Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:53 AM - Re: Zenith-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 11/29/02 (Chris Weber)
2. 05:46 AM - Re: Shopping for a drill press (Grant Corriveau)
3. 06:15 AM - Re: Zenith Flyers Home Airports (Cleone Markwell)
4. 06:54 AM - Re: Airport contact list (William Nichelson)
5. 08:06 AM - Re: Zenith Flyers Home Airports (Ed Kramer)
6. 08:47 AM - Re: Zenith flyers home airports (Grant Corriveau)
7. 09:42 AM - XL Fuel System (wizard-24@juno.com)
8. 10:33 AM - Fast At Last (Schallgren@aol.com)
9. 11:58 AM - 601HDS Patial Kit For Sale (Don)
10. 12:07 PM - [ RURUNY ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
11. 12:56 PM - Re: XL Canopy (randewilbers1@aol.com)
12. 01:40 PM - Re: Shopping for a drill press (Carlos Sa)
13. 01:42 PM - Re: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 11/29/02 (daveaustin2@sprint.ca)
14. 04:51 PM - Re: Fast At Last (Grant Corriveau)
15. 06:26 PM - Re: When to install the elevator trim? (Bryan Martin)
16. 08:05 PM - (RURUNY@aol.com)
17. 11:03 PM - Re: (Jim Frisby)
18. 11:05 PM - New, NEW List Digest Format... (Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 11/29/02 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Chris Weber" <chrisoz@gmx.net>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2@sprint.ca>
>
> Can anyone on the list help me with a paint colour question..
> I want to use camoflage colours as used by wartime aircraft. I have the
> definition of the colours in British standards numbers and Federal
Standards
> numbers.
Hello Dave,
fwiw, a couple of month ago I had to make a low goaround because a friends
Messerschmidt 109 G Replica, retractable undercarriage and all, had suffered
a flat tailwheel on our grassstrip. You just don't see those things when
they are camourflaged!!!
I saw the white spinner before I saw the rest of the plane.
As much as I love the British WWII planes, they are the reason that got me
into flying, I would hesitate to run the additional risk of collision and
lost time if you should ever get in trouble and you are invisible.
How about polishing her up and marking her as a Mustang P51? Nice and shiny!
Cheers, Chris
601 "Small and Humble", polished
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Shopping for a drill press |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Grant Corriveau <grantC@ca.inter.net>
on 02/11/29 22:16, Carlos Sa at carlosfsa@yahoo.com wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Carlos Sa <carlosfsa@yahoo.com>
>
> Good point, Michel.
>
> However, it takes only about 15 minutes to cut each hole by hand, so that's
> what I'm
> doing.
Carlos,
When you say you are using the flycutter 'by hand', do you mean with a
hand-held drill? I used the flycutter in my variable speed handheld drill,
to make holes for instruments, etc... I got pretty good at it after a couple
of practice tries -- working at a very slow drill speed with the metal
well-clamped to a peice of wood behind . fwiw
Grant
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith Flyers Home Airports |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Cleone Markwell <cleone@rr1.net>
And if you are crossing Illinois between St. Louis and Indianapolis my home
airport is Casey, Illinois, 1H8, One Hotel Eight on the eastern side of
the state. Love to see Zodiacs. Cleone
At 10:28 AM 11/30/02 -0500, you wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: Benford2@aol.com
>
>If you are going skiing, snowmobilin or anything else look me up here in
>Jackson Hole, JAC. We have a log guest house that is just sitting there
>staring at the Tetons waiting to have the woodstove lit.
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Airport contact list |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: William Nichelson <bn2@bright.net>
Please include me in the map of builders too. I live in Bellefontaine, Ohio
and my plane is hangered in Kenton, Ohio at Hardin County Airport (I95). I
have a 601HDS, with about 120 hours of flying behind me.
I have had several builders and prospective builders come by to see my
plane and would welcome any visitors. My kids are all grown too, so I have
spare bedrooms if you need a place to stay for the night. I think I will
plan a trip for next summer and take advantage of stopping in on other
builders - sounds like a great time and adventure.
Bill Nichelson
Bellefontaine, Ohio USA
Zodiac 601HDS
S/N 6-3556 - N132BN - "Casual Passion"
3300 Jabiru Engine, Prince Prop
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/pm.cgi?login=bn2&ID=272125&action=display
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith Flyers Home Airports |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Ed Kramer" <edkramer@prodigy.net>
Greetings Listers,
I also would like to be included in the map of Zenith builders &
flyers. I live in West Seneca, NY. I am 2 miles from Buffalo Airfield (9G0).
I am currently building a CH 701 & any builders, prospective builders or
flyers are welcome to stop by for a visit.
