Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:14 AM - hold fire !! (Mark Jefferies)
2. 04:45 AM - Re: Gear handle in the neutral position (A. Dennis Savarese)
3. 04:49 AM - Re: hold fire !! (A. Dennis Savarese)
4. 04:54 AM - Re: Gear handle in the neutral position (Rob Rowe)
5. 05:18 AM - Re: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position (A. Dennis Savarese)
6. 05:34 AM - Re: No Guts, No Glory (Aviation Collectables) (Roger Kemp)
7. 06:59 AM - Re: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position (cjpilot710@aol.com)
8. 06:59 AM - Re: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position (Ernest Martinez)
9. 07:28 AM - Re: hold fire !! (Ben Marsh)
10. 07:55 AM - Gear handle in the neutral position - modified diagram (Rob Rowe)
11. 08:29 AM - CJ6 purchase (Valkyre1)
12. 08:34 AM - Re: hold fire !! (fish@aviation-tech.com)
13. 09:09 AM - Gear Handle Position (Jeff Linebaugh)
14. 09:31 AM - Re: CJ6 purchase (ANDREWS)
15. 09:47 AM - [ Rob Rowe ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
16. 09:55 AM - Re: CJ6 purchase (Cliff Umscheid)
17. 10:05 AM - Re: CJ6 purchase (ByronMFox@aol.com)
18. 10:32 AM - antique spam can (Aviatre@aol.com)
19. 10:32 AM - Re: CJ6 purchase (Doug Sapp)
20. 11:44 AM - Re: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position (Doug Sapp)
21. 11:48 AM - Re: CJ6 purchase (Roger Kemp)
22. 12:07 PM - Re: CJ6 purchase (Roger Kemp)
23. 12:58 PM - Re: CJ6 purchase (cjpilot710@aol.com)
24. 02:56 PM - Re: Re: Re: louvered panels (Rob Mortara)
25. 04:53 PM - Re: CJ6 purchase (Roger Kemp)
26. 05:22 PM - Re: hold fire !! (Ben Marsh)
27. 05:46 PM - Re: hold fire !! (Brian Lloyd)
28. 06:48 PM - Re: CJ6 purchase (Bitterlich GS11 Mark G)
29. 07:04 PM - Re: hold fire !! (Bitterlich GS11 Mark G)
30. 08:45 PM - Re: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position (Shinden33)
31. 09:04 PM - Re: Gear Handle Position (Shinden33)
32. 09:13 PM - Russian MI-2 helicopter. (Walt Murphy)
33. 10:15 PM - Re: Russian MI-2 helicopter. (D. E. Robertson)
Message 1
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Mark. Noted UR comments nitrous oxide. Knowledgeable.
Looking on web there is a lot of info. I think from reading it (skip
reading) that maybe 10% increase in power is not problematical but over that
special considerations etc as you have noted.
So, 10% that's 36-40hp. Not worth the hassle of a "difficult" system when
that power can easily be obtained in 2 incremental stages.
1 400hp gears
2 Fuel injection.
360 - 400hp on the gears, then another 30+ hp on fuel injection. You will
end up with 1100mm manifold static, exactly the same as the M14R engine with
carburettor, the same power output as the M14R engine but without the huge
price. (38,000$) All of the shelf parts and proven. If you wish we will
build you an engine like this, no problem. 3 months lead time, guaranteed
delivery. 28,000 USD delivered USA, well anywhere in world for that matter.
Our solution is simple and proven, why reinvent the wheel.
that_mail@yahoo.com writes: "I'm seriously considering adding nitrox
injection to my M-14"
BTW, I only get the digest so will only see your replied Wednesday, em
direct for instant responses.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Gear handle in the neutral position |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>
You deplete the air in landing gear actuators and uplock assemblies. ie:
assuming the rear cockpit gear handle is in neutral to begin with, when you
move the front cockpit handle from the down (or up) position to the neutral
position, the air in the landing gear actuators and the uplock assemblies
(the mechanisms that cause the "parrot hooks" to release) is expelled
through the gear handle.
If you were to continue the movement of the gear handle from let's say the
down to up position, while the air is being depleted from the down side of
the actuator, air is forced into the up side of the actuator. This action
is normal and acts like a "shock absorber" for the actuators. However, if
you deplete the air on whichever side the gear is in (up or down) by putting
the gear handle in the neutral position, be aware that if the gear is down
and you move the gear handle first to neutral and let the air pressure
deplete and THEN move it to up, the gear will slam quite noticeably into the
up position.
The lesson to be learned here is if you deplete the air in the actuators by
putting the gear handle to neutral, (assumes the rear cockpit is in neutral)
ALWAYS put the gear handle in the LAST position the gear was in before
moving the gear handle to the opposite position. This will prevent the
unopposed movement of the actuator into the opposite position and the
resultant slamming of the gear into position.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Shinden33" <shinden33@earthlink.net>
Subject: Yak-List: Gear handle in the neutral position
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Shinden33" <shinden33@earthlink.net>
>
> Ladies & Gents,
>
> Excuse my newness to the airplane, but what specifically happens with both
> gear handles in the neutral position?
>
> Scott
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: hold fire !! |
For those contemplating this change, please be sure to take into account the fact
that if you're currently turning the V530 two blade paddle prop on your M14P,
it was not designed for engines over 360 HP. Thus the cost of the 3 blade
MTV or similar prop must be taken into account when budgeting for the changeover.
FWIW
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: Mark Jefferies
To: 'YAK USA LIST'
Cc: that_mail@yahoo.com ; BitterlichMG@cherrypoint.usmc.mil
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 3:10 AM
Subject: Yak-List: hold fire !!
Mark. Noted UR comments nitrous oxide. Knowledgeable.
Looking on web there is a lot of info. I think from reading it (skip reading)
that maybe 10% increase in power is not problematical but over that special considerations
etc as you have noted.
So, 10% that's 36-40hp. Not worth the hassle of a "difficult" system when that
power can easily be obtained in 2 incremental stages.
1 400hp gears
2 Fuel injection.
360 - 400hp on the gears, then another 30+ hp on fuel injection. You will end
up with 1100mm manifold static, exactly the same as the M14R engine with carburettor,
the same power output as the M14R engine but without the huge price.
(38,000$) All of the shelf parts and proven. If you wish we will build you an
engine like this, no problem. 3 months lead time, guaranteed delivery. 28,000
USD delivered USA, well anywhere in world for that matter.
Our solution is simple and proven, why reinvent the wheel.
that_mail@yahoo.com writes: "I'm seriously considering adding nitrox
injection to my M-14" BTW, I only get the digest so will only see your replied
Wednesday, em direct for instant responses.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Gear handle in the neutral position |
Scott,
With both gear levers in neutral then both sides (up / down) of the air
feeds from the gear selector valves to the gear actuators are vented.
Gear up - the up-locks on each gear leg prevent the gear from drooping
Gear down - the ball-bearing locking mechanism in each actuator prevents the
actuator (gear) from collapsing, coupled with the over-centre action of the
actuator on the gear elbow joint.
The above systems assume, of course, you service the up-locks, actuators etc
and have them correctly adjusted.
I've also attached a simple PDF schematic of the air system, which may pose
more questions than it answers!
Hope this helps ...
Rob
------------------------------
Subject: Gear handle in the neutral position
From: Shinden33 (shinden33@earthlink.net)
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Shinden33" <shinden33@earthlink.net>
Ladies & Gents,
Excuse my newness to the airplane, but what specifically happens with both
gear handles in the neutral position?
Scott
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Gear handle in the neutral position |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>
Rob,
That is an outstanding drawing of the pneumatic system. If I may make one
suggestion to help differentiate the flap actuator from the landing gear
actuator, maybe you could draw the shaft coming out of the flap actuator in
both directions (since that is the way it really works) rather than only one
direction which makes the flap actuator look identical to the gear
actuators.
Other than that, it is great!
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Rowe" <yak-list@robrowe.plus.com>
Subject: Yak-List: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position
Scott,
With both gear levers in neutral then both sides (up / down) of the air
feeds from the gear selector valves to the gear actuators are vented.
Gear up - the up-locks on each gear leg prevent the gear from drooping
Gear down - the ball-bearing locking mechanism in each actuator prevents the
actuator (gear) from collapsing, coupled with the over-centre action of the
actuator on the gear elbow joint.
