Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:18 AM - Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval (Walter Lannon)
2. 02:48 PM - Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval (Jill Gernetzke)
3. 03:14 PM - Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval (cjpilot710@aol.com)
4. 05:09 PM - Re: Snot Valve Not Snotting... (Gazoo)
5. 06:49 PM - Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval (Walter Lannon)
6. 07:19 PM - Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval (Walter Lannon)
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| Subject: | Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval |
No sweat Gary,
Done the same and have this distressing habit of proof-reading AFTER I hit
send ------not getting smarter??
Walt
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Gabbard
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2017 8:37 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Nanchang Company, M14P approval
Ooops. Sorry Walter. Once again my error. But the beer still sounds. Must
be y week for screwing up. LOL. AND YES WARMER WEATHER. Gary
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 19, 2017, at 19:17, Walter Lannon <wlannon@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
> and
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| Subject: | Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval |
As long as we are trying to keep the history correct, the prop hub installed
on the engine would have to be for a splined shaft. So it would not be a
V-530 hub, but the PZL US-122000 hub for the Wilga.
Have a great weekend,
Jill
M-14P, Inc.
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| Subject: | Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval |
Actually the original engine the CJ-6 prototype was Czechoslovakia Doris
B
engine. Evidently the airplane could not reach design speed and the
engine / prop wouldn't match up. That engine was use in one other East
block
aircraft prototype and never any place else. That was 1958, in 59 they
changed to the Soviet A-14P, and "F530D35" prop. As far as I can tell,
China
has never made horizontal opposed aircraft engine.
The Chinese designers had a tough time convincing their government (very
pro Russia at the time) that the CJ-6 was better than the Yak 18A which th
e
Soviets were offering. The A-14p (or HS-6) took care of that.
Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
In a message dated 1/19/2017 7:57:05 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
ggg6@att.net writes:
--> Yak-List message posted by: Gary Gabbard <ggg6@att.net>
Hi Craig
Yes I am aware of the plan to install a six cyl opposed engine in the CJ
originally
And you very well may be correct on not being an M14-P installed. The
paddle prop pic that I saw helped to make me feel the info might be true.
But I
stand corrected. Thank You for the info. If I stumble over Florida way on
e
of these days, I owe you a =F0=9F=8D=BA or =F0=9F=8D=BB two. Later.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 19, 2017, at 11:00, Walter Lannon <wlannon@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: "Walter Lannon" <wlannon@shaw.ca>
>
> Hi Gary;
>
> That's a really cute story, kind of like a fairy tale, nice, but not to
o
accurate.
>
> The original engine intended for the CJ6 was a 6 cyl. horiz. opposed
Chinese design. Installed on the first prototype it was quickly found
unacceptable and replaced with the early version of the original Ivchenko
engine,
the AI14R. That engine went into Chinese production as the Huosai 6
and,later, the 6A.
> The propellor installation was the stock, original V530 hub and wooden
blades. Chinese designed blades eventually replaced them.
> About the same time as your friend (1993) I imported the first CJ's int
o
Canada directly from China (there were two already here but imported from
Texas)
>
> Cheers;
> Walt
>
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Gary Gabbard
> Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2017 1:12 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Nanchang Company, M14P approval
>
> --> Yak-List message posted by: Gary Gabbard <ggg6@att.net>
>
> Gentlemen, as I recall. The CJ was first produced for the PLA, and it
originally was delivered into Chinese military service with the Russian
M14-P engine . But somewhere along the line they decided they didn't need
that
much horsepower for a trainer. So China made a deal with Wilga of Poland
to manufacture their own engine made by Housi of China. Under license fro
m
Wilga. So the Airplane and the engine mount are the same as the originall
y
produced airframe that was originally produced with the M14-P engine. Thi
s
was learned in a conversation with Ron Bailey of PHX at the time (1995)
who
was an early importer of the CJ's. He spent a lot of time in China during
the time he was importing them to the USA. Since purchasing my CJ from hi
m
in early (1995). Several years after I purchased the CJ. I lost track of
Ron years ago. I believe he moved from PHX years ago, so can't verify thi
s by
contacting him. I did see a picture of some CJ's with the large paddle
blade props on them !
> that I believe Ron took them on one of his trips to China. The large
square paddle blades would indicate that it was equipped with the M14-P.
And
that was before anyone was installing M14-P engines in them here in the
USA
as I recall. I have had my CJ for 22 years. Ok maybe if anyone has
contacts in China you could verify that the Airplane was produced original
ly with
the M14-P. Good luck on your search. Hope this small amount of info may
help you.
> Gary. In Las Vegas, Nevada. CJ N22YK.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Jan 18, 2017, at 19:25, Richard Goode
<richard.goode@russianaeros.com> wrote:
>>
<richard.goode@russianaeros.com>
>>
>> I'm not an expert on how these things are handled in North America, bu
t
>> surely an STC is approval for a modification onto a certified aircraft
,
and
>> of course the Nanchang is completely "experimental", and in the USA
owners
>> have the fantastic good fortune to be able to do pretty much what they
like
>> in terms of modifications and engine changes.
