Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:48 AM - bail out (Mark Jefferies YAK Uk)
2. 06:18 AM - 52TW - Main Tires & Tubes (David McGirt)
3. 06:41 AM - Re: bail out (fish@aviation-tech.com)
4. 07:38 AM - Looks like anyone can fly formation these days. (David McGirt)
5. 07:40 AM - check lists, forced landings, and pilots (Brian Lloyd)
6. 07:49 AM - Re: Looks like anyone can fly formation these days. (Genzlinger, Reade)
7. 07:58 AM - eric Beard died in Cargo Plane Friday (Russian Thunder Yak -54 pilot) (Mark Schrick)
8. 08:01 AM - Re: Looks like anyone can fly formation these days. (Brian Lloyd)
9. 08:11 AM - Re: Looks like anyone can fly formation these days. (Fraser, Gus)
10. 08:59 AM - Re: Air bottles (Richard Basiliere)
11. 10:45 AM - Re: Silicone Tape (Ron Davis)
12. 10:48 AM - Re: Yak 50 Landing Gear Leg (Bitterlich GS11 Mark G)
13. 10:52 AM - Re: check lists, forced landings, and pilots (Ron Davis)
14. 11:21 AM - Re: Silicone Tape (Bitterlich GS11 Mark G)
15. 11:36 AM - Re: check lists, forced landings, and pilots (Roger Kemp)
16. 11:50 AM - Re: Silicone Tape (cgalley)
17. 11:51 AM - Re: Air bottles (Ron Davis)
18. 12:56 PM - Re: Air bottles (Richard Basiliere)
19. 12:56 PM - Re: Air bottles (fish@aviation-tech.com)
20. 01:01 PM - Re: Air bottles (DaBear)
21. 01:11 PM - Waycross (David McGirt)
22. 01:22 PM - Re: Air bottles (Richard Basiliere)
23. 01:30 PM - Re: bail out (Gpw678@aol.com)
24. 02:55 PM - Jim Selby - Contact info needed (David McGirt)
25. 03:11 PM - 52TW - Main Tires & Tubes (Frank Haertlein)
26. 05:41 PM - Re: 52TW - Main Tires & Tubes (A. Dennis Savarese)
27. 06:26 PM - Re: Jim Selby - Contact info needed (Jim Selby)
28. 07:01 PM - All New BBS Interface For Matronics List Forums! (Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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In the UK there was a dead stick of a Knat, yes you read right Folland
Knat!! Engine quit and pax would not eject when instructed, so pilot landed
straight ahead in open field and all was well. Amazing when you consider
touch down was in the region of 90kts or more. (MJ estimate)
As I said in my last post, 18ft / sec vertical is a darn site safer than
65kts horizontal. It was only a MIG 15, 100's more of them why on earth try
to "save" one of them. L-29 has the same seat I believe, basically a single
cartridge just a bit bigger than a 12 gauge shot gun. It will throw you
about 30 ft I think.
BTW, I have a full set of L-29 manuals, about 12 books or more I believe,
all English.
I had heard from people that in a conversation with his Mig-15 show
partner he always said he would rather land the plane than eject,
while his partner maintained that he would bail out.
Ejection is dangerous business, so is dead stick landing a jet. Had he
lived, would he have been right or wrong? Its anybody's guess.
Message 2
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| Subject: | 52TW - Main Tires & Tubes |
Ok, time to replace the mains on my 52TW - one recommendation I have is for
Condor 600x6 6ply tires, and Goodyear tubes..
Anyone else have better thoughts on this one? Thanks..
David McGirt
Yak 52 TW
Message 3
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--> Yak-List message posted by: fish@aviation-tech.com
Mark Jefferies,
Skip Holm (SR-71, USAF & Lockheed Test Pilot, Reno Air racer), also dead sticked
a Knat while he was ferrying it and lost an engine. I beleive it was last year
or the year before. Then had a second plane drop him off so he could ferry a
anouther aircraft the same day.
Fly Safe
John Fischer
Yak-52, N213YA
>
>
>In the UK there was a dead stick of a Knat, yes you read right Folland
>Knat!! Engine quit and pax would not eject when instructed, so pilot landed
>straight ahead in open field and all was well. Amazing when you consider
>touch down was in the region of 90kts or more. (MJ estimate)
>
>
>
>As I said in my last post, 18ft / sec vertical is a darn site safer than
>65kts horizontal. It was only a MIG 15, 100's more of them why on earth try
>to "save" one of them. L-29 has the same seat I believe, basically a single
>cartridge just a bit bigger than a 12 gauge shot gun. It will throw you
>about 30 ft I think.
>
>
>
>BTW, I have a full set of L-29 manuals, about 12 books or more I believe,
>all English.
>
>
>
>I had heard from people that in a conversation with his Mig-15 show
>
> partner he always said he would rather land the plane than eject,
>
> while his partner maintained that he would bail out.
>
>
>
> Ejection is dangerous business, so is dead stick landing a jet. Had he
>
> lived, would he have been right or wrong? Its anybody's guess.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Looks like anyone can fly formation these days. |
Here is your morning humor..
Goldfish in formation.
http://www.mcgirt.net/humor/2005/General_Humor/waterballet.wmv
Message 5
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| Subject: | check lists, forced landings, and pilots |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
I felt that my exchange with Roger was starting to get a bit acrimonious
so I quit without saying some of the things I wanted to say. (I guess I
must be getting old.) Pappy then popped up and made a number of my major
points for me. I am glad to see I am not thinking these things by myself.
I am not knocking emergency checklists. Heck, when everything is going
to hell in a hand basket and you are in real fear of dying, your brain
is not going to work too well. Having those emergency checklists burned
into your brain so you *do* something is a wonderful thing. Even if your
brain never comes back on-line there is a good chance that your
emergency check list will have accomplished something positive. It might
even save your life or save your airplane. This is A Very Good Thing.
But the checklist is no substitute for real thought as Pappy pointed
out. If you are thinking you probably have time to try a couple of
things that might not be in the checklist. This is especially true of
things like electrical and pneumatic problems in our airplanes. And it
is still true of a forced landing with a seized engine as you have to
select and evaluate a landing spot. It is amazing just how much time
only a little time is.
And any time you can make a decision ahead of time you are better off as
well. It takes time to make a decision and sometimes you do not have
that time. Engine failure in the pattern is a perfect example. If you
figure out from where in the pattern you can make it back to the runway
and then adhere to that decision you will be able to act more quickly in
the case where the fan stops turning. You can probably even figure out
where your emergency landing sites are going to be in the neighborhood
of your home field and then decide ahead of time whether each will be a
gear-up or gear-down site.
Roger, I apologize for apparently baiting you. I tend to do that,
especially when I perceive someone being dogmatic. For those of you who
have been around since the beginning, you remember how I used to bait
Mike McCoy. The reason I did it was because Mike was dogmatic and
inflexible. Everything was "by the book" with no apparent room for
thought and evaluation. Don't get me wrong; I thought Mike was a very
good pilot and instructor and his departure from the Yak/CJ community is
a loss to all of us. But he would get in these rigid though patterns
that would prevent him from even trying to analyze whether what he
"knew" was right. That was when I would "beat him up" on some topic to
try to get his attention and get him thinking about different
approaches. (<sigh> It didn't work and I get awshit points for not
figuring out a better way of dealing with him. Mea Culpa.)
My experience is such that, Any time someone says to you the words
"always" or "never" with regard to doing something in an airplane, they
are almost always wrong. There will always (ha, I just did it myself) be
an exception and only your brain will tell you when you need to exercise
that exception. Our brains have oversized frontal lobes for a reason.
Regardless of whether you think they are a gift of God or a lucky
survival trait, use them.
And please remember something else: we are all here because we love flying.
--
Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr.
brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery
Message 6
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| Subject: | Looks like anyone can fly formation these days. |
I think Ski should include this in his next ground school!!
