Today's Message Index:
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1. 02:13 PM - Yak/CJ minimum requirements (Jerry Painter)
2. 02:34 PM - Re: Yak/CJ minimum requirements (Brian Lloyd)
3. 04:14 PM - Fw: yak list (Herb Coussons)
4. 04:50 PM - Re: Yak/CJ minimum requirements (CD 2.0)
5. 05:09 PM - Re: Re: Yak/CJ minimum requirements (Brian Lloyd)
6. 05:10 PM - Re: Re: Yak/CJ minimum requirements (Brian Lloyd)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Yak/CJ minimum requirements |
Speaking strictly as a CFI/stick-in-the-mud who has given more than 6000
hours of instruction, a fair amount in CJ's/-52's and lots of BFR's I would
make the following comments:
1. Competent/adequate training is more important than total time, ratings,
complex/hp time or anything else. CJ's and Yaks are easy to fly, but you
have to get it right. That requires proper instruction.
2. There are a lot of shi*ty pilots out there.
3. Experience helps.
Be careful.
Jerry Painter
Wild Blue Aviation
www.FlyWBA.com
JP@FlyWBA.com
425-876-0865
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Yak/CJ minimum requirements |
On Sun, Aug 14, 2011 at 2:10 PM, Jerry Painter <wild.blue@frontier.com>wrote:
>
> Speaking strictly as a CFI/stick-in-the-mud who has given more than 6000
> hours of instruction, a fair amount in CJ's/-52's and lots of BFR's I would
> make the following comments:
>
> 1. Competent/adequate training is more important than total time, ratings,
> complex/hp time or anything else. CJ's and Yaks are easy to fly, but you
> have to get it right. That requires proper instruction.
> 2. There are a lot of shi*ty pilots out there.
> 3. Experience helps.
>
I was going to weigh in on this and add my two cents. Your comment #1 covers
100% of what I was going to say but you did it with about 1/10 the number of
words I was going to use.
FWIW, the training syllabus I use for transition training in the CJ6A is 10
hours: 5 on the ground and 5 in flight.
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
Message 3
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See Below -
Posting for Lee
Dr. Herb Coussons, MD
drc@wscare.com
2641 Development Drive
Green Bay, WI 54311
Cell 920-639-8434
Work 920-338-6868
Fax 920-338-6869
Begin forwarded message:
> From: "Haven, Lee" <LHaven@megtec.com>
> Date: August 14, 2011 1:47:48 PM CDT
> To: "Herb Coussons" <drc@wscare.com>
> Subject: yak list
>
> Can you do me a favor and post to the Yak list? I can't seem to find
a source for the metric dowel pins holding the cowling on. I managed to
get the pins into the back of instrument panel last week (they were
missing). I stole them from my cowl as they were easy to get at.
>
> Suggested post
> "Does anyone have a source for the hinged metric cowl pins on a Yak
52"?
>
> Bonus question...
> "Does anyone have a source for the original Russian hose ends"?
>
> Thanks
>
> Lee Haven
> Global Product Manager
> MEGTEC Systems
> (920)337-1500 X3707
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Yak/CJ minimum requirements |
I would be skeptical of any transition training consisting of just 5 hours of ground
instruction and 5 hours of flying time in any aircraft... :)
It is not difficult to get into a flat spin through a mishandled stall turn in
a Yak 52, and recovering from certain types of spins can be difficult and can
lead to considerable height loss... and a simple attempted maneuver such as a
stall turn, after a vertical climb, if mishandled, could easily result in a flat
spin... leaving the pilot with limited airspace available for recovery.
As most know, a recovery action from an unintentional spin if delayed by the time
taken to recognise and react correctly to the event could be catastrophic.
This is something that a good instructor needs to "cover extensively" during
training.
These are aerobatic aircraft and any pilot needs to be careful and methodical in
his approach to improving his aerobatic flying. I believe the judgement of
many pilots is based on "unknown circumstances" and it seems likely that many
don't appreciate the degree of risk involved in the manoeuvres they are attempting.
For example, in a normal erect spin a Yak 52 will lose 300 to 400 feet per turn.
If a spin develops in which the pitch attitude is less than 45 the height loss
will be less per turn, but the rotation rate will be higher and the recovery
may be more difficult and take longer.... Once the flat spin has fully developed
it can take up to four complete rotations for the recovery to be made...
stick forces on both elevator and rudder in order to move the stick forward and
to obtain opposite rudder can be extremely high requiring a great deal of strength...
this can give the impression of jammed controls if one is not used
to it and this can only be achieved through practise with an appropriate instructor.
Carl
brian(at)lloyd.com wrote:
> FWIW, the trainingsyllabusI use for transition training in the CJ6A is 10 hours:
5 on the ground and 5 in flight.
>
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=349447#349447
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Yak/CJ minimum requirements |
On Sun, Aug 14, 2011 at 4:48 PM, CD 2.0 <dbowie2007@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> I would be skeptical of any transition training consisting of just 5 hours
> of ground instruction and 5 hours of flying time in any aircraft... :)
>
Just a couple of points before you get carried away:
1. You have to put a stake in the ground somewhere but those numbers are
reasonable for a current, competent pilot.
2. My 10-hour syllabus is for CJ6A transition training, not Yak-52
transition training. Yak-52 transition training involves additional
exploration of spins and spin recovery. (Or should. Remember, the FAA
doesn't think we need to know how to spin an aircraft or recover from said
spin.)
3. The actual time required is going to be dependent on the capability of
the student.
4. If you pour hot coffee on yourself you may get burned.
5. If you repeatedly poke a dog with a stick, said dog may bite you.
6. If you drop a heavy object, it may strike your foot and cause pain or
injury.
7. On the Yak List it is necessary to state things that would otherwise
be intuitively obvious to a competent observer.
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Yak/CJ minimum requirements |
On Sun, Aug 14, 2011 at 5:07 PM, Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Sun, Aug 14, 2011 at 4:48 PM, CD 2.0 <dbowie2007@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> I would be skeptical of any transition training consisting of just 5 hours
>> of ground instruction and 5 hours of flying time in any aircraft... :)
>>
>
> Just a couple of points before you get carried away:
>
> 1. You have to put a stake in the ground somewhere but those numbers
> are reasonable for a current, competent pilot.
> 2. My 10-hour syllabus is for CJ6A transition training, not Yak-52
> transition training. Yak-52 transition training involves additional
> exploration of spins and spin recovery. (Or should. Remember, the FAA
> doesn't think we need to know how to spin an aircraft or recover from said
> spin.)
> 3. The actual time required is going to be dependent on the capability
> of the student.
> 4. If you pour hot coffee on yourself you may get burned.
> 5. If you repeatedly poke a dog with a stick, said dog may bite you.
> 6. If you drop a heavy object, it may strike your foot and cause pain
> or injury.
> 7. On the Yak List it is necessary to state things that would otherwise
> be intuitively obvious to a competent observer.
>
>
One more thing. If you ask, you will find people on this list who have been
through my 10-hour transition training course for the CJ6A. They can
probably comment as to the efficacy of my syllabus.
> --
> Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
> 3191 Western Dr.
> Cameron Park, CA 95682
> brian@lloyd.com
> +1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
> +1.916.877.5067 (USA)
>
>
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
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