Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:43 AM - Yak 52 Questions... (Rico Jaeger)
2. 06:36 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (A. Dennis Savarese)
3. 07:10 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
4. 07:23 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Rico Jaeger)
5. 07:43 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (A. Dennis Savarese)
6. 07:46 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (A. Dennis Savarese)
7. 07:54 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Roger Kemp MD)
8. 08:07 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Rico Jaeger)
9. 08:12 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
10. 08:16 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Richard Goode)
11. 08:21 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
12. 08:21 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Brian Lloyd)
13. 08:27 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
14. 08:33 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Didier Blouzard)
15. 08:40 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Donald & Marilyn Andrews)
16. 08:52 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Roger Kemp MD)
17. 08:54 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Roger Kemp MD)
18. 08:56 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Rico Jaeger)
19. 08:57 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Rico Jaeger)
20. 09:00 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
21. 09:03 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Roger Kemp MD)
22. 09:14 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
23. 09:31 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
24. 09:37 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (delfin)
25. 09:49 AM - DYNON (Jay Land)
26. 09:57 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Roger Kemp MD)
27. 10:14 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
28. 10:17 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Mark Davis)
29. 10:21 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Roger Kemp MD)
30. 10:21 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (kevin pilling)
31. 10:27 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
32. 10:31 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
33. 10:59 AM - Re: DYNON (Genzlinger, Reade)
34. 11:23 AM - Re: DYNON ()
35. 11:35 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Jan Mevis)
36. 11:57 AM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (A. Dennis Savarese)
37. 12:00 PM - Re: DYNON (Jay Land)
38. 12:02 PM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Roger Baker)
39. 01:16 PM - Re: DYNON (Roger Kemp MD)
40. 03:07 PM - Re: DYNON (Stephen Morrey)
41. 03:55 PM - Re: DYNON (Jay Land)
42. 06:27 PM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Brian Lloyd)
43. 07:06 PM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E)
44. 08:04 PM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... (cjpilot710@aol.com)
45. 09:17 PM - Re: DYNON ()
46. 09:19 PM - Re: Yak 52 Questions... ()
47. 10:01 PM - Re: DYNON (Stephen Morrey)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Hey, Guys!
1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
retraction cycles?
There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
...and THANK YOU!
Rico
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
Message 3
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
One additional comment:
The threaded bolts that go into these jack points are exactly the same as those
used on old Volkswagon wheels. A old trick that was passed on to me long ago.
Mark Bitterlich
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of A. Dennis Savarese
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 9:33 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33 AM
>>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one
on
each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting
and
extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this
Rico,
the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed
for any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> > retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> > *
> *
>
>
> *
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
Good point Mark. I've gone to the local Yak-Autozone or Yak-Advance
Auto Parts store or NAPA (National Aircraft Parts Association) store and
bought non-vehicle specific 14 mm wheel lugs and wheel nuts and made
jack points from them.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 9:04 AM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14
64E wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14
64E"<mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>
> One additional comment:
>
> The threaded bolts that go into these jack points are exactly the same as those
used on old Volkswagon wheels. A old trick that was passed on to me long ago.
>
> Mark Bitterlich
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of A. Dennis Savarese
> Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 9:33 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
>
>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
>> Hey, Guys!
>> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
>> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
>> retraction cycles?
>> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
>> ...and THANK YOU!
>> Rico
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially damaging?
How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33 AM
>>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres"
is. Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank
to the system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the
naive questions.
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 9:41 AM
>>>
th.net>
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed
for any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions
?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011
8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> > retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> > *
> *
>
>
> *
Message 9
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
A warning and explantion concerning test emergency gear blowdown is also probably
in order right now, just in case he, or anyone else decides to just "try it
out" while on jacks. Also procedures to reset it. Just a thought.
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of A. Dennis Savarese
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed
for any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> > retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> > *
> *
>
>
> *
Message 10
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
55 atm x 10 would be interesting!!
Richard
Richard Goode
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: 22 November 2011 15:52
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially damaging?
How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33 AM
>>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com
www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by <http://www.invictawiz.com/> Invictawiz MailScanner,
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Message 11
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
The normal air pressure for the system is 735 PSI which equates to 50 atmospheres.
Some debate here on nitpicking bars and atmospheres that I will avoid.
You have a gage in your cockpit which reads the normal bottle on the left and
the emergency bottle pressure on the right. It reads in single digits, like 1-7,
and you multiply that by 10 to get the actual reading. So when it reads 5,
that means 50 which means 50 atmospheres, which means .... 735 PSI.
Dennis has warned you not to run the bottle down to extremely low pressures because
if you do that, and then EXTEND the gear, it will come down fast and hard,
which is not the end of the world, but it is also not a really GOOD thing.
So, if you have the external air bottle connected, just use it to keep the pressure
gage in the cockpit reading between say 3-5. Be careful to fill the bottle
in the aircraft SLOWLY. So not just open everything wide open and let er
rip. Not good for a number of components, so avoid that.
Emergency blow-down is a whole different subject.
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres" is. Will
I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to the system?
I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive questions.
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 9:41 AM >>>
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed
for any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> > retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> -= November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Click href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/connbsp; -Matt Dralle, List sp; - The Yak-List Email Forum matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Lisp; - -Matt ========
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Rico Jaeger <rijaeger@wausau.k12.wi.us>wrote:
> OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres"
> is. Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to
> the system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive
> questions.
>
NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DO NOT USE OXYGEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF YOU USE O2 YOU COULD IGNITE THE OIL IN THE LINES!!!!!!!!
Normally one uses compressed air from a SCUBA tank. If that isn't
convenient you can use N2 (nitrogen). N2 is totally safe and eliminates any
chance of fire but can (under some conditions) make your engine hard to
start.
As for atmospheres, PSI, and kilograms force per square centimeter
(kgf/cm^2) here is the skinny:
1. The stock gauges read out in kgf/cm^2.
2. 1 kgf/cm^2 is very close to one atmosphere, enough so that, in this
case you can use them interchangeably.
3. 1 atmosphere = 15psi.
4. 50 kgf/cm^2 is approximately equal to 750psi.
Hopefully this helps.
I am beginning to get the feeling that you might want to find someone to
help you who has a bit more experience.
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
Message 13
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Over 8 THOUSAND PSI.
Kind of makes you wonder how he prescribes drugs to patients doesn't it?
NURSE, THIS MAN NEED 5 UNITS OF BLOOD. Times 10 of course! Sigh.....
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Richard Goode
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:13 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
55 atm x 10 would be interesting!!
Richard
Richard Goode
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: 22 November 2011 15:52
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially damaging? How
much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33 AM >>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com <http://www.buildersbooks.com/>
www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by Invictawiz MailScanner <http://www.invictawiz.com/> , and is
believed to be clean.
nnual List Fund Raiser. Click on
< find out more about
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
_bsp; --> http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
www.aeroelectric.com <http://www.aeroelectric.com/>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
NEVER USE OXYGEN IN THE AIR LINES.
There has been accidents using oxygen.
Scuba air is perfectly fine.
N2 is luxury
I tested retractation and air start with 15 bars and it works...but one
chance...not two !!!
Best regards
2011/11/22 Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com>
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Rico Jaeger <rijaeger@wausau.k12.wi.us>wrote:
>
>> OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres"
>> is. Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to
>> the system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive
>> questions.
>>
>
> NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> DO NOT USE OXYGEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> IF YOU USE O2 YOU COULD IGNITE THE OIL IN THE LINES!!!!!!!!