The above systems assume, of course, you service the up-locks, actuators etc
and have them correctly adjusted.
I've also attached a simple PDF schematic of the air system, which may pose
more questions than it answers!
Hope this helps ...
Rob
------------------------------
Subject: Gear handle in the neutral position
From: Shinden33 (shinden33@earthlink.net)
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Shinden33" <shinden33@earthlink.net>
Ladies & Gents,
Excuse my newness to the airplane, but what specifically happens with both
gear handles in the neutral position?
Scott
Message 6
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| Subject: | No Guts, No Glory (Aviation Collectables) |
Nuts! Gotta admit..both are pretty cute!
Doc
----- Original Message -----
From: Bitterlich GS11 Mark G
Subject: RE: Yak-List: No Guts, No Glory (Aviation Collectables)
Doc has a SISTER?
Personally, I was eye-balling his daughter......
:-)
MGB
-----Original Message-----
From: Francis Butler [mailto:francis_butler@msn.com]
Subject: Re: Yak-List: No Guts, No Glory (Aviation Collectables)
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Francis Butler" <francis_butler@msn.com>
Sorry Doc, I just had to throw in a post today. There are many of us that
just lurk out here on the list and rarely add our two cents. But let's face
it, this list is 25% useful information from people like Richard Goode, Mark
Jefferies, Mark Bitterlich, Doug Sapp, Jill G, Jeff L, Brian Lloyd and a few
others and the rest is nothing more than B.S and is of entertainment value
only. Never boring, always entertaining. And now that we are at the point
of listing our personal libraries, I just couldn't help it. Sorry.
By the way, you can keep your wingman, I know that's a special bond with air
force types. Us Marines are looking for your sisters.
FB
>From: "Roger Kemp" <viperdoc@mindspring.com>
>Reply-To: yak-list@matronics.com
>To: yak-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Yak-List: No Guts, No Glory (Aviation Collectables)
>Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2005 13:52:21 -0500
>
>--> Yak-List message posted by: "Roger Kemp" <viperdoc@mindspring.com>
>
>Francis,
>You obviously are bored with the list. You need to be introduced to my
>favorite XC wingman, Lt. Richard Gozenya.
>Doc
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: Francis Butler <francis_butler@msn.com>
> > To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> > Date: 10/24/2005 1:15:39 PM
> > Subject: Re: Yak-List: No Guts, No Glory (Aviation Collectables)
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Francis Butler"
><francis_butler@msn.com>
> >
> >
> > As long as we are going to show off our collectables.....
> > For sale - collectors edition
> > 1st edition book titled "Green Eggs and Ham" by Dr. Seuss
> > Will draw picture of airplane on cover for you aviation collectors.
> >
> > For a few dollars extra, will throw in copy of "One Fish Two Fish Red
>Fish
> > Blue Fish" that can be re-titled with a stroke of my Sharpie "One Yak
>Two
> > Yak Red Yak Blue Yak".
> >
> > And as long as we are wasting space on the internet, how bout a rehash
>of
>a
> > limerick or two. A few of those were highly entertaining.
> >
> > FB
> > Grey Yak Red Yak
> > RB-10 (100% complete)
> > RB-10 (80% complete, no rubber band)
> > RB-10 (data plate only, no balsa airframe or rubber band)
> >
> > I luv this Yak list....
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Gear handle in the neutral position |
In a message dated 10/25/2005 7:57:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
yak-list@robrowe.plus.com writes:
Here is a little twist. While the CJ and Yak systems are very similar,
there are some CJ WITHOUT gear up locks. Putting the gear handle from up to
neutral as some manuals call for, will only cause the gear to fall. IOW my gear
handle MUST remain up all the time. My CJ came China like that and I found
two different system drawings showing that.
There was a while back a lot of discussion about the whys and why nots. The
biggest concern seem to be the "ware" of O rings in the actuators by leaving
the gear handle in the up position. Ware come from movement of the O rings
as the piston moves in the actuator, not while its sealing and not in motion.
If the act of 'sealing' was a 'ware' consideration, than ware would be a
problem with the gear in the down position too.
I personally think the system without the up locks is better. One, if you
lose air, the gear starts to fall by it self. You let it go all the way down
and than open the emergency air valve, saving some pressure. Two, the system
is less complicated (fewer B nuts and fittings) therefore less leaks. A
number of years ago while on a short x-country flight to show off my airplane
to
my F-15 driver nephew, I developed a leak that the compressor was just able
to keep up with. Around 25 atmospheres, while doing some acro the gear
would start to fall when I pulled 2 or 3 Gs.
I've been flying this system on my airplane for some 11 years and 1,500 plus
hours (the airplane had 1,000 when I got it). In that time I've changed the
seals on the landing gear actuators maybe 2 or 3 times. The flap actuator
seals have actually give me the most problems.
Remember on the CJ, that the rear cockpit gear must be in neutral, in order
for the front gear handle to work. The rear handle OVER RIDES the front
handle not matter what its position.
Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
Scott,
With both gear levers in neutral then both sides (up / down) of the air
feeds from the gear selector valves to the gear actuators are vented.
Gear up - the up-locks on each gear leg prevent the gear from drooping
Gear down - the ball-bearing locking mechanism in each actuator prevents the
actuator (gear) from collapsing, coupled with the over-centre action of the
actuator on the gear elbow joint.
The above systems assume, of course, you service the up-locks, actuators etc
and have them correctly adjusted.
I've also attached a simple PDF schematic of the air system, which may pose
more questions than it answers!
Hope this helps ...
Rob
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Gear handle in the neutral position |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Ernest Martinez <erniel29@gmail.com>
That is a really nice drawing and from what I can see off hand, most
of it applies to the CJ system also, except that the on CJ, the main
air valve (labeled main air tap) is between the distribution point and
the main air tank, which means that you have to open the valve in
order to fill the tank. One other thing I noticed is that the CJ has a
check valve to prevent emergency air from backfeeding into the main
system.
On 10/25/05, A. Dennis Savarese <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>
>
> Rob,
> That is an outstanding drawing of the pneumatic system. If I may make one
> suggestion to help differentiate the flap actuator from the landing gear
> actuator, maybe you could draw the shaft coming out of the flap actuator in
> both directions (since that is the way it really works) rather than only one
> direction which makes the flap actuator look identical to the gear
> actuators.
>
> Other than that, it is great!
> Dennis
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rob Rowe" <yak-list@robrowe.plus.com>
> To: <Yak-List@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 6:48 AM
> Subject: Yak-List: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position
>
>
> Scott,
>
> With both gear levers in neutral then both sides (up / down) of the air
> feeds from the gear selector valves to the gear actuators are vented.
>
> Gear up - the up-locks on each gear leg prevent the gear from drooping
>
> Gear down - the ball-bearing locking mechanism in each actuator prevents the
> actuator (gear) from collapsing, coupled with the over-centre action of the
> actuator on the gear elbow joint.
>
> The above systems assume, of course, you service the up-locks, actuators etc
> and have them correctly adjusted.
>
> I've also attached a simple PDF schematic of the air system, which may pose
> more questions than it answers!
>
> Hope this helps ...
>
> Rob
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Gear handle in the neutral position
> From: Shinden33 (shinden33@earthlink.net)
> Date: Mon Oct 24 - 11:15 PM
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Shinden33" <shinden33@earthlink.net>
>
> Ladies & Gents,
>
> Excuse my newness to the airplane, but what specifically happens with both
> gear handles in the neutral position?
>
> Scott
>
>
Message 9
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Greetings,
I spend a little time in the unlimited racing environment.
While there are a few using nitrous, some of the fast movers you'd expect to
take liberal doses of the juice, don't use it at all. Dago Red was
untouchably fast, without nitrous. September Fury, not yet at full stride,
is not a user. The Dreadnought racer, races clean. Why?
Nitrous oxide injection is really hard on motors. The most
successful racer in modern unlimited racing history (quiz time-Hint: he
doesn't fly) often states that he loved it when Rare Bear ran nitrous,
because he knew it lost 500 horsepower every time it got an injection. 500
fewer bhp makes for a slower gold race.
As nitrous oxide relates to an M-14P in a Yak, one must ask why?
Obviously, given my preamble, it ain't a winning way, unless one enjoys
replacing engines. As well, all the little Yaks are really draggy. Again,
why?
