Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:16 AM - Re: Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 (Todd McCutchan)
2. 06:14 AM - Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang ... (cjpilot710@aol.com)
3. 06:59 AM - Re: Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 (cjpilot710@aol.com)
4. 07:13 AM - Re: Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 (cjpilot710@aol.com)
5. 07:32 AM - Re: Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 (Todd McCutchan)
6. 07:41 AM - Re: Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 (Bill Geipel)
7. 08:46 AM - Re: Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 (Frank)
8. 08:52 AM - Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 (skyjockey)
9. 11:35 AM - Re: Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 (DaBear)
10. 09:29 PM - Re: Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 (cjpilot710@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 |
There is no shortage of CJ, Yak, and T-34's to fly with in the SoCal, Southw
est areas. Florida as well. I don't know much about Oregon.
Get what you can afford to buy, operate, and maintain and that best fits you
r mission.
Good luck and happy new year!
Todd McCutchan
T-34A & Yak-50
Cell: (260) 402-1740
E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com
www.fastaircraft.com
> On Dec 26, 2015, at 10:47 PM, skyjockey <mixxalot@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> True well I live in San Diego but next year or two plan to buy land and pr
ivate airstrip in a cheaper state like Arizona, Nevada, Oregon or maybe Flor
ida. Not sure what community exists here and in the southwest?
>
> Julie Clark flies a T34 and she is one of the most famous airshow aerobati
c pilots.
>
> --------
> warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451424#451424
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang |
...
Dead Bear,
I been waiting YEARS to hear you say that! Heheheheheh
Pappy
In a message dated 12/26/2015 4:12:35 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
dabear@damned.org writes:
--> Yak-List message posted by: "DaBear@damned.org" <dabear@damned.org>
Mark,
I've owned the Yak-52 and the CJ6, the 52 does NOT have a bigger cockpit
than the CJ6. Maybe you meant to say the 50. BTW, with the rudder
peddle mods and the malcom hood, you would fit in the CJ6. The CJ6 is
a completely different airplane when the M14p is added and i have
roughly 300 hours in the Yak-52 (2 years ownership), and 600-900 hours
in the Stock CJ6 and M14P(f) CJ6 respectively. The CJ6 is a much better
formation plane then the 52, the 52 is a much better acro plane. In my
not so humble opinion.
Bear
On 12/26/2015 3:05 PM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD wrote:
<mark.bitterlich@navy.mil>
>
> Having 900 hours in a T-34B, and 1000 or so in a YAK-50 (but none in a
CJ-6 I am sad to report), I will say this.
>
>
> The T-34 has much more room, has a fairly high Vne, and uses all
American parts (thus they are available), but they are not cheap, the FAA is
keeping a close eye on them after a wing off light came on during that incident
where some idiots were teaching dog-fighting skills to wanna-be's in
airframes with many many thousands of hours on them yanking well over the max
G
limit of +6/-4 (at the time). That required one of several different kinds
of spar mods and inspections.
>
>
> They are EASY to fly, have 3 axis trim and with 50 gallons have a decent
range. The controls are balanced well, and include anti-servo's on the
control surfaces. Many have engines upgraded to 520 or 550's with 3 bladed
props. Needed, because with the stock 470, they were pretty much a dog at
2950 pounds gross. They will do aerobatics, but they do not maintain energy
(when stock), and you have to constantly be aware of your degrading energy
state. Many rudders have been sorta bent by folks doing snaps at too high
an entry speed, and a lot of them have magnesium control surfaces, which
need to be hawked carefully for corrosion. Some of have been re-skinned to
aluminum. By the way, inverted flight in a T-34 is limited to something
like 15 seconds. They use a dry sump engine and a 3 gallon oil tank. The
oil is not returned to the tank when inverted and if you are not careful and
roll upright after too long inverted without reducing to idle, you can
actually do amazing!
t!
> hings to the prop... like have it come off.
>
>
> The landing gear is tough, hard to hurt, and will take huge amounts of
punishment. I saw one landed in a plowed field with no damage. They are
extremely stable for formation flying and have excellent vis. Basically the
T-34 will always be my most favorite airplane to own, overall....but that
comes at a pretty darn steep price.
>
>
> I'd say the aerobatic capability of the CJ is in the same ball-park as
the T-34. Cockpits are MUCH smaller, but can be modified. Both are
trainers and had the same goals in mind, so their design features are on a par
with each other. The CJ-6 is by FAR the more beautiful aircraft, and MUCH
cheaper to own, and ... hey, it's got a radial! Like the T-34, the CJ is also
somewhat underpowered, but is a stable formation platform.
