Today's Message Index:
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1. 09:23 AM - Re: More on Alcohol fuel blends (Jim Ivey)
2. 10:27 AM - mogas (Jerry Painter)
3. 11:37 AM - Ethanol Blends (ByronMFox@aol.com)
4. 01:48 PM - Re: Ethanol Blends (KingCJ6@aol.com)
5. 01:57 PM - Re: More on Alcohol fuel blends (N4829T@aol.com)
6. 02:14 PM - Yak pictures at Spain (Txusma y Merche)
7. 04:06 PM - Re: M14 (Marcus Bates)
8. 06:07 PM - Re: More on Alcohol fuel blends (Brian Lloyd)
9. 06:47 PM - Sun & Fun hotel info. (cjpilot710@aol.com)
10. 07:14 PM - Re: Sun&Fun ()
11. 07:47 PM - Mark your calendars... (Barry Hancock)
Message 1
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| Subject: | More on Alcohol fuel blends |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jim Ivey" <jim@jimivey.com>
Another thing about "alcohol" containing Mogas fuels:
If you let your aircraft sit more than two weeks between flights don't use
mogas. Mogas is not as stable a blend as Avgas and will varnish out your
fuel system if not regularly replaced. Avgas is fully stable and can store
for years without these problems. This is why I fill my lawn mower and
tiller with 100LL at the end of the summer. Next spring they start right up
without a problem. Mogas without a special stabilizer additive will result
in a gummed up mess come spring.
I also have had first-hand experience with the alcohol in Mogas eating
sloshing compound and resin out of a fiberglass tank (homebuilt). The goo
plugged the fuel pickup and forced landing resulted. Kit factory stated
that it's materials were incompatible with alcohol and added placard to
subsequent kits.
Life's too short to try to save $1.00 a gallon or run the R&D necessary to
confirm compatibility.
In the overall scheme of things I consider avgas cheap compared to all costs
involved in maintaing, storing and flying an aircraft.
Jim
Message 2
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jerry Painter" <wild.blue@verizon.net>
As a towpilot and glider pilot I've been on both ends of the towline behind
mogas burning towplanes for almost twenty years. (Glider clubs tend to run
on the lean side of the financial curve.) I'm talking about Pawnees (235hp
Lycoming O-540's) and Super Cubs (Lycoming O-320's and O-360's) mostly.
Friends have also been using mogas for many years in their spammers. No
problemos, mostly, just a few gooey o-rings here and there. But, being of
pure heart and mind and having an incurable tendency to do what I'm told, I
always stuck to avgas.
Then one fine day, I suffered a fit of impecuniary delirium and decided to
put mogas in my Wilga. Ran fine. I'm talking airport mogas, not
jeep-can-from-the-cheapest-gas-station mogas here. Next day I open the
hangar door and there's a small puddle of fuel on the floor--like from a
dripping drain valve size drip. You may know Wilgas use a float in a
plastic tube below the wing for fuel gages like a Stearman. The fuel was
dripping from the gage. Fortunately, the drip wasn't bad. A small crack
had developed in the top of the plastic tube maybe 1/2 inch long.
Next day the drip was not only worse, it was coming from both gages. Drain
the tanks etc. etc. There were 22 gallons of fuel in each tank.
Both tubes eventually opened up cracks about 1/16 of an inch wide running
nearly the full lengths of the tubes and turned a milky white such that they
weren't even translucent any more. Waaaah?
Mind you this is airport mogas being burned by lots of other folks. The
drained fuel smelled "bad." I took the strainer apart for fun and the
gasket had turned to goo. Fortunately I had spare gaskets and float gage
tubes. Carburetor diaphragms?
That was about two years ago. The replacement fuel gage tubes are clear to
this day and fortunately no damage was done to the carburetor. But I don't
burn no mogas no mo. Was this another bonus effect of "oxygenates" in the
mogas? I've never heard of another similar case and the glider club still
burns the same mogas in the Pawnee with no problems. And although I blame
the fuel, I don't really have any conclusive evidence. Bad communist
plastic? Mebbe, but I don't think so.
Jerry Painter
Message 3
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--> Yak-List message posted by: ByronMFox@aol.com
So, it's resolved. Stay away from such fuels. Thanks everyone for your
comments. I'll find some other way to save money. Instead of insisting that it's
traditional for wingmen to buy his lunch when we fly formation, Dave King's
going to start buying his own. ...Blitz
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Ethanol Blends |
--> Yak-List message posted by: KingCJ6@aol.com
In a message dated 1/26/2004 11:37:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
ByronMFox@aol.com writes:
Instead of insisting that it's
traditional for wingmen to buy his lunch when we fly formation, Dave King's
going to start buying his own. ...Blitz
Too bad, I had a good thing going. Looks like it's back to the "free" Costco
taste sample lunches...