What would be interesting is building a fast mover with an
M-14P. While there is no class for such a racer, it could be a little sexy.
Even then, controlling drag will produce more speed then injecting the motor
with a highly corrosive and disastrous does of unnecessary hormones.
Regards,
BHM
_____
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark Jefferies
Subject: Yak-List: hold fire !!
Mark. Noted UR comments nitrous oxide. Knowledgeable.
Looking on web there is a lot of info. I think from reading it (skip
reading) that maybe 10% increase in power is not problematical but over that
special considerations etc as you have noted.
So, 10% that's 36-40hp. Not worth the hassle of a "difficult" system when
that power can easily be obtained in 2 incremental stages.
1 400hp gears
2 Fuel injection.
360 - 400hp on the gears, then another 30+ hp on fuel injection. You will
end up with 1100mm manifold static, exactly the same as the M14R engine with
carburettor, the same power output as the M14R engine but without the huge
price. (38,000$) All of the shelf parts and proven. If you wish we will
build you an engine like this, no problem. 3 months lead time, guaranteed
delivery. 28,000 USD delivered USA, well anywhere in world for that matter.
Our solution is simple and proven, why reinvent the wheel.
that_mail@yahoo.com writes: "I'm seriously considering adding nitrox
injection to my M-14"
BTW, I only get the digest so will only see your replied Wednesday, em
direct for instant responses.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Gear handle in the neutral position - modified diagram |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Rob Rowe" <yak-list@robrowe.plus.com>
Dennis,
Good point ... I'll post the modified diagram on the photo share site to
save cluttering everyone's email (should have thought of that originally
...doh!)
Rob
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position
From: A. Dennis Savarese (dsavarese@elmore.rr.com)
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese"
<dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>
Rob,
That is an outstanding drawing of the pneumatic system. If I may make one
suggestion to help differentiate the flap actuator from the landing gear
actuator, maybe you could draw the shaft coming out of the flap actuator in
both directions (since that is the way it really works) rather than only one
direction which makes the flap actuator look identical to the gear
actuators.
Other than that, it is great!
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Rowe" <yak-list@robrowe.plus.com>
Subject: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position
Scott,
With both gear levers in neutral then both sides (up / down) of the air
feeds from the gear selector valves to the gear actuators are vented.
Gear up - the up-locks on each gear leg prevent the gear from drooping
Gear down - the ball-bearing locking mechanism in each actuator prevents the
actuator (gear) from collapsing, coupled with the over-centre action of the
actuator on the gear elbow joint.
The above systems assume, of course, you service the up-locks, actuators etc
and have them correctly adjusted.
I've also attached a simple PDF schematic of the air system, which may pose
more questions than it answers!
Hope this helps ...
Rob
------------------------------
Subject: Gear handle in the neutral position
From: Shinden33 (shinden33@earthlink.net)
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Shinden33" <shinden33@earthlink.net>
Ladies & Gents,
Excuse my newness to the airplane, but what specifically happens with both
gear handles in the neutral position?
Scott
Message 11
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|
Hey out there. I am a recently retired Delta pilot and am strongly considering
purchasing a 1974 Nanchang CJ6. I have flown with a fellow DAL pilot in
his and it is just what I'm looking for.
My background is civilian with several thousand CFI hours in Cessnas and a
brief ownership stint in a T-34. That, however was way back in my early twenties.
Essentially, the last thing that I've flown in the past 29 years were airliners
and finally left seat on a Boeing 767, so I'm starting over assuming I know
basically nothing again about this type of aircraft.
Any assistance that those of you YAK pilots out there can give me regarding
what to look for in purchasing one that I can enjoy for the second half of my
aviation lifetime would be much appreciated.
The aircraft appears to be in good shape, but I am primarily concerned about
the possibility of corrosion and metal fatigue. I do know that anodized steel
is a definite plus in this machine.
I also trust the soon to be previous owner. The aircraft history includes
3000-4000hrs put on in China by military training. Of course there is no guarantee
on what was done to it then, but the current owner has no reason to suspect
any overspeeds, over stresses etc.
It needs an annual but only has about 86 hours on the engine since import.
I have been perusing your email chat for the last few days and you folks have
some great info going on....besides that it's just plain fun.
Again, any suggestions or comments regarding what to look for when purchasing
one will be much appreciated. Has anyone ever actually done a dye check on
the airframe of a Nanchang, or is this ridiculously expensive?
What are the systems and flight characteristic problems inherent to this type
aircraft?
Many Thanks Guys, (& Ladies)
Fraternally, - Val
Message 12
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--> Yak-List message posted by: fish@aviation-tech.com
BHM,
Mat Jackson (unlimited Racer) was talking of doing just that at Reno this year.
I have offered him my AI-14 to use as a mock-up for his project. It will be
a single seat, carbon fiber aircraft.
Only the future will know if it actually happens!
Fly Safe
John Fischer
>
>
>Greetings,
>
>
>
> I spend a little time in the unlimited racing environment.
>While there are a few using nitrous, some of the fast movers you'd expect to
>take liberal doses of the juice, don't use it at all. Dago Red was
>untouchably fast, without nitrous. September Fury, not yet at full stride,
>is not a user. The Dreadnought racer, races clean. Why?
>
>
>
> Nitrous oxide injection is really hard on motors. The most
>successful racer in modern unlimited racing history (quiz time-Hint: he
>doesn't fly) often states that he loved it when Rare Bear ran nitrous,
>because he knew it lost 500 horsepower every time it got an injection. 500
>fewer bhp makes for a slower gold race.
>
>
>
> As nitrous oxide relates to an M-14P in a Yak, one must ask why?
>Obviously, given my preamble, it ain't a winning way, unless one enjoys
>replacing engines. As well, all the little Yaks are really draggy. Again,
>why?
>
>
>
> What would be interesting is building a fast mover with an
>M-14P. While there is no class for such a racer, it could be a little sexy.
>Even then, controlling drag will produce more speed then injecting the motor
>with a highly corrosive and disastrous does of unnecessary hormones.
>
>
>
>Regards,
>
>
>
>BHM
>
>
>
> _____
>
>From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark Jefferies
>Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 1:11 AM
>To: 'YAK USA LIST'
>Cc: that_mail@yahoo.com; BitterlichMG@cherrypoint.usmc.mil
>Subject: Yak-List: hold fire !!
>
>
>
>Mark. Noted UR comments nitrous oxide. Knowledgeable.
>
>
>
>Looking on web there is a lot of info. I think from reading it (skip
>reading) that maybe 10% increase in power is not problematical but over that
>special considerations etc as you have noted.
>
>
>
>So, 10% that's 36-40hp. Not worth the hassle of a "difficult" system when
>that power can easily be obtained in 2 incremental stages.
>
>
>
>1 400hp gears
>
>2 Fuel injection.
>
>
>
>360 - 400hp on the gears, then another 30+ hp on fuel injection. You will
>end up with 1100mm manifold static, exactly the same as the M14R engine with
>carburettor, the same power output as the M14R engine but without the huge
>price. (38,000$) All of the shelf parts and proven. If you wish we will
>build you an engine like this, no problem. 3 months lead time, guaranteed
>delivery. 28,000 USD delivered USA, well anywhere in world for that matter.
>
>
>
>
>Our solution is simple and proven, why reinvent the wheel.
>
>
>
> that_mail@yahoo.com writes: "I'm seriously considering adding nitrox
> injection to my M-14"
>
>BTW, I only get the digest so will only see your replied Wednesday, em
>direct for instant responses.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 13
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"yak-list@matronics. com" <yak-list@matronics.com>
| Subject: | Gear Handle Position |
Scott,
Welcome to the group, and to the Yak-List. I think that you will find a
wealth of information, most of it good, but it is no substitute for quality
instruction.
I hope that you received a good thorough systems course when you received
your aircraft. If not, I hope that you would pursue some good thorough
training as soon as you can. All of us depend on each other to safely
operate our aircraft, and have a thorough knowledge of how to operate and
maintain them. If one guy goofs, we all suffer through reputation, and
higher insurance costs.
There are several ways to get quality instruction in our aircraft. The RPA
has Initial Training Syllabi for the CJ-6A and Yak 52 aircraft. Our website
also lists instructors.
