Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:24 AM - Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (Hans Oortman)
2. 12:31 AM - Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (Rob Kent - WLAC Russian Engineering)
3. 12:39 AM - Yak 50 DC (Mark Jefferies YAK UK)
4. 04:19 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Phil Cogan)
5. 04:52 AM - Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (A. Dennis Savarese)
6. 06:15 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Genzlinger, Reade)
7. 06:32 AM - Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (flir47)
8. 06:35 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Roger Kemp)
9. 06:45 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (A. Dennis Savarese)
10. 06:53 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (ggg6@att.net)
11. 06:54 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Genzlinger, Reade)
12. 07:35 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Roger Kemp)
13. 07:39 AM - Re: Yak 50 DC (Yak Pilot)
14. 07:55 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (seancrotty@aol.com)
15. 08:00 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (Don Milbourn)
16. 08:51 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (Doug Sapp)
17. 09:10 AM - Fly In at MRT on 5-12-07 (Craig Schneider)
18. 09:39 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (john Fischer)
19. 11:37 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Roger Kemp)
20. 08:40 PM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (Walter Lannon)
21. 08:53 PM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (KingCJ6@aol.com)
22. 10:50 PM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (Doug Sapp)
23. 11:26 PM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (shinden33)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? |
Phil,
It is not even "normal" aluminium either but so called "dural aluminium"
which probably is even more difficult to find. The latter is much harder and
tougher than the normal aluminium. In Holland the normal aluminium is rather
easy to get the dural type just a bit more difficult.
Dennis, is copper not a bit too soft??
Hans
_____
Van: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] Namens PSalter@aol.com
Verzonden: maandag 12 februari 2007 0:32
Aan: yak-list@matronics.com
Onderwerp: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
I spent hours Friday searching for metric aluminum tubing to replace damaged
tubing connecting the main air valve, terminating at the aft bulkhead next
to the rear seat. I bought a roll of 1/4" copper tube and decided to resize
and use the metric fittings from my old air line. I tried a few different
methods of shrinking the tube with poor results. I decided to tie one end of
the copper to my trailer hitch and the other to a come-a-long attached to
another vehicle. I stretched the tube and checked the diameter with a
micrometer until I had the desired diameter. My shade tree engineering
worked better than I hoped for. I replaced the damaged tubing with the newly
sized copper used the original fittings and went flying. I was told 1/4"
tubing (un-stretched) is good for 4000 psi. I am guessing if I lose half the
strength in the stretching process, I still have a safety factor of around
2. Are there any reasons why I shouldn't use copper?
Phil
N700HS CJ6A
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? |
We looked into the aluminium tubing. We found that we could obtain the
correct material, with all the required properties and strengths, in
drawn lengths of 1.5m for approx $2.5 per length. The downside was that
a minimum order would have been 4000 lengths, when we only use a max of
a dozen per year we decided to stick with the metric copper tubing which
is much easier to obtain in small quantities.
Regards
Rob Kent
Stores Manager
WLAC - Russian Engineering
www.wlacrussianeng.co.uk
Tel: +44 1628 829 165
Fax: +44 1628 825 975
Mob: +44 7842 964 358
----- Original Message -----
From: PSalter@aol.com
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 11:32 PM
Subject: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
I spent hours Friday searching for metric aluminum tubing to replace
damaged tubing connecting the main air valve, terminating at the aft
bulkhead next to the rear seat. I bought a roll of 1/4" copper tube and
decided to resize and use the metric fittings from my old air line. I
tried a few different methods of shrinking the tube with poor results. I
decided to tie one end of the copper to my trailer hitch and the other
to a come-a-long attached to another vehicle. I stretched the tube and
checked the diameter with a micrometer until I had the desired diameter.
My shade tree engineering worked better than I hoped for. I replaced the
damaged tubing with the newly sized copper used the original fittings
and went flying. I was told 1/4" tubing (un-stretched) is good for
4000 psi. I am guessing if I lose half the strength in the stretching
process, I still have a safety factor of around 2. Are there any reasons
why I shouldn't use copper?