Reade
_____
From: David McGirt [mailto:david@mcgirt.net]
Subject: Yak-List: Looks like anyone can fly formation these days.
{SPAM?} Header
Here is your morning humor..
Goldfish in formation...
http://www.mcgirt.net/humor/2005/General_Humor/waterballet.wmv
<http://www.mcgirt.net/humor/2005/General_Humor/waterballet.wmv>
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<FONT faceArial
color#0000ff size2>I think Ski should include this in his next ground
school!!
<FONT faceArial
color#0000ff size2>
<FONT faceArial
color#0000ff size2>Reade
<BLOCKQUOTE dirltr
style"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT:
0px">
From: David McGirt [mailto:david@mcgirt.net]
To:
yak-list@matronics.com
Subject: Yak-List: Looks like anyone can fly
formation these days.
<SPAN
style"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">{SPAM?}
Header
Here is your morning humor..
<SPAN
style"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
<SPAN
style"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Goldfish in formation
<SPAN
style"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
<SPAN
style"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><A
">http://www.mcgirt.net/humor/2005/General_Humor/waterballet.wmv
<SPAN
style"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
<SPAN
style"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
Message 7
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| Subject: | eric Beard died in Cargo Plane Friday (Russian Thunder Yak -54 |
pilot)
Air Show Pilot Dies Hauling Freight
Described by colleagues as "one of the top three or four performers" in the
business, air show pilot Eric Beard, 48, died Friday when the Piper Seneca he
was flying crashed in fog about 400 yards short of the runway at Skagit
Regional Airport near Burlington, Wash. Beard was perhaps better-known for
flying a rare Yak-54 nicknamed Russian Thunder
<http://www.russianthunder.com/> in air shows all over the world. On Friday
he was flying for Airpac Airlines, a Seattle-based cargo company. He worked
part-time for Airpac and also worked for Boeing. His last transmission to
Whidbey Island approach was normal and there was no indication of an
emergency, according to Tom Peterson, air search coordinator with the state
department of transportation. "He was supposed to call once he got on the
ground," Peterson told KOMO News. "They did not hear from him and the people
waiting for him on the ground reported that he didn't call in or make it."
Beard is survived by his wife Diane and four children. Beard held two degrees
from Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University and worked for NASA on both the
space shuttle and Titan rocket programs. He began flying aerobatics in the
early 1980s and performed for 13 years, including appearances at EAA
AirVenture and other major shows. The Yak-54 is one of seven aircraft
purpose-built for aerobatics in 1996 by the Yakevlev Design Bureau. Fred
Rosenfelder, the air boss for three major Seattle-area air shows, said that
not only was Beard a top performer, he was a meticulous pilot. "He always knew
his routine. He was meticulous with the safety of his routine and if it wasn't
right, it wouldn't happen," Rosenfelder said.
********************************************************************
Mark Schrick
966 Wallace Drive
San Jose, Ca 95120-1848
Hm/Fax 408-323-5150
Cell 408-391-6664
Email schrick@pacbell.net
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Looks like anyone can fly formation these days. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
David McGirt wrote:
> Here is your morning humor..
>
>
>
> Goldfish in formation
>
>
>
> http://www.mcgirt.net/humor/2005/General_Humor/waterballet.wmv
I don't know, it looks pretty cool to me. The amazing thing is just how
much time someone had to spend teaching goldfish to do that.
It also makes you wonder why we have trouble getting some wingmen to do
it. Heck, goldfish can do it and they are not the brightest bulbs in the
animal kingdom. Maybe we aren't feeding them the right fish food.
--
Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr.
brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery
Message 9
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| Subject: | Looks like anyone can fly formation these days. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Fraser, Gus" <gus.fraser@gs.com>
Yea it must have taken almost as long as it takes to teach pilots.
Gus
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Lloyd
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Looks like anyone can fly formation these days.
--> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
David McGirt wrote:
> Here is your morning humor..
>
>
>
> Goldfish in formation...
>
>
>
> http://www.mcgirt.net/humor/2005/General_Humor/waterballet.wmv
I don't know, it looks pretty cool to me. The amazing thing is just how much
time someone had to spend teaching goldfish to do that.
It also makes you wonder why we have trouble getting some wingmen to do it.
Heck, goldfish can do it and they are not the brightest bulbs in the animal
kingdom. Maybe we aren't feeding them the right fish food.
--
Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr.
brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery
Message 10
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|
FYI on the firefighter SCBA fittings. They are "all" standard GCA
Universal threaded fittings. Survivair, Scott, MSA, all the same. If
we have a big "event" multiple agencies will be "invited" and we need to
be able to fill our bottles from other Fire Dept compressors or cascade
systems. I'd love to have the SCBA adapter to Russian airplane - the
SCBA bottles are a dime a dozen.
Respectfully, rick b
>>> L39parts@hotmail.com 1/8/2006 8:05:27 AM >>>
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Brown" <L39parts@hotmail.com>
In the US, firemen's SCBA bottle fittings vary with the manufacturer.
SCUBA
diving bottles use a standard fitting, but there are a lot of airports
in
the US that are a long ways from the ocean and quite possibly a long
ways
from a dive shop. Another problem is that most US airports don't have
a
fire department on the field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hans Oortman" <pa3arw@euronet.nl>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Hans Oortman" <pa3arw@euronet.nl>
>
> Guys,
>
> The only thing we carry around during a trip in our Yak52 is a hose,
which
> I
> had made especially for this purpose, with on one side an adapter
which
> goes
> on the plane and on the other side an adapter with release valve
which
> goes
> on a scuba dive bottle. In Europe this is a standardized connector,
i.e.,
> these scuba dive bottles have the same connector as all air bottles
used
> by
> the fire brigades at airfields/airports and what have you.
> There is always a nice fire fighter at an airport or airfield who
wants to
> give you a hand to charge your air bottle in the plane with one of
his.
> Be aware though: these bottles have 200 bars (and nowadays even 300
bars),
> so open them very slowly. We are using this method since years
already and
> it works perfectly.
>
> Hans
> Yak52 pilot from Holland
>
> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> Van: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] Namens Roger Doc Kemp
> Verzonden: dinsdag 3 januari 2006 20:17
> Aan: yak-list@matronics.com
> Onderwerp: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Roger Doc Kemp"
<viperdoc@mindspring.com>
>
> Gus,
> Send me pictures of your tank. I am using a pony tank for backup.
> viperdoc@mindspring.com
> Doc
>
>
>> [Original Message]
>> From: Fraser, Gus <gus.fraser@gs.com>
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com <yak-list@matronics.com>
>> Date: 1/3/2006 8:04:12 AM
>> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
>>
>> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Fraser, Gus" <gus.fraser@gs.com>
>>
>> I used to carry the adapter around with me but recently I have
changed. I
>> now carry a paintball gun tank. It is a 4500 pound tank with a
regulator
> to
>> 800psi on the output. Paintball is the fastest growing extreme sport
in
> the
>> US and shops for this are popping up all over the place if I need a
> refill.
>> The tank is about a foot long and about 4 inches around so takes up
>> little
>> space. I can send pictures if anyone is interested.
>>
>> Gus
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Boede
>> Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 11:07 PM
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air bottles
>>
>> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Jon Boede" <jon@email.net>
>>
>> I have a SCUBA to "red star" hose that flies with my airplane... I
used
>> to
>> be concerned about running out of air but then I discovered
something:
>>
>> When primed up good, when the weather is above 40F, hand-propping
the CJ
> is
>> really quite easy. It WANTS to start.
>>
>> Once you get over any trepidation about hand propping it, the SCUBA
> fitting
>> is really the backup to the backup. Carrying extra air around
hasn't
>> been
>> something that would have "saved the day", at lease at so far, after
>> 1,200
>> hours.