If you have any questions, or I can help in any way, feel free to call me
anytime. I do not claim to be the expert, but if I don't know, I can
certainly steer you in the right direction.
Fly Safely,
Jeff Linebaugh
jefflinebaugh@earthlink.net
CJ-6P N621CJ
Memphis, TN
901 850-8776
901 606-6735 cell
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: CJ6 purchase |
Val,
Call Bill Blackwell on your questions about the CJ-6A ( 623) 703-1001
----- Original Message -----
From: Valkyre1
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 8:31 AM
Subject: Yak-List: CJ6 purchase
Hey out there. I am a recently retired Delta pilot and am strongly considering
purchasing a 1974 Nanchang CJ6. I have flown with a fellow DAL pilot in
his and it is just what I'm looking for.
My background is civilian with several thousand CFI hours in Cessnas and
a brief ownership stint in a T-34. That, however was way back in my early twenties.
Essentially, the last thing that I've flown in the past 29 years were airliners
and finally left seat on a Boeing 767, so I'm starting over assuming I
know basically nothing again about this type of aircraft.
Any assistance that those of you YAK pilots out there can give me regarding
what to look for in purchasing one that I can enjoy for the second half of
my aviation lifetime would be much appreciated.
The aircraft appears to be in good shape, but I am primarily concerned about
the possibility of corrosion and metal fatigue. I do know that anodized steel
is a definite plus in this machine.
I also trust the soon to be previous owner. The aircraft history includes
3000-4000hrs put on in China by military training. Of course there is no guarantee
on what was done to it then, but the current owner has no reason to suspect
any overspeeds, over stresses etc.
It needs an annual but only has about 86 hours on the engine since import.
I have been perusing your email chat for the last few days and you folks
have some great info going on....besides that it's just plain fun.
Again, any suggestions or comments regarding what to look for when purchasing
one will be much appreciated. Has anyone ever actually done a dye check
on the airframe of a Nanchang, or is this ridiculously expensive?
What are the systems and flight characteristic problems inherent to this
type aircraft?
Many Thanks Guys, (& Ladies)
Fraternally, - Val
Message 15
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| Subject: | [ Rob Rowe ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Rob Rowe <rr@robrowe.plus.com>
Lists: Yak-List
Subject: YAK-52 Air System Schematic
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/rr@robrowe.plus.com.10.25.2005/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures@matronics.com
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: CJ6 purchase |
Val,
Though you will hear dissenting voices, I submit that you can save a few
intermediate steps and some expense by going directly to the aircraft
which will give you the most total fulfillment and satisfaction. Pass up
the CJ and go directly to a higher plane (pun intended). Buy yourself a
nifty YAK 50 and experience something other than kissing your sister. The
CJs and YAK 52s can't wipe the sweat off the balls of a YAK 50 and best
yet, there's no room for a copilot so you won't have to put up with that
cheap chatter over on the right. Finally, you'll always be the first one
out of the cockpit so you'll never have to look around the side of that
fat headed copilot as you greet the throngs of admiring hero worshippers
who crave to shake your hand upon arrival and congratulate you for that
superb landing. As the girl with the biggies said "Why blend in when you
can stand out?"
Enjoy retirement, show the world what you're REALLY worth, you can
make more money in a year or two in this market than you made in your
entire career hauling those 200 "xperts" around behind you.
Submitted with humility, conviction and grattitude to all the girls
who loved me (and compassion for all those guys junior to me who
couldn't get my line of flying ).
CLIFF UMSCHEID EAL 1950 to 1987
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 09:31:21 -0600 "Valkyre1" <Valkyre1@comcast.net>
writes:
Hey out there. I am a recently retired Delta pilot and am strongly
considering purchasing a 1974 Nanchang CJ6. I have flown with a fellow
DAL pilot in his and it is just what I'm looking for.
My background is civilian with several thousand CFI hours in Cessnas
and a brief ownership stint in a T-34. That, however was way back in my
early twenties.
Essentially, the last thing that I've flown in the past 29 years
were airliners and finally left seat on a Boeing 767, so I'm starting
over assuming I know basically nothing again about this type of aircraft.
Any assistance that those of you YAK pilots out there can give me
regarding what to look for in purchasing one that I can enjoy for the
second half of my aviation lifetime would be much appreciated.
The aircraft appears to be in good shape, but I am primarily
concerned about the possibility of corrosion and metal fatigue. I do know
that anodized steel is a definite plus in this machine.
I also trust the soon to be previous owner. The aircraft history
includes 3000-4000hrs put on in China by military training. Of course
there is no guarantee on what was done to it then, but the current owner
has no reason to suspect any overspeeds, over stresses etc.
It needs an annual but only has about 86 hours on the engine since
import.
I have been perusing your email chat for the last few days and you
folks have some great info going on....besides that it's just plain fun.
Again, any suggestions or comments regarding what to look for when
purchasing one will be much appreciated. Has anyone ever actually done a
dye check on the airframe of a Nanchang, or is this ridiculously
expensive?
What are the systems and flight characteristic problems inherent to
this type aircraft?
Many Thanks Guys, (& Ladies)
Fraternally, - Val
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: CJ6 purchase |
Val, I strongly recommend that you have either Bill Blackwell, 623-703-1001
(Phoenix area) or Jim Selby (northern California) 831-883-1266, do a
prepurchase inspection for you. Perhaps some of our folks in the central US and
eastern
seaboard can recommend others depending on where you live. Better not to be
surprised. Delighted that you'll be joining us.
Thanks, Blitz
Byron M. Fox
The RPA Store
80 Milland Drive
Mill Valley, CA 94941
415-380-0907 Eves
414-307-2405 Days
Message 18
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| Subject: | antique spam can |
I am going to be selling my Cessna 140. Not nearly as much fun as the CJ,
but it sure uses a lot less gas!
Anyone interested, please contact me off list.
Frank Surfas
home 530-644-0272
cell 818-335-7698
Message 19
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Val,
Welcome aboard! Doug Sapp here, I'm the CJ6 parts guy, if I can be of any
assistance feel free to contact me off list.
Always Yakin,
Doug Sapp
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Valkyre1
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 8:31 AM
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Subject: Yak-List: CJ6 purchase
Hey out there. I am a recently retired Delta pilot and am strongly
considering purchasing a 1974 Nanchang CJ6. I have flown with a fellow DAL
pilot in his and it is just what I'm looking for.
My background is civilian with several thousand CFI hours in Cessnas
and a brief ownership stint in a T-34. That, however was way back in my
early twenties.
Essentially, the last thing that I've flown in the past 29 years were
airliners and finally left seat on a Boeing 767, so I'm starting over
assuming I know basically nothing again about this type of aircraft.
Any assistance that those of you YAK pilots out there can give me
regarding what to look for in purchasing one that I can enjoy for the second
half of my aviation lifetime would be much appreciated.
The aircraft appears to be in good shape, but I am primarily
concerned about the possibility of corrosion and metal fatigue. I do know
that anodized steel is a definite plus in this machine.
I also trust the soon to be previous owner. The aircraft history
includes 3000-4000hrs put on in China by military training. Of course there
is no guarantee on what was done to it then, but the current owner has no
reason to suspect any overspeeds, over stresses etc.
It needs an annual but only has about 86 hours on the engine since
import.
I have been perusing your email chat for the last few days and you
folks have some great info going on....besides that it's just plain fun.
Again, any suggestions or comments regarding what to look for when
purchasing one will be much appreciated. Has anyone ever actually done a dye
check on the airframe of a Nanchang, or is this ridiculously expensive?
What are the systems and flight characteristic problems inherent to
this type aircraft?
Many Thanks Guys, (& Ladies)
Fraternally, - Val
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Gear handle in the neutral position |
Jim,
The next time your flap or gear actuators start to leak send them to me and
I'll overhaul them for you. I now have the proper factory original square
cut 0 rings, felt seals and new steel top mounting lug (with new bearing).
This is the lug that is on the upper end of the nose gear actuator, where it
attaches to the airframe. We discovered that some of the stock aluminum
factory mounting lugs have a problem. It is my belief that they forgot to
heat treat some of them. We Rockwell hardness tested 6 of them and they
Rockwelled from a low of 7 to a high of 18. The units that tested below 12
all showed elongation in the area where the bearing was pressed in. One was
so bad that the bearing was slopping up and down in the oblong'd hole. It
seemed that the units which tested over 12 had good round bearing holes (I'm
speaking of the hole that the bearing is pressed into).
