Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:17 AM - Re: Re: UK CJ6 mods' (Richard Goode)
2. 12:43 AM - Re: Re: UK CJ6 mods' (Jan Mevis)
3. 01:03 AM - Re: UK CJ6 mods' (Harv)
4. 04:08 AM - M14P mixture adjustment? (Jerry Painter)
5. 05:28 AM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (Vic)
6. 06:05 AM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (Richard Goode)
7. 06:25 AM - Yak 18T Spinner screw source? (flier)
8. 08:29 AM - Re: Jeri (Jim)
9. 09:03 AM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (Vic)
10. 09:12 AM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (DaBear)
11. 09:34 AM - Re: Re: Jeri (Shaun Dawson)
12. 09:39 AM - Re: Compass Amplifier Tubes (Ernest Martinez)
13. 09:45 AM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (Todd McCutchan)
14. 10:08 AM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (Robin Hou)
15. 10:26 AM - Re: Compass Amplifier Tubes (doug sapp)
16. 10:52 AM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (Cory Robin)
17. 11:01 AM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (George S. Coy)
18. 11:01 AM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (Todd McCutchan)
19. 12:29 PM - Re: MGL digital tach on an M-14 (Cory Robin)
20. 12:41 PM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (DaBear)
21. 12:46 PM - Re: MGL digital tach on an M-14 (DaBear)
22. 01:42 PM - Re: Compass Amplifier Tubes (Ernest Martinez)
23. 03:32 PM - Re: M14P mixture adjustment? (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: UK CJ6 mods' |
Having fought these bureaucratic issues with different aviation authorities
I would say that your pessimism is not totally merited.
UK aviation law is controlled by the Air Navigation Order, and in the end
this is the only legislation that counts. In essence it says "If a
non-type-certificated aircraft is airworthy then the CAA shall (which
legally means must, in my view) give the aircraft a Permit to Fly". A UK
"Permit" is effectively the equivalent of the US "experimental" category.
However, what is curious is that one then needs a look in the BCARs, which
are effectively our CAA's interpretation of the law, and in which they do
not define "airworthy" in any obvious way, such as saying that the aircraft
has been built in certain numbers; has been approved by certain authorities;
has been flown by a CAA test pilot or whatever. Instead they say an aircraft
is airworthy if (and only if it falls into one of a number of categories
such as a home-built of an approved sort; a recognised "classic" aircraft
and if it is "ex-military". It is the latter category that allows us to fly
Yaks and CJs, since we were able to demonstrate to the CAA that these
aircraft were clearly operated by their respective air forces.
Knowing how the authorities work, I would suggest that there is a certain
chance that a CJ-6 powered by M 14 P is no longer considered as an original
ex-military aircraft, but this gives scope for negotiation and discussion.
More importantly, there is obviously the ability to go back to the basic
legislation, and to demonstrate "airworthiness" in a more obvious and
practical fashion.
So I would say that all is not lost, and that is worth fighting. I have
taken this issue up previously with UK CAA, and individuals there have
privately admitted to me that their interpretation of the ANO is a curious
one, and that they can see the potential for someone to challenge this,
demanding a more practical definition of "airworthy". And if you can prove
that an aircraft is airworthy, then it must be given a permit!
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jay-dub
Sent: 08 July 2014 21:06
Subject: Yak-List: Re: UK CJ6 mods'
I reckon you have two hopes of getting the M14P approved for the CJ-6 in the
UK. No hope and Bob Hope .... and Bob's dead.
--------
CJ and Yak-52 owner
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=426320#426320
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| Subject: | Re: UK CJ6 mods' |
So one proof might be that a CJ-6 with an M14P is considered to be
airworthy by another CAA?
Unless airworthiness "stops" at the border of a country (that's what the
Dutch CAA says today).
Anyway, struggling with aviation authorities remains difficult and time
consuming, everywhere.
We never would have had the aviation that we know today, with the
mentality and the attitude of today's civil servants.
BR,
Jan
On 09/07/14 09:16, "Richard Goode" <richard.goode@russianaeros.com> wrote:
><richard.goode@russianaeros.com>
>
>Having fought these bureaucratic issues with different aviation
>authorities
>I would say that your pessimism is not totally merited.
>
>UK aviation law is controlled by the Air Navigation Order, and in the end
>this is the only legislation that counts. In essence it says "If a
>non-type-certificated aircraft is airworthy then the CAA shall (which
>legally means must, in my view) give the aircraft a Permit to Fly". A UK
>"Permit" is effectively the equivalent of the US "experimental" category.
>
>However, what is curious is that one then needs a look in the BCARs, which
>are effectively our CAA's interpretation of the law, and in which they do
>not define "airworthy" in any obvious way, such as saying that the
>aircraft
>has been built in certain numbers; has been approved by certain
>authorities;
>has been flown by a CAA test pilot or whatever. Instead they say an
>aircraft
>is airworthy if (and only if it falls into one of a number of categories
>such as a home-built of an approved sort; a recognised "classic" aircraft
>and if it is "ex-military". It is the latter category that allows us to
>fly
>Yaks and CJs, since we were able to demonstrate to the CAA that these
>aircraft were clearly operated by their respective air forces.
>
>Knowing how the authorities work, I would suggest that there is a certain
>chance that a CJ-6 powered by M 14 P is no longer considered as an
>original
>ex-military aircraft, but this gives scope for negotiation and discussion.
>More importantly, there is obviously the ability to go back to the basic
>legislation, and to demonstrate "airworthiness" in a more obvious and
>practical fashion.
>
>So I would say that all is not lost, and that is worth fighting. I have
>taken this issue up previously with UK CAA, and individuals there have
>privately admitted to me that their interpretation of the ANO is a curious
>one, and that they can see the potential for someone to challenge this,
>demanding a more practical definition of "airworthy". And if you can prove
>that an aircraft is airworthy, then it must be given a permit!
>
>Richard Goode Aerobatics
>Rhodds Farm
>Lyonshall
>Hereford
>HR5 3LW
>
>Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
>Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
>www.russianaeros.com
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jay-dub
>Sent: 08 July 2014 21:06
>To: yak-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Yak-List: Re: UK CJ6 mods'
>
>
>I reckon you have two hopes of getting the M14P approved for the CJ-6 in
>the
>UK. No hope and Bob Hope .... and Bob's dead.
>
>--------
>CJ and Yak-52 owner
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=426320#426320
>
>
>--
>This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by
>MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: UK CJ6 mods' |
Good points Richard.
I found the UK CAA to be very helpful when bringing my CJ onto the UK register
and we made around a dozen modifications. It takes time of course and you will
need good internal contacts with a genuine interest in what you are trying to
achieve. You'll also need to back up any proposed mods with justifications/evidence
where appropriate.