>
>
> But to continue ... there are the YAK's and also the SU-29 if you have
money. The SU-29 beats them all in my opinion. Again, small cockpits, but
has range and will rip your lips off. It is the Ferrari of two seaters
until you get to heavy iron and it does better aerobatics than anything else
discussed.
>
>
> The YAK-52 has slightly bigger cockpits than the CJ, but less fuel.
Slower than the CJ-6, but with comparable pilots will eat the CJ-6 alive in a
dog fight, simply because it has more energy and is designed for it. It
is a tractor of a Russian airplane. Has some spin characteristics that need
to be experienced with an instructor, but not anything dangerous once you
learn what's up. It was built to be an advanced trainer, meaning advanced
aerobatics. It will even do tumbles.
>
>
> So if you ever think of getting serious about aerobatics, or
dog-fighting, etc., etc., the YAK-52 is really the best choice. It can go cross
country, but with more fuel stops and as I said is slower than the CJ. If
you're a tall guy that likes a roomy cockpit and does not want an Experimental
Category aircraft, the T-34 is the best choice. The CJ is middle ground in
all catagories. It does everything, but is simply not the BEST at
everything, but again, I think it is one of the best looking aircraft out there,
and if I could fit into the darn thing, would probably own one, but with an
M-14 installed!
>
>
> Single seaters like the 50, 55, 26, 31, etc., are a whole different
category so need not be mentioned.
>
>
> Mark
>
>
> p.s. I will always LOVE the electric landing gear with manual emergency
crank in the T-34 better than the pneumatic mess in the CJ's and Yaks.
Simple and reliable and nothing LEAKS! :-)
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
[owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] on behalf of skyjockey [mixxalot@yahoo.com]
> Sent: Saturday, December 26, 2015 11:35 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Yak-List: Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or
Nanchang CJ-6
>
>
> I need to fly in a CJ6 and T34 to make the decision!
>
> --------
> warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451416#451416
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 |
You might want to look at what some common replacement parts will cost you
visa C-6 to T-34. Engine overhauls are slightly cheaper. Annuals or
conditional inspections are cheaper and can be done a an A&P on CJ. I once
happened compared replacing gear handles. $1,200 for the T-34 switch, $200
for the CJ's valve. CJ is A LOT easier to repair. A bird strike on a
leading edge is a universe easier to repair.
As far a handling characteristic, almost the same. They use the same
airfoil - no different other than span and plan form. Weights nearly identical.
Because they are cheaper to fly over haul, you more money to spend on fuel
thus you get to fly more. That's whole idea right?
And then there is that verse in the RPA song:
"Don't give me T-34.
"She's just a money hungry whore"
"Her spars and bend and brake"
"In her, you're life's is at stake"
"No I don't want a T-34"
;-)
Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
In a message dated 12/26/2015 11:39:08 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
mixxalot@yahoo.com writes:
--> Yak-List message posted by: "skyjockey" <mixxalot@yahoo.com>
I need to fly in a CJ6 and T34 to make the decision!
--------
warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451416#451416
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 |
Look up FD44 - Eagle's Nest Aerodrome in Florida. LOW TAXES = more
flying. CHEAPER FUEL = more flying. Cheaper real estate = more flying.
In a message dated 12/27/2015 12:50:44 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
mixxalot@yahoo.com writes:
--> Yak-List message posted by: "skyjockey" <mixxalot@yahoo.com>
True well I live in San Diego but next year or two plan to buy land and
private airstrip in a cheaper state like Arizona, Nevada, Oregon or maybe
Florida. Not sure what community exists here and in the southwest?
Julie Clark flies a T34 and she is one of the most famous airshow
aerobatic pilots.
--------
warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451424#451424
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 |
Gosh. I better sell mine right away! Whoever tried to sell you a gear handle
for $1200 is an idiot. $60 is the real price.
Speed, comfort, efficiency, reliability, baggage, range, AN parts (aircraft s
pruce), parts manuals, and any A&P can work on it/familiar with it - T-34. W
ill cost more to buy but cost less to maintain. In 6 years and 800 hours I r
arely need to do anything besides put gas in it.
CJ6 is a good plane. Cheaper to buy, not as reliable but as said pretty easy
to support thanks to Doug Sapp, Jill, the Coy's, ACE Hardware and Harbor Fre
ight. It's a bit slower, cockpits smaller, no heat, hard to access and small
er baggage. Overall a very good option.