Actuator test: Place the actuator in a vice, put a pressure gauge on the
forward port. Apply 150 psi to the aft port (ram will extend), you should
have 0 pressure loss in 5 minutes. Next, reverse the process and check the
ram in the retracted position. After the 5 minute check I leave the
pressure on for 1 hour, if my loss is more than 2% (3 psi) over an hour's
time, I pull it down and start over. If a pressure loss is noted use soapy
water (30% water max) to check all possible leak points.
Shop note: When you paint the retract cly do so with the ram about 50%
extended and mask off the ram. After the paint dries extend the ram and use
thinner or remover to remove any paint that might be on the ram. If any
paint is retracted into the 0 rings it will cause the premature failure of
the end cap 0 rings.
The Chinese tell me that normal "TBO" of any of the actuators (in a clean
air system) should be about 800 to 1000 hours, less if the air system is
dirty or the aircraft is not flown frequently.
Always Yakin,
Doug Sapp
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of cjpilot710@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 6:56 AM
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position
In a message dated 10/25/2005 7:57:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
yak-list@robrowe.plus.com writes:
Here is a little twist. While the CJ and Yak systems are very similar,
there are some CJ WITHOUT gear up locks. Putting the gear handle from up to
neutral as some manuals call for, will only cause the gear to fall. IOW my
gear handle MUST remain up all the time. My CJ came China like that and I
found two different system drawings showing that.
There was a while back a lot of discussion about the whys and why nots.
The biggest concern seem to be the "ware" of O rings in the actuators by
leaving the gear handle in the up position. Ware come from movement of the
O rings as the piston moves in the actuator, not while its sealing and not
in motion. If the act of 'sealing' was a 'ware' consideration, than ware
would be a problem with the gear in the down position too.
I personally think the system without the up locks is better. One, if you
lose air, the gear starts to fall by it self. You let it go all the way
down and than open the emergency air valve, saving some pressure. Two, the
system is less complicated (fewer B nuts and fittings) therefore less leaks.
A number of years ago while on a short x-country flight to show off my
airplane to my F-15 driver nephew, I developed a leak that the compressor
was just able to keep up with. Around 25 atmospheres, while doing some
acro the gear would start to fall when I pulled 2 or 3 Gs.
I've been flying this system on my airplane for some 11 years and 1,500
plus hours (the airplane had 1,000 when I got it). In that time I've
changed the seals on the landing gear actuators maybe 2 or 3 times. The
flap actuator seals have actually give me the most problems.
Remember on the CJ, that the rear cockpit gear must be in neutral, in
order for the front gear handle to work. The rear handle OVER RIDES the
front handle not matter what its position.
Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
Scott,
With both gear levers in neutral then both sides (up / down) of the air
feeds from the gear selector valves to the gear actuators are vented.
Gear up - the up-locks on each gear leg prevent the gear from drooping
Gear down - the ball-bearing locking mechanism in each actuator prevents
the
actuator (gear) from collapsing, coupled with the over-centre action of
the
actuator on the gear elbow joint.
The above systems assume, of course, you service the up-locks, actuators
etc
and have them correctly adjusted.
I've also attached a simple PDF schematic of the air system, which may
pose
more questions than it answers!
Hope this helps ...
Rob
Message 21
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Val,
A couple of contacts for you: Rich Hess @ hess737@aol.com and Dennis Savarese@
dsavarese@elmore.rr.com.
Doug Sapp on this list. They all can help you as there others on this list that
will gladly give advice. Some worth using.
Doc
----- Original Message -----
From: Valkyre1
Subject: Yak-List: CJ6 purchase
Hey out there. I am a recently retired Delta pilot and am strongly considering
purchasing a 1974 Nanchang CJ6. I have flown with a fellow DAL pilot in
his and it is just what I'm looking for.
My background is civilian with several thousand CFI hours in Cessnas and a
brief ownership stint in a T-34. That, however was way back in my early twenties.
Essentially, the last thing that I've flown in the past 29 years were airliners
and finally left seat on a Boeing 767, so I'm starting over assuming I know
basically nothing again about this type of aircraft.
Any assistance that those of you YAK pilots out there can give me regarding
what to look for in purchasing one that I can enjoy for the second half of my
aviation lifetime would be much appreciated.
The aircraft appears to be in good shape, but I am primarily concerned about
the possibility of corrosion and metal fatigue. I do know that anodized steel
is a definite plus in this machine.
I also trust the soon to be previous owner. The aircraft history includes
3000-4000hrs put on in China by military training. Of course there is no guarantee
on what was done to it then, but the current owner has no reason to suspect
any overspeeds, over stresses etc.
It needs an annual but only has about 86 hours on the engine since import.
I have been perusing your email chat for the last few days and you folks have
some great info going on....besides that it's just plain fun.
Again, any suggestions or comments regarding what to look for when purchasing
one will be much appreciated. Has anyone ever actually done a dye check on
the airframe of a Nanchang, or is this ridiculously expensive?
What are the systems and flight characteristic problems inherent to this type
aircraft?
Many Thanks Guys, (& Ladies)
Fraternally, - Val
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: CJ6 purchase |
Ah hell, why not get both a 50 and a 52?
Doc
----- Original Message -----
From: Cliff Umscheid
Subject: Re: Yak-List: CJ6 purchase
Val,
Though you will hear dissenting voices, I submit that you can save a few intermediate
steps and some expense by going directly to the aircraft which will give
you the most total fulfillment and satisfaction. Pass up the CJ and go directly
to a higher plane (pun intended). Buy yourself a nifty YAK 50 and experience
something other than kissing your sister. The CJs and YAK 52s can't wipe the
sweat off the balls of a YAK 50 and best yet, there's no room for a copilot
so you won't have to put up with that cheap chatter over on the right. Finally,
you'll always be the first one out of the cockpit so you'll never have to
look around the side of that fat headed copilot as you greet the throngs of
admiring hero worshippers who crave to shake your hand upon arrival and congratulate
you for that superb landing. As the girl with the biggies said "Why blend
in when you can stand out?"
Enjoy retirement, show the world what you're REALLY worth, you can make more
money in a year or two in this market than you made in your entire career hauling
those 200 "xperts" around behind you.
Submitted with humility, conviction and grattitude to all the girls who loved
me (and compassion for all those guys junior to me who couldn't get my line
of flying ).
CLIFF UMSCHEID EAL 1950 to 1987
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 09:31:21 -0600 "Valkyre1" <Valkyre1@comcast.net> writes:
Hey out there. I am a recently retired Delta pilot and am strongly considering
purchasing a 1974 Nanchang CJ6. I have flown with a fellow DAL pilot in
his and it is just what I'm looking for.
My background is civilian with several thousand CFI hours in Cessnas and a
brief ownership stint in a T-34. That, however was way back in my early twenties.
Essentially, the last thing that I've flown in the past 29 years were airliners
and finally left seat on a Boeing 767, so I'm starting over assuming I know
basically nothing again about this type of aircraft.
Any assistance that those of you YAK pilots out there can give me regarding
what to look for in purchasing one that I can enjoy for the second half of my
aviation lifetime would be much appreciated.
The aircraft appears to be in good shape, but I am primarily concerned about
the possibility of corrosion and metal fatigue. I do know that anodized steel
is a definite plus in this machine.
I also trust the soon to be previous owner. The aircraft history includes
3000-4000hrs put on in China by military training. Of course there is no guarantee
on what was done to it then, but the current owner has no reason to suspect
any overspeeds, over stresses etc.
It needs an annual but only has about 86 hours on the engine since import.
I have been perusing your email chat for the last few days and you folks have
some great info going on....besides that it's just plain fun.
Again, any suggestions or comments regarding what to look for when purchasing
one will be much appreciated. Has anyone ever actually done a dye check on
the airframe of a Nanchang, or is this ridiculously expensive?
What are the systems and flight characteristic problems inherent to this type
aircraft?
