--> Yak-List message posted by: KevLCo@aol.com
I haven't messed with mine, how do they go "bad"? Does it need swung, or do
the magnets go dead? I've heard they go bad, just not why.
Kevin
Las Vegas
Message 7
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--> Yak-List message posted by: Barry Hancock <radialpower@cox.net>
On Tuesday, November 11, 2003, at 11:58 PM, Yak-List Digest Server wrote:
> Congradulations to Team Red (Bob Watts, Terry Calloway,
> Roger Modglin) for an article on them in Nov. Pacific Flyer.
> Good exposure for RPA type aircraft.
>
> Craig Payne
And just imagine the exposure they will get when they perform at All Red
Star next May! TC, this is your informal invitation.... :)
Barry Hancock
Director of Operations
Red Stars, Inc.
949.300.5510
www.allredstar.com
"Communism - Lousy Politics, Great Airplanes"
Message 8
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| Subject: | There are TWO crazies amongst us??? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Barry Hancock <radialpower@cox.net>
On Tuesday, November 11, 2003, at 11:58 PM, Bruce Campbell wrote:
> My YAK and my Commander both use 24V.
Just when I thought I had the corner on the Ted
Smith/Pinko-commie-rat-bastard airplane design combination!
Barry Hancock
Director of Operations
Red Stars, Inc.
949.300.5510
www.allredstar.com
"Communism - Lousy Politics, Great Airplanes"
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: YAK 52 Compass |
--> Yak-List message posted by: D Zeman <curious_wings@yahoo.com>
If you are talking about the whiskey compass; one of
mine eventually leaked away the fluid. Remove compass
and open the back cover (two holes that tips of
needle-nose pliers will fit into and screw out).
Replace the o-ring (hardware store) and fill as much
as you can before replacing back cover. Install back
cover with new o-ring and then you will have to slowly
fill with a syringe through the special screw hole in
the back cover.
Cheers,
Z
__________________________________
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: YAK 52 Compass |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Boyd Braem <bcbraem@comcast.net>
What kind of whiskey did you use to fill it? Does it matter?
I think the original question concerned a remote compass and the flood
gate detector in the tail--be careful when you irrigate.
Boyd.
do not archive
On Wednesday, November 12, 2003, at 11:50 AM, D Zeman wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: D Zeman <curious_wings@yahoo.com>
>
> If you are talking about the whiskey compass; one of
> mine eventually leaked away the fluid. Remove compass
> and open the back cover (two holes that tips of
> needle-nose pliers will fit into and screw out).
> Replace the o-ring (hardware store) and fill as much
> as you can before replacing back cover. Install back
> cover with new o-ring and then you will have to slowly
> fill with a syringe through the special screw hole in
> the back cover.
>
> Cheers,
> Z
>
> __________________________________
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Message 11
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "jay reiter" <jmreiter@adelphia.net>
The compass fluid we used at TWA was a refined kerosene type fluid. If the fluid
is not correct it will cloud up or damage the lettering on the rotor. I do not
know if that type is correct for these aircraft.
Message 12
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Doug Sapp" <rvfltd@televar.com>
Guys, It's called white kerosene. Most any instrument shop has it.
Suppose you could use white lightning too but it would most likely eat the
numbers off the compass, just think of what it does to your
guts.............pass the jug Clem!
"Still" Yakin in the back woods,
Doug Sapp
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of jay reiter
Subject: Yak-List: Compass Fluid
--> Yak-List message posted by: "jay reiter" <jmreiter@adelphia.net>
The compass fluid we used at TWA was a refined kerosene type fluid. If the
fluid is not correct it will cloud up or damage the lettering on the rotor.
I do not know if that type is correct for these aircraft.
Message 13
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| From: | "Jorgen Nielsen @ Mweb" <jorgen.nielsen@mweb.co.za> |
| Subject: | Re: YAK 52 Compass |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jorgen Nielsen @ Mweb" <jorgen.nielsen@mweb.co.za>
I have 17yr single malt thash gooood foorrr alll dishicultf prooblemsh...
Sorry, couldn't resist!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Boyd Braem
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: YAK 52 Compass
--> Yak-List message posted by: Boyd Braem <bcbraem@comcast.net>
What kind of whiskey did you use to fill it? Does it matter?
I think the original question concerned a remote compass and the flood
gate detector in the tail--be careful when you irrigate.
