---------------------------------------------------------- Yak-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 03/03/17: 18 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:35 AM - Re: Re: Air Tank Cocktail (Richard Goode) 2. 05:07 AM - Re: Air Tank Cocktail (Vic) 3. 05:54 AM - Re: Re: Air Tank Cocktail (Richard Goode) 4. 06:52 AM - Re: Air Tank Cocktail (Vic) 5. 07:22 AM - Re: Re: Air Tank Cocktail (doug sapp) 6. 08:16 AM - Selling my CJ (Ernest Martinez) 7. 10:22 AM - Air Tank Cocktail (Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD) 8. 10:32 AM - Re: Air Tank Cocktail (Harv) 9. 11:03 AM - Re: Re: Air Tank Cocktail (Larry Pine) 10. 12:00 PM - Re: Selling my CJ (William Geipel) 11. 12:27 PM - Re: Selling my CJ (Ernest Martinez) 12. 12:44 PM - Re: Selling my CJ (William Geipel) 13. 01:17 PM - Re: Selling my CJ (Greg Wrobel) 14. 01:45 PM - Re: Selling my CJ (Ernest Martinez) 15. 01:55 PM - Re: Re: Air Tank Cocktail (Mark Davis) 16. 05:25 PM - Re: Re: Air Tank Cocktail (Robin Hou) 17. 05:57 PM - Re: Re: Air Tank Cocktail (A. Dennis Savarese) 18. 07:19 PM - Re: Re: Air Tank Cocktail (Ernest Martinez) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:35:18 AM PST US From: "Richard Goode" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail I am no expert in these matters, but is it a good idea to have a mixture of grease, presumably slightly inflammable, with very high pressure air? Richard Goode Aerobatics Rhodds Farm Lyonshall Hereford HR5 3LW Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129 www.russianaeros.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vic Sent: 03 March 2017 03:08 Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail Whats good about glycerin when you expect to get water in the tank ?? That will be washed away soon and be gone. You want rust protection, no ? We use real sticky chain lube from spray cans, let the thinner in it dry before assembly and no rust for years. Vic Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466817#466817 -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:07:14 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail From: "Vic" Richard, I suggested having the thinner dried before assembling the system. High pressure - 50 bar ?? Or else, injecting pure alcohol into the system not flammable ?? Vic Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466820#466820 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:54:28 AM PST US From: "Richard Goode" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail Good point - but I do know that highly compressed air and anything flammable is not a great idea! Richard Goode Aerobatics Rhodds Farm Lyonshall Hereford HR5 3LW Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129 www.russianaeros.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vic Sent: 03 March 2017 13:04 Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail Richard, I suggested having the thinner dried before assembling the system. High pressure - 50 bar ?? Or else, injecting pure alcohol into the system not flammable ?? Vic Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466820#466820 -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:52:00 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail From: "Vic" Richard, dont confuse (mildly) compressed air with pure oxygen. I would definitely NOT advise grease or some such in oxygen cylinders. But simple grease or oil is not easy to ignite, like in Diesels. Youd require a LOT more pressure plus temperature to get the bang. Anybody operating his Diesel will know , even more so in winter times. No, I dont see any problem here, never had any since ten years with chain grease in the tank. But then, we never had any visible water there too, in the 18 T. Dunno, why not . . . Vic Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466825#466825 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:22:44 AM PST US From: doug sapp Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail Gents, Both Glycerin and alcohol are humectants, meaning that they absorb moisture. The "cocktail" is fully described in the manual, which most of us have but for some reason fail to read. Castor oil is also used in the pneumatic system, and is VERY effective in stopping the tiny leaks which plague us all on occasion. It too is covered in the manual. Best, Doug On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 2:32 AM, Richard Goode < richard.goode@russianaeros.com> wrote: > richard.goode@russianaeros.com> > > I am no expert in these matters, but is it a good idea to have a mixture of > grease, presumably slightly inflammable, with very high pressure air? > > > Richard Goode Aerobatics > Rhodds Farm > Lyonshall > Hereford > HR5 3LW > > Tel: +44 (0) 1544 340120 > Fax: +44 (0) 1544 340129 > www.russianaeros.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vic > Sent: 03 March 2017 03:08 > To: yak-list@matronics.com > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail > > > What=C2=B4s good about glycerin when you expect to get water in the tank ?? That > will be washed away soon and be gone. You want rust protection, no ? We u se > real sticky chain lube from spray cans, let the thinner in it dry before > assembly and no rust for years. > > Vic > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466817#466817 > > > -- > This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by > MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. > > =========== =========== =========== =========== =========== > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:16:51 AM PST US From: Ernest Martinez Subject: Yak-List: Selling my CJ I'm selling my CJ. Fly away condition. Nice tight stock airplane. $65k. Contact me off list. Ernie ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:22:26 AM PST US From: "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD" Subject: Yak-List: Air Tank Cocktail The subject of what to mix up and put in the pneumatic system has been an on-again, off-again