Phil
N700HS CJ6A
Message 3
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Mark, on the 50 you will find that the main fuse which is mounted in the
centre of the grey box can fail through vibration. The wire breaks of at the
caps internally. Just for a test, solder a wire along the outside of it.
This is a pain failure as it can be intermittent in our experience.
Various manuals http://www.yakuk.com/manuals.asp are here. The tech
description has the drawings for the 50.
Mark Jefferies for YAK <http://www.yakuk.com> UK Ltd
Message 4
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| Subject: | Yakk'in in Philly |
Welcome aboard Scott!
We have many Yaks and CJs in the Phila, NJ area. Where will you base your
plane?
Contact me and we'll be glad to help out.
Phil Cogan
N21740@earthlink.net
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of shinden33
Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 9:50 PM
Subject: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly
Hi all,
I will be moving my '52 from So Cal to Philadelphia this summer. My wife
goT accepted to Vet school at the University of Penn! Does anyone have
recommendations on Yakk'in in the Philly area? I'd like to get my name on a
list for a hangar and get an idea of who the local mechanics are and where
they can be found. General area advice such as where to live or tips for
Vet School students (if anyone on list may have that kind of experience as
well) would helpful as well. Thanks in advance!
Scott Glaser
8252
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? |
Hans,
The copper tubing that I have purchased was not too soft as far as I
could tell. I guess my question is, too soft for what? It certainly
doesn't bend any easier than the normal aluminum tubing. The reason I
had to use copper was the unavailability of aluminum metric tubing.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: Hans Oortman
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 2:23 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
Phil,
It is not even "normal" aluminium either but so called "dural
aluminium" which probably is even more difficult to find. The latter is
much harder and tougher than the normal aluminium. In Holland the normal
aluminium is rather easy to get the dural type just a bit more
difficult.
Dennis, is copper not a bit too soft??
Hans
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Van: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] Namens PSalter@aol.com
Verzonden: maandag 12 februari 2007 0:32
Aan: yak-list@matronics.com
Onderwerp: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
I spent hours Friday searching for metric aluminum tubing to replace
damaged tubing connecting the main air valve, terminating at the aft
bulkhead next to the rear seat. I bought a roll of 1/4" copper tube and
decided to resize and use the metric fittings from my old air line. I
tried a few different methods of shrinking the tube with poor results. I
decided to tie one end of the copper to my trailer hitch and the other
to a come-a-long attached to another vehicle. I stretched the tube and
checked the diameter with a micrometer until I had the desired diameter.
My shade tree engineering worked better than I hoped for. I replaced the
damaged tubing with the newly sized copper used the original fittings
and went flying. I was told 1/4" tubing (un-stretched) is good for
4000 psi. I am guessing if I lose half the strength in the stretching
process, I still have a safety factor of around 2. Are there any reasons
why I shouldn't use copper?
Phil
N700HS CJ6A
Message 6
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| Subject: | Yakk'in in Philly |
Hey Scott:
Welcome to Philly! I hangar at DYL - Doylestown, PA about 30 miles north of
center city. I'm the only Yak there but over at N14 (Flying W) in Medford,
NJ there are several 52's and a couple of those Chinese things. There are
other Yaks and CJs in the area. We have an active formation group -
Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying the 52
the way it was intended.... Call me at your convenience to discuss the
other items.
Reade Genzlinger
215.914.0370
> -----Original Message-----
> From: shinden33 [mailto:shinden33@earthlink.net]
> Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 9:50 PM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly
>
> {SPAM?} Header
>
> Hi all,
>
> I will be moving my '52 from So Cal to Philadelphia this
> summer.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? |
Gents,
Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will fatigue over time.
Then failure is inevitable. Copper should never be used in or near an environment
that induces any kind of vibration. Hans is correct with the term dural
aluminium. Using copper just to save money is a dangerous idea!
