Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:46 AM - Re: Mag Questions (cpayne@joimail.com)
2. 04:32 AM - Re: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52 (A. Dennis Savarese)
3. 07:40 AM - Timing changed (yakparts@simplyweb.net)
4. 08:04 AM - Re: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52 (Lee Taylor)
5. 08:38 AM - Re: Timing changed (A. Dennis Savarese)
6. 08:58 AM - Re: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52 (Ernest Martinez)
7. 09:50 AM - Re: LED replacments for LDG LIGHTS (Aubrey Price)
8. 06:34 PM - Re: LED replacments for LDG LIGHTS (jay reiter)
9. 10:18 PM - Request for the RPA (Drew Blahnick)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Mag Questions |
--> Yak-List message posted by: cpayne@joimail.com
Dennis,
See my responses.
>I have some questions on magneto and engine timing for you
engine savvy
>folks.
>
>What is the gear ratio between the propeller and the
engine?
.658
>What is the correct amount of advance for the magneto
(M-9F), on an M14P
engine?
The Book says 23 degrees BTDC.
>Where is it measured?
>Prop flange or cylinder?
22 to 24 degrees BTDC by the crank, if by the prop, then 23
x .658 or 14-30 to 16 degrees. The Yak vendors have the
maintenance manual if you don't have one.
>I have a Russian "time right" indicator and it currently
indicates 30
>deg BTDC on #4 cylinder, both mags.
Yes the engine will run at this many degrees advanced,
that's what the automatic advance mags allow the engine to
do. But not the M9F without paying a penalty. The penalty is
kickback on starting with eventual air compressor failure.
>Using the index marks on the prop flange I get 42 deg
advance indicated
>for the same condition.
That doesn't sound right, the prop turns .658 times for
every crank revolution. Thus you should be reading about 20
degrees BTDC on the prop.
>The engine starts and runs well so things can't be too far
off.
Perhaps the Time-rite wasn't used properly. It's a little
tricky.
>Thanks in advance
>Dennis Lenton
Craig Payne
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52 |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
Response is within your email in CAPS
Dennis Savarese
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
Subject: Yak-List: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
>
> I have some questions on magneto and engine timing for you engine savvy
> folks.
>
> What is the gear ratio between the propeller and the engine? .658
>
> What is the correct amount of advance for the magneto (M-9F), on an M14P
> engine? 15 DEGREES BEFORE TOP DEAD CENTER.
>
> Where is it measured? AT THE PROP FLANGE
>
> Prop flange or cylinder? SEE ABOVE
>
> I have a Russian "time right" indicator and it currently indicates 30
> deg BTDC on #4 cylinder, both mags.
>
> Using the index marks on the prop flange I get 42 deg advance indicated
> for the same condition.
TO SET THE TIMING, BRING #4 CYLINDER UP TO TDC ON THE COMPRESSION STROKE.
THEN CREATE A POINTER (SAFETY WIRE WORKS WELL) TO POINT TO THE ZERO MARK ON
THE PROP FLANGE. NEXT, USING A MAGNETO SYNCHRONIZER/TIMING BOX, CONNECT THE
SYNCHRONIZER TO THE SPRING CLIP ON THE POINTS IN EITHER MAG. TURN ON THE
MAG SWITCHES IN BOTH COCKPITS TO THE APPROPRIATE MAG THAT YOU HAVE CONNECTED
THE TIMING BOX. LEFT MAG (LOOKING AT IT FROM THE FRONT COCKPIT) IS NUMBER
1. WHILE WATCHING THE PROP FLANGE ROTATE THE PROP OPPOSITE OF NORMAL
ROTATION TO 30+ DEGREES BTC. TURN ON THE MAG SYNCHRONIZER/TIMING BOX.