Ed Kramer
West Seneca, NY
CH 701
edkramer@prodigy.net
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Grant Corriveau <grantC@ca.inter.net>
on 02/11/30 00:18, Gary Gower at ggower_99@yahoo.com wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
>
> Sorry, forgot the link...
>
> http://www.airnav.com/airport/KOPL
>
Gary,
Thanks for sending that link - what a great site. I sincerely hope that the
will extend it to cover Canada and Mexico and the Bahamas...
This is not only a great way to plan/dream flights on the Zodie, but during
my frequent crossings of the USA, I have several emergency/alternate
airports along the route that I always keep an eye on. Our company manuals
contain very sketchy information (sometimes out of date) about these
airports, so I intend to print up my own file for certain airports from this
website. (and pass it on to my Pilot's Union for others too)
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
Message 7
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: wizard-24@juno.com
OK, I'm at the point now where I can no longer just stare at the plane
and wonder where and how the fuel lines will be run. Time to get to it!
Problem is, I'm having trouble figuring out how to plumb for 4 tanks for
my XL, so I was wondering what everyone else is doing.
Here's my situation: Two main wing tanks (inboard), and two auxilliary
tanks (outboard). That means 4 fuel lines total -- two from each side of
the plane entering the fuselage. The gascolator is already installed in
the floor of the cabin per ZAC's plans. So now I have to decide what's
best.....do I run each tank independently to its own valve, or do I "T"
them together so I have only 2 systems. And if I "T" them.....do I
connect the two outboard tanks to each other, or do I "T" each set of
wing tanks? I'm not sure how the fuel will flow when one tanks empties
under a "T"d system. And as for valves, to avoid having a bump in the
fuel lines, I suppose they'll have to be installed on the floor channel
per the plans....but that seems awfully hard to reach the valves that
would over in the passenger side of the cockpit. I suppose I could use
one of those expensive Andair valves with an extension so the control
handle can be mounted on the center section, but they don't seem to make
one that accomodates four separate tanks.
Also -- with respect to wiring --- where is everyone routing everything?
Through the middle tunnel? (and if so, how are you avoiding interference
with the control cables?) Or are you cutting a hole in the middle spar?
There's lots to run in the way of wiring, antennae, pitot/static lines,
brake lines, etc, and I'm just not finding enough room for all that
stuff!
Thanks,
Mike Fortunato
601XL
Message 8
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Schallgren@aol.com
601'ers especially Perry and Grant:
Some additional info I would have included on my previous report had time
permitted.
The Jabiru 3300 produces 120 HP at 3300 rpm.
The empty weight of N323WS is 632 pounds. That has been supplemented by a 5
pound lead weight on the tail at 146.6" courtesy of Jeff Small. This latter
was required because we put the battery in the engine compartment which made
it a very forward CG.
The aircraft is a trike and the engine is air cooled so no radiator is
required.
The cowl came from Jabiru along with the firewall forward package. Great
cowl, highly recommended.
75% cruise is 2750 rpm which gave us 130 mph at 6,500.' I am hoping it will
be a little higher when we can fly lower without running into the ground.
We have no speed mods completed as yet. The nose gear wheel pant attaching
points are mounted and the pant will soon be installed. The only gap cover
installed is immediately below the horizontal stabilizer. Several additional
speed enhancements are planned.
Sensenich has two prop divisions, the wooden division is in Florida where our
prop came from. Our prop is wooden, two bladed and the diameter is 64" with
a 49 degree pitch. We got only about 2500 rpm at the beginning of the
takeoff roll so what we have now is a cruise prop. Takeoff roll even with
about 500 fewer rpm's was still impressive.
Considerable self-doubt was generated by the flying with a Prince 58 X 48
with much slower speeds resulting. When you are failing you wonder if it's
sloppy building, improperly functioning engine or the prop. Now we feel that
we have passed the building test as the aircraft flies at the speeds Zenith
says it should. Quite simply, the problem always was the prop. New much
reduced fuel flows and higher speeds are predicted and will be reported.
So from two unbiased, impartial builders we say; Build Zenith, Power by
Jabiru, Prop by Sensenich.
Stan Challgren and TR Moore
Message 9
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| Subject: | 601HDS Patial Kit For Sale |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Don" <grandpanma@earthlink.net>
Hi List,
***** UPDATE *****
*** PRICE REDUCED AGAIN ***
Still have my Partial Kit FOR SALE. $4995.00
*********** MUST SELL ************
Get a head start or add cheaply to what you already have.
My financial situation has changed and I can no longer afford to
continue building.
I started out building the 601HDS Rudder in the factory weekend
workshop, brought the "Tail kit" home with me. Finished the "Tail kit",
now was working on the "Wing kit".