>>
>> Interestingly we in the UK are allowed to fly Yak 50 and 52 only on th
e
>> basis that they are "ex-military", since we do not have any form of an
>> experimental category. The Nanchang, similarly, fits into the same
category.
>>
>> We have recently sold an M 14 P to a UK customer to put into his
Nanchang,
>> but he is having a bureaucratic nightmare with UK CAA to authorise the
>> conversion. They have asked for stress calculations on the engine
mounts;
>> proof that the engine will be sufficiently cooled et cetera.
>>
>> I would be very doubtful whether there is any "official" documentation
from
>> China authorising the installation of the Russian engine, but I could
be
>> wrong!
>>
>> Richard Goode
>>
>> Rhodds Farm
>> Lyonshall
>> Hereford
>> HR5 3LW
>> United Kingdom
>> Tel: +94 (0) 81 241 5137 (Sri Lanka)
>> Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
>> Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
>> www.russianaeros.com
>> I=99m currently in Sri Lanka but this Mail is working,and my loc
al phone
is
>> +94 779 132 160.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Top Ace
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2017 10:38 PM
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Yak-List: Nanchang Company, M14P approval
>>
>>
>> Installation of a M-14P on a CJ.,,, I know many of the CJ owners have
>> installed the MP-14P engine in the United States,, which is or was
approved
>> by the FAA,,, Here in Canada,, Transport Canada does not recognize any
other
>> motor then the Housai, I would like to install the M14P on my aircraft
.
>> I would need a field or an STC from them to install it here in Canada,
,,
>>
>> I am aware of one MP-14 installed here in Canada !!! 1999,, which at
the
>> time, he was allotted an stc based on a letter that was written from
>> Nanchang at the time that this was a approved engine that could be
>> installed. ( Lost, filed away, or misplaced copy)
>>
>> Question if any one can help is,, does anyone have a copy, or have
>> documentation from Nanchang that it is allowed. I sure would like to
have
>> this so I can present my case to Transport Canada.
>> Have only owned this Cj since June,,, you folks have had them for 20
years
>> plus,, appreciate any help you could send my way.
>> David
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=465193#465193
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
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Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Snot Valve Not Snotting... |
Thanks for posting Craig. I had the same problem. Annual is next week so snot
valve cleaning it is.
--------
Stefan Corriveau
stefancorriveau@hotmail.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=465287#465287
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval |
Jill:
The number you are quoting for the PZL Wilga prop. hub is actually the
design number of the blade, not the hub.
If you could take the time and actually look at one you will see the hub
design number is V530 - T35. The M14P uses the same BASIC design number
but
with a very different dash number.
Walt
-----Original Message-----
From: Jill Gernetzke
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2017 2:48 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Nanchang Company, M14P approval
As long as we are trying to keep the history correct, the prop hub installed
on the engine would have to be for a splined shaft. So it would not be a
V-530 hub, but the PZL US-122000 hub for the Wilga.
Have a great weekend,
Jill
M-14P, Inc.
---
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Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Nanchang Company, M14P approval |
Thanks Pappy;
I had forgotten the name of the Czech engine (Doris B).
The final radial engine choice was the AI14R, later AI14RA Translation :
Alexander Ivchenco, Model 14, Radial, Air start.
There was a later version with electric start: AI14RC. Cylinders manufac
tured for the C engine will not work on the A due no provision for air inje
ction.
Cheers;
Walt
From: cjpilot710@aol.com
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2017 3:14 PM
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Nanchang Company, M14P approval
Actually the original engine the CJ-6 prototype was Czechoslovakia Doris B
engine. Evidently the airplane could not reach design speed and the engine
/ prop wouldn't match up. That engine was use in one other East block air
craft prototype and never any place else. That was 1958, in 59 they change
d to the Soviet A-14P, and "F530D35" prop. As far as I can tell, China has
never made horizontal opposed aircraft engine.
The Chinese designers had a tough time convincing their government (very pr
o Russia at the time) that the CJ-6 was better than the Yak 18A which the S
oviets were offering. The A-14p (or HS-6) took care of that.
Jim "Pappy" Goolsby
In a message dated 1/19/2017 7:57:05 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, ggg6@att.n
et writes:
Hi Craig
Yes I am aware of the plan to install a six cyl opposed engine in the CJ
originally
And you very well may be correct on not being an M14-P installed. The pad
dle prop pic that I saw helped to make me feel the info might be true. But
I stand corrected. Thank You for the info. If I stumble over Florida way on
e of these days, I owe you a =F0=9F=8D=BA or =F0=9F=8D=BB two. Later.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 19, 2017, at 11:00, Walter Lannon <wlannon@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Gary;
>
> That's a really cute story, kind of like a fairy tale, nice, but not to
o accurate.