ROTATE THE PROP IN THE NORMAL DIRECTION SLOWLY. OBSERVE THE TIMING MARKS ON
THE PROP FLANGE. WHEN THE BOX SOUNDS OFF-STOP, THE POINTS OPENED. READ THE
TIMING UNDER THE POINTER YOU CREATED ON THE PROP FLANGE. THAT IS WHAT THE
MAG IS TIMED TO.
>
> The engine starts and runs well so things can't be too far off.
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Dennis Lenton
>
> N107YK
>
>
Message 3
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--> Yak-List message posted by: yakparts@simplyweb.net
Group,
Frank's change in timing on his engine may be the result of 3 things:
1. He timed the engine incorrectly.
2. A tooth (teeth) have broken off a gear and the timing has slipped.
3. The engine has suffered a hydraulic lock, causing the accessory
drive shaft to twist and change the timing to the mags, air
distributor.
We recommend customers check their mag timing after a hydraulic lock.
It is the prudent thing to do.
4. Less likely: The point plate has loosened and shifted. Unless you
have been making adjustments to the points, there are several locktabs
that hold the screws in place.
In response to Dennis Lenton's post:
Time: 09:47:18 PM PST US
From: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
Subject: Yak-List: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
I have some questions on magneto and engine timing for you engine savvy
folks. Read the manual. The M-14P Maintenance Manual is essential to
maintaining your engines. The information you need is in there.
What is the gear ratio between the propeller and the engine? in the
manual
What is the correct amount of advance for the magneto (M-9F), on an M14P
engine? in the manual
Where is it measured? Prop flange
Prop flange or cylinder?
I have a Russian "time right" indicator and it currently indicates 30
deg BTDC on #4 cylinder, both mags.
Using the index marks on the prop flange I get 42 deg advance indicated
for the same condition. The engine would not run this far advanced.
Timing
M-14P Maintenance Manual: Section 72.00.00 Page 5 The prop turns 0.658
revolutions for one crank revolution
M-14P Maintenance Manual: Section 74.10.01, Page 205 Task card 202:
Procedures stated and timing listed 14 degrees 30 minutes to 16 degrees.
14 degrees 30 minutes / divided by .658 = 22 degrees
16 degrees divided by .658 = 24 degrees 20 minutes.
The engine crank timing is correctly set between 22 degrees and 24
degrees 20 minutes following the procedure in the task card.
I don't know how an M-14P owner can properly maintain their engine
without the information within this manual. We stock and sell this
manual.
Regards,
Jill Gernetzke
The engine starts and runs well so things can't be too far off.
Thanks in advance
Dennis Lenton
N107YK
Message 4
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| Subject: | Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52 |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Lee Taylor " <leetay1@idcomm.com>
ADDITIONAL to "Timing procedure" First off, guys, this sounds really
stupid, but I will explain.
FIRST, REMOVE ONE SPARK PLUG FROM EACH CYLINDER!
You will be pulling the prop thru by hand, with hot mags. YOU
DO NOT WANT THAT ENGINE FIRING!
As I said, rather stupidly obvious, but a friend of mine is
right now in final stages of recovering from a very severe hand-whack
when his engine fired when he moved the prop, and DIDN'T have the mag
switch fully off.
Lee Taylor
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-
> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of A. Dennis Savarese
> Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 5:31 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
>
> Response is within your email in CAPS
> Dennis Savarese
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Yak-List: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
> >
> > I have some questions on magneto and engine timing for you engine
savvy
> > folks.
> >
> > What is the gear ratio between the propeller and the engine? .658
> >
> > What is the correct amount of advance for the magneto (M-9F), on an
M14P
> > engine? 15 DEGREES BEFORE TOP DEAD CENTER.
> >
> > Where is it measured? AT THE PROP FLANGE
> >
> > Prop flange or cylinder? SEE ABOVE
> >
> > I have a Russian "time right" indicator and it currently indicates
30
> > deg BTDC on #4 cylinder, both mags.
> >
> > Using the index marks on the prop flange I get 42 deg advance
indicated
> > for the same condition.
