Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:51 AM - Re: Propeller not responding on ground at 70% (Richard Goode)
2. 01:08 AM - Re: Compressor shearing shaft. (Richard Goode)
3. 04:53 AM - Re: Propeller not responding on ground at 70% (George Coy)
4. 06:15 AM - Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Rico Jaeger)
5. 06:38 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Ernest Martinez)
6. 06:56 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Roger Kemp)
7. 06:59 AM - Re: Compressor shearing shaft. (Byron M Fox)
8. 07:20 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Rico Jaeger)
9. 09:04 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (doug sapp)
10. 09:19 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD)
11. 09:30 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Rico Jaeger)
12. 09:40 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD)
13. 09:51 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Rico Jaeger)
14. 10:00 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Roger Kemp)
15. 10:06 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD)
16. 10:07 AM - Re: Compressor shearing shaft. (Richard Goode)
17. 10:07 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD)
18. 10:19 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Didier Blouzard)
19. 10:23 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Rico Jaeger)
20. 10:24 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Gary Gabbard)
21. 10:32 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Rico Jaeger)
22. 10:41 AM - FW: Compressor shearing shaft. (George S. Coy)
23. 11:01 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD)
24. 11:05 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Roger Kemp)
25. 11:11 AM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Roger Kemp)
26. 12:19 PM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Richard Hess)
27. 09:34 PM - Fw: Compressor shearing shaft. (Byron M Fox)
28. 10:17 PM - Re: Compressor shearing shaft. (kingcj6@aol.com)
29. 10:27 PM - Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown (Jan Mevis)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Propeller not responding on ground at 70% |
I suggest you check the small filter for the oil going into the governor
if this gets clogged, the governor cannot operate correctly.
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of YAKY52
Sent: 10 September 2014 23:40
Subject: Yak-List: Propeller not responding on ground at 70%
Hello Yakkers,
I need advices on this subject...
Airplane didn't fly for 45days no issue last time I flew And I ran the
engine.
After an oil change I did the engine run, normal warm up 40 /120,
cycling the prop at 70% nothing happened, ZERO REACTION, but oil Pressure
slightly drop.
2nd run I tried to look the screen in the hub nothing found, 82/85% power,
same condition, prop cycling down to 56%.
Intermediate setting 72 % -80% irregular dropping in percentage.
I have tough either pressure problem on governor, some kind of dirt
somewhere...the p rop cable is in place and secure.
Any advise or idea would be very appreciate.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430323#430323
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Compressor shearing shaft. |
There are just two rivets, but they are a special and quite soft steel that
is designed to shear if the load to the compressor becomes too great. If,
however, they are too strong, then they will not shear and can cause damage
elsewhere.
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of YAKY52
Sent: 10 September 2014 23:47
Subject: Yak-List: Compressor shearing shaft.
I toke off compressor from the airplane because I didn't have any pressure
building in the bottle.
Results the two pieces of the shafts sheared in correspondence of the
joining rivets.
No big deal simple repair but.....
How many rivets are supposed to be fitted in the two half of the shafts??
There is space for 6 of them but I found just 2 steel rivets which looks a
bit too weak setting to me.
Any suggestion or personal experience or knowledge???
Thank you.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430325#430325
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Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Propeller not responding on ground at 70% |
I suspect that he may have the blades frozen in the hub. Remove the dome on the
piston on the front of the prop and see if you can rotate the blades freely
Sent from my iPad
> On Sep 10, 2014, at 6:39 PM, "YAKY52" <vulavula@libero.it> wrote:
>
>
> Hello Yakkers,
>
> I need advices on this subject...
>
> Airplane didn't fly for 45days no issue last time I flew And I ran the engine.
>
> After an oil change I did the engine run, normal warm up 40 /120, cycling the
prop at 70% nothing happened, ZERO REACTION, but oil Pressure slightly drop.
>
> 2nd run I tried to look the screen in the hub nothing found,
> 82/85% power, same condition, prop cycling down to 56%.
>
> Intermediate setting 72 % -80% irregular dropping in percentage.
>
> I have tough either pressure problem on governor, some kind of dirt somewhere...the
p
> rop cable is in place and secure.
>
> Any advise or idea would be very appreciate.
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430323#430323
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down=2C my prop spins bac
kwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen co
nsistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards rot
ation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau=2C WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Could be something as simple as a piston rising up during the compression
stroke during shutdown but not reaching TDC, and the pressure in the
cylinder just pushes back against the piston.
Ernie
On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 9:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop spins
> backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen
> consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards
> rotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
>
> Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Rico,
What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% for 10 s
ec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire and die
seling at higher temps.
Doc
Sent from my iPhone
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop spins back
wards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen cons
istently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards rotati
on can also shear the compressor coupling...?
>
> Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
>
>
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
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>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Compressor shearing shaft. |
This compressor shear pin failure has happened twice to the M14P on my CJ. I
n both cases, the compressor overheated because of insufficient ram air cool
ing. The compressor's piston was gummed up with deteriorated oil which had b
ecome a gritty substance.