I think you should give it a try and see but....
Why fit an MP14?
As far as I'm aware there is no supply shortage of the Housai HS6 radial engine
and they are readily available directly from the PLA in China.
If you want to achieve a better rate of climb then throw out all that old military
radio kit, braided wiring, ADF antenna etc because it weighs about 60kg!
[Shocked]
Rgs
Harv
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=426349#426349
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| Subject: | M14P mixture adjustment? |
Got a Yak-18T that shows head temps of 200 gage on initial climb. Seems a
bit high tho it cools down at cruise power. Have not yet verified gage
accuracy. Am wondering if its running a bit lean. I don't see a full power
enrichment circuit in the carburetor dwgs or any adjustment other than
bleed air jets (apparently in series which makes no sense) in the main
circuit plus an adjustment on the AMC diaphragm rod. So I have a few
questions: 1) does anyone have bleed air jet sets for sale? 2) are the jets
actually in series? 3) Do the jets affect the idle, main or full power
circuits? How do you establish a baseline in order to evaluate changes made
to the mixture short of a flow bench?
Jerry Painter
Wild Blue Aviation
FlyWBA@gmail.com
FlyWBA.com
425-876-0865
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| Subject: | Re: M14P mixture adjustment? |
Hi Jerry,
200 degrees C is nothing to worry about, could be 220 no problems. For mixture
setting I use a lambda sensor in the exhaust pipe to know the facts.
Vic
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=426355#426355
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| Subject: | M14P mixture adjustment? |
200=C2=B0 is acceptable in the climb, but I would not want more than
that. In passing, the temperature senders on the sparking plugs are not
that accurate, and it is worth cleaning them and the seat on the
cylinder well, and also, possibly, moving the sender to another cylinder
to check.
You refer to a "bleed jet" =93 to avoid confusion the Russian
manual calls it a suction jet. It is made in sizes of 1.3 mm to 2.0 mm,
and by virtue of being a compensating jet a smaller jet richens the
mixture. It affects the engine at medium and full power settings but not
at idle. It does make a big difference to cylinder head temperatures,
and indeed to fuel consumption. We recommend to owners to change the
jets between summer and winter, and to use the biggest jet that is
compatible with engine temperatures being acceptable.
I don't understand what you mean by the jets being "in series". There is
only one.
Changing them is easy, and the jet has its size stamped in very small
letters on the end.
We have stocks of all the commonly used sizes.
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Painter
Sent: 09 July 2014 12:06
Subject: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
Got a Yak-18T that shows head temps of 200 gage on initial climb. Seems
a bit high tho it cools down at cruise power. Have not yet verified
gage accuracy. Am wondering if its running a bit lean. I don't see a
full power enrichment circuit in the carburetor dwgs or any adjustment
other than bleed air jets (apparently in series which makes no sense) in
the main circuit plus an adjustment on the AMC diaphragm rod. So I have
a few questions: 1) does anyone have bleed air jet sets for sale? 2) are
the jets actually in series? 3) Do the jets affect the idle, main or
full power circuits? How do you establish a baseline in order to
evaluate changes made to the mixture short of a flow bench?
Jerry Painter
Wild Blue Aviation
FlyWBA@gmail.com
FlyWBA.com
425-876-0865
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| Subject: | Yak 18T Spinner screw source? |
Hi All,
I'm trying to locate a replacement spinner screw for a Yak18T fiberglass spinner.
This is the 6mm screw that has the center pin that depresses the locking spring
in the receptacle in the spinner backplate.
I can't seem to find a replacement and I'm about to head to some machine shops
to try to get a quote.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Ted
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=426359#426359
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SmVyaSwKCkkgYW0gbm90IHN1cmUgd2hhdCB5b3VyIGNvbXB1dGVyIGlzIHRyeWluZyB0byBydW4u
IMKgIFNjcmlwdCBpcyBjb21wdXRlciBjb2RlIGFuZCBjb3VsZCBlaXRoZXIgYmUgZ29vZCBvciBi
YWQgZGVwZW5kaW5nIG9uIHdoZXJlIGl0IGNhbWUgZnJvbS4gwqBJZiBpbiBkb3VidCB0ZWxsIGl0
IHRvICJzdG9wIi4gwqAgRGlkIHlvdSB0cnkgdHVybmluZyBvZmYgdGhlIGNvbXB1dGVyLCDCoGxl
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IDEyOjA0IEFNICAoR01ULTA3OjAwKSA8L2Rpdj48ZGl2PlRvOiBKaW0gPGppbUBqaW1pdmV5LmNv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| Subject: | Re: M14P mixture adjustment? |
Richard,
what is the theory of changing jets as opposed to setting mixture with the mixture
needle? I guess jets will set fuel flow for about full power and the needle
for lower power settings as in cruise ?
Vic
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=426370#426370
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| Subject: | M14P mixture adjustment? |
Just a reminder about Oil and CHT Temps here is the info from
the M14P manual.
Oil Temps
Engine Inlet
C
C
F
F
Recommended
50
65
122
149
Min Permissible
40
104
Max Sustain
75
167
Max 15 Min
85
185
Max Delta in/Out
50
122
32
CHT
32
Recommended
140
190
284
374
Min
120
248
Min Prolonged
140
284
Max Prolonged
220
428
Max 15 Min
240
464
That is the recommendation from the folks that built the M14P. I
recommend keeping CHTs well below 400 for engine life. But operation is
up to you.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Goode
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 9:05 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
200=C2=B0 is acceptable in the climb, but I would not want more than
that. In passing, the temperature senders on the sparking plugs are not
that accurate, and it is worth cleaning them and the seat on the
cylinder well, and also, possibly, moving the sender to another cylinder
to check.
You refer to a "bleed jet" =93 to avoid confusion the Russian
manual calls it a suction jet. It is made in sizes of 1.3 mm to 2.0 mm,
and by virtue of being a compensating jet a smaller jet richens the
mixture. It affects the engine at medium and full power settings but not
at idle. It does make a big difference to cylinder head temperatures,
and indeed to fuel consumption. We recommend to owners to change the
jets between summer and winter, and to use the biggest jet that is
compatible with engine temperatures being acceptable.
I don't understand what you mean by the jets being "in series". There is
only one.
Changing them is easy, and the jet has its size stamped in very small
letters on the end.
We have stocks of all the commonly used sizes.
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com <http://www.russianaeros.com>
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Painter
Sent: 09 July 2014 12:06
Subject: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
Got a Yak-18T that shows head temps of 200 gage on initial climb. Seems
a bit high tho it cools down at cruise power. Have not yet verified
gage accuracy. Am wondering if its running a bit lean. I don't see a
full power enrichment circuit in the carburetor dwgs or any adjustment
other than bleed air jets (apparently in series which makes no sense) in
the main circuit plus an adjustment on the AMC diaphragm rod. So I have
a few questions: 1) does anyone have bleed air jet sets for sale? 2) are
the jets actually in series? 3) Do the jets affect the idle, main or
full power circuits? How do you establish a baseline in order to
evaluate changes made to the mixture short of a flow bench?