>
> TO SET THE TIMING, BRING #4 CYLINDER UP TO TDC ON THE COMPRESSION
STROKE.
> THEN CREATE A POINTER (SAFETY WIRE WORKS WELL) TO POINT TO THE ZERO
MARK
> ON
> THE PROP FLANGE. NEXT, USING A MAGNETO SYNCHRONIZER/TIMING BOX,
CONNECT
> THE
> SYNCHRONIZER TO THE SPRING CLIP ON THE POINTS IN EITHER MAG. TURN ON
THE
> MAG SWITCHES IN BOTH COCKPITS TO THE APPROPRIATE MAG THAT YOU HAVE
> CONNECTED
> THE TIMING BOX. LEFT MAG (LOOKING AT IT FROM THE FRONT COCKPIT) IS
NUMBER
> 1. WHILE WATCHING THE PROP FLANGE ROTATE THE PROP OPPOSITE OF NORMAL
> ROTATION TO 30+ DEGREES BTC. TURN ON THE MAG SYNCHRONIZER/TIMING BOX.
> ROTATE THE PROP IN THE NORMAL DIRECTION SLOWLY. OBSERVE THE TIMING
MARKS
> ON
> THE PROP FLANGE. WHEN THE BOX SOUNDS OFF-STOP, THE POINTS OPENED.
READ
> THE
> TIMING UNDER THE POINTER YOU CREATED ON THE PROP FLANGE. THAT IS WHAT
THE
> MAG IS TIMED TO.
> >
> > The engine starts and runs well so things can't be too far off.
> >
> > Thanks in advance
> >
> > Dennis Lenton
> >
> > N107YK
> >
> >
>
>
>
==
>
==
>
==
>
==
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Timing changed |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
I believe the problem was he was using the Russian TDC indicator to read
degrees and not to find TDC on cylinder #4.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: <yakparts@simplyweb.net>
Subject: Yak-List: Timing changed
> --> Yak-List message posted by: yakparts@simplyweb.net
>
> Group,
>
> Frank's change in timing on his engine may be the result of 3 things:
>
> 1. He timed the engine incorrectly.
>
> 2. A tooth (teeth) have broken off a gear and the timing has slipped.
>
> 3. The engine has suffered a hydraulic lock, causing the accessory
> drive shaft to twist and change the timing to the mags, air
> distributor.
> We recommend customers check their mag timing after a hydraulic lock.
> It is the prudent thing to do.
>
> 4. Less likely: The point plate has loosened and shifted. Unless you
> have been making adjustments to the points, there are several locktabs
> that hold the screws in place.
>
> In response to Dennis Lenton's post:
>
>
> Time: 09:47:18 PM PST US
> From: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
> Subject: Yak-List: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
>
> I have some questions on magneto and engine timing for you engine savvy
> folks. Read the manual. The M-14P Maintenance Manual is essential to
> maintaining your engines. The information you need is in there.
>
> What is the gear ratio between the propeller and the engine? in the
> manual
>
> What is the correct amount of advance for the magneto (M-9F), on an M14P
> engine? in the manual
>
> Where is it measured? Prop flange
>
> Prop flange or cylinder?
>
> I have a Russian "time right" indicator and it currently indicates 30
> deg BTDC on #4 cylinder, both mags.
>
> Using the index marks on the prop flange I get 42 deg advance indicated
> for the same condition. The engine would not run this far advanced.
>
> Timing
>
> M-14P Maintenance Manual: Section 72.00.00 Page 5 The prop turns 0.658
> revolutions for one crank revolution
>
> M-14P Maintenance Manual: Section 74.10.01, Page 205 Task card 202:
> Procedures stated and timing listed 14 degrees 30 minutes to 16 degrees.
> 14 degrees 30 minutes / divided by .658 = 22 degrees
> 16 degrees divided by .658 = 24 degrees 20 minutes.