>
> Normally one uses compressed air from a SCUBA tank. If that isn't
> convenient you can use N2 (nitrogen). N2 is totally safe and eliminates any
> chance of fire but can (under some conditions) make your engine hard to
> start.
>
> As for atmospheres, PSI, and kilograms force per square centimeter
> (kgf/cm^2) here is the skinny:
>
> 1. The stock gauges read out in kgf/cm^2.
> 2. 1 kgf/cm^2 is very close to one atmosphere, enough so that, in this
> case you can use them interchangeably.
> 3. 1 atmosphere = 15psi.
> 4. 50 kgf/cm^2 is approximately equal to 750psi.
>
> Hopefully this helps.
>
> I am beginning to get the feeling that you might want to find someone to
> help you who has a bit more experience.
>
> --
> Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
> 3191 Western Dr.
> Cameron Park, CA 95682
> brian@lloyd.com
> +1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
> +1.916.877.5067 (USA)
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
____________________________
Didier BLOUZARD
Portable : +33 6 24 24 36 72
Email: didier.blouzard@gmail.com <didier.blouzard@anolistech.fr>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Thank God you monitor the Yak list, Brian thank you.
Don Andrews
_____
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Lloyd
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:20 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Rico Jaeger <rijaeger@wausau.k12.wi.us>
wrote:
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres" is.
Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to the
system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive
questions.
NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DO NOT USE OXYGEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF YOU USE O2 YOU COULD IGNITE THE OIL IN THE LINES!!!!!!!!
Normally one uses compressed air from a SCUBA tank. If that isn't convenient
you can use N2 (nitrogen). N2 is totally safe and eliminates any chance of
fire but can (under some conditions) make your engine hard to start.
As for atmospheres, PSI, and kilograms force per square centimeter
(kgf/cm^2) here is the skinny:
1. The stock gauges read out in kgf/cm^2.
2. 1 kgf/cm^2 is very close to one atmosphere, enough so that, in this
case you can use them interchangeably.
3. 1 atmosphere = 15psi.
4. 50 kgf/cm^2 is approximately equal to 750psi.
Hopefully this helps.
I am beginning to get the feeling that you might want to find someone to
help you who has a bit more experience.
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
Message 16
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
DO NOT PUT OXYGEN in the air system! UNLESS YOU WANT TO BE BLOWN UP IN A
Literal SINCE when you first start the plane!. Use compressed air only.
Nitrogen will work but will in most instances not start your engine when you
get to that point.
NO OXYGEN in the AIR TANKS! YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT!
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres" is.
Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to the
system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive
questions.
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 9:41 AM
>>>
<dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net>
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed
for any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> > retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> -= November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Click
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/connbs
p; -Matt Dralle, List sp; - The Yak-List Email
Forum
matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Lis
p; - -Matt ========
Message 17
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
I stand corrected. Meant 5.5 ATM X 10. Missed the decimal point!
The air gauge on the left lower side of the instrument panel is you air
pressure gauge. It is labeled in atmospheres (ATM).
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Goode
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:14 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
55 atm x 10 would be interesting!!
Richard
Richard Goode
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: 22 November 2011 15:52
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially damaging?
How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33 AM
>>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com
www.homebuilthelp.com
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Message 18
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Thanks for breaking that down, Mark. If you take it slowly enough, I'm
like novocaine - eventually I'll get it. :)
>>> "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich
@navy.mil> 11/22/2011 10:19 AM >>>
MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
The normal air pressure for the system is 735 PSI which equates to 50
atmospheres. Some debate here on nitpicking bars and atmospheres that I
will avoid. You have a gage in your cockpit which reads the normal
bottle on the left and the emergency bottle pressure on the right. It
reads in single digits, like 1-7, and you multiply that by 10 to get the
actual reading. So when it reads 5, that means 50 which means 50
atmospheres, which means .... 735 PSI.
Dennis has warned you not to run the bottle down to extremely low
pressures because if you do that, and then EXTEND the gear, it will come
down fast and hard, which is not the end of the world, but it is also not
a really GOOD thing. So, if you have the external air bottle connected,
just use it to keep the pressure gage in the cockpit reading between say
3-5. Be careful to fill the bottle in the aircraft SLOWLY. So not just
open everything wide open and let er rip. Not good for a number of
components, so avoid that.
Emergency blow-down is a whole different subject.
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres"
is. Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank
to the system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the
naive questions.
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 9:41 AM
>>>
th.net>
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed
for any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions
?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011
8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> > retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> -= November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Click href="http://www
.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/connbsp;
-Matt Dralle, List sp; - The Yak-List Email Forum matronics.c
om/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Lisp;
- -Matt ========
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
Um...that's why I'm "asking."
>>> Brian Lloyd <brian@lloyd.com> 11/22/2011 10:19 AM >>>
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Rico Jaeger <rijaeger@wausau.k12.wi.us>
wrote:
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres"
is. Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank
to the system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the
naive questions.
NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DO NOT USE OXYGEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF YOU USE O2 YOU COULD IGNITE THE OIL IN THE LINES!!!!!!!!
Normally one uses compressed air from a SCUBA tank. If that isn't
convenient you can use N2 (nitrogen). N2 is totally safe and eliminates
any chance of fire but can (under some conditions) make your engine hard
to start.
As for atmospheres, PSI, and kilograms force per square centimeter
(kgf/cm^2) here is the skinny:
The stock gauges read out in kgf/cm^2.
1 kgf/cm^2 is very close to one atmosphere, enough so that, in this case
you can use them interchangeably.
1 atmosphere = 15psi.
50 kgf/cm^2 is approximately equal to 750psi.
Hopefully this helps.
I am beginning to get the feeling that you might want to find someone to
help you who has a bit more experience.
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
==
Message 20
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
50 atmosphere equals 734.79 PSI to be exact. 14.695 is the conversion factor.
50 kgf/cm2 equals 711.17 PSI
Don't know how you came up with 750 PSI, But hey... you do tend to be exact so
I am mentioning it. Bottom line, Lower than 6 on the gage, and higher than
4 is a good thing more or less.
Damn right. Never pump pure oxygen into the airplanes pneumatic system. Sorry
we all missed that. Nice catch Brian.
I personally prefer nitrogen.... especially in the emergency air tank of the YAK-52.
That tank is NOT filled from the engine compressor and is ONLY filled from
the external fill port. Filling the emergency tank with nitrogen is 100%
overkill, but if you have it, use it. It will reduce corrosion.
I have heard about the problems with starting. I tend to disagree. The air start
system injects air into cylinders during the downward portion of the power
stroke on each cylinder it is feeding. Other cylinders are then in the intake
and compression strokes and are not really impacted. The lower three or four
cylinders are another matter and are PURGED to flow out oil during the starting
cycle. Regardless, I have used nitrogen many times in the MAIN bottle, and
if it was harder to start, I sure never noticed it.
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Brian Lloyd
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:19 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Rico Jaeger <rijaeger@wausau.k12.wi.us> wrote:
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres" is. Will
I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to the system?
I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive questions.
NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DO NOT USE OXYGEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF YOU USE O2 YOU COULD IGNITE THE OIL IN THE LINES!!!!!!!!
Normally one uses compressed air from a SCUBA tank. If that isn't convenient you
can use N2 (nitrogen). N2 is totally safe and eliminates any chance of fire
but can (under some conditions) make your engine hard to start.
