Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:02 AM - Re: Cockpit labeling Answers (Aubrey Price)
2. 04:12 AM - Re: Panel Stickers (Stuart Mackereth)
3. 04:15 AM - Re: M14 Power Settings Page Updated (Stuart Mackereth)
4. 04:19 AM - Static Air Problem ? (Stuart Mackereth)
5. 04:24 AM - Re: M14 Power Settings Page Updated (Brian Lloyd)
6. 04:43 AM - Re: Airspeed Indicator problem (A. Dennis Savarese)
7. 04:52 AM - Re: Static Air Problem ? (Brian Lloyd)
8. 05:00 AM - Re: Static Air Problem ? (A. Dennis Savarese)
9. 05:00 AM - Re: Static Air Problem ? (Ernest Martinez)
10. 05:07 AM - Re: Static Air Problem ? (A. Dennis Savarese)
11. 07:00 AM - Re: Airspeed Indicator problem (KevLCo@aol.com)
12. 07:01 AM - Detroit City Airport (Widiker, John D)
13. 07:04 AM - Canopy opens while inverted (Greg Arnold)
14. 07:20 AM - Re: Canopy opens while inverted (KevLCo@aol.com)
15. 07:30 AM - Re: Detroit City Airport (Ernest Martinez)
16. 07:32 AM - Re: Airspeed Indicator problem (Jim Ivey)
17. 07:45 AM - Re: Re: Thump/Chuff (Deon Esterhuizen)
18. 07:54 AM - Re: Airspeed Indicator problem (Jim Ivey)
19. 08:08 AM - 6 & 8 mm flare tool (Mark Jefferies YAK UK Ltd)
20. 08:10 AM - Re: Re: Thump/Chuff (Ernest Martinez)
21. 08:13 AM - Re: Detroit City Airport (Widiker, John D)
22. 08:35 AM - Re: aerobatic training (Greg Arnold)
23. 08:35 AM - Re: Static Air Problem ? (Walt Lannon)
24. 08:43 AM - Re: aerobatic training (Greg Arnold)
25. 08:54 AM - Re: Re: aerobatic training (Ernest Martinez)
26. 03:50 PM - Re: Static Air Problem ? (Gus Fraser)
27. 03:52 PM - Re: Static Air Problem ? (Gus Fraser)
28. 04:06 PM - Re: Static Air Problem ? (Brian Lloyd)
29. 04:51 PM - Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report (MFilucci@aol.com)
30. 05:03 PM - Re: Static Air Problem ? (A. Dennis Savarese)
31. 05:16 PM - Re: Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report (Brian Lloyd)
32. 06:42 PM - Re: Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report (Deon Esterhuizen)
33. 06:59 PM - Yak at Kittyhawk (Gus Fraser)
34. 07:04 PM - Re: Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report (Gus Fraser)
35. 07:07 PM - Re: Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report (Gus Fraser)
36. 07:43 PM - Re: (JohnD623@aol.com (by way of Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Cockpit labeling Answers |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Aubrey Price <aprice@vartec.net>
Thanks you very much. This sounds like a process I used in the past. I am an
Amateur Radio Operator( WB5RXA ). I used to make rub on labels with a photo
process and apply them to my equipment. I have called Kodak and Polaroid and
they no loner make the material. I will give him a call. Thanks again
Aubrey Price
N288Y
http://www.tammyprice.com/yak
-----Original Message-----
From: Patrick Scofield [mailto:patrick@designworx.com]
Subject: Yak-List: Cockpit labeling Answers
--> Yak-List message posted by: Patrick Scofield <patrick@designworx.com>
Gentlemen,
Listen and I will impart a couple of cockpit labeling secrets.
I've been in the Industrial design field for twenty years. To build
accurate product prototype models for clients we used rub-down letters.
When we couldn't find the letters shapes and forms we needed we would
have theme made custom. For a brief period of time there was a
process called INT that you could do yourself, but it was cranky and
troublesome
There is still a source, I've worked with this gentleman for the past
twenty years and he is likely one of two guys left in the country that
makes custom rub-downs. He is used to working with professionals and
if he is handled poorly he will dry up as a source. He chemically
mixes the compounds and floats them in a water bath onto glass it is
quit an old world process ( I hope I have this right Ken).
His Name is Ken Fritz and he can be reached at ken Fritz Graphics (602)
274-2864 kenfritz@cox.net
The best way to work with him is to send email him an Adobe Illustrator
file, again he is not Kinko's nor is he 'Fast Signs', I send him
complete files in the correct format and I don't ask him to do design
(although he can). If you ask him to do more it will cost more. He
can generate any color rub down in anything your master art desires,
the rest is up to you.
So far I've done about 18 cockpits this way, L-39's and my CJ-6. We
use, yellow, blue, red, black and white rub-downs to achieve the
results. I generate usable master art in Macromedia Freehand, export
it as an .ai file and ask Ken to output them. Custom colors are
specified using the Pantone system. He uses a UV inhibitor in the
cockpit labels and a moderate tack adhesive. I apply the labels over
a PPG catalyzed urethane base coat, apply a light mist of PPG clear on
top (too much will lift the rub downs edges) and then two modest flood
coats. Voila! Remember that rub-downs are pressure and heat sensitive
and have a shelf-life of less than 6 months. Also large area labels
rely too much on the label's adhesive and too little on the entombing
qualities of the clear-coat, so be careful!
Again I want to repeat that Ken is a real gent, rough handling will not
improve his efforts, reduce his cost or speed his delivery.
Patrick Scofield
President
Concept Designworx, Inc.