Boyd.
do not archive
On Wednesday, November 12, 2003, at 11:50 AM, D Zeman wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: D Zeman <curious_wings@yahoo.com>
>
> If you are talking about the whiskey compass; one of
> mine eventually leaked away the fluid. Remove compass
> and open the back cover (two holes that tips of
> needle-nose pliers will fit into and screw out).
> Replace the o-ring (hardware store) and fill as much
> as you can before replacing back cover. Install back
> cover with new o-ring and then you will have to slowly
> fill with a syringe through the special screw hole in
> the back cover.
>
> Cheers,
> Z
>
> __________________________________
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Message 14
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| From: | "Jorgen Nielsen @ Mweb" <jorgen.nielsen@mweb.co.za> |
| Subject: | Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jorgen Nielsen @ Mweb" <jorgen.nielsen@mweb.co.za>
Does the governopr run on "normal" oil pressure or is there a separate pump?
I recently dropped oil pressure (one of those minor Oh Sh.. moments when you
have the choice of landing off airport & wrecking the plane (maybe) but
saving the motor (maybe) or heading for nearest rwy, saving the plane
(maybe) but wrecking the engine (maybe)) and was told after that the
governor has a separate pump.
Jorgen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of A. Dennis
Savarese
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Prop surging (..."the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the
runway") is changes in prop pitch and is typically not caused by intake
leaks Frank. With good oil pressure as Bruce states, I'd suggest the prop
governor first.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank Haertlein" <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Frank Haertlein"
<yak52driver@earthlink.net>
>
> Bruce;
> Have whatever mechanic you get check the tightness if all intake
> fittings including the carburetor. It may be as simple as needing to
> tighten things up.
> Frank
> N9110M
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Campbell
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bruce Campbell"
> --> <baruch@intelligentflight.com>
>
> I had to leave my YAK 52 in CIC during its ferry flight from HWD to
> Arlington, WA. I live in WA.
>
> The prop started surging badly. No problem with oil press according to
> the gauges. But the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the run
> way
> (*very* careful power application, BTW).
>
> Does anyone know anyone local to Northern California that I could
> coordinate with to get this thing flying again?
>
> Bruce Campbell
> Yak 52 N82623
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> >
> > I have a stock 52 electrical system. I do have some 12V devices I use
> > a voltage converter which I got from aircraft spruce it is good for 4
> > amps which is good for most small appliances, cameras etc. If you need
>
> > more
> than
> > that then get an ex military one they are about 200 bucks used.
> >
> > Gus
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> > N13472@aol.com
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
> >
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
> >
> > For a home built / experimental I would defiantly go with a 24 Vdc
> > system. The savings in weight / cost due to the smaller wire size is
> > worth the effort. But the
> > main reason is cost of used avionics, stobes, pumps, etc. As most home
> > builder
> > use 12 Vdc systems the demand for 24 Vdc equip is low, check the
> prices at
> > the
> > salvage yards.
> >
> > Tom Elliott
> > N63727
> >
> >
>
>
> > ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Batteries (was: Alternators for the M14P) |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" <l39parts@hotmail.com>
A MiG 15 takes over 800 amps (24 volts) for about 30 seconds. Two Optima
batteries in series will start it at least twice without any charging..
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ernie" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Batteries (was: Alternators for the M14P)
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernie" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
>
> An L-29, has an electric starter which requires 200 AMPS @24V for the
first
> 5 seconds then 400 AMPS for an additional 8-12 seconds.
>
> Ernie
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ron Davis" <l39parts@hotmail.com>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Batteries (was: Alternators for the M14P)
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" <l39parts@hotmail.com>
> >
> > Keep in mind that many turbine planes (L-39 and Boeing 737, to name two)
> > spin the turbine with an air motor instead of an electric one. They
take
> > little battery capacity for starting, like the CJ, and the battery needs
> to
> > be sized for reserve power. Both of the above have multiple generators,
> so
> > even that isn't a huge concern.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Brian Lloyd" <brian@lloyd.com>
> > To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Yak-List: Batteries (was: Alternators for the M14P)
> >
> >
> > > --> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
> > >
> > > Ernie wrote:
> > >
> > > > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernie" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
> > > >
> > > > I found out what you meant first hand this weekend while flying a a
> > local
> > > > airshow. My L-29 has 2 new 650 CCA Die Hards which on a good day
will
> > start
> > > > me at around 690 Degrees EGT. While my buddy this weekend using the
> > Hawkers
> > > > consistently started some where around 560 degrees. I'm sold, just
> > waiting
> > > > for a battery box.