As for atmospheres, PSI, and kilograms force per square centimeter (kgf/cm^2) here
is the skinny:
1. The stock gauges read out in kgf/cm^2.
2. 1
3.
4. is very close to one atmosphere, enough so that, in this case you can use them
interchangeably.
5. 1 atmosphere = 15psi.
6. 50 kgf/cm^2 is approximately equal to 750psi.
Hopefully this helps.
I am beginning to get the feeling that you might want to find someone to help you
who has a bit more experience.
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
Message 21
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
A little Forane, a little Nitrous with 2 X's the O2, a little Versed, a
little Fentanyl, and a wallop of Porpofol to start! Of course a slug of
Norcuron so you will be still while we cut and Wallah...you have anesthesia!
BP goes up...a little more Forane...BP goes down...a little less Forane. Of
course all with care to follow the volume in the tank. That's where a hooter
hose and a big bore IV come in handy. Ringer's and Lasix can fix most volume
problems that decreasing the Forane does not. Once out of the PACU...you
are the surgeon's problem!
:^))
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:23 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Over 8 THOUSAND PSI.
Kind of makes you wonder how he prescribes drugs to patients doesn't it?
NURSE, THIS MAN NEED 5 UNITS OF BLOOD. Times 10 of course! Sigh.....
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Richard Goode
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:13 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
55 atm x 10 would be interesting!!
Richard
Richard Goode
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: 22 November 2011 15:52
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially damaging?
How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
>>> AM >>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main gear
legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling attaches.
They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've attached a photo of
the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on each side of the cowl.
BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the nose wheel fork has to clear
the jack AND the ground when retracting and extending. Use a 3-legged jack
for the nose wheel and make absolutely certain the wheel assembly will clear
the legs of the jack before you swing the gear. Also, make absolutely
certain the nose tire will clear the ground during the swing up and down.
Measure from the pivot axle bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through
the wheel axle to below the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make
sure the wheel clears the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the
nose wheel touches the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push
the airplane off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico, the
lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the gear will
slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The reason being -
the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock absorber" on the opposite
side of the actuator. ie: when doing a retraction, the air pressure in the
DOWN side of the actuator is expelled from the actuator as the gear is
moving to the UP position and vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam
when the air pressure is low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to
the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com <http://www.buildersbooks.com/> www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
--
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Message 22
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Rico, did anyone mention oxygen is not a good thing?
Just wondering if you needed further advice. :-)
Lots of urban legends on the YAK list. For example, I am now going to pick on
Doc some more since it is a hobby of mine on occasion.
Doc, when was the last time you personally filled your main air bottle with nitrogen
and then tried to start it? I mean personally, not a story from others.
I don't know what the heck the deal is with this, but I have now used nitrogen
on three M-14's and they started easily. One in a YAK-50, one in a YAK-52,
and one in a Sukhoi 31.
The reason I bring this up (again) is that most airports don't even keep nitrogen
at that kind of pressure handy. Compressed air, yes. Dry pumped nitrogen,
no. At New Bern NC, I am the ONLY person with it. Including all the shops on
the field.
Personally, if I am not going to fly the YAK for awhile, I purge all the air systems
with nitrogen and then fill them tippee top. Never had a problem what-so-ever.
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:49 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
DO NOT PUT OXYGEN in the air system! UNLESS YOU WANT TO BE BLOWN UP IN A Literal
SINCE when you first start the plane!. Use compressed air only. Nitrogen will
work but will in most instances not start your engine when you get to that point.
NO OXYGEN in the AIR TANKS! YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT!
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres" is. Will
I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to the system?
I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive questions.
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 9:41 AM >>>
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed
for any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> > retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> -= November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Click href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/connbsp; -Matt Dralle, List sp; - The Yak-List Email Forum matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Lisp; - -Matt ========
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com <http://www.buildersbooks.com/>
www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
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Message 23
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
That's the freaking Air Force for ya. In the Marines, we just use a hammer. Different
sizes for different applications of course.
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 12:01 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
A little Forane, a little Nitrous with 2 X's the O2, a little Versed, a
little Fentanyl, and a wallop of Porpofol to start! Of course a slug of
Norcuron so you will be still while we cut and Wallah...you have anesthesia!
BP goes up...a little more Forane...BP goes down...a little less Forane. Of
course all with care to follow the volume in the tank. That's where a hooter
hose and a big bore IV come in handy. Ringer's and Lasix can fix most volume
problems that decreasing the Forane does not. Once out of the PACU...you
are the surgeon's problem!
:^))
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:23 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Over 8 THOUSAND PSI.
Kind of makes you wonder how he prescribes drugs to patients doesn't it?
NURSE, THIS MAN NEED 5 UNITS OF BLOOD. Times 10 of course! Sigh.....
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Richard Goode
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:13 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
55 atm x 10 would be interesting!!
Richard
Richard Goode
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: 22 November 2011 15:52
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially damaging?
How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
>>> AM >>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main gear
legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling attaches.
They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've attached a photo of
the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on each side of the cowl.
BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the nose wheel fork has to clear
the jack AND the ground when retracting and extending. Use a 3-legged jack
for the nose wheel and make absolutely certain the wheel assembly will clear
the legs of the jack before you swing the gear. Also, make absolutely
certain the nose tire will clear the ground during the swing up and down.
Measure from the pivot axle bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through
the wheel axle to below the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make
sure the wheel clears the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the
nose wheel touches the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push
the airplane off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico, the
lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the gear will
slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The reason being -
the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock absorber" on the opposite
side of the actuator. ie: when doing a retraction, the air pressure in the
DOWN side of the actuator is expelled from the actuator as the gear is
moving to the UP position and vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam
when the air pressure is low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to
the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com <http://www.buildersbooks.com/> www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A Is there somewhere to ob
tain a complete list of Aerostar total to date production of the yak-52 wit
h serial number.- thanks=0A
Message 25
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Does anyone have the Dynon Autopilot on their CJ or Yak?
Thanks, Jay
Message 26
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Yeah and most airports don't have Sharader valve adapters either. That is
why when I go XC (rarely these days) I carry a pony bottle along with my
Stage I SCUBA tank adapter/ refill setup. I can always get air from a Dive
shop or a fire station. Never had to yet to date. Maybe it is good
maintenance or just plain blind luck. As for using N2 to start or fill my
tanks with...have not even given it a thought. The O2 in the tank
...definately thought about that but have not tried that either. Figure 50
ATM of O2 fired off would be a bit more schrapnell than my ol body could
survive.
So answer...Compress Air Yes,
Nitrogen - No,
Oxygen - Not NO BUT HELL NO! I am making
nominations for the next Darwin Awards if there are any takers/experimenters
wanting
to try?!!
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:12 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Rico, did anyone mention oxygen is not a good thing?
Just wondering if you needed further advice. :-)
Lots of urban legends on the YAK list. For example, I am now going to pick
on Doc some more since it is a hobby of mine on occasion.
Doc, when was the last time you personally filled your main air bottle with
nitrogen and then tried to start it? I mean personally, not a story from
others. I don't know what the heck the deal is with this, but I have now
used nitrogen on three M-14's and they started easily. One in a YAK-50, one
in a YAK-52, and one in a Sukhoi 31.
The reason I bring this up (again) is that most airports don't even keep
nitrogen at that kind of pressure handy. Compressed air, yes. Dry pumped
nitrogen, no. At New Bern NC, I am the ONLY person with it. Including all
the shops on the field.
Personally, if I am not going to fly the YAK for awhile, I purge all the air
systems with nitrogen and then fill them tippee top. Never had a problem
what-so-ever.