--------
You built and fly an RV.......BIG DEAL!!!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=94449#94449
Message 8
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| Subject: | Yakk'in in Philly |
> [Original Message]
> From: Genzlinger, Reade <ReadeG@Cairnwood.com>
We have an active formation group -
> Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying the 52
> the way it was intended....
> other items.
>
> Reade Genzlinger
Reade,
Would that be with a student in the nose and an IP in the trunk? Are yall
using them YAKs for DOSAF training up there with the NE Raiders?
Sorry, just being my smart ass self.
Doc
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? |
Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm aluminum tubing.
I personally would appreciate it very much.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "flir47" <me262pilot@comcast.net>
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM
Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
>
> Gents,
>
> Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will fatigue over
> time. Then failure is inevitable. Copper should never be used in or near
> an environment that induces any kind of vibration. Hans is correct with
> the term ?odural aluminium?. Using copper just to save money is a
> dangerous idea!
>
> --------
> You built and fly an RV.......BIG DEAL!!!!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=94449#94449
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? |
Gentlemen, does anyone have a connection in China for the Alumimun Tubing,, they
gladly export most everything?
Gary Gabbard CJ N22YK
-------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>:
--------------
>
> Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm aluminum tubing.
> I personally would appreciate it very much.
> Dennis
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "flir47"
> To:
> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM
> Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
>
>
> >
> > Gents,
> >
> > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will fatigue over
> > time. Then failure is inevitable. Copper should never be used in or near
> > an environment that induces any kind of vibration. Hans is correct with
> > the term ?odural aluminium?. Using copper just to save money is a
> > dangerous idea!
> >
> > --------
> > You built and fly an RV.......BIG DEAL!!!!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=94449#94449
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
<html>
<!-- BEGIN WEBMAIL STATIONERY -->
<head></head>
<body>
<!-- WEBMAIL STATIONERY noneset -->
<DIV></DIV>
<P>Gentlemen, does anyone have a connection in China for the Alumimun Tubing,,
they gladly export most everything? </P>
<P> </P>
<P>Gary Gabbard CJ N22YK<BR></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px
solid">-------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>:
-------------- <BR><BR><BR>> --> Yak-List message
posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" <DSAVARESE@ELMORE.RR.COM><BR>> <BR>> Please
help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm aluminum tubing. <BR>>
I personally would appreciate it very much. <BR>> Dennis <BR>> <BR>>
----- Original Message ----- <BR>> From: "flir47" <ME262PILOT@COMCAST.NET><BR>>
To: <YAK-LIST@MATRONICS.COM><BR>> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007
8:32 AM <BR>> Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air
Line??? <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "flir47"
<ME262PILOT@COMCAST.NET><BR>> > <BR>> > Gents, <BR>> >
<BR>> > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will fatigue
over <BR>> > time. Then failure is inevi
table.
hat, F
<!-- END WEBMAIL STATIONERY -->
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Yakk'in in Philly |
Hey Doc:
Well - actually - a little of both!!
Gena Elfimov (Skytrace) has come over a number of years and taken a group of
us through the entire DOSAAF program - nothing like it! Past that I'm just
like the rest of us - having way too much fun flying these things.
Reade
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Kemp [mailto:viperdoc@mindspring.com]
> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:35 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly
>
> {SPAM?} Header
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: Genzlinger, Reade <ReadeG@Cairnwood.com>
> We have an active formation group -
> > Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying
> > the 52 the way it was intended....
> > other items.
> >
> > Reade Genzlinger
>
> Reade,
> Would that be with a student in the nose and an IP in the
> trunk? Are yall using them YAKs for DOSAF training up there
> with the NE Raiders?
> Sorry, just being my smart ass self.
> Doc
Message 12
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| Subject: | Yakk'in in Philly |
Now that would be fun! Same here, just having a group of fun flying these
birds! Still nothing in the US invetory can touch them for the money! Even
if we do have to work on them more than those flat head Lycomings!