The fix was to copy the compressor cooling horn/shroud from a Yak 18T. It de
livers more cooling ram air because it half surrounds the compressor. It's c
onstructed of carbon fiber. The local fellow who built it for me intends the
produce more, but can't seem to find the time to create a master plug from w
hich copies can be replicated. He's had several requests. I'll bug him again
. Hope the photos come through.
Blitz Fox
415-307-2405
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 1:05 AM, "Richard Goode" <richard.goode@russianaeros.c
om> wrote:
>
s.com>
>
> There are just two rivets, but they are a special and quite soft steel tha
t
> is designed to shear if the load to the compressor becomes too great. If,
> however, they are too strong, then they will not shear and can cause damag
e
> elsewhere.
>
> Richard Goode Aerobatics
> Rhodds Farm
> Lyonshall
> Hereford
> HR5 3LW
>
> Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
> Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
> www.russianaeros.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of YAKY52
> Sent: 10 September 2014 23:47
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Yak-List: Compressor shearing shaft.
>
>
> I toke off compressor from the airplane because I didn't have any pressure
> building in the bottle.
> Results the two pieces of the shafts sheared in correspondence of the
> joining rivets.
> No big deal simple repair but.....
>
> How many rivets are supposed to be fitted in the two half of the shafts??
>
> There is space for 6 of them but I found just 2 steel rivets which looks a
> bit too weak setting to me.
>
> Any suggestion or personal experience or knowledge???
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430325#430325
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by
> MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
>
>
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>
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Message 8
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Great point=2C Doc. I'm embarrassed to say I don't pay that much attention
to shut down temps and just look for needles in the green. The only time my
Cylinder Temp creeps into the upper yellow band is when I'm above 95% on i
nitial climb out. But as soon as I back it down to about 85-90% it settles
reliably back in the green and stays there. It's typically pretty cool up h
ere in cheeseland w/ a fairly lengthy taxi back to the T=2C so temps have a
good chance to simmer down. I will be more attentive to specific readings
next time - hopefully tonight! THANK YOU!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau=2C WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
From: f16viperdoc@me.com
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
Rico=2C What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70
% for 10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misf
ire and dieseling at higher temps. Doc
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 11=2C 2014=2C at 8:13 AM=2C Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wro
te:
=0A
=0A
=0A
Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down=2C my prop spins bac
kwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen co
nsistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards rot
ation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau=2C WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
=0A
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D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=0A
ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List=0A
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
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ot=3B">http://www.matronics.com/contribution=0A
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Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
What is your shut down procedure?
What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
Doug
On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
> Rico,
> What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% for
> 10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire
> and dieseling at higher temps.
> Doc
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop spins
> backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen
> consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards
> rotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
>
> Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
> *
>
> D============================================
> ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>
> D============================================
> //forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
> D============================================
> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
> D============================================
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
I'd also be curious what exact plugs are being used... Russian or Automobile and
if the latter what heat range.
Also, have you modified the carb in any way?
Mark
p.s. A sudden reversal in direction of rotation does indeed put a load on sheer
couplings. Compressor, generator, mags, you name it.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of doug sapp
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:03 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
What is your shut down procedure?
What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
Doug
On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
Rico,
What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% for
10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire and
dieseling at higher temps.
Doc
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop
spins backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen
consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards
rotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau, WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
Message 11
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
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Message 12
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
This might open an interesting discussion.
The Russian instructions I have call for pulling the engine back to idle (same
as you) and right after killing the mags, opening the throttle all the way until
the engine stops rotating, and then return to idle.
I have been doing that for years. Curious if others ever read it.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:28 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
Doug,
Russian mags.
I lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler open, run up to 65% or so during which
time I shut off all nonessential electrical (master / ignition / generator and
engine instruments still ON) and pull off my headset or helmet so I may hear
anything unusual - this is usually about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds, smoothly
pull throttle back to idle for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill master / ignition
/ generator. After that - unlock brakes / shut off air / hop out and kill
rear mags, open cylinder drain and push in. I think that covers it as I currently
sit at my desk... :)
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau, WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
________________________________
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
From: dougsappllc@gmail.com
What is your shut down procedure?
What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
Doug
On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
Rico,
What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% for
10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire and
dieseling at higher temps.
Doc
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop
spins backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen
consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards
rotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau, WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
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Message 14
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|
| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Have tried it both ways. Savage x 10sec, idle, mags off, full advance or no advance.
Seems CHT drove counter rotation for me in this LA heat.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 11:37 AM, "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
wrote:
>
>
> This might open an interesting discussion.
>
> The Russian instructions I have call for pulling the engine back to idle (same
as you) and right after killing the mags, opening the throttle all the way until
the engine stops rotating, and then return to idle.
>
> I have been doing that for years. Curious if others ever read it.
>
> Mark
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
> Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:28 PM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
>
> Doug,
>
> Russian mags.