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:49 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
DO NOT PUT OXYGEN in the air system! UNLESS YOU WANT TO BE BLOWN UP IN A
Literal SINCE when you first start the plane!. Use compressed air only.
Nitrogen will work but will in most instances not start your engine when you
get to that point.
NO OXYGEN in the AIR TANKS! YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT!
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres" is.
Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to the
system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive
questions.
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 9:41
>>> AM >>>
--> <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net>
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed for
any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one
> on each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because
> the nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when
> retracting and extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and
> make absolutely certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the
> jack before you swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the
> nose tire will clear the ground during the swing up and down. Measure
> from the pivot axle bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the
> wheel axle to below the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make
> sure the wheel clears the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if
> the nose wheel touches the ground in any way during the retraction, it
> will push the airplane off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real
mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this
> Rico, the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the
> harder the gear will slam into place when doing retractions and
> extensions. The reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts
> as a "shock absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when
> doing a retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator
> is expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position
> and vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure
> is low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for
> > multiple retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> -= November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Click
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/connbs
p; -Matt Dralle, List sp; - The Yak-List Email
Forum
matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Lis
p; - -Matt ========
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com <http://www.buildersbooks.com/> www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com
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Message 27
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Of course when you fly in your handy-dandy F-16 Fighting Falcon, nitrogen is all
they use.
Hmmm.
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 12:53 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
Yeah and most airports don't have Sharader valve adapters either. That is
why when I go XC (rarely these days) I carry a pony bottle along with my
Stage I SCUBA tank adapter/ refill setup. I can always get air from a Dive
shop or a fire station. Never had to yet to date. Maybe it is good
maintenance or just plain blind luck. As for using N2 to start or fill my
tanks with...have not even given it a thought. The O2 in the tank
...definately thought about that but have not tried that either. Figure 50
ATM of O2 fired off would be a bit more schrapnell than my ol body could
survive.
So answer...Compress Air Yes,
Nitrogen - No,
Oxygen - Not NO BUT HELL NO! I am making
nominations for the next Darwin Awards if there are any takers/experimenters
wanting
to try?!!
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:12 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Rico, did anyone mention oxygen is not a good thing?
Just wondering if you needed further advice. :-)
Lots of urban legends on the YAK list. For example, I am now going to pick
on Doc some more since it is a hobby of mine on occasion.
Doc, when was the last time you personally filled your main air bottle with
nitrogen and then tried to start it? I mean personally, not a story from
others. I don't know what the heck the deal is with this, but I have now
used nitrogen on three M-14's and they started easily. One in a YAK-50, one
in a YAK-52, and one in a Sukhoi 31.
The reason I bring this up (again) is that most airports don't even keep
nitrogen at that kind of pressure handy. Compressed air, yes. Dry pumped
nitrogen, no. At New Bern NC, I am the ONLY person with it. Including all
the shops on the field.
Personally, if I am not going to fly the YAK for awhile, I purge all the air
systems with nitrogen and then fill them tippee top. Never had a problem
what-so-ever.
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:49 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
DO NOT PUT OXYGEN in the air system! UNLESS YOU WANT TO BE BLOWN UP IN A
Literal SINCE when you first start the plane!. Use compressed air only.
Nitrogen will work but will in most instances not start your engine when you
get to that point.
NO OXYGEN in the AIR TANKS! YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT!
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres" is.
Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to the
system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive
questions.
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 9:41
>>> AM >>>
--> <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net>
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed for
any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one
> on each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because
> the nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when
> retracting and extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and
> make absolutely certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the
> jack before you swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the
> nose tire will clear the ground during the swing up and down. Measure
> from the pivot axle bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the
> wheel axle to below the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make
> sure the wheel clears the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if
> the nose wheel touches the ground in any way during the retraction, it
> will push the airplane off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real
mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this
> Rico, the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the
> harder the gear will slam into place when doing retractions and
> extensions. The reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts
> as a "shock absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when
> doing a retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator
> is expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position
> and vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure
> is low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for
> > multiple retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> -= November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Click
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/connbs
p; -Matt Dralle, List sp; - The Yak-List Email
Forum
matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Lis
p; - -Matt ========
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com <http://www.buildersbooks.com/> www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
Mark,
I've never noticed any difference starting after charging the system
with nitrogen. The first time I started it with a pure nitrogen charge, I
pulled it through, then primed it, then pulled a couple more blades to pull
the fuel charge into the cylinders. It started as usual on the first
compression stroke before it had time to get the nitrogen into a cylinder
through the start valve. Even if it would start harder keep in mind that
every cycle of the gear, flaps or brakes decreasing the blend of nitrogen to
air as the air compressor replenishes the system.
Mark Davis
N44YK
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E"
<mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:57 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
> MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>
> 50 atmosphere equals 734.79 PSI to be exact. 14.695 is the conversion
> factor.
>
> 50 kgf/cm2 equals 711.17 PSI
>
> Don't know how you came up with 750 PSI, But hey... you do tend to be
> exact so I am mentioning it. Bottom line, Lower than 6 on the gage, and
> higher than 4 is a good thing more or less.
>
> Damn right. Never pump pure oxygen into the airplanes pneumatic system.
> Sorry we all missed that. Nice catch Brian.
>
> I personally prefer nitrogen.... especially in the emergency air tank of
> the YAK-52. That tank is NOT filled from the engine compressor and is
> ONLY filled from the external fill port. Filling the emergency tank with
> nitrogen is 100% overkill, but if you have it, use it. It will reduce
> corrosion.
>
> I have heard about the problems with starting. I tend to disagree. The
> air start system injects air into cylinders during the downward portion of
> the power stroke on each cylinder it is feeding. Other cylinders are then
> in the intake and compression strokes and are not really impacted. The
> lower three or four cylinders are another matter and are PURGED to flow
> out oil during the starting cycle. Regardless, I have used nitrogen many
> times in the MAIN bottle, and if it was harder to start, I sure never
> noticed it.
>
>
> Mark
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Brian Lloyd
> Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:19 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Rico Jaeger <rijaeger@wausau.k12.wi.us>
> wrote:
>
>
> OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres"
> is. Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank
> to the system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the
> naive questions.
>
>
> NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> DO NOT USE OXYGEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> IF YOU USE O2 YOU COULD IGNITE THE OIL IN THE LINES!!!!!!!!
>
> Normally one uses compressed air from a SCUBA tank. If that isn't
> convenient you can use N2 (nitrogen). N2 is totally safe and eliminates
> any chance of fire but can (under some conditions) make your engine hard
> to start.
>
> As for atmospheres, PSI, and kilograms force per square centimeter
> (kgf/cm^2) here is the skinny:
>
> 1. The stock gauges read out in kgf/cm^2.
> 2. 1
> 3.
> 4. is very close to one atmosphere, enough so that, in this case you can
> use them interchangeably.
> 5. 1 atmosphere = 15psi.
> 6. 50 kgf/cm^2 is approximately equal to 750psi.
>
> Hopefully this helps.
>
> I am beginning to get the feeling that you might want to find someone to
> help you who has a bit more experience.
>
> --
> Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
> 3191 Western Dr.
> Cameron Park, CA 95682
> brian@lloyd.com
> +1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
> +1.916.877.5067 (USA)
>
>
>
Message 29
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
The Marines may like the knots on their heads and the headaches when they
wake up but the rest of the population of patient's don't like to pay for
brutan anesthesia. Understand the Marine thing though and we will do
everything we can to make the ride lumpy! :^))
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:25 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
That's the freaking Air Force for ya. In the Marines, we just use a hammer.
