Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:34 AM - Re: excessive mag drop & warm cyl. (Steve Dalton)
2. 05:38 AM - Valve Lash Adjustment (Craig Payne)
3. 05:43 AM - Re: excessive mag drop & warm cyl. (A. Dennis Savarese)
4. 07:48 AM - Re: CJ Service Techs in USA (ANDREWS)
5. 11:17 AM - Yak 9 video (Daniel Fortin)
6. 12:15 PM - Re: Valve Lash Adjustment (YakL1@aol.com)
7. 03:06 PM - Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? (Scooter)
8. 03:39 PM - Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? (A. Dennis Savarese)
9. 04:45 PM - Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? (Scooter)
10. 06:15 PM - Re: Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? (A. Dennis Savarese)
11. 08:24 PM - Re: Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? (Roger Kemp)
12. 10:33 PM - ARS V - hotel, online registration closing (Barry Hancock)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: excessive mag drop & warm cyl. |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Steve Dalton" <sdalton@goeaston.net>
> Last July just before OSH I got water in the ignition wires on my?regular?52.
After various methods of drying out the wires, I ended up fouling the champions,
so I replaced them with the Chinese plugs.? ran well with good mag checks
but I immediately noticed a little higher cylinder head temps at various power
settings.??
Ski replaced his Champions with the Russian plugs and his CHT was noticably higher.
The Champions seem to run cold. That's one reason why they foul so easily
at idle. MMO does help this. :)
> After?a few months, I began to experience mag checks in excess of 3 percent.
mag checks degraded to 5 or 6 percent drop on both mags but?the engine ran smooth.?
I changed out the ignition harness and plugs?with the kit from Dennis, checked
timing, point gaps, and plug gaps.? The engine starts easy, runs smooth,
and develops 100 percent RPM, but I still get a 5 percent mag drop during a
static?run up whether before or after a flight, and cylinder head temps are still
10 to 20 degrees higher than normal during all phases of operation.
Sounds like the problem developed long after the plug swap, and replacing the harness
and plugs did not help. Because BOTH mags drop equally, it would seem
to be a timing problem, ie, you timed them both the same...but wrong. The higher
temps could just be due to hotter plugs than the cold Champions. Please keep
us posted on your fix.
What did you find to be the problem with the TD engine at Sun & Fun? Hope you're
up and running soon.
Steve
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=31599#31599
Message 2
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| Subject: | Valve Lash Adjustment |
The principal reason for routine checking of valve lash is due to wear. Wear between
the valve and seat mostly.The reason for having valve lash is that the valve
train expands with heat and tends to tighten up at operating temperature.
Excessive lash can lead to losses in combustion effiency and a buildup of deposits
on the valve and seat, leading to burning, etc.
The problem with adjusting lash hot is that the other cylinders are cooling while
one is being adjusted. The result may be not enough lash on a cylinder which
causes a "sticking" spot during air start due to air escaping through the valve,
or a loss of compression after the valve train heats up; which means the
valve really never closes during the compression stroke.
I check mine cold, and on more than one cam lobe. Remember that there are 4 intake
lobes and 4 exhaust lobes for 9 cylinders. If a cam lobe experiences more
wear than the other lobes, valve lash is excessive for each valve train that the
lobe opens. On a tired old Huosai, I measured a .002" difference in lobes.
Upon teardown, there was pitting on valve, seats, and cam lobes due to sitting
in storage for a long time without "pickling". Of course the Chinese logbook
showed 15 day runups, but the handwriting, even in Chinese looked identical for
every entry :>(
Craig Payne
cpayne@joimail.com
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: excessive mag drop & warm cyl. |
RE: Yak-List: excessive mag drop & warm cyl.If I'm not mistaken, the M14
manual says to set the valve lash cold. Spec is .3 mm (.012"), with a
tolerance of .25 mm (.010") to .35 mm (.014"). If one sets the valve
clearance slightly on the loose side, say closer to the .35, that may
help with the non-linear metal expansion and provide overall adequate
valve clearances. As we all know, too tight equals burned valves. A
couple of key points when checking the valve clearance:
1 - be sure to release the lifter spring pressure by pressing down on
the rocker arm adjuster nut and then insert the feeler gauge between the
roller and valve.
2 - never measure the gap going with the roller. Always measure the gap
at 90 degrees to the roller for a more accurate measurement
3 - a standard feeler gauge with the end slight bent is typically too
long and binds on the valve spring washer when feeling the measurement.
It is best to shorten the bent end of the feeler gauge to about 1/2" so
it no longer will bind on the valve spring washer when inserted
perpendicular to the roller.