>
>
> I lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler open, run up to 65% or so during which
time I shut off all nonessential electrical (master / ignition / generator
and engine instruments still ON) and pull off my headset or helmet so I may hear
anything unusual - this is usually about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds, smoothly
pull throttle back to idle for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill master / ignition
/ generator. After that - unlock brakes / shut off air / hop out and kill
rear mags, open cylinder drain and push in. I think that covers it as I currently
sit at my desk... :)
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 09:03:21 -0700
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
> From: dougsappllc@gmail.com
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>
>
> What is your shut down procedure?
> What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
>
> Doug
>
> On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
>
>
> Rico,
> What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% for
10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire and
dieseling at higher temps.
> Doc
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop
spins backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen
consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards
rotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
>
> Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
>
//
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
>
>
>
> D============================================
> ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
> D============================================
> //forums.matronics.com
> D============================================
> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> D============================================
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ) {l 7 r h M4 Mi z . ' N jB &j)E R ' Ey n j j + j|
n )b ' !j ' + + I r yhi k k h y ! ! j ~m ' o j
j +a a 0 k x & 4N4 X@E9
> I& z j ( l V j ^Y ky m ~ ' hm ~ ' o .+- & *'Y
. + :W @vh j ~m ' o{k 0 k x & ' o
) {l 7 r h M4 Mi z . ' N jB &j)E R '
> Ey n j j +
> j| n )b ' !j ' + + I r yhi k k h y ! ! j ~m '
o j j +a a 0 k x & 4N4 X@E9
> I& z j ( l V j ^Y ky m ~ ' hm ~ ' o .+- & *'Y
. + :W @vh j ~m ' o{k 0 k x & ' o
>
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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|
| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Rico, the only time I have had reverse rotation was long ago when I experimented
with using automobile fuel. With the lower octane fuel, the engine often continued
to "run on" and sometimes did a rapid reversal as you have detailed.
One time it did that and sheered the generator coupling, and right after that
I said phooey to auto gas! This was back in the days before they started mixing
in alcohol.
The reason I mentioned plugs is because if heat ranges are changed the plug can
retain enough heat to cause a form of ignition. Glad you did not do that.
And of course, I have to add that I run MMO in my fuel. Quite a bit of it in fact.
About half a quart to 30 gallons of fuel, but that fuel is now 100% BLUE
Low Lead AvGas. :-)
You might just try that simple trick of opening the throttle all the way after
the mags are secured. In fact, more than once I have done both simultaneously.
I.E. Push the throttle up rapidly at the exact same time with the other hand
I kill the mag switch. I have never had a run on, or backwards spin using
that method. Not once.
Of course, there are so many other variables... but it is worth a shot.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:51 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
Mark,
I just had a "lister" reply w/ that MAGS OFF / THROTTLE OPEN tip off-list. As
far as plugs, I have Dennis' conversion and abide steadfastly to his specific
instructions.
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau, WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
> From: mark.bitterlich@navy.mil
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 16:37:47 +0000
>
> --> <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>
> This might open an interesting discussion.
>
> The Russian instructions I have call for pulling the engine back to idle (same
as you) and right after killing the mags, opening the throttle all the way until
the engine stops rotating, and then return to idle.
>
> I have been doing that for years. Curious if others ever read it.
>
> Mark
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
> Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:28 PM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
>
> Doug,
>
> Russian mags.
>
>
> I lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler open, run up to 65% or so
> during which time I shut off all nonessential electrical (master /
> ignition / generator and engine instruments still ON) and pull off my
> headset or helmet so I may hear anything unusual - this is usually
> about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds, smoothly pull throttle back to idle
> for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill master / ignition / generator.
> After that - unlock brakes / shut off air / hop out and kill rear
> mags, open cylinder drain and push in. I think that covers it as I
> currently sit at my desk... :)
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 09:03:21 -0700
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
> From: dougsappllc@gmail.com
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>
>
> What is your shut down procedure?
> What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
>
> Doug
>
> On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
>
>
> Rico,
> What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% for 10 sec.?
Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire and dieseling
at higher temps.
> Doc
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop spins backwards
a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen consistently
- maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards rotation can
also shear the compressor coupling...?