Different sizes for different applications of course.
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 12:01 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> <viperdoc@mindspring.com>
A little Forane, a little Nitrous with 2 X's the O2, a little Versed, a
little Fentanyl, and a wallop of Porpofol to start! Of course a slug of
Norcuron so you will be still while we cut and Wallah...you have anesthesia!
BP goes up...a little more Forane...BP goes down...a little less Forane. Of
course all with care to follow the volume in the tank. That's where a hooter
hose and a big bore IV come in handy. Ringer's and Lasix can fix most volume
problems that decreasing the Forane does not. Once out of the PACU...you
are the surgeon's problem!
:^))
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:23 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Over 8 THOUSAND PSI.
Kind of makes you wonder how he prescribes drugs to patients doesn't it?
NURSE, THIS MAN NEED 5 UNITS OF BLOOD. Times 10 of course! Sigh.....
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Richard Goode
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:13 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
55 atm x 10 would be interesting!!
Richard
Richard Goode
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: 22 November 2011 15:52
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially damaging?
How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
>>> AM >>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main gear
legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling attaches.
They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've attached a photo of
the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on each side of the cowl.
BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the nose wheel fork has to clear
the jack AND the ground when retracting and extending. Use a 3-legged jack
for the nose wheel and make absolutely certain the wheel assembly will clear
the legs of the jack before you swing the gear. Also, make absolutely
certain the nose tire will clear the ground during the swing up and down.
Measure from the pivot axle bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through
the wheel axle to below the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make
sure the wheel clears the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the
nose wheel touches the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push
the airplane off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico, the
lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the gear will
slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The reason being -
the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock absorber" on the opposite
side of the actuator. ie: when doing a retraction, the air pressure in the
DOWN side of the actuator is expelled from the actuator as the gear is
moving to the UP position and vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam
when the air pressure is low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to
the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com <http://www.buildersbooks.com/> www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
If you use oxygen rather than air you could well blow the U/C off the
aircraft.
DONT USE OXYGEN
Use only inert nitrogen or air.
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: 22 November 2011 16:04
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres" is.
Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to the
system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive
questions.
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 9:41 AM
>>>
<dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net>
More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed
for any retraction.
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>
>
> >>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
> AM >>>
> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>
> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> > Hey, Guys!
> > 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> > 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> > retraction cycles?
> > There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> > ...and THANK YOU!
> > Rico
> > *
> >
> >
> -= November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Click
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/connbs
p; -Matt Dralle, List sp; - The Yak-List Email
Forum
matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Lis
p; - -Matt ========
Message 31
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
I totally agree.
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Mark Davis
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 1:14 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
Mark,
I've never noticed any difference starting after charging the system
with nitrogen. The first time I started it with a pure nitrogen charge, I
pulled it through, then primed it, then pulled a couple more blades to pull
the fuel charge into the cylinders. It started as usual on the first
compression stroke before it had time to get the nitrogen into a cylinder
through the start valve. Even if it would start harder keep in mind that
every cycle of the gear, flaps or brakes decreasing the blend of nitrogen to
air as the air compressor replenishes the system.
Mark Davis
N44YK
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E"
<mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:57 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
> MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>
> 50 atmosphere equals 734.79 PSI to be exact. 14.695 is the conversion
> factor.
>
> 50 kgf/cm2 equals 711.17 PSI
>
> Don't know how you came up with 750 PSI, But hey... you do tend to be
> exact so I am mentioning it. Bottom line, Lower than 6 on the gage, and
> higher than 4 is a good thing more or less.
>
> Damn right. Never pump pure oxygen into the airplanes pneumatic system.
> Sorry we all missed that. Nice catch Brian.
>
> I personally prefer nitrogen.... especially in the emergency air tank of
> the YAK-52. That tank is NOT filled from the engine compressor and is
> ONLY filled from the external fill port. Filling the emergency tank with
> nitrogen is 100% overkill, but if you have it, use it. It will reduce
> corrosion.
>
> I have heard about the problems with starting. I tend to disagree. The
> air start system injects air into cylinders during the downward portion of
> the power stroke on each cylinder it is feeding. Other cylinders are then
> in the intake and compression strokes and are not really impacted. The
> lower three or four cylinders are another matter and are PURGED to flow
> out oil during the starting cycle. Regardless, I have used nitrogen many
> times in the MAIN bottle, and if it was harder to start, I sure never
> noticed it.
>
>
> Mark
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Brian Lloyd
> Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:19 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Rico Jaeger <rijaeger@wausau.k12.wi.us>
> wrote:
>
>
> OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres"
> is. Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank
> to the system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the
> naive questions.
>
>
> NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> DO NOT USE OXYGEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> IF YOU USE O2 YOU COULD IGNITE THE OIL IN THE LINES!!!!!!!!
>
> Normally one uses compressed air from a SCUBA tank. If that isn't
> convenient you can use N2 (nitrogen). N2 is totally safe and eliminates
> any chance of fire but can (under some conditions) make your engine hard
> to start.
>
> As for atmospheres, PSI, and kilograms force per square centimeter
> (kgf/cm^2) here is the skinny:
>
> 1. The stock gauges read out in kgf/cm^2.
> 2. 1
> 3.
> 4. is very close to one atmosphere, enough so that, in this case you can
> use them interchangeably.
> 5. 1 atmosphere = 15psi.
> 6. 50 kgf/cm^2 is approximately equal to 750psi.
>
> Hopefully this helps.
>
> I am beginning to get the feeling that you might want to find someone to
> help you who has a bit more experience.
>
> --
> Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
> 3191 Western Dr.
> Cameron Park, CA 95682
> brian@lloyd.com
> +1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
> +1.916.877.5067 (USA)
>
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Roger that. :-)
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 1:19 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
The Marines may like the knots on their heads and the headaches when they
wake up but the rest of the population of patient's don't like to pay for
brutan anesthesia. Understand the Marine thing though and we will do
everything we can to make the ride lumpy! :^))
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:25 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
That's the freaking Air Force for ya. In the Marines, we just use a hammer.
Different sizes for different applications of course.
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 12:01 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> <viperdoc@mindspring.com>
A little Forane, a little Nitrous with 2 X's the O2, a little Versed, a
little Fentanyl, and a wallop of Porpofol to start! Of course a slug of
Norcuron so you will be still while we cut and Wallah...you have anesthesia!
BP goes up...a little more Forane...BP goes down...a little less Forane. Of
course all with care to follow the volume in the tank. That's where a hooter
hose and a big bore IV come in handy. Ringer's and Lasix can fix most volume
problems that decreasing the Forane does not. Once out of the PACU...you
are the surgeon's problem!
:^))
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:23 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Over 8 THOUSAND PSI.
Kind of makes you wonder how he prescribes drugs to patients doesn't it?
NURSE, THIS MAN NEED 5 UNITS OF BLOOD. Times 10 of course! Sigh.....
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Richard Goode
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:13 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
55 atm x 10 would be interesting!!
Richard
Richard Goode
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: 22 November 2011 15:52
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially damaging?
How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
>>> AM >>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main gear
legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling attaches.
They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've attached a photo of
the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on each side of the cowl.
BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the nose wheel fork has to clear
the jack AND the ground when retracting and extending. Use a 3-legged jack
for the nose wheel and make absolutely certain the wheel assembly will clear
the legs of the jack before you swing the gear. Also, make absolutely
certain the nose tire will clear the ground during the swing up and down.
