---------------------------------------------------------- Yak-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 07/15/14: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:16 AM - Re: Oil (Jan Mevis) 2. 01:05 AM - Re: Oil (Ernest Martinez) 3. 06:19 AM - Re: Oil (jblake207@comcast.net) 4. 08:54 AM - Re: Oil (Roger Kemp) 5. 11:09 AM - Re: Oil (cjpilot710@aol.com) 6. 11:10 AM - Air Digram (Ernest Martinez) 7. 11:20 AM - Re: Air Digram (Colin McGeachy) 8. 11:28 AM - Re: Air Digram (Robin Hou) 9. 11:53 AM - Re: Air Digram (Ernest Martinez) 10. 12:04 PM - Re: Re: Pressure Problem (Warren Hill) 11. 12:32 PM - Re: Air Digram (Ernest Martinez) 12. 12:43 PM - Re: DG Cockpit Gauge (Hank Gibson) 13. 01:52 PM - Re: Air Digram (Tom Elliott) 14. 04:39 PM - Operating Limits Letter (Ernest Martinez) 15. 05:39 PM - Re: Oil (Keith Pickford) 16. 10:19 PM - Re: Operating Limits Letter (Richard Hess) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:16:10 AM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil From: Jan Mevis Excellent Walt! Jan From: Walter Lannon Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil Hi Ernie; I would recommend that you stay with the Aeroshell W oils. Your location does not experience severe temperature changes so W100 winter and W120 summer should be just fine. With just one exception all of the approved aviation (piston) engine oils are mineral oils. This includes the Phillips X/C 20W50 and 25W60. As far as I know, the only difference (if you can refer to it as such) between radial and opposed engine oils is the recommended viscosity. There is no such thing as an aviation detergent oil (though I believe there was, briefly, some 60 + years ago). There are three basic varieties of aviatio n mineral oils. 1. No additives (straight) e.g: 100 SUS or 50 SAE. 2. An ashless dispersant additive (AD oils) e.g: W100/ W50. ( the W is used by Aeroshell & Phillips other companies may have different designators) 3. Multi-Grade AD oils with a viscosity modifier added e.g: Phillips X/C 25W60, Aeroshell 15W50. Both use SAE viscosity numbers (60 SAE = 120 SUS) .. The exception referred to above is the Aeroshell multi-grade. It is a 50% synthetic. It appears to be a very good oil for relatively modern opposed engines but I would not use it in any radial. Apparently it has been improved over the years but:- I used it in an E225 Continental years ago and found (compared to the previous W100) the oil pressure dropped, oil temp. increased and, over time, it seeped right through the crankcase! About the same time a friend put it in his Harvard (R1340) and shortly afte r parked it for about 3 months. When he returned there was no oil left. Personally I have been using 25W60 for some time in CJ=B9s and Harvard=B9s primarily due to the seasonal temperature change ( =AD10C to 40C). Walt From: Ernest Martinez Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 3:13 PM Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil I'm currently on Aeroshell W100. But I'm in Florida and wondering if W120 would be better for the hot weather here. But I have to say that this is on e of the driest Housai motors I've seen. Ernie On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 5:20 PM, Jim wrote: > > > Ernie, > > You didn't specify if the Aeroshell your airplane has been using was W10 0, > W120 or a multi-grade . I use Aeroshell W120 and found it best for my h igh > temperature environment. Years ago I got smart and tried multi-weight a nd > even worse added Lenkite. The thing leaked out oil like shit out of a > Christmas goose. Went back to Aeroshell W120 and haven't looked back. > > Even more important would be an engine (unlike yours) that had been run on > non-detergent mineral oil. A good way to die would be switching from > straight mineral oil to detergent oil (AD). I know somebody that had a total > catastrophic failure when he switched to AD oil and the detergent did it 's > job and loosened up all the "sleeping" gunk and deposits in the engine w hich > plugged the oil system. Over Lake Washington. > > It is never a good idea to switch horses midstream (say after 100SMOH or so) > when it comes to oil. > > Jim > > > > On 7/14/2014 1:37 PM, DaBear wrote: > > > >> >> >> >> Ernie, >> >> >> >> I=B9ve used the 25/60 multi-weight oil for both of my M14=B9s and I did swi tch >> from the 100W that the previous owner used to the 25w60 for the Housai. >> That said, I wouldn=B9t switch from 100W unless you really had a reason. One >> thing with the 100w is that since many of the flat engine airplanes use it, >> it is easier to find while travelling. >> >> >> >> Good luck with the new CJ >> >> >> >> Bear >> >> >> >> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com >> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest Martin ez >> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 1:15 PM >> To: yak-list >> Subject: Yak-List: Oil >> >> >> >> >> >> In my previous CJ I used to use the Phillips 25/60 Radial Engine Oil an d was >> happy with it. My new plane has been running AeroShell all of it's US l ife ( >> 12+ years) and it's a strong, very dry, motor thats working just fine w ith >> excellent oil analysis trends. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> My first thought was to switch to the Phillips at next oil change, but then >> my 2nd thought was "if it aint broke don't fix it". >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I was hoping to get some thoughts on this, since I'm not sure what make s >> "Radial Engine Oil" any different than flat engine oil. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Ernie >> >> >> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >> http://forums.matronics.com >> http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> > > > > et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List > tp://forums.matronics.com > _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com / Navigator?Yak-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:05:29 AM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil From: Ernest Martinez Thanks Pappy, Walt, Jan, I do remember having a lot more oil pour out of my exhaust during prop pull thru, with the X/C. W120 it is then. Should I use MMO? Just kidding, :) No really, I'm just kidding. Ernie On Tuesday, July 15, 2014, Jan Mevis wrote: > Excellent Walt! > > Jan > > From: Walter Lannon > > " < > yak-list@matronics.com > > > Date: Tuesday 15 July 2014 08:36 > To: "yak-list@matronics.com > " < > yak-list@matronics.com > > > Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil > > Hi Ernie; > > I would recommend that you stay with the Aeroshell W oils. Your locatio n > does not experience severe temperature changes so W100 winter and W120 > summer should be just fine. > > With just one exception all of the approved aviation (piston) engine oils > are mineral oils. This includes the Phillips X/C 20W50 and 25W60. As f ar > as I know, the only difference (if you can refer to it as such) between > radial and opposed engine oils is the recommended viscosity. There is no > such thing as an aviation detergent oil (though I believe there was, > briefly, some 60 + years ago). There are three basic varieties of > aviation mineral oils. 1. No additives (straight) e.g: 100 SUS or 50 SAE .. > 2. An ashless dispersant additive (AD oils) e.g: W100/ W50. ( the W is > used by Aeroshell & Phillips other companies may have different > designators) > 3. Multi-Grade AD oils with a viscosity modifier added e.g: Phillips > X/C 25W60, Aeroshell 15W50. Both use SAE viscosity numbers (60 SAE = 120 > SUS). > > The exception referred to above is the Aeroshell multi-grade. It is a 50 % > synthetic. It appears to be a very good oil for relatively modern oppos ed > engines but I would not use it in any radial. Apparently it has been > improved over the years but:- I used it in an E225 Continental years ago > and found (compared to the previous W100) the oil pressure dropped, oil > temp. increased and, over time, it seeped right through the crankcase! > About the same time a friend put it in his Harvard (R1340) and shortly > after parked it for about 3 months. When he returned there was no oil > left. > > Personally I have been using 25W60 for some time in CJ=99s and Harv ard=99s > primarily due to the seasonal temperature change ( =9310C to 40C). > > Walt > > > *From:* Ernest Martinez > > *Sent:* Monday, July 14, 2014 3:13 PM > *To:* yak-list > *Subject:* Re: Yak-List: Oil > > I'm currently on Aeroshell W100. But I'm in Florida and wondering if W120 > would be better for the hot weather here. But I have to say that this is > one of the driest Housai motors I've seen. > > Ernie > > > On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 5:20 PM, Jim > wrote: > >> Ernie, >> >> You didn't specify if the Aeroshell your airplane has been using was >> W100, W120 or a multi-grade . I use Aeroshell W120 and found it best fo r >> my high temperature environment. Years ago I got smart and tried >> multi-weight and even worse added Lenkite. The thing leaked out oil lik e >> shit out of a Christmas goose. Went back to Aeroshell W120 and haven't >> looked back. >> >> Even more important would be an engine (unlike yours) that had been run >> on non-detergent mineral oil. A good way to die would be switching from >> straight mineral oil to detergent oil (AD). I know somebody that had a >> total catastrophic failure when he switched to AD oil and the detergent did >> it's job and loosened up all the "sleeping" gunk and deposits in the eng ine >> which plugged the oil system. Over Lake Washington. >> >> It is never a good idea to switch horses midstream (say after 100SMOH or >> so) when it comes to oil. >> >> Jim >> >> >> On 7/14/2014 1:37 PM, DaBear wrote: >> >> Ernie, >> >> >> >> I=99ve used the 25/60 multi-weight oil for both of my M14=99 s and I did >> switch from the 100W that the previous owner used to the 25w60 for the >> Housai. That said, I wouldn=99t switch from 100W unless you reall y had a >> reason. One thing with the 100w is that since many of the flat engine >> airplanes use it, it is easier to find while travelling. >> >> >> >> Good luck with the new CJ >> >> >> >> Bear >> >> >> >> *From:* owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com >> [ >> mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com >> ] * On >> Behalf Of *Ernest Martinez >> *Sent:* Monday, July 14, 2014 1:15 PM >> *To:* yak-list >> *Subject:* Yak-List: Oil >> >> >> >> In my previous CJ I used to use the Phillips 25/60 Radial Engine Oil and >> was happy with it. My new plane has been running AeroShell all of it's U S >> life ( 12+ years) and it's a strong, very dry, motor thats working just >> fine with excellent oil analysis trends. >> >> >> >> My first thought was to switch to the Phillips at next oil change, but >> then my 2nd thought was "if it aint broke don't fix it". >> >> >> >> I was hoping to get some thoughts on this, since I'm not sure what makes >> "Radial Engine Oil" any different than flat engine oil. >> >> >> >> Ernie >> >> >> >> >> >> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List * >> >> *http://forums.matronics.com * >> >> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution * >> >> >> >> >> * >> >> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >> * >> >> > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics .com/Navigator?Yak-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c > * > > * > > ww.