>
> Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
>
>
>
> D======================
> =====================
> ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
> D======================
> =====================
> //forums.matronics.com
> D======================
> =====================
> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> D======================
> =====================
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ) {l 7 r h M4 Mi z . ' N jB &j)E R ' Ey n j j + j| n )b ' !j
> ' + + I r yhi k k h y ! ! j ~m ' o j j +a a 0 k x & 4N4 X@E9 I& z
j ( l V j ^Y ky m ~ ' hm ~ ' o .+- & *'Y . + :W @vh j ~m ' o{k 0 k
x & ' o ) {l 7 r h M4 Mi z . ' N jB &j)E R '
> Ey n j j +
> j| n )b ' !j ' + + I r yhi k k h y ! ! j ~m '
> o j j +a a 0 k x & 4N4 X@E9 I& z j ( l V j ^Y ky m ~
> ' hm ~ ' o .+- & *'Y . + :W @vh j ~m ' o{k 0 k
> x & ' o
>
>
>
>
>
) {l 7 r h M4 Mi z . ' N jB &j)E R '
Ey n j j +
j| n )b ' !j ' + + I r yhi k k h y ! ! j ~m '
o j j +a a 0 k x & 4N4 X@E9
I& z j ( l V j ^Y ky m ~ ' hm ~ ' o .+- & *'Y
. + :W @vh j ~m ' o{k 0 k x & ' o
Message 16
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|
| Subject: | Compressor shearing shaft. |
It is also worth saying that these compressors are not that strong and often
fail before the engine reaches its TBO. There are two solutions - the first
is to make sure it is well-cooled, in that I know of many installations
where they do not have cold air ducted onto them and will inevitably fail,
or, at its least, reduce the life.
The other is to have a cockpit controlled tap with which one can
remove all the load from the compressor once pressure has been built up,
which means that, for most the time, it is operating at no load and will
have a much longer life. Of course, you need to remember to shut the tap
before landing so you still have a compressor for flaps and brakes!
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of YAKY52
Sent: 10 September 2014 23:47
Subject: Yak-List: Compressor shearing shaft.
I toke off compressor from the airplane because I didn't have any pressure
building in the bottle.
Results the two pieces of the shafts sheared in correspondence of the
joining rivets.
No big deal simple repair but.....
How many rivets are supposed to be fitted in the two half of the shafts??
There is space for 6 of them but I found just 2 steel rivets which looks a
bit too weak setting to me.
Any suggestion or personal experience or knowledge???
Thank you.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430325#430325
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by
MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
Message 17
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Concur that heat would be a big factor inducing this situation as well.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:59 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
Have tried it both ways. Savage x 10sec, idle, mags off, full advance or no advance.
Seems CHT drove counter rotation for me in this LA heat.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 11:37 AM, "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD" <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
wrote:
>
> --> <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>
> This might open an interesting discussion.
>
> The Russian instructions I have call for pulling the engine back to idle (same
as you) and right after killing the mags, opening the throttle all the way until
the engine stops rotating, and then return to idle.
>
> I have been doing that for years. Curious if others ever read it.
>
> Mark
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
> Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:28 PM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
>
> Doug,
>
> Russian mags.
>
>
> I lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler open, run up to 65% or so
> during which time I shut off all nonessential electrical (master /
> ignition / generator and engine instruments still ON) and pull off my
> headset or helmet so I may hear anything unusual - this is usually
> about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds, smoothly pull throttle back to idle
> for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill master / ignition / generator.
> After that - unlock brakes / shut off air / hop out and kill rear
> mags, open cylinder drain and push in. I think that covers it as I
> currently sit at my desk... :)
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 09:03:21 -0700
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
> From: dougsappllc@gmail.com
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>
>
> What is your shut down procedure?
> What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
>
> Doug
>
> On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
>
>
> Rico,
> What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% for
10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire and
dieseling at higher temps.
> Doc
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop
spins backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen
consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards
rotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
>
> Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
>
//
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
> D============================================
> ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
> D============================================
> //forums.matronics.com
> D============================================
> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
> D======================
> =====================
>
>
> ) {l 7 r h M4 Mi z . ' N jB &j)E R ' Ey n j j + j|
n )b ' !j ' + + I r yhi k k h y ! ! j ~m ' o j
j +a a 0 k x & 4N4 X@E9
> I& z j ( l V j ^Y ky m ~ ' hm ~ ' o .+- & *'Y
. + :W @vh j ~m ' o{k 0 k x & ' o
) {l 7 r h M4 Mi z . ' N jB &j)E R '
> Ey n j j +
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. + :W @vh j ~m ' o{k 0 k x & ' o
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
The book says to shut down at 150.
160 is accepted but if it happen that you shut down at 170 you should write
it in your logbook
So the normal shutdown temperature is between 150 and 160.
Didier
2014-09-11 15:13 GMT+02:00 Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com>:
> Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop spins
> backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happ
en
> consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards
> rotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
>
> Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
> *
>
===========
nics.com/Navigator?Yak-List>
===========
===========
om/contribution>
===========
>
> *
>
>
--
____________________________
Didier BLOUZARD
Directeur G=C3=A9n=C3=A9ral DATEXIS
Portable : +33 6 51 84 48 02
Email: didier.blouzard@gmail.com <didier.blouzard@anolistech.fr>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
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Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Rico, check the idle speed. It should be 26% minimum. If slower then the but
terfly in the carburetor throat will be closed more. If it is the engine wil
l suck in more fuel with the throttle closed and that can cause a kick back.
Worth looking at. Gary. CJ N22YK
Sent from my iPhone
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 9:28, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Doug,
>
> Russian mags.