> > >
> > > Turbine engines need a *LOT* of current and need to keep the voltage
> high
> > to get the compressor RPM high enough to avoid a hot start. This means
> you
> > need batteries with very low internal resistance so the voltage doesn't
> drop
> > while spooling up the gas generator shaft. The original battery to have
> > this kind of low resistance was NiCd but they are expensive and come
with
> > their own set of problems. AGM (absorbed glass mat) batteries,
especially
> > the newer ones with spiral-wound foil plates (they are cylindrical) have
> > very low internal resistance and will produce huge amounts of current
> while
> > still keeping the voltage up, just the ticket for starting turbine
> engines.
> > >
> > > Standard flooded-cell (wet) type batteries do not have low internal
> > resistance unless you make them big so they would not be the best choice
> for
> > starting turbine engines.
> > >
> > > OTOH, battery capacity (total energy storage) depends on just how much
> > lead and electrolyte you have. If you want the battery to provide power
> for
> > a long time after the generator has failed you need a bigger battery.
> > >
> > > The Yak-52 and CJ do not need much starting current since the
compressed
> > air system does the work. OTOH these are all-electric airplanes and if
> you
> > want things to keep running you need a lot of battery capacity.
Frankly,
> > gelled electrolyte batteries (gel-cells) are ideal for these aircraft.
> The
> > turbine-powered aircraft should not consider using anything except AGM
> > batteries.
> > >
> > > The only issue with using any sealed battery, gel or AGM, is that you
> must
> > be careful to charge them properly. They will quickly die if they are
> > overcharged. Hot weather or a hot battery will lead to overcharging and
> > early battery death. This could be a real problem for our
turbine-powered
> > brethren. Conversely a cold battery will never be fully charged which
> will
> > also damage the battery in the long run. Flooded-cell batteries are
much
> > more resistant to damage from overcharging because you can add water to
> > them. (And if you find you have to add water every couple of weeks or
so,
> > that means you are definitely overcharging.) Charging voltage needs to
be
> > adjusted downward when it is hot and upward when it is cold. That is
why
> > the B&C alternator controller/regulator has a temperature compensation
> > option. It automatically adjusts the charging voltage to meet the needs
> of
> > the battery ensuring a full charge without overcharging.
> > >
> > > I have done a lot of battery research for my boat and for the back-up
> > electrical system in my Comanche. (Electrical system failure while doing
> > hard IFR tends to bother me.) I will be happy to share more info if
> people
> > are interested.
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite
201
> > > brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
> > > +1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
> > > GMT-4
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Doug Sapp" <rvfltd@televar.com>
>>was told after that the governor has a separate pump.
You were lied to, they live off he same pump.
Doug Sapp
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jorgen Nielsen
@ Mweb
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jorgen Nielsen @ Mweb"
<jorgen.nielsen@mweb.co.za>
Does the governopr run on "normal" oil pressure or is there a separate pump?
I recently dropped oil pressure (one of those minor Oh Sh.. moments when you
have the choice of landing off airport & wrecking the plane (maybe) but
saving the motor (maybe) or heading for nearest rwy, saving the plane
(maybe) but wrecking the engine (maybe)) and was told after that the
governor has a separate pump.
Jorgen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of A. Dennis
Savarese
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Prop surging (..."the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the
runway") is changes in prop pitch and is typically not caused by intake
leaks Frank. With good oil pressure as Bruce states, I'd suggest the prop
governor first.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank Haertlein" <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Frank Haertlein"
<yak52driver@earthlink.net>
>
> Bruce;
> Have whatever mechanic you get check the tightness if all intake
> fittings including the carburetor. It may be as simple as needing to
> tighten things up.
> Frank
> N9110M
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Campbell
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bruce Campbell"
> --> <baruch@intelligentflight.com>
>
> I had to leave my YAK 52 in CIC during its ferry flight from HWD to
> Arlington, WA. I live in WA.
>
> The prop started surging badly. No problem with oil press according to
> the gauges. But the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the run
> way
> (*very* careful power application, BTW).
>
> Does anyone know anyone local to Northern California that I could
> coordinate with to get this thing flying again?
