Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:07 AM - Re: new air problem (Roger Kemp M.D.)
2. 08:01 AM - Secure Garmin GPS Mount (White3)
3. 08:44 AM - Re: Secure Garmin GPS Mount (doug sapp)
4. 09:11 AM - Re: Secure Garmin GPS Mount (Roger Kemp M.D.)
5. 10:00 AM - Re: Yak 52 Starter Sequence? (Gill Gutierrez)
6. 10:02 AM - Re: new air problem (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
7. 01:13 PM - air starting solenoid (T A LEWIS)
8. 04:47 PM - Re: air starting solenoid (Walter Lannon)
9. 05:07 PM - Re: airstart solenoid (Frank Stelwagon)
10. 06:00 PM - Re: Re: airstart solenoid (T A LEWIS)
11. 06:16 PM - Follow up air leak (Bill1200)
Message 1
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Key word first operational base. Not training base. Hill AFB was the first
operational base. The Viper got the nick name "Lawn Dart" because of many of
the GE 100 engines fuel flow controllers were failing causing obviously loss
of power. That resulted in a number of A models being parked in the Utah
desert. Hence the name "Lawn Dart". The joke used to be if you want an F-16
buy land in Utah. One will drop in before long.
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Halverson
Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2010 1:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: new air problem
Luke?
+-----Original Message-----
+From: Roger Kemp M.D. [mailto:viperdoc@mindspring.com]
+Sent: Wednesday, June 2, 2010 08:28 PM
+To: yak-list@matronics.com
+Subject: RE: Yak-List: new air problem
+
+That would be true. Now do you know what AF Base was associated with that
+terminology? Hint it was the first operation base for the F-16 A as they
+came into the inventory.
+
+Doc
Message 2
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| Subject: | Secure Garmin GPS Mount |
I have a Garmin 296 but I really need a secure mount for it. The standard mount
is not able to hold the unit in high G maneuvers. Not an ideal situation in
an inverted Yak !
Does anybody have a mount that they can recommend please ?
--------
It's not a hairy cow.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299860#299860
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Secure Garmin GPS Mount |
Will a Garmin 195 mount work for you?
Doug
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 8:00 AM, White3 <richardjakobek@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
>
> I have a Garmin 296 but I really need a secure mount for it. The standard
> mount is not able to hold the unit in high G maneuvers. Not an ideal
> situation in an inverted Yak !
> Does anybody have a mount that they can recommend please ?
>
> --------
> It's not a hairy cow.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299860#299860
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Secure Garmin GPS Mount |
Look at the RAM mounts from Air Craft Spruce. In my 52, I used the band
mount to strap the articulating arm to the vent tube. I then took the back
plate off the Garmin c clamp mount for the 295 and attached the Garmin back
plate mount to a RAM ball mount. The ball mount is then locked onto the
articulating arm. This whole unit then sits nicely in front of the vent air
deflector between your legs/knees.
It is easy to read and literally is out of the glare of the sun. Under
negative G, my unit does not even think about leaving the A/C.
doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of White3
Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2010 10:00 AM
Subject: Yak-List: Secure Garmin GPS Mount
I have a Garmin 296 but I really need a secure mount for it. The standard
mount is not able to hold the unit in high G maneuvers. Not an ideal
situation in an inverted Yak !
Does anybody have a mount that they can recommend please ?
--------
It's not a hairy cow.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299860#299860
Message 5
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Starter Sequence? |
Bill,
Prop degrees for Housai is 9 degrees, for M14P 8 degrees, both on #4
cylinder after TDC.
Gill
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Lang
Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 9:38 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Starter Sequence?
The mechanic is working on the spider now. He asked me to ask if anyone
knows the number of degrees of prop rotation from TDC to set the spider at,
or any other advice for setting it. The instuctions from the M14 manual are
a bit ambiguous. (no access to Housai Manual)
Bill
_____
From: gill.g@gpimail.com
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Starter Sequence?