>
> The engine crank timing is correctly set between 22 degrees and 24
> degrees 20 minutes following the procedure in the task card.
>
> I don't know how an M-14P owner can properly maintain their engine
> without the information within this manual. We stock and sell this
> manual.
>
> Regards,
> Jill Gernetzke
>
>
> The engine starts and runs well so things can't be too far off.
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Dennis Lenton
>
> N107YK
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52 |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ernest Martinez" <ernest.martinez@oracle.com>
Why would anyone be doing this with hot mags????
Ernie
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lee Taylor
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Lee Taylor " <leetay1@idcomm.com>
ADDITIONAL to "Timing procedure" First off, guys, this sounds really
stupid, but I will explain.
FIRST, REMOVE ONE SPARK PLUG FROM EACH CYLINDER!
You will be pulling the prop thru by hand, with hot mags. YOU
DO NOT WANT THAT ENGINE FIRING!
As I said, rather stupidly obvious, but a friend of mine is
right now in final stages of recovering from a very severe hand-whack
when his engine fired when he moved the prop, and DIDN'T have the mag
switch fully off.
Lee Taylor
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-
> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of A. Dennis Savarese
> Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 5:31 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <adsavar@gte.net>
>
> Response is within your email in CAPS
> Dennis Savarese
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Yak-List: Magneto/Engine Timing Yak52
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Dennis Lenton" <lenton@waypt.com>
> >
> > I have some questions on magneto and engine timing for you engine
savvy
> > folks.
> >
> > What is the gear ratio between the propeller and the engine? .658
> >
> > What is the correct amount of advance for the magneto (M-9F), on an
M14P
> > engine? 15 DEGREES BEFORE TOP DEAD CENTER.
> >
> > Where is it measured? AT THE PROP FLANGE
> >
> > Prop flange or cylinder? SEE ABOVE
> >
> > I have a Russian "time right" indicator and it currently indicates
30
> > deg BTDC on #4 cylinder, both mags.
> >
> > Using the index marks on the prop flange I get 42 deg advance
indicated
> > for the same condition.
>
> TO SET THE TIMING, BRING #4 CYLINDER UP TO TDC ON THE COMPRESSION
STROKE.
> THEN CREATE A POINTER (SAFETY WIRE WORKS WELL) TO POINT TO THE ZERO
MARK
> ON
> THE PROP FLANGE. NEXT, USING A MAGNETO SYNCHRONIZER/TIMING BOX,
CONNECT
> THE
> SYNCHRONIZER TO THE SPRING CLIP ON THE POINTS IN EITHER MAG. TURN ON
THE
> MAG SWITCHES IN BOTH COCKPITS TO THE APPROPRIATE MAG THAT YOU HAVE
> CONNECTED
> THE TIMING BOX. LEFT MAG (LOOKING AT IT FROM THE FRONT COCKPIT) IS
NUMBER
> 1. WHILE WATCHING THE PROP FLANGE ROTATE THE PROP OPPOSITE OF NORMAL
> ROTATION TO 30+ DEGREES BTC. TURN ON THE MAG SYNCHRONIZER/TIMING BOX.
> ROTATE THE PROP IN THE NORMAL DIRECTION SLOWLY. OBSERVE THE TIMING
MARKS
> ON
> THE PROP FLANGE. WHEN THE BOX SOUNDS OFF-STOP, THE POINTS OPENED.
READ
> THE
> TIMING UNDER THE POINTER YOU CREATED ON THE PROP FLANGE. THAT IS WHAT
THE
> MAG IS TIMED TO.
> >
> > The engine starts and runs well so things can't be too far off.
> >
> > Thanks in advance
> >
> > Dennis Lenton
> >
> > N107YK
> >
> >
>
>
>
==
>
==
>
==
>
==
>
>
>
==
==
==
==
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: LED replacments for LDG LIGHTS |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Aubrey Price <aprice@vartec.net>
What size resistor are you putting in series to drop the voltage. Great
idea. Why didn't I think of it.