>>
>> Jon
>>
>> > I have a standard type SCUBA bottle in my hangar and I carry the
>> > SCUBA fitting with on a cross country for emergency. Not many
places
>> > you cannot borrow or rent a SCUBA bottle for an emergency. A
schraeder
>> > fitting is not necessary as the check valve in the system does
the
>> > same, the small amount of loss when you unhook the botle is not
worth
>> > the trouble. I tapped the fuselage fitting for AN816- 4 pipe
fitting
>> > and use matching fitting on the SCUBA hose then cap the fitting
to
>> > keeo
>> the dirt out with AN929-4 cap.
>> > However as Craig says hand propping is not that difficult. To make
it
>> > safer I bleed off all the air then chock the airplane as you
will
>> > have no brakes!
>> >
>> > Merry Xmas and Happy New Year to all
>> >
>> > Joe
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Silicone Tape |
MessageThe contest lines are still open. Does ANYONE out there know the difference
between silicone tape (which Mr. Lansden ask about) and teflon tape?
----- Original Message -----
From: Frank Haertlein
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2006 5:14 PM
Subject: Yak-List: Silicone Tape
Cy
I know you're right. I tried Teflon tape for my air recharging system. It worked
at low pressures but just couldn't handle it as the pressures got higher.
You'll probly spank me for this but I found that high temp silicone sealant used
sparingly on the threads, and in such a way as to preclude squeeze out, worked
just fine. You do have to wait until it cures though.
Frank
Message 12
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| Subject: | Yak 50 Landing Gear Leg |
He could also simply copy the design that is installed on my 50. I'll even
treat you to dinner Tom.
Mark Bitterlich
-----Original Message-----
From: doug sapp [mailto:rvfltd@televar.com]
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 50 Landing Gear Leg
--> Yak-List message posted by: "doug sapp" <rvfltd@televar.com>
Tom,
Paul Dumoret has a CJ6 that was converted to Cleveland toe brakes, he wants
to go back to the std system. Give him a call, no sense in reinventing the
wheel, most all of his stuff would bolt right up to your 50 I think.
Paul Dumoret 250-535-0395
Always Yakin,
Doug Sapp
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Tom Johnson
Subject: Yak-List: Yak 50 Landing Gear Leg
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Tom Johnson" <tomjohnson@cox.net>
I am once again on the hunt to borrow a Yak 50 landing gear leg.
Or perhaps a Yak 52 Gear Leg would work.
Designing a hydraulic brake system and having a leg to work with on a bench
is preferred.
I will pay all shipping costs back and forth of course.
Please contact me OFF list.
Thanks,
Tj
---------------------------
Thomas Johnson
Airpower Insurance, LLC
36 West Ocotillo Road
Phoenix, AZ 85013-1235
Tel: 602-628-2701
Fax: 623-321-5843
E: tomjohnson@cox.net
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: check lists, forced landings, and pilots |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" <L39parts@hotmail.com>
If there wasn't a need for thinking, there wouldn't be a need for a human at
the controls. You could just program a computer with the "always" and
"never" rules and send it off with a load of paying passengers. Look up the
casualty rates for drones if you can't visualize how well this would work on
your own.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Lloyd" <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
Subject: Yak-List: check lists, forced landings, and pilots
> --> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
>
> I felt that my exchange with Roger was starting to get a bit acrimonious
> so I quit without saying some of the things I wanted to say. (I guess I
> must be getting old.) Pappy then popped up and made a number of my major
> points for me. I am glad to see I am not thinking these things by myself.
>
> I am not knocking emergency checklists. Heck, when everything is going
> to hell in a hand basket and you are in real fear of dying, your brain
> is not going to work too well. Having those emergency checklists burned
> into your brain so you *do* something is a wonderful thing. Even if your
> brain never comes back on-line there is a good chance that your
> emergency check list will have accomplished something positive. It might
> even save your life or save your airplane. This is A Very Good Thing.
>
> But the checklist is no substitute for real thought as Pappy pointed
> out. If you are thinking you probably have time to try a couple of
> things that might not be in the checklist. This is especially true of
> things like electrical and pneumatic problems in our airplanes. And it
> is still true of a forced landing with a seized engine as you have to
> select and evaluate a landing spot. It is amazing just how much time
> only a little time is.
>
> And any time you can make a decision ahead of time you are better off as
> well. It takes time to make a decision and sometimes you do not have
> that time. Engine failure in the pattern is a perfect example. If you
> figure out from where in the pattern you can make it back to the runway
> and then adhere to that decision you will be able to act more quickly in
> the case where the fan stops turning. You can probably even figure out
> where your emergency landing sites are going to be in the neighborhood
> of your home field and then decide ahead of time whether each will be a
> gear-up or gear-down site.
>
> Roger, I apologize for apparently baiting you. I tend to do that,
> especially when I perceive someone being dogmatic. For those of you who
> have been around since the beginning, you remember how I used to bait
> Mike McCoy. The reason I did it was because Mike was dogmatic and
> inflexible. Everything was "by the book" with no apparent room for
> thought and evaluation. Don't get me wrong; I thought Mike was a very
> good pilot and instructor and his departure from the Yak/CJ community is
> a loss to all of us. But he would get in these rigid though patterns
> that would prevent him from even trying to analyze whether what he
> "knew" was right. That was when I would "beat him up" on some topic to
> try to get his attention and get him thinking about different
> approaches. (<sigh> It didn't work and I get awshit points for not
> figuring out a better way of dealing with him. Mea Culpa.)
>
> My experience is such that, Any time someone says to you the words
> "always" or "never" with regard to doing something in an airplane, they
> are almost always wrong. There will always (ha, I just did it myself) be
> an exception and only your brain will tell you when you need to exercise
> that exception. Our brains have oversized frontal lobes for a reason.
> Regardless of whether you think they are a gift of God or a lucky
> survival trait, use them.
>
> And please remember something else: we are all here because we love
> flying.
>
> --
> Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr.
> brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630
> +1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
>
> I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
> - Antoine de Saint-Exupery
>
>
>
Message 14
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That said..... and I agree with the fact that you should not use it...... it
is very common in the military to use teflon tape as an emergency fix if you
have the flare leaking slightly. The tape is placed BEHIND the flare and
as the nut is screwed tight, it seals it. I am not ENDORSING this as a
"fix". It is one of those "use at your own risk" recommendations, but done
properly, it will not get into the system and it will in fact seal a
connector even at 3000 psi. Where I have seen it used is just as a "one
time only to get it home" fix.
Mark Bitterlich
-----Original Message-----
From: Walter Lannon [mailto:wlannon@cablerocket.com]
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Silicone Tape
The use of teflon plumbing tape is verbotten in aircraft hydraulic systems,
pneumatic systems are no different in this regard.
In any case the seal is made by the flare (or flareless type) metal to metal
joint not the fitting threads. The correct thread lubricant is Parker
Seallube or Threadlube.
A small piece of plumbing tape in a close tolerance hydraulic or pneumatic
valve can not only cause a leak but can also cause a valve seizure.
Walt
riginal Message -----
From: cgalley <mailto:cgalley@qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Silicone Tape
You are talking about the white Teflon tape I presume. I won't let any of
that stuff near an airplane. It creates real problems on even low pressure
systems.
Your gas grill uses very low pressure. Probably measured in inches of water.
Takes almost 28 inches of water to have a psi of just one pound. When you
talk 50 atm, multiply by 14.7 or 735 psi. I'll bet the system is designed
for metal to metal seals due to the extremely pressure. No sealers wanted or
necessary.
The "tape" even if it seals a connection will cause leaks as any little bit
caught in a valve might cause it to leak. Your system needs to be free of
foreign contaminates. Teflon tape is a foreign contaminate.
Cy Galley - Chair,
AirVenture Emergency Aircraft Repair
A Service Project of Chapter 75
EAA Safety Programs Editor - TC
EAA Sport Pilot
----- Original Message -----
From: John <mailto:johnlans@intergate.com> E. Lansden
Subject: Yak-List: Silicone Tape
Am thinking of using the "silicone tape" to seal all my air system
connections. It seems to work great on my gas grill connection and other
applications where a good seal is necessary. Anyone see any problem with
using it in this application?