Doc
> [Original Message]
> From: Genzlinger, Reade <ReadeG@Cairnwood.com>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 2/12/2007 9:05:56 AM
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly
>
>
> Hey Doc:
>
> Well - actually - a little of both!!
>
> Gena Elfimov (Skytrace) has come over a number of years and taken a group
of
> us through the entire DOSAAF program - nothing like it! Past that I'm
just
> like the rest of us - having way too much fun flying these things.
>
> Reade
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Roger Kemp [mailto:viperdoc@mindspring.com]
> > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:35 AM
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly
> >
> > {SPAM?} Header
> >
> >
> > > [Original Message]
> > > From: Genzlinger, Reade <ReadeG@Cairnwood.com>
> > We have an active formation group -
> > > Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying
> > > the 52 the way it was intended....
> > > other items.
> > >
> > > Reade Genzlinger
> >
> > Reade,
> > Would that be with a student in the nose and an IP in the
> > trunk? Are yall using them YAKs for DOSAF training up there
> > with the NE Raiders?
> > Sorry, just being my smart ass self.
> > Doc
>
>
Message 13
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|
Hi Mark. Great advice, thank you for taking the time to write. I had what you
have described happen already and it did exactly as you said! I went right
to those fuses first this time with no luck. It appears the main contactor relay
is not closing, although I havfe no idea why yet. First, I can hardly fit
into that hole to get into the aircraft to work on it. Second, working on it
with the engine running is rather unnerving to say the least. I am going to
try something different. I have a variable power supply that I can crank up to
28 volts. I plan on disconnecting the generator and hooking up that power supply
to emulate it. I will probably put a light bulb on the generator field
wire to act as a load for the carbon pile regulator. Using that, I THINK I may
be able to troubleshoot the circuits real time just as if the engine were running.
I have never tried anything like this before, but I can not think why
it would not work in theory. The electrics on
these aircraft are really not a whole lot of fun to work on. I am eye-balling
that B&C SK-35 alternator replacement with a keen eye right about now, but wow...
very expensive.
Anyway, thanks one and all for all the help, and I will give a report of success
or failure!
Mark Bitterlich
N50YK
Mark Jefferies YAK UK <mj@yakuk.com> wrote:
Mark, on the 50 you will find that the main fuse which is mounted in the
centre of the grey box can fail through vibration. The wire breaks of at the
caps internally. Just for a test, solder a wire along the outside of it.
This is a pain failure as it can be intermittent in our experience.
Various manuals http://www.yakuk.com/manuals.asp are here. The tech
description has the drawings for the 50.
Mark Jefferies for YAK UK Ltd
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Yakk'in in Philly |
Hey Reade,
My name is Sean Crotty and I was an instructor pilot in the USAF - T-37's
and have flown the CJ-6 in the past but haven't got a chance to fly the 52 yet
-
I am working for an airline now and get to Philly all the time actually
typing this on a long layover this trip from the Hilton out by the airport.
Would love to stay in touch and see if there might be a seat free sometime in
the
future - formation would be icing on the cake - I taught formation flying as
well as aerobatics for over four years before moving to the heavies - so
would be fun to share some flying with you guys if you get a chance email me
back.
Sean
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? |
I have a frend in china ,he also owns a yak. I will check with him.
Don Milbourn
----- Original Message -----
From: ggg6@att.net
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 7:52 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
Gentlemen, does anyone have a connection in China for the Alumimun
Tubing,, they gladly export most everything?
Gary Gabbard CJ N22YK
-------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese"
<dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>: --------------
>
> Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm
aluminum tubing.
> I personally would appreciate it very much.
> Dennis
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "flir47"
> To:
> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM
> Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
>
>
> >
> > Gents,
> >
> > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will
fatigue over
> > time. Then failure is inevi table. hat, F
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! |
Guys I have two never flown aircraft which were damaged in a trucking
accident, I can easily strip some tubing out of them, how much do you
need. Or on the other hand you could try to export it out of china if
you want to wait 90 days.