Jerry Painter
Wild Blue Aviation
FlyWBA@gmail.com <mailto:FlyWBA@gmail.com>
FlyWBA.com
425-876-0865
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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Message 11
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Strange thing to be on a Yak list, but what Jeri is describing might be the
browser complaining about JavaScript running on a web page. This can get
slow for all sorts of reasons, including a bad web page, or low memory
resulting in swapping.
Make sure Jeri pulls the prop through a sufficient amount of times also,
and check to make sure that there is sufficient pressure :).
Shaun
On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Jim <jim@jimivey.com> wrote:
> Jeri,
>
> I am not sure what your computer is trying to run. Script is computer
> code and could either be good or bad depending on where it came from. If
> in doubt tell it to "stop". Did you try turning off the computer,
> leaving it for 1 minute and then starting it again?
> Hope that works but let me know if otherwise.
>
> Jim
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Jeri Hallberg
> Date:07/08/2014 12:04 AM (GMT-07:00)
> To: Jim
> Subject: Jeri
>
> hey
>
> Hi Jimmy!![image: Emoji]
>
> The computer at Waldo'S continues to present notices regarding an option to
>
> "RUN" or " STOP" a script.
>
> then I get these little sky blue circles that I assume mean there is some
> sort of
> procedure going on.
>
> Any ideas??
>
> Yes I know it is late and you are probably asleep so if you want to
> respond great
>
> if not
>
> that's cool too
>
> but responding would be better
>
>
> using it for browsing..
>
>
> no research or anything like that
>
> at this time.
>
>
> Jeri
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Compass Amplifier Tubes |
These are the tubes for the FL-3 Amplifier.
6H6P and 6J8P
They are common, and easily found on Ebay for about $3.00 each.
Ernie
On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 4:50 PM, Ernest Martinez <erniel29@gmail.com> wrote:
> 6k8 is the Chinese/russiandesignator, it's not aUS 6k8
>
>
> On Monday, July 7, 2014, Gill Gutierrez <gill.g@gpimail.com> wrote:
>
>> Tube Depot has 6K8 tubes for <$9
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
>> owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Ernest Martinez
>> *Sent:* Monday, July 07, 2014 12:00 PM
>> *To:* yak-list
>> *Subject:* Re: Yak-List: Compass Amplifier Tubes
>>
>>
>>
>> Yes the 6H6 works for the 6X6c but trying to figure out what to use for
>> whats labeled 6K8 or 6zh176 (zh is represented by mirror image k's back to
>> back in Cryllic).
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 1:27 PM, Gill Gutierrez <gill.g@gpimail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> RCA 6H6 works
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
>> owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Ernest Martinez
>> *Sent:* Saturday, July 05, 2014 10:05 AM
>> *To:* yak-list
>> *Subject:* Yak-List: Compass Amplifier Tubes
>>
>>
>>
>> I've replaced the tubes in the compass amplifier, but I can't remember
>> now what the equivalents were. The tube base says 6x6 and 6k8 but a google
>> search finds nothing easily found for the 6x6. Underneath is it says 6 (2
>> k's back to back) 6c I'm not sure if that back to back k symbol is meant to
>> be translated as a K.
>>
>>
>>
>> Any help would be appreciated.
>>
>>
>>
>> I know I an just buy the whole amp, but I've seen this symptom before
>> where the needle just goes round and round, and tube replacement fixed it.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Ernie
>>
>>
>>
>> Nanchang CJ-6A
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>*
>>
>> *http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>*
>>
>> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>*
>>
>> *tp://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>*
>>
>> *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Ernie
>>
>>
>>
>> Nanchang CJ-6A
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>*
>>
>> *http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>*
>>
>> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>
>>
>>
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>>
>>
>
> --
> Ernie
>
> Nanchang CJ-6A
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: M14P mixture adjustment? |
Why are oil temps so much lower than flat six engines? Is this a radial diff
erence or a Russian oil difference?
On my IO-520 in my T-34 max oil is 240 F with 170 recommended.
Todd McCutchan
T-34A & Yak-50
Cell: (260) 402-1740
E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com
www.fastaircraft.com
> On Jul 9, 2014, at 9:12 AM, "DaBear" <dabear@damned.org> wrote:
>
> Just a reminder about Oil and CHT Temps here is the info from th
e M14P manual.
>
> Oil Temps
> Engine Inlet
> C
> C
> F
> F
> Recommended
> 50
> 65
> 122
> 149
> Min Permissible
> 40
> 104
> Max Sustain
> 75
> 167
> Max 15 Min
> 85
> 185
> Max Delta in/Out
> 50
> 122
> 32
> CHT
> 32
> Recommended
> 140
> 190
> 284
> 374
> Min
> 120
> 248
> Min Prolonged
> 140
> 284
> Max Prolonged
> 220
> 428
> Max 15 Min
> 240
> 464
>
>
> That is the recommendation from the folks that built the M14P. I recomme
nd keeping CHTs well below 400 for engine life. But operation is up to you.
>
> Bear
>
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@ma
tronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Goode
> Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 9:05 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
>
> 200=C2=B0 is acceptable in the climb, but I would not want more than that.
In passing, the temperature senders on the sparking plugs are not that accu
rate, and it is worth cleaning them and the seat on the cylinder well, and a
lso, possibly, moving the sender to another cylinder to check.
>
> You refer to a "bleed jet" =93 to avoid confusion the Russian manual
calls it a suction jet. It is made in sizes of 1.3 mm to 2.0 mm, and by vir
tue of being a compensating jet a smaller jet richens the mixture. It affec
ts the engine at medium and full power settings but not at idle. It does mak
e a big difference to cylinder head temperatures, and indeed to fuel consump
tion. We recommend to owners to change the jets between summer and winter, a
nd to use the biggest jet that is compatible with engine temperatures being a
cceptable.
>
> I don't understand what you mean by the jets being "in series". There is o
nly one.
>
> Changing them is easy, and the jet has its size stamped in very small lett
ers on the end.
>
> We have stocks of all the commonly used sizes.
