Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:09 AM - Re: Re: Corvairs (Robert Rehmel)
2. 01:31 PM - Rotax 912 school (Jon Croke)
3. 02:01 PM - Re: Re: Corvairs (John Krumrine)
4. 02:55 PM - accurate drawings (not 6-w-2) (CLOJAN@aol.com)
5. 03:28 PM - cutting alum bar (alex trent)
6. 04:47 PM - Re: accurate drawings (not 6-w-2) (Steve Shuck)
7. 05:19 PM - Re: cutting alum bar (Randall Stout)
8. 05:48 PM - Re: cutting alum bar (Philip Polstra)
9. 07:32 PM - Keep It Simple Fred (Larry Bohannon)
10. 10:11 PM - Re: Keep It Simple Fred (Gary Gower)
Message 1
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert Rehmel" <traveler601@earthlink.net>
I would be interested also. I hunted around for a few months for a core
and finally got one off of a guy in Milwaukee. Around Dayton Ohio there
was a junk yard getting rid of Corviars. You had to haul away the whole
car to get just the engine.
If Wynne is putting together an engine mount for the Zodiac is it going to
be just plans or do you buy the mount from him?
> [Original Message]
> From: nhulin <nhulin@hotmail.com>
> To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 2/13/2003 9:45:30 PM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Corvairs
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "nhulin" <nhulin@hotmail.com>
>
> Mike,
>
> I had an email reply from William a couple of weeks back. He is still
> intending to do the engine mounts. He advises that the stock engine
cowling
> will work with the front mounted starter with an added "bump". I'm still
> following up with the local Corsa club members for a rebuildable core.
There
> doesn't seem to be too many Corvairs in the mid-west.
>
> I'd really like to hear some first hand input from anyone who has actually
> got to the point of hanging a Corvair on their 601. Anyone out there?
>
> ...neil
> 601XL - doing wings and stuff
>
> > Me too!
> >
> > In fact, I sent an email to William Wynne to see how he was coming along
> > (IF he was coming along) on a FWF kit for the Corvair/601XL application.
> > Supposedly, he was working on one based on comments made in ZAC's
> > newsletter. I sent that email a couple of weeks ago and haven't heard
> > back yet. So any info on this engine choice would be great.
> >
> > Mike Fortunato
> > 601XL
>
>
>
>
>
--- Robert Rehmel
--- traveler601@earthlink.net
Message 2
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| Subject: | Rotax 912 school |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jon Croke" <Jon@joncroke.com>
Just returned this week from the Rotax 912 repair school (Lucedale,
Mississippi) at South MS Lite Aircraft. The 3 day workshop was conducted by
Eric Tucker who works for Kodiak (which is the distributor for Rotax in
N.A.)
Boy, was this great! Eric has been repairing/supporting this engine from
the beginning and really knows his stuff. We had a 912 torn down to every
single part on the workbench. And then put it all back together! While none
of us in attendance (about 15 students) would ever completely overhaul a 912
(tools, fixtures, and the experience to do it right must be on hand!) it was
still and incredibly valuable experience to know how this thing is put
together, and what some of the common failures are caused by. Also, we got a
history lesson about Rotax and some background on their manufacturing.
After finishing the 3 days, you realize that the engine is relatively
simple, and become a heck of a lot less afraid of it!
I know the class is 'expensive' ($450), but in the scheme of things, it is a
great investment and you cant really put a price tag on getting that kind of
knowledge! One (maybe obvious) detail that I would like to pass along to
all that own this engine is that the HEAVY MAINTENANCE manual along with the
Illustrated PARTS manual is ONLINE and downloadable/printable from their
website http://www.kodiakbs.com These are the latest versions as I noticed
that the one I had from my engine was way outta date. Also, the LINE
Maintenance, Installation, and Operator manuals are there, too. These
manuals contain so much valuable info.... Also, of course, the service
bulletins.
Got the scoop on the oil, coolant and fuel types to be used as far as the
factory is concerned. Finally now understand why a lot of the Loctite
numbers used in the Rotax manuals are darn hard to find around here... they
are European versions! Did you know that the 912 series is designed for a
1800 TBO, with a block life design of 3600 hours ? Yes, I know the official
TBO is 1200. Also, interesting discussions between the 912 and the 'S'
version... more than meets the eye there!