>
> I lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler open, run up to 65% or so during
which time I shut off all nonessential electrical (master / ignition / gene
rator and engine instruments still ON) and pull off my headset or helmet so I
may hear anything unusual - this is usually about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds,
smoothly pull throttle back to idle for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill m
aster / ignition / generator. After that - unlock brakes / shut off air / ho
p out and kill rear mags, open cylinder drain and push in. I think that cove
rs it as I currently sit at my desk... :)
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
>
>
> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 09:03:21 -0700
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
> From: dougsappllc@gmail.com
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>
> What is your shut down procedure?
> What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
>
> Doug
>
> On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
> Rico,
> What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% for 1
0 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire and d
ieseling at higher temps.
> Doc
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop spins back
wards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen cons
istently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards rotati
on can also shear the compressor coupling...?
>
> Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
>
>
> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
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> ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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>
>
>
==========================
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Message 21
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
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CQkgIA=
Message 22
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| Subject: | Compressor shearing shaft. |
We have new couplings with original shear pins installed in stock. Contact
off list.
George Coy
MotorstarNA
714 Airport Rd.
Swanton VT 05488
802-868-5633 off
802-363-5782 cell
802-868-4465 Fax
george.coy@gmail.com
http://motorstarna.com/
SKYPE george.coy
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Goode
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 1:06 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Compressor shearing shaft.
--> <richard.goode@russianaeros.com>
It is also worth saying that these compressors are not that strong and often
fail before the engine reaches its TBO. There are two solutions - the first
is to make sure it is well-cooled, in that I know of many installations
where they do not have cold air ducted onto them and will inevitably fail,
or, at its least, reduce the life.
The other is to have a cockpit controlled tap with which one can
remove all the load from the compressor once pressure has been built up,
which means that, for most the time, it is operating at no load and will
have a much longer life. Of course, you need to remember to shut the tap
before landing so you still have a compressor for flaps and brakes!
Richard Goode Aerobatics
Rhodds Farm
Lyonshall
Hereford
HR5 3LW
Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
www.russianaeros.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of YAKY52
Sent: 10 September 2014 23:47
Subject: Yak-List: Compressor shearing shaft.
I toke off compressor from the airplane because I didn't have any pressure
building in the bottle.
Results the two pieces of the shafts sheared in correspondence of the
joining rivets.
No big deal simple repair but.....
How many rivets are supposed to be fitted in the two half of the shafts??
There is space for 6 of them but I found just 2 steel rivets which looks a
bit too weak setting to me.
Any suggestion or personal experience or knowledge???
Thank you.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430325#430325
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by
MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
Message 23
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| Subject: | Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
RICO! Why in heavens name is that mess happening? When you bring the engine
to idle, there should be a very clean change-over to battery load. I am assuming
you are using a fully stock Russian generator and charging system.
The very first thing you should check is battery voltage under load. Just turn
on everything as you normally would and check battery voltage without the engine
running. If it is down below 12 volts, change your batteries. This is pretty
important by the way.
Your indications are pointing to not enough current being available to trip the
reverse current relay properly. This is typically due to bad batteries.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 1:32 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
Thanks for that, Gary! Again - I'll have to start paying better attention to numbers.
Most of the time my "idle" is about 35% - otherwise my generator cuts out
and the radio garbles, GPS cycles and cockpit lighting goes dark. But for shutdown,
my final pull is always back to the stops. I'd have to say I'm right
in there at that 25%'ish range...
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau, WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
________________________________
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
From: ggg6@att.net
Rico, check the idle speed. It should be 26% minimum. If slower then the butterfly
in the carburetor throat will be closed more. If it is the engine will suck
in more fuel with the throttle closed and that can cause a kick back. Worth
looking at. Gary. CJ N22YK
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 11, 2014, at 9:28, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
Doug,
Russian mags.
I lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler open, run up to 65% or so during
which time I shut off all nonessential electrical (master / ignition / generator
and engine instruments still ON) and pull off my headset or helmet so I
may hear anything unusual - this is usually about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds, smoothly
pull throttle back to idle for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill master
/ ignition / generator. After that - unlock brakes / shut off air / hop out
and kill rear mags, open cylinder drain and push in. I think that covers it as
I currently sit at my desk... :)
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau, WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
________________________________
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 09:03:21 -0700
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
From: dougsappllc@gmail.com
To: yak-list@matronics.com
What is your shut down procedure?
What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
Doug
On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
Rico,
What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine
@ 70% for 10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire
and dieseling at higher temps.
Doc
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down,
my prop spins backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't
happen consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards
rotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau, WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G
//
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
D============================================
ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
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==================================
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Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Yeah, it would. Will not it takes full throttle to taxi and will have a lot o
f vibration depending on how asymmetrical your blades are.
Doc
Sent from my iPad
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 12:22 PM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> This is fantastic, guys! THANK YOU for sharing - I will try the "Throttle U
p" trick and report back after a few runs.
>
> I suppose "Gear Up" would prevent unsolicited rotation as well... :")
>
> Your patience and knowledge is greatly appreciated. And I WILL have more q
uestions...!!
