---------------------------------------------------------- Yak-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 06/18/05: 15 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:03 AM - Re: operation and limitations for Yak 52 (Ron Davis) 2. 03:33 AM - Re: operation and limitations for Yak 52 (A. Dennis Savarese) 3. 03:46 AM - Re: The Feds (Ron Davis) 4. 05:57 AM - Re: operation and limitations for Yak 52 (Jim Ivey) 5. 06:29 AM - Re: The Feds (Daniel Fortin) 6. 07:43 AM - Re: operation and limitations for Yak 52 (Ron Davis) 7. 07:44 AM - Re: operation and limitations for Yak 52 (Ron Davis) 8. 08:09 AM - Air Filling Connector (Mike Beresford) 9. 08:09 AM - Re: operation and limitations for Yak 52 (Ron Spencer) 10. 09:11 AM - Re: operation and limitations for Yak 52 (Luke Sollitt) 11. 09:41 AM - Re: operation and limitations for Yak 52 (Ernest Martinez) 12. 10:42 AM - Re: operation and limitations for Yak 52 (Jon Boede) 13. 11:03 AM - Re: The Feds (Jon Boede) 14. 11:49 AM - [ Jim Goolsby ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares) 15. 08:13 PM - Great Circle Route Fuel Stop Planner (Frank Haertlein) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:03:43 AM PST US From: "Ron Davis" Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" Ops limits are generally imposed by the feds via an attachment to the airworthiness certificate. If they want you to write them, I suggest you not unduly limit yourself. Submit these: Operational limits for Yak __, serial number _________ 1) Aircraft is limited to subsonic speeds. 2) Aircraft shall be operated from the surface to 80,000' within the atmosphere of planet earth. 3) Maintenance shall be performed by a human, or other trained mammal, at least once per decade. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:33:38 AM PST US From: "A. Dennis Savarese" Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 --> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" Individuals can not write their own OL's. The FAA inspector writes and issues the OL's based on FAA Order 8130.2E. There are boilerplate paragraphs which he/she will insert and there are paragraphs which he/she can write into OL's to meet the local area requirements. However, you can "discuss" particular paragraphs which you feel are overly restrictive and outside the scope and intent of the Order. As Ron says, they are attached to the Airworthiness Certificate, but not physically attached. The OL's and Airworthiness Certificate are married together and as I previously stated, if the aircraft is relocated or sold, a new Airworthiness Certificate and Operating Limitations must be issued by and FAA Inspector, even if it stays within the jurisdiction of the same FSDO. moved to an Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Davis" Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" > > Ops limits are generally imposed by the feds via an attachment to the > airworthiness certificate. If they want you to write them, I suggest you > not unduly limit yourself. Submit these: > > > Operational limits for Yak __, serial number _________ > > 1) Aircraft is limited to subsonic speeds. > 2) Aircraft shall be operated from the surface to 80,000' within the > atmosphere of planet earth. > 3) Maintenance shall be performed by a human, or other trained mammal, at > least once per decade. > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:46:17 AM PST US From: "Ron Davis" Subject: Re: Yak-List: The Feds --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" Think how worried the feds would be if Worldwide Warbirds had ten FLYING L-39s on the ramp... >Au contraire, mon fraire... The Feds were very interested in the >Shared Squadrons the first time we put an ad out in In Flight USA. >The Feds have been searching for a guy at our airport who is >advertising flight training in the L-39 (not even ACM, etc.). Anything >that gets advertised is going to raise the eyebrow of the Feds. > >In fact, we (Worldwide Warbirds) have been under satellite surveillance >for several years....10+ L-39's on the same ramp at any one time seems >to have their interest.... ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:57:49 AM PST US From: Jim Ivey Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 --> Yak-List message posted by: Jim Ivey Yakkers and 'Changers: I have a CJ-6A with M-14P for sale by owner (me). Anyone interested please contact me off-list at jim@jimivey.com or cell phone (915) 820-4252. If you reply directly to this message the whole Yak list will get it, so please use the above email address to be considerate to folks not interested. Thanks, Jim Ivey ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:29:25 AM PST US From: "Daniel Fortin" Subject: RE: Yak-List: The Feds --> Yak-List message posted by: "Daniel Fortin" Barry, It is "Au contraire mon FRERE"!!! Get with it buddy ;-) Dan >From: Barry Hancock >Reply-To: yak-list@matronics.com >To: yak-list@matronics.com >Subject: Yak-List: The Feds >Date: Fri, 17 Jun 2005 21:02:36 -0700 > >--> Yak-List message posted by: Barry Hancock > >On Jun 16, 2005, at 11:58 PM, Yak-List Digest Server wrote: > > > You can hire an expensive lawyer to weasel his way through the regs, > > or you > > can just ignore them. The feds are pretty