Always Yakin,
Doug
Don Milbourn wrote:
> I have a frend in china ,he also owns a yak. I will check with him.
>
> Don Milbourn
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* ggg6@att.net <mailto:ggg6@att.net>
> *To:* yak-list@matronics.com <mailto:yak-list@matronics.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, February 12, 2007 7:52 AM
> *Subject:* Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
>
> Gentlemen, does anyone have a connection in China for the
> Alumimun Tubing,, they gladly export most everything?
>
>
>
> Gary Gabbard CJ N22YK
>
> -------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese"
> <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com <mailto:dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>>:
> --------------
>
>
> >
> > Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm
> aluminum tubing.
> > I personally would appreciate it very much.
> > Dennis
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "flir47"
> > To:
> > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM
> > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air
> Line???
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Gents,
> > >
> > > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and
> will fatigue over
> > > time. Then failure is inevi table. hat, F
>
>*
>
>href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
>href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>
>*
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>*
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>*
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Message 17
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| Subject: | Fly In at MRT on 5-12-07 |
FYI: Warbird Fly In 5-12-07
MRT (Union County Airport, Marysville, Ohio)
FAA Wings Seminars
Pancake Breakfest
EAA Chapter 9 will be hosting is first Informal Warbird Fly In on May
12th, 2007 at the Union County Airport (MRT) in Marysville Ohio. Pancake
breakfest starts at 9am followed by FAA Wings presentions by Dr. Bob
Lewis on "Hypoxia" and Jerry Eichenberger on "Sport Plane Partnerships".
All Warbirds (WWI, WWII,other foriegn/domestic wars and conflicts) are
invited to fly In. Plenty of ramp space, Fuel Discounts and a great
group of local pilots and friends. Fly Bys and formation groups please
coordinate wth me prior to the Fly In. If there's an FAST IP who can do
a class onsite, classroom space will be available. Contact me at
craig@ustek.com for more info and to let me know you're coming.
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! |
Group,
If I remember correctly, I had a damaged air line on my Yak.
I cut the tubing past the russian fittings, placed an an fiting on the line
and flaired it. Did the same on the other end and used a union to connect them.
If I remenber correct, the russian flair is similiar to the US flair and there
is a line similiar enough to work. I beleive that I looked a making a new line
using the russian fittings and US flair, but it would take longer to make the
new line then splicing the old one.
Laterrrr
John Fischer
Yak-52, N213YA
>
>Guys I have two never flown aircraft which were damaged in a trucking
>accident, I can easily strip some tubing out of them, how much do you
>need. Or on the other hand you could try to export it out of china if
>you want to wait 90 days.
>
>Always Yakin,
>Doug
>
>Don Milbourn wrote:
>
>> I have a frend in china ,he also owns a yak. I will check with him.
>>
>> Don Milbourn
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> *From:* ggg6@att.net <mailto:ggg6@att.net>
>> *To:* yak-list@matronics.com <mailto:yak-list@matronics.com>
>> *Sent:* Monday, February 12, 2007 7:52 AM
>> *Subject:* Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
>>
>> Gentlemen, does anyone have a connection in China for the
>> Alumimun Tubing,, they gladly export most everything?
>>
>>
>>
>> Gary Gabbard CJ N22YK
>>
>> -------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese"
>> <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com <mailto:dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>>:
>> --------------
>>
>>
>> >
>> > Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm
>> aluminum tubing.
>> > I personally would appreciate it very much.
>> > Dennis
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "flir47"
>> > To:
>> > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM
>> > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air
>> Line???
>> >
>> >
>> > >
>> > > Gents,
>> > >
>> > > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and
>> will fatigue over
>> > > time. Then failure is inevi table. hat, F
>>
>>*
>>
>>href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
>>href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>>
>>*
>>
>>*
>>
>>
>>*
>>
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Yakk'in in Philly |
Sean,
If you are a member of the RPA, there is a membership roster page. You can find
guys near you that are flying and maybe get in some pit time with someone in
your local area. Don't know where home is for you. We are down the MGM area.
