Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:21 AM - Update on the Baklan-5 Radio (Elmar)
2. 11:04 AM - Re: Update on the Baklan-5 Radio (ROBERT SCHWARTZ)
3. 11:17 AM - Re: Update on the Baklan-5 Radio (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
4. 11:18 AM - Re: Yak 55 Flight Test Report (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
5. 11:59 AM - Left Horiz. (Roger Baker)
6. 12:17 PM - Re: Left Horiz. (A. Dennis Savarese)
7. 12:30 PM - Re: Left Horiz. (ben)
8. 12:38 PM - Re: Left Horiz. (Scooter)
9. 12:54 PM - Re: Re: Left Horiz. (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
10. 02:40 PM - More left horiZ (Roger Baker)
11. 03:01 PM - Re: More left horiZ (Jorgen Nielsen)
12. 04:35 PM - Re: More left horiZ (Roger Kemp M.D.)
13. 06:01 PM - Re: Rockford (Jill Gernetzke)
14. 06:18 PM - Re: More left horiZ (Roger Baker)
15. 09:12 PM - Checklist (Roger Kemp M.D.)
16. 10:28 PM - Re: Checklist (Roger Baker)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Update on the Baklan-5 Radio |
Guys,
yesterday we spent the whole day (12 hours)
on troubleshooting my friend's Yak 52 radio.
After checking all the wiring, plugs and connectors,
even the ones in the tail where the radio is (and
I am 6 foot 4 inches) we found a blown 10 amp
fuse on the radio tray. Replaced it, and voila'
the radio came back to life.
Thanks again to Mark and Dennis, who guided
us in the right direction.
cheers
Elmar (C-FTKL)
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Update on the Baklan-5 Radio |
To maintain the originality of my YAK, I am looking to find the original
radio and transceiver components in new or like new condition.
Looking for a direction guys!!!
Robert E. Schwartz
From: "Elmar" <tamara_b@telus.net>
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 12:20 PM
Subject: Yak-List: Update on the Baklan-5 Radio
>
>
> Guys,
>
> yesterday we spent the whole day (12 hours)
> on troubleshooting my friend's Yak 52 radio.
> After checking all the wiring, plugs and connectors,
> even the ones in the tail where the radio is (and
> I am 6 foot 4 inches) we found a blown 10 amp
> fuse on the radio tray. Replaced it, and voila'
> the radio came back to life.
>
> Thanks again to Mark and Dennis, who guided
> us in the right direction.
>
> cheers
>
> Elmar (C-FTKL)
> --
> Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Update on the Baklan-5 Radio |
Try George Coy. The normal going rate for a used but functional Balken
5 is between $450 and $550. That's the R/T alone.
Mark Bitterlich
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of ROBERT
SCHWARTZ
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 14:03
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Update on the Baklan-5 Radio
--> <schwartzcompany@worldnet.att.net>
To maintain the originality of my YAK, I am looking to find the original
radio and transceiver components in new or like new condition.
Looking for a direction guys!!!
Robert E. Schwartz
Message 4
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| Subject: | Yak 55 Flight Test Report |
Are you running the PF engine? Just curious.
Mark Bitterlich
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dr Andre Katz
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2007 21:59
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 55 Flight Test Report
i have a 50LS climb rate in the zlin is a bit higher than the yak i
believe but i fly both without bothering to check the climb rate. i get
to 3500 feet my initial acro faster in the zlin probably due to thin
wings. energy management is much easier in the zlin due to the fact that
you do not lose so much altitude in the down maneuvers as in the yak, i
have to start at 4k in the yak and worry a bit about vertical downs
since i am a novice in the sport. i am much more comfortable in the
zlin due to the seating position the zlin seat is a marvel the yak is a
bitch for a tall person;. the zlin is a gentle pussycat the yak is a
tall monster both are really tame when you know them. Landing the zlin
is a piece of cake and the speed is slow, the yak wants 180 k on final
and it has a pump injector that tends to enrich the mixture when you add
power on short final and tends to lag a bit and a couple of unsuspecting
guys have hit hard due to the device. i have not changed the injector
nozzle yet but i am prepared for the choke.