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List > com > ronics.com/contribution > > * > > * > =========== nics.com/Navigator?Yak-List> =========== =========== om/contribution> =========== > > * > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:19:15 AM PST US From: jblake207@comcast.net Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil Use the MMO Ernie, but only if you wear a flight suit and helmet.=C2- :-) =C2- JB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ernest Martinez" Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2014 3:04:44 AM Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil Thanks Pappy, Walt, Jan, I do remember having a lot more oil pour out of my exhaust during prop pull thru, with=C2-the X/C. W120 it is then. Should I use MMO? Just kidding, :) No really, I'm just kidding. Ernie On Tuesday, July 15, 2014, Jan Mevis < jan.mevis@informavia.be > wrote: Excellent Walt! Jan From: Walter Lannon < wlannon@shaw.ca > Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil Hi Ernie; =C2- I would recommend that you stay with the Aeroshell W oils.=C2-=C2- Your location does not experience severe temperature changes so W100 winter and W120 summer should be just fine. =C2- With just one exception all of the approved aviation (piston) engine oils a re mineral oils.=C2- This includes the Phillips X/C 20W50 and 25W60.=C2 -=C2- As far as I know, the only difference (if you can refer to it as such) between radial and opposed engine oils is the recommended viscosity. =C2- There is no such thing as an aviation detergent oil (though I believ e there was, briefly, some 60 + years ago).=C2-=C2- There are three bas ic varieties of aviation mineral oils.=C2- 1. No additives (straight) e.g : 100 SUS or 50 SAE.=C2- 2.=C2- An ashless dispersant additive (AD oils )=C2- e.g: W100/ W50.=C2- ( the W is used by Aeroshell & Phillips other companies may have different designators)=C2- 3.=C2- Multi-Grade AD oils with a viscosity modifier added e.g:=C2-=C2 - Phillips X/C 25W60,=C2- Aeroshell 15W50.=C2- Both use SAE viscosity numbers (60 SAE = 120 SUS). =C2- The exception referred to above is the Aeroshell multi-grade.=C2- It is a 50% synthetic.=C2-=C2- It appears to be a very good oil for relatively modern opposed engines but I would not use it in any radial.=C2-=C2- A pparently it has been improved over the years but:-=C2- I used it in an E 225 Continental years ago and found (compared to the previous W100) the oil pressure dropped, oil temp. increased and, over time, it=C2- seeped righ t through the crankcase!=C2-=C2- About the same time a friend put it in his Harvard (R1340) and shortly after parked it for about 3 months.=C2- =C2- When he returned there was no oil left.=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2- Personally I have been using 25W60 for some time in CJ=99s and Harvar d=99s primarily due to the seasonal temperature change ( =9310C to 40C). =C2- Walt =C2- =C2- From: Ernest Martinez Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 3:13 PM Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil =C2- I'm currently on Aeroshell W100. But I'm in Florida and wondering if W120 w ould be better for the hot weather here. But I have to say that this is one of the driest Housai motors I've seen. =C2- Ernie On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 5:20 PM, Jim < jim@jimivey.com > wrote:
Ernie, You didn't specify if the Aeroshell your airplane has been using was W100, W120 or a multi-grade .=C2- I use Aeroshell W120 and found it best for my high temperature environment.=C2- Years ago I got smart and tried multi- weight and even worse added Lenkite.=C2- The thing leaked out oil like sh it out of a Christmas goose.=C2- Went back to Aeroshell W120 and haven't looked back. Even more important would be an engine (unlike yours) that had been run on non-detergent mineral oil.=C2- A good way to die would be switching from straight mineral oil to detergent oil (AD).=C2- I know somebody that had a total catastrophic failure when he switched to AD oil and the detergent d id it's job and loosened up all the "sleeping" gunk and deposits in the eng ine which plugged the oil system.=C2- Over Lake Washington. It is never a good idea to switch horses midstream (say after 100SMOH or so ) when it comes to oil. Jim On 7/14/2014 1:37 PM, DaBear wrote:
Ernie, =C2- I=99ve used the 25/60 multi-weight oil for both of my M14=99s a nd I did switch from the 100W that the previous owner used to the 25w60 for the Housai.=C2- That said, I wouldn=99t switch from 100W unless yo u really had a reason.=C2- One thing with the 100w is that since many of the flat engine airplanes use it, it is easier to find while travelling. =C2- Good luck with the new CJ =C2- Bear =C2- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [ mailto:owner-yak-list-server@ma tronics.com ] On Behalf Of Ernest Martinez Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 1:15 PM Subject: Yak-List: Oil =C2- In my previous CJ I used to use the Phillips 25/60 Radial Engine Oil and wa s happy with it. My new plane has been running AeroShell all of it's US lif e ( 12+ years) and it's a strong, very dry, motor thats working just fine w ith excellent oil analysis trends. =C2- My first thought was to switch to the Phillips at next oil change, but then my 2nd thought was "if it aint broke don't fix it". =C2- I was hoping to get some thoughts on this, since I'm not sure what makes "R adial Engine Oil" any different than flat engine oil. =C2- Ernie =C2- =C2- http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution =C2- et="_blank"> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List tp:// forums.mat ronics.com _blank"> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=C2- href=" http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics. com/Navigator?Yak-List href=" http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums. matronics.com href=" http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.ma tronics.com/c ww.