One final thing to check of course would be leaking intake gland nuts or
intake tube collars, which cause lean cylinders. Immediately after
shutting down, use a laser temperature sensor to measure the heat on
each cylinder. Always measure at the exact same point on each cylinder,
such as just below the base of the spark plug. Look for significant
differences in cylinder heat. You may also be able to move the probes
from the rear plug of #4 to possibly #3 cylinder. Then see what you get
for CHT.
Just my 2 cents worth -
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: Bitterlich GS11 Mark G
To: 'yak-list@matronics.com'
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2006 3:14 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: excessive mag drop & warm cyl.
The suggestions for finding TDC and setting timing accurately have
already been given and are very good obviously. What I believe is
significant is that both Mags have equal drop, and as they drop
increased, they stayed equal through-out the process. One thing I can
say from direct observation and that is, the more advanced the engine
timing is, the less the mag drop, and... a retarded engine runs hot.
Just the opposite of what makes sense. So... maybe it IS timing.
Valve Lash. There is just no question that valve lash drifts
considerably in one year. In other words, I strongly suspect you have a
valve lash issue simply by the statement that you have not adjusted them
in awhile. What is "awhile" ?? I run my engine very hard, and have
gotten into the habit of checking them every 6 months or so. I've also
seen a dramatic change in valve lash going from hot to cold. Opinions
vary on how to set lash... most people say: "Medium Warm". I'd like to
hear what Dennis has to say about that personally. I have measured lash
when the engine is HOT HOT HOT... and then have let it go stone cold and
have measured it again. I was agog.... it is a HUGE difference. Since
lash can impact generated power by a LOT... I lean towards setting them
HOT. Of course, it is then hard to set them all the same! Setting them
dead cold at least gets them all the same... assuming the change with
heat is linear on all cylinders. What do you have to say about this
Dennis, or anyone else for that matter?
Mark
N50YK
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Bernier
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2006 12:33 PM
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Yak-List: excessive mag drop & warm cyl.
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Jim Bernier" <JBernier@dart.org>
Bill
I found it far more accurate to find TDC by making a tool out of an
old spark plug. Hollow out the ceramic center, all of the ceramic, and
force a steel rod down the center so that it extends beyond the point
were the piston would miss it. You determine this distance with the same
screw driver. Measure the distance that the screw driver travels into
the cylinder at the same angle as the plug would travel when the piston
is near TDC. Add about 0.5 inches to the distance. Affix the rod to this
distance in the plug by measuring from the flat contact point. You
should round the end of the rod so it doesn't nick the piston. I used JB
Weld to hold it in place. Be certain that when you rotate the plug that
the rod stays centered. Pull the piston back down by reversing the prop
direction, counter clockwise. Insert the new plug and finger tighten.
Bring the piston back up in contact with the plug. Slowly. Once this is
established read the degrees on the prop hub with a digital level!
. (They cost about $100 on the internet and well worth it.) Find the
angle on the opposite side of the piston travel. Same technique, only
with the piston traveling in the opposite direction. You will have to
remove the plug, bring the piston beyond TDC, replace the plug, bring
the piston back toward TDC until it touches the plug. Measure this angle
using the same place on the prop hub. Determine the difference and
divide it by 2. Add this to the original measurement for an accurate
TDC. To find the advanced angle that the mags need to be set at just add
this to your calculated TDC angle. Always set the piston in this
position by moving the prop from well before TDC to the determined
angle, prop turning in normal rotation. Clockwise as you face it.
It's more work but very accurate.
BTW, As long as you set the final prop angle by moving it clockwise,
prop lash will not be a factor. If you move it counter clockwise it will
be a factor and your final piston position will be wrong.
Good luck.
Jim B
>>> bwalker11@charter.net 04/28/06 8:18 AM >>>
----- Original Message -----
From: A. Dennis Savarese
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2006 7:42 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: excessive mag drop & warm cyl.
Bill,
Just a couple of questions first -
-What did you use to set TDC when you checked/set the timing?
I watched the exhaust valve open and close during the exhaust
stroke to make sure I was on the compression stroke and used a
screwdriver to feel for TDC on the top of the piston.
-What did you set the timing to? The spec is 14-16 degrees BTDC as
measured at the propeller flange.
After marking "0" with a piece of saftey wire, I backed up the
to 30 BTDC then pulled in the direction of rotation. Both lights came
on at the same time at 15 BTDC.
-When you found what degree the points opened with the mag timing
box, did you check to see if the rotor was pointing DIRECTLY at the
scribed mark on the mag boss?
Did not check this - I'll go back and do it.
- When was the last time the mag caps/distribution caps were
replaced? The condition of the contacts on both the rotor and cap can
make a difference.