Jim Lankford
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: check lists, forced landings, and pilots |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Roger Kemp <viperdoc@mindspring.com>
Ron,
That concept is closer than you think. It is said in my community that we are seeing
the last manned fighters. This is the last generation of fighter pilots.
It is not very far off at all!
A chilling thought but true none the less.
By the way, the causalty rates for drones is less than that of the carbon units.
Unless you are a raghead carrying a mortor tube though the date grove near Fallusia.
Damned amazing what a Hell fire launched from a lurking predator will
do to ruin an ambush! Not that I'm for taking the human out of the cockpit. I'm
not! But it will soon be a fact of life as we know it.
Sad but true, the carbon units will be coming out of the cockpits to be replaced
by silicon waffers.
I can see the swagger at the causual bar on Friday night.. "Hi, I'm R2D2 cuttie...
does your silicon go all the way to your really nice waffers? ...wanta play
with my pigtail and jiggle my antennae?"
Dogmatic Viperdoc
-----Original Message-----
>From: Ron Davis <L39parts@hotmail.com>
>Sent: Jan 9, 2006 1:51 PM
>To: yak-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Yak-List: check lists, forced landings, and pilots
>
>--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" <L39parts@hotmail.com>
>
>If there wasn't a need for thinking, there wouldn't be a need for a human at
>the controls. You could just program a computer with the "always" and
>"never" rules and send it off with a load of paying passengers. Look up the
>casualty rates for drones if you can't visualize how well this would work on
>your own.
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Brian Lloyd" <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
>To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
>Sent: Monday, January 09, 2006 8:39 AM
>Subject: Yak-List: check lists, forced landings, and pilots
>
>
>> --> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
>>
>> I felt that my exchange with Roger was starting to get a bit acrimonious
>> so I quit without saying some of the things I wanted to say. (I guess I
>> must be getting old.) Pappy then popped up and made a number of my major
>> points for me. I am glad to see I am not thinking these things by myself.
>>
>> I am not knocking emergency checklists. Heck, when everything is going
>> to hell in a hand basket and you are in real fear of dying, your brain
>> is not going to work too well. Having those emergency checklists burned
>> into your brain so you *do* something is a wonderful thing. Even if your
>> brain never comes back on-line there is a good chance that your
>> emergency check list will have accomplished something positive. It might
>> even save your life or save your airplane. This is A Very Good Thing.
>>
>> But the checklist is no substitute for real thought as Pappy pointed
>> out. If you are thinking you probably have time to try a couple of
>> things that might not be in the checklist. This is especially true of
>> things like electrical and pneumatic problems in our airplanes. And it
>> is still true of a forced landing with a seized engine as you have to
>> select and evaluate a landing spot. It is amazing just how much time
>> only a little time is.
>>
>> And any time you can make a decision ahead of time you are better off as
>> well. It takes time to make a decision and sometimes you do not have
>> that time. Engine failure in the pattern is a perfect example. If you
>> figure out from where in the pattern you can make it back to the runway
>> and then adhere to that decision you will be able to act more quickly in
>> the case where the fan stops turning. You can probably even figure out
>> where your emergency landing sites are going to be in the neighborhood
>> of your home field and then decide ahead of time whether each will be a
>> gear-up or gear-down site.
>>
>> Roger, I apologize for apparently baiting you. I tend to do that,
>> especially when I perceive someone being dogmatic. For those of you who
>> have been around since the beginning, you remember how I used to bait
>> Mike McCoy. The reason I did it was because Mike was dogmatic and
>> inflexible. Everything was "by the book" with no apparent room for
>> thought and evaluation. Don't get me wrong; I thought Mike was a very
>> good pilot and instructor and his departure from the Yak/CJ community is
>> a loss to all of us. But he would get in these rigid though patterns
>> that would prevent him from even trying to analyze whether what he
>> "knew" was right. That was when I would "beat him up" on some topic to
>> try to get his attention and get him thinking about different
>> approaches. (<sigh> It didn't work and I get awshit points for not
>> figuring out a better way of dealing with him. Mea Culpa.)
>>
>> My experience is such that, Any time someone says to you the words
>> "always" or "never" with regard to doing something in an airplane, they
>> are almost always wrong. There will always (ha, I just did it myself) be
>> an exception and only your brain will tell you when you need to exercise
>> that exception. Our brains have oversized frontal lobes for a reason.
>> Regardless of whether you think they are a gift of God or a lucky
>> survival trait, use them.
>>
>> And please remember something else: we are all here because we love
>> flying.
>>
>> --
>> Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr.
>> brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630
>> +1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
>>
>> I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
>> - Antoine de Saint-Exupery
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Silicone Tape |
MessageI have used silicone rubber self-sealing tape to seal electrical connectors
from the weather but I doubt it would work in a pressure situation.
Cy Galley - Chair,
AirVenture Emergency Aircraft Repair
A Service Project of Chapter 75
EAA Safety Programs Editor - TC
EAA Sport Pilot
----- Original Message -----
From: Ron Davis
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 09, 2006 12:44 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Silicone Tape
The contest lines are still open. Does ANYONE out there know the difference
between silicone tape (which Mr. Lansden ask about) and teflon tape?
----- Original Message -----
From: Frank Haertlein
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2006 5:14 PM
Subject: Yak-List: Silicone Tape
Cy
I know you're right. I tried Teflon tape for my air recharging system. It worked
at low pressures but just couldn't handle it as the pressures got higher.
You'll probly spank me for this but I found that high temp silicone sealant
used sparingly on the threads, and in such a way as to preclude squeeze out,
worked just fine. You do have to wait until it cures though.
Frank
Message 17
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SCUBA to commie airplane adapters can be ordered from my former partner at L39ZAparts@hotmail.com
unless the Kazakistan warrants caught up with him.
I defer to your experience, which is probably more recent than mine. In the mining
industry, NIOSH allows only certified systems. Our safety engineers determined
that using a part (cylinder) from MSA on a regulator from Scott constituted
an uncertified "system". They were fanatics about things like that, not
like FAA un-approved parts regs.
At another job, we changed from Scott to a German-built system, Interspiro perhaps.
My recollection is that those fittings were incompatible with the existing
filling fittings, but I wouldn't swear to it. It was many years ago.
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Basiliere
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 09, 2006 9:49 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air bottles
FYI on the firefighter SCBA fittings. They are "all" standard GCA Universal
threaded fittings. Survivair, Scott, MSA, all the same. If we have a big "event"
multiple agencies will be "invited" and we need to be able to fill our bottles
from other Fire Dept compressors or cascade systems. I'd love to have the
SCBA adapter to Russian airplane - the SCBA bottles are a dime a dozen.
Respectfully, rick b
>>> L39parts@hotmail.com 1/8/2006 8:05:27 AM >>>
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Brown" <L39parts@hotmail.com>
In the US, firemen's SCBA bottle fittings vary with the manufacturer. SCUBA
diving bottles use a standard fitting, but there are a lot of airports in
the US that are a long ways from the ocean and quite possibly a long ways
from a dive shop. Another problem is that most US airports don't have a
fire department on the field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hans Oortman" <pa3arw@euronet.nl>
To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 1:14 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Hans Oortman" <pa3arw@euronet.nl>
>
> Guys,
>
> The only thing we carry around during a trip in our Yak52 is a hose, which
> I
> had made especially for this purpose, with on one side an adapter which
> goes
> on the plane and on the other side an adapter with release valve which
> goes
> on a scuba dive bottle. In Europe this is a standardized connector, i.e.,
> these scuba dive bottles have the same connector as all air bottles used
> by
> the fire brigades at airfields/airports and what have you.
> There is always a nice fire fighter at an airport or airfield who wants to
> give you a hand to charge your air bottle in the plane with one of his.
> Be aware though: these bottles have 200 bars (and nowadays even 300 bars),
> so open them very slowly. We are using this method since years already and
> it works perfectly.