>
> Bruce Campbell
> Yak 52 N82623
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> >
> > I have a stock 52 electrical system. I do have some 12V devices I use
> > a voltage converter which I got from aircraft spruce it is good for 4
> > amps which is good for most small appliances, cameras etc. If you need
>
> > more
> than
> > that then get an ex military one they are about 200 bucks used.
> >
> > Gus
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> > N13472@aol.com
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
> >
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
> >
> > For a home built / experimental I would defiantly go with a 24 Vdc
> > system. The savings in weight / cost due to the smaller wire size is
> > worth the effort. But the
> > main reason is cost of used avionics, stobes, pumps, etc. As most home
> > builder
> > use 12 Vdc systems the demand for 24 Vdc equip is low, check the
> prices at
> > the
> > salvage yards.
> >
> > Tom Elliott
> > N63727
> >
> >
>
>
> > ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
Message 17
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|
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jim Ivey" <jim@jimivey.com>
Always used unscented lamp oil like you find in the plastic jug at Wal Mart.
It is basically the same think as white kerosene. I always fill a large
open container (bowl, pitcher etc...) with the fluid and fully submerse the
compass, rocking it back and forth to remove all air bubbles. I then insert
the plug while still submersed in the fluid. Works pretty good and no
bubble at the top of the compass when you're done.
If you fly the tropics much you could use the citronella-scented oil to try
and keep the 'skeeters away.
The new SIRS series compasses that are now available use a silicon-based
fluid that dampens much better than kerosene. Don't know what the specs are
on the fluid but the SIRS compass I put in my Comanche is as solid as a DG
and has no deviation whatsoever. There is a no-maintenance guarantee on
them too. I will replace all traditional compasses with an SIRS the next
time each needs rebuilding. It's about time somebody brought the 50-year
old compass designs into the modern realm.
Jim
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jay reiter
> Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2003 12:07 PM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Compass Fluid
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "jay reiter" <jmreiter@adelphia.net>
>
> The compass fluid we used at TWA was a refined kerosene type
> fluid. If the fluid is not correct it will cloud up or damage
> the lettering on the rotor. I do not know if that type is
> correct for these aircraft.
>
>
> ===========
> ============
> Matronics Forums.
> ============
> ============
> ============
>
>
>
>
>
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "jay reiter" <jmreiter@adelphia.net>
Remember the governor is a pump and a control valve supplying boosted oil
pressure to control the prop. That could be confusing with out a full
explanation.
Message 19
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| Subject: | Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
I agree check that the governor adjustment screw is tight it is one of the
things that is not wire locked. Could also be the seals in the prop that are
leaking. If you want to inspect these then get back to the list for the
removal procedure as it is real easy to damage the oil snout.
Gus
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of A. Dennis
Savarese
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Prop surging (..."the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the
runway") is changes in prop pitch and is typically not caused by intake
leaks Frank. With good oil pressure as Bruce states, I'd suggest the prop
governor first.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank Haertlein" <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Frank Haertlein"
<yak52driver@earthlink.net>
>
> Bruce;
> Have whatever mechanic you get check the tightness if all intake
> fittings including the carburetor. It may be as simple as needing to
> tighten things up.
> Frank
> N9110M
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Campbell
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bruce Campbell"
> --> <baruch@intelligentflight.com>
>
> I had to leave my YAK 52 in CIC during its ferry flight from HWD to
> Arlington, WA. I live in WA.
>
> The prop started surging badly. No problem with oil press according to
> the gauges. But the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the run
> way
> (*very* careful power application, BTW).
>
> Does anyone know anyone local to Northern California that I could
> coordinate with to get this thing flying again?
>
> Bruce Campbell
> Yak 52 N82623
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> >
> > I have a stock 52 electrical system. I do have some 12V devices I use
> > a voltage converter which I got from aircraft spruce it is good for 4
> > amps which is good for most small appliances, cameras etc. If you need
>
> > more
> than
> > that then get an ex military one they are about 200 bucks used.
> >
> > Gus
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> > N13472@aol.com
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
> >
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
> >
> > For a home built / experimental I would defiantly go with a 24 Vdc
> > system. The savings in weight / cost due to the smaller wire size is
> > worth the effort. But the
> > main reason is cost of used avionics, stobes, pumps, etc. As most home
> > builder
> > use 12 Vdc systems the demand for 24 Vdc equip is low, check the
> prices at
> > the
> > salvage yards.