topic for decades now. It seems that everyone has their own idea of "extra ingredients" that can be added to make it even better. I respect the fact that Jon is actually ASKING about "tool oil" here, and not just doing it out of hand because someone else suggested it. For the record, I followed lots of advice when I first purchased my Russian aircraft one of which was adding pneumatic tool oil to the mixture of "stuff" to blow into the pneumatic system. The result was a total failure of the chevron seals in the landing gear actuators. Were they old to begin with? Yes they were. However, adding that tool oil was without a doubt the catalyst that led to their demise and I was just lucky that I didn't end up becoming a statistic. Experimental aircraft owners have a lot of latitude on what they can do with their airplanes but I would suggest caution when implementing ideas that are not covered in the maintenance manuals. Mark p.s. Jon, don't add any "tool oil" or anything else that will end up being blown through the aircrafts pneumatic system. Instead stick to the plan. The one the people who made the airplane recommend. -----Original Message----- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Boede Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2017 7:01 PM Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Yak-List: Air Tank Cocktail I'm rinsing my main air tank. I have glycerin from Doug, but how much of that and how much alcohol and what kind of alcohol goes in? Mixed together or just put them in and let them work it out? Also, put a little tool oil in the main tank or no? Thanks, Jon ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:32:35 AM PST US Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail From: "Harv" I believe the manual also mentions applying varnish to protect from rust. Once the tanks are rust free and clean could a simple 2k clear lacquer be applied (or something like POR15) with a sloshing action and then drained and allowed to cure, once coated rust won't form..? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466831#466831 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:03:22 AM PST US From: Larry Pine Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail There is a lot of opinions on this.=C2-=C2- I did the same inspection d uring my last 100hr and I believe Doug Sapp suggested pure Castor oil.=C2 - That is what I did, but I'm sure others used all sorts of stuff.Larry P ine From: Harv To: yak-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, March 3, 2017 10:31 AM Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail I believe the manual also mentions applying varnish to protect from rust. Once the=C2- tanks are rust free and clean could a simple 2k clear lacque r be applied (or something like POR15) with a sloshing action and then drai ned and allowed to cure, once coated rust won't form..? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466831#466831 S - WIKI - - =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -Matt Dralle, List Admin. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:00:09 PM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: Selling my CJ From: William Geipel Then what will you fly? > On Mar 3, 2017, at 09:14, Ernest Martinez wrote: > > I'm selling my CJ. Fly away condition. Nice tight stock airplane. $65k. Contact me off list. > > Ernie ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:27:31 PM PST US From: Ernest Martinez Subject: Re: Yak-List: Selling my CJ A Broom :) On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 2:55 PM, William Geipel wrote: > > Then what will you fly? > > > On Mar 3, 2017, at 09:14, Ernest Martinez wrote: > > > > I'm selling my CJ. Fly away condition. Nice tight stock airplane. $65k. > Contact me off list. > > > > Ernie > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:44:00 PM PST US From: William Geipel Subject: Re: Yak-List: Selling my CJ Two seater I hope. Must not forget Ms. Mary. > On Mar 3, 2017, at 13:24, Ernest Martinez wrote: > > A Broom :) > > On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 2:55 PM, William Geipel > wrote: > > > Then what will you fly? > > > On Mar 3, 2017, at 09:14, Ernest Martinez > wrote: > > > > I'm selling my CJ. Fly away condition. Nice tight stock airplane. $65k. Contact me off list. > > > > Ernie > > > ======================== =========== > List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List > ======================== =========== > FORUMS - > eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com > ======================== =========== > WIKI - > errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com > ======================== =========== > b Site - > -Matt Dralle, List Admin. > rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ======================== =========== > > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:17:06 PM PST US From: Greg Wrobel Subject: Re: Yak-List: Selling my CJ Ernie, if u sell your CJ, who is going to keep us entertained at Swamp Thunder. The local police will not have anything to do if they are looking for you when you are AOL from the morning briefs. Who is going to close down all the bars every night? The brass pole dancer at the pool table won't have anyone to buy her drinks. Who are we going to pick on because of their LSD beliefs (Liberal, Socialist, Democrats). Don't sell your airplane, we're gonna miss you!!!! On Mar 3, 2017 15:46, "William Geipel" wrote: > Two seater I hope. Must not forget Ms. Mary. > > On Mar 3, 2017, at 13:24, Ernest Martinez wrote: > > A Broom :) > > On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 2:55 PM, William Geipel wrote: > >> >> Then what will you fly? >> >> > On Mar 3, 2017, at 09:14, Ernest Martinez wrote: >> > >> > I'm selling my CJ. Fly away condition. Nice tight stock airplane. $65k. >> Contact me off list. >> > >> > Ernie >> >> >> =================================== >> List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/ >> Navigator?Yak-List >> =================================== >> FORUMS - >> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com >> =================================== >> WIKI - >> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com >> =================================== >> b Site - >> -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> =================================== >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:45:32 PM PST US From: Ernest Martinez Subject: Re: Yak-List: Selling my CJ First of all I don't appreciate all the falsehoods mentioned here.....I'm not a Liberal :) On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 4:13 PM, Greg Wrobel wrote: > Ernie, if u sell your CJ, who is going to keep us entertained at Swamp > Thunder. The local police will not have anything to do if they are looking > for you when you are AOL from the morning briefs. Who is going to close > down all the bars every night? The brass pole dancer at the pool table > won't have anyone to buy her drinks. Who are we going to pick on because of > their LSD beliefs (Liberal, Socialist, Democrats). Don't sell your > airplane, we're gonna miss you!!!! > > On Mar 3, 2017 15:46, "William Geipel" wrote: > >> Two seater I hope. Must not forget Ms. Mary. >> >> On Mar 3, 2017, at 13:24, Ernest Martinez wrote: >> >> A Broom :) >> >> On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 2:55 PM, William Geipel wrote: >> >>> >>> Then what will you fly? >>> >>> > On Mar 3, 2017, at 09:14, Ernest Martinez wrote: >>> > >>> > I'm selling my CJ. Fly away condition. Nice tight stock airplane. >>> $65k. Contact me off list. >>> > >>> > Ernie >>> >>> >>> ========== >>> List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/ >>> Navigator?Yak-List >>> ========== >>> FORUMS - >>> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com >>> ========== >>> WIKI - >>> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com >>> ========== >>> b Site - >>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >>> ========== >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:55:41 PM PST US From: "Mark Davis" Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail Harv, Anything that can harden can fracture. I'd be worried about fractured bits moving through the system that wouldn't be friendly to the actuators and cylinders or start system. Whatever gunk forms in the system seems to be carried out with an occasional dose of glycerine/alcohol in my system. I've even cured a leaking actuator in my landing gear before by giving it a shot of glycerine/alcohol. The handful of snot in my hand after cycling the gear a few times must've had the culprit mixed in with it. That's my experience, YMMV. Mark Davis N44YK -----Original Message----- From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Harv Sent: Friday, March 03, 2017 11:31 AM Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail I believe the manual also mentions applying varnish to protect from rust. Once the tanks are rust free and clean could a simple 2k clear lacquer be applied (or something like POR15) with a sloshing action and then drained and allowed to cure, once coated rust won't form..? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466831#466831 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 05:25:23 PM PST US From: Robin Hou Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail Since the subject of this post has drifted to main tank rust prevention, I always wonder if adding an additional stainless steel compress air/water filter from Doug Sapp to the main tank outlet would help the entire system stay clean? Do you see any down side to this idea (other then the added cost and maintenance which are fairly minimum)? On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Mark Davis wrote: > > Harv, > Anything that can harden can fracture. I'd be worried about fractured > bits moving through the system that wouldn't be friendly to the actuators > and cylinders or start system. Whatever gunk forms in the system seems to > be carried out with an occasional dose of glycerine/alcohol in my system. > I've even cured a leaking actuator in my landing gear before by giving it a > shot of glycerine/alcohol. The handful of snot in my hand after cycling > the > gear a few times must've had the culprit mixed in with it. That's my > experience, YMMV. > > Mark Davis > N44YK > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Harv > Sent: Friday, March 03, 2017 11:31 AM > To: yak-list@matronics.com > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail > > > I believe the manual also mentions applying varnish to protect from rust. > > Once the tanks are rust free and clean could a simple 2k clear lacquer be > applied (or something like POR15) with a sloshing action and then drained > and allowed to cure, once coated rust won't form..? > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466831#466831 > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 05:57:10 PM PST US Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail From: "A. Dennis Savarese" I guess you could put one on the output side as well. But because the compressor on the CJ fills both the main and emergency bottles, you should really put one on the output of both tanks. The way the moisture gets into the tank in the first place is from the compressor.That's why putting Doug's SS filter on the input to the tank is the best thing you can do...stop the moisture to the maximum extent possible from entering the two tanks. Dennis On 3/3/2017 7:23 PM, Robin Hou wrote: > Since the subject of this post has drifted to main tank rust > prevention, I always wonder if adding an additional stainless steel > compress air/water filter from Doug Sapp to the main tank outlet would > help the entire system stay clean? > > Do you see any down side to this idea (other then the added cost and > maintenance which are fairly minimum)? > > On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Mark Davis > wrote: > > > > > Harv, > Anything