2550 N Thunderbird Circle
Suite #302
Mesa, AZ 85215
USA
Bus. 480-968-4125
Fax. 480-968-4126
Message 2
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth" <stuart@bramptonyork.com>
I've done this as a temporary measure too - and frankly, I'm quite
pleased. They are a little reflective with any glare, but I believe a
matt version of the plastic for lamination is available..
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roy O. Wright
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Panel Stickers
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Roy O. Wright" <roy@wright.org>
Seven years ago I used a color laser printer on photo paper
to remake placards then laminated the top and double sided taped the
back. I had originally intended them to be temporary until I could do
it right. Surprisingly they still look like new.
Have fun,
Roy
',,'',,'',,',,'
Roy Wright 512.378.1234 mailto:royw@cisco.com
Cisco Systems import com.cisco.std-disclaimer
"Experience is the thing you get the moment after you needed to have
it."
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Message 3
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| Subject: | M14 Power Settings Page Updated |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth" <stuart@bramptonyork.com>
Jorgen.. and to make matters worse the air pressures are either in
kg/cm2 or psi or bar or kpa .. Sheesh.. Wish some intl body would wake
up and set a global standard!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jorgen Nielsen
Subject: RE: Yak-List: M14 Power Settings Page Updated
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jorgen Nielsen"
--> <jorgen.nielsen@mweb.co.za>
And to add to that, Dennis & I have been chatting off-list & I have
updated the cockpit cards with his updated info re fuel burn and blower
pressure. So those folk that have the old version don't cut out and
laminate just yet...
Will post soon, but thought to update the cards for those who fly
non-metric, so a question: do the guys in the US fly with standard ASI
(kmh) or change ASI to one calibrated in MPH or KTS?
FWIW, we have a funny/strange system in SA. We have been metric
generally for many decades now, and most people cannot relate to MPH or
inches, feet etc.
But for flying, we think in kts and nautical miles for speed & distance,
in feet for altitude but hectopascal / millibar for pressure. When
asking for taxi or joining at airfield with ATC, we are given QNH (in
hectopascals) in order to set our altimeters (in feet) to read altitude
AMSL correctly.
My Yak has all standard Russian metric instrumentation except for
altimeter. I see checklists etc. posted on US sites that read in MPH
though, hence the question.
Also FWIW, when driving if someone talks about miles or speed as MPH, it
means nothing and I can't relate without first doing some math. But
when flying, the reverse is true. If given km or kmh, I first have to
convert to nm and kts before I can relate. I guess everything is
relative.
Jorgen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of A. Dennis
Savarese
Subject: Yak-List: M14 Power Settings Page Updated
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
For all those folks flying behind a 360 HP M14P, I have just updated the
POWER SETTINGS page on my web site, www.yak-52.com, to include a column
showing fuel consumption in gallons and liters per hour. Also have
added the actual manifold pressures where the chart from the engine and
operation manual (and the chart on the web site) says "SURPLUS". Hope
you find this helpful. Dennis
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Message 4
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| Subject: | Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth" <stuart@bramptonyork.com>
Hrm.. discovered that my ASI drops a hundred feet or so when opening the
canopy.. I remember a thread on this problem not so long ago .. Dennis
was it you? Any pointers on where to start. Thanks.
Stuart
Yak52
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest
Martinez
Subject: Yak-List: Prop Balancing
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez"
--> <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
Has anyone ever had the prop on the Housai dynamically balanced??
Ernie
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Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: M14 Power Settings Page Updated |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
Stuart Mackereth wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth" <stuart@bramptonyork.com>
>
> Jorgen.. and to make matters worse the air pressures are either in
> kg/cm2 or psi or bar or kpa .. Sheesh.. Wish some intl body would wake
> up and set a global standard!
(This is a [mis]quote and I can't remember to whom to grant attribution.)
The great thing about standards is there are so many of them! If you don't like
the current one just wait a bit and someone will come up with one more to your
liking!
(Another:)
Be careful what you ask for; you may get it.
--
Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
+1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
GMT-4
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Airspeed Indicator problem |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Or could it possibly be a failure of the diaphragm internal to the ASI?
This assumes only a single ASI has the problem. If it is common to both
front and rear, remove the left wing root panel and verify the pitot and
static lines from the wing to the fuselage, including the moisture traps,
are connected properly. To test for the correct line at the wing root,
trace the lines from the moisture traps to the fuselage and to the wing
root. Then remove the b nut fittings at the wing root and have someone blow
compressed air into the pitot tube. Obviously, the fitting at the wing root
that you can feel the air pressure is the pitot line. Look inside the
cockpit where the lines come to the T fitting inside the fuselage. The T
fitting with the white lines is the static line. Just above that one
diagonally is the pitot T fitting. It will have the black lines on it.
Trace the connection on the outside of the fuselage, through the moisture
trap, to the b-nut at the wing root where you had felt the air pressure
earlier.
Hope this helps.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Walt Lannon" <lannon@look.ca>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Airspeed Indicator problem
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Walt Lannon" <lannon@look.ca>
>
> Sounds like the pitot and static lines are reversed. Since you have not
> indicated a discrepancy with the altimeter or rate of climb it suggests
the
> screw up is at the ASI.
>
> Walt
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bryan Coppersmith" <bryan@yaknz.com>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Yak-List: Airspeed Indicator problem
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: Bryan Coppersmith <bryan@yaknz.com>
> >
> > I recently read an article where someone (in USA I think) had a problem
> > with their airspeed indicator operating in reverse. We have the same
> > problem on one of our Yak 52's here in New Zealand but I can no longer
> > find the article.
