---------------------------------------------------------- Yak-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 05/13/09: 9 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:04 AM - TW-TD-50 speeds...??? (Zjopa) 2. 12:22 AM - Re: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? (Nigel Willson) 3. 06:52 AM - Re: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? (Roger Kemp M.D.) 4. 06:57 AM - Re: Is anyone in Salt Lake City (barryhancock) 5. 07:22 AM - Re: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? (Zjopa) 6. 07:30 AM - Re: problem with my Baklan 5 radio (vincent) 7. 08:40 AM - Re: Re: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? (Roger Kemp M.D.) 8. 09:30 AM - Re: Re: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? (David Jester) 9. 01:13 PM - Aircraft for sale (Barry Hancock) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:04:34 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? From: "Zjopa" So.. What are good target speeds in k/ph for final turn (or base) Final, Over the fence, and over the threshold??? What do you guys like to hold. The reason I ask is that i seem to boing and bounce if I do the book 170 approach speed. Or maybe it's a technique thing... Any pointers graciously accepted. Hopalong Zjiopa! :) -------- "Well, boys, we got three engines out, we got more holes in us than a horse trader's mule, the radio is gone and we're leaking fuel and if we was flying any lower why we'd need sleigh bells on this thing... " - Henry Paulson, US Treasury Secretary Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243831#243831 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:22:28 AM PST US From: Nigel Willson Subject: Re: Yak-List: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? For '52 speeds are: Base to final turn 180-200 Reduce to 170 on final for flaps Approach 150 all the way for normal or reduce over threshold to 130 for short field Nigel On 13 May 2009, at 08:03, "Zjopa" wrote: > > So.. > > What are good target speeds in k/ph for final turn (or base) > Final, Over the fence, and over the threshold??? > > What do you guys like to hold. > > The reason I ask is that i seem to boing and bounce if I do the book > 170 approach speed. > > Or maybe it's a technique thing... > Any pointers graciously accepted. > > Hopalong Zjiopa! :) > > -------- > "Well, boys, we got three engines out, we got more holes in us > than a horse trader's mule, the radio is gone and we're leaking fuel > and if we was flying any lower why we'd need sleigh bells on this > thing... " > > - Henry Paulson, US Treasury Secretary > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243831#243831 > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:52:26 AM PST US From: "Roger Kemp M.D." Subject: RE: Yak-List: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? First, let clarify what you are flying. A YAK 50, a YAK-52 TW? If you are flying a 50, than all landings are no flaps since she does not have them. Assuming you are flying a YAK-50 the following is how I fly my approaches and landings. On downwind - 200 kph or < for gear. At the Perch - 150 -160 kph Prop @ 70% and (for me) generally idle on MP ()use as needed for glide slope adjustment. Base turn - use pitch and slip to control A/S on base and final. Power as needed but shooting for holding 150 KPH. Generally takes 10 to 13 degrees of alpha to hold that A/S. Slips make for a steeper descent with better runway visibility out the side glass. Final- slow to 130 kph for 3 point touch down at 110-120 (110 kph - stall speed gear down configuration). Use slips to maintain runway heading (along with seeing the runway) and lose altitude without increasing A/S. Final for Wheel landing- 140-150 over the threshold trying to slow to max 140 for Touchdown. Either speed makes for a long roll out vs 3 point landing. You are trying to fly her on to the deck in a level attitude. Pinning her with forward push on the stick means timing the arrival is everything. Watch the attitude that a F4-U Corsair flies on base turn and final. Granted he has flaps and the 50 does not. The 50 is a floater in ground effect. You just have to hold her off about 1-2 feet off the runway until she gets down to 110 kph and quits flying. If you are doing a 3 point you will be holding about 13 degrees of alpha! You are only seeing the world through the angle screen on the left and the right. I tend to look left more than right since I can snap shot look at the AS indicator while watching my runway position in the flare (if you can call flying down the glide slope at 13 deg alpha to touchdown a flare). Guess the flare started at the base turn because you are using it and the slip to control your descent rate/ airspeed. Drop the nose on a 50 and watch you're A/S increase by 20 KPH in a heartbeat. That is my technique for the landing in a 50. If you are talking about a 52 TW then it is another bucket of worms that I do not have experience with. If you 3 point her (the 50) with the same site picture that you have sitting in her on the ramp at engine start while timing your touchdown to arrive at the runway at 110 kph to 115 kph (splitting hairs) you will not bounce. With the 50, you have to finesse her onto the ground and fly her to the chokes. Summary: Downwind: <200 kph gear Perch: 160-150 kph Base: 150 Kph Final: Two Point 140-150 kph (short final) Touchdown ~ 130-140 KPH. Final: Three Point 130 Kph (short final) slowing to 110 Kph for Touchdown. The final slowing is flown in ground effect at 13 degrees alpha (for me that is). You'll find as you do this more and more it becomes a thing of feel. Viperdoc -----Original Message----- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Zjopa Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2009 2:04 AM Subject: Yak-List: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? So.. What are good target speeds in k/ph for final turn (or base) Final, Over the fence, and over the threshold??? What do you guys like to hold. The reason I ask is that i seem to boing and bounce if I do the book 170 approach speed. Or maybe it's a technique thing... Any pointers graciously accepted. Hopalong Zjiopa! :) -------- "Well, boys, we got three engines out, we got more holes in us than a horse trader's mule, the radio is gone and we're leaking fuel and if we was flying any lower why we'd need sleigh bells on this thing... " - Henry Paulson, US Treasury Secretary Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243831#243831 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:57:30 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Re: Is anyone in Salt Lake City From: "barryhancock" Gang, Just as an FYI, there are a few RPA members in the Salt Lake Area. Val Walker is based in Salt Lake, Skip Slyfield and Bruce Kirchenheiter are at Heber (south of Park City) and I'm in Provo when not in Chino. We're all less than an hours drive from SLC. Cheers, Barry -------- Barry Hancock Worldwide Warbirds, Inc. www.worldwidewarbirds.