---------------------------------------------------------- Yak-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 02/12/07: 23 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:24 AM - Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (Hans Oortman) 2. 12:31 AM - Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (Rob Kent - WLAC Russian Engineering) 3. 12:39 AM - Yak 50 DC (Mark Jefferies YAK UK) 4. 04:19 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Phil Cogan) 5. 04:52 AM - Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (A. Dennis Savarese) 6. 06:15 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Genzlinger, Reade) 7. 06:32 AM - Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (flir47) 8. 06:35 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Roger Kemp) 9. 06:45 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (A. Dennis Savarese) 10. 06:53 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (ggg6@att.net) 11. 06:54 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Genzlinger, Reade) 12. 07:35 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Roger Kemp) 13. 07:39 AM - Re: Yak 50 DC (Yak Pilot) 14. 07:55 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (seancrotty@aol.com) 15. 08:00 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? (Don Milbourn) 16. 08:51 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (Doug Sapp) 17. 09:10 AM - Fly In at MRT on 5-12-07 (Craig Schneider) 18. 09:39 AM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (john Fischer) 19. 11:37 AM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (Roger Kemp) 20. 08:40 PM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (Walter Lannon) 21. 08:53 PM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (KingCJ6@aol.com) 22. 10:50 PM - Re: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! (Doug Sapp) 23. 11:26 PM - Re: Yakk'in in Philly (shinden33) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:24:54 AM PST US From: "Hans Oortman" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Phil, It is not even "normal" aluminium either but so called "dural aluminium" which probably is even more difficult to find. The latter is much harder and tougher than the normal aluminium. In Holland the normal aluminium is rather easy to get the dural type just a bit more difficult. Dennis, is copper not a bit too soft?? Hans _____ Van: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] Namens PSalter@aol.com Verzonden: maandag 12 februari 2007 0:32 Aan: yak-list@matronics.com Onderwerp: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? I spent hours Friday searching for metric aluminum tubing to replace damaged tubing connecting the main air valve, terminating at the aft bulkhead next to the rear seat. I bought a roll of 1/4" copper tube and decided to resize and use the metric fittings from my old air line. I tried a few different methods of shrinking the tube with poor results. I decided to tie one end of the copper to my trailer hitch and the other to a come-a-long attached to another vehicle. I stretched the tube and checked the diameter with a micrometer until I had the desired diameter. My shade tree engineering worked better than I hoped for. I replaced the damaged tubing with the newly sized copper used the original fittings and went flying. I was told 1/4" tubing (un-stretched) is good for 4000 psi. I am guessing if I lose half the strength in the stretching process, I still have a safety factor of around 2. Are there any reasons why I shouldn't use copper? Phil N700HS CJ6A ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:31:20 AM PST US From: "Rob Kent - WLAC Russian Engineering" Subject: Re: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? We looked into the aluminium tubing. We found that we could obtain the correct material, with all the required properties and strengths, in drawn lengths of 1.5m for approx $2.5 per length. The downside was that a minimum order would have been 4000 lengths, when we only use a max of a dozen per year we decided to stick with the metric copper tubing which is much easier to obtain in small quantities. Regards Rob Kent Stores Manager WLAC - Russian Engineering www.wlacrussianeng.co.uk Tel: +44 1628 829 165 Fax: +44 1628 825 975 Mob: +44 7842 964 358 ----- Original Message ----- From: PSalter@aol.com To: yak-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 11:32 PM Subject: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? I spent hours Friday searching for metric aluminum tubing to replace damaged tubing connecting the main air valve, terminating at the aft bulkhead next to the rear seat. I bought a roll of 1/4" copper tube and decided to resize and use the metric fittings from my old air line. I tried a few different methods of shrinking the tube with poor results. I decided to tie one end of the copper to my trailer hitch and the other to a come-a-long attached to another vehicle. I stretched the tube and checked the diameter with a micrometer until I had the desired diameter. My shade tree engineering worked better than I hoped for. I replaced the damaged tubing with the newly sized copper used the original fittings and went flying. I was told 1/4" tubing (un-stretched) is good for 4000 psi. I am guessing if I lose half the strength in the stretching process, I still have a safety factor of around 2. Are there any reasons why I shouldn't use copper? Phil N700HS CJ6A ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:39:08 AM PST US From: "Mark Jefferies YAK UK" Subject: Yak-List: Yak 50 DC Mark, on the 50 you will find that the main fuse which is mounted in the centre of the grey box can fail through vibration. The wire breaks of at the caps internally. Just for a test, solder a wire along the outside of it. This is a pain failure as it can be intermittent in our experience. Various manuals http://www.yakuk.com/manuals.asp are here. The tech description has the drawings for the 50. Mark Jefferies for YAK UK Ltd ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:19:25 AM PST US From: "Phil Cogan" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Welcome aboard Scott! We have many Yaks and CJs in the Phila, NJ area. Where will you base your plane? Contact me and we'll be glad to help out. Phil Cogan N21740@earthlink.net -----Original Message----- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of shinden33 Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 9:50 PM Subject: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Hi all, I will be moving my '52 from So Cal to Philadelphia this summer. My wife goT accepted to Vet school at the University of Penn! Does anyone have recommendations on Yakk'in in the Philly area? I'd like to get my name on a list for a hangar and get an idea of who the local mechanics are and where they can be found. General area advice such as where to live or tips for Vet School students (if anyone on list may have that kind of experience as well) would helpful as well. Thanks in advance! Scott Glaser 8252 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:52:56 AM PST US From: "A. Dennis Savarese" Subject: Re: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Hans, The copper tubing that I have purchased was not too soft as far as I could tell. I guess my question is, too soft for what? It certainly doesn't bend any easier than the normal aluminum tubing. The reason I had to use copper was the unavailability of aluminum metric tubing. Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: Hans Oortman To: yak-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 2:23 AM Subject: RE: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Phil, It is not even "normal" aluminium either but so called "dural aluminium" which probably is even more difficult to find. The latter is much harder and tougher than the normal aluminium. In Holland the normal aluminium is rather easy to get the dural type just a bit more difficult. Dennis, is copper not a bit too soft?? Hans ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Van: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] Namens PSalter@aol.com Verzonden: maandag 12 februari 2007 0:32 Aan: yak-list@matronics.com Onderwerp: Yak-List: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? I spent hours Friday searching for metric aluminum tubing to replace damaged tubing connecting the main air valve, terminating at the aft bulkhead next to the rear seat. I bought a roll of 1/4" copper tube and decided to resize and use the metric fittings from my old air line. I tried a few different methods of shrinking the tube with poor results. I decided to tie one end of the copper to my trailer hitch and the other to a come-a-long attached to another vehicle. I stretched the tube and checked the diameter with a micrometer until I had the desired diameter. My shade tree engineering worked better than I hoped for. I replaced the damaged tubing with the newly sized copper used the original fittings and went flying. I was told 1/4" tubing (un-stretched) is good for 4000 psi. I am guessing if I lose half the strength in the stretching process, I still have a safety factor of around 2. Are there any reasons why I shouldn't use copper? Phil N700HS CJ6A ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:15:17 AM PST US From: "Genzlinger, Reade" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Hey Scott: Welcome to Philly! I hangar at DYL - Doylestown, PA about 30 miles north of center city. I'm the only Yak there but over at N14 (Flying W) in Medford, NJ there are several 52's and a couple of those Chinese things. There are other Yaks and CJs in the area. We have an active formation group - Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying the 52 the way it was intended.... Call me at your convenience to discuss the other items. Reade Genzlinger 215.914.0370 > -----Original Message----- > From: shinden33 [mailto:shinden33@earthlink.net] > Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 9:50 PM > To: yak-list@matronics.com > Subject: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly > > {SPAM?} Header > > Hi all, > > I will be moving my '52 from So Cal to Philadelphia this > summer. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:32:31 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? From: "flir47" Gents, Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will fatigue over time. Then failure is inevitable. Copper should never be used in or near an environment that induces any kind of vibration. Hans is correct with the term dural aluminium. Using copper just to save money is a dangerous idea! -------- You built and fly an RV.......BIG DEAL!!!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=94449#94449 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:35:50 AM PST US From: "Roger Kemp" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly > [Original Message] > From: Genzlinger, Reade We have an active formation group - > Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying the 52 > the way it was intended.... > other items. > > Reade Genzlinger Reade, Would that be with a student in the nose and an IP in the trunk? Are yall using them YAKs for DOSAF training up there with the NE Raiders? Sorry, just being my smart ass self. Doc ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:45:42 AM PST US From: "A. Dennis Savarese" Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm aluminum tubing. I personally would appreciate it very much. Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: "flir47" Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? > > Gents, > > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will fatigue over > time. Then failure is inevitable. Copper should never be used in or near > an environment that induces any kind of vibration. Hans is correct with > the term ?odural aluminium?. Using copper just to save money is a > dangerous idea! > > -------- > You built and fly an RV.......BIG DEAL!!!! > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=94449#94449 > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:53:45 AM PST US From: ggg6@att.net Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Gentlemen, does anyone have a connection in China for the Alumimun Tubing,, they gladly export most everything? Gary Gabbard CJ N22YK -------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese" : -------------- > > Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm aluminum tubing. > I personally would appreciate it very much. > Dennis > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "flir47" > To: > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? > > > > > > Gents, > > > > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will fatigue over > > time. Then failure is inevitable. Copper should never be used in or near > > an environment that induces any kind of vibration. Hans is correct with > > the term ?odural aluminium?. Using copper just to save money is a > > dangerous idea! > > > > -------- > > You built and fly an RV.......BIG DEAL!!!! > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=94449#94449 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Gentlemen,  does anyone have a connection in China for the Alumimun Tubing,, they gladly export most everything?  