Measure from the pivot axle bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through
the wheel axle to below the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make
sure the wheel clears the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the
nose wheel touches the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push
the airplane off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico, the
lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the gear will
slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The reason being -
the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock absorber" on the opposite
side of the actuator. ie: when doing a retraction, the air pressure in the
DOWN side of the actuator is expelled from the actuator as the gear is
moving to the UP position and vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam
when the air pressure is low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to
the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com <http://www.buildersbooks.com/> www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com/> <http://forums.matronics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
--
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<http://forums.matronics.com/> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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Message 33
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Jay:
I have a 52 TD that the former owner tricked out with a Dynon D-100, 430
and a TruTrak Digi-Flight II auto pilot. They are all linked which is
total overkill in a 52 but very sweet when flying from Wyoming to PA and
back!!
It all has worked quite well in the 2.5 years I've had the TD. I've had
a stock 52 since 1996 and its been across the US 3 times - all I can
say now is that I'm totally spoiled with the TruTrak. The Dynon
autopilot was not on the market when the D-100 was installed.
Reade Genzlinger
Cairnwood Cooperative Corp.
215.914.0370
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Land
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 12:47 PM
Subject: Yak-List: DYNON
Does anyone have the Dynon Autopilot on their CJ or Yak?
Thanks, Jay
Message 34
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I have the Dynon SkyView system with 3 screens and the auto pilot. great
system.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Land
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 12:47 PM
Subject: Yak-List: DYNON
Does anyone have the Dynon Autopilot on their CJ or Yak?
Thanks, Jay
Message 35
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
We recently had a Yak 52 that was charged with pure oxygen ... the owner
survived the shrapnell .after the explosion, the plane looked as if one
fired upon it with a machine gun ..
Jan
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Lloyd
Sent: dinsdag 22 november 2011 17:20
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Rico Jaeger <rijaeger@wausau.k12.wi.us>
wrote:
OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25 atmospheres" is.
Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a welding oxygen tank to the
system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you - and so sorry for the naive
questions.
NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DO NOT USE OXYGEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF YOU USE O2 YOU COULD IGNITE THE OIL IN THE LINES!!!!!!!!
Normally one uses compressed air from a SCUBA tank. If that isn't convenient
you can use N2 (nitrogen). N2 is totally safe and eliminates any chance of
fire but can (under some conditions) make your engine hard to start.
As for atmospheres, PSI, and kilograms force per square centimeter
(kgf/cm^2) here is the skinny:
1. The stock gauges read out in kgf/cm^2.
2. 1 kgf/cm^2 is very close to one atmosphere, enough so that, in this
case you can use them interchangeably.
3. 1 atmosphere = 15psi.
4. 50 kgf/cm^2 is approximately equal to 750psi.
Hopefully this helps.
I am beginning to get the feeling that you might want to find someone to
help you who has a bit more experience.
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
Message 36
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|
| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
If anyone wants a gear retraction/extension procedure including the
emergency gear extension procedure that will not shake the airplane off
the jacks, please go to my web site,
http://www.yak-52.com/maintena.htm#Gear Retraction / Extension Test
Procedure
<http://www.yak-52.com/maintena.htm#Gear%20Retraction%20/%20Extension%20Test%20Procedure>
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com
On 11/22/2011 10:08 AM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14
64E wrote:
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14
64E"<mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>
> A warning and explantion concerning test emergency gear blowdown is also probably
in order right now, just in case he, or anyone else decides to just "try
it out" while on jacks. Also procedures to reset it. Just a thought.
>
> Mark
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of A. Dennis Savarese
> Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 10:41 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
>
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese"<dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net>
>
> More undesirable than damaging because it shakes the heck out of the
> airplane while on the jacks. Air pressure? I think I already answered
> that. On an average of all 52's a minimum of 25 ATM's will be needed
> for any retraction.
>
> A. Dennis Savarese
> 334-285-6263
> 334-546-8182 (cell)
> Skype: Yakguy1
> www.yak-52.com
>
>
> On 11/22/2011 9:20 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
>> OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
>> damaging? How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>
>>
>>>>> "A. Dennis Savarese"<dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
>> AM>>>
>> You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main
>> gear legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling
>> attaches. They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've
>> attached a photo of the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on
>> each side of the cowl. BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the
>> nose wheel fork has to clear the jack AND the ground when retracting and
>> extending. Use a 3-legged jack for the nose wheel and make absolutely
>> certain the wheel assembly will clear the legs of the jack before you
>> swing the gear. Also, make absolutely certain the nose tire will clear
>> the ground during the swing up and down. Measure from the pivot axle
>> bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through the wheel axle to below
>> the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make sure the wheel clears
>> the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the nose wheel touches
>> the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push the airplane
>> off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
>>
>> Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
>> difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
>> the lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the
>> gear will slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The
>> reason being - the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock
>> absorber" on the opposite side of the actuator. ie: when doing a
>> retraction, the air pressure in the DOWN side of the actuator is
>> expelled from the actuator as the gear is moving to the UP position and
>> vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam when the air pressure is
>> low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to the DOWN position.
>>
>> Dennis
>>
>>
>> A. Dennis Savarese
>> 334-285-6263
>> 334-546-8182 (cell)
>> Skype: Yakguy1
>> www.yak-52.com
>>
>>
>> On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
>>> Hey, Guys!
>>> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
>>> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
>>> retraction cycles?
>>> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
>>> ...and THANK YOU!
>>> Rico
>>> *
>>>
>>>
>>> *
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>
>
Message 37
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Which Dynon servos did you use? Anything special about the autopilot
install?
I am just looking at a D10A to replace Horizon and thinking about the
autopilot at the same time as its not much more money.
Some reviews out there in RV6 land that say the Dynon has some heading and
altitude holding issues at times?
Thanks,
Jay
On 11/22/11 2:17 PM, "dabear@devere.us" <dabear@devere.us> wrote:
> I have the Dynon SkyView system with 3 screens and the auto pilot=8A great
> system.
>
> Bear
>
>
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Land
> Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 12:47 PM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: DYNON
>
> Does anyone have the Dynon Autopilot on their CJ or Yak?
>
> Thanks, Jay
>
>
>
> <http://www.buildersbooks.com>
om>
>
>
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
Pictures??
Roger_____________________________________________________________________
______________
On Nov 22, 2011, at 11:32 AM, Jan Mevis wrote:
> We recently had a Yak 52 that was charged with pure oxygen ... the
owner survived the shrapnell =85after the explosion, the plane looked as
if one fired upon it with a machine gun =85.
>
> Jan
>
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Lloyd
> Sent: dinsdag 22 november 2011 17:20
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
>
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Rico Jaeger
<rijaeger@wausau.k12.wi.us> wrote:
> OK, being a complete novice here...I have no idea what "25
atmospheres" is. Will I know how to achieve that when I hook up a
welding oxygen tank to the system? I've only dealt w/ PSI. Thank you -
and so sorry for the naive questions.
>
> NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> DO NOT USE OXYGEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> IF YOU USE O2 YOU COULD IGNITE THE OIL IN THE LINES!!!!!!!!
>
> Normally one uses compressed air from a SCUBA tank. If that isn't
convenient you can use N2 (nitrogen). N2 is totally safe and eliminates
any chance of fire but can (under some conditions) make your engine hard
to start.