>
> Richard Goode Aerobatics
> Rhodds Farm
> Lyonshall
> Hereford
> HR5 3LW
>
> Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
> Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
> www.russianaeros.com
>
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@ma
tronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Painter
> Sent: 09 July 2014 12:06
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
>
> Got a Yak-18T that shows head temps of 200 gage on initial climb. Seems a b
it high tho it cools down at cruise power. Have not yet verified gage accur
acy. Am wondering if its running a bit lean. I don't see a full power enrich
ment circuit in the carburetor dwgs or any adjustment other than bleed air j
ets (apparently in series which makes no sense) in the main circuit plus an a
djustment on the AMC diaphragm rod. So I have a few questions: 1) does anyon
e have bleed air jet sets for sale? 2) are the jets actually in series? 3) D
o the jets affect the idle, main or full power circuits? How do you establis
h a baseline in order to evaluate changes made to the mixture short of a flo
w bench?
>
> Jerry Painter
> Wild Blue Aviation
> FlyWBA@gmail.com
> FlyWBA.com
> 425-876-0865
>
>
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
>
> http://forums.matronics.com
>
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
> --
> This message has been scanned for viruses and
> dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
> believed to be clean.
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
> http://forums.matronics.com
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: M14P mixture adjustment? |
Bear's listed oil temps are the recommended minimum, not maximum. The forma
t makes the "Min" easy to miss.=0A=0A=0AOn Wednesday, July 9, 2014 10:00 AM
, Todd McCutchan <todd@fastaircraft.com> wrote:=0A =0A=0A=0AWhy are oil tem
ps so much lower than flat six engines? Is this a radial difference or a Ru
ssian oil difference?=0A=0AOn my IO-520 in my T-34 max oil is 240 F with 17
0 recommended.=0A=0ATodd McCutchan=0AT-34A & Yak-50=0ACell: (260) 402-1740
=0AE-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com=0Awww.fastaircraft.com=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Jul 9
, 2014, at 9:12 AM, "DaBear" <dabear@damned.org> wrote:=0A=0A=0AJust a remi
nder about Oil and CHT Temps here is the info from the M14P manua
l. =0A>=C2-=0A>Oil Temps =0A>Engine Inlet C C F F =0A>Recommended 50
65 122 149 =0A>Min Permissible 40 104 =0A>Max Sustain 75 167 =0A>Max 15
Min 85 185 =0A>Max Delta in/Out 50 122 =0A> 32 =0A>CHT 32 =0A>Re
commended 140 190 284 374 =0A>Min 120 248 =0A>Min Prolonged 140 284 =0A
>Max Prolonged 220 428 =0A>Max 15 Min 240 464 =0A>=C2-=0A>=C2-=0A>T
hat is the recommendation from the folks that built the M14P.=C2-=C2- I
recommend keeping CHTs well below 400 for engine life.=C2- But operation
is up to you.=0A>=C2-=0A>Bear=0A>=C2-=0A>From:owner-yak-list-server@ma
tronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richa
rd Goode=0A>Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 9:05 AM=0A>To: yak-list@matronic
s.com=0A>Subject: RE: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?=0A>=C2-=0A>200
=C2=B0 is acceptable in the climb, but I would not want more than that. In
passing, the temperature senders on the sparking plugs are not that accurat
e, and it is worth cleaning them and the seat on the cylinder well, and als
o, possibly, moving the sender to another cylinder to check.=0A>=C2-=0A>Y
ou refer to a "bleed jet" =93 to avoid confusion the Russian manual c
alls it a suction jet. It is made in sizes of 1.3 mm to 2.0 mm, and by virt
ue of being a compensating jet a smaller jet =C2-richens the mixture. It
affects the engine at medium and full power settings but not at idle. It do
es make a big difference to cylinder head temperatures, and indeed to fuel
consumption. We recommend to owners to change the jets between summer and w
inter, and to use the biggest jet that is compatible with engine temperatur
es being acceptable.=0A>=C2-=0A>I don't understand what you mean by the j
ets being "in series". There is only one.=0A>=C2-=0A>Changing them is eas
y, and the jet has its size stamped in very small letters on the end.=0A>
=C2-=0A>We have stocks of all the commonly used sizes.=0A>=C2-=0A>Richa
rd Goode Aerobatics=0A>Rhodds Farm=0A>Lyonshall=0A>Hereford=0A>HR5 3LW=0A>
=C2-=0A>Tel:=C2- +44 (0) 1544 340120=0A>Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129=0A>www
.russianaeros.com=0A>=C2-=0A>From:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [ma
ilto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Painter=0A>Sen
t: 09 July 2014 12:06=0A>To: yak-list@matronics.com=0A>Subject: Yak-List: M
14P mixture adjustment?=0A>=C2-=0A>Got a Yak-18T that shows head temps of
200 gage on initial climb. Seems a bit=C2- high tho it cools down at cru
ise power. Have not yet verified gage accuracy. Am wondering if its running
a bit lean. I don't see a full power enrichment circuit in the carburetor
dwgs or any adjustment other than bleed air jets (apparently in series whic
h makes no sense) in the main circuit plus an adjustment on the AMC diaphra
gm rod. So I have a few questions: 1) does anyone have bleed air jet sets f
or sale? 2) are the jets actually in series? 3) Do the jets affect the idle
, main or full power circuits? How do you establish a baseline in order to
evaluate changes made to the mixture short of a flow bench?=0A>Jerry Painte
r=0A>Wild Blue Aviation=0A>FlyWBA@gmail.com=0A>FlyWBA.com=0A>425-876-0865
=0A>=C2-=0A>=C2-=0A>=C2-=0A>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Li
st=0A>=C2-=0A>http://forums.matronics.com=0A>=C2-=0A>http://www.matroni
cs.com/contribution=0A>=C2-=0A>=C2-=0A>=0A>-- =0A>This message has been
scanned for viruses and =0A>dangerous content by MailScanner, and is =0A>b
elieved to be clean. =0A>=C2-=0A>=C2-=0A>http://www.matronics.com/Navig
ator?Yak-List=0A>http://forums.matronics.com=0A>http://www.matronics.com/co
ntribution=0A>=C2-=0A>D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0Aist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-Li
st=0AD=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=0A//forums.matronics.com=0AD=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0Aot;">http://www.matronics.com/contrib
ution=0AD=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
===============
Message 15
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|
| Subject: | Re: Compass Amplifier Tubes |
Thanks Ernie, now I know where to send customers who are in need of
replacement tubes. Previously the only option was to buy a complete new
FL-3 unit.
The list works only if we are all willing to share our knowledge.
Thanks again.
Doug
On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 9:37 AM, Ernest Martinez <erniel29@gmail.com> wrote:
> These are the tubes for the FL-3 Amplifier.
>
> 6H6P and 6J8P
>
> They are common, and easily found on Ebay for about $3.00 each.