>
> Hans
> Yak52 pilot from Holland
>
> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> Van: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] Namens Roger Doc Kemp
> Verzonden: dinsdag 3 januari 2006 20:17
> Aan: yak-list@matronics.com
> Onderwerp: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Roger Doc Kemp" <viperdoc@mindspring.com>
>
> Gus,
> Send me pictures of your tank. I am using a pony tank for backup.
> viperdoc@mindspring.com
> Doc
>
>
>> [Original Message]
>> From: Fraser, Gus <gus.fraser@gs.com>
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com <yak-list@matronics.com>
>> Date: 1/3/2006 8:04:12 AM
>> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
>>
>> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Fraser, Gus" <gus.fraser@gs.com>
>>
>> I used to carry the adapter around with me but recently I have changed. I
>> now carry a paintball gun tank. It is a 4500 pound tank with a regulator
> to
>> 800psi on the output. Paintball is the fastest growing extreme sport in
> the
>> US and shops for this are popping up all over the place if I need a
> refill.
>> The tank is about a foot long and about 4 inches around so takes up
>> little
>> space. I can send pictures if anyone is interested.
>>
>> Gus
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Boede
>> Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 11:07 PM
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air bottles
>>
>> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Jon Boede" <jon@email.net>
>>
>> I have a SCUBA to "red star" hose that flies with my airplane... I used
>> to
>> be concerned about running out of air but then I discovered something:
>>
>> When primed up good, when the weather is above 40F, hand-propping the CJ
> is
>> really quite easy. It WANTS to start.
>>
>> Once you get over any trepidation about hand propping it, the SCUBA
> fitting
>> is really the backup to the backup. Carrying extra air around hasn't
>> been
>> something that would have "saved the day", at lease at so far, after
>> 1,200
>> hours.
>>
>> Jon
>>
>> > I have a standard type SCUBA bottle in my hangar and I carry the
>> > SCUBA fitting with on a cross country for emergency. Not many places
>> > you cannot borrow or rent a SCUBA bottle for an emergency. A schraeder
>> > fitting is not necessary as the check valve in the system does the
>> > same, the small amount of loss when you unhook the botle is not worth
>> > the trouble. I tapped the fuselage fitting for AN816- 4 pipe fitting
>> > and use matching fitting on the SCUBA hose then cap the fitting to
>> > keeo
>> the dirt out with AN929-4 cap.
>> > However as Craig says hand propping is not that difficult. To make it
>> > safer I bleed off all the air then chock the airplane as you will
>> > have no brakes!
>> >
>> > Merry Xmas and Happy New Year to all
>> >
>> > Joe
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
nics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Listhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 18
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Absolutely correct on the "system" thing.
Scott won't fit in a Survivair pac, nor will Interspiro, MSA, etc.
but...they (the bottles) can all fill from the same hose - that is the
threaded GCA adapter on them all. The new Scott NexGen2's are too cool.
They have their own specialized fitting to allow the bottle to "snap"
into place (supplying high pressure air - 4500psi- to the first stage
regulator) rather than being threaded on to the 1st stage like the
others and the older Scotts (using the CGA fitting). The new Scott
bottles have 3 different ways to fill them now - including the universal
GCA. Thank you Homeland Security for the 50 Scott packs we received
@$4,000 a pop last week. Good bye, Survivair and Monsieur Cousteau...
(the dime a dozen used SCBA bottles alluded to earlier)
More than most of you folks cared to know about how our Firefighters go
to work...sorry
Rick b
>>> L39parts@hotmail.com 1/9/2006 12:51:10 PM >>>
SCUBA to commie airplane adapters can be ordered from my former
partner at L39ZAparts@hotmail.com unless the Kazakistan warrants caught
up with him.
I defer to your experience, which is probably more recent than mine.
In the mining industry, NIOSH allows only certified systems. Our safety
engineers determined that using a part (cylinder) from MSA on a
regulator from Scott constituted an uncertified "system". They were
fanatics about things like that, not like FAA un-approved parts regs.
At another job, we changed from Scott to a German-built system,
Interspiro perhaps. My recollection is that those fittings were
incompatible with the existing filling fittings, but I wouldn't swear to
it. It was many years ago.
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Basiliere
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air bottles
FYI on the firefighter SCBA fittings. They are "all" standard GCA
Universal threaded fittings. Survivair, Scott, MSA, all the same. If
we have a big "event" multiple agencies will be "invited" and we need to
be able to fill our bottles from other Fire Dept compressors or cascade
systems. I'd love to have the SCBA adapter to Russian airplane - the
SCBA bottles are a dime a dozen.
Respectfully, rick b
>>> L39parts@hotmail.com 1/8/2006 8:05:27 AM >>>
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Brown" <L39parts@hotmail.com>
In the US, firemen's SCBA bottle fittings vary with the manufacturer.
SCUBA
diving bottles use a standard fitting, but there are a lot of airports
in
the US that are a long ways from the ocean and quite possibly a long
ways
from a dive shop. Another problem is that most US airports don't have
a
fire department on the field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hans Oortman" <pa3arw@euronet.nl>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Hans Oortman" <pa3arw@euronet.nl>
>
> Guys,
>
> The only thing we carry around during a trip in our Yak52 is a hose,
which
> I
> had made especially for this purpose, with on one side an adapter
which
> goes
> on the plane and on the other side an adapter with release valve
which
> goes
> on a scuba dive bottle. In Europe this is a standardized connector,
i.e.,
> these scuba dive bottles have the same connector as all air bottles
used
> by
> the fire brigades at airfields/airports and what have you.
> There is always a nice fire fighter at an airport or airfield who
wants to
> give you a hand to charge your air bottle in the plane with one of
his.
> Be aware though: these bottles have 200 bars (and nowadays even 300
bars),
> so open them very slowly. We are using this method since years
already and
> it works perfectly.
>
> Hans
> Yak52 pilot from Holland
>
> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> Van: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] Namens Roger Doc Kemp
> Verzonden: dinsdag 3 januari 2006 20:17
> Aan: yak-list@matronics.com
> Onderwerp: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Roger Doc Kemp"
<viperdoc@mindspring.com>
>
> Gus,
> Send me pictures of your tank. I am using a pony tank for backup.
> viperdoc@mindspring.com
> Doc
>
>
>> [Original Message]
>> From: Fraser, Gus <gus.fraser@gs.com>
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com <yak-list@matronics.com>
>> Date: 1/3/2006 8:04:12 AM
>> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
>>
>> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Fraser, Gus" <gus.fraser@gs.com>
>>
>> I used to carry the adapter around with me but recently I have
changed. I
>> now carry a paintball gun tank. It is a 4500 pound tank with a
regulator
> to
>> 800psi on the output. Paintball is the fastest growing extreme sport
in
> the
>> US and shops for this are popping up all over the place if I need a
> refill.
>> The tank is about a foot long and about 4 inches around so takes up
>> little
>> space. I can send pictures if anyone is interested.
>>
>> Gus
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Boede
>> Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 11:07 PM
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air bottles
>>
>> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Jon Boede" <jon@email.net>
>>
>> I have a SCUBA to "red star" hose that flies with my airplane... I
used
>> to
>> be concerned about running out of air but then I discovered
something:
>>
>> When primed up good, when the weather is above 40F, hand-propping
the CJ
> is
>> really quite easy. It WANTS to start.
>>
>> Once you get over any trepidation about hand propping it, the SCUBA
> fitting
>> is really the backup to the backup. Carrying extra air around
hasn't
>> been
>> something that would have "saved the day", at lease at so far, after
>> 1,200
>> hours.
>>
>> Jon
>>
>> > I have a standard type SCUBA bottle in my hangar and I carry the
>> > SCUBA fitting with on a cross country for emergency. Not many
places
>> > you cannot borrow or rent a SCUBA bottle for an emergency. A
schraeder
>> > fitting is not necessary as the check valve in the system does
the
>> > same, the small amount of loss when you unhook the botle is not
worth
>> > the trouble. I tapped the fuselage fitting for AN816- 4 pipe
fitting
>> > and use matching fitting on the SCUBA hose then cap the fitting
to
>> > keeo
>> the dirt out with AN929-4 cap.