Yak 52 is really a local only plane that is the only serious aerobatic choic
e (other than Yak 50). Standard tanks offer very limited range but it has a f
ull inverted system. Cockpits are slightly less roomy (especially back) than
the CJ and the plane is the slowest of bunch in cruise. It is also the chea
pest to buy. Reliability and support will be on par with the CJ.
Todd McCutchan
T-34A & Yak-50
Cell: (260) 402-1740
E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com
www.fastaircraft.com
> On Dec 27, 2015, at 7:56 AM, cjpilot710@aol.com wrote:
>
> You might want to look at what some common replacement parts will cost you
visa C-6 to T-34. Engine overhauls are slightly cheaper. Annuals or condi
tional inspections are cheaper and can be done a an A&P on CJ. I once happe
ned compared replacing gear handles. $1,200 for the T-34 switch, $200 for t
he CJ's valve. CJ is A LOT easier to repair. A bird strike on a leading ed
ge is a universe easier to repair.
>
> As far a handling characteristic, almost the same. They use the same airf
oil - no different other than span and plan form. Weights nearly identical.
>
> Because they are cheaper to fly over haul, you more money to spend on fuel
thus you get to fly more. That's whole idea right?
>
> And then there is that verse in the RPA song:
>
> "Don't give me T-34.
> "She's just a money hungry whore"
> "Her spars and bend and brake"
> "In her, you're life's is at stake"
> "No I don't want a T-34"
> ;-)
>
> Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
>
> In a message dated 12/26/2015 11:39:08 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, mixxalo
t@yahoo.com writes:
>
> I need to fly in a CJ6 and T34 to make the decision!
>
> --------
> warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451416#451416=====
==========================
===============
> _nbsp; (And Get Some AWESOME FREE to find Gifts nbsp; List k y
ou for p; -Matt Dralle, List =========
=============== e ties Day =======
==========================
=============== - MATRONICS WEB FO
RUMS ========================
========================
- List Contribution Web Site sp; ====
==========================
====================
>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 |
Tell us who so we don=92t buy from them.
On Dec 27, 2015, at 8:23, Todd McCutchan <todd@fastaircraft.com> wrote:
> Gosh. I better sell mine right away! Whoever tried to sell you a gear
handle for $1200 is an idiot. $60 is the real price.
>
> Speed, comfort, efficiency, reliability, baggage, range, AN parts
(aircraft spruce), parts manuals, and any A&P can work on it/familiar
with it - T-34. Will cost more to buy but cost less to maintain. In 6
years and 800 hours I rarely need to do anything besides put gas in it.
>
> CJ6 is a good plane. Cheaper to buy, not as reliable but as said
pretty easy to support thanks to Doug Sapp, Jill, the Coy's, ACE
Hardware and Harbor Freight. It's a bit slower, cockpits smaller, no
heat, hard to access and smaller baggage. Overall a very good option.
>
> Yak 52 is really a local only plane that is the only serious aerobatic
choice (other than Yak 50). Standard tanks offer very limited range but
it has a full inverted system. Cockpits are slightly less roomy
(especially back) than the CJ and the plane is the slowest of bunch in
cruise. It is also the cheapest to buy. Reliability and support will be
on par with the CJ.
>
> Todd McCutchan
> T-34A & Yak-50
> Cell: (260) 402-1740
> E-mail: todd@fastaircraft.com
> www.fastaircraft.com
>
>
>
> On Dec 27, 2015, at 7:56 AM, cjpilot710@aol.com wrote:
>
>> You might want to look at what some common replacement parts will
cost you visa C-6 to T-34. Engine overhauls are slightly cheaper.
Annuals or conditional inspections are cheaper and can be done a an A&P
on CJ. I once happened compared replacing gear handles. $1,200 for the
T-34 switch, $200 for the CJ's valve. CJ is A LOT easier to repair. A
bird strike on a leading edge is a universe easier to repair.
>>
>> As far a handling characteristic, almost the same. They use the same
airfoil - no different other than span and plan form. Weights nearly
identical.
>>
>> Because they are cheaper to fly over haul, you more money to spend on
fuel thus you get to fly more. That's whole idea right?
>>
>> And then there is that verse in the RPA song:
>>
>> "Don't give me T-34.
>> "She's just a money hungry whore"
>> "Her spars and bend and brake"
>> "In her, you're life's is at stake"
>> "No I don't want a T-34"
>> ;-)
>>
>> Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
>>
>> In a message dated 12/26/2015 11:39:08 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
mixxalot@yahoo.com writes:
>>
>> I need to fly in a CJ6 and T34 to make the decision!