that can harden can fracture. I'd be worried about > fractured > bits moving through the system that wouldn't be friendly to the > actuators > and cylinders or start system. Whatever gunk forms in the system > seems to > be carried out with an occasional dose of glycerine/alcohol in my > system. > I've even cured a leaking actuator in my landing gear before by > giving it a > shot of glycerine/alcohol. The handful of snot in my hand after > cycling the > gear a few times must've had the culprit mixed in with it. That's my > experience, YMMV. > > Mark Davis > N44YK > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com > ] On Behalf Of Harv > Sent: Friday, March 03, 2017 11:31 AM > To: yak-list@matronics.com > Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail > > > > > I believe the manual also mentions applying varnish to protect > from rust. > > Once the tanks are rust free and clean could a simple 2k clear > lacquer be > applied (or something like POR15) with a sloshing action and then > drained > and allowed to cure, once coated rust won't form..? > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466831#466831 > > > > =================================== > List" rel="noreferrer" > target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List > =================================== > FORUMS - > eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com > =================================== > WIKI - > errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com > =================================== > b Site - > -Matt Dralle, List Admin. > rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > =================================== > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:19:46 PM PST US From: Ernest Martinez Subject: Re: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail It's also important to have a tight air system. In a normally operating system the air compressor will charge up the air system up to operating pressure and then that air remains static in the plumbing, while the remaining air being produced by the compressor just blows by the pressure regulator prior to the desiccant. But if you ignore a leaky air valve or actuator, then you end up with air constantly flowing through your system very rapidly depleting the moisture absorbing capacity of your desiccant which then leads to very wet air flowing through your air system from it's point of origin at the compressor to where it ultimately finds it's way out at the leak. This can happen very rapidly with a sufficient leak. If you feel moisture on your hand when you actuate your flaps or gear, thats water blowing out of the exhaust port, and means you have water in your system and your desiccant is dead. Ernie On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 8:48 PM, A. Dennis Savarese < dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> wrote: > dsavarese0812@bellsouth.net> > > I guess you could put one on the output side as well. But because the > compressor on the CJ fills both the main and emergency bottles, you should > really put one on the output of both tanks. > > The way the moisture gets into the tank in the first place is from the > compressor.That's why putting Doug's SS filter on the input to the tank is > the best thing you can do...stop the moisture to the maximum extent > possible from entering the two tanks. > Dennis > > > On 3/3/2017 7:23 PM, Robin Hou wrote: > >> Since the subject of this post has drifted to main tank rust prevention, >> I always wonder if adding an additional stainless steel compress air/water >> filter from Doug Sapp to the main tank outlet would help the entire system >> stay clean? >> >> Do you see any down side to this idea (other then the added cost and >> maintenance which are fairly minimum)? >> >> On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Mark Davis > markdavis@wbsnet.org>> wrote: >> >> > >> >> Harv, >> Anything that can harden can fracture. I'd be worried about >> fractured >> bits moving through the system that wouldn't be friendly to the >> actuators >> and cylinders or start system. Whatever gunk forms in the system >> seems to >> be carried out with an occasional dose of glycerine/alcohol in my >> system. >> I've even cured a leaking actuator in my landing gear before by >> giving it a >> shot of glycerine/alcohol. The handful of snot in my hand after >> cycling the >> gear a few times must've had the culprit mixed in with it. That's my >> experience, YMMV. >> >> Mark Davis >> N44YK >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com >> >> [mailto:owner-yak-list-server@matronics.com >> ] On Behalf Of Harv >> Sent: Friday, March 03, 2017 11:31 AM >> To: yak-list@matronics.com >> Subject: Yak-List: Re: Air Tank Cocktail >> >> > >> >> I believe the manual also mentions applying varnish to protect >> from rust. >> >> Once the tanks are rust free and clean could a simple 2k clear >> lacquer be >> applied (or something like POR15) with a sloshing action and then >> drained >> and allowed to cure, once coated rust won't form..? >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466831#466831 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> =================================== >> List" rel="noreferrer" >> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List >> =================================== >> FORUMS - >> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com >> =================================== >> WIKI - >> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com >> =================================== >> b Site - >> -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.mat >> ronics.com/contribution >> =================================== >> >> >> >> >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message yak-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Yak-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/yak-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/yak-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.