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243865#243865 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:22:24 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Re: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? From: "Zjopa" Awesome info Doc.. Thanks. To clarify I'm flying a 52TD which has a steeper deck angle than the TW. I think it's about the same as the 50 but I'm in the front seat.. so theres a "Bit" more visibility. I'm looking forward to finding a nice little deserted ex-B52 base with no-one around to practice my 3-pointers. Gotta re-calibrate my AOA and try some approaches with that. Thanks Z -------- "Well, boys, we got three engines out, we got more holes in us than a horse trader's mule, the radio is gone and we're leaking fuel and if we was flying any lower why we'd need sleigh bells on this thing... " - Henry Paulson, US Treasury Secretary Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243871#243871 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:30:32 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Re: problem with my Baklan 5 radio From: "vincent" There is a 10A fuse on the radio trail and it was out of service ! I changed the fuse and everything is ok! thank you all for your help !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243872#243872 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:40:02 AM PST US From: "Roger Kemp M.D." Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? Z, If I remember correctly your stall speed dirty is around 120-130 kph. So if it were me, I would hold about 150 down to the flare then slow it to 130 holding her off at a foot or so off the ground. Yes, you do have about a 11-12 degree nose high attitude. When sitting in her look out to the edge of the runway before take off and try to remember that as you are gliding in ground effect. Doc -----Original Message----- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Zjopa Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2009 9:22 AM Subject: Yak-List: Re: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? Awesome info Doc.. Thanks. To clarify I'm flying a 52TD which has a steeper deck angle than the TW. I think it's about the same as the 50 but I'm in the front seat.. so theres a "Bit" more visibility. I'm looking forward to finding a nice little deserted ex-B52 base with no-one around to practice my 3-pointers. Gotta re-calibrate my AOA and try some approaches with that. Thanks Z -------- "Well, boys, we got three engines out, we got more holes in us than a horse trader's mule, the radio is gone and we're leaking fuel and if we was flying any lower why we'd need sleigh bells on this thing... " - Henry Paulson, US Treasury Secretary Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243871#243871 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:30:07 AM PST US From: David Jester Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: TW-TD-50 speeds...??? Guys: I have a 52TD. Doc is about right on the approach speeds. I drop the flaps at 165 to 170. I then hold 155 or so all the way down. I keep the power in until I reach the runway. I wheel land exclusively maintaining a speed above stall. This allows better rudder authority as I reduce power and allow the air speed to bleed off and the tail to ease down. Keeping a little power in has eliminated the bounce in my landings. Sent from my iPhone On May 13, 2009, at 9:21 AM, "Zjopa" wrote: > > Awesome info Doc.. Thanks. > To clarify I'm flying a 52TD which has a steeper deck angle than the > TW. I think it's about the same as the 50 but I'm in the front > seat.. so theres a "Bit" more visibility. > I'm looking forward to finding a nice little deserted ex-B52 base > with no-one around to practice my 3-pointers. Gotta re-calibrate my > AOA and try some approaches with that. > Thanks > > Z > > -------- > "Well, boys, we got three engines out, we got more holes in us > than a horse trader's mule, the radio is gone and we're leaking fuel > and if we was flying any lower why we'd need sleigh bells on this > thing... " > > - Henry Paulson, US Treasury Secretary > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243871#243871 > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 01:13:49 PM PST US From: Barry Hancock Subject: Yak-List: Aircraft for sale Gang, I've recently posted 3 aircraft for sale on Barnstormers.com. They'll be up soon on our web site and the other usual places. Yak-50. Serial #001. Historical aircraft with very low times and in great shape. $85,000 1989 Nanchang CJ-6. Also an historical aircraft with low times and complete refurbish by WW in 2009. $85,000. 2003 Lancair Legacy. One of a kind all carbon fiber beauty. Routine cruise 210 KTAS on 11 gph! $260,000. If you have any questions please contact me directly...and feel free to spread the word. Thanks, Barry Barry Hancock Worldwide Warbirds, Inc. www.worldwidewarbirds.com (909) 606-4444 office (949) 300-5510 cell "The complete center for warbird excellence" Express Mailing address: 7000 Merrill Ave, B-110, Unit J Chino, CA 91710 Regular Mailing address: 7000 Merrill Ave., Box 91 Chino, CA 91710 The information contained in this e-mail message is intended only for the personal and confidential use of the designated recipients. If the reader of this message is not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, use, dissemination, forwarding or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. Please notify us immediately by reply e-mail or telephone, and delete the original message and all attachments from your system. 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