>
> BTW - if any of you happen to be passing through WI Saturday, there is a n
ice little fly in in Oconto (OCQ) where 3 of us Yakkers are headed. Lotsa GA
planes and a nice Avenger will be there as well. Friendly folks - although s
ounds like Fall temps, but great for a flight suit!
>
> Rico Jaeger
> 915 S. 11th Ave.
> Wausau, WI. 54401
> 715.529.7426
> //
> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> N8558G //
> //
> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> N21YK //
>
>
>
>
> > From: mark.bitterlich@navy.mil
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
> > Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 17:05:42 +0000
> >
k.bitterlich@navy.mil>
> >
> > Concur that heat would be a big factor inducing this situation as well.
> >
> > Mark
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@
matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp
> > Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:59 PM
> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
> >
> >
> > Have tried it both ways. Savage x 10sec, idle, mags off, full advance or
no advance. Seems CHT drove counter rotation for me in this LA heat.
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> > > On Sep 11, 2014, at 11:37 AM, "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD" <mar
k.bitterlich@navy.mil> wrote:
> > >
> > > --> <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
> > >
> > > This might open an interesting discussion.
> > >
> > > The Russian instructions I have call for pulling the engine back to id
le (same as you) and right after killing the mags, opening the throttle all t
he way until the engine stops rotating, and then return to idle.
> > >
> > > I have been doing that for years. Curious if others ever read it.
> > >
> > > Mark
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
> > > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
> > > Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:28 PM
> > > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > > Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
> > >
> > > Doug,
> > >
> > > Russian mags.
> > >
> > >
> > > I lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler open, run up to 65% or so
> > > during which time I shut off all nonessential electrical (master /
> > > ignition / generator and engine instruments still ON) and pull off my
> > > headset or helmet so I may hear anything unusual - this is usually
> > > about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds, smoothly pull throttle back to idle
> > > for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill master / ignition / generator.
> > > After that - unlock brakes / shut off air / hop out and kill rear
> > > mags, open cylinder drain and push in. I think that covers it as I
> > > currently sit at my desk... :)
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > >
> > > Rico Jaeger
> > > 915 S. 11th Ave.
> > > Wausau, WI. 54401
> > > 715.529.7426
> > > //
> > > 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> > > N8558G //
> > > //
> > > 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> > > N21YK //
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > >
> > > Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 09:03:21 -0700
> > > Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
> > > From: dougsappllc@gmail.com
> > > To: yak-list@matronics.com
> > >
> > >
> > > What is your shut down procedure?
> > > What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
> > >
> > > Doug
> > >
> > > On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote
:
> > >
> > >
> > > Rico,
> > > What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% f
or 10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire a
nd dieseling at higher temps.
> > > Doc
> > >
> > > Sent from my iPhone
> > >
> > > On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrot
e:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop spins b
ackwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen c
onsistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards rot
ation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
> > >
> > > Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > >
> > > Rico Jaeger
> > > 915 S. 11th Ave.
> > > Wausau, WI. 54401
> > > 715.529.7426
> > > //
> > > 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
> > > N8558G //
> > > //
> > > 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
> > > N21YK //
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
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> > > ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
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Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
Will note... Takes full throttle to taxi.
Sent from my iPad
> On Sep 11, 2014, at 1:04 PM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
>
> Yeah, it would. Will not it takes full throttle to taxi and will have a lo
t of vibration depending on how asymmetrical your blades are.
> Doc
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Sep 11, 2014, at 12:22 PM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> This is fantastic, guys! THANK YOU for sharing - I will try the "Throttle
Up" trick and report back after a few runs.
>>
>> I suppose "Gear Up" would prevent unsolicited rotation as well... :")
>>
>> Your patience and knowledge is greatly appreciated. And I WILL have more q
uestions...!!
>>
>> BTW - if any of you happen to be passing through WI Saturday, there is a n
ice little fly in in Oconto (OCQ) where 3 of us Yakkers are headed. Lotsa GA
planes and a nice Avenger will be there as well. Friendly folks - although s
ounds like Fall temps, but great for a flight suit!
>>
>> Rico Jaeger
>> 915 S. 11th Ave.
>> Wausau, WI. 54401
>> 715.529.7426
>> //
>> 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
>> N8558G //
>> //
>> 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
>> N21YK //
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > From: mark.bitterlich@navy.mil
>> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> > Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
>> > Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 17:05:42 +0000
>> >
rk.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>> >
>> > Concur that heat would be a big factor inducing this situation as well.
>> >
>> > Mark
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server
@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp
>> > Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:59 PM
>> > To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> > Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
>> >
>> >
>> > Have tried it both ways. Savage x 10sec, idle, mags off, full advance o
r no advance. Seems CHT drove counter rotation for me in this LA heat.
>> >
>> > Sent from my iPhone
>> >
>> > > On Sep 11, 2014, at 11:37 AM, "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD" <ma
rk.bitterlich@navy.mil> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > --> <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>> > >
>> > > This might open an interesting discussion.