andres
Jorgen Nielsen <jorgen.nielsen@mweb.co.za> wrote:
Andres - which Zlin do you fly? I have been looking at 50LS and
a Yak 55 -
would like an opinion on both? Climb rate, energy management
etc?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dr
Andre Katz
Sent: 09 May 2007 11:49 PM
To: yak-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 55 Flight Test Report
look into mark/s web page in england, there is a
comparison in the webb from a high time pilot that
flew both the 55 and the su 26 his report is very
favorable and credible. I have a zlin and a 55 and for
the buck there is nothing like the 55, you will love
the radial engine and after you get over the quirks of
inverted spin (I recommend Nick timofeyev in florida)
there is nothing like it at the price (unless you have
the bucks for a sukhoi or big extra). The down side is
the funny air start stuff but you get over it. Lots of
power, easy to fly and land, easy to mantain, messy in
the hangar leaks oil all over, but it pays back on fun
time. The main down is if you want to go unlimited,
they say its not competitive there. I dont plan to be
there so I have fun with mine.
andres
--- PSalter@aol.com wrote:
> Anyone willing to give a description of the flying
> qualities good and bad of
> the Yak 55. I have always been interested in the 55
> but have not found a
> report.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Phil
Message 5
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These photos show that bad things can happen to good guys. I hope
that we can get some info posted here on the list as to how this
happened. It has the appearance of what could be a valuable
"Learning Experience" for many of us. Perhaps a "starting with the
air off" incident by the dark colored airplane.
Roger
Message 6
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It does look like the prop blade is fractured and bent backwards on the
green airplane. This can also happen when taxiing in close formation with
the air off.
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Baker" <f4ffm2@adelphia.net>
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 1:55 PM
Subject: Yak-List: Left Horiz.
> These photos show that bad things can happen to good guys. I hope
> that we can get some info posted here on the list as to how this
> happened. It has the appearance of what could be a valuable
> "Learning Experience" for many of us. Perhaps a "starting with the
> air off" incident by the dark colored airplane.
>
> Roger
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
Message 7
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This reminds me of something my friend Art Vance said, "Guess who I ran into
at formation school?" Interestingly, this is the same Art Vance that had a
similar moment during the join-up for a race Sea Fury elevator verse P-51
prop. It doesn't get closer than that friends.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Baker
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 11:56 AM
Subject: Yak-List: Left Horiz.
These photos show that bad things can happen to good guys. I hope
that we can get some info posted here on the list as to how this
happened. It has the appearance of what could be a valuable
"Learning Experience" for many of us. Perhaps a "starting with the
air off" incident by the dark colored airplane.
Roger
Message 8
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There are some photos on airliners.net with the following caption:
"ZU-CWL (cn 822107) The tail munched by the prop of another Yak 52, ZU-WAN during
a Yak formation flying course. This happened at the holding point and no one
was injured."
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=112288#112288
Message 9
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"Holding Point" as in "holding on the ground, correct?"
Mark Bitterlich
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Scooter
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 15:38
Subject: Yak-List: Re: Left Horiz.
There are some photos on airliners.net with the following caption:
"ZU-CWL (cn 822107) The tail munched by the prop of another Yak 52,
ZU-WAN during a Yak formation flying course. This happened at the
holding point and no one was injured."
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=112288#112288
Message 10
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Thank guys for your comments.
However, I was trying to get someone who actually knows what
happened to CAUSE this particular accident....which did happen in
Durban, South Africa on April 22nd. It did happen in the run up area
while involved in some kind of formation activity.
I thought it would be educational if one of the folks from South
Africa with FACTUAL FIRST HAND knowledge were to post a debriefing
here on the list. Several days ago, I did ask, on the list, if
anyone from SA could update us on the list about this
collision...but, so far, no response. This lists main value is its'
ability to disseminate real world operational information. And this
might be a prime example of that ability.
We all know that a Yak 52 can be started and, depending on the
individual airplanes' air system, taxiied for some distance before it
becomes obvious that one can neither steer nor stop...because the
main air valve is not on.
