---------------------------------------------------------- Yak-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 03/20/09: 12 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 09:28 AM - Re: Scott Taliwheel for Yak 55M (Wesley Warner) 2. 09:49 AM - Questions on Tachometer Drive (mike_beresford@yahoo.co.uk) 3. 12:48 PM - Re: Questions on Tachometer Drive (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E) 4. 03:30 PM - starter woes (Dr Andre Katz) 5. 04:25 PM - Wanted to buy - used or new. (Frank) 6. 04:28 PM - Re: starter woes (Frank) 7. 05:11 PM - Re: starter woes (A. Dennis Savarese) 8. 05:21 PM - Re: starter woes (Dr Andre Katz) 9. 05:39 PM - Re: starter woes (A. Dennis Savarese) 10. 08:29 PM - Re: starter woes (Jim Selby) 11. 08:40 PM - Re: starter woes (Dr Andre Katz) 12. 10:16 PM - Re: starter woes (ronald wasson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 09:28:39 AM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: Scott Taliwheel for Yak 55M From: Wesley Warner I found the one adapter I have here at home. It was packed away. I have attached a pic of it. In the picture is a gear extender as well, so you can get an idea of what they look like. This particular Scott adapter is for a plane without the gear extenders. It will work on one with them, it's just not perfect. Wes On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 7:34 PM, Yak 55M wrote: > Thanks Wes, > > that makes sense.- I think I have the extenders, but I will double chec k. > Any chance you can provide a photo (sorry to be a pest)?- Thanks for th e > follow up on the adapter plate, anything would help. > > Regards, > > Anthony. > > > On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 1:13 PM, Wesley Warner > wrote: >> >> >> I'm having some issues getting in touch with the the guy I had making >> them before. -Hopefully I can see him next week or so. -I thought I >> had one of the prototypes here, but I guess it's not. -I should be >> able to find that one next week also. >> >> The extenders normally are just some plate material that bolts to the >> landing gear holes and lowers the axles by about 3". -Most people >> started using them to run the larger Whirlwind prop and still have an >> adequate amount of ground clearance. >> >> Wes >> >> On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 1:12 AM, Yak 55M wrote: >> > Thanks Wes, >> > >> > the previous owner installed Grove 500x5 wheels and tires.- I don't >> > think I >> > have gear extenders, from what I can tell the axles are bolted directl y >> > to >> > the base of the legs.- What do the extenders look like, and what is >> > their >> > purpose?- I will check my ailerons as you suggested and let you know if >> > I >> > need the bushings. >> > >> > Regards, >> > >> > Anthony. >> >> >> ======================= >> rget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >> ========== >> http://forums.matronics.com >> ========== >> le, List Admin. >> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> ========== >> >> >> > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 09:49:13 AM PST US From: mike_beresford@yahoo.co.uk Subject: Yak-List: Questions on Tachometer Drive Hi all Over the years I have had a few problems with the tachoeter in my Yak-52, which usually seemed to be resolved by cleaig contacts. Recently the tachometer failed, and no amount of contact cleaning helped. I suspected a loose wire, so I checked the cannon plug at the generator side. When I opened it one of the wires was loose, so I resoldered it and hecked the wiring. During this it became obvious that I was not the first person to do this - there is a join in the wiring in the engine bay, as though this section has previously been replaced. I still cannot get the tachometer to work. I did a bit of work with my multimeter this morning, and found: - with both the generator and instrument ends disconnected, I get continuity between pin 1 of the generator with pin 1 of the instrument, likewise pin 2 to pin 2, pin 3 to pin 3, earth to earth. No continuity between pin 1 generator and any other pin, except instrument pin 1. Likewise for pins two and three. Pin 4 on the instrument does not appear to be connected to anything. From this I believe that the wiring is correct and intact. - When running the engine, I measured the AC voltages on the connector at the tachometer in the front cockpit. Pin 1 to earth had a small voltage, pin 3 to earth had a small voltage. No voltage on pin 2 to earth. >From these results, it seems to me that the fault lies with the tachometer drive and not with the wiring or tachometer instrument. It seems to have lost a phase. Before I start removing the drive unit, are there any other tests I can do to confirm my diagnosis? ALso, is my assumptinon that each pin on the generator connects to the same number pin on the instrument valid? It seems logical to me, but there may be some reason why the order may differ? Any advice would be appreciated. As a matter of interest, at least one previous owner of this aircraft had hassles with tachometer readings. Thanks Blue skies Mike Beresford South Africa ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:48:01 PM PST US Subject: RE: Yak-List: Questions on Tachometer Drive From: "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E" Mike, you have done good tests. It has been my experience that the Russian wire and their solder is not up to the same quality as one might hope. Here is a list of things: 1. Replace the wire that actually solders to the tach generator cannon plug with aircraft grade multi-strand Teflon covered wire. Then SPLICE it is with a environmental crimp splice to the original Russian wiring about a foot back. MAKE DARN SURE YOU MAINTAIN TOTAL SHIELDING OF THESE WIRES AND THAT THE SHIELD IS WELL CONNECTED TO THE CANNON PLUG ITSELF. Loss of shielding to the tach generator will result in the most horrific noise you can imagine to the radio and can actually result in burning out the receiver itself. THAT HAPPENED right here at my airport! 