> >
> > Does anyone have a link to the article or know what causes this problem?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > BJ
> > _______________
> > Bryan Coppersmith
> > Tel: 647 864 9020
> > Fax: 647 864 9087
> > Mob: 6421 445 933
> >
> >
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
Stuart Mackereth wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth" <stuart@bramptonyork.com>
>
> Hrm.. discovered that my ASI drops a hundred feet or so when opening the
> canopy.. I remember a thread on this problem not so long ago .. Dennis
> was it you? Any pointers on where to start. Thanks.
You have a leak in the static system. Start checking the static lines. The Yak-52
has some additional things to check too because the rear cockpit can fail
the front instruments as I recall.
--
Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
+1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
GMT-4
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Yep! I did. How does and ASI drop 100 feet? Do you mean your altimeter?
If so, you have a static system leak. Your ASI, VSI and Altimeter should
all be affected when you open/close the canopy. Look for the two rubber
hoses behind the rear seat that went to the flight recorder. One will be
connected to a white metal tube (static) and the other to a black metal tube
(pitot). Most likely one or both are unplugged. When the flight recorder
is removed, some people forget to plug these lines and your symptoms are
precisely what you see as the result.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stuart Mackereth" <stuart@bramptonyork.com>
Subject: Yak-List: Static Air Problem ?
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth"
<stuart@bramptonyork.com>
>
> Hrm.. discovered that my ASI drops a hundred feet or so when opening the
> canopy.. I remember a thread on this problem not so long ago .. Dennis
> was it you? Any pointers on where to start. Thanks.
>
> Stuart
> Yak52
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest
> Martinez
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Prop Balancing
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez"
> --> <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
>
> Has anyone ever had the prop on the Housai dynamically balanced??
>
> Ernie
>
>
> > ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
On my airplane there is a T in the pitot and static lines behind the
panel, one end of the T is plugged, if the plug was not there for the
static line then there could be a pressure differential between the
cabin and where the static port is. Its very possible for the cabin
pressure to increase if you crack open the canopy. I would think that
the cabin pressure would decrease since an opened canopy would probably
cause a venture effect, but I'm not a fluid dynamacist. Also I cant
remember if there is an alternate airsource for our planes, I know the
jet has 2 pitot tubes that I can select from, but don't think there is
one in the 52/CJ.
Ernie
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stuart
Mackereth
Subject: Yak-List: Static Air Problem ?
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth"
<stuart@bramptonyork.com>
Hrm.. discovered that my ASI drops a hundred feet or so when opening the
canopy.. I remember a thread on this problem not so long ago .. Dennis
was it you? Any pointers on where to start. Thanks.
Stuart
Yak52
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest
Martinez
Subject: Yak-List: Prop Balancing
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez"
--> <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
Has anyone ever had the prop on the Housai dynamically balanced??
Ernie
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Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Correct Brian. It's the two lines that went to the flight recorder. When
the flight recorder is remove, many times we find both the pitot and static
rubber hoses left unplugged. The indication is higher airspeed with the
canopy open and a drop of about 10 or so MPH (+ -) with the canopy closed.
Sort of like an alternate static source in the 172's. Most folks are very
disappointed when they find their YAK 52 is not as fast as they thought it
was when they plug the lines properly. I was one of those people 4 1/2
years ago.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Lloyd" <brian@lloyd.com>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Static Air Problem ?
> --> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
>
> Stuart Mackereth wrote:
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth"
<stuart@bramptonyork.com>
> >
> > Hrm.. discovered that my ASI drops a hundred feet or so when opening the
> > canopy.. I remember a thread on this problem not so long ago .. Dennis
> > was it you? Any pointers on where to start. Thanks.
>
> You have a leak in the static system. Start checking the static lines.
The Yak-52 has some additional things to check too because the rear cockpit
can fail the front instruments as I recall.
>
> --
>
> Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
> brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
> +1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
> GMT-4
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Airspeed Indicator problem |
--> Yak-List message posted by: KevLCo@aol.com
Here's a cool one~ funny the subject should come up. Yesterday I tried to do
a pitot/static check on the -52, and the test showed a massive leak on the
pressure side. I had hooked up the test box to the pitot head, via large tubing
and reducers. After splitting the system at the wing root, and finding that
the problem was in the wing, I found that the pitot head is not a sealed unit!
The wires for the heater pass through the impact air chamber, and while it
doesn't affect the system, you can't test it this way. Freakin Ruskies. Every
other airplane I've ever tested is a sinch from the pitot head with tubing.
Solution: I pulled the pitot head (thanks, Carl for tips on how-to) and
attached the test box directly to the lines at the back of the pitot head.
Everything was happy after that. Ok, not everything. I have a few minor leaks
to
fix behind the panel~ I changed out all the rubber for cracking.
To the subject at hand: The ASI takes dual input from both the static system
and pressure system to allow for altitude compensation to airspeed, right?
The higher up you go, the thinner the air, and the resultant speed must be so
compensated. The bellows is surrounded by atmospheric on the outside, and
impact pressure on the inside. If you loose your pressure source (remember my
cracking rubber?), and all the ASI receives is static, it will work backwards.
Just something to think about. Good luck!
Kevin
N152YK
Vegas, baby, yeah!
Message 12
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| Subject: | Detroit City Airport |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Widiker, John D" <john.widiker@eds.com>
The Warbirds list seems to be a ghost town, I'm hoping someone here may have
an idea, I hope nobody is upset that it's not Yak specific, and apologize if
this is not an appropriate list post.
I'm trying to identify a P-51 that collided with me in the late 80s. The
accident occurred at Detroit City Airport in 1988 or 1989. I've been telling
the story for years now and think it would be fun to know what specific
plane it was. Here's a short list of the details, maybe someone could
suggest a way to find more about the specific plane.