I can tell you from personal experience that this is a bit of a
queezy feeling. Fortunately, the only thing in front of me was a
fence which was far enough away that I had time to get the air on and
turn before "spending a lot of money real fast" or worse. Some of
our fellow "listers" have not been so lucky.
So, from the photos....it appears obvious that the dark colored
airplane's prop did hit the silver airplanes' left horizontal
stabilizer and elevator. It appears that only one prop blade may be
damaged on the dark airplane...leading me to speculate that perhaps
the pilot of the dark airplane might have switched off his mags after
discovering that he couldn't stop or steer...but, just a bit too late
to avoid the silver airplane.
The above paragraph is just speculation, of course. But it is
speculation based on an incident that occurred only a year or so ago
involving our local area formation group...also in the run-up area.
That incident did not involve any damage, fortunately....but only
because when the "air off" airplane discovered he couldn't stop or
steer, he was pointed just enough to the side that he just sort of
"drifted" past me (and the rest of the formation) with his prop
stopped and a helpless look on his face. Fortunately, as he left the
paved area...he rolled onto quite level ground and coasted to a
stop....turned the air on, restarted the engine, and rejoined the
formation a bit the wiser (as were all of us who witnessed to event).
Enough of my what ifs. South Aftican Yak folks....what happened to
cause this incident?
Thanks,
Roger
Message 11
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I will find out and post.
Jorgen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Baker
Sent: 11 May 2007 11:37 PM
Subject: Yak-List: More left horiZ
Thank guys for your comments.
However, I was trying to get someone who actually knows what
happened to CAUSE this particular accident....which did happen in
Durban, South Africa on April 22nd. It did happen in the run up area
while involved in some kind of formation activity.
I thought it would be educational if one of the folks from South
Africa with FACTUAL FIRST HAND knowledge were to post a debriefing
here on the list. Several days ago, I did ask, on the list, if
anyone from SA could update us on the list about this
collision...but, so far, no response. This lists main value is its'
ability to disseminate real world operational information. And this
might be a prime example of that ability.
We all know that a Yak 52 can be started and, depending on the
individual airplanes' air system, taxiied for some distance before it
becomes obvious that one can neither steer nor stop...because the
main air valve is not on.
I can tell you from personal experience that this is a bit of a
queezy feeling. Fortunately, the only thing in front of me was a
fence which was far enough away that I had time to get the air on and
turn before "spending a lot of money real fast" or worse. Some of
our fellow "listers" have not been so lucky.
So, from the photos....it appears obvious that the dark colored
airplane's prop did hit the silver airplanes' left horizontal
stabilizer and elevator. It appears that only one prop blade may be
damaged on the dark airplane...leading me to speculate that perhaps
the pilot of the dark airplane might have switched off his mags after
discovering that he couldn't stop or steer...but, just a bit too late
to avoid the silver airplane.
The above paragraph is just speculation, of course. But it is
speculation based on an incident that occurred only a year or so ago
involving our local area formation group...also in the run-up area.
That incident did not involve any damage, fortunately....but only
because when the "air off" airplane discovered he couldn't stop or
steer, he was pointed just enough to the side that he just sort of
"drifted" past me (and the rest of the formation) with his prop
stopped and a helpless look on his face. Fortunately, as he left the
paved area...he rolled onto quite level ground and coasted to a
stop....turned the air on, restarted the engine, and rejoined the
formation a bit the wiser (as were all of us who witnessed to event).
Enough of my what ifs. South Aftican Yak folks....what happened to
cause this incident?
Thanks,
Roger
Message 12
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Are we forgetting the last entry in the EP section of the Russian Checklist?
Loss of braking
Mags off.
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Baker
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 4:37 PM
Subject: Yak-List: More left horiZ
Thank guys for your comments.
However, I was trying to get someone who actually knows what
happened to CAUSE this particular accident....which did happen in
Durban, South Africa on April 22nd. It did happen in the run up area
while involved in some kind of formation activity.
I thought it would be educational if one of the folks from South
Africa with FACTUAL FIRST HAND knowledge were to post a debriefing
here on the list. Several days ago, I did ask, on the list, if
anyone from SA could update us on the list about this
collision...but, so far, no response. This lists main value is its'
ability to disseminate real world operational information. And this
might be a prime example of that ability.