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List com ronics.com/contribution et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=== ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:54:11 AM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil From: Roger Kemp Got a pesky cat leaving paw prints on your freshly waxed CJ wings? Just kidding! Doc Sent from my iPad > On Jul 15, 2014, at 3:04 AM, Ernest Martinez wrote: > > Thanks Pappy, Walt, Jan, > > I do remember having a lot more oil pour out of my exhaust during prop pul l thru, with the X/C. > > W120 it is then. > > Should I use MMO? Just kidding, :) No really, I'm just kidding. > > Ernie > >> On Tuesday, July 15, 2014, Jan Mevis wrote: >> Excellent Walt! >> >> Jan >> >> From: Walter Lannon >> Date: Tuesday 15 July 2014 08:36 >> To: "yak-list@matronics.com" >> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil >> >> Hi Ernie; >> >> I would recommend that you stay with the Aeroshell W oils. Your locatio n does not experience severe temperature changes so W100 winter and W120 sum mer should be just fine. >> >> With just one exception all of the approved aviation (piston) engine oils are mineral oils. This includes the Phillips X/C 20W50 and 25W60. As far as I know, the only difference (if you can refer to it as such) between rad ial and opposed engine oils is the recommended viscosity. There is no such t hing as an aviation detergent oil (though I believe there was, briefly, some 60 + years ago). There are three basic varieties of aviation mineral oils . 1. No additives (straight) e.g: 100 SUS or 50 SAE. 2. An ashless disper sant additive (AD oils) e.g: W100/ W50. ( the W is used by Aeroshell & Phi llips other companies may have different designators) >> 3. Multi-Grade AD oils with a viscosity modifier added e.g: Phillips X /C 25W60, Aeroshell 15W50. Both use SAE viscosity numbers (60 SAE = 120 S US). >> >> The exception referred to above is the Aeroshell multi-grade. It is a 50 % synthetic. It appears to be a very good oil for relatively modern oppose d engines but I would not use it in any radial. Apparently it has been imp roved over the years but:- I used it in an E225 Continental years ago and f ound (compared to the previous W100) the oil pressure dropped, oil temp. inc reased and, over time, it seeped right through the crankcase! About the s ame time a friend put it in his Harvard (R1340) and shortly after parked it f or about 3 months. When he returned there was no oil left. >> >> Personally I have been using 25W60 for some time in CJ=99s and Harv ard=99s primarily due to the seasonal temperature change ( =9310 C to 40C). >> >> Walt >> >> >> From: Ernest Martinez >> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 3:13 PM >> To: yak-list >> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil >> >> I'm currently on Aeroshell W100. But I'm in Florida and wondering if W120 would be better for the hot weather here. But I have to say that this is on e of the driest Housai motors I've seen. >> >> Ernie >> >> >>> On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 5:20 PM, Jim wrote: >>> Ernie, >>> >>> You didn't specify if the Aeroshell your airplane has been using was W10 0, W120 or a multi-grade . I use Aeroshell W120 and found it best for my hi gh temperature environment. Years ago I got smart and tried multi-weight an d even worse added Lenkite. The thing leaked out oil like shit out of a Chr istmas goose. Went back to Aeroshell W120 and haven't looked back. >>> >>> Even more important would be an engine (unlike yours) that had been run o n non-detergent mineral oil. A good way to die would be switching from stra ight mineral oil to detergent oil (AD). I know somebody that had a total ca tastrophic failure when he switched to AD oil and the detergent did it's job and loosened up all the "sleeping" gunk and deposits in the engine which pl ugged the oil system. Over Lake Washington. >>> >>> It is never a good idea to switch horses midstream (say after 100SMOH or so) when it comes to oil. >>> >>> Jim >>> >>> >>> On 7/14/2014 1:37 PM, DaBear wrote: >>>> Ernie, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I=99ve used the 25/60 multi-weight oil for both of my M14=99 s and I did switch from the 100W that the previous owner used to the 25w60 f or the Housai. That said, I wouldn=99t switch from 100W unless you re ally had a reason. One thing with the 100w is that since many of the flat e ngine airplanes use it, it is easier to find while travelling. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Good luck with the new CJ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Bear >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server @matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest Martinez >>>> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 1:15 PM >>>> To: yak-list >>>> Subject: Yak-List: Oil >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> In my previous CJ I used to use the Phillips 25/60 Radial Engine Oil an d was happy with it. My new plane has been running AeroShell all of it's US l ife ( 12+ years) and it's a strong, very dry, motor thats working just fine w ith excellent oil analysis trends. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> My first thought was to switch to the Phillips at next oil change, but t hen my 2nd thought was "if it aint broke don't fix it". >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I was hoping to get some thoughts on this, since I'm not sure what make s "Radial Engine Oil" any different than flat engine oil. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Ernie >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >>>> http://forums.matronics.com >>>> http://www.matronics.com/contribution >>> >>> >>> >>> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >>> tp://forums.matronics.com >>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >>> >> >> >> >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics .com/Navigator?Yak-List >> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com >> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c >> >> >> ww.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >> com >> ronics.com/contribution >> >> >> >> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> > > > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:09:48 AM PST US From: cjpilot710@aol.com Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil It cures acme you know. In a message dated 7/15/2014 9:19:36 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jblake207@comcast.net writes: Use the MMO Ernie, but only if you wear a flight suit and helmet. :-) JB ____________________________________ From: "Ernest Martinez" Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2014 3:04:44 AM Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil Thanks Pappy, Walt, Jan, I do remember having a lot more oil pour out of my exhaust during prop pull thru, with the X/C. W120 it is then. Should I use MMO? Just kidding, :) No really, I'm just kidding. Ernie On Tuesday, July 15, 2014, Jan Mevis <_jan.mevis@informavia.be_ (mailto:jan.mevis@informavia.be) > wrote: Excellent Walt! Jan From: Walter Lannon <_wlannon@shaw.ca_ (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','wlannon@shaw.ca');) > (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','yak-list@matronics.com');) " <_y ak-list@matronics.com_ (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','yak-list@matronics.com');) > (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','yak-list@matronics.com');) " <_y ak-list@matronics.com_ (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','yak-list@matronics.com');) > Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil Hi Ernie; I would recommend that you stay with the Aeroshell W oils. Your location does not experience severe temperature changes so W100 winter and W120 summer should be just fine. With just one exception all of the approved aviation (piston) engine oils are mineral oils. This includes the Phillips X/C 20W50 and 25W60. As fa r as I know, the only difference (if you can refer to it as such) between radial and opposed engine oils is the recommended viscosity. There is no such thing as an aviation detergent oil (though I believe there was, brief ly, some 60 + years ago). There are three basic varieties of aviation minera l oils. 1. No additives (straight) e.g: 100 SUS or 50 SAE. 2. An ashless dispersant additive (AD oils) e.g: W100/ W50. ( the W is used by Aeroshell & Phillips other companies may have different designators) 3. Multi-Grade AD oils with a viscosity modifier added e.g: Phillips X/C 25W60, Aeroshell 15W50. Both use SAE viscosity numbers (60 SAE = 1 20 SUS). The exception referred to above is the Aeroshell multi-grade. It is a 50% synthetic. It appears to be a very good oil for relatively modern opposed engines but I would not use it in any radial. Apparently it has been improved over the years but:- I used it in an E225 Continental years ago and found (compared to the previous W100) the oil pressure dropped, oil temp. increased and, over time, it seeped right through the crankcase! About the same time a friend put it in his Harvard (R1340) and shortly after parked it for about 3 months. When he returned there was no oil left. Personally I have been using 25W60 for some time in CJ=99s and Harva rd=99s primarily due to the seasonal temperature change ( =9310C to 40C). Walt From: _Ernest Martinez_ (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','erniel29@gmail.com');) Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 3:13 PM (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','yak-list@matronics.com');) Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil I'm currently on Aeroshell W100. But I'm in Florida and wondering if W120 would be better for the hot weather here. But I have to say that this is one of the driest Housai motors I've seen. Ernie On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 5:20 PM, Jim <_jim@jimivey.com_ (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','jim@jimivey.com');) > wrote: Ernie, You didn't specify if the Aeroshell your airplane has been using was W100, W120 or a multi-grade . I use Aeroshell W120 and found it best for my high temperature environment. Years ago I got smart and tried multi-weigh t and even worse added Lenkite. The thing leaked out oil like shit out of a Christmas goose. Went back to Aeroshell W120 and haven't