>> > >
>> > > The Russian instructions I have call for pulling the engine back to i
dle (same as you) and right after killing the mags, opening the throttle all
the way until the engine stops rotating, and then return to idle.
>> > >
>> > > I have been doing that for years. Curious if others ever read it.
>> > >
>> > > Mark
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
>> > > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
>> > > Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:28 PM
>> > > To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> > > Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
>> > >
>> > > Doug,
>> > >
>> > > Russian mags.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > I lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler open, run up to 65% or so
>> > > during which time I shut off all nonessential electrical (master /
>> > > ignition / generator and engine instruments still ON) and pull off my
>> > > headset or helmet so I may hear anything unusual - this is usually
>> > > about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds, smoothly pull throttle back to idle
>> > > for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill master / ignition / generator.
>> > > After that - unlock brakes / shut off air / hop out and kill rear
>> > > mags, open cylinder drain and push in. I think that covers it as I
>> > > currently sit at my desk... :)
>> > >
>> > > Thanks!
>> > >
>> > > Rico Jaeger
>> > > 915 S. 11th Ave.
>> > > Wausau, WI. 54401
>> > > 715.529.7426
>> > > //
>> > > 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
>> > > N8558G //
>> > > //
>> > > 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
>> > > N21YK //
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > ________________________________
>> > >
>> > > Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 09:03:21 -0700
>> > > Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
>> > > From: dougsappllc@gmail.com
>> > > To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > What is your shut down procedure?
>> > > What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
>> > >
>> > > Doug
>> > >
>> > > On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrot
e:
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Rico,
>> > > What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70% f
or 10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire a
nd dieseling at higher temps.
>> > > Doc
>> > >
>> > > Sent from my iPhone
>> > >
>> > > On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wro
te:
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my prop spins
backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't happen
consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards r
otation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
>> > >
>> > > Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
>> > >
>> > > Thanks!
>> > >
>> > > Rico Jaeger
>> > > 915 S. 11th Ave.
>> > > Wausau, WI. 54401
>> > > 715.529.7426
>> > > //
>> > > 1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
>> > > N8558G //
>> > > //
>> > > 1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
>> > > N21YK //
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D
>> > > ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
>> > > D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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>> > > //forums.matronics.com
>> > > D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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>> > > ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> > >
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>> > >
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>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >========================
==p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List">http://www.matronics.com/Nav
igator========================
==========================
== --> http://www.matro=================
==========================
==
>> >
>> >
>> >
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>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
I do the same. Works well=0A =0A=0A =0A=0A=0ARichard Hess=0APres
ident=0AInternational Jets, Inc.=0ACell 404-964-4885=0A=0A =0A=0A =0A=0A
-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR,
WD, WD <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>=0ATo: yak-list <yak-list@matronics.com
>=0ASent: Thu, Sep 11, 2014 1:40 pm=0ASubject: RE: Yak-List: R
everse Rotation On Shutdown=0A=0A=0A--> Yak-List message posted by
: "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD" =0A<mark.bitterlich@navy.mil
>=0A=0AThis might open an interesting discussion.=0A=0AThe Russian
instructions I have call for pulling the engine back to idle
(same =0Aas you) and right after killing the mags, opening
the throttle all the way until =0Athe engine stops rotating,
and then return to idle.=0A=0AI have been doing that for yea
rs. Curious if others ever read it.=0A=0AMark=0A=0A=0A-----Ori
ginal Message-----=0AFrom: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:own
er-yak-list-server@matronics.com] =0AOn Behalf Of Rico Jaeger=0ASent:
Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:28 PM=0ATo: yak-list@matronics.com=0A
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown=0A=0ADoug,=0A=0A
Russian mags.=0A=0A=0AI lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler
open, run up to 65% or so during which =0Atime I shut
off all nonessential electrical (master / ignition / generator
and =0Aengine instruments still ON) and pull off my headset
or helmet so I may hear =0Aanything unusual - this is usua
lly about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds, smoothly pull =0Athrottle
back to idle for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill master
/ ignition / =0Agenerator. After that - unlock brakes / shut
off air / hop out and kill rear =0Amags, open cylinder
drain and push in. I think that covers it as I currently
sit =0Aat my desk... :)=0A=0AThanks!=0A=0ARico Jaeger=0A915 S. 11t
h Ave.=0AWausau, WI. 54401=0A715.529.7426=0A
//=0A1966 Cessna 150F
^/---//-X=0AN8558G
//=0A
//=0A1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X=0A
N21YK
//=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A
=0ADate: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 09:03:21 -0700=0ASubject: Re: Yak-List
: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown=0AFrom: dougsappllc@gmail.com=0ATo: y
ak-list@matronics.com=0A=0A=0AWhat is your shut down procedure?=0AWhat
mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?=0A=0ADoug=0A=0AOn Th
u, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com>
wrote:=0A=0A=0A Rico,=0A What CH
T's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @
70% for =0A10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C.