We all know that a Yak 52 can be started and, depending on the
individual airplanes' air system, taxiied for some distance before it
becomes obvious that one can neither steer nor stop...because the
main air valve is not on.
I can tell you from personal experience that this is a bit of a
queezy feeling. Fortunately, the only thing in front of me was a
fence which was far enough away that I had time to get the air on and
turn before "spending a lot of money real fast" or worse. Some of
our fellow "listers" have not been so lucky.
So, from the photos....it appears obvious that the dark colored
airplane's prop did hit the silver airplanes' left horizontal
stabilizer and elevator. It appears that only one prop blade may be
damaged on the dark airplane...leading me to speculate that perhaps
the pilot of the dark airplane might have switched off his mags after
discovering that he couldn't stop or steer...but, just a bit too late
to avoid the silver airplane.
The above paragraph is just speculation, of course. But it is
speculation based on an incident that occurred only a year or so ago
involving our local area formation group...also in the run-up area.
That incident did not involve any damage, fortunately....but only
because when the "air off" airplane discovered he couldn't stop or
steer, he was pointed just enough to the side that he just sort of
"drifted" past me (and the rest of the formation) with his prop
stopped and a helpless look on his face. Fortunately, as he left the
paved area...he rolled onto quite level ground and coasted to a
stop....turned the air on, restarted the engine, and rejoined the
formation a bit the wiser (as were all of us who witnessed to event).
Enough of my what ifs. South Aftican Yak folks....what happened to
cause this incident?
Thanks,
Roger
Message 13
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Group,
There seems to be a call from people to video the seminar. I will see
what resources are available and if we can pull it off.
We have talked about hosting a Yak Fly-in with the focus being on
maintenance and a fly-out or two. Kingman (IGM) is a great airport to
do this as we are an old B-17 base. There are plenty of non-flying
activities to do:
Grand Canyon, Laughlin/Bullhead, Hoover Dam, Las Vegas, Oatman; which
is an old gold mining town and Route 66. Planning will be 1 -2 years
in advance. There are some customers that I have talked to for 12
...13 years and have never met.
It would be a treat to put a voice with a face.
Jill Gernetzke
M-14P, Incorporated
4905 Flightline Drive
Kingman, AZ 86401 -7417
(928)-681-4400
Fax(928)681-4404
www.m-14p.com
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: More left horiZ |
No "Ace", "we're" not forgetting anything. I thought you Wind Force,
no that's Air Force...sorry.....guys had more latitude than to
blindly follow some checklist...I guess not. In my flying career,
doc, which includes quite a few airplanes, quite a few hours, quite a
few years....I always operated with the philosophy of... if something
goes wrong with my flying machine...and I can fix it immediately
without endangering anybody outside or any property outside, or
endangering myself or anybody inside my airplane, or doing any damage
to my airplane...that I would do that, thereby avoiding having an
emergency and thus not having to run any flippin' Emergency Checklist.
Anybody that wants to certainly can feel free to sit back in their
cozy office and offer whatever criticism that they want....but it's
largely irrelevant.
Roger "Only Posts when it's important or interesting"
Baker_______________________________________________________________
On May 11, 2007, at 4:32 PM, Roger Kemp M.D. wrote:
> <viperdoc@mindspring.com>
>
> Are we forgetting the last entry in the EP section of the Russian
> Checklist?
> Loss of braking
> Mags off.
> Doc
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Baker
> Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 4:37 PM
> To: Yak List
> Subject: Yak-List: More left horiZ
>
>
> Thank guys for your comments.
>
> However, I was trying to get someone who actually knows what
> happened to CAUSE this particular accident....which did happen in
> Durban, South Africa on April 22nd. It did happen in the run up area
> while involved in some kind of formation activity.
>
> I thought it would be educational if one of the folks from South
> Africa with FACTUAL FIRST HAND knowledge were to post a debriefing
> here on the list. Several days ago, I did ask, on the list, if
> anyone from SA could update us on the list about this
> collision...but, so far, no response. This lists main value is its'
> ability to disseminate real world operational information. And this
> might be a prime example of that ability.