 

Gary Gabbard       CJ  N22YK

-------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese@elmore.rr.com>: --------------


> --> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese"
>
> Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm aluminum tubing.
> I personally would appreciate it very much.
> Dennis
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "flir47"
> To:
> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM
> Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line???
>
>
> > --> Yak-List message posted by: "flir47"
> >
> > Gents,
> >
> > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will fatigue over
> > time. Then failure is inevi table. hat, F
________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:54:27 AM PST US From: "Genzlinger, Reade" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Hey Doc: Well - actually - a little of both!! Gena Elfimov (Skytrace) has come over a number of years and taken a group of us through the entire DOSAAF program - nothing like it! Past that I'm just like the rest of us - having way too much fun flying these things. Reade > -----Original Message----- > From: Roger Kemp [mailto:viperdoc@mindspring.com] > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:35 AM > To: yak-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly > > {SPAM?} Header > > > > [Original Message] > > From: Genzlinger, Reade > We have an active formation group - > > Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying > > the 52 the way it was intended.... > > other items. > > > > Reade Genzlinger > > Reade, > Would that be with a student in the nose and an IP in the > trunk? Are yall using them YAKs for DOSAF training up there > with the NE Raiders? > Sorry, just being my smart ass self. > Doc ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:35:17 AM PST US From: "Roger Kemp" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Now that would be fun! Same here, just having a group of fun flying these birds! Still nothing in the US invetory can touch them for the money! Even if we do have to work on them more than those flat head Lycomings! Doc > [Original Message] > From: Genzlinger, Reade > To: > Date: 2/12/2007 9:05:56 AM > Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly > > > Hey Doc: > > Well - actually - a little of both!! > > Gena Elfimov (Skytrace) has come over a number of years and taken a group of > us through the entire DOSAAF program - nothing like it! Past that I'm just > like the rest of us - having way too much fun flying these things. > > Reade > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Roger Kemp [mailto:viperdoc@mindspring.com] > > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:35 AM > > To: yak-list@matronics.com > > Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly > > > > {SPAM?} Header > > > > > > > [Original Message] > > > From: Genzlinger, Reade > > We have an active formation group - > > > Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying > > > the 52 the way it was intended.... > > > other items. > > > > > > Reade Genzlinger > > > > Reade, > > Would that be with a student in the nose and an IP in the > > trunk? Are yall using them YAKs for DOSAF training up there > > with the NE Raiders? > > Sorry, just being my smart ass self. > > Doc > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:39:33 AM PST US From: Yak Pilot Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 50 DC Hi Mark. Great advice, thank you for taking the time to write. I had what you have described happen already and it did exactly as you said! I went right to those fuses first this time with no luck. It appears the main contactor relay is not closing, although I havfe no idea why yet. First, I can hardly fit into that hole to get into the aircraft to work on it. Second, working on it with the engine running is rather unnerving to say the least. I am going to try something different. I have a variable power supply that I can crank up to 28 volts. I plan on disconnecting the generator and hooking up that power supply to emulate it. I will probably put a light bulb on the generator field wire to act as a load for the carbon pile regulator. Using that, I THINK I may be able to troubleshoot the circuits real time just as if the engine were running. I have never tried anything like this before, but I can not think why it would not work in theory. The electrics on these aircraft are really not a whole lot of fun to work on. I am eye-balling that B&C SK-35 alternator replacement with a keen eye right about now, but wow... very expensive. Anyway, thanks one and all for all the help, and I will give a report of success or failure! Mark Bitterlich N50YK Mark Jefferies YAK UK wrote: Mark, on the 50 you will find that the main fuse which is mounted in the centre of the grey box can fail through vibration. The wire breaks of at the caps internally. Just for a test, solder a wire along the outside of it. This is a pain failure as it can be intermittent in our experience. Various manuals http://www.yakuk.com/manuals.asp are here. The tech description has the drawings for the 50. Mark Jefferies for YAK UK Ltd ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:55:08 AM PST US From: seancrotty@aol.com Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Hey Reade, My name