I was taking my first flight lesson with an instructor from Olsen Flight
service and had preflighted and taxied to a place to wait for clearance. We
watched a man land a P51 Mustang, the instructor remarked that the man had 2
of them at this time. While waiting I noticed that the Mustang was not
weaving as I would expect with a tail dragger but instead progressing
straight along and headed toward us at a considerable rate. I remarked a few
times that he was going to hit us, and much to the instructors surprise it
happened. The planes right wing struck the tail and rear cockpit of our
plane ripping it almost completely off the airframe. We spun several times
and came to a stop. Upon exiting the aircraft it was very surprising to us
that with the total destruction of the rear of our 4 place aircraft the
Mustang didn't even have a scratch on it. We filled out some paper work and
called it a day.
Here's where I'm having trouble. Detroit City is as far as I can tell almost
completely deserted. The only person I've been able to speak to there has
been a janitor. Olsen flight service is out of business (Jan the owner was a
very very nice lady). I've not been able to find the incident posted
anywhere either.
Any suggestions as to how I might solve the mystery of this Mustangs
identity?? Thanks for any suggestions you may have.
~John
Message 13
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| Subject: | Canopy opens while inverted |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Greg Arnold" <catfsh4u@bellsouth.net>
The other day while flying inverted the front canopy blew open and I lost my headset..darn
it!!. Anyway I thought maybe I just didn't latch the canopy right
so I latched it real good and rolled the 52 and there went the canopy again.
I figured either the latch is worn or the bearings are worn. I cleaned out the
canopy bearings and found lots of metal dust in the runs. So I guess I need
to pull the canopy off and rebuild the thing, or? Anybody done this before?
Any suggestions before I tear into this? Also, what's a good product for getting
Plexiglas/lexan clear? I have some mild hazing in the back canopy that
looks like someone tried to clean it with a brush or something (very tiny fine
scratches).
Regards,
Greg Arnold
(251) 680-4673 (cell)
catfsh4u@bellsouth.net
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Canopy opens while inverted |
--> Yak-List message posted by: KevLCo@aol.com
Hmmm... metal dust? Has your canopy been worked on lately? Anyone installed
new transparencies in the last few years? The reason I ask is that the
rollers are attached to fittings, and the fittings are installed with spacers
(washers) underneath a few of them to properly align the roller screws into the
slider rail. If the roller screws are at an odd angle, then a the canopy won't
slide easily, as the bearing is at an angle with the rail it slides back and
forth in.
Unlatching in flight? There is a spring in the latch that holds it down into
the adjustment holes~ I wonder if maybe the spring has broken? The adjusting
holes in the canopy rail should be crisp around the circumference. If
chamfered, they provide a "ramp" for the latch to ride up and out on.
Is the latch fully engaging in the hole? On ours, I've had to message the
canopy back and forth to allow the the latch pin to fall completely into the
adjusting hole. Dirt loves to accumulate in the latch mechanism, it's where our
gruby hands reach several times during each flight.
The latching cable that goes overhead to the grab ball sometimes gets dirty,
bent or kinked. It travels inside a small tube as it passes through the bow
frame, and can grab or drag inside that guide tube, not allowing the latch to
fall completely into the hole.
Is there any lateral or horizontal play in the canopy while it's closed, or
partially closed? Does it work up or down? All it takes is maybe 1/2 an inch
of play and the latch pin comes clear of the hole.
Hope this helps. Good luck. Verify condition of the adjustment holes,
verify proper and full engagement of the latching pin into these holes, tension
of
the spring to hold it in place, and security of the canopy.
Kevin
N152YK
Vegas
Message 15
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| Subject: | Detroit City Airport |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
If you filed the accident, then there should be an NTSB report. Goto
NTSB.gov and to a search, you can use the N number of the plane you were
in to find the incident.
Ernie
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Widiker, John
D
Subject: Yak-List: Detroit City Airport
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Widiker, John D" <john.widiker@eds.com>
The Warbirds list seems to be a ghost town, I'm hoping someone here may
have
an idea, I hope nobody is upset that it's not Yak specific, and
apologize if
this is not an appropriate list post.
I'm trying to identify a P-51 that collided with me in the late 80s. The
accident occurred at Detroit City Airport in 1988 or 1989. I've been
telling
the story for years now and think it would be fun to know what specific
plane it was. Here's a short list of the details, maybe someone could
suggest a way to find more about the specific plane.
I was taking my first flight lesson with an instructor from Olsen Flight
service and had preflighted and taxied to a place to wait for clearance.
We
watched a man land a P51 Mustang, the instructor remarked that the man
had 2
of them at this time. While waiting I noticed that the Mustang was not
weaving as I would expect with a tail dragger but instead progressing
straight along and headed toward us at a considerable rate. I remarked a
few
times that he was going to hit us, and much to the instructors surprise
it
happened. The planes right wing struck the tail and rear cockpit of our
plane ripping it almost completely off the airframe. We spun several
times
and came to a stop. Upon exiting the aircraft it was very surprising to
us
that with the total destruction of the rear of our 4 place aircraft the
Mustang didn't even have a scratch on it. We filled out some paper work
and
called it a day.
Here's where I'm having trouble. Detroit City is as far as I can tell
almost
completely deserted. The only person I've been able to speak to there
has
been a janitor. Olsen flight service is out of business (Jan the owner
was a
very very nice lady). I've not been able to find the incident posted
anywhere either.
Any suggestions as to how I might solve the mystery of this Mustangs
identity?? Thanks for any suggestions you may have.