Doc
----- Original Message -----
From:
Sent: 2/12/2007 10:08:59 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly
Hey Reade,
My name is Sean Crotty and I was an instructor pilot in the USAF - T-37's and have
flown the CJ-6 in the past but haven't got a chance to fly the 52 yet - I
am working for an airline now and get to Philly all the time actually typing this
on a long layover this trip from the Hilton out by the airport. Would love
to stay in touch and see if there might be a seat free sometime in the future
- formation would be icing on the cake - I taught formation flying as well as
aerobatics for over four years before moving to the heavies - so would be fun
to share some flying with you guys if you get a chance email me back.
Sean
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! |
My 2 cents worth on the tubing question;
While copper was in fairly common use on aircraft in years gone by it is not
the best choice. As already pointed out it hardens over time and becomes
critical under vibration.
The correct material is 5052 aircraft tubing available from any aircraft
parts supplier.
The Chinese and Russian tubing is the same material and , in the 6 & 8 mm
dia. has a wall thickness of 1 mm (0.0394")
The 8mm dia. can be directly replaced with 5/16" 5052 using the metric nut
and sleeve with no modification. Outer dia. is 0.0015" less. The standard
wall thickness of 0.035" may be adequate but I use (and recommend) 0.049"
to guarantee equivalent or better strength.
The 6mm dia. can be replaced by 1/4" 5052 and the 0.035" wall thickness is
adequate in this dia.
To use the metric fittings the sleeve is replaced by the standard AN unit
( I forget the P/N) and the nut is modified by boring out to accept the AN
sleeve. This is easily done with an appropriate single flute step drill,
just be sure to make a small chamfer on the inside edge to avoid damage to
the sleeve.
A standard (Aircraft NOT Automotive) flaring tool is fine giving an
included angle of 75deg compared to the Russian/Chinese standard of 74deg.
Do not use the alum. alloy tubing available in coils. This is 3003 material
and the strength is not adequate. It's aircraft use is (or should be)
limited to vent and static lines only.
Cheers;
Walt
----- Original Message -----
From: "john Fischer" <fish@aviation-tech.com>
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 1:38 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call
Doug!!!
>
> Group,
>
> If I remember correctly, I had a damaged air line on my Yak.
>
> I cut the tubing past the russian fittings, placed an an fiting on the
> line
> and flaired it. Did the same on the other end and used a union to connect
> them.
>
>
> If I remenber correct, the russian flair is similiar to the US flair and
> there
> is a line similiar enough to work. I beleive that I looked a making a new
> line
> using the russian fittings and US flair, but it would take longer to make
> the
> new line then splicing the old one.
>
> Laterrrr
> John Fischer
> Yak-52, N213YA
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! |
Walt - thanks for this, and other Yak List posters continued informative and
unique insights into our world of a/c maintenance & safety. Priceless and
much appreciated information.
Dave
In a message dated 2/12/2007 8:41:55 PM Pacific Standard Time,
wlannon@cablerocket.com writes:
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Walter Lannon" <wlannon@cablerocket.com>
My 2 cents worth on the tubing question;
While copper was in fairly common use on aircraft in years gone by it is not
the best choice. As already pointed out it hardens over time and becomes
critical under vibration.
The correct material is 5052 aircraft tubing available from any aircraft
parts supplier.
The Chinese and Russian tubing is the same material and , in the 6 & 8 mm
dia. has a wall thickness of 1 mm (0.0394")
The 8mm dia. can be directly replaced with 5/16" 5052 using the metric nut
and sleeve with no modification. Outer dia. is 0.0015" less. The standard
wall thickness of 0.035" may be adequate but I use (and recommend) 0.049"
to guarantee equivalent or better strength.
The 6mm dia. can be replaced by 1/4" 5052 and the 0.035" wall thickness is
adequate in this dia.