I only finished the skeleton of one wing, that's where I stopped.
Must sell what I have.
Drawings & Manuals: (stays with kit) $340.00
Complete Tail Kit W/flush electric trim tab:(Finished) 1495.00
Wing & Aileron Kit: (finished skeleton of one wing) 4580.00
Leading Edge fuel tank kit: 875.00
Navigation/strobe light Kit: ** SOLD **
____________
Total: 7280.00
Have a few EXTRA parts I will include.
Will sell at a very reasonable price: ---- Around ---- $4995.00
My E-mail Address is: grandpanma@earthlink.net
I live in Puckett, MS. That's about 25 miles south/east of Jackson, MS.
My phone No. 601-591-1589
Sincerely,
Donald Vough Jr.
Message 10
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| Subject: | [ RURUNY ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: RURUNY <RURUNY@aol.com>
Subject: 701 Elevator Mistake Photo
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/RURUNY@aol.com.12.01.2002/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures@matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
Message 11
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: randewilbers1@aol.com
Mike: If you have access to a 5" or 6" vise mounted to a work bench you can
make a nice bending tool. Tape three 3/8" bolts to the jaws as follows:
Put 2 0n one jaw at each end. Let the bolts be perpendicular to the jaw and
let the heads rest on the jaw and tape securely.
Put the other bolt in the center of the other jaw and tape securely.
Place your frame in the vise and tighten the vise. The frames will bend very
easily.
Make SMALL frequent bends to get the profile of the longerons. This job
doesn't take very long, but it sure works well.
Dick Wilbers 601HDS
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Shopping for a drill press |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Carlos Sa <carlosfsa@yahoo.com>
Grant, I mean it literaly: I drill the centre hole and then hold the cutter and
turn
it with my hands. It sounds worse than it actually is.
The cutter shaft is too large for my drills...
Regards
Carlos
> > However, it takes only about 15 minutes to cut each hole by hand, so that's
> > what I'm
> > doing.
>
> Carlos,
>
> When you say you are using the flycutter 'by hand', do you mean with a
> hand-held drill? I used the flycutter in my variable speed handheld drill,
> to make holes for instruments, etc... I got pretty good at it after a couple
> of practice tries -- working at a very slow drill speed with the metal
> well-clamped to a peice of wood behind . fwiw
>
> Grant
>
>
>
>
>
>
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 11/29/02 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "daveaustin2@sprint.ca" <daveaustin2@sprint.ca>
Chris,
The colour scheme is for a replica warplane! Not the Zodie, but thought
someone on the list would have an answer.
I appreciate your comments.
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Chris Weber chrisoz@gmx.net
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 11/29/02
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Chris Weber" <chrisoz@gmx.net>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2@sprint.ca>
>
> Can anyone on the list help me with a paint colour question..
> I want to use camoflage colours as used by wartime aircraft. I have the
> definition of the colours in British standards numbers and Federal
Standards
> numbers.
Hello Dave,
fwiw, a couple of month ago I had to make a low goaround because a friends
Messerschmidt 109 G Replica, retractable undercarriage and all, had suffered
a flat tailwheel on our grassstrip. You just don't see those things when
they are camourflaged!!!
I saw the white spinner before I saw the rest of the plane.
As much as I love the British WWII planes, they are the reason that got me
into flying, I would hesitate to run the additional risk of collision and
lost time if you should ever get in trouble and you are invisible.
How about polishing her up and marking her as a Mustang P51? Nice and shiny!
Cheers, Chris
601 "Small and Humble", polished
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Fast At Last |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Grant Corriveau <grantC@ca.inter.net>
on 02/12/01 13:31, Schallgren@aol.com at Schallgren@aol.com wrote:
> Now we feel that
> we have passed the building test as the aircraft flies at the speeds Zenith
> says it should
Good stuff! It's educational From 80 Hp to 120 is a 50% increase from the
original design, and produces the last 10 to 15 mph that we weren't seeing
in Heinz's original specs (or at least as they developed into the 601HDS)
.... the 'wall of drag' laws are valid. (i.e. square of the speed, etc.))
Anyhow, now we know what's required.
Good work discovering a decent prop for the Jab 3300! That'll help out a lot
of folks.
Grant
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: When to install the elevator trim? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "W. R. \"Gig\" Giacona" <wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: When to install the elevator trim?
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "W. R. \"Gig\" Giacona"
> <wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
>
I installed the recessed trim tab on my XL elevator after closing. It
was no problem.
Bryan Martin
Message 16
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: RURUNY@aol.com
Brian Unruh ruruNY@aol.com
Long Island, NY
STOL CH 701
Ser No 4831
Drawing 7-H-5
Part Numbers 7H5-3 7H5-1
While finishing the last steps for the elevator construction I pilot drilled &
clecoed(#40) 7H5-3 horn angle and 7H5-1 upper elevator horn to elevator.I was
very proud of my work at this point till I realized the elevator was upside down.