> >
> > Tom Elliott
> > N63727
> >
> >
>
>
> > ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jim Duffy" <jduffy@webpipe.net>
I would have them check the prop governor screen on the right front of the
engine it is easy to get to and easy to take out and clean in some solvent,
if clogged it will cause this. Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Campbell" <baruch@intelligentflight.com>
Subject: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bruce Campbell"
<baruch@intelligentflight.com>
>
> I had to leave my YAK 52 in CIC during its ferry flight from HWD to
> Arlington, WA. I live in WA.
>
> The prop started surging badly. No problem with oil press according to the
> gauges. But the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the run way
> (*very* careful power application, BTW).
>
> Does anyone know anyone local to Northern California that I could
coordinate
> with to get this thing flying again?
>
> Bruce Campbell
> Yak 52 N82623
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> >
> > I have a stock 52 electrical system. I do have some 12V devices I use a
> > voltage converter which I got from aircraft spruce it is good for 4 amps
> > which is good for most small appliances, cameras etc. If you need more
> than
> > that then get an ex military one they are about 200 bucks used.
> >
> > Gus
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of N13472@aol.com
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
> >
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
> >
> > For a home built / experimental I would defiantly go with a 24 Vdc
system.
> > The
> > savings in weight / cost due to the smaller wire size is worth the
effort.
> > But the
> > main reason is cost of used avionics, stobes, pumps, etc. As most home
> > builder
> > use 12 Vdc systems the demand for 24 Vdc equip is low, check the prices
at
> > the
> > salvage yards.
> >
> > Tom Elliott
> > N63727
> >
> >
>
>
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | Re: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Walt Lannon" <lannon@look.ca>
The governor is a combined boost oil pump and fly-weight governor. The pump
boosts engine oil pressure to approx. 150 psi for prop operation. The
fly-weights position a spool type pilot valve to direct the oil flow to or
from the propellor. (simple single acting type as used in the Yak 52 and
CJ6)
The RPM adjusting screw will have no bearing on the problem. It is only for
fine tuning the take-off RPM setting. For the CJ one turn is about 15 RPM.
The 52 should be about 20 to 25 per turn.
Possible (but unlikely) gov. problems -----
1. Internal failure - check prop oil filter on RH side of nose case for any
contamination.
2. Sticking pilot valve due to contamination or damage.
3. Worn out or damaged pilot valve bearing
4. Worn out pump or press. relief valve leaking
If you feel it is a governor problem take it to propellor shop for teardown
& inspection.
Walt
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Doug Sapp" <rvfltd@televar.com>
>
>
> >>was told after that the governor has a separate pump.
>
> You were lied to, they live off he same pump.
>
> Doug Sapp
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Jorgen Nielsen @ Mweb"
> <jorgen.nielsen@mweb.co.za>
>
> Does the governopr run on "normal" oil pressure or is there a separate
pump?
>
> I recently dropped oil pressure (one of those minor Oh Sh.. moments when
you
> have the choice of landing off airport & wrecking the plane (maybe) but
> saving the motor (maybe) or heading for nearest rwy, saving the plane
> (maybe) but wrecking the engine (maybe)) and was told after that the
> governor has a separate pump.
> Jorgen
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
>
> Prop surging (..."the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the
> runway") is changes in prop pitch and is typically not caused by intake
> leaks Frank. With good oil pressure as Bruce states, I'd suggest the prop
> governor first.
> Dennis
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Frank Haertlein" <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Frank Haertlein"
> <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
> >
> > Bruce;
> > Have whatever mechanic you get check the tightness if all intake
> > fittings including the carburetor. It may be as simple as needing to
> > tighten things up.
> > Frank
> > N9110M
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Campbell
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Yak-List: Recommended Yak mech for a stranded Yak in Chico.
> >
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bruce Campbell"
> > --> <baruch@intelligentflight.com>
> >
> > I had to leave my YAK 52 in CIC during its ferry flight from HWD to
> > Arlington, WA. I live in WA.
> >
> > The prop started surging badly. No problem with oil press according to
> > the gauges. But the surging was so bad the plane settled back on the run
> > way
> > (*very* careful power application, BTW).
> >
> > Does anyone know anyone local to Northern California that I could
> > coordinate with to get this thing flying again?
> >
> > Bruce Campbell
> > Yak 52 N82623
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> > To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: RE: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
> >
> >
> > > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
> > >
> > > I have a stock 52 electrical system. I do have some 12V devices I use
> > > a voltage converter which I got from aircraft spruce it is good for 4
> > > amps which is good for most small appliances, cameras etc. If you need
> >
> > > more
> > than
> > > that then get an ex military one they are about 200 bucks used.