If you have access to a Housai manual, it provides better instructions as it
has a diagram. The difference relates to prop gearing. I have reset mine
twice after engine disassembly and it's not a big deal.
Gill
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Yak Pilot
Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 5:50 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Starter Sequence?
GOOD FOR YOU! Good job in finding the proper task cards!
Let me run my mouth one last time. First, adjusting this thing is a real
pain in the ass. It is hard to get to the nuts and stuff to remove it, it
requires you to get the engine set up perfectly, and then insert the thing
back in and tighten it down. I have been involved in adjusting it twice,
and it was a real ass kicker.
Next... make darn sure... let me correct that: MAKE DAMN SURE that you know
this is the problem before you remove it from the engine and start trying to
re-adjust it. Once you remove it, you have no choice but to finish the job.
I am not kidding when I tell you that a flow restriction in the air system
will cause the exact same problem that you are reporting.
Yes, it is most likely that someone messed with this in the past, and just
could never get it right again, and this is what you have wrong now. (I.E.
A misadjusted Air Distributor) The odds are good that this is your problem,
but as a Tech Rep, my mind always considers the alternatives and you can
never rule out ANYTHING unless you verify it as a "known good". That said,
if your AIR FLOW to this unit is low, it will do the exact same thing you
are now reporting.
That said, if I was there, I would take my nitrogen bottle with a good
regulator and would connect it DIRECTLY to the line going to the air
distributor and would set it to 730 PSI and would see what happened when I
turned it on. If the engine does the exact same thing, then you are sure
that the distributor is the problem. However, if the engine spins right
around perfectly, then you can STOP RIGHT THERE and say "BOY OH BOY IT IS
NOT THE AIR DISTRIBUTOR" and you have saved yourself one HUGE amount of
work.
Consider this advice carefully.
Best regards,
Mark Bitterlich
--- On Thu, 4/8/10, Bill Lang <billlang@live.com.au> wrote:
From: Bill Lang <billlang@live.com.au>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Starter Sequence?
Mark
Further to my last.. found the ref on George's web site M14 maint Manual,
task card 204. Hope my guy
can do it.
Thanks
Bill
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Starter Sequence?
> Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2010 12:53:38 -0400
> From: mark.bitterlich@navy.mil
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>
MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>
>
>
> MOST LIKELY: Your air distributor is out of alignment.
>
> This is a tedious and exacting job. VERY TEDIOUS AND VERY EXACTING!
>
> There is a little gear in there with many little itsy tiny teeth that
> has to be JUST right.
>
> I would suggest you contact Dennis Savarese directly, I believe he has
> the procedure written out and ready to send. It is addressed in the
> maint. Cards for the engine. It might also be at George Coy's web site.
> His site is also a wealth of knowledge.
>
> It is much MUCH more complicated than just spinning it 180 degrees, SAD
> TO SAY! Without the instructions, I have seen people mess with this
> thing for days. DAYS!
>
> Just FYI, the thing does more than just put air into a cylinder to make
> the piston move. When it is perfectly set up, it not only puts air into
> one cylinder to push the piston down, it also sends air to the lower
> cylinders WITH THE EXHAUST VALVES OPEN to help push any oil that is in
> there right out the exhaust. But it has to be timed PERFECTLY to the
> engine, just like the ignition distributor on your car, or the mag on
> your airplane. Please excuse the language on the net, but it is a real
> SOB to adjust.
>
> I am sorry that I do not have the instructions to give you, or have them
> memorized... But I will tell you to not even think about messing with it
> until you have the instructions fully in hand and understand them
> perfectly.
>
> Mark Bitterlich
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Lang
> Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 6:30 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Yak 52 Starter Sequence?
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>
> Technical advice needed ref starter. I have just purchesed a Yak52 that
> has apparently had a starter problem since a new engine was installed.
> It seems that there is a sequencing problem of the air going into the
> cylinders. It turns a few degrees on start, and then air appears to blow
> straight through the cylinder to exhaust. Sometimes it turns backwards.
> Would it be possible to install the starter spider 180 out? My mechanic
> and I would appreciate if anyone has faced this problem and found a fix.