busy fighting terrorism and > > can't > > be bothered with the little things. > >Au contraire, mon fraire... The Feds were very interested in the >Shared Squadrons the first time we put an ad out in In Flight USA. >The Feds have been searching for a guy at our airport who is >advertising flight training in the L-39 (not even ACM, etc.). Anything >that gets advertised is going to raise the eyebrow of the Feds. > >In fact, we (Worldwide Warbirds) have been under satellite surveillance >for several years....10+ L-39's on the same ramp at any one time seems >to have their interest.... > >Cheers, > >Barry > > >Barry Hancock >Worldwide Warbirds, Inc. >1-866-L39-JETS >cell (949) 300-5510 >www.worldwidewarbirds.com >www.sharedsquadrons.com > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:43:02 AM PST US From: "Ron Davis" Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" There may be some debate about whether the ops limits are "physically attached", but my reading of the regs says that they are part of the Airworthiness Cert. The Airworthiness Cert must be in the plane, therefore the ops limits must be carried in the plane when it flies. I will probably regret having brought this up. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:44:31 AM PST US From: "Ron Davis" Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" I've never found the part that says you need a new Airworthiness Cert when the plane is sold. Can you reference an FAR? Do you get a new one on a spam can when it's sold or does the new owner use the old cert? ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:09:30 AM PST US From: Mike Beresford Subject: Yak-List: Air Filling Connector --> Yak-List message posted by: Mike Beresford Hi all Does anyone have a specification or drawing for the connector needed to plug into the YAk-52 air refilling point? At the moment I'm filling with a makeshift coupling from a scuba cylinder, but it's not the easiest arrangement. Thanks Mike ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:09:47 AM PST US From: "Ron Spencer" Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Spencer" That is a true statement. In order to fly the aircraft legally they must be on board at all times. They are not like the aircraft logs, hence why many may confuse the two. -rs- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Davis" Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" > > There may be some debate about whether the ops limits are "physically > attached", but my reading of the regs says that they are part of the > Airworthiness Cert. The Airworthiness Cert must be in the plane, > therefore > the ops limits must be carried in the plane when it flies. > > I will probably regret having brought this up. > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:11:19 AM PST US From: Luke Sollitt Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 --> Yak-List message posted by: Luke Sollitt I think the airworthiness certificate is for the plane, not the owner. It never expires except by lack of compliance with an AD or lack of annual (or in our case, condition inspection). Only the registration transfers. Luke On Sat, 18 Jun 2005, Ron Davis wrote: > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" > > I've never found the part that says you need a new Airworthiness Cert when > the plane is sold. Can you reference an FAR? Do you get a new one on a > spam can when it's sold or does the new owner use the old cert? > > Luke Sollitt Space Radiation Lab 219 Downs, 220-47 Caltech Pasadena, CA 91125 (626) 395-6634 "That road does not lead towards war, whose gate lies open to the stars" -- Alcuin ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:41:45 AM PST US From: Ernest Martinez Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 --> Yak-List message posted by: Ernest Martinez Whenever the plane is sold OR the homebase is changed a NEW cert must be issued. The homebase and the OWNERS name is clearly written in the ops limitations. In order to get the cert, the ops limits must be given to the FSDO they then stamp the date and the FSDO on the certificate, this is what makes it official. The FSDO guy will ask for your AW cert and issue you a new one with an issue date which is on the FSDO stamp. In the case of jets, a maintenance program must also be submitted with a cover letter showing the home base and the mechanic authorized to do the work. On 6/18/05, Luke Sollitt wrote: > --> Yak-List message posted by: Luke Sollitt > > I think the airworthiness certificate is for the plane, not the owner. It > never expires except by lack of compliance with an AD or lack of annual > (or in our case, condition inspection). Only the registration transfers. > > Luke > > On Sat, 18 Jun 2005, Ron Davis wrote: > > > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" > > > > I've never found the part that says you need a new Airworthiness Cert when > > the plane is sold. Can you reference an FAR? Do you get a new one on a > > spam can when it's sold or does the new owner use the old cert? > > > > > > Luke Sollitt > Space Radiation Lab > 219 Downs, 220-47 Caltech > Pasadena, CA 91125 > (626) 395-6634 > > "That road does not lead towards war, whose gate lies open to the stars" > > -- Alcuin > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:42:17 AM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: operation and limitations for Yak 52 From: "Jon Boede" --> Yak-List message posted by: "Jon Boede" If you're going to re-write them it'd be better to: a) Get with 8130.2E yourself and make up a Word .doc and submit that along with a print of all of 8130.2E ... besides the fact that you're probably handier with Word than is some inspector, it will give you a good understanding of how you're limited and save him some time. b) Reference the home operating base as an external attachment to the operating limitations such that next time all somebody has to do is change the attachment. Jon > --> Yak-List message posted by: Ernest Martinez > > Whenever the plane is sold OR the homebase is changed a NEW cert must > be issued. The homebase and the OWNERS name is clearly written in the > ops limitations. In order to get the cert, the ops limits must be > given to the FSDO they then stamp the date and the FSDO on the > certificate, this is what makes it official. The FSDO guy will ask for > your AW cert and issue you a new one with an issue date which is on > the FSDO stamp. In the case of jets, a maintenance program must also > be submitted with a cover letter showing the home base and the > mechanic authorized to do the work. > > On 6/18/05, Luke Sollitt wrote: >> --> Yak-List message posted by: Luke Sollitt >> >> I think the airworthiness certificate is for the plane, not the owner. >> It >> never expires except by lack of compliance with an AD or lack of annual >> (or in our case, condition inspection). Only the registration transfers. >> >> Luke >> >> On Sat, 18 Jun 2005, Ron Davis wrote: >> >> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" >> > >> > I've never found the part that says you need a new Airworthiness Cert >> when >> > the plane is sold. Can you reference an FAR? Do you get a new one on >> a >> > spam can when it's sold or does the new owner use the old cert? >> > >> > >> >> Luke Sollitt >> Space Radiation Lab >> 219 Downs, 220-47 Caltech >> Pasadena, CA 91125 >> (626) 395-6634 >> >> "That road does not lead towards war, whose gate lies open to the stars" >> >> -- Alcuin >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 11:03:16 AM PST US Subject: RE: Yak-List: The Feds From: "Jon Boede" --> Yak-List message posted by: "Jon Boede" I wonder if you can get an insurance discount for being under satellite surveillance. Jon :-) > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Daniel Fortin" > > Barry, > > It is "Au contraire mon FRERE"!!! Get with it buddy ;-) > > Dan > >>From: Barry Hancock >>Reply-To: yak-list@matronics.com >>To: yak-list@matronics.com >>Subject: Yak-List: The Feds >>Date: Fri, 17 Jun 2005 21:02:36 -0700 >> >>--> Yak-List message posted by: Barry Hancock >> >>On Jun 16, 2005, at 11:58 PM, Yak-List Digest Server wrote: >> >> > You can hire an expensive lawyer to weasel his way through the regs, >> > or you >> > can just ignore them. The feds are pretty busy fighting terrorism and >> > can't >> > be bothered with the little things. >> >>Au contraire, mon fraire... The Feds were very interested in the >>Shared Squadrons the first time we put an ad out in In Flight USA. >>The Feds have been searching for a guy at our airport who is >>advertising flight training in the L-39 (not even ACM, etc.). Anything >>that gets advertised is going to raise the eyebrow of the Feds. >> >>In fact, we (Worldwide Warbirds) have been under satellite surveillance >>for several years....10+ L-39's on the same ramp at any one time seems >>to have their interest.... >> >>Cheers, >> >>Barry >> >> >>Barry Hancock >>Worldwide Warbirds, Inc. >>1-866-L39-JETS >>cell (949) 300-5510 >>www.worldwidewarbirds.com >>www.sharedsquadrons.com ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:49:46 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: [ Jim Goolsby ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! From: Email List Photo Shares --> Yak-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares A new Email List Photo Share is available: Poster: Jim Goolsby Lists: Yak-List,Warbird-List Subject: A real rare warbird. http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/cjpilot710@aol.com.06.18.2005/index.html o Main Photo Share Index http://www.matronics.com/photoshare o Submitting a Photo Share If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the following information along with your email message and files: 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to: 2) Your Full Name: 3) Your Email Address: 4) One line Subject description: 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic: 6) One-line Description of each photo or file: Email the information above and your files and photos to: pictures@matronics.com ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 08:13:48 PM PST US From: "Frank Haertlein" Subject: Yak-List: Great Circle Route Fuel Stop Planner --> Yak-List message posted by: "Frank Haertlein" Yaksters; If you'd like to see what is the shortest route to your destination with the lowest fuel costs along the way then check out this link. It's a great tool for planning cross-country flights. http://www.airnav.com/plan/fuel/ Frank N9110M YAK-52 L71