>
> We all know that a Yak 52 can be started and, depending on the
> individual airplanes' air system, taxiied for some distance before it
> becomes obvious that one can neither steer nor stop...because the
> main air valve is not on.
>
> I can tell you from personal experience that this is a bit of a
> queezy feeling. Fortunately, the only thing in front of me was a
> fence which was far enough away that I had time to get the air on and
> turn before "spending a lot of money real fast" or worse. Some of
> our fellow "listers" have not been so lucky.
>
> So, from the photos....it appears obvious that the dark colored
> airplane's prop did hit the silver airplanes' left horizontal
> stabilizer and elevator. It appears that only one prop blade may be
> damaged on the dark airplane...leading me to speculate that perhaps
> the pilot of the dark airplane might have switched off his mags after
> discovering that he couldn't stop or steer...but, just a bit too late
> to avoid the silver airplane.
>
> The above paragraph is just speculation, of course. But it is
> speculation based on an incident that occurred only a year or so ago
> involving our local area formation group...also in the run-up area.
> That incident did not involve any damage, fortunately....but only
> because when the "air off" airplane discovered he couldn't stop or
> steer, he was pointed just enough to the side that he just sort of
> "drifted" past me (and the rest of the formation) with his prop
> stopped and a helpless look on his face. Fortunately, as he left the
> paved area...he rolled onto quite level ground and coasted to a
> stop....turned the air on, restarted the engine, and rejoined the
> formation a bit the wiser (as were all of us who witnessed to event).
>
> Enough of my what ifs. South Aftican Yak folks....what happened to
> cause this incident?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Roger
>
>
Message 15
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Ok, Roger, I'll take the bait. You are saying you have not commited a
checklist or an EP checklist for that matter to memory or learned the DASH
1 for all the aircraft you fly or have flown in your career?
My intial comment was not made from a comfortable office either. As for
second guessing, I believe someone else brought up taxiing with the air
turned off. But what the heck did the Ru IP's have the little button on the
top of the stick for in the trunk? Could it have been to train the student
to turn off the mags and try to steer straiaght ahead before they did
something like taxi into another aircraft or worse? Another thing that has
not been said about this incident is brake fade after heating up the brakes
from taxiing a long distance or heavy usage on roll out. Of course it
could have resulted from a broken cable, air hose, air leak with min air, or
a brain fart. We do not know the circumstances behind this accident.
We can hopefully get more information on the incident and learn from it from
the luxury of our offices or arm chairs at home not in the cockpit chewing
up your lead's tail.
Doc
Message 16
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Geez viper doc....I don't think your posting is coherent.
May I suggest that you read the final paragraph of the following
message from the archives:
Message:
#26045
From:
Roger Baker <f4ffm2(at)adelphia.net>
Date:
Aug 04, 2006
Subject:
photos, attacks, and propriety
No more from me on this
subject_________________________________________________________________
__________________________________________________
On May 11, 2007, at 9:07 PM, Roger Kemp M.D. wrote:
> <image001.jpg>
> Ok, Roger, I=92ll take the bait. You are saying you have not commited
> a checklist or an EP checklist for that matter to memory or
> learned the DASH 1 for all the aircraft you fly or have flown in
> your career?
>
> My intial comment was not made from a comfortable office either. As
> for second guessing, I believe someone else brought up taxiing with
> the air turned off. But what the heck did the Ru IP=92s have the
> little button on the top of the stick for in the trunk? Could it
> have been to train the student to turn off the mags and try to
> steer straiaght ahead before they did something like taxi into
> another aircraft or worse? Another thing that has not been said
> about this incident is brake fade after heating up the brakes from
> taxiing a long distance or heavy usage on roll out. Of course it
> could have resulted from a broken cable, air hose, air leak with
> min air, or a brain fart. We do not know the circumstances behind
> this accident.
>
> We can hopefully get more information on the incident and learn
> from it from the luxury of our offices or arm chairs at home not in
> the cockpit chewing up your lead=92s tail.
>
> Doc
>
>
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