~John
=
==
==
==
==
Message 16
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| Subject: | Airspeed Indicator problem |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jim Ivey" <jim@jimivey.com>
Kevin:
The ASI does take dual input, one is the static pressure (as you pointed
out) and the other is the pitot pressure which is technically "Total
Pressure". Total pressure is the sum of both static and dynamic pressure
and by itself is not useful. For an ASI to indicate speed it is only
concerned with the dynamic pressure component of total pressure. In order
to get this result it must subtract static pressure from total pressure,
leaving this dynamic pressure.
If you loose pitot pressure then that side of the diaphragm will read the
ambient pressure of the cockpit or the ambient pressure of wherever the
break in the pitot line is. Thus the ASI will read the difference between
that new unwanted pressure and the static pressure. If this unwanted
pressure is lower than static then the ASI will have the tendency to move
backwards. The ASI is the only instrument attached to the pitot pressure
line and therefore in this scenario the other instruments will not show
problems as they only depend on static pressure.
It was not uncommon for small light slow aircraft built before WWII to have
their static pressure ports on their instruments vented to the cabin. The
errors involved were not important to Cub and Taylorcraft guys.
> -----Original Message-----
>
> To the subject at hand: The ASI takes dual input from both
> the static system
> and pressure system to allow for altitude compensation to
> airspeed, right?
> The higher up you go, the thinner the air, and the resultant
> speed must be so
> compensated. The bellows is surrounded by atmospheric on the
> outside, and
> impact pressure on the inside. If you loose your pressure
> source (remember my
> cracking rubber?), and all the ASI receives is static, it
> will work backwards.
> Just something to think about. Good luck!
>
> Kevin
> N152YK
> Vegas, baby, yeah!
Message 17
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Deon Esterhuizen" <desterhuizen@hyphos360.com>
Greg,
I did a three day course with Nikolay last November. He does as far as I
know all training at Keystone Heights. Extremely good pilot (obviously)
- we did a lot of flat spin training. Let me know when you want to do
your training, I might just join you - the more students the cheaper,
and I have a lot of friends in Jacksonville - we can overnight there.
Deon.
N192YK
Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Arnold [mailto:catfsh4u@bellsouth.net]
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Greg Arnold" <catfsh4u@bellsouth.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Basiliere" <BasiliereR@ci.boulder.co.us>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Richard Basiliere"
<BasiliereR@ci.boulder.co.us>
>
> Boy are you lucky... The "best of the best" is in Ocala, FL. Nikolay
> Timofeev former World Aerobatic and European Grand Prix Champion, on
and
> on. Not only has the man shown HE can do it he also can teach it. I
> have seen him teach levels from Sportsman to Unlimited and a couple of
> WAC competitors at the same camp. They all benefitted.
> niktim@earthlink.net is his e-mail 352-861-7437 and 352-804-2225
> One of those phone #'s may not be good now.
> Respectfully, Rick
> PS. Yes, I have used him and will again
Rick:
Wow. Thanks for information. That sounds like exactly what I'm looking
for. I'll give Mr. Timofeev a call/email this week and see what his
schedule looks like.
Best Regards,
Greg Arnold
=
==
==
==
==
Message 18
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| Subject: | Airspeed Indicator problem |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jim Ivey" <jim@jimivey.com>
By the way, when working on the pitot lines or pressure checking, always
disconnect your ASI as it only takes a couple of PSI to break it (never even
blow into your pitot tube by mouth). If clearing obstructions with an air
hose disconnect ASI and blow from the cockpit side of the system out.
Jim
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | 6 & 8 mm flare tool |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Mark Jefferies YAK UK Ltd" <mark@yakuk.com>
YAK and CJ owners.
I have noted how difficult it is for you to make up new 6 & 8mm pipes for your
a/c.
We have the tools for this in the UK. cost for tools with 6 + 8mm collects is 273$.
The 6mm pipes is 7.5 meters for $48 This is car brake pipe rated at about
4500psi. The working pressure on the YAK is 730psi.
I am just about to place an order for the flare tool and could obtain others if
required. prices are plus shipping.
Pls advise direct to mark@yakuk.com
This mail could appear to be advertising but its a service if I don't tell you
about you wont know and could get a lot of owners out of trouble.
Best regards
Mark Jefferies
: Managing director YAK UK Ltd
Little Gransden Airfield, Sandy, Beds SG19 3BP, England.
( +44 (0)1767 651156 Office + 651157 fax
( +44 (0)7785 538 317 Mobile
: Conditions/ terms of business
Message 20
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
I'd be interested in participating also. Nikolay lives right near me, we
could do the training here at Leeward Air Ranch since we have an
aerobatic box. There are some nice hotels located here in Ocala on the
main drag nice restaurants, and we wouldn't have to pay for Nikolays
Hotel room.
Ernie
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deon
Esterhuizen
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Deon Esterhuizen"
<desterhuizen@hyphos360.com>
Greg,
I did a three day course with Nikolay last November. He does as far as I
know all training at Keystone Heights. Extremely good pilot (obviously)
- we did a lot of flat spin training. Let me know when you want to do
your training, I might just join you - the more students the cheaper,
and I have a lot of friends in Jacksonville - we can overnight there.
Deon.
N192YK
Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Arnold [mailto:catfsh4u@bellsouth.net]
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Greg Arnold" <catfsh4u@bellsouth.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Basiliere" <BasiliereR@ci.boulder.co.us>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Richard Basiliere"
<BasiliereR@ci.boulder.co.us>
>
> Boy are you lucky... The "best of the best" is in Ocala, FL. Nikolay
> Timofeev former World Aerobatic and European Grand Prix Champion, on
and
> on. Not only has the man shown HE can do it he also can teach it. I
> have seen him teach levels from Sportsman to Unlimited and a couple of
> WAC competitors at the same camp. They all benefitted.