looked back. Even more important would be an engine (unlike yours) that had been run on non-detergent mineral oil. A good way to die would be switching from straight mineral oil to detergent oil (AD). I know somebody that had a to tal catastrophic failure when he switched to AD oil and the detergent did it's job and loosened up all the "sleeping" gunk and deposits in the engine whi ch plugged the oil system. Over Lake Washington. It is never a good idea to switch horses midstream (say after 100SMOH or so) when it comes to oil. Jim On 7/14/2014 1:37 PM, DaBear wrote: Ernie, I=99ve used the 25/60 multi-weight oil for both of my M14=99s and I did switch from the 100W that the previous owner used to the 25w60 for the Ho usai. That said, I wouldn=99t switch from 100W unless you really had a rea son. One thing with the 100w is that since many of the flat engine airplanes us e it, it is easier to find while travelling. Good luck with the new CJ Bear From: _owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com_ (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','owner-yak-list-server@matronics.c om');) [_mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com_ (javascript-blocked-blocked:_e({},'cvml','owner-yak-list-server@matronics.c om');) ] On Behalf Of Ernest Martinez Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 1:15 PM Subject: Yak-List: Oil In my previous CJ I used to use the Phillips 25/60 Radial Engine Oil and was happy with it. My new plane has been running AeroShell all of it's US life ( 12+ years) and it's a strong, very dry, motor thats working just fi ne with excellent oil analysis trends. My first thought was to switch to the Phillips at next oil change, but then my 2nd thought was "if it aint broke don't fix it". I was hoping to get some thoughts on this, since I'm not sure what makes "Radial Engine Oil" any different than flat engine oil. Ernie http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List _http://forums.matronics.com_ (http://forums.matronics.com/) http://www.matronics.com/contribution et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List tp://_forums.matronics.com_ (http://forums.matronics.com/) _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.c om/Navigator?Yak-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c _ww.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List_ (http://ww.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List) com _ronics.com/contribution_ (http://ronics.com/contribution) et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution et=_blank data-mce-href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.ma tronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List a-mce-href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com blan k data-mce-href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronic s.co m/contribution ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 11:10:56 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Air Digram From: Ernest Martinez Does anyone have a really good Air Schematic for a CJ that they could forward to me. The one I have is tiny and hard to read. I remember years back someone created a really nice color one, I've searched the archives and see it mentioned but can't find a link to the actual diagram. Thanks Ernie ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:20:17 AM PST US From: Colin McGeachy Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air Digram Here you go. On 15 July 2014 14:10, Ernest Martinez wrote: > Does anyone have a really good Air Schematic for a CJ that they could > forward to me. The one I have is tiny and hard to read. I remember years > back someone created a really nice color one, I've searched the archives > and see it mentioned but can't find a link to the actual diagram. > > Thanks > > Ernie > > * > > > * > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:28:12 AM PST US From: Robin Hou Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air Digram See attached. Not sure if it will come through. If not, please email me. Robin On Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:21 AM, Ernest Martinez wrote: Does anyone have a really good Air Schematic for a CJ that they could forward to me. The one I have is tiny and hard to read. I remember years back someone created a really nice color one, I've searched the archives and see it mentioned but can't find a link to the actual diagram. Thanks Ernie ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:53:32 AM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air Digram From: Ernest Martinez Very nice thanks! Ernie On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 2:18 PM, Colin McGeachy wrote: > Here you go. > > > On 15 July 2014 14:10, Ernest Martinez wrote: > >> Does anyone have a really good Air Schematic for a CJ that they could >> forward to me. The one I have is tiny and hard to read. I remember years >> back someone created a really nice color one, I've searched the archives >> and see it mentioned but can't find a link to the actual diagram. >> >> Thanks >> >> Ernie >> >> * >> >> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >> * >> >> > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:04:22 PM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Pressure Problem From: Warren Hill Mark, Wanted to thank you for the insights below. Had several episodes of an intermittent in-flight gear up problem associated with loud hissing from the forward cockpit gear actuator selector. Long story short, the problem ended up being a main gear actuator seal. Ended