is Sean Crotty and I was an instructor pilot in the USAF - T-37's and have flown the CJ-6 in the past but haven't got a chance to fly the 52 yet - I am working for an airline now and get to Philly all the time actually typing this on a long layover this trip from the Hilton out by the airport. Would love to stay in touch and see if there might be a seat free sometime in the future - formation would be icing on the cake - I taught formation flying as well as aerobatics for over four years before moving to the heavies - so would be fun to share some flying with you guys if you get a chance email me back. Sean ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 08:00:05 AM PST US From: "Don Milbourn" Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? I have a frend in china ,he also owns a yak. I will check with him. Don Milbourn ----- Original Message ----- From: ggg6@att.net To: yak-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 7:52 AM Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Gentlemen, does anyone have a connection in China for the Alumimun Tubing,, they gladly export most everything? Gary Gabbard CJ N22YK -------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese" : -------------- > > Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm aluminum tubing. > I personally would appreciate it very much. > Dennis > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "flir47" > To: > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? > > > > > > Gents, > > > > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and will fatigue over > > time. Then failure is inevi table. hat, F ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 08:51:40 AM PST US From: Doug Sapp Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! Guys I have two never flown aircraft which were damaged in a trucking accident, I can easily strip some tubing out of them, how much do you need. Or on the other hand you could try to export it out of china if you want to wait 90 days. Always Yakin, Doug Don Milbourn wrote: > I have a frend in china ,he also owns a yak. I will check with him. > > Don Milbourn > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* ggg6@att.net > *To:* yak-list@matronics.com > *Sent:* Monday, February 12, 2007 7:52 AM > *Subject:* Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? > > Gentlemen, does anyone have a connection in China for the > Alumimun Tubing,, they gladly export most everything? > > > > Gary Gabbard CJ N22YK > > -------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese" > >: > -------------- > > > > > > Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm > aluminum tubing. > > I personally would appreciate it very much. > > Dennis > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "flir47" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM > > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air > Line??? > > > > > > > > > > Gents, > > > > > > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and > will fatigue over > > > time. Then failure is inevi table. hat, F > >* > >href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > >* > >* > > >* > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 09:10:07 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Fly In at MRT on 5-12-07 From: "Craig Schneider" FYI: Warbird Fly In 5-12-07 MRT (Union County Airport, Marysville, Ohio) FAA Wings Seminars Pancake Breakfest EAA Chapter 9 will be hosting is first Informal Warbird Fly In on May 12th, 2007 at the Union County Airport (MRT) in Marysville Ohio. Pancake breakfest starts at 9am followed by FAA Wings presentions by Dr. Bob Lewis on "Hypoxia" and Jerry Eichenberger on "Sport Plane Partnerships". All Warbirds (WWI, WWII,other foriegn/domestic wars and conflicts) are invited to fly In. Plenty of ramp space, Fuel Discounts and a great group of local pilots and friends. Fly Bys and formation groups please coordinate wth me prior to the Fly In. If there's an FAST IP who can do a class onsite, classroom space will be available. Contact me at craig@ustek.com for more info and to let me know you're coming. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 09:39:36 AM PST US From: "john Fischer" Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! Group, If I remember correctly, I had a damaged air line on my Yak. I cut the tubing past the russian fittings, placed an an fiting on the line and flaired it. Did the same on the other end and used a union to connect them. If I remenber correct, the russian flair is similiar to the US flair and there is a line similiar enough to work. I beleive that I looked a making a new line using the russian fittings and US flair, but it would take longer to make the new line then splicing the old one. Laterrrr John Fischer Yak-52, N213YA > >Guys I have two never flown aircraft which were damaged in a trucking >accident, I can easily strip some tubing out of them, how much do you >need. Or on the other hand you could try to export it out of china if >you want to wait 90 days. > >Always Yakin, >Doug > >Don Milbourn wrote: > >> I have a frend in china ,he also owns a yak. I will check with him. >> >> Don Milbourn >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> *From:* ggg6@att.net >> *To:* yak-list@matronics.com >> *Sent:* Monday, February 12, 2007 7:52 AM >> *Subject:* Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? >> >> Gentlemen, does anyone have a connection in China for the >> Alumimun Tubing,, they gladly export most everything? >> >> >> >> Gary Gabbard CJ N22YK >> >> -------------- Original message from "A. Dennis Savarese" >> >: >> -------------- >> >> >> > >> > Please help us locate a source for acceptable 6 mm and 8 mm >> aluminum tubing. >> > I personally would appreciate it very much. >> > Dennis >> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "flir47" >> > To: >> > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:32 AM >> > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air >> Line??? >> > >> > >> > > >> > > Gents, >> > > >> > > Soft is good. Copper will work harden from vibration and >> will fatigue over >> > > time. Then failure is inevi table. hat, F >> >>* >> >>href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >>href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com >> >>* >> >>* >> >> >>* >> > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 11:37:12 AM PST US From: "Roger Kemp" Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Sean, If you are a member of the RPA, there is a membership roster page. You can find guys near you that are flying and maybe get in some pit time with someone in your local area. Don't know where home is for you. We are down the MGM area. Doc ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: 2/12/2007 10:08:59 AM Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Hey Reade, My name is Sean Crotty and I was an instructor pilot in the USAF - T-37's and have flown the CJ-6 in the past but haven't got a chance to fly the 52 yet - I am working for an airline now and get to Philly all the time actually typing this on a long layover this trip from the Hilton out by the airport. Would love to stay in touch and see if there might be a seat free sometime in the future - formation would be icing on the cake - I taught formation flying as well as aerobatics for over four years before moving to the heavies - so would be fun to share some flying with you guys if you get a chance email me back. Sean ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 08:40:12 PM PST US From: "Walter Lannon" Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! My 2 cents worth on the tubing question; While copper was in fairly common use on aircraft in years gone by it is not the best choice. As already pointed out it hardens over time and becomes critical under vibration. The correct material is 5052 aircraft tubing available from any aircraft parts supplier. The Chinese and Russian tubing is the same material and , in the 6 & 8 mm dia. has a wall thickness of 1 mm (0.0394") The 8mm dia. can be directly replaced with 5/16" 5052 using the metric nut and sleeve with no modification. Outer dia. is 0.0015" less. The standard wall thickness of 0.035" may be adequate but I use (and recommend) 0.049" to guarantee equivalent or better strength. The 6mm dia. can be replaced by 1/4" 5052 and the 0.035" wall thickness is adequate in this dia. To use the metric fittings the sleeve is replaced by the standard AN unit ( I forget the P/N) and the nut is modified by boring out to accept the AN sleeve. This is easily done with an appropriate single flute step drill, just be sure to make a small chamfer on the inside edge to avoid damage to the sleeve. A standard (Aircraft NOT Automotive) flaring tool is fine giving an included angle of 75deg compared to the Russian/Chinese standard of 74deg. Do not use the alum. alloy tubing available in coils. This is 3003 material and the strength is not adequate. It's aircraft use is (or should be) limited to vent and static lines only. Cheers; Walt ----- Original Message ----- From: "john Fischer" Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 1:38 AM Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! > > Group, > > If I remember correctly, I had a damaged air line on my Yak. > > I cut the tubing past the russian fittings, placed an an fiting on the > line > and flaired it. Did the same on the other end and used a union to connect > them. > > > If I remenber correct, the russian flair is similiar to the US flair and > there > is a line similiar enough to work. I beleive that I looked a making a new > line > using the russian fittings and US flair, but it would take longer to make > the > new line then splicing the old one. > > Laterrrr > John Fischer > Yak-52, N213YA ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 08:53:35 PM PST US From: KingCJ6@aol.com Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! Walt - thanks for this, and other Yak List posters continued informative and unique insights into our world of a/c maintenance & safety. Priceless and much appreciated information. Dave In a message dated 2/12/2007 8:41:55 PM Pacific Standard Time, wlannon@cablerocket.com writes: --> Yak-List message posted by: "Walter Lannon" My 2 cents worth on the tubing question; While copper was in fairly common use on aircraft in years gone by it is not the best choice. As already pointed out it hardens over time and becomes critical under vibration. The correct material is 5052 aircraft tubing available from any aircraft parts supplier. The Chinese and Russian tubing is the same material and , in the 6 & 8 mm dia. has a wall