>
> The original engine intended for the CJ6 was a 6 cyl. horiz. opposed Ch
inese design. Installed on the first prototype it was quickly found unacc
eptable and replaced with the early version of the original Ivchenko engine
, the AI14R. That engine went into Chinese production as the Huosai 6 and
,later, the 6A.
> The propellor installation was the stock, original V530 hub and wooden
blades. Chinese designed blades eventually replaced them.
> About the same time as your friend (1993) I imported the first CJ's int
o Canada directly from China (there were two already here but imported from
Texas)
>
> Cheers;
> Walt
>
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Gary Gabbard
> Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2017 1:12 AM
> To: yak-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Yak-List: Nanchang Company, M14P approval
>
>
> Gentlemen, as I recall. The CJ was first produced for the PLA, and it
originally was delivered into Chinese military service with the Russian M14
-P engine . But somewhere along the line they decided they didn't need that
much horsepower for a trainer. So China made a deal with Wilga of Poland
to manufacture their own engine made by Housi of China. Under license from
Wilga. So the Airplane and the engine mount are the same as the originally
produced airframe that was originally produced with the M14-P engine. This
was learned in a conversation with Ron Bailey of PHX at the time (1995) who
was an early importer of the CJ's. He spent a lot of time in China during
the time he was importing them to the USA. Since purchasing my CJ from him
in early (1995). Several years after I purchased the CJ. I lost track of R
on years ago. I believe he moved from PHX years ago, so can't verify this b
y contacting him. I did see a picture of some CJ's with the large paddle bl
ade props on them !
> that I believe Ron took them on one of his trips to China. The large sq
uare paddle blades would indicate that it was equipped with the M14-P. And
that was before anyone was installing M14-P engines in them here in the US
A as I recall. I have had my CJ for 22 years. Ok maybe if anyone has contac
ts in China you could verify that the Airplane was produced originally with
the M14-P. Good luck on your search. Hope this small amount of info may h
elp you.
> Gary. In Las Vegas, Nevada. CJ N22YK.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Jan 18, 2017, at 19:25, Richard Goode <richard.goode@russianaeros.c
om> wrote:
>>
aeros.com>
>>
>> I'm not an expert on how these things are handled in North America, bu
t
>> surely an STC is approval for a modification onto a certified aircraft
, and
>> of course the Nanchang is completely "experimental", and in the USA ow
ners
>> have the fantastic good fortune to be able to do pretty much what they
like
>> in terms of modifications and engine changes.
>>
>> Interestingly we in the UK are allowed to fly Yak 50 and 52 only on th
e
>> basis that they are "ex-military", since we do not have any form of an
>> experimental category. The Nanchang, similarly, fits into the same cat
egory.
>>
>> We have recently sold an M 14 P to a UK customer to put into his Nanch
ang,
>> but he is having a bureaucratic nightmare with UK CAA to authorise the
>> conversion. They have asked for stress calculations on the engine moun
ts;
>> proof that the engine will be sufficiently cooled et cetera.
>>
>> I would be very doubtful whether there is any "official" documentation
from
>> China authorising the installation of the Russian engine, but I could
be
>> wrong!
>>
>> Richard Goode
>>
>> Rhodds Farm
>> Lyonshall
>> Hereford
>> HR5 3LW
>> United Kingdom
>> Tel: +94 (0) 81 241 5137 (Sri Lanka)
>> Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120
>> Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129
>> www.russianaeros.com
>> I=99m currently in Sri Lanka but this Mail is working,and my loc
al phone is
>> +94 779 132 160.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Top Ace
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2017 10:38 PM
>> To: yak-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Yak-List: Nanchang Company, M14P approval
>>
>>
>> Installation of a M-14P on a CJ.,,, I know many of the CJ owners have
>> installed the MP-14P engine in the United States,, which is or was app
roved
>> by the FAA,,, Here in Canada,, Transport Canada does not recognize any
other
>> motor then the Housai, I would like to install the M14P on my aircraft
=2E
>> I would need a field or an STC from them to install it here in Canada,
,,
>>
>> I am aware of one MP-14 installed here in Canada !!! 1999,, which at t
he
>> time, he was allotted an stc based on a letter that was written from
>> Nanchang at the time that this was a approved engine that could be
>> installed. ( Lost, filed away, or misplaced copy)
>>
>> Question if any one can help is,, does anyone have a copy, or have
>> documentation from Nanchang that it is allowed. I sure would like to h
ave
>> this so I can present my case to Transport Canada.
>> Have only owned this Cj since June,,, you folks have had them for 20 y
ears
>> plus,, appreciate any help you could send my way.
>> David
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=465193#465193
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by
>> MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
>
>
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