>
> Ernie
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 4:50 PM, Ernest Martinez <erniel29@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> 6k8 is the Chinese/russiandesignator, it's not aUS 6k8
>>
>>
>> On Monday, July 7, 2014, Gill Gutierrez <gill.g@gpimail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Tube Depot has 6K8 tubes for <$9
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
>>> owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Ernest Martinez
>>> *Sent:* Monday, July 07, 2014 12:00 PM
>>> *To:* yak-list
>>> *Subject:* Re: Yak-List: Compass Amplifier Tubes
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes the 6H6 works for the 6X6c but trying to figure out what to use for
>>> whats labeled 6K8 or 6zh176 (zh is represented by mirror image k's back to
>>> back in Cryllic).
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 1:27 PM, Gill Gutierrez <gill.g@gpimail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> RCA 6H6 works
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
>>> owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Ernest Martinez
>>> *Sent:* Saturday, July 05, 2014 10:05 AM
>>> *To:* yak-list
>>> *Subject:* Yak-List: Compass Amplifier Tubes
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I've replaced the tubes in the compass amplifier, but I can't remember
>>> now what the equivalents were. The tube base says 6x6 and 6k8 but a google
>>> search finds nothing easily found for the 6x6. Underneath is it says 6 (2
>>> k's back to back) 6c I'm not sure if that back to back k symbol is meant to
>>> be translated as a K.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Any help would be appreciated.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I know I an just buy the whole amp, but I've seen this symptom before
>>> where the needle just goes round and round, and tube replacement fixed it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Ernie
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Nanchang CJ-6A
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>*
>>>
>>> *http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>*
>>>
>>> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>*
>>>
>>> *tp://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>*
>>>
>>> *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Ernie
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Nanchang CJ-6A
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>*
>>>
>>> *http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>*
>>>
>>> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *
>>>
>>> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>
>>> tp://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
>>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>>>
>>> *
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Ernie
>>
>> Nanchang CJ-6A
>>
>>
>>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
Message 16
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|
| Subject: | Re: M14P mixture adjustment? |
if I'm not mistaken, inlet temps are lower than 'connected probes' or
outlet temps. I'm certain that if measured at outlet, it'll be just a few
=C2=B0 higher than inlet. :)
The lycoming accessory case and oil temp probe is much closer to where the
oil will be used... If the M-14P had the oil temp probe located in such a
location, the specs would be a bit higher in temps I'm sure.
On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 10:24 AM, Todd McCutchan <todd@fastaircraft.com>
wrote:
> Why are oil temps so much lower than flat six engines? Is this a radial
> difference or a Russian oil difference?
>
> On my IO-520 in my T-34 max oil is 240 F with 170 recommended.
>
>
Message 17
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|
| Subject: | M14P mixture adjustment? |
The temperatures vary depending where you measure it at the inlet,
outlet or somewhere in between (Lycoming/Continental)
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Todd McCutchan
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
Why are oil temps so much lower than flat six engines? Is this a radial
difference or a Russian oil difference?
On my IO-520 in my T-34 max oil is 240 F with 170 recommended.
Todd McCutchan
T-34A & Yak-50
Cell: (260) 402-1740
E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com
www.fastaircraft.com
On Jul 9, 2014, at 9:12 AM, "DaBear" <dabear@damned.org> wrote:
Just a reminder about Oil and CHT Temps here is the info from
the M14P manual.
Oil Temps
Engine Inlet
C
C
F
F
Recommended
50
65
122
149
Min Permissible
40
104
Max Sustain
75
167
Max 15 Min
85
185
Max Delta in/Out
50
122
32
CHT
32
Recommended
140
190
284
374
Min
120
248
Min Prolonged
140
284
Max Prolonged
220
428
Max 15 Min
240
464
That is the recommendation from the folks that built the M14P. I
recommend keeping CHTs well below 400 for engine life. But operation is
up to you.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Goode
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 9:05 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
200=C2=B0 is acceptable in the climb, but I would not want more than
that. In passing, the temperature senders on the sparking plugs are not
that accurate, and it is worth cleaning them and the seat on the
cylinder well, and also, possibly, moving the sender to another cylinder
to check.
You refer to a "bleed jet" =93 to avoid confusion the Russian
manual calls it a suction jet. It is made in sizes of 1.3 mm to 2.0 mm,
and by virtue of being a compensating jet a smaller jet richens the
mixture. It affects the engine at medium and full power settings but not
at idle. It does make a big difference to cylinder head temperatures,
and indeed to fuel consumption. We recommend to owners to change the
jets between summer and winter, and to use the biggest jet that is
compatible with engine temperatures being acceptable.
I don't understand what you mean by the jets being "in series". There is
only one.
Changing them is easy, and the jet has its size stamped in very small
letters on the end.
We have stocks of all the commonly used sizes.
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Painter
Sent: 09 July 2014 12:06
Subject: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
Got a Yak-18T that shows head temps of 200 gage on initial climb. Seems
a bit high tho it cools down at cruise power. Have not yet verified
gage accuracy. Am wondering if its running a bit lean. I don't see a
full power enrichment circuit in the carburetor dwgs or any adjustment
other than bleed air jets (apparently in series which makes no sense) in
the main circuit plus an adjustment on the AMC diaphragm rod. So I have
a few questions: 1) does anyone have bleed air jet sets for sale? 2) are
the jets actually in series? 3) Do the jets affect the idle, main or
full power circuits? How do you establish a baseline in order to
evaluate changes made to the mixture short of a flow bench?
Jerry Painter
Wild Blue Aviation
FlyWBA@gmail.com
FlyWBA.com
425-876-0865
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by <http://www.mailscanner.info/> MailScanner, and is
believed to be clean.
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
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ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
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Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: M14P mixture adjustment? |
Max sustain 167 F and max 15 min is 185 F vs my recommended 170 F and max co
ntinuous 240 F.
That seeks like a big difference.
Is it due to Russian oil or radial engine?
Todd McCutchan
T-34A & Yak-50
Cell: (260) 402-1740
E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com
www.fastaircraft.com
> On Jul 9, 2014, at 10:06 AM, Robin Hou <rmhou@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Bear's listed oil temps are the recommended minimum, not maximum. The form
at makes the "Min" easy to miss.
>
>
> On Wednesday, July 9, 2014 10:00 AM, Todd McCutchan <todd@fastaircraft.com
> wrote:
>
>
> Why are oil temps so much lower than flat six engines? Is this a radial di
fference or a Russian oil difference?
>
> On my IO-520 in my T-34 max oil is 240 F with 170 recommended.
>
> Todd McCutchan
> T-34A & Yak-50
> Cell: (260) 402-1740
> E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com
> www.fastaircraft.com
>
>
>
>> On Jul 9, 2014, at 9:12 AM, "DaBear" <dabear@damned.org> wrote:
>>
>> Just a reminder about Oil and CHT Temps here is the info from t
he M14P manual.