> > >
> > > Gus
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> > > N13472@aol.com
> > > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > > Subject: Re: Yak-List: 12 or 24 ?
> > >
> > >
> > > --> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
> > >
> > > For a home built / experimental I would defiantly go with a 24 Vdc
> > > system. The savings in weight / cost due to the smaller wire size is
> > > worth the effort. But the
> > > main reason is cost of used avionics, stobes, pumps, etc. As most home
> > > builder
> > > use 12 Vdc systems the demand for 24 Vdc equip is low, check the
> > prices at
> > > the
> > > salvage yards.
> > >
> > > Tom Elliott
> > > N63727
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > > ==
> > direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> > ==
> > ==
> > ==
> >
> >
>
>
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | Re: Alternators for the M14P |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
Jorgen Nielsen @ Mweb wrote:
> reaches charge, the current reduces to float. If you dont have power in the
> hangar use a solar panel or 2 in series for 24V.
Actually, once the lead-acid battery reaches full charge you need to drop the *voltage*
to a float level. This voltage is selected so that the battery neither
charges nor discharges and it varies with temperature. The really good chargers
for lead-acid batteries charge in three stages:
1. constant current in order to put back about 80% of the charge and this switches
to;
2. constant voltage at the absorption level, typically about 14.6V (29.2V) for
a fixed amount of time and then;
3. drops to a float voltage of around 13.2V (26.4V).
These numbers vary depending on battery type; i.e. flooded cell, AGM, or gel; and
they vary with temperature.
> This is the same problem yachties have, good info on the web.
Most of what I have found on the web posted by so-called experts for yachties has just been flat-out wrong. Go read the manufacturer's data. For sealed AGM/Gel batteries the Deka on-line technical manual is really useful reading. See: http://www.eastpenn-deka.com/products/pdfs/0139.pdf.
I have also found Ample Power to have good information as well. They make smart
regulators and battery chargers for boats and RVs. Their stuff is designed
to rapidly charge a battery without damaging it so you get the maximum number
of cycles from the battery.
> When choosing a battery work out the total drain (e.g. xsponder + comm) in
> Amp hours, multiply by how many hours you want, double it and thats what
> size battery you need. E.g. 1.5AH X 3 hours + 4.5AH, you need a 9AH
> battery. You will never get all 9AH out of it and shouldn't discharge
> totally anyway, plus you get a bit of reserve.
Battery manufacturers will specify the battery capacity at different discharge
rates. As the current draw increases the battery capacity decreases. So you
need to figure out the current and the time but then you need to refer to the
battery manufacturer's specs. Remember, aircraft use is not the same as deep-cycle
energy storage use (like boats and houses with solar PV panels).
In the case of an airplane, the alternator is not likely to fail often so the discharge
may be 100% since the battery will very seldom be required to perform
this task. Doubling the capacity of the battery is overkill. Figuring out the
right battery size and then adding 20% in order to accommodate the battery's
decrease in capacity with time makes more sense.
--
Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
+1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
GMT-4
Message 23
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--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
Jim Griffin wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Jim Griffin" <jgriffint28@cox.net>
>
> I wonder why the battery states it should be charged at one to two amps on a
> charger? What you say is true for a topped off battery but I don't think
> your battery life will be long if you run it down for whatever reason and
> hit it with 50 amps over and over.
The smaller batteries have higher internal resistance and hence are self-limiting
on current when being charged in a typical constant-voltage charging system
like an aircraft or automobile electrical system. Your statement above sounds
like it is applicable to constant-current type chargers.
As for battery life, the depth of discharge is critical. The kinds of starting
batteries we tend to use have very poor life if fully discharged. Four or five
complete discharges may destroy a starting battery.
Here is an example of life vs charge cycles for the AGM batteries I use on the
boat:
(From the East Penn [Deka] Battery Company at http://www.eastpenn-deka.com/products/pdfs/0139.pdf)
Typical* VRLA Battery Cycling Ability vs. Depth of Discharge
Typical Life Cycles
Capacity Withdrawn Gel AGM
100% 300 150
80% 390 200
50% 650 370
25% 1500 925
10% 3800 3100
As you see, the less you take out, the longer the battery will last.
--
Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
+1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
GMT-4
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