Otherwise can get misfire and =0Adieseling at higher temps.=0A
Doc=0A=0A Sent from my iPhone=0A
=0A On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jae
ger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com> wrote:=0A=0A=0A=0A
Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I
shut down, my prop =0Aspins backwards a revolution or 2? Is
this a form of dieseling? It doesn't =0Ahappen consistently -
maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that backwards
=0Arotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?=0A=0A
Any wisdom shared would be much
appreciated!=0A=0A Thanks!=0A=0A
Rico Jaeger=0A
915 S. 11th Ave.=0A
Wausau, WI. 54401=0A
715.529.7426=0A
=0A//=0A
1966 Cessna 150F
^/---//-X=0A
N8558G
//=0A
//=0A
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X=0A
N21YK
//=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A
ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List=0A
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=0A //forums.matronics.com=0A
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
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D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A
ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution=0A
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A
=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A) =DF=A2{l 7 r h M4 Mi=C7=9C z
. ' N jB &j)E R=C7=AD '
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' + =D8=A8 =DC=86+ I r yhi k k
h y =DD=9A ! ! j ~m '
o j =0Aj +a a =7F 0 k x & =D6
=AF 4N4 X@E9=0AI& z j ( =D7=A7
l =DA=8AV j ^Y =C5=A2 ky m ~ =C9=9A
' hm ~ =C9=9A ' o .+- & *'Y
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z . ' N jB &j)E R=C7=AD '=0A
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' + =D8=A8 =DC=86+ I r yhi k k
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o j j +a a =7F 0 k x & =D6=AF
4N4 X@E9=0AI& z j ( =D7=A7 l =DA
=8AV j ^Y =C5=A2 ky m ~ =C9=9A '
hm ~ =C9=9A ' o .+- & *'Y =D2=8A=D7
=93 =0A=CA=8B . + =C6=AD :=DA'W
@vh j ~m ' o=DC=A2{k
=7F 0 k x & ' =D8=A8 o
===========================
===========================
===========================
-Matt Dralle, List A
===========================
===========================
===0A=0A=0A=0A=0A =0A
Message 27
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| Subject: | Compressor shearing shaft. |
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Compressor shearing shaft. |
No info/data showing...=0A=0A=0A=0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: By
ron M Fox <byronmfox@gmail.com>=0ATo: Yak List <yak-list@matronics.c
om>=0ASent: Thu, Sep 11, 2014 9:34 pm=0ASubject: Fwd: Yak-List:
Compressor shearing shaft.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown |
So do I, and I even cut the mags before completely idle (at about 43 =93 40
%,
when I see the oil pressure drop substantially).
In this way, the prop still has some inertia.
Jan
From: Richard Hess <hess737@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
I do the same. Works well
Richard Hess
President
International Jets, Inc.
Cell 404-964-4885
-----Original Message-----
From: Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD, WD <mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
Sent: Thu, Sep 11, 2014 1:40 pm
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
<mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
This might open an interesting discussion.
The Russian instructions I have call for pulling the engine back to idle
(same
as you) and right after killing the mags, opening the throttle all the way
until
the engine stops rotating, and then return to idle.
I have been doing that for years. Curious if others ever read it.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com?> ]
On Behalf Of Rico Jaeger
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 12:28 PM
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
Doug,
Russian mags.
I lock brakes, verify gills / oil cooler open, run up to 65% or so during
which
time I shut off all nonessential electrical (master / ignition / generator
and
engine instruments still ON) and pull off my headset or helmet so I may hea
r
anything unusual - this is usually about 20 seconds +/- 5 seconds, smoothly
pull
throttle back to idle for about 10 seconds, pull mags, kill master /
ignition /
generator. After that - unlock brakes / shut off air / hop out and kill rea
r
mags, open cylinder drain and push in. I think that covers it as I currentl
y
sit
at my desk... :)
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau, WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
________________________________
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Reverse Rotation On Shutdown
From: dougsappllc@gmail.com
What is your shut down procedure?
What mags are you using? Russian or Chinese?
Doug
On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 6:54 AM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc@me.com> wrote:
Rico,
What CHT's are you shutting down at after scavaging you engine @ 70
%
for
10 sec.? Should be shutting down at 160-170 C. Otherwise can get misfire an
d
dieseling at higher temps.
Doc
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:13 AM, Rico Jaeger <rocknpilot@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Can anyone tell me why - occasionally when I shut down, my
prop
spins backwards a revolution or 2? Is this a form of dieseling? It doesn't
happen consistently - maybe twice in the last 10 runs. I've heard that
backwards
rotation can also shear the compressor coupling...?
Any wisdom shared would be much appreciated!
Thanks!
Rico Jaeger
915 S. 11th Ave.
Wausau, WI. 54401
715.529.7426
//
1966 Cessna 150F ^/---//-X
N8558G //
//
1992 Yakovlev Yak 52 ^/---//-X
N21YK //
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
ist"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
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//forums.matronics.com
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===========================/Navigator?Yak-List"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-====================
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