>>
>> Oil Temps
>> Engine Inlet
>> C
>> C
>> F
>> F
>> Recommended
>> 50
>> 65
>> 122
>> 149
>> Min Permissible
>> 40
>> 104
>> Max Sustain
>> 75
>> 167
>> Max 15 Min
>> 85
>> 185
>> Max Delta in/Out
>> 50
>> 122
>> 32
>> CHT
>> 32
>> Recommended
>> 140
>> 190
>> 284
>> 374
>> Min
>> 120
>> 248
>> Min Prolonged
>> 140
>> 284
>> Max Prolonged
>> 220
>> 428
>> Max 15 Min
>> 240
>> 464
>>
>>
>> That is the recommendation from the folks that built the M14P. I recomm
end keeping CHTs well below 400 for engine life. But operation is up to you
.
>>
>> Bear
>>
>> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Goode
>> Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 9:05 AM
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: RE: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
>>
>> 200=C2=B0 is acceptable in the climb, but I would not want more than that
. In passing, the temperature senders on the sparking plugs are not that acc
urate, and it is worth cleaning them and the seat on the cylinder well, and a
lso, possibly, moving the sender to another cylinder to check.
>>
>> You refer to a "bleed jet" =93 to avoid confusion the Russian manua
l calls it a suction jet. It is made in sizes of 1.3 mm to 2.0 mm, and by vi
rtue of being a compensating jet a smaller jet richens the mixture. It affe
cts the engine at medium and full power settings but not at idle. It does ma
ke a big difference to cylinder head temperatures, and indeed to fuel consum
ption. We recommend to owners to change the jets between summer and winter, a
nd to use the biggest jet that is compatible with engine temperatures being a
cceptable.
>>
>> I don't understand what you mean by the jets being "in series". There is o
nly one.
>>
>> Changing them is easy, and the jet has its size stamped in very small let
ters on the end.
>>
>> We have stocks of all the commonly used sizes.
>>
>> Richard Goode Aerobatics
>> Rhodds Farm
>> Lyonshall
>> Hereford
>> HR5 3LW
>>
>> Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
>> Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
>> www.russianaeros.com
>>
>> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Painter
>> Sent: 09 July 2014 12:06
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
>>
>> Got a Yak-18T that shows head temps of 200 gage on initial climb. Seems a
bit high tho it cools down at cruise power. Have not yet verified gage acc
uracy. Am wondering if its running a bit lean. I don't see a full power enri
chment circuit in the carburetor dwgs or any adjustment other than bleed air
jets (apparently in series which makes no sense) in the main circuit plus a
n adjustment on the AMC diaphragm rod. So I have a few questions: 1) does an
yone have bleed air jet sets for sale? 2) are the jets actually in series? 3
) Do the jets affect the idle, main or full power circuits? How do you estab
lish a baseline in order to evaluate changes made to the mixture short of a f
low bench?
>> Jerry Painter
>> Wild Blue Aviation
>> FlyWBA@gmail.com
>> FlyWBA.com
>> 425-876-0865
>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> This message has been scanned for viruses and
>> dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
>> believed to be clean.
>>
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
>> http://forums.matronics.com
>> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>
>>
>>
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>> ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
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| Subject: | Re: MGL digital tach on an M-14 |
I just talked to MGL after purchasing an RV-1.... Support there says the
P-Lead installation is unreliable, but 'go ahead and try it to see what
happens'...
I don't like the 'try it' idea when it comes to airplanes.
Anyone using a digital tach with the P-lead successfully?
What are your settings? (4.5 pulses per rev?)
Did you use the 10k ohm resistor?
thanks in advance.
-Threeper65
Message 20
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| Subject: | M14P mixture adjustment? |
Disclaimer NOTE: I=99m just typing while my mind thinks, this is
my opinion, not an opinion of an expert. Although, I AM an expert ON my
opinions. :)
In the flat engines, the oil is mostly in the engine and a little is in
cooler. In the CJ and Yak oil is mostly in the oil tank, with a little
in the engine and a little in the oil cooler. Therefore, the system
has lower temp oil overall through the process. It could be that the
temp probe for the flat engine is in the engine or on the outlet side.
I couldn=99t get the outlet side oil temps anywhere near 240DegF.
Also interesting is that in these engines, Housai, M14P and now my
M14PF, it has been extremely difficult to impossible to get the oil temp
on the outbound side of the engine up to 212deg F to =9Cboil
off=9D any water/condensation from the oil. The oil temps in the
system tend to run cold even in the heat of summer. For example,
running a week or so ago with OAT around 90DegF, Altitude around 2-3k
feet, airspeed at 145-150kts, power at max continuous, oil inlet temps
were 124degF with oil cooler door closed. Oil outlet only got to
170degF. The oil cooler was changed (New) as of 800 hours ago, so it is
warn. I=99m running 25w60 . Climb up to 9-12k of altitude and
power back a little and its hard to keep the oil temps above 115degF
For people running the M14P and PF in the summer. What are you seeing
for CHT temps on initial take off, cruise, climb? What are the power
settings you are using when seeing these tempts?
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Todd McCutchan
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 1:39 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
Max sustain 167 F and max 15 min is 185 F vs my recommended 170 F and
max continuous 240 F.
That seeks like a big difference.
Is it due to Russian oil or radial engine?
Todd McCutchan
T-34A & Yak-50
Cell: (260) 402-1740
E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com <mailto:todd@fastaircraft.com>
www.fastaircraft.com <http://www.fastaircraft.com>
On Jul 9, 2014, at 10:06 AM, Robin Hou <rmhou@yahoo.com
<mailto:rmhou@yahoo.com> > wrote:
Bear's listed oil temps are the recommended minimum, not maximum. The
format makes the "Min" easy to miss.
On Wednesday, July 9, 2014 10:00 AM, Todd McCutchan
<todd@fastaircraft.com <mailto:todd@fastaircraft.com> > wrote:
Why are oil temps so much lower than flat six engines? Is this a radial
difference or a Russian oil difference?
On my IO-520 in my T-34 max oil is 240 F with 170 recommended.
Todd McCutchan
T-34A & Yak-50
Cell: (260) 402-1740
E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com <mailto:todd@fastaircraft.com>
www.fastaircraft.com <http://www.fastaircraft.com/>
On Jul 9, 2014, at 9:12 AM, "DaBear" <dabear@damned.org
<mailto:dabear@damned.org> > wrote:
Just a reminder about Oil and CHT Temps here is the info from
the M14P manual.