Many Thanks Guys, (& Ladies)
Fraternally, - Val
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Re: CJ6 purchase |
In a message dated 10/25/2005 12:56:07 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
netmaster15@juno.com writes:
Val,
Don't listen to that EAL guy (gee look at his retirement date! He's older
than dirt). :-) The Yak-50 is good but there is this issue (or rumor) its
only good for 500 hours. Hmmmm? Like to clear that one up. Beside being=20an
retired airline guy, - - you are a retired DAL guy. Now not to put disparity
on you back ground, but you do need some class here. The CJ is better. You
will always hear ALL Yak pilots hollering "Give me some" when on the wing of a
CJ-6. Most of the time you don't know if they are begging for fuel or the
reduction on the manifold. 9 out of 10 times they are the first to holler
about their low fuel light coming on. They will be the first ones to holler
"Joker" and (with even higher pitch) "Bingo!" :)
"Oh! I don't to fly a Yak fifty
With one seat she may look really nifty
But with fast rolls and snap
She'll s- -t in your lap.
No I don't want to in a Yak fifty."
"But give me a CJ-6 A
An send me into the fray.
With guns and panache
I will kick any ass
Yes! give me a CJ-6 A"
You stick with the CJ-6 decision. She do all the acro you will need to
clean you pipes AND you will have a seat for those gracious ladies to give a ride
to. Plus with the expert counseling from the like "Linedog" and other RPA
folk you'll be in style.
Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
PAA 1966-1986 UAL 1986-2000
(Sorry guys its cold outside and I needed something to do.) :)
Val,
Though you will hear dissenting voices, I submit that you can save a few
intermediate steps and some expense by going directly to the aircraft which=20
will
give you the most total fulfillment and satisfaction. Pass up the CJ and go
directly to a higher plane (pun intended). Buy yourself a nifty YAK 50 and
experience something other than kissing your sister. The CJs and YAK 52s can't
wipe the sweat off the balls of a YAK 50 and best yet, there's no room for
a copilot so you won't have to put up with that cheap chatter over on the
right. Finally, you'll always be the first one out of the cockpit so you'll
never have to look around the side of that fat headed copilot as you greet the
throngs of admiring hero worshippers who crave to shake your hand upon
arrival and congratulate you for that superb landing. As the girl with the biggies
said "Why blend in when you can stand out?"
Enjoy retirement, show the world what you're REALLY worth, you can make
more money in a year or two in this market than you made in your entire
career hauling those 200 "=EBxperts" around behind you.
Submitted with humility, conviction and grattitude to all the girls who
loved me (and compassion for all those guys junior to me who couldn't get=20my
line of flying ).
CLIFF UMSCHEID EAL 1950 to 1987
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 09:31:21 -0600 "Valkyre1" <_Valkyre1@comcast.net_
(mailto:Valkyre1@comcast.net) > writes:
Hey out there. I am a recently retired Delta pilot and am strongly
considering purchasing a 1974 Nanchang CJ6. I have flown with a fellow DAL pilot
in his and it is just what I'm looking for.
My background is civilian with several thousand CFI hours in Cessnas
and a brief ownership stint in a T-34. That, however was way back in my early
twenties.
Essentially, the last thing that I've flown in the past 29 years were
airliners and finally left seat on a Boeing 767, so I'm starting over assuming
I know basically nothing again about this type of aircraft.
Any assistance that those of you YAK pilots out there can give me
regarding what to look for in purchasing one that I can enjoy for the second half
of my aviation lifetime would be much appreciated.
The aircraft appears to be in good shape, but I am primarily concerned
about the possibility of corrosion and metal fatigue. I do know that anodized
steel is a definite plus in this machine.
I also trust the soon to be previous owner. The aircraft history
includes 3000-4000hrs put on in China by military training. Of course there is
no
guarantee on what was done to it then, but the current owner has no reason=20to
suspect any overspeeds, over stresses etc.
It needs an annual but only has about 86 hours on the engine since
import.
I have been perusing your email chat for the last few days and you
folks have some great info going on....besides that it's just plain fun.
Again, any suggestions or comments regarding what to look for when
purchasing one will be much appreciated. Has anyone ever actually done a dye
check on the airframe of a Nanchang, or is this ridiculously expensive?
What are the systems and flight characteristic problems inherent to
this type aircraft?
Many Thanks Guys, (& Ladies)
Fraternally, - Val
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: re: louvered panels |
Craig: could you send pictures where the louvered panels are and the
extension on the exhaust.
With the exhaust extension how does the lower cowl come off.? What type of
exhaust system are you using? I have a stainless one piece. Does your wheel
wells have a fabric patch around the air lines?
Have you seen any changes to the CO levels with these modifications?
rob
_____
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Craig Payne
Subject: Yak-List: Re: re: louvered panels
Barry,
Yes it helps some but I'm not through yet. Adding 3" to the exhaust stacks
moved a lot of the oily stuff down below the underside. Lots cleaner down
there now but still some CO in the rear cockpit., perhaps through wheel
wells. A rear cockpit vent will help in cruise but not much will help when
flying with any AOA.
Craig Payne
cpayne@joimail.com
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: CJ6 purchase |
Ahhh Sh_ _ _ _ _ ttttt!!!! Here we go again! Sloweeerrr Rooollll (CJ) vs quicker
Roll (52) vs snap ROLL (nifty 50) vs SNAP Roll with a full blower 9 G slice
back turn to shoot ya in the Lips as she blows thru with her ears pinned back
and fangs hanging (aka Viper). We are off an running, whose got the longer Pitot
tube?!!!
Anyway Val, Welcome to the Red Star Community, provided you buy a Red Star Aircraft
even if it does have funny bent wings and a curley Q in the middle of the
star!
Sorry Pappy, I too am bored sitting here waiting on my wife to go out for supper
tonight. Liv'n on Mollie time!
Doc
----- Original Message -----
From:
Subject: Re: Yak-List: CJ6 purchase
In a message dated 10/25/2005 12:56:07 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, netmaster15@juno.com
writes:
Val,
Don't listen to that EAL guy (gee look at his retirement date! He's older than
dirt). :-) The Yak-50 is good but there is this issue (or rumor) its only good
for 500 hours. Hmmmm? Like to clear that one up. Beside being an retired
airline guy, - - you are a retired DAL guy. Now not to put disparity on you
back ground, but you do need some class here. The CJ is better. You will always
hear ALL Yak pilots hollering "Give me some" when on the wing of a CJ-6.
Most of the time you don't know if they are begging for fuel or the reduction
on the manifold. 9 out of 10 times they are the first to holler about their low
fuel light coming on. They will be the first ones to holler "Joker" and (with
even higher pitch) "Bingo!" :)
"Oh! I don't to fly a Yak fifty
With one seat she may look really nifty
But with fast rolls and snap
She'll s- -t in your lap.
No I don't want to in a Yak fifty."
"But give me a CJ-6 A
An send me into the fray.
With guns and panache
I will kick any ass
Yes! give me a CJ-6 A"
You stick with the CJ-6 decision. She do all the acro you will need to clean you
pipes AND you will have a seat for those gracious ladies to give a ride to.
Plus with the expert counseling from the like "Linedog" and other RPA folk you'll
be in style.
Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
PAA 1966-1986 UAL 1986-2000
(Sorry guys its cold outside and I needed something to do.) :)
Val,
Though you will hear dissenting voices, I submit that you can save a few intermediate
steps and some expense by going directly to the aircraft which will give
you the most total fulfillment and satisfaction. Pass up the CJ and go directly
to a higher plane (pun intended). Buy yourself a nifty YAK 50 and experience
something other than kissing your sister. The CJs and YAK 52s can't wipe the
sweat off the balls of a YAK 50 and best yet, there's no room for a copilot
so you won't have to put up with that cheap chatter over on the right. Finally,
you'll always be the first one out of the cockpit so you'll never have to
look around the side of that fat headed copilot as you greet the throngs of
admiring hero worshippers who crave to shake your hand upon arrival and congratulate
you for that superb landing. As the girl with the biggies said "Why blend
in when you can stand out?"
Enjoy retirement, show the world what you're REALLY worth, you can make more
money in a year or two in this market than you made in your entire career hauling
those 200 "xperts" around behind you.
Submitted with humility, conviction and grattitude to all the girls who loved
me (and compassion for all those guys junior to me who couldn't get my line
of flying ).
CLIFF UMSCHEID EAL 1950 to 1987
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 09:31:21 -0600 "Valkyre1" <Valkyre1@comcast.net> writes:
Hey out there. I am a recently retired Delta pilot and am strongly considering
purchasing a 1974 Nanchang CJ6. I have flown with a fellow DAL pilot in
his and it is just what I'm looking for.