>>
>> --------
>> warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>>
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451416#451416=====
================
>> _nbsp; (And Get Some AWESOME FREE to find Gifts nbsp;
List k you for p; -Matt Dralle, List
========================
e ties Day =====================
== - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS
=======================
- List Contribution Web Site sp;
>>
>>
>>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 |
I flew a t-34 out of a navy flying club, and loved it. I couldn't afford a t34,
so eventually I got a cj6. I much prefer the CJ. I no longer own the CJ . What
I have now is an IAR-823, Romanian trainer. Fully aerobatic , stick controls,
4 place, plenty of baggage space, Lycoming IO540 powered, 90 gal fuel capacity,
1100 mile range, 160 knot cruise. Prices comparable to the CJ .
And oh buy the way, mine is for sale.
Sent from my iPad
> On Dec 26, 2015, at 9:34 AM, Bill Geipel <l129bs@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> T-34 = No Aerobatics Big price No upside down
Faster Target not so many
Just a Bonanza
> CJ6 = Aerobatics 1/2 price Upside down
Not so much Fighter Lots of fun folks and fly-ins
Not just an airplane
> Yak = Best aerobatics 1/4 price Better upside down
Not so much Best fighter Ditto
Not just a CJ6
>
>
> What are you trying to decide?
>
>
>
>
>> On Dec 26, 2015, at 9:35, skyjockey <mixxalot@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I need to fly in a CJ6 and T34 to make the decision!
>>
>> --------
>> warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451416#451416
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 |
Thanks guys, great tips. I am looking to buy a place next year and my plane in
same time period. Since I scuba dive Florida is great place for that if you can
handle the humidity and bugs and dodge the many tstorms. For aircraft purchase,
I still need to experience a CJ and T34. Another option is a Yak 52TW or Yak52
with extended fuel tanks for longer range.
--------
warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451435#451435
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 |
Remember to fly in both the stock CJ6 and one with an M14p upgrade. They are different
Randy DeVere
> On Dec 27, 2015, at 11:49, skyjockey <mixxalot@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> Thanks guys, great tips. I am looking to buy a place next year and my plane in
same time period. Since I scuba dive Florida is great place for that if you
can handle the humidity and bugs and dodge the many tstorms. For aircraft purchase,
I still need to experience a CJ and T34. Another option is a Yak 52TW or
Yak52 with extended fuel tanks for longer range.
>
> --------
> warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451435#451435
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: First time buyer of a Yak 52 or Nanchang CJ-6 |
I love this bickering about airplanes!!! For those guys who learn to fly
in the T-34 - - - well you know the old saying "No matter how ugly, your
first lover is always the one you thought the most beautiful". Its' cockpit
is to big. You tend to rattle around in it. To this day I love the Champ.
ALL VERSION of it. And I love the B-24 and think the B-17 over rated.
And I love the Storch! Shit I just don't enough time for all the airplanes
I love. I don't love a 51. I don't love the B25, - - - to hard to pull
the props though. I loved the 777 and 747SP. I didn't love the 767-100
(piece of crap), but her big sister 767-300 was the one airplane I could
grease on no matter what! I love the 747-400- - - -had great bunks! I always
wanted to fly a Connie, and a DC6. I got to familiar with a DC-3, but a
Loadmaster would be interesting.
Well here is to a great New Year fellow listers. May your airplane dreams
come true.
"Oh give me a CJ-6 A.
And send me into the fray
With guns and panache
I'll kick any ass!
Yes give me a CJ-6 A "
;-)
Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
In a message dated 12/27/2015 2:36:15 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
dabear@damned.org writes:
--> Yak-List message posted by: DaBear <dabear@damned.org>
Remember to fly in both the stock CJ6 and one with an M14p upgrade. They
are different
Randy DeVere
> On Dec 27, 2015, at 11:49, skyjockey <mixxalot@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "skyjockey" <mixxalot@yahoo.com>
>
> Thanks guys, great tips. I am looking to buy a place next year and my
plane in same time period. Since I scuba dive Florida is great place for that
if you can handle the humidity and bugs and dodge the many tstorms. For
aircraft purchase, I still need to experience a CJ and T34. Another option is
a Yak 52TW or Yak52 with extended fuel tanks for longer range.
>
> --------
> warbird and lover of all things that go fast and upside down!
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451435#451435
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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