Aubrey Price
VarTec Telecom, Inc.
-----Original Message-----
From: N13472@aol.com <N13472@aol.com>
Subject: Yak-List: LED replacments for LDG LIGHTS
--> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
Ref, the below, Frank if you will look in Radio Shack, Newark, Mosler, etc.
catalogs
you will find LED replacements for most light bulb configurations.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Time: 09:12:30 AM PST US
From: "Frank Haertlein" <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
Subject: Yak-List: Gear Indicator Light Bulb
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Frank Haertlein"
<yak52driver@earthlink.net>
Speaking of light bulbs;
I'm taking bright white-light diodes and putting them in my yak light
bulb (lamp) indicators like the gear and flaps. I'm breaking off the
glass portion and soldering in the diodes. They take tens of years to
burn out. They may just outlast your lifetime.
So, to answer your question, it takes one to think of the idea for a new
light bulb, another to actually build the product and make it work and
one to sell it to those who want to benefit from this promising new
product :)
I'll let the list know how it turns out.
Tom Elliott
CJ-6 N63727
Sandy Valley NV
3L2
Message 8
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|
| Subject: | Re: LED replacments for LDG LIGHTS |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "jay reiter" <jmreiter@adelphia.net>
At 20 ma a 1400 ohm resistor drops 28v and disapates .56 watt. Seams that an
1864 is less complicated. Thats why the industry and military switched from
the 327 and 313 forty years ago.
-- Original Message -----
From: "Aubrey Price" <aprice@vartec.net>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: LED replacments for LDG LIGHTS
> --> Yak-List message posted by: Aubrey Price <aprice@vartec.net>
>
> What size resistor are you putting in series to drop the voltage. Great
> idea. Why didn't I think of it.
> Aubrey Price
> VarTec Telecom, Inc.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: N13472@aol.com <N13472@aol.com>
> To: yak-list-digest@matronics.com <yak-list-digest@matronics.com>
> Subject: Yak-List: LED replacments for LDG LIGHTS
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: N13472@aol.com
>
> Ref, the below, Frank if you will look in Radio Shack, Newark, Mosler,
etc.
> catalogs
> you will find LED replacements for most light bulb configurations.
> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> Time: 09:12:30 AM PST US
> From: "Frank Haertlein" <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
> Subject: Yak-List: Gear Indicator Light Bulb
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Frank Haertlein"
> <yak52driver@earthlink.net>
>
> Speaking of light bulbs;
> I'm taking bright white-light diodes and putting them in my yak light
> bulb (lamp) indicators like the gear and flaps. I'm breaking off the
> glass portion and soldering in the diodes. They take tens of years to
> burn out. They may just outlast your lifetime.
>
> So, to answer your question, it takes one to think of the idea for a new
> light bulb, another to actually build the product and make it work and
> one to sell it to those who want to benefit from this promising new
> product :)
>
> I'll let the list know how it turns out.
>
>
> Tom Elliott
> CJ-6 N63727
> Sandy Valley NV
> 3L2
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Request for the RPA |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Drew Blahnick" <aapilot@adelphia.net>
Folks,
While we are switching over to a much more capable web site technology for the
RPAs home site, we are looking for the following to display in the aircraft and
training sections:
"Pilot Reports" on the CJ-6, Yak 52, Yak 55, Su-26/29, Zlins, L-39, L-29, Migs,
etc.
Just short articles in your own words about the flying capabilites and general
overview of procedures, speeds, etc. Just as you might see in drivers reports
of new model cars.
I found such a pilot report on the Yak 50 to be helpful and would like to invite
some of you who are gifted in putting "action" in to words to author such a
document for the assoc. and future aircraft owners
Thanks, if you have such a pilot report, please e-mail it to me directly!
Drew
Drew Blahnick
RedStar Pilots Assoc.
310.872.0754
"Communism: Lousy Politics-Excellent Airplanes"
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