up eventually replacing all three gear actuators. Problem solved. Great explanation that helped me figure this one out. The tired old joke is that we fly these airplanes to see what needs to be fixed next. Warren Hill N464TW Mesa, AZ On Jun 25, 2014, at 9:10 AM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD wrote: > > Actually Keith, the gear selector in the YAK is something you really need to know in detail. When I first got my 50, I noticed that the gear handle "had a leak". I removed it from the aircraft, took it all apart, and there was not a darn thing wrong with it. This was about 14 years ago. > > I reverse engineered every single air-line in that darn thing and finally figured it out, which it today pretty much common knowledge. > > You're right about the port but it is important to know that the air you hear venting is coming from the OPPOSITE SIDE of the actuators that you are trying to pressurize. In other words, picture this: If you have an actuator and push on it in one direction, the internal plunger is going to push air OUT the other side! And that air has to go SOMEPLACE and that "someplace" is out the vent you are talking about. > > So when you put the gear handle DOWN, air goes in and forces the actuators to move. The air on the OPPOSITE side of that piston is then pushed out of the actuator, up through the air lines, to the gear actuator and out the vent. > > An important things to realize about this. > > The actuators are internally sealed (in the YAK-50) with rubber Chevron Seals. These can fail, meaning they will leak. This is of course a very bad thing and needs to be corrected immediately. How do you know it is happening? Because when the gear goes down (or up) and the handle is left in that position, air pressure is constantly fed to the piston in the actuator. If the internal seals leak, the air will come out the opposite side of the actuator, go up the air-lines to the gear actuator handle and HISS out of the vent port constantly. This can leak you to believe you have a bad gear actuator selector when in fact you have a serious problem in your gear actuator(s)! > > So bottom line, if you hear air hissing out of the gear actuator lever in the cockpit, do not immediately assume there is a leak in the gear selector, instead check to see if it is coming out of the VENT in which case, suspect a leaking gear actuator seal. > > Mark > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of keithmckinley > Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2014 9:30 AM > To: yak-list@matronics.com > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Pressure Problem > > > The gear and flap selector valve has a small port that will vent air when the selector is moved from one position to the other. I've had one of these selector valves leak so bad through this port I could not build full pressure. > If you have started playing with the ones in the rear cockpit you may start there. > > Mine was a CJ and I believe the selectors are the same in a Yak > > -------- > Keith McKinley > 700HS > X26 Sebastian, FL > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=425447#425447 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:32:51 PM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air Digram From: Ernest Martinez Now I just need something on the diagram interpreted. I assumed that the flap circuit was similar to the gear circuit, but according this this diagram that Collin sent me the flap valves both have their air provided at the center port. The only difference is the diverter valves on the aft cockpit flap valve (according to the drawing, the diverters I'm assuming are near the actuator). Am I to interpret this as: Air from the aft flap valve has precedence over air from the forward flap valve at the diverter valves? Ernie On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 2:53 PM, Ernest Martinez wrote: > Very nice thanks! > > Ernie > > > On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 2:18 PM, Colin McGeachy > wrote: > >> Here you go. >> >> >> >> >> On 15 July 2014 14:10, Ernest Martinez wrote: >> >>> Does anyone have a really good Air Schematic for a CJ that they could >>> forward to me. The one I have is tiny and hard to read. I remember years >>> back someone created a really nice color one, I've searched the archives >>> and see it mentioned but can't find a link to the actual diagram. >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> Ernie >>> >>> * >>> >>> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >>> tp://forums.matronics.com >>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >>> >>> * >>> >>> >> > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:43:00 PM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: DG Cockpit Gauge From: Hank Gibson Hello all- anyone have a working Directional Gyro gauge (ZH-4) willing to pa rt with? Pls contact me off list. hkgibby@yahoo.com/904-738-3240. Tks- Hoot Sent from my iPhone > On Jul 15, 2014, at 2:18 PM, Colin McGeachy wrot e: > > Here you go. > > > > >> On 15 July 2014 14:10, Ernest Martinez wrote: >> Does anyone have a really good Air Schematic for a CJ that they could for ward to me. The one I have is tiny and hard to read. I remember years back s omeone created a really nice color one, I've searched the archives and see i t mentioned but can't find a link to the actual diagram. >> >> Thanks >> >> Ernie >> >> >> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:52:43 PM PST US From: "Tom Elliott" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Air Digram You are correct. Tom