> Is there a mark on the spider or foolproof way of installing the spider
> that was overlooked by the original mechanics
>
> Taa
>
> Bill
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> Looking for a hot date? View photos of singles in your area!
>======================
&g===========
>
>
>
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Find it at CarPoint.com.au
Message 6
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I am sure you're both right. In truth, the USMC has always had to steal
all the good stuff from the Air Force.
I guess nothing's changed... :-)
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp
M.D.
Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 11:28 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: new air problem
That would be true. Now do you know what AF Base was associated with
that terminology? Hint it was the first operation base for the F-16 A as
they came into the inventory.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Hamlin
Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 5:43 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: new air problem
Lawn darts are F-16s
--- On Wed, 6/2/10, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
<mark.bitterlich@navy.mil> wrote:
From: Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
<mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Subject: RE: Yak-List: new air problem
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil
--> <http://us.mc511.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=mark.bitterlich@navy.m
--> il> >
LawnDart (which is what we call F-18's in the Corps) mentioned the line
going from the compressor to the snot valve. This line ... The one with
the "loop" in it .........fails a lot. Which is why in some other
Russian designs (notably the Sukhoi's) they replace this with a steel
braided flex line, which is what I have done as well in my YAK-50.
Problem solved. I think Doug Sapp might even be able to make these
things for you. Not sure, but worth asking. He also mentioned there
can be leaks in the Banjo Fitting at the compressor. This is also right
on the money, and there is check valve in there that can leak as well.
What I have done is to reverse pressurize this line by removing it from
the snot valve, and then hooking it to a high pressure source and
applying 700 psi and listening for leaks. The Banjo Fitting at the
compressor uses crush washers and if you don't put in new ones once you
have taken it apart and put it back together again, it might leak. I've
gotten away with not using new ones a few times, but .... Luck of the
draw.
I will offer one more thing. I have noticed that when I have had to use
the external filling port, that if I am not careful I can put in WAY too
much air in there VERY quickly, with the result that the pop-off valve
really starts banging away. No big deal right? Well, not so fast.
After I have done that, the stupid thing starts to LEAK! Usually this
happens on an aircraft that has not had the pop-off seal replaced in a
blue moon, and the abuse of having it really go nuts during a ground air
fill-up is the straw that broke the camels back. Another good
indication of the beginning of the end is a pop-off valve that hisses
and very slowly seats, which is about what you were describing.
There is difference somewhere in the air design between the YAK-50 and
52, and since I don't own a 52 I really would feel better asking Dennis
about this... But for example on the 50, the emergency air bottle is
filled by the compressor, and in the 52 it is only filled from the
external source. I also am not sure about the check valve differences
between the 50 and 52. It is POSSIBLE that on the 52 that the pop-off
valve is still in the loop even with the bottle valve closed. Not sure
of that... It's out of the loop in the 50... But I just don't know on
the 52.
Bottom line:
It might also be worth your time looking at the pop-off valve for slow
leaks. It also might cause slow pressurization with the engine running.
You can also take high pressure air and put it into the system just like
the compressor does from the snot valve fitting and check for leaks that
way too.
Mark Bitterlich
P.s. A good indication of whether you have a cracked line, or leaking
banjo fitting from the compressor to the snot valve is to follow this
simple test. Start engine, let the pressure come up just a tad, then
shut everything down and closed all valves. Wait about 15 minutes or so
and then open the snot valve. Do you get a good rush of air like you
usually do? If you do, then more than likely you have no leaks between
the compressor and the snot valve. If you open the snot valve and get
no air rushing out, or much less than you remember from the past, then
you probably do have a leak in that area.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
<http://us.mc511.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-yak-list-server@matr
onics.com>
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
<http://us.mc511.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-yak-list-server@matr
onics.com> ] On Behalf Of Bill1200
Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 11:28
<http://us.mc511.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=yak-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Yak-List: new air problem
--> <http://us.mc511.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=billdykes52@gmail.com>
--> >
Replaced compressor 7 months ago and all has been well, until.....