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: More on Alcohol fuel blends |
--> Yak-List message posted by: N4829T@aol.com
There have been several posts about the use of (Mogas) verses 100LL. I have
flown my CJ over 400 hrs.on Mogas and have never experienced any problems.
Before I decided to burn Mogas, I made sure there wasn't any alcohol present!
I
did this with the old tube and water test.
I know several guys that have used mogas and said it caused all kinds of
problems These were the same guys that found out the the mogas they had been
burning contained alcohol!!
Jim Plumlee
N31103/CJ-6A
"launch Pad"
843-987-3260
843-236-0679
Message 6
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| Subject: | Yak pictures at Spain |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Txusma y Merche" <jsagastuy@euskalnet.net>
You can see very good pictures in:
http://www.airliners.net/
Search:
Aircraft Type: Other yakovlev
Country: Spain
Best Regards
Jesus
Message 7
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Marcus Bates" <mlbjr@earthlink.net>
Yep, that's my dad. By the way, he has a M-14-P that may be available.
If you make a deal with him, remember that I want the locked M14. Marcus
Jr.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: More on Alcohol fuel blends |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
Jim Ivey wrote:
> Life's too short to try to save $1.00 a gallon or run the R&D necessary to
> confirm compatibility.
At 15 gph that works out to be $15/hr. At the time I was flying my CJ 20-30 hours
per month. That represents a savings of $300-$450 per month. It very quickly
paid for the 100gal tank in my pickup truck and after that it was all gravy.
I was able to purchase mogas directly from a distributor who was able to
verify the contents of the fuel (lack of alcohol).
In addition to being cheaper I experienced fewer problems with fouled spark plugs.
My first set of Chinese plugs went over 500 hours on mostly mogas. Mogas
also solved the plug-fouling problem I had with the Lyc O-235 in my Piper Clipper.
> In the overall scheme of things I consider avgas cheap compared to all costs
> involved in maintaing, storing and flying an aircraft.
Like anything else you need to research the issues and know what you are doing.
Mogas can be used safely if you treat it properly. Both EAA and Peterson have
done extensive testing and have proven that mogas may be used safely in many
airplanes. My experience has been universally positive but I made sure I never
got any fuel with alcohol.
I did experience one downside to using mogas: my kids discovered that they could
use the tank in the back of my truck to refill their cars when I wasn't looking.
I would go to fuel the planes and discover I didn't have nearly as much
fuel in the tank as I thought I did.
--
Brian Lloyd 6501 Red Hook Plaza
brian@lloyd.com Suite 201
http://www.lloyd.com St. Thomas, VI 00802
+1.340.998.9447 (voice) +1.360.838.9669 (fax)
Message 9
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| Subject: | Sun & Fun hotel info. |
orthopilot@msn.com, Lynch@netjets.com, jesposito@genchemcorp.com
--> Yak-List message posted by: cjpilot710@aol.com
Troops,
I have set aside 15 rooms at the Howard Johnson in Winter Haven.
You are required to make your own reservation.
The rooms are under the "Red Star Pilots Association"
The phone number at the hotel is 863-293-7321
Rates are $59.00 = tax per night. No Smoking - Doubles.
This will be the forth year there. As you may know this is next door to
Holiday Inn where the EAA WB stay. We can walk across the parking lot and drink
with them or crash their party. The bar at our hotel has a big schreen TV and
is a little more "laid back" than H I's. We are a short walk to one of the
best sea food places and they are used to us 'en-mass'.
Everyone is welcome to join us there however, this will not be basic
formation training clinic event.
If you come with a recommendation for a check ride, we should have a check
pilot there to give you the check ride. Formation recurrent flights will be
made also. We will be practicing mass formation and flying in the show. Our
gold is to show off our formation skills - not only to the public but more
importantly, to the other war birds groups. To have fun safely.
Remember the planned airport is GIF -- Winter Haven Gilbert field.
Tie downs are a must.
Rich Parish is the FBO # 863-293-2501 if you have special questions for him.
Jim Goolsby
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little safety,
deserve neither liberty nor safety"
Benjamin Franklin 1759
"With my shield, or on it"
Trojan Warriors BC
"The reason older men are like fine wine. When young, they are like grapes
until some woman stomps all over them."
Unknown older man.
Message 10
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--> Yak-List message posted by: <catfsh4u@bellsouth.net>
FWIW, Gilbert Field is adjacent to Jack Brown's Seaplane base. For those who like
to collect ratings you could come a little early and get a seaplane rating.
I takes two days generally. Be sure to make reservations though. Might already
be tight.
Greg Arnold
Message 11
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| Subject: | Mark your calendars... |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Barry Hancock <radialpower@cox.net>
...last year it was the largest ever such event in the free world. This
year it will be even bigger and even better. You don't want to miss.....
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