My background is civilian with several thousand CFI hours in Cessnas and a
brief ownership stint in a T-34. That, however was way back in my early twenties.
Essentially, the last thing that I've flown in the past 29 years were airliners
and finally left seat on a Boeing 767, so I'm starting over assuming I know
basically nothing again about this type of aircraft.
Any assistance that those of you YAK pilots out there can give me regarding
what to look for in purchasing one that I can enjoy for the second half of my
aviation lifetime would be much appreciated.
The aircraft appears to be in good shape, but I am primarily concerned about
the possibility of corrosion and metal fatigue. I do know that anodized steel
is a definite plus in this machine.
I also trust the soon to be previous owner. The aircraft history includes
3000-4000hrs put on in China by military training. Of course there is no guarantee
on what was done to it then, but the current owner has no reason to suspect
any overspeeds, over stresses etc.
It needs an annual but only has about 86 hours on the engine since import.
I have been perusing your email chat for the last few days and you folks have
some great info going on....besides that it's just plain fun.
Again, any suggestions or comments regarding what to look for when purchasing
one will be much appreciated. Has anyone ever actually done a dye check on
the airframe of a Nanchang, or is this ridiculously expensive?
What are the systems and flight characteristic problems inherent to this type
aircraft?
Many Thanks Guys, (& Ladies)
Fraternally, - Val
Message 26
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ben Marsh" <ben@designselect.net>
Matt's a real busy guy with a lot of irons in the fire. As sexy as
one of our little motors would be in a racers, I remain concerned about
homebuilts. Tsunami, The Pond Racer and Miss Ashley killed their pilots
dead. I'm not a great fan of recreating the wheel. Still, I dig speed. We
all do.
BHM
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
fish@aviation-tech.com
Subject: RE: Yak-List: hold fire !!
--> Yak-List message posted by: fish@aviation-tech.com
BHM,
Mat Jackson (unlimited Racer) was talking of doing just that at Reno this
year.
I have offered him my AI-14 to use as a mock-up for his project. It will be
a single seat, carbon fiber aircraft.
Only the future will know if it actually happens!
Fly Safe
John Fischer
>
>
>Greetings,
>
>
>
> I spend a little time in the unlimited racing environment.
>While there are a few using nitrous, some of the fast movers you'd expect
to
>take liberal doses of the juice, don't use it at all. Dago Red was
>untouchably fast, without nitrous. September Fury, not yet at full stride,
>is not a user. The Dreadnought racer, races clean. Why?
>
>
>
> Nitrous oxide injection is really hard on motors. The most
>successful racer in modern unlimited racing history (quiz time-Hint: he
>doesn't fly) often states that he loved it when Rare Bear ran nitrous,
>because he knew it lost 500 horsepower every time it got an injection. 500
>fewer bhp makes for a slower gold race.
>
>
>
> As nitrous oxide relates to an M-14P in a Yak, one must ask
why?
>Obviously, given my preamble, it ain't a winning way, unless one enjoys
>replacing engines. As well, all the little Yaks are really draggy. Again,
>why?
>
>
>
> What would be interesting is building a fast mover with an
>M-14P. While there is no class for such a racer, it could be a little
sexy.
>Even then, controlling drag will produce more speed then injecting the
motor
>with a highly corrosive and disastrous does of unnecessary hormones.
>
>
>
>Regards,
>
>
>
>BHM
>
>
>
> _____
>
>From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark Jefferies
>Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 1:11 AM
>To: 'YAK USA LIST'
>Cc: that_mail@yahoo.com; BitterlichMG@cherrypoint.usmc.mil
>Subject: Yak-List: hold fire !!
>
>
>
>Mark. Noted UR comments nitrous oxide. Knowledgeable.
>
>
>
>Looking on web there is a lot of info. I think from reading it (skip
>reading) that maybe 10% increase in power is not problematical but over
that
>special considerations etc as you have noted.
>
>
>
>So, 10% that's 36-40hp. Not worth the hassle of a "difficult" system when
>that power can easily be obtained in 2 incremental stages.
>
>
>
>1 400hp gears
>
>2 Fuel injection.
>
>
>
>360 - 400hp on the gears, then another 30+ hp on fuel injection. You will
>end up with 1100mm manifold static, exactly the same as the M14R engine
with
>carburettor, the same power output as the M14R engine but without the huge
>price. (38,000$) All of the shelf parts and proven. If you wish we will
>build you an engine like this, no problem. 3 months lead time, guaranteed
>delivery. 28,000 USD delivered USA, well anywhere in world for that
matter.
>
>
>
>
>Our solution is simple and proven, why reinvent the wheel.
>
>
>
> that_mail@yahoo.com writes: "I'm seriously considering adding nitrox
> injection to my M-14"
>
>BTW, I only get the digest so will only see your replied Wednesday, em
>direct for instant responses.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: hold fire !! |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
Ben Marsh wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ben Marsh" <ben@designselect.net>
>
> Matt's a real busy guy with a lot of irons in the fire. As sexy as
> one of our little motors would be in a racers, I remain concerned about
> homebuilts. Tsunami, The Pond Racer and Miss Ashley killed their pilots
> dead. I'm not a great fan of recreating the wheel. Still, I dig speed. We
> all do.
But consider the biplane, sport, and Formula 1 classes. These are all
"homebuilts". They have a pretty reasonable safety record. I am not sure it is
all that fair to paint all "homebuilts" with the same brush here.
--
Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr.
brian-yak@lloyd.com Folsom, CA 95630
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery
Message 28
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Pappy.... I tend to bow to your superior judgment and experience in most all
things... except for this. I agree that a CJ-6 is a super airplane. It's
also a fast little bugger at the very top end. I am not going to speak to
the area of "class" because that is simply perspective and personal opinion.
It is also possible that some of the YAK-52 guys might occasionally ask you
to "give me some" although maybe it's not your airplane that they're talking
about... but we'll leave that subject alone, thank you very much! .
That said, Boyo... do not even think for one nanosecond that I can't stuff
my fat ass (300 plus pounds) into my stock 2 bladed 360 horsepower YAK-50
and just leave you in the DUST on takeoff... you won't be asking to "give me
some", you'll be wondering whether you forgot your contact lenses as you
lose SIGHT of that speck in the distance called MY AIRPLANE. With a 5500
foot runway at sea level, I'll do a SAFE half Cuban on take-off... pull-up
before the end of the runway...... care to try to stay with me?
Short on fuel ? Absolutely, I only carry about 28 gallons useful. 160
nautical miles is about as far as I can go on one tank safely, but then I
want to get out and stretch my legs anyway. Not quite as fast as a CJ-6 ?
I do not know truthfully, but I can reach about 170 knots at full power.
Absolutely unbelievable short field performance with NO FLAPS? See picture:
YAK-50. Faster climb than ANYTHING else with the same engine prop/combo?
See picture: YAK-50
However.... if you have little taildragger time, fly typically with your
feet on the floor, need a forgiving airplane that was never meant to WIN
WORLD COMPETITIONS, and need that Babe in the back, because that's the ONLY
way you might "get some" ... well then, of course the CJ-6 is the best
choice.
Oh I live to fly my Yak Fifty
With one seat she DOES look real nifty
Her maneuvers are spectacular
even if they aren't in Pappy's vernacular
So I will continue to kick ass in my Fifty
Every once in awhile comes a CJ-6
It's an airplane that's not fun to fix
how can anyone pay more than a cent
in an airplane that comes with wings bent
Oh why in the world buy a CJ-6
Mark Bitterlich
-----Original Message-----
From: cjpilot710@aol.com [mailto:cjpilot710@aol.com]
Subject: Re: Yak-List: CJ6 purchase
In a message dated 10/25/2005 12:56:07 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
netmaster15@juno.com writes:
Val,
Don't listen to that EAL guy (gee look at his retirement date! He's older
than dirt). :-) The Yak-50 is good but there is this issue (or rumor) its
only good for 500 hours. Hmmmm? Like to clear that one up. Beside being
an retired airline guy, - - you are a retired DAL guy. Now not to put
disparity on you back ground, but you do need some class here. The CJ is
better. You will always hear ALL Yak pilots hollering "Give me some" when
on the wing of a CJ-6. Most of the time you don't know if they are begging
for fuel or the reduction on the manifold. 9 out of 10 times they are the
first to holler about their low fuel light coming on. They will be the
first ones to holler "Joker" and (with even higher pitch) "Bingo!" :)
"Oh! I don't to fly a Yak fifty
With one seat she may look really nifty
But with fast rolls and snap
She'll s- -t in your lap.