>
> As for atmospheres, PSI, and kilograms force per square centimeter
(kgf/cm^2) here is the skinny:
> The stock gauges read out in kgf/cm^2.
> 1 kgf/cm^2 is very close to one atmosphere, enough so that, in this
case you can use them interchangeably.
> 1 atmosphere = 15psi.
> 50 kgf/cm^2 is approximately equal to 750psi.
> Hopefully this helps.
>
> I am beginning to get the feeling that you might want to find someone
to help you who has a bit more experience.
>
> --
> Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
> 3191 Western Dr.
> Cameron Park, CA 95682
> brian@lloyd.com
> +1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
> +1.916.877.5067 (USA)
>
>
>
> www.aeroelectric.com
> www.buildersbooks.com
> www.homebuilthelp.com
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
> http://forums.matronics.com
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
>
>
Roger E. Baker, Managing Director
Panadero Energy Components, LLC
dba PEC AirAssist
760/809-5506
760/730-9244
760/454-4595 fax
f4ffm2@roadrunner.com
Message 39
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Jay,
I have a D10 in my 50. Without the RMG there were heading issues. There is
too much electromagnetic activity under that glare shield for the internal
compass to compensate. When I moved it to a remote place, it has not been a
problem after I swung it. I have not installed the auto pilot fxn.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Land
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 1:58 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: DYNON
Which Dynon servos did you use? Anything special about the autopilot
install?
I am just looking at a D10A to replace Horizon and thinking about the
autopilot at the same time as its not much more money.
Some reviews out there in RV6 land that say the Dynon has some heading and
altitude holding issues at times?
Thanks,
Jay
On 11/22/11 2:17 PM, "dabear@devere.us" <dabear@devere.us> wrote:
I have the Dynon SkyView system with 3 screens and the auto pilot. great
system.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Land
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 12:47 PM
Subject: Yak-List: DYNON
Does anyone have the Dynon Autopilot on their CJ or Yak?
Thanks, Jay
onth --
me AWESOME FREE Gifts!)
="http://www.aeroelectric.com">http://www.aeroelectric.com>
<http://www.buildersbooks.com>
ef="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">http://www.homebuilthelp.com>
://www.matronics.com/contribution
; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
ail Forum -
">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
matronics.com
;- List Contribution Web Site -
; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 40
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yes I do. works great
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 12:46 PM, Jay Land <jland@popeandland.com> wrote:
> Does anyone have the Dynon Autopilot on their CJ or Yak?
>
> Thanks, Jay
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 41
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Which servos did you use? Anything difficult in the installation?
Do you have any pictures of the servo installation?
Thanks!
Jay
On 11/22/11 6:04 PM, "Stephen Morrey" <stephenmorrey@gmail.com> wrote:
> yes I do. -works great-
>
> On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 12:46 PM, Jay Land <jland@popeandland.com> wrote:
>> Does anyone have the Dynon Autopilot on their CJ or Yak?
>>
>> Thanks, Jay
>>
>>
>>
>> _blank">www.aeroelectric.com <mailto:jland@popeandland.com>
>> .com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com <mailto:jland@popeandland.co
m>
>> ="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com <mailto:jland@popeandland.com>
> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <mailto:jland@popeandland.c
om>
> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
> <mailto:jland@popeandland.com>
> tp://forums.matronics.com <mailto:jland@popeandland.com>
> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <mailto:jland@popeandland.c
om>
>
>
>
>
> <http://www.buildersbooks.com>
om>
>
>
Message 42
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:19 AM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point,
MALS-14 64E <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil> wrote:
> MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>
> The normal air pressure for the system is 735 PSI which equates to 50
> atmospheres. Some debate here on nitpicking bars and atmospheres that I
> will avoid.
Bars are atmospheres ... or were. Later they decided that one standard
atmosphere was 1.0132 Bar. But the Bar was intended to be a standard
atmosphere. I doubt anyone's gauge has the necessary 1% accuracy to make
the difference significant tho'.
> You have a gage in your cockpit which reads the normal bottle on the left
> and the emergency bottle pressure on the right. It reads in single digits,
> like 1-7, and you multiply that by 10 to get the actual reading. So when
> it reads 5, that means 50 which means 50 atmospheres, which means .... 735
> PSI.
>
I am going to get nit-picky here. The gauges in the Yak and CJ are
calibrated in kilograms of force per square cm (kgF/cm^2) not Bar and not
Atmospheres. Again, the measurement is really close, with 1 Bar = 1.0197
kgF/cm^2 so all these are within 1% of each other making the difference
inconsequential for our uses. And it is close enough to use 1 ATM = 1 BAR
1 kgF/cm2 = 15psi.
But the official measurement is 1kgF/cm^2. :-)
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
Message 43
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Sigh ....
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Brian Lloyd
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 9:24 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 8:19 AM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14
64E <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil> wrote:
The normal air pressure for the system is 735 PSI which equates to 50 atmospheres.
Some debate here on nitpicking bars and atmospheres that I will avoid.
Bars are atmospheres ... or were. Later they decided that one standard atmosphere
was 1.0132 Bar. But the Bar was intended to be a standard atmosphere. I doubt
anyone's gauge has the necessary 1% accuracy to make the difference significant
tho'.
You have a gage in your cockpit which reads the normal bottle on the left and
the emergency bottle pressure on the right. It reads in single digits, like 1-7,
and you multiply that by 10 to get the actual reading. So when it reads 5,
that means 50 which means 50 atmospheres, which means .... 735 PSI.
I am going to get nit-picky here. The gauges in the Yak and CJ are calibrated in
kilograms of force per square cm (kgF/cm^2) not Bar and not Atmospheres. Again,
the measurement is really close, with 1 Bar = 1.0197 kgF/cm^2 so all these
are within 1% of each other making the difference inconsequential for our uses.
And it is close enough to use 1 ATM = 1 BAR = 1 kgF/cm2 = 15psi.
But the official measurement is 1kgF/cm^2. :-)
--
Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL
3191 Western Dr.
Cameron Park, CA 95682
brian@lloyd.com
+1.767.617.1365 (Dominica)
+1.916.877.5067 (USA)
Message 44
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| Subject: | Re: Yak 52 Questions... |
One I started passing a kidney stone landing at Heathrow. By the time I
got out customs, I was on my knees in pain. A female Bobby called the
medics, (Mick & Mike) who quickly had me breath Nitrous Oxide and O2 (50%).
Three breaths of that and NO PAIN PLUS I WAS ONE HAPPY CAMPER! Back here in
the states, same problem, different kidney, 10 years later, the medic was
trying stick me in slow and bunching ambulance to give me morphine. :45 later
(we stopped for the night fright train though town) just as we pull up to
the ER door, he finely injects me.
Pappy
In a message dated 11/22/2011 12:03:39 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
viperdoc@mindspring.com writes:
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Roger Kemp MD" <viperdoc@mindspring.com>
A little Forane, a little Nitrous with 2 X's the O2, a little Versed, a
little Fentanyl, and a wallop of Porpofol to start! Of course a slug of
Norcuron so you will be still while we cut and Wallah...you have
anesthesia!
BP goes up...a little more Forane...BP goes down...a little less Forane. Of
course all with care to follow the volume in the tank. That's where a
hooter
hose and a big bore IV come in handy. Ringer's and Lasix can fix most
volume
problems that decreasing the Forane does not. Once out of the PACU...you
are the surgeon's problem!
:^))
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark
G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:23 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Over 8 THOUSAND PSI.
Kind of makes you wonder how he prescribes drugs to patients doesn't it?