Elliott CJ-6A NX63727 777 Quartz Ave PMB 7004 Sandy Valley NV 89019 Cell 541-297-5497 N13472@AOL.COM From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest Martinez Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2014 12:32 PM Subject: Re: Yak-List: Air Digram Now I just need something on the diagram interpreted. I assumed that the flap circuit was similar to the gear circuit, but according this this diagram that Collin sent me the flap valves both have their air provided at the center port. The only difference is the diverter valves on the aft cockpit flap valve (according to the drawing, the diverters I'm assuming are near the actuator). Am I to interpret this as: Air from the aft flap valve has precedence over air from the forward flap valve at the diverter valves? Ernie On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 2:53 PM, Ernest Martinez wrote: Very nice thanks! Ernie On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 2:18 PM, Colin McGeachy wrote: Here you go. On 15 July 2014 14:10, Ernest Martinez wrote: Does anyone have a really good Air Schematic for a CJ that they could forward to me. The one I have is tiny and hard to read. I remember years back someone created a really nice color one, I've searched the archives and see it mentioned but can't find a link to the actual diagram. Thanks Ernie et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 07/15/14 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 04:39:25 PM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Operating Limits Letter From: Ernest Martinez The previous owner of my airplane lost his ops limits, and I've forgotten the procedure to get them with the new Home base etc. Can someone fill me in. Thanks Ernie ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 05:39:13 PM PST US From: Keith Pickford Subject: Re: Yak-List: Oil =0A"driest housai I've ever seen" =0A=0A=0AJust means it hasn't got any oil in it=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Tuesday, 15 July 2014 10:23 AM, Ernest Martinez wrote:=0A =0A=0A=0AI'm currently on Aeroshell W100. But I'm in Florida and wondering if W120 would be better for the hot weather here. But I have to say that this is one of the driest Housai motors I've seen. =0A=0AErnie=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 5:20 PM, Jim wrote:=0A=0AErnie,=0A>=0A>You didn't specify if the Aeroshell your airpl ane has been using=0A was W100, W120 or a multi-grade .=C2- I use Ae roshell W120 and found=0A it best for my high temperature environment. =C2- Years ago I got=0A smart and tried multi-weight and even worse added Lenkite.=C2- The=0A thing leaked out oil like shit out of a Ch ristmas goose.=C2- Went=0A back to Aeroshell W120 and haven't looked back.=0A>=0A>Even more important would be an engine (unlike yours) that ha d=0A been run on non-detergent mineral oil.=C2- A good way to die wo uld be=0A switching from straight mineral oil to detergent oil (AD). =C2- I know=0A somebody that had a total catastrophic failure when h e switched to=0A AD oil and the detergent did it's job and loosened up all the=0A "sleeping" gunk and deposits in the engine which plugged t he oil=0A system.=C2- Over Lake Washington.=0A>=0A>It is never a goo d idea to switch horses midstream (say after=0A 100SMOH or so) when it comes to oil.=0A>=0A>Jim=0A>=0A>=0A>On 7/14/2014 1:37 PM, DaBear wrote:=0A >=0A>Ernie,=0A>>=C2-=0A>>I=99ve used the 25/60 multi-weight oil for both of my M14=99s and I did switch from the 100W that the previous owner used to the 25w60 for the Housai.=C2- That said, I wouldn=99t switch from 100W unless you really had a reason.=C2- One thing with the 100w is that since many of the flat engine airplanes use it, it is easier t o find while travelling.=0A>>=C2-=0A>>Good luck with the new CJ=0A>>=C2 -=0A>>Bear=0A>>=C2-=0A>>From:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailt o:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest Martinez=0A>>Sen t: Monday, July 14, 2014 1:15 PM=0A>>To: yak-list=0A>>Subject: Yak-List: Oi l=0A>>=C2-=0A>>In my previous CJ I used to use the Phillips 25/60 Radial Engine Oil and was happy with it. My new plane has been running AeroShell a ll of it's US life ( 12+ years) and it's a strong, very dry, motor thats wo rking just fine with excellent oil analysis trends.=C2-=0A>>=C2-=0A>>My first thought was to switch to the Phillips at next oil change, but then m y 2nd thought was "if it aint broke don't fix it".=0A>>=C2-=0A>>I was hop ing to get some thoughts on this, since I'm not sure what makes "Radial Eng ine Oil" any different than flat engine oil.=0A>>=C2-=0A>>Ernie=0A>>=C2 -=0A>>=C2-=0A>>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List=0A>>http://f orums.matronics.com=0A>>http://www.matronics.com/contribution=0A>>=C2-=0A >=0A>et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List=0Atp://forum ========= ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 10:19:48 PM PST US From: Richard Hess Subject: Re: Yak-List: Operating Limits Letter FAA has them on file Richard Hess C 404-964-4885 > On Jul 16, 2014, at 1:38, Ernest Martinez wrote: > > The previous owner of my airplane lost his ops limits, and I've forgotten t he procedure to get them with the new Home base etc. > > Can someone fill me in. > > Thanks > > Ernie > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message yak-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Yak-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/yak-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/yak-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.