> niktim@earthlink.net is his e-mail 352-861-7437 and 352-804-2225
> One of those phone #'s may not be good now.
> Respectfully, Rick
> PS. Yes, I have used him and will again
Rick:
Wow. Thanks for information. That sounds like exactly what I'm looking
for. I'll give Mr. Timofeev a call/email this week and see what his
schedule looks like.
Best Regards,
Greg Arnold
=
==
==
==
==
=
==
==
==
==
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | Detroit City Airport |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Widiker, John D" <john.widiker@eds.com>
Thank you very much!! I found it by doing a date search at that site. The
Mustang that hit me was N6341T, further searching shows that it is now owned
by Jack Roush and is painted currently as "Old Crow" I was at an airshow
this summer where the Roush plane was and showed my wife what part of the
Mustang hit us, not knowing, IT WAS THE ONE THAT HIT US!! Thanks again! I'm
laughing so hard right now..
~John
-----Original Message-----
From: Ernest Martinez [mailto:ernest.martinez@oracle.com]
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Detroit City Airport
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez"
--> <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
If you filed the accident, then there should be an NTSB report. Goto
NTSB.gov and to a search, you can use the N number of the plane you were in
to find the incident.
Ernie
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Widiker, John D
Subject: Yak-List: Detroit City Airport
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Widiker, John D" <john.widiker@eds.com>
The Warbirds list seems to be a ghost town, I'm hoping someone here may have
an idea, I hope nobody is upset that it's not Yak specific, and apologize if
this is not an appropriate list post.
I'm trying to identify a P-51 that collided with me in the late 80s. The
accident occurred at Detroit City Airport in 1988 or 1989. I've been telling
the story for years now and think it would be fun to know what specific
plane it was. Here's a short list of the details, maybe someone could
suggest a way to find more about the specific plane.
I was taking my first flight lesson with an instructor from Olsen Flight
service and had preflighted and taxied to a place to wait for clearance. We
watched a man land a P51 Mustang, the instructor remarked that the man had 2
of them at this time. While waiting I noticed that the Mustang was not
weaving as I would expect with a tail dragger but instead progressing
straight along and headed toward us at a considerable rate. I remarked a few
times that he was going to hit us, and much to the instructors surprise it
happened. The planes right wing struck the tail and rear cockpit of our
plane ripping it almost completely off the airframe. We spun several times
and came to a stop. Upon exiting the aircraft it was very surprising to us
that with the total destruction of the rear of our 4 place aircraft the
Mustang didn't even have a scratch on it. We filled out some paper work and
called it a day.
Here's where I'm having trouble. Detroit City is as far as I can tell almost
completely deserted. The only person I've been able to speak to there has
been a janitor. Olsen flight service is out of business (Jan the owner was a
very very nice lady). I've not been able to find the incident posted
anywhere either.
Any suggestions as to how I might solve the mystery of this Mustangs
identity?? Thanks for any suggestions you may have.
~John
=
==
==
==
==
advertising on the Matronics Forums.
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | Re: aerobatic training |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Greg Arnold" <catfsh4u@bellsouth.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Deon Esterhuizen" <desterhuizen@hyphos360.com>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Deon Esterhuizen"
<desterhuizen@hyphos360.com>
>
> Greg,
>
> I did a three day course with Nikolay last November. He does as far as I
> know all training at Keystone Heights. Extremely good pilot (obviously)
> - we did a lot of flat spin training. Let me know when you want to do
> your training, I might just join you - the more students the cheaper,
> and I have a lot of friends in Jacksonville - we can overnight there.
>
> Deon.
> N192YK
> Tampa
>
Deon,
Sounds great --Lets do it. Email me off-list. I would like to see if we can
get something scheduled in the next few months. I'm pretty flexible with my
time right now.
Greg
N624PT
Mobile
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Re: Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Walt Lannon" <lannon@look.ca>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Lloyd" <brian@lloyd.com>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Static Air Problem ?
> --> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
>
> Stuart Mackereth wrote:
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth"
<stuart@bramptonyork.com>
> >
> > Hrm.. discovered that my ASI drops a hundred feet or so when opening the
> > canopy.. I remember a thread on this problem not so long ago .. Dennis
> > was it you? Any pointers on where to start. Thanks.
>
> You have a leak in the static system. Start checking the static lines.
The Yak-52 has some additional things to check too because the rear cockpit
can fail the front instruments as I recall
The static system is common to both cockpits in the CJ as well. The leak can
be anywhere in the system, most likely a poor hose in either cockpit.
> --
>
> Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
> brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
> +1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
> GMT-4
>
>
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | re: aerobatic training |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Greg Arnold" <catfsh4u@bellsouth.net>
Ernie:
That's great. As I said I'm available anytime to do this training. I just
need a heads-up..a week or so notice would be great. Winter-early Spring
time is best for me. I guess I better get my canopy latch fixed...
Greg
N624PT
Mobile
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ernest Martinez" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez"
<ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
>
> I'd be interested in participating also. Nikolay lives right near me, we
> could do the training here at Leeward Air Ranch since we have an
> aerobatic box. There are some nice hotels located here in Ocala on the
> main drag nice restaurants, and we wouldn't have to pay for Nikolays
> Hotel room.
>
> Ernie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deon
> Esterhuizen
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Deon Esterhuizen"
> <desterhuizen@hyphos360.com>
>
> Greg,
>
> I did a three day course with Nikolay last November. He does as far as I
> know all training at Keystone Heights. Extremely good pilot (obviously)
> - we did a lot of flat spin training. Let me know when you want to do
> your training, I might just join you - the more students the cheaper,
> and I have a lot of friends in Jacksonville - we can overnight there.