NURSE, THIS MAN NEED 5 UNITS OF BLOOD. Times 10 of course! Sigh.....
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Richard Goode
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:13 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
55 atm x 10 would be interesting!!
Richard
Richard Goode
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: 22 November 2011 15:52
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially
damaging?
How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
>>> AM >>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main gear
legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling attaches.
They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've attached a photo of
the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on each side of the cowl.
BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the nose wheel fork has to clear
the jack AND the ground when retracting and extending. Use a 3-legged jack
for the nose wheel and make absolutely certain the wheel assembly will
clear
the legs of the jack before you swing the gear. Also, make absolutely
certain the nose tire will clear the ground during the swing up and down.
Measure from the pivot axle bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through
the wheel axle to below the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make
sure the wheel clears the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the
nose wheel touches the ground in any way during the retraction, it will
push
the airplane off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico,
the
lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the gear will
slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The reason being -
the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock absorber" on the
opposite
side of the actuator. ie: when doing a retraction, the air pressure in the
DOWN side of the actuator is expelled from the actuator as the gear is
moving to the UP position and vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam
when the air pressure is low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to
the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
> *
>
>
> *
www.aeroelectric.com
www.buildersbooks.com <http://www.buildersbooks.com/>
www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by
Invictawiz MailScanner <http://www.invictawiz.com/> , and is believed to
be
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nnual List Fund Raiser. Click on
< find out more about
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Message 45
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I used the medium servos (42/47 I think). I believe once you have
everything set up well, it works great. Mine has not had any holding issues
and fly's flight plans via the internal GPS/Nav, Garmin 496, or SL-30.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Land
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 2:58 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: DYNON
Which Dynon servos did you use? Anything special about the autopilot
install?
I am just looking at a D10A to replace Horizon and thinking about the
autopilot at the same time as its not much more money.
Some reviews out there in RV6 land that say the Dynon has some heading and
altitude holding issues at times?
Thanks,
Jay
On 11/22/11 2:17 PM, "dabear@devere.us" <dabear@devere.us> wrote:
I have the Dynon SkyView system with 3 screens and the auto pilot. great
system.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Land
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 12:47 PM
Subject: Yak-List: DYNON
Does anyone have the Dynon Autopilot on their CJ or Yak?
Thanks, Jay
onth --
me AWESOME FREE Gifts!)
="http://www.aeroelectric.com">http://www.aeroelectric.com>
<http://www.buildersbooks.com>
ef="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">http://www.homebuilthelp.com>
://www.matronics.com/contribution
; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
ail Forum -
">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
matronics.com
;- List Contribution Web Site -
; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 46
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| Subject: | Yak 52 Questions... |
Trust me, it is an art to hit a vein in a moving ambulance.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of cjpilot710@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:02 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
One I started passing a kidney stone landing at Heathrow. By the time I got
out customs, I was on my knees in pain. A female Bobby called the medics,
(Mick & Mike) who quickly had me breath Nitrous Oxide and O2 (50%). Three
breaths of that and NO PAIN PLUS I WAS ONE HAPPY CAMPER! Back here in the
states, same problem, different kidney, 10 years later, the medic was trying
stick me in slow and bunching ambulance to give me morphine. :45 later (we
stopped for the night fright train though town) just as we pull up to the ER
door, he finely injects me.
Pappy
In a message dated 11/22/2011 12:03:39 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
viperdoc@mindspring.com writes:
A little Forane, a little Nitrous with 2 X's the O2, a little Versed, a
little Fentanyl, and a wallop of Porpofol to start! Of course a slug of
Norcuron so you will be still while we cut and Wallah...you have anesthesia!
BP goes up...a little more Forane...BP goes down...a little less Forane. Of
course all with care to follow the volume in the tank. That's where a hooter
hose and a big bore IV come in handy. Ringer's and Lasix can fix most volume
problems that decreasing the Forane does not. Once out of the PACU...you
are the surgeon's problem!
:^))
Doc
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bitterlich, Mark G
CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:23 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
--> Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Over 8 THOUSAND PSI.
Kind of makes you wonder how he prescribes drugs to patients doesn't it?
NURSE, THIS MAN NEED 5 UNITS OF BLOOD. Times 10 of course! Sigh.....
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Richard Goode
Sent: Tue 11/22/2011 11:13 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
55 atm x 10 would be interesting!!
Richard
Richard Goode
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp MD
Sent: 22 November 2011 15:52
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
? #1 - yes
? #2 - start with 55 atm (x 10) of course.
Doc
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Yak 52 Questions...
OK. Roger all that. Is a "hard retract" undesirable or potentially damaging?
How much air pressure will I need to do the initial retractions?
>>> "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> 11/22/2011 8:33
>>> AM >>>
You have to have jack points to screw into the wings (behind the main gear
legs) and at the base of the firewall where the lower cowling attaches.
They are 14 mm threads. Jill has them available. I've attached a photo of
the nose jack point. There are two of them...one on each side of the cowl.
BE VERY CAREFUL with the nose jack because the nose wheel fork has to clear
the jack AND the ground when retracting and extending. Use a 3-legged jack
for the nose wheel and make absolutely certain the wheel assembly will clear
the legs of the jack before you swing the gear. Also, make absolutely
certain the nose tire will clear the ground during the swing up and down.
Measure from the pivot axle bolt (nose wheel mounting point) down through
the wheel axle to below the tire and swing the arc back and forth to make
sure the wheel clears the ground during the retraction. Otherwise, if the
nose wheel touches the ground in any way during the retraction, it will push
the airplane off the nose wheel jack. That would be a real mess.
Once the main system gets down to about 25 Atmospheres you may have
difficulty doing gear retractions and extensions. Understand this Rico, the
lower the pressure in the main air tank the harder the harder the gear will
slam into place when doing retractions and extensions. The reason being -
the air pressure in the actuators acts as a "shock absorber" on the opposite
side of the actuator. ie: when doing a retraction, the air pressure in the
DOWN side of the actuator is expelled from the actuator as the gear is
moving to the UP position and vice versa. Gravity contributes to the slam
when the air pressure is low in the main air tank and the gear is moved to
the DOWN position.
Dennis
A. Dennis Savarese
334-285-6263
334-546-8182 (cell)
Skype: Yakguy1
www.yak-52.com <http://www.yak-52.com/>
On 11/22/2011 7:39 AM, Rico Jaeger wrote:
> Hey, Guys!
> 1) Where exactly are jacks placed under a Yak for retraction tests?
> 2) How much of a charge will the pneumatic system require for multiple
> retraction cycles?
> There'll be more, but for now...HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
> ...and THANK YOU!
> Rico
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I have a yak 52. The install of servos was quite easy. I dont have any
pics tonight but next time I am at the plane perhaps I can snap a few. As
I recall the roll servo (possibly the pitch) attached where the centering
springs attached under the front seat. I removed the springs
to accommodate the servo install. I dont remember which size servo but I
can check but I seem to remember it was not the smallest size. I wanted
the largest that would fit.
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 6:53 PM, Jay Land <jland@popeandland.com> wrote:
> Which servos did you use? Anything difficult in the installation?
>
> Do you have any pictures of the servo installation?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Jay
>
>
> On 11/22/11 6:04 PM, "Stephen Morrey" <stephenmorrey@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> yes I do. works great
>
> On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 12:46 PM, Jay Land <jland@popeandland.com> wrote:
>
> Does anyone have the Dynon Autopilot on their CJ or Yak?
>
> Thanks, Jay
>
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