>> > However as Craig says hand propping is not that difficult. To make
it
>> > safer I bleed off all the air then chock the airplane as you
will
>> > have no brakes!
>> >
>> > Merry Xmas and Happy New Year to all
>> >
>> > Joe
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>
nics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Listhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution</A======================================
Message 19
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--> Yak-List message posted by: fish@aviation-tech.com
Yaksters,
I can not beleive that a fire dept, will allow there cylinder to connect to
your system. This is dangerous!
Once the pressure equilizes, the air can possably backflow into there tanks.
at this point there tanks are contaminated, and cannot be used for breathing
air until they are checked and cleaned. That is why you leave some pressure
in cylinders to keep them from becoming contaminated.
I would also have some concern about filling tanks at a shop as the same thing
can happen to their systems. Once the pressure equilizes form their tanks to
yours, there system will become contaminated.
I have heard to many stories about divers who had problems with thier air air
(compressors need to be maintained also), which sometimes leads to contaminated
air. That I would be rather error on the side of safety when it comes to breating
air (compressed or Oxygen).
Fly Safe
John fischer
>
>
>SCUBA to commie airplane adapters can be ordered from my former partner >at
L39ZAparts@hotmail.com unless the Kazakistan warrants caught up with >him.
>
>I defer to your experience, which is probably more recent than mine. In >the
mining industry, NIOSH allows only certified systems. Our safety >engineers
determined that using a part (cylinder) from MSA on a >regulator from Scott
constituted an uncertified "system". They were >fanatics about things like
that, not like FAA un-approved parts regs.
>
>At another job, we changed from Scott to a German-built system, >Interspiro
perhaps. My recollection is that those fittings were >incompatible with the
existing filling fittings, but I wouldn't swear to >it. It was many years ago.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Richard Basiliere
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Monday, January 09, 2006 9:49 AM
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air bottles
>
>
> FYI on the firefighter SCBA fittings. They are "all" standard GCA >Universal
threaded fittings. Survivair, Scott, MSA, all the same. If >we have a big
"event" multiple agencies will be "invited" and we need to >be able to fill
our bottles from other Fire Dept compressors or cascade >systems. I'd love
to have the SCBA adapter to Russian airplane - the >SCBA bottles are a dime
a dozen.
>
> Respectfully, rick b
>
> >>> L39parts@hotmail.com 1/8/2006 8:05:27 AM >>>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Brown" <L39parts@hotmail.com>
>
> In the US, firemen's SCBA bottle fittings vary with the manufacturer. >SCUBA
> diving bottles use a standard fitting, but there are a lot of airports >in
> the US that are a long ways from the ocean and quite possibly a long >ways
> from a dive shop. Another problem is that most US airports don't have >a
> fire department on the field.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Hans Oortman" <pa3arw@euronet.nl>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 1:14 PM
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Hans Oortman" <pa3arw@euronet.nl>
> >
> > Guys,
> >
> > The only thing we carry around during a trip in our Yak52 is a hose, >which
> > I
> > had made especially for this purpose, with on one side an adapter >which
> > goes
> > on the plane and on the other side an adapter with release valve >which
> > goes
> > on a scuba dive bottle. In Europe this is a standardized connector, >i.e.,
> > these scuba dive bottles have the same connector as all air bottles >used
> > by
> > the fire brigades at airfields/airports and what have you.
> > There is always a nice fire fighter at an airport or airfield who >wants
to
> > give you a hand to charge your air bottle in the plane with one of >his.
> > Be aware though: these bottles have 200 bars (and nowadays even 300 >bars),
> > so open them very slowly. We are using this method since years >already
and
> > it works perfectly.
> >
> > Hans
> > Yak52 pilot from Holland
> >
> > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> > Van: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] Namens Roger Doc Kemp
> > Verzonden: dinsdag 3 januari 2006 20:17
> > Aan: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Onderwerp: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Roger Doc Kemp" ><viperdoc@mindspring.com>
> >
> > Gus,
> > Send me pictures of your tank. I am using a pony tank for backup.
> > viperdoc@mindspring.com
> > Doc
> >
> >
> >> [Original Message]
> >> From: Fraser, Gus <gus.fraser@gs.com>
> >> To: yak-list@matronics.com <yak-list@matronics.com>
> >> Date: 1/3/2006 8:04:12 AM
> >> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
> >>
> >> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Fraser, Gus" <gus.fraser@gs.com>
> >>
> >> I used to carry the adapter around with me but recently I have >changed.
I
> >> now carry a paintball gun tank. It is a 4500 pound tank with a >regulator
> > to
> >> 800psi on the output. Paintball is the fastest growing extreme >sport
in
> > the
> >> US and shops for this are popping up all over the place if I need a
> > refill.
> >> The tank is about a foot long and about 4 inches around so takes up >
> >> little
> >> space. I can send pictures if anyone is interested.
> >>
> >> Gus
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> >> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Boede
> >> Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 11:07 PM
> >> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> >> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air bottles
> >>
> >> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Jon Boede" <jon@email.net>
> >>
> >> I have a SCUBA to "red star" hose that flies with my airplane... I >used
> >> to
> >> be concerned about running out of air but then I discovered >something:
> >>
> >> When primed up good, when the weather is above 40F, hand-propping >the
CJ
> > is
> >> really quite easy. It WANTS to start.
> >>
> >> Once you get over any trepidation about hand propping it, the SCUBA
> > fitting
> >> is really the backup to the backup. Carrying extra air around >hasn't
> >> been
> >> something that would have "saved the day", at lease at so far, >after
> >> 1,200
> >> hours.
> >>
> >> Jon
> >>
> >> > I have a standard type SCUBA bottle in my hangar and I carry the
> >> > SCUBA fitting with on a cross country for emergency. Not many >places
> >> > you cannot borrow or rent a SCUBA bottle for an emergency. A >schraeder
> >> > fitting is not necessary as the check valve in the system does >the
> >> > same, the small amount of loss when you unhook the botle is not >worth
> >> > the trouble. I tapped the fuselage fitting for AN816- 4 pipe >fitting
> >> > and use matching fitting on the SCUBA hose then cap the fitting >to
> >> > keeo
> >> the dirt out with AN929-4 cap.
> >> > However as Craig says hand propping is not that difficult. To >make
it
> >> > safer I bleed off all the air then chock the airplane as you >will
> >> > have no brakes!
> >> >
> >> > Merry Xmas and Happy New Year to all
> >> >
> >> > Joe
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>nics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Listh>ttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 20
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--> Yak-List message posted by: DaBear <dabear@damned.org>
I've used my SCUBA fitting for over 7 years. Don't see a reason to go
to scuba.
DaBear
Richard Basiliere wrote:
> FYI on the firefighter SCBA fittings. They are "all" standard GCA
> Universal threaded fittings. Survivair, Scott, MSA, all the same. If
> we have a big "event" multiple agencies will be "invited" and we need
> to be able to fill our bottles from other Fire Dept compressors or
> cascade systems. I'd love to have the SCBA adapter to Russian
> airplane - the SCBA bottles are a dime a dozen.
>
> Respectfully, rick b
>
> >>> L39parts@hotmail.com 1/8/2006 8:05:27 AM >>>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Brown" <L39parts@hotmail.com>
>
> In the US, firemen's SCBA bottle fittings vary with the manufacturer.
> SCUBA
> diving bottles use a standard fitting, but there are a lot of airports in
> the US that are a long ways from the ocean and quite possibly a long ways
> from a dive shop. Another problem is that most US airports don't have a
> fire department on the field.
>
>
Message 21
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "David McGirt" <david@mcgirt.net>
There will be a group of us meeting in LaGrange, GA around noon on Thursday,
then flying down together to Waycross that afternoon.. All that are passing
through are welcome..