2. Any repairs or previous splices should also be shielded. Onto your particular problem. Remove (UNSCREW) the Tach Generator from the engine. It is EASY to do. Remove the cannon plug and simply look for the bright steel colored ring that has finger holds to unscrew it. Be sure you know what you are doing here and DO NOT disassemble the accessory plate itself! Simply unscrew the ring and remove the tach generator. Ok, now go over to your bench and get a normal variable speed electric drill. Connect the tachometer generator shaft into the chuck of the electric drill. Have someone else hold this contraption for you. Now start up the electric drill and measure from each pin to case ground and between each TWO pins... Such as 1-2 1-3 2-3 At any given RPM of the drill, you should see equal pin to pin voltage, and all pin to ground voltages should be close to equal. It's an easy test, and very effective in finding out if your tach gen is bad, which from what you describe most likely is. 3. If you lose any single wire, or have the wiring backwards from the tach gen to the tachometer movement itself in the cockpit, the thing will not just lay there dead. It will move BACKWARDS, or it will move correctly but be "way off" from the proper normal pointer indication for the given RPM. Since you have checked the wiring properly, I would first check the tach gen just like I mentioned above... If it actually checks GOOD, then try the airplane with one tach indicator DISCONNECTED and the other one working and then reverse. It is possible for a bad tach indicator in the cockpit to load down the voltage making both read zero, but that is extremely rare. Most likely... You have a bad tach gen, but the drill test will verify it in about 30 minutes total time. Good Luck, Mark Bitterlich N50YK -----Original Message----- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of mike_beresford@yahoo.co.uk Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 12:48 PM Subject: Yak-List: Questions on Tachometer Drive Hi all Over the years I have had a few problems with the tachoeter in my Yak-52, which usually seemed to be resolved by cleaig contacts. Recently the tachometer failed, and no amount of contact cleaning helped. I suspected a loose wire, so I checked the cannon plug at the generator side. When I opened it one of the wires was loose, so I resoldered it and hecked the wiring. During this it became obvious that I was not the first person to do this - there is a join in the wiring in the engine bay, as though this section has previously been replaced. I still cannot get the tachometer to work. I did a bit of work with my multimeter this morning, and found: - with both the generator and instrument ends disconnected, I get continuity between pin 1 of the generator with pin 1 of the instrument, likewise pin 2 to pin 2, pin 3 to pin 3, earth to earth. No continuity between pin 1 generator and any other pin, except instrument pin 1. Likewise for pins two and three. Pin 4 on the instrument does not appear to be connected to anything. From this I believe that the wiring is correct and intact. - When running the engine, I measured the AC voltages on the connector at the tachometer in the front cockpit. Pin 1 to earth had a small voltage, pin 3 to earth had a small voltage. No voltage on pin 2 to earth. >From these results, it seems to me that the fault lies with the tachometer drive and not with the wiring or tachometer instrument. It seems to have lost a phase. Before I start removing the drive unit, are there any other tests I can do to confirm my diagnosis? ALso, is my assumptinon that each pin on the generator connects to the same number pin on the instrument valid? It seems logical to me, but there may be some reason why the order may differ? Any advice would be appreciated. As a matter of interest, at least one previous owner of this aircraft had hassles with tachometer readings. Thanks Blue skies Mike Beresford South Africa ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:30:02 PM PST US From: Dr Andre Katz Subject: Yak-List: starter woes my 55m today left me in the middle of nowhere. I have the kimball dual sole noid system without a filter, when pressure exceeds 600 psi it dumps the st uff out. I have replaced the old russian starter dual system with a button that combines the vibrator and the wire to the solenoid that puts air into the back of the engine. Today for the first time since I have owned the pla ne, after sitting for 2 months it started on the first blade, then of cours e went to get a burger 30 miles out and sure enough, with 600 psi in the ta nk, all I get is a bit of hissing at the push button and no motion of the p rop, I replaced the solenoid (since I have a second one on board for dumpin g air wishing that that will make it come home) but no way, i think that th e chances of any repair go down in direct -proportion of the number of lo okers around the airplane. any ideas?I suspect that there is gunk in the system. appreciate any help. stuck in Lancaster texas (KLNC) andres ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:25:14 PM PST US From: "Frank" Subject: Yak-List: Wanted to buy - used or new. OK, Boys...I may be reaching here but...........I know this email list goes round the world. Maybe someone out there can help. I'm looking for ejection seats, new or recent manufacture, with manufacturer support for parts like squibs, motors, etc. The seats should be suitable for or can be adapted to the Saab J-35 Drakken and Aermacchi MB326B Impala jets. Initial quantity will be around 10-15 seats. Please call or email if you have any leads. Thanks in advance. Frank Haertlein 760-784-0818 frank@orionite.com ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:28:59 PM PST US From: "Frank" Subject: Re: Yak-List: starter woes Check your battery voltage. If it's low it can cause the solenoid to not operate. ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr Andre Katz To: yak-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 3:26 PM Subject: Yak-List: starter woes my 55m today left me in the middle of nowhere. I have the kimball dual solenoid system without a filter, when pressure exceeds 600 psi it dumps the stuff out. I have replaced the old russian starter dual system with a button that combines the vibrator and the wire to the solenoid that puts air into the back of the engine. Today for the first time since I have owned the plane, after sitting for 2 months it started on the first blade, then of course went to get a burger 30 miles out and sure enough, with 600 psi in the tank, all I get is a bit of hissing at the push button and no motion of the prop, I replaced the solenoid (since I have a second one on board for dumping air wishing that that will make it come home) but no way, i think that the chances of any repair go down in direct proportion of the number of lookers around the airplane. any ideas?I suspect that there is gunk in the system. appreciate any help. stuck in Lancaster texas (KLNC) andres __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 3952 (20090320) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:11:53 PM PST US From: "A. Dennis Savarese" Subject: Re: Yak-List: starter woes This may sound too simple, but did you move the prop about 20 degrees and try starting it again? Sometimes when everything lines up a certain way, it will just hiss when you hit the start button. Many an M14 has experienced this problem. Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr Andre Katz To: yak-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 5:26 PM Subject: Yak-List: starter woes my 55m today left me in the middle of nowhere. I have the kimball dual solenoid system without a filter, when pressure exceeds 600 psi it dumps the stuff out. I have replaced the old russian starter dual system with a button that combines the vibrator and the wire to the solenoid that puts air into the back of the engine. Today for the first time since I have owned the plane, after sitting for 2 months it started on the first blade, then of course went to get a burger 30 miles out and sure enough, with 600 psi in the tank, all I get is a bit of hissing at the push button and no motion of the prop, I replaced the solenoid (since I have a second one on board for dumping air wishing that that will make it come home) but no way, i think that the chances of any repair go down in direct proportion of the number of lookers around the airplane. any ideas?I suspect that there is gunk in the system. appreciate any help. stuck in Lancaster texas (KLNC) andres ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:21:32 PM PST US From: Dr Andre Katz Subject: Re: Yak-List: starter woes will check the volts tomorrow when I go back thanks for the suggestion andres ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:39:00 PM PST US From: "A. Dennis Savarese" Subject: Re: Yak-List: starter woes Andre, also check the flexible air line going to the air start spider. I have seen them crack due to the twist it. The one on my airplane (Yak 52) was one of them. All it did was hiss when I hit the start button. Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr Andre Katz To: yak-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 7:19 PM Subject: Re: Yak-List: starter woes will check the volts tomorrow when I go back thanks for the suggestion andres ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:29:00 PM PST US From: "Jim Selby" Subject: Re: Yak-List: starter woes Chinese Engines as well.... ----- Original Message ----- From: A. Dennis Savarese To: yak-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 5:10 PM Subject: Re: Yak-List: starter woes This may sound too simple, but did you move the prop about 20 degrees and try starting it again? Sometimes when everything lines up a certain way, it will just hiss when you hit the start button. Many an M14 has experienced this problem. Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr Andre Katz To: yak-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 5:26 PM Subject: Yak-List: starter woes my 55m today left me in the middle of nowhere. I have the kimball dual solenoid system without a filter, when pressure exceeds 600 psi it dumps the stuff out. I have replaced the old russian starter dual system with a button that combines the vibrator and the wire to the solenoid that puts air into the back of the engine. Today for the first time since I have owned the plane, after sitting for 2 months it started on the first blade, then of course went to get a burger 30 miles out and sure enough, with 600 psi in the tank, all I get is a bit of hissing at the push button and no motion of the prop, I replaced the solenoid (since I have a second one on board for dumping air wishing that that will make it come home) but no way, i think that the chances of any repair go down in direct proportion of the number of lookers around the airplane. any ideas?I suspect that there is gunk in the system. appreciate any help. stuck in Lancaster texas (KLNC) andres href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics .com/Navigator?Yak-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:40:06 PM PST US From: Dr Andre Katz Subject: Re: Yak-List: starter woes we moved the prop into many positions I had seen this problem before but the prop did move a bit every time, this time I got no movement at all at the prop, we rotated it back, forwards to no avail thanks will check the line, the volts, and see what happens tomorrow thanks a ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:16:46 PM PST US From: ronald wasson Subject: Re: Yak-List: starter woes Leaky exhaust valve. Push start valve and listen to the exhaust and you will hear a hiss . Starter is stuck on the cylinder and won't advance air distributor. Move prop a blade and it will start . You move it off the leaking cylinder to allow starter to pop air to good cylinder. Will only occur if the prop stops on that cylinder. Some times it will advance to that cylinder and stop. Get it started before that cylinder comes around or you have move the prop pass that cylinder again As the engine warms up it should stop sticking but will get worse with every run. Fix is to grind valve to stop sticking / leaking On Mar 20, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Dr Andre Katz wrote: > > > we moved the prop into many positions I had seen this problem before > but the prop did move a bit every time, this time I got no movement > at all at the prop, we rotated it back, forwards to no avail > thanks > will check the line, the volts, and see what happens tomorrow > thanks > a > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message yak-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Yak-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/yak-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/yak-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.