After crying for 10 minutes, I calmed down accepted my error,
turned it right side up and reinstalled these 2 parts and the 7H5-2 lower horn
all in their proper place and drilled and clecoed A5. What I am left with is 4
#40 holes on the front of the spar and 4 #40 holes on the bottom skin. I would
like to know if only rivets can be put in these holes by them selves or should
I make backing plates from scrap for backside of holes. Or is this unreparable.
See photo in photoshare at:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/RURUNY@aol.com.12.01.2002/index.html
Im waiting to hear from zenith but would like input from listers.
Started Oct17 2002...Completed rudder Stab and....elevator I hope.
Thank you,
Brian Unruh
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/bunruh
Message 17
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Frisby" <marslander@hotmail.com>
Brian,
Those holes look like #30 to me, in any case, as long as they are 10mm or
more from the new holes, they don't present any structural problem. For
cosmetic purposes, you can put blind rivets in them, some say that putting a
rivet in those stray holes reduces any tendency for a crack to start there,
I'm not convinced, but it does look better.
Jim Frisby
Palmer, Alaska
>From: RURUNY@aol.com
>Reply-To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Date: Sun, 01 Dec 2002 23:03:44 -0500
>
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: RURUNY@aol.com
>
>Brian Unruh ruruNY@aol.com
>Long Island, NY
>STOL CH 701
>Ser No 4831
>Drawing 7-H-5
>Part Numbers 7H5-3 7H5-1
>
>While finishing the last steps for the elevator construction I pilot
>drilled & clecoed(#40) 7H5-3 horn angle and 7H5-1 upper elevator horn to
>elevator.I was very proud of my work at this point till I realized the
>elevator was upside down.
>After crying for 10 minutes, I calmed down accepted my error,
>turned it right side up and reinstalled these 2 parts and the 7H5-2 lower
>horn all in their proper place and drilled and clecoed A5. What I am left
>with is 4 #40 holes on the front of the spar and 4 #40 holes on the bottom
>skin. I would like to know if only rivets can be put in these holes by them
>selves or should I make backing plates from scrap for backside of holes. Or
>is this unreparable. See photo in photoshare at:
>http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/RURUNY@aol.com.12.01.2002/index.html
>
>Im waiting to hear from zenith but would like input from listers.
>Started Oct17 2002...Completed rudder Stab and....elevator I hope.
>
>Thank you,
> Brian Unruh
>http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/bunruh
>
>
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
Message 18
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| Subject: | New, NEW List Digest Format... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Dear Listers,
Okay, so I woke up this morning to an email box full of hate-mail about the
new List Digest format. I thought it was cool, but I guess not... Still,
it seemed like too much code to just throw out, so I've modified things a
little and I'm hoping everyone will be happy with the new, NEW
arrangement. Here's how it works now:
o The HTML and TXT enclosures aren't sent in the Digest any longer.
o URL Links to the HTML and TEXT versions of the day's Digests
will be found at the top of the digest email.
o The new Digest Index will be found at the top of the digest email
following the URL Links.
o The full digest text will then be found in the email as before.
o All of the previous Digests will now be available on line. The
URL for the main digest page is:
http://www.matronics.com/digest
From here, you can drill into the specific List Digest of interest.
o Both the HTML and TXT versions of the Digests can be found here.
o The List Message Trailer will contain a Link directly to the given
o Right now there's only one Digest shown, but each day there will
be another. They will be sorted with the newest at the top.
Left-hand column is the HTML version, right-hand column the TXT
version.
A couple people also complained that some messages in the HTML version were
just one long line that went off to the right forever and they hated
that. Come to think of it, this is also an issue in the Search Engine,
List Browser, and Archive Browser. Some email programs don't included hard
Returns at regular intervals and that's what causes this. I wrote a
program tonight that will automatically chop these long lines into 78
characters or less and wrap the rest of the line. After tonight's Archive
transfer, all of the Searching and Browsing tools shouldn't have the
problem any longer either. Woo hoo!
So, back to the new Digest format. What people are going to see in the
new, NEW Digest is a bit of verbiage at the top of the email describing the
URL links to the HTML and TXT on-line versions, followed by the Links,
followed by the day's Index, followed by the day's messages just as
before. Lines longer than 78 characters will also be automatically wrapped
onto the next line.
Hopefully this will be a more pleasing arrangement for everyone. Sorry to
get everybody so stirred up over the format change!
The List of Contributors is coming out tomorrow night... Still time to
make that Contribution! http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
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