To use the metric fittings the sleeve is replaced by the standard AN unit
( I forget the P/N) and the nut is modified by boring out to accept the AN
sleeve. This is easily done with an appropriate single flute step drill,
just be sure to make a small chamfer on the inside edge to avoid damage to
the sleeve.
A standard (Aircraft NOT Automotive) flaring tool is fine giving an
included angle of 75deg compared to the Russian/Chinese standard of 74deg.
Do not use the alum. alloy tubing available in coils. This is 3003 material
and the strength is not adequate. It's aircraft use is (or should be)
limited to vent and static lines only.
Cheers;
Walt
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! |
Outstanding post Walter! You get two attaboys for that one.
Always yakin,
Doug
Walter Lannon wrote:
>
> My 2 cents worth on the tubing question;
>
> While copper was in fairly common use on aircraft in years gone by it
> is not the best choice. As already pointed out it hardens over time
> and becomes critical under vibration.
> The correct material is 5052 aircraft tubing available from any
> aircraft parts supplier.
> The Chinese and Russian tubing is the same material and , in the 6 & 8
> mm dia. has a wall thickness of 1 mm (0.0394")
>
> The 8mm dia. can be directly replaced with 5/16" 5052 using the metric
> nut and sleeve with no modification. Outer dia. is 0.0015" less. The
> standard wall thickness of 0.035" may be adequate but I use (and
> recommend) 0.049" to guarantee equivalent or better strength.
>
> The 6mm dia. can be replaced by 1/4" 5052 and the 0.035" wall
> thickness is adequate in this dia.
> To use the metric fittings the sleeve is replaced by the standard AN
> unit ( I forget the P/N) and the nut is modified by boring out to
> accept the AN sleeve. This is easily done with an appropriate single
> flute step drill, just be sure to make a small chamfer on the inside
> edge to avoid damage to the sleeve.
>
> A standard (Aircraft NOT Automotive) flaring tool is fine giving an
> included angle of 75deg compared to the Russian/Chinese standard of
> 74deg.
>
> Do not use the alum. alloy tubing available in coils. This is 3003
> material and the strength is not adequate. It's aircraft use is (or
> should be) limited to vent and static lines only.
>
> Cheers;
> Walt
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "john Fischer"
> <fish@aviation-tech.com>
> To: <yak-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 1:38 AM
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
> Call Doug!!!
>
>
>>
>> Group,
>>
>> If I remember correctly, I had a damaged air line on my Yak.
>>
>> I cut the tubing past the russian fittings, placed an an fiting on
>> the line
>> and flaired it. Did the same on the other end and used a union to
>> connect them.
>>
>>
>> If I remenber correct, the russian flair is similiar to the US flair
>> and there
>> is a line similiar enough to work. I beleive that I looked a making a
>> new line
>> using the russian fittings and US flair, but it would take longer to
>> make the
>> new line then splicing the old one.
>>
>> Laterrrr
>> John Fischer
>> Yak-52, N213YA
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Yakk'in in Philly |
Thanks for all the great gouge. I'll definitely be looking everyone up once
I get there.
Scott
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Genzlinger, Reade
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 6:53 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly
Hey Doc:
Well - actually - a little of both!!
Gena Elfimov (Skytrace) has come over a number of years and taken a group of
us through the entire DOSAAF program - nothing like it! Past that I'm just
like the rest of us - having way too much fun flying these things.
Reade
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Kemp [mailto:viperdoc@mindspring.com]
> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:35 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly
>
> {SPAM?} Header
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: Genzlinger, Reade <ReadeG@Cairnwood.com>
> We have an active formation group -
> > Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying
> > the 52 the way it was intended....
> > other items.
> >
> > Reade Genzlinger
>
> Reade,
> Would that be with a student in the nose and an IP in the
> trunk? Are yall using them YAKs for DOSAF training up there
> with the NE Raiders?
> Sorry, just being my smart ass self.
> Doc
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