Left the air valve open by mistake after a flight about 3 weeks ago.
Pressure had bled down to about 2, when I got back a few days later.
Thought no big deal, filled it up externally and went about my flight.
Then on the next flight prep noticed the pressure down to about 3,
checked the valve which was off. Started OK at 3, but noticed VERY slow
build up, barely got up to 4 during the flight. Checked the snot valve
yesterday and seems good (no leak). Checked pressure after several days
on the ground with no loss of pressure (valve off). Took the pressure
down to 2 by actuating flaps, ran at 50% sitting on the ground, took
about 10minutes to get to 3.
Another thing I've noticed, when I fill it externally it pops off about
6 and bleeds down to about 5.5. Never has the compressor got up to 5.5
either the old one or the new one. Don;t understand that.
So, question is where to start looking for MOST likely leak source??????
Read this topic online here:
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Message 7
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| Subject: | air starting solenoid |
Hi,
Does anyone know why the air solenoid is groundedthrough the mag switch on a CJ
?
On my 65 model you must have the mag in both , ie. 1+2 , to get a ground to the
solenoid .
Unless I can find a good reason I am going to ground the solenoid directly to the
airplane
ground bar .
Thanks ,
Terry Lewis
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: air starting solenoid |
Hi Terry;
Just checked the wiring diagram. The ground wire from the air start solenoid
(-3Q2) goes diectly to an airframe ground bus and not to either mag switch.
All ground busses are common with the airframe however and the mag switch
ground wires (-4Q3 & -5Q3) go to their respective ground busses. FWIW.
Cheers;
Walt
----- Original Message -----
From: "T A LEWIS" <talew@bellsouth.net>
Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2010 1:12 PM
Subject: Yak-List: air starting solenoid
>
> Hi,
> Does anyone know why the air solenoid is grounded through the mag switch
> on a CJ ?
> On my 65 model you must have the mag in both , ie. 1+2 , to get a ground
> to the solenoid .
> Unless I can find a good reason I am going to ground the solenoid directly
> to the airplane
> ground bar .
> Thanks ,
> Terry Lewis
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | RE: airstart solenoid |
I don't think It is grounded thru the mag switch on all CJ's. Some YAK
18's (CJ-5) are also grounded thru the mag switch. The reason I would
assume was to teach the student to turn on the mags when trying to start
the engine. Either way works.
Frank
CJ6-A
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: RE: airstart solenoid |
Walt and Frank ,=0AI think you are both right . =0AOther , later model ,
-CJ's in Fla. are not wired like mine .-My CJ is direct from China with
no mods .=0AAs Walt says the wiring diagram does not show this ground bein
g any thing other than directly to ground . It did make trouble shooting=0A
my-problem a little harder . =0AAgain , thanks to all who offered suggest
ions-to this-problem .=0AFinal solution was-correct an-intermittent
ground , and-a new solenoid from Doug Sapp .=0ATerry Lewis=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Frank Stelwagon <pfstelwagon@ea
rthlink.net>=0ATo: yak-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Thu, June 3, 2010 8:07:20
PM=0ASubject: Yak-List: RE: airstart solenoid=0A=0A=0AI don't think It is
grounded thru the mag switch on all CJ's.- Some YAK 18's (CJ-5) are also
grounded thru the mag switch.- The reason I would assume was to teach the
student to turn on the mags when trying to start the engine.- Either way
===================
Message 11
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| Subject: | Follow up air leak |
Mark, thanks again, you saved me a lot of money. The test you suggested was right
on. Ran the engine, shut down, open snot valve...no air. Ran it again, got
out very quickly and started spraying soapy water on banjo fitting....leaks so
fast, barely caught them. Tightened all nuts (don't have new washers handy) rechecked
and no leaks, plenty of air out the snot valve when opened up on final
check. Lots of fun re-doing the safety wire on the bottom nut, but worth the
aggravation. Glad to be flying again!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=299954#299954
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