I swapped a mag cap off my new plane on one of the mags and It
did not make any difference on either plane. Mag caps looked good
anyway.
- Have you tried swapping the mags from left to right to see if the
5% mag drop follows the mag swap?
No, both mags are getting equal drop. Except for watching the
RPM for each mag, I could not tell it there was anything wrong.
- Has anyone made any fuel flow adjustments on the carburetor?
No
- Are you certain you do not have any intake leaks particularly
around the intake gland nuts and their rubber seals which could cause
lean operation and higher CHT's?
Good Idea - I'm going to check these today along with the valve
clearances.
Dennis
Thanks, Dennis
Wild Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Walker
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2006 7:15 AM
Subject: Yak-List: excessive mag drop & warm cyl.
Last July just before OSH I got water in the ignition wires on my
regular 52. After various methods of drying out the wires, I ended up
fouling the champions, so I replaced them with the Chinese plugs. ran
well with good mag checks but I immediately noticed a little higher
cylinder head temps at various power settings. After a few months, I
began to experience mag checks in excess of 3 percent. mag checks
degraded to 5 or 6 percent drop on both mags but the engine ran smooth.
I changed out the ignition harness and plugs with the kit from Dennis,
checked timing, point gaps, and plug gaps. The engine starts easy, runs
smooth, and develops 100 percent RPM, but I still get a 5 percent mag
drop during a static run up whether before or after a flight, and
cylinder head temps are still 10 to 20 degrees higher than normal during
all phases of operation. Also compression checked over 70/80 on all
cylinders. I have not measured the valve clearances lately, I suppose I
could !
have an exhaust valve not opening completely. Any Ideas, anyone ?
Dennis?
Wild Bill
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Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: CJ Service Techs in USA |
In the Southwest Bill Blackwell at Deervalley airport (KDVT) in Phoenix
Arizona maintains 25 CJ-6s / 5 YAK-52 / 2 YAK-50 / 1YAK-52W just in the
Phoenix area.
Blackwell Redstar Aviation LLC
4403 West Villa Linda Drive
Glendale,AZ 85310
(623) 703-1001
billblackwell@phxinternet.net
----- Original Message -----
From: ByronMFox@aol.com
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2006 8:24 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: CJ Service Techs in USA
In a message dated 4/28/2006 9:50:30 AM Pacific Standard Time,
hkgibby@yahoo.com writes:
I am buying a CJ6 and am putting together a list of A&P's and
Avionics techs who people have had success with from around the lower 48
and Canada.
In the San Francisco Bay Area, Jim Selby at Marina Airport (OAR) near
Monterey has extensive CJ experience. I think Jim has imported north of
20 CJs. He expertly maintains most of the CJs in our area.
Jim can be reached at 831-883-1266 and at jimscjs@mbay.net ...Blitz
Byron M. Fox
80 Milland Drive
Mill Valley, CA 94941
Home 415-380-0907
Cell 415-307-2405
Message 5
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--> Yak-List message posted by: "Daniel Fortin" <fougapilot@hotmail.com>
Anyone still has a copy of the video showing the Yak 9 nearly pancakes it
after a split S?
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Valve Lash Adjustment |
In a message dated 4/29/2006 5:39:34 AM Pacific Standard Time,
cpayne@joimail.com writes:
On a tired old Huosai, I measured a .002" difference in lobes. Upon
teardown, there was pitting on valve, seats, and cam lobes due to sitting in
storage
for a long time without "pickling". Of course the Chinese logbook showed 15
day runups, but the handwriting, even in Chinese looked identical for every
entry :
Have you been making this daily entry or am I supposed to do it?
Message 7
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| Subject: | Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Scooter" <yakk52@verizon.net>
Anyone ever see anything like this (see attached photo)? I noticed this after
taxiing around the airport for a bit, warming the engine prior to changing the
oil. The consistency of the spatter is like oily-grease i think (thicker than
straight grease). I cleaned it off and flew a quick flight then a longer flight
and it didn't happen again. I didn't notice any difference in braking.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=31689#31689
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/wheel_144.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/wheel_630.jpg
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>
Scooter,
You need to replace the felt grease seals in the drum. There is an outer
felt grease seal around the opening where the large disk fits into the drum.
This seal prevents what is seen in the photo. There is another grease seal
at the very back of the drum around the outside edge. This seal helps
prevent the grease from splattering all over the brake pads. The felt
grease seals comes in a kit. I believe Doug Sapp has these grease seals on
the shelf. Give him a call or email.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scooter" <yakk52@verizon.net>
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2006 5:04 PM
Subject: Yak-List: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter?