>
> Deon.
> N192YK
> Tampa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Greg Arnold [mailto:catfsh4u@bellsouth.net]
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Greg Arnold" <catfsh4u@bellsouth.net>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Richard Basiliere" <BasiliereR@ci.boulder.co.us>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Richard Basiliere"
> <BasiliereR@ci.boulder.co.us>
> >
> > Boy are you lucky... The "best of the best" is in Ocala, FL. Nikolay
> > Timofeev former World Aerobatic and European Grand Prix Champion, on
> and
> > on. Not only has the man shown HE can do it he also can teach it. I
> > have seen him teach levels from Sportsman to Unlimited and a couple of
> > WAC competitors at the same camp. They all benefitted.
> > niktim@earthlink.net is his e-mail 352-861-7437 and 352-804-2225
> > One of those phone #'s may not be good now.
> > Respectfully, Rick
> > PS. Yes, I have used him and will again
>
> Rick:
>
> Wow. Thanks for information. That sounds like exactly what I'm looking
> for. I'll give Mr. Timofeev a call/email this week and see what his
> schedule looks like.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Greg Arnold
>
>
> > ==
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
> > ==
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | re: aerobatic training |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
I'll talk to my neighbor he just bought an SU-31 from Nikolay, I'll get
his number and fee schedule. Contact me off list.
Ernie
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Greg Arnold
Subject: Yak-List: re: aerobatic training
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Greg Arnold" <catfsh4u@bellsouth.net>
Ernie:
That's great. As I said I'm available anytime to do this training. I
just
need a heads-up..a week or so notice would be great. Winter-early
Spring
time is best for me. I guess I better get my canopy latch fixed...
Greg
N624PT
Mobile
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ernest Martinez" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez"
<ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
>
> I'd be interested in participating also. Nikolay lives right near me,
we
> could do the training here at Leeward Air Ranch since we have an
> aerobatic box. There are some nice hotels located here in Ocala on the
> main drag nice restaurants, and we wouldn't have to pay for Nikolays
> Hotel room.
>
> Ernie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deon
> Esterhuizen
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Deon Esterhuizen"
> <desterhuizen@hyphos360.com>
>
> Greg,
>
> I did a three day course with Nikolay last November. He does as far as
I
> know all training at Keystone Heights. Extremely good pilot
(obviously)
> - we did a lot of flat spin training. Let me know when you want to do
> your training, I might just join you - the more students the cheaper,
> and I have a lot of friends in Jacksonville - we can overnight there.
>
> Deon.
> N192YK
> Tampa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Greg Arnold [mailto:catfsh4u@bellsouth.net]
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Greg Arnold" <catfsh4u@bellsouth.net>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Richard Basiliere" <BasiliereR@ci.boulder.co.us>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Thump/Chuff
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Richard Basiliere"
> <BasiliereR@ci.boulder.co.us>
> >
> > Boy are you lucky... The "best of the best" is in Ocala, FL.
Nikolay
> > Timofeev former World Aerobatic and European Grand Prix Champion, on
> and
> > on. Not only has the man shown HE can do it he also can teach it.
I
> > have seen him teach levels from Sportsman to Unlimited and a couple
of
> > WAC competitors at the same camp. They all benefitted.
> > niktim@earthlink.net is his e-mail 352-861-7437 and 352-804-2225
> > One of those phone #'s may not be good now.
> > Respectfully, Rick
> > PS. Yes, I have used him and will again
>
> Rick:
>
> Wow. Thanks for information. That sounds like exactly what I'm
looking
> for. I'll give Mr. Timofeev a call/email this week and see what his
> schedule looks like.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Greg Arnold
>
>
> > ==
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
> > ==
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
=
==
==
==
==
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
You have a static leak. When I got my Yak 52 I found that the rear cockpit
static hose was disconnected. This caused the same symptoms you describe.
Gus Fraser
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Stuart
Mackereth
Subject: Yak-List: Static Air Problem ?
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth" <stuart@bramptonyork.com>
Hrm.. discovered that my ASI drops a hundred feet or so when opening the
canopy.. I remember a thread on this problem not so long ago .. Dennis
was it you? Any pointers on where to start. Thanks.
Stuart
Yak52
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest
Martinez
Subject: Yak-List: Prop Balancing
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez"
--> <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
Has anyone ever had the prop on the Housai dynamically balanced??
Ernie
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Message 27
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| Subject: | Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
I test flew a Yak when I was buying mine and was amazed when we lifted off
at 30 kts and climbed out at 50. The recorder had been removed and not
plugged. When I asked the owner about this he said that was what he always
flew it at, I kid you not.
Gus
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of A. Dennis
Savarese
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Static Air Problem ?
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Yep! I did. How does and ASI drop 100 feet? Do you mean your altimeter?
If so, you have a static system leak. Your ASI, VSI and Altimeter should
all be affected when you open/close the canopy. Look for the two rubber
hoses behind the rear seat that went to the flight recorder. One will be
connected to a white metal tube (static) and the other to a black metal tube
(pitot). Most likely one or both are unplugged. When the flight recorder
is removed, some people forget to plug these lines and your symptoms are
precisely what you see as the result.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stuart Mackereth" <stuart@bramptonyork.com>
Subject: Yak-List: Static Air Problem ?
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Stuart Mackereth"
<stuart@bramptonyork.com>
>
> Hrm.. discovered that my ASI drops a hundred feet or so when opening the
> canopy.. I remember a thread on this problem not so long ago .. Dennis
> was it you? Any pointers on where to start. Thanks.