Oil Temps
Engine Inlet
C
C
F
F
Recommended
50
65
122
149
Min Permissible
40
104
Max Sustain
75
167
Max 15 Min
85
185
Max Delta in/Out
50
122
32
CHT
32
Recommended
140
190
284
374
Min
120
248
Min Prolonged
140
284
Max Prolonged
220
428
Max 15 Min
240
464
That is the recommendation from the folks that built the M14P. I
recommend keeping CHTs well below 400 for engine life. But operation is
up to you.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Goode
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 9:05 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
200=C2=B0 is acceptable in the climb, but I would not want more than
that. In passing, the temperature senders on the sparking plugs are not
that accurate, and it is worth cleaning them and the seat on the
cylinder well, and also, possibly, moving the sender to another cylinder
to check.
You refer to a "bleed jet" =93 to avoid confusion the Russian
manual calls it a suction jet. It is made in sizes of 1.3 mm to 2.0 mm,
and by virtue of being a compensating jet a smaller jet richens the
mixture. It affects the engine at medium and full power settings but not
at idle. It does make a big difference to cylinder head temperatures,
and indeed to fuel consumption. We recommend to owners to change the
jets between summer and winter, and to use the biggest jet that is
compatible with engine temperatures being acceptable.
I don't understand what you mean by the jets being "in series". There is
only one.
Changing them is easy, and the jet has its size stamped in very small
letters on the end.
We have stocks of all the commonly used sizes.
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com <http://www.russianaeros.com/>
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Painter
Sent: 09 July 2014 12:06
Subject: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
Got a Yak-18T that shows head temps of 200 gage on initial climb. Seems
a bit high tho it cools down at cruise power. Have not yet verified
gage accuracy. Am wondering if its running a bit lean. I don't see a
full power enrichment circuit in the carburetor dwgs or any adjustment
other than bleed air jets (apparently in series which makes no sense) in
the main circuit plus an adjustment on the AMC diaphragm rod. So I have
a few questions: 1) does anyone have bleed air jet sets for sale? 2) are
the jets actually in series? 3) Do the jets affect the idle, main or
full power circuits? How do you establish a baseline in order to
evaluate changes made to the mixture short of a flow bench?
Jerry Painter
Wild Blue Aviation
FlyWBA@gmail.com <mailto:FlyWBA@gmail.com>
FlyWBA.com <http://flywba.com/>
425-876-0865
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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Message 21
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| Subject: | MGL digital tach on an M-14 |
I used the Horizon digital tach on my Housai and M14P directly with no
resistor. I used the Horizon on the M14P for over 500 hours. On the
Dynon SkyView you need the resistor to get smooth readings, but works
flawlessly. I=99ve had it on my CJ for over 2.5 years and 250
hours.
I have No experience with the MGL tach.
The correct pulses per rev for the M14P is 2.25.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cory Robin
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 3:28 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: MGL digital tach on an M-14
I just talked to MGL after purchasing an RV-1.... Support there says
the P-Lead installation is unreliable, but 'go ahead and try it to see
what happens'...
I don't like the 'try it' idea when it comes to airplanes.
Anyone using a digital tach with the P-lead successfully?
What are your settings? (4.5 pulses per rev?)
Did you use the 10k ohm resistor?
thanks in advance.
-Threeper65
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Compass Amplifier Tubes |
Update
The 6J8P is a Chinese tube, J grade means military. The American equivalent
is 6SJ7.
Ernie
On Wednesday, July 9, 2014, doug sapp <dougsappllc@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thanks Ernie, now I know where to send customers who are in need of
> replacement tubes. Previously the only option was to buy a complete new
> FL-3 unit.
>
> The list works only if we are all willing to share our knowledge.
>
> Thanks again.
>
> Doug
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 9:37 AM, Ernest Martinez <erniel29@gmail.com
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','erniel29@gmail.com');>> wrote:
>
>> These are the tubes for the FL-3 Amplifier.
>>
>> 6H6P and 6J8P
>>
>> They are common, and easily found on Ebay for about $3.00 each.
>>
>> Ernie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 4:50 PM, Ernest Martinez <erniel29@gmail.com
>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','erniel29@gmail.com');>> wrote:
>>
>>> 6k8 is the Chinese/russiandesignator, it's not aUS 6k8
>>>
>>>
>>> On Monday, July 7, 2014, Gill Gutierrez <gill.g@gpimail.com
>>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','gill.g@gpimail.com');>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Tube Depot has 6K8 tubes for <$9
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:* owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
>>>> owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Ernest Martinez
>>>> *Sent:* Monday, July 07, 2014 12:00 PM
>>>> *To:* yak-list
>>>> *Subject:* Re: Yak-List: Compass Amplifier Tubes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes the 6H6 works for the 6X6c but trying to figure out what to use for
>>>> whats labeled 6K8 or 6zh176 (zh is represented by mirror image k's back to
>>>> back in Cryllic).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 1:27 PM, Gill Gutierrez <gill.g@gpimail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> RCA 6H6 works
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:* owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
>>>> owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Ernest Martinez
>>>> *Sent:* Saturday, July 05, 2014 10:05 AM
>>>> *To:* yak-list
>>>> *Subject:* Yak-List: Compass Amplifier Tubes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I've replaced the tubes in the compass amplifier, but I can't remember
>>>> now what the equivalents were. The tube base says 6x6 and 6k8 but a google
>>>> search finds nothing easily found for the 6x6. Underneath is it says 6 (2
>>>> k's back to back) 6c I'm not sure if that back to back k symbol is meant to
>>>> be translated as a K.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Any help would be appreciated.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I know I an just buy the whole amp, but I've seen this symptom before
>>>> where the needle just goes round and round, and tube replacement fixed it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Ernie
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Nanchang CJ-6A
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>*
>>>>
>>>> *http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>*
>>>>
>>>> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>*
>>>>
>>>> *tp://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>*
>>>>
>>>> *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Ernie
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Nanchang CJ-6A
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>*
>>>>
>>>> *http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>*
>>>>
>>>> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>
>>>> tp://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
>>>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>>>>
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Ernie
>>>
>>> Nanchang CJ-6A
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> *
>>
>> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>
>> tp://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>>
>> *
>>
>>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | M14P mixture adjustment? |
Bear,
Regarding your design premises for flat engines, keep in mind this is only true
for those with a wet sump. For those with a dry sump, which is a whole lot
of them, such as the GSO-480 series for example, they too have an external oil
tank where most of the oil is outside of the engine case. Just something to
keep in mind. I also fly a UTVA-66 with a dry sump GSO-480 with an auto-mixture
adjust pressure carb. I can control EGT, and thus CHT and oil temp with
a simple push of the throttle by a VAST amount. If I keep RPM up high (3200
or so) and pull the throttle back to say 38 inches (this is a blown engine remember,
with max manifold of 48 inches), I can run the EGT's right up into the
danger area in seconds. I control CHT and Oil Temp with the throttle... and
that was an interesting lesson to learn believe me.