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Scooter" <yakk52@verizon.net>
>
> Anyone ever see anything like this (see attached photo)? I noticed this
> after taxiing around the airport for a bit, warming the engine prior to
> changing the oil. The consistency of the spatter is like oily-grease i
> think (thicker than straight grease). I cleaned it off and flew a quick
> flight then a longer flight and it didn't happen again. I didn't notice
> any difference in braking.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=31689#31689
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/wheel_144.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/wheel_630.jpg
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Scooter" <yakk52@verizon.net>
thanks dennis! thanks also for all of your excellent advice. don't know what
we'd do without you.
dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.co wrote:
> Scooter,
> You need to replace the felt grease seals in the drum. There is an outer
> felt grease seal around the opening where the large disk fits into the drum.
> This seal prevents what is seen in the photo. There is another grease seal
> at the very back of the drum around the outside edge. This seal helps
> prevent the grease from splattering all over the brake pads. The felt
> grease seals comes in a kit. I believe Doug Sapp has these grease seals on
> the shelf. Give him a call or email.
> Dennis
>
> ---
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=31700#31700
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>
Scooter you humble me.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scooter" <yakk52@verizon.net>
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2006 6:44 PM
Subject: Yak-List: Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter?
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Scooter" <yakk52@verizon.net>
>
> thanks dennis! thanks also for all of your excellent advice. don't know
> what we'd do without you.
>
>
> dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.co wrote:
>> Scooter,
>> You need to replace the felt grease seals in the drum. There is an outer
>> felt grease seal around the opening where the large disk fits into the
>> drum.
>> This seal prevents what is seen in the photo. There is another grease
>> seal
>> at the very back of the drum around the outside edge. This seal helps
>> prevent the grease from splattering all over the brake pads. The felt
>> grease seals comes in a kit. I believe Doug Sapp has these grease seals
>> on
>> the shelf. Give him a call or email.
>> Dennis
>>
>> ---
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=31700#31700
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter? |
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Roger Kemp" <viperdoc@mindspring.com>
He's right.
Doc
> [Original Message]
> From: A. Dennis Savarese <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 4/29/2006 8:21:46 PM
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter?
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese"
<dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>
>
> Scooter you humble me.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Scooter" <yakk52@verizon.net>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2006 6:44 PM
> Subject: Yak-List: Re: Yak wheel grease/oil spatter?
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "Scooter" <yakk52@verizon.net>
> >
> > thanks dennis! thanks also for all of your excellent advice. don't
know
> > what we'd do without you.
> >
> >
> >
> > dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.co wrote:
> >> Scooter,
> >> You need to replace the felt grease seals in the drum. There is an
outer
> >> felt grease seal around the opening where the large disk fits into the
> >> drum.
> >> This seal prevents what is seen in the photo. There is another grease
> >> seal
> >> at the very back of the drum around the outside edge. This seal helps
> >> prevent the grease from splattering all over the brake pads. The felt
> >> grease seals comes in a kit. I believe Doug Sapp has these grease
seals
> >> on
> >> the shelf. Give him a call or email.
> >> Dennis
> >>
> >> ---
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=31700#31700
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | ARS V - hotel, online registration closing |
Airmen (and women),
We have just received a list of names from the Best Western in
Porterville....and it is clear that some have registered but not made
hotel reservations. Rooms are being held for us until the 1st of
May....yes, like in two days...this May, not next. ;)-
If you are planning to attend ARS and have either not registered or
not made hotel reservations, NOW is the time. Did I mention NOW is
the time? I would hate for people to show up and not be able to get
a room. There is a very nice camping area at the airport tho'....
So if you don't secure a room by May 1, Costco's having good deals on
tents right now... ;)
Here's the hotel info:
> HOTEL
>
> If you call to make a reservation without mentioning All Red Star,
> they will tell you the hotel is sold out! This is because we have
> 80 rooms reserved! When someone calls to make a reservation, use
> "All Red Star" as the group name, which is in their computer. Then
> use one of the following codes for your stay, if applicable.
>
> 3rd - 7th: CGRED
> 4th - 7th: CGSTAR
> 5th - 7th: CGREDS
> 6ht - 7th: CGRED1
>
> The front desk person will ask how many days and then the code will
> go along with their confirmation number. The CG is Best Western's
> group code...nothing to do with us; something they have to use. If
> you have any questions, please contact our Event Coordinator, Amy
> Rose, at bomberamy@yahoo.com.
>
> For reservations, DO NOT use the internet. Call them at 559-781-7411.
Also, online registration will also close May 1. You can still
register at the event.
Looking forward to seeing you all there!
Cheers,
Barry
Barry Hancock
Event Director
All Red Star
(949) 300-5510
www.allredstar.com
"A Unique Aviation Experience"
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