No I don't want to in a Yak fifty."
"But give me a CJ-6 A
An send me into the fray.
With guns and panache
I will kick any ass
Yes! give me a CJ-6 A"
You stick with the CJ-6 decision. She do all the acro you will need to
clean you pipes AND you will have a seat for those gracious ladies to give a
ride to. Plus with the expert counseling from the like "Linedog" and other
RPA folk you'll be in style.
Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
PAA 1966-1986 UAL 1986-2000
(Sorry guys its cold outside and I needed something to do.) :)
Val,
Though you will hear dissenting voices, I submit that you can save a few
intermediate steps and some expense by going directly to the aircraft which
will give you the most total fulfillment and satisfaction. Pass up the CJ
and go directly to a higher plane (pun intended). Buy yourself a nifty YAK
50 and experience something other than kissing your sister. The CJs and YAK
52s can't wipe the sweat off the balls of a YAK 50 and best yet, there's
no room for a copilot so you won't have to put up with that cheap chatter
over on the right. Finally, you'll always be the first one out of the
cockpit so you'll never have to look around the side of that fat headed
copilot as you greet the throngs of admiring hero worshippers who crave to
shake your hand upon arrival and congratulate you for that superb landing.
As the girl with the biggies said "Why blend in when you can stand out?"
Enjoy retirement, show the world what you're REALLY worth, you can make
more money in a year or two in this market than you made in your entire
career hauling those 200 "xperts" around behind you.
Submitted with humility, conviction and grattitude to all the girls who
loved me (and compassion for all those guys junior to me who couldn't get
my line of flying ).
CLIFF UMSCHEID EAL 1950 to 1987
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 09:31:21 -0600 "Valkyre1" < Valkyre1@comcast.net
<mailto:Valkyre1@comcast.net> > writes:
Hey out there. I am a recently retired Delta pilot and am strongly
considering purchasing a 1974 Nanchang CJ6. I have flown with a fellow DAL
pilot in his and it is just what I'm looking for.
My background is civilian with several thousand CFI hours in Cessnas
and a brief ownership stint in a T-34. That, however was way back in my
early twenties.
Essentially, the last thing that I've flown in the past 29 years were
airliners and finally left seat on a Boeing 767, so I'm starting over
assuming I know basically nothing again about this type of aircraft.
Any assistance that those of you YAK pilots out there can give me
regarding what to look for in purchasing one that I can enjoy for the second
half of my aviation lifetime would be much appreciated.
The aircraft appears to be in good shape, but I am primarily concerned
about the possibility of corrosion and metal fatigue. I do know that
anodized steel is a definite plus in this machine.
I also trust the soon to be previous owner. The aircraft history
includes 3000-4000hrs put on in China by military training. Of course there
is no guarantee on what was done to it then, but the current owner has no
reason to suspect any overspeeds, over stresses etc.
It needs an annual but only has about 86 hours on the engine since
import.
I have been perusing your email chat for the last few days and you
folks have some great info going on....besides that it's just plain fun.
Again, any suggestions or comments regarding what to look for when
purchasing one will be much appreciated. Has anyone ever actually done a dye
check on the airframe of a Nanchang, or is this ridiculously expensive?
What are the systems and flight characteristic problems inherent to
this type aircraft?
Many Thanks Guys, (& Ladies)
Fraternally, - Val
Message 29
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"'yak-list@matronics.com'"
| Subject: | RE: hold fire !! |
Thanks for your comments Mark. I concur with all of your observations and
recommendations. I am indeed especially interested in the fuel injection
and hope that someday it will be offered as a stand alone upgrade.
I may get grief for saying this, but to ME, your price tag for such an
engine seems VERY GOOD. In the meantime, I need to either sell my spare
engine, or run it out before seriously looking at your offer, attractive as
it is!
Best Regards,
Mark Bitterlich
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Jefferies [mailto:mark.j@yakuk.com]
Subject: hold fire !!
Mark. Noted UR comments nitrous oxide. Knowledgeable.
Looking on web there is a lot of info. I think from reading it (skip
reading) that maybe 10% increase in power is not problematical but over that
special considerations etc as you have noted.
So, 10% that's 36-40hp. Not worth the hassle of a "difficult" system when
that power can easily be obtained in 2 incremental stages.
1 400hp gears
2 Fuel injection.
360 - 400hp on the gears, then another 30+ hp on fuel injection. You will
end up with 1100mm manifold static, exactly the same as the M14R engine with
carburettor, the same power output as the M14R engine but without the huge
price. (38,000$) All of the shelf parts and proven. If you wish we will
build you an engine like this, no problem. 3 months lead time, guaranteed
delivery. 28,000 USD delivered USA, well anywhere in world for that matter.
Our solution is simple and proven, why reinvent the wheel.
that_mail@yahoo.com <mailto:that_mail@yahoo.com> writes: "I'm
seriously considering adding nitrox
injection to my M-14"
BTW, I only get the digest so will only see your replied Wednesday, em
direct for instant responses.
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Gear handle in the neutral position |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Shinden33" <shinden33@earthlink.net>
Rob,
I can't open the file. What version of Adobe were you using?
Scott
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Rob Rowe
Subject: Yak-List: Re: Gear handle in the neutral position
Scott,
With both gear levers in neutral then both sides (up / down) of the air
feeds from the gear selector valves to the gear actuators are vented.
Gear up - the up-locks on each gear leg prevent the gear from drooping
Gear down - the ball-bearing locking mechanism in each actuator prevents the
actuator (gear) from collapsing, coupled with the over-centre action of the
actuator on the gear elbow joint.
The above systems assume, of course, you service the up-locks, actuators etc
and have them correctly adjusted.
I've also attached a simple PDF schematic of the air system, which may pose
more questions than it answers!
Hope this helps ...
Rob
------------------------------
Subject: Gear handle in the neutral position
From: Shinden33 (shinden33@earthlink.net)
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Shinden33" <shinden33@earthlink.net>
Ladies & Gents,
Excuse my newness to the airplane, but what specifically happens with both
gear handles in the neutral position?
Scott
Message 31
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| Subject: | Gear Handle Position |
Jeff,
Thanks for the welcome. I don't have the airplane yet but I am talking on
one. I will definitely be seeking the proper instruction once I have an
airplane. I am already going through the flight manual, hence the
quesitons.
Scott
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jeff Linebaugh
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 9:09 AM
To: shinden33@earthlink.net; yak-list@matronics. com
Subject: Yak-List: Gear Handle Position
Scott,
Welcome to the group, and to the Yak-List. I think that you will
find a wealth of information, most of it good, but it is no substitute for
quality instruction.
I hope that you received a good thorough systems course when you
received your aircraft. If not, I hope that you would pursue some good
thorough training as soon as you can. All of us depend on each other to
safely operate our aircraft, and have a thorough knowledge of how to operate
and maintain them. If one guy goofs, we all suffer through reputation, and
higher insurance costs.
There are several ways to get quality instruction in our aircraft.
The RPA has Initial Training Syllabi for the CJ-6A and Yak 52 aircraft. Our
website also lists instructors.
If you have any questions, or I can help in any way, feel free to
call me anytime. I do not claim to be the expert, but if I don't know, I
can certainly steer you in the right direction.
Fly Safely,
Jeff Linebaugh
jefflinebaugh@earthlink.net
CJ-6P N621CJ
Memphis, TN
901 850-8776
901 606-6735 cell
Message 32
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| Subject: | Russian MI-2 helicopter. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Walt Murphy <waltmurphy@charter.net>
I have a friend who is interested in importing an MI-2 helicopter. It
will be based in Reno,NV and I'm curious to know if there are any
others in the western US.
thanks, Walt
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Russian MI-2 helicopter. |
0.15 HTML_TEXT_AFTER_BODY BODY: HTML contains text after BODY close tag
Send Lloyd an email. I believe he has been part of an import of a Mi-2
lloydsea@webtv.net
Regards.
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