thickness of 1 mm (0.0394") The 8mm dia. can be directly replaced with 5/16" 5052 using the metric nut and sleeve with no modification. Outer dia. is 0.0015" less. The standard wall thickness of 0.035" may be adequate but I use (and recommend) 0.049" to guarantee equivalent or better strength. The 6mm dia. can be replaced by 1/4" 5052 and the 0.035" wall thickness is adequate in this dia. To use the metric fittings the sleeve is replaced by the standard AN unit ( I forget the P/N) and the nut is modified by boring out to accept the AN sleeve. This is easily done with an appropriate single flute step drill, just be sure to make a small chamfer on the inside edge to avoid damage to the sleeve. A standard (Aircraft NOT Automotive) flaring tool is fine giving an included angle of 75deg compared to the Russian/Chinese standard of 74deg. Do not use the alum. alloy tubing available in coils. This is 3003 material and the strength is not adequate. It's aircraft use is (or should be) limited to vent and static lines only. Cheers; Walt ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 10:50:11 PM PST US From: Doug Sapp Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? Call Doug!!! Outstanding post Walter! You get two attaboys for that one. Always yakin, Doug Walter Lannon wrote: > > My 2 cents worth on the tubing question; > > While copper was in fairly common use on aircraft in years gone by it > is not the best choice. As already pointed out it hardens over time > and becomes critical under vibration. > The correct material is 5052 aircraft tubing available from any > aircraft parts supplier. > The Chinese and Russian tubing is the same material and , in the 6 & 8 > mm dia. has a wall thickness of 1 mm (0.0394") > > The 8mm dia. can be directly replaced with 5/16" 5052 using the metric > nut and sleeve with no modification. Outer dia. is 0.0015" less. The > standard wall thickness of 0.035" may be adequate but I use (and > recommend) 0.049" to guarantee equivalent or better strength. > > The 6mm dia. can be replaced by 1/4" 5052 and the 0.035" wall > thickness is adequate in this dia. > To use the metric fittings the sleeve is replaced by the standard AN > unit ( I forget the P/N) and the nut is modified by boring out to > accept the AN sleeve. This is easily done with an appropriate single > flute step drill, just be sure to make a small chamfer on the inside > edge to avoid damage to the sleeve. > > A standard (Aircraft NOT Automotive) flaring tool is fine giving an > included angle of 75deg compared to the Russian/Chinese standard of > 74deg. > > Do not use the alum. alloy tubing available in coils. This is 3003 > material and the strength is not adequate. It's aircraft use is (or > should be) limited to vent and static lines only. > > Cheers; > Walt > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "john Fischer" > > To: > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 1:38 AM > Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Copper Tubing For Replacement Air Line??? > Call Doug!!! > > >> >> Group, >> >> If I remember correctly, I had a damaged air line on my Yak. >> >> I cut the tubing past the russian fittings, placed an an fiting on >> the line >> and flaired it. Did the same on the other end and used a union to >> connect them. >> >> >> If I remenber correct, the russian flair is similiar to the US flair >> and there >> is a line similiar enough to work. I beleive that I looked a making a >> new line >> using the russian fittings and US flair, but it would take longer to >> make the >> new line then splicing the old one. >> >> Laterrrr >> John Fischer >> Yak-52, N213YA > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 11:26:29 PM PST US From: "shinden33" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Thanks for all the great gouge. I'll definitely be looking everyone up once I get there. Scott -----Original Message----- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Genzlinger, Reade Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 6:53 AM Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly Hey Doc: Well - actually - a little of both!! Gena Elfimov (Skytrace) has come over a number of years and taken a group of us through the entire DOSAAF program - nothing like it! Past that I'm just like the rest of us - having way too much fun flying these things. Reade > -----Original Message----- > From: Roger Kemp [mailto:viperdoc@mindspring.com] > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:35 AM > To: yak-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yakk'in in Philly > > {SPAM?} Header > > > > [Original Message] > > From: Genzlinger, Reade > We have an active formation group - > > Northeast Raiders - and some of us like to add to the fun by flying > > the 52 the way it was intended.... > > other items. > > > > Reade Genzlinger > > Reade, > Would that be with a student in the nose and an IP in the > trunk? Are yall using them YAKs for DOSAF training up there > with the NE Raiders? > Sorry, just being my smart ass self. > Doc ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message yak-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Yak-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/yak-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/yak-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.