Pretty sure Tim Williams is calling a few of you ( he in not much for
email.. ;) Anyway, just thought I would pass the word.. Self serve gas
there, pretty cheap..
David
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ron Davis
Subject: Re: Yak-List: check lists, forced landings, and pilots
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Davis" <L39parts@hotmail.com>
If there wasn't a need for thinking, there wouldn't be a need for a human at
the controls. You could just program a computer with the "always" and
"never" rules and send it off with a load of paying passengers. Look up the
casualty rates for drones if you can't visualize how well this would work on
your own.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Lloyd" <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
Subject: Yak-List: check lists, forced landings, and pilots
> --> Yak-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
>
> I felt that my exchange with Roger was starting to get a bit acrimonious
> so I quit without saying some of the things I wanted to say. (I guess I
> must be getting old.) Pappy then popped up and made a number of my major
> points for me. I am glad to see I am not thinking these things by myself.
>
> I am not knocking emergency checklists. Heck, when everything is going
> to hell in a hand basket and you are in real fear of dying, your brain
> is not going to work too well. Having those emergency checklists burned
> into your brain so you *do* something is a wonderful thing. Even if your
> brain never comes back on-line there is a good chance that your
> emergency check list will have accomplished something positive. It might
> even save your life or save your airplane. This is A Very Good Thing.
>
> But the checklist is no substitute for real thought as Pappy pointed
> out. If you are thinking you probably have time to try a couple of
> things that might not be in the checklist. This is especially true of
> things like electrical and pneumatic problems in our airplanes. And it
> is still true of a forced landing with a seized engine as you have to
> select and evaluate a landing spot. It is amazing just how much time
> only a little time is.
>
> And any time you can make a decision ahead of time you are better off as
> well. It takes time to make a decision and sometimes you do not have
> that time. Engine failure in the pattern is a perfect example. If you
> figure out from where in the pattern you can make it back to the runway
> and then adhere to that decision you will be able to act more quickly in
> the case where the fan stops turning. You can probably even figure out
> where your emergency landing sites are going to be in the neighborhood
> of your home field and then decide ahead of time whether each will be a
> gear-up or gear-down site.
>
> Roger, I apologize for apparently baiting you. I tend to do that,
> especially when I perceive someone being dogmatic. For those of you who
> have been around since the beginning, you remember how I used to bait
> Mike McCoy. The reason I did it was because Mike was dogmatic and
> inflexible. Everything was "by the book" with no apparent room for
> thought and evaluation. Don't get me wrong; I thought Mike was a very
> good pilot and instructor and his departure from the Yak/CJ community is
> a loss to all of us. But he would get in these rigid though patterns
> that would prevent him from even trying to analyze whether what he
> "knew" was right. That was when I would "beat him up" on some topic to
> try to get his attention and get him thinking about different
> approaches. (<sigh> It didn't work and I get awshit points for not
> figuring out a better way of dealing with him. Mea Culpa.)
>
> My experience is such that, Any time someone says to you the words
> "always" or "never" with regard to doing something in an airplane, they
> are almost always wrong. There will always (ha, I just did it myself) be
> an exception and only your brain will tell you when you need to exercise
> that exception. Our brains have oversized frontal lobes for a reason.
> Regardless of whether you think they are a gift of God or a lucky
> survival trait, use them.
>
> And please remember something else: we are all here because we love
> flying.
>
> --
> Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr.
> brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630
> +1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
>
> I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
> - Antoine de Saint-Exupery
>
>
>
Message 22
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If I'm correct (think I am - while looking at Sarah's Yak-55 and my
SU-29)
#1. There is an anti back flow valve just inside the fuselage from the
external fill connector - other wise you would never be able to DC
(disconnect) without losing all the air you just put in.
#2. Our Fire Dept compressors and cascade systems are set to be full
(to be able to fill bottles at..) 4500-5000psi. We NEVER see less than
2500 psi on our cascade. Our compressor works just like yours - it
pumps up to 4500 psi as the system drops below that. It does our FF's
no good to enter a burning building with a tank less than full - 4500 +
10%. There would be a winnable liability suit...
#3. This is the same system that fills the 80 cu ft SCUBA bottles our
Dive Search and Recovery team uses
#4 I guess it goes without saying that at those pressures there is NO
WAY there could ever be any back flow from a system that maxes out at 50
bar - 750 psi - whatever.
Again respectfully,
Lt. rick b
>>> fish@aviation-tech.com 1/9/2006 12:36:42 PM >>>
--> Yak-List message posted by: fish@aviation-tech.com
Yaksters,
I can not beleive that a fire dept, will allow there cylinder to
connect to
your system. This is dangerous!
Once the pressure equilizes, the air can possably backflow into there
tanks.
at this point there tanks are contaminated, and cannot be used for
breathing
air until they are checked and cleaned. That is why you leave some
pressure
in cylinders to keep them from becoming contaminated.
I would also have some concern about filling tanks at a shop as the
same thing
can happen to their systems. Once the pressure equilizes form their
tanks to
yours, there system will become contaminated.
I have heard to many stories about divers who had problems with thier
air air
(compressors need to be maintained also), which sometimes leads to
contaminated
air. That I would be rather error on the side of safety when it comes
to breating
air (compressed or Oxygen).
Fly Safe
John fischer
>
>
>SCUBA to commie airplane adapters can be ordered from my former
partner >at
L39ZAparts@hotmail.com unless the Kazakistan warrants caught up with
>him.
>
>I defer to your experience, which is probably more recent than mine.
In >the
mining industry, NIOSH allows only certified systems. Our safety
>engineers
determined that using a part (cylinder) from MSA on a >regulator from
Scott
constituted an uncertified "system". They were >fanatics about things
like
that, not like FAA un-approved parts regs.
>
>At another job, we changed from Scott to a German-built system,
>Interspiro
perhaps. My recollection is that those fittings were >incompatible
with the
existing filling fittings, but I wouldn't swear to >it. It was many
years ago.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Richard Basiliere
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Monday, January 09, 2006 9:49 AM
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air bottles
>
>
> FYI on the firefighter SCBA fittings. They are "all" standard GCA
>Universal
threaded fittings. Survivair, Scott, MSA, all the same. If >we have a
big
"event" multiple agencies will be "invited" and we need to >be able to
fill
our bottles from other Fire Dept compressors or cascade >systems. I'd
love
to have the SCBA adapter to Russian airplane - the >SCBA bottles are a
dime
a dozen.
>
> Respectfully, rick b
>
> >>> L39parts@hotmail.com 1/8/2006 8:05:27 AM >>>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Ron Brown" <L39parts@hotmail.com>
>
> In the US, firemen's SCBA bottle fittings vary with the
manufacturer. >SCUBA
> diving bottles use a standard fitting, but there are a lot of
airports >in
> the US that are a long ways from the ocean and quite possibly a long
>ways
> from a dive shop. Another problem is that most US airports don't
have >a
> fire department on the field.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Hans Oortman" <pa3arw@euronet.nl>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 1:14 PM
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Hans Oortman"
<pa3arw@euronet.nl>
> >
> > Guys,
> >
> > The only thing we carry around during a trip in our Yak52 is a
hose, >which
> > I
> > had made especially for this purpose, with on one side an adapter
>which
> > goes
> > on the plane and on the other side an adapter with release valve
>which
> > goes
> > on a scuba dive bottle. In Europe this is a standardized
connector, >i.e.,
> > these scuba dive bottles have the same connector as all air
bottles >used
> > by
> > the fire brigades at airfields/airports and what have you.
> > There is always a nice fire fighter at an airport or airfield who
>wants
to
> > give you a hand to charge your air bottle in the plane with one of
>his.
> > Be aware though: these bottles have 200 bars (and nowadays even
300 >bars),
> > so open them very slowly. We are using this method since years
>already
and
> > it works perfectly.