I do not have the external temperature equipment that you have on my M-14P. That
said, oil temperature in M-14 engines flying aerobatics using the standard
probe locations and standard stock instrumentation has ALWAYS been an issue (meaning
they tend to run very high), and many attempts have been made to address
this in all models, such as cooler relocation, bigger coolers, wing root changes
to add the oil cooler there, etc.
Personally, my YAK-50 in hot weather will run the oil temp right into the red if
you let it. Such as on an extended climb. This is true for every YAK and
Sukhoi I have ever dealt with.
So your statement that the oil runs so cool as to not even boil off the water runs
counter to every single experience I have had with these engines.
The only time I have seen anything near to what you are talking about is when the
engines are run WAY WAY RICH. The amount of fuel you dump into this engine
makes a HUGE HUGE difference on engine temperature very much the same as the
UTVA-66. And the carbs between the two are very similar in the way they work.
For my airplane, speed is the main issue. If I run high power settings in the
summer, I have to push the nose over and get some speed to get the oil temp down.
However, I am climbing at 85% or HIGHER at full throttle. Yeah, I know
a lot of folks like to baby these engines and that is fine, but I have found them
to run better when I push them hard. So far .....at over 800 hours, the
only engine issues I have had were with leaded up exhaust valves and that is when
I was trying to be ever so careful with the engine. Of course MMO fixed
all that ....... but I think personally it was because I started running the engine
a lot harder and kept it hot. That opinion and 2 cents might buy you a
glass of water, however that is what I do, and it works for me. As for anyone
else.... you're on your own. :-)
Mark
________________________________
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com]
on behalf of DaBear [dabear@damned.org]
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 3:40 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
Disclaimer NOTE: Im just typing while my mind thinks, this is my opinion, not an
opinion of an expert. Although, I AM an expert ON my opinions. :)
In the flat engines, the oil is mostly in the engine and a little is in cooler.
In the CJ and Yak oil is mostly in the oil tank, with a little in the engine
and a little in the oil cooler. Therefore, the system has lower temp oil overall
through the process. It could be that the temp probe for the flat engine
is in the engine or on the outlet side. I couldnt get the outlet side oil
temps anywhere near 240DegF.
Also interesting is that in these engines, Housai, M14P and now my M14PF, it has
been extremely difficult to impossible to get the oil temp on the outbound side
of the engine up to 212deg F to boil off any water/condensation from the oil.
The oil temps in the system tend to run cold even in the heat of summer.
For example, running a week or so ago with OAT around 90DegF, Altitude around
2-3k feet, airspeed at 145-150kts, power at max continuous, oil inlet temps were
124degF with oil cooler door closed. Oil outlet only got to 170degF. The
oil cooler was changed (New) as of 800 hours ago, so it is warn. Im running
25w60 . Climb up to 9-12k of altitude and power back a little and its hard to
keep the oil temps above 115degF
For people running the M14P and PF in the summer. What are you seeing for CHT
temps on initial take off, cruise, climb? What are the power settings you are
using when seeing these tempts?
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Todd McCutchan
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 1:39 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
Max sustain 167 F and max 15 min is 185 F vs my recommended 170 F and max continuous
240 F.
That seeks like a big difference.
Is it due to Russian oil or radial engine?
Todd McCutchan
T-34A & Yak-50
Cell: (260) 402-1740
E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com<mailto:todd@fastaircraft.com>
www.fastaircraft.com<http://www.fastaircraft.com/>
On Jul 9, 2014, at 10:06 AM, Robin Hou <rmhou@yahoo.com<mailto:rmhou@yahoo.com>> wrote:
Bear's listed oil temps are the recommended minimum, not maximum. The format makes
the "Min" easy to miss.
On Wednesday, July 9, 2014 10:00 AM, Todd McCutchan <todd@fastaircraft.com<mailto:todd@fastaircraft.com>> wrote:
Why are oil temps so much lower than flat six engines? Is this a radial difference
or a Russian oil difference?
On my IO-520 in my T-34 max oil is 240 F with 170 recommended.
Todd McCutchan
T-34A & Yak-50
Cell: (260) 402-1740
E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com<mailto:todd@fastaircraft.com>
www.fastaircraft.com<http://www.fastaircraft.com/>
On Jul 9, 2014, at 9:12 AM, "DaBear" <dabear@damned.org<mailto:dabear@damned.org>> wrote:
Just a reminder about Oil and CHT Temps here is the info from the M14P manual.
Oil Temps
Engine Inlet
C
C
F
F
Recommended
50
65
122
149
Min Permissible
40
104
Max Sustain
75
167
Max 15 Min
85
185
Max Delta in/Out
50
122
32
CHT
32
Recommended
140
190
284
374
Min
120
248
Min Prolonged
140
284
Max Prolonged
220
428
Max 15 Min
240
464
That is the recommendation from the folks that built the M14P. I recommend keeping
CHTs well below 400 for engine life. But operation is up to you.
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Goode
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 9:05 AM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
200 is acceptable in the climb, but I would not want more than that. In passing,
the temperature senders on the sparking plugs are not that accurate, and it
is worth cleaning them and the seat on the cylinder well, and also, possibly,
moving the sender to another cylinder to check.
You refer to a "bleed jet" to avoid confusion the Russian manual calls it a suction
jet. It is made in sizes of 1.3 mm to 2.0 mm, and by virtue of being a compensating
jet a smaller jet richens the mixture. It affects the engine at medium
and full power settings but not at idle. It does make a big difference to
cylinder head temperatures, and indeed to fuel consumption. We recommend to
owners to change the jets between summer and winter, and to use the biggest jet
that is compatible with engine temperatures being acceptable.
I don't understand what you mean by the jets being "in series". There is only one.
Changing them is easy, and the jet has its size stamped in very small letters on
the end.
We have stocks of all the commonly used sizes.
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com<http://www.russianaeros.com/>
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Painter
Sent: 09 July 2014 12:06
Subject: Yak-List: M14P mixture adjustment?
Got a Yak-18T that shows head temps of 200 gage on initial climb. Seems a bit
high tho it cools down at cruise power. Have not yet verified gage accuracy. Am
wondering if its running a bit lean. I don't see a full power enrichment circuit
in the carburetor dwgs or any adjustment other than bleed air jets (apparently
in series which makes no sense) in the main circuit plus an adjustment on
the AMC diaphragm rod. So I have a few questions: 1) does anyone have bleed
air jet sets for sale? 2) are the jets actually in series? 3) Do the jets affect
the idle, main or full power circuits? How do you establish a baseline in order
to evaluate changes made to the mixture short of a flow bench?
Jerry Painter
Wild Blue Aviation
FlyWBA@gmail.com<mailto:FlyWBA@gmail.com>
FlyWBA.com<http://flywba.com/>
425-876-0865
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
http://forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/>
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