>
> Stuart
> Yak52
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest
> Martinez
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Prop Balancing
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez"
> --> <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
>
> Has anyone ever had the prop on the Housai dynamically balanced??
>
> Ernie
>
>
> > ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
Walt Lannon wrote:
>>>You have a leak in the static system. Start checking the static lines.
>>
>> The Yak-52 has some additional things to check too because the rear cockpit
>> can fail the front instruments as I recall
>
> The static system is common to both cockpits in the CJ as well. The leak can
> be anywhere in the system, most likely a poor hose in either cockpit.
I was thinking of the pneumatic switches that allow the IP in the rear seat to
disable or cause an apparent malfunction of the various pitot and static instruments
in the front cockpit. But I may be incorrect as it has now been a couple
of years since I was last in the back seat of a Yak-52.
As for the P/S system being plumbed to both cockpits in the CJ and the -52, I was
taking that as a given.
--
Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
+1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
GMT-4
Message 29
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| Subject: | Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report |
--> Yak-List message posted by: MFilucci@aol.com
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20030124X00102&key=1
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Static Air Problem ? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
You're 100% correct Brian. They are typically called "disabling switches"
and as you said, simulated pitot/static instrument failures in the front
cockpit.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Lloyd" <brian@lloyd.com>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Static Air Problem ?
> --> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
>
> Walt Lannon wrote:
>
> >>>You have a leak in the static system. Start checking the static lines.
> >>
> >> The Yak-52 has some additional things to check too because the rear
cockpit
> >> can fail the front instruments as I recall
> >
> > The static system is common to both cockpits in the CJ as well. The leak
can
> > be anywhere in the system, most likely a poor hose in either cockpit.
>
> I was thinking of the pneumatic switches that allow the IP in the rear
seat to disable or cause an apparent malfunction of the various pitot and
static instruments in the front cockpit. But I may be incorrect as it has
now been a couple of years since I was last in the back seat of a Yak-52.
>
> As for the P/S system being plumbed to both cockpits in the CJ and
the -52, I was taking that as a given.
>
> --
>
> Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
> brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
> +1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
> GMT-4
>
>
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
MFilucci@aol.com wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: MFilucci@aol.com
>
> http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20030124X00102&key=1
I wonder if additional aerobatic training might have led the pilot to think to
roll or push to inverted flight in an attempt to get the airplane to level off.
He may have had sufficient elevator travel to achieve level inverted flight.
If nothing else that would have made it possible to have time to bail out.
I also wonder if I would have had the presence of mind to roll inverted under that
situation.
--
Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
+1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
GMT-4
Message 32
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| Subject: | Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Deon Esterhuizen" <desterhuizen@hyphos360.com>
After seeing the photo Gus posted a while back (Screw driver logged in
bell crank) I had your exact thoughts, what about an inverted maneuver -
So I simulated the event with Microsoft Flight simulator restricting up
elevator movement on my joystick - hopefully (with normal acrobatic
practice as well) this will get stuck in my mind if ever I have to use
it.
It was very informative to simulate the event at different speeds and
altitudes.
Deon.
-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Lloyd [mailto:brian@lloyd.com]
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
MFilucci@aol.com wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: MFilucci@aol.com
>
> http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20030124X00102&key=1
I wonder if additional aerobatic training might have led the pilot to
think to roll or push to inverted flight in an attempt to get the
airplane to level off. He may have had sufficient elevator travel to
achieve level inverted flight. If nothing else that would have made it
possible to have time to bail out.
I also wonder if I would have had the presence of mind to roll inverted
under that situation.
--
Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
+1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
GMT-4
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Message 33
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| Subject: | Yak at Kittyhawk |
DATE_IN_FUTURE_12_24
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
Take a look at EAA Sport pilot this month page 79.
Yak N52EK goes to Kittyhawk
Gus
Message 34
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| Subject: | Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
Tom Johnson,
Any chance of a significant deduction in insurance if we retrofit the
bellcrank shield devices designed by Marke Jefferies and Dennis Savernase ?
This accident scenario counts for 5 instances that I know about and
protection is better than an NTSB report any day.
As you warned the group these aircraft types are being looked at closely
this year and I for one am fitting a shield and a perspex inspection hatch
in the tail cone ( I will post a pattern to the list for those interested in
the pattern.
Gus
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
MFilucci@aol.com
Subject: Yak-List: Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report
--> Yak-List message posted by: MFilucci@aol.com
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20030124X00102&key=1
Message 35
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| Subject: | Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Gus Fraser" <fraseg@comcast.net>
This almost a carbon copy of an accident in England and I asked the same
question then. Tough call we were not there but that would have been the
obvious choice.
They were military pilots and one would suppose that they had unusual
attitude training but military training is a little light on -ve G maneuvers
as this is not a good ACM scenario, no sight of the enemy.
Gus
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Brian Lloyd
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Utah Yak-52 Crash, NTSB final report
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
MFilucci@aol.com wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: MFilucci@aol.com
>
> http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20030124X00102&key=1
I wonder if additional aerobatic training might have led the pilot to think
to roll or push to inverted flight in an attempt to get the airplane to
level off. He may have had sufficient elevator travel to achieve level
inverted flight. If nothing else that would have made it possible to have
time to bail out.
I also wonder if I would have had the presence of mind to roll inverted
under that situation.
--
Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza, Suite 201
brian@lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
+1.340.998.9447 - voice +1.360.838.9669 - fax
GMT-4
Message 36
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--> Yak-List message posted by: JohnD623@aol.com (by way of Matt Dralle <nospam@matronics.com>)
Stay away from mig for your aircraft, save the mig for welding on trailer
hitches. Just keep practicing with the gas torch.
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