> >
> > Hans
> > Yak52 pilot from Holland
> >
> > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> > Van: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] Namens Roger Doc
Kemp
> > Verzonden: dinsdag 3 januari 2006 20:17
> > Aan: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Onderwerp: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
> >
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Roger Doc Kemp"
><viperdoc@mindspring.com>
> >
> > Gus,
> > Send me pictures of your tank. I am using a pony tank for backup.
> > viperdoc@mindspring.com
> > Doc
> >
> >
> >> [Original Message]
> >> From: Fraser, Gus <gus.fraser@gs.com>
> >> To: yak-list@matronics.com <yak-list@matronics.com>
> >> Date: 1/3/2006 8:04:12 AM
> >> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air bottles
> >>
> >> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Fraser, Gus"
<gus.fraser@gs.com>
> >>
> >> I used to carry the adapter around with me but recently I have
>changed.
I
> >> now carry a paintball gun tank. It is a 4500 pound tank with a
>regulator
> > to
> >> 800psi on the output. Paintball is the fastest growing extreme
>sport
in
> > the
> >> US and shops for this are popping up all over the place if I need
a
> > refill.
> >> The tank is about a foot long and about 4 inches around so takes
up >
> >> little
> >> space. I can send pictures if anyone is interested.
> >>
> >> Gus
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> >> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon
Boede
> >> Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 11:07 PM
> >> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> >> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air bottles
> >>
> >> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Jon Boede" <jon@email.net>
> >>
> >> I have a SCUBA to "red star" hose that flies with my airplane...
I >used
> >> to
> >> be concerned about running out of air but then I discovered
>something:
> >>
> >> When primed up good, when the weather is above 40F, hand-propping
>the
CJ
> > is
> >> really quite easy. It WANTS to start.
> >>
> >> Once you get over any trepidation about hand propping it, the
SCUBA
> > fitting
> >> is really the backup to the backup. Carrying extra air around
>hasn't
> >> been
> >> something that would have "saved the day", at lease at so far,
>after
> >> 1,200
> >> hours.
> >>
> >> Jon
> >>
> >> > I have a standard type SCUBA bottle in my hangar and I carry
the
> >> > SCUBA fitting with on a cross country for emergency. Not many
>places
> >> > you cannot borrow or rent a SCUBA bottle for an emergency. A
>schraeder
> >> > fitting is not necessary as the check valve in the system does
>the
> >> > same, the small amount of loss when you unhook the botle is not
>worth
> >> > the trouble. I tapped the fuselage fitting for AN816- 4 pipe
>fitting
> >> > and use matching fitting on the SCUBA hose then cap the
fitting >to
> >> > keeo
> >> the dirt out with AN929-4 cap.
> >> > However as Craig says hand propping is not that difficult. To
>make
it
> >> > safer I bleed off all the air then chock the airplane as you
>will
> >> > have no brakes!
> >> >
> >> > Merry Xmas and Happy New Year to all
> >> >
> >> > Joe
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>nics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Listh>ttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 23
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the incident in the Uk Re the GNAT, It was a friend of mine on the way to
meet me at an airshow. He lost all thrust except idle, this happened as he
turned downwind. He opted to stay with the jet as he was over a congested area
just north of london. the landing speed was in the region of 150+ knots into a
field. he survived and later flew a cessna 172 back to the show.
And Yes , we had more than a few beers later that night.
ger
Message 24
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| Subject: | Jim Selby - Contact info needed |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "David McGirt" <david@mcgirt.net>
Can someone email me Jim Selby's email or phone number off list please
David McGirt
Message 25
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| Subject: | 52TW - Main Tires & Tubes |
David
You have two choices if running the stock rims. Desser tires or the original
Russian. The Russian tires are better. You can get them from Jill & Carl
Hays at www.m-14p.com
If you have non-stock rims then I can't help you.
Regards
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McGirt
Subject: Yak-List: 52TW - Main Tires & Tubes
Ok, time to replace the mains on my 52TW - one recommendation I have is for
Condor 600x6 6ply tires, and Goodyear tubes..
Anyone else have better thoughts on this one? Thanks..
David McGirt
Yak 52 TW
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: 52TW - Main Tires & Tubes |
MessageFrank,
The Russian tires won't fit the Cleveland rims on the TW.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: Frank Haertlein
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 09, 2006 5:11 PM
Subject: Yak-List: 52TW - Main Tires & Tubes
David
You have two choices if running the stock rims. Desser tires or the original Russian. The Russian tires are better. You can get them from Jill & Carl Hays at www.m-14p.com
If you have non-stock rims then I can't help you.
Regards
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McGirt
Sent: Monday, January 09, 2006 8:17 AM
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Subject: Yak-List: 52TW - Main Tires & Tubes
Ok, time to replace the mains on my 52TW - one recommendation I have is for
Condor 600x6 6ply tires, and Goodyear tubes..
Anyone else have better thoughts on this one? Thanks..
David McGirt
Yak 52 TW
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Jim Selby - Contact info needed |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jim Selby" <alikatz@mbay.net>
Jim Selby
831-384-7046 Home
831-883-1266 Hanger
jimscjs@mbay.net
Jim Selby Jr
831-915-8300 Cell
----- Original Message -----
From: "David McGirt" <david@mcgirt.net>
Subject: Yak-List: Jim Selby - Contact info needed
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "David McGirt" <david@mcgirt.net>
>
> Can someone email me Jim Selby's email or phone number off list please
>
> David McGirt
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Message 28
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| Subject: | All New BBS Interface For Matronics List Forums! |
--> Yak-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Dear Listers,
I'm very proud to announce a completely new BBS interface is now available for
all of the Email Lists at Matronics! This is a full-featured system that allows
for viewing, posting, attachments, polls - the works.
But the best part is that it is *completely* integrated with all of the existing
email tools currently available at Matronics! What this means at the most basic
level is that, if you post a message to List from Email in the traditional
way, it will show up on the BBS system *and* get distributed to everyone currently
subscribed to the Email List. By the same token, if you are on the BBS
and post a message to a given List-Forum, the message will not only show up on
the BBS, but also be distributed to everyone on the Email List!!
It is really a very nice implementation and I am very pleased with its operation.
All of the tools you have come to know and love such as the List Search Engine
and List Browse and Download will still be available and contain all of the
latest posts. Think of the new BBS interface as just another method of accessing
the all of the Lists.
You can use the BBS to view all of the latest posts without having to do anything
except use your browser to surf over to the site. You can view and look at
all of the various List's posts. If you want to post a new message or reply
to an existing message from the BBS, you will have to Register on the BBS. This
is a *very* simple process and will only take a couple of minutes. There is
a small icon in the upper righthand side of the main BBS page labeled "Register"
to get you started.
I strongly recommend that you use the exact *same* email address you are subscribed
to the Email Lists with when registering on the BBS. Also, while not an
absolute requirement, I would really appreciate it if people would use their full
name when choosing their Username on the BBS (for example "Matt Dralle").
This just makes it easier for everyone to know who's posting. Also, I have enabled
the ability to upload a small user picture with your profile called an
"avatar". Please use a *real* picture of yourself *with* your cloths on! Thank
you! Maximum size of the bitmap is 120x120.
You can either be subscribed to the BBS, or any number of Email Lists, or both.
Registering on the BBS will allow you to email directly to all of the various
Lists. However, to receive direct List Email, you will need to be *subscribed*
to the various Lists as you have in the past. No changes here in operation.
I have added numerous links on the BBS pointing to the Email List subscription
page.
I've had the BBS connected to the Lists for about a week now, so its already loaded
up with a fair number of messages. You can post photos and other documents
directly to the BBS and links to them will appear in the List Email distributions.
Also, when any messages posted to the BBS are viewed in the List Email
distribution, there will be a URL link at the bottom of the message pointing
back to the BBS.
And here's what you've been waiting for -- the main URL for the new Matronics Email
List BBS is:
http://forums.matronics.com
Please surf on over, Register, and have a great time! I think this will be the
dawn of a whole new era for the Lists at Matronics!
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
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