Many of you already know this too: the certified versions (F, etc) are the
SAME engines we use as UL uncertified and they all get tested at the
factory. There are different options for these, of course, but they make no
distinction in manufacturing. The extra several GRAND $$$ for certified is
the paper trail to track all the parts... etc. I'm sure that's money well
spent ;)
Now I still love my 503, (Firestar) and would like to attend the parallel
course on 2 cycle repair, but that would be another $450 and another day. My
701 project is using a used 912, and I still shudder at the price of that
thing (even used!) It seems that these ridiculous prices for parts on the
912 all boil down to limited production numbers.... same ol story.
Of course, you cant leave Lucedale, MS (now there's a big town!) without
traveling the Florida panhandle... camped at St Joe Island, St George...
etc. Paradise down there..... now its back to the Green Bay, Wi weather...
burrrr...
If you get the chance to go to one of these workshops, IMHO you will not be
dissapointed... we made some good friends with the other students... as
everyone in attendance was a 912 owner with something interesting attached
to it!
Jon
Firestar
Zenith 701 80%
www.joncroke.com
Message 3
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Krumrine <jqk4@psu.edu>
If you're looking for corvair engines for rebuilding, The Corvair Ranch in
Gettysburg, PA (717) 624-2805
has a wide selection. I just bought a 66 engine with all the right numbers
according to William. It costs $400 which is a little steep, but at least
I knew what I was getting and Rob is very willing to work with me for any
additional parts I need.
I have a rebuilt 0235 that has sit in my basement for 10 years, and I
planed to use it, but after researching extensively the corvair option, I
decided to rebuild the Corvair and use it. I've already disassemble the
engine, and it is a very easy engine to work on. I kinda like the idea that
if my engine needs any maintenance, I built it and know how to fix it.
John Krumrine
At 01:18 PM 2/15/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert Rehmel" <traveler601@earthlink.net>
>
>I would be interested also. I hunted around for a few months for a core
>and finally got one off of a guy in Milwaukee. Around Dayton Ohio there
>was a junk yard getting rid of Corviars. You had to haul away the whole
>car to get just the engine.
>
>If Wynne is putting together an engine mount for the Zodiac is it going to
>be just plans or do you buy the mount from him?
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: nhulin <nhulin@hotmail.com>
> > To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> > Date: 2/13/2003 9:45:30 PM
> > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Corvairs
> >
> > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "nhulin" <nhulin@hotmail.com>
> >
> > Mike,
> >
> > I had an email reply from William a couple of weeks back. He is still
> > intending to do the engine mounts. He advises that the stock engine
>cowling
> > will work with the front mounted starter with an added "bump". I'm still
> > following up with the local Corsa club members for a rebuildable core.
>There
> > doesn't seem to be too many Corvairs in the mid-west.
> >
> > I'd really like to hear some first hand input from anyone who has actually
> > got to the point of hanging a Corvair on their 601. Anyone out there?
> >
> > ...neil
> > 601XL - doing wings and stuff
> >
> > > Me too!
> > >
> > > In fact, I sent an email to William Wynne to see how he was coming along
> > > (IF he was coming along) on a FWF kit for the Corvair/601XL application.
> > > Supposedly, he was working on one based on comments made in ZAC's
> > > newsletter. I sent that email a couple of weeks ago and haven't heard
> > > back yet. So any info on this engine choice would be great.
> > >
> > > Mike Fortunato
> > > 601XL
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>--- Robert Rehmel
>--- traveler601@earthlink.net
>
>
John A. Krumrine
Director of Development
College of Agricultural Sciences
The Pennsylvania State University
230 Agricultural Administration Building
University Park, PA 16802
Office: 814-863-1168
Fax: 814-863-6152
http://www.development.psu.edu
Message 4
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| Subject: | accurate drawings (not 6-w-2) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: CLOJAN@aol.com
Mark: I want to give you a heads up on the aileron drawing 6-w-2 because I
know you are approaching that step but someone else on the list may also
benefit so it's to the list.
Look at the drawing above (3-aileron skin) and you will see two measurements
(295mm and 45mm). I laid the entire aileron by measuring back 45mm. Don't.
Use the 295mm measurement. 295 + 45=340. My top skin measures 348mm. That
difference of 8 mm will screw up all of the darn top rivet lines. Things
worked out much nicer once I understood this. Would have meant new skins if I
had predrilled the 20mm flange with my original layout. The way it is I have
10mm spacing on the first rivets now instead of 15. Also get all of the
aileron info from the builders page before you start. The instructions from
the web site are easier to understand than from the manual.(yes they are
different). This was a tuff one! Jack Russell
Message 5
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| Subject: | cutting alum bar |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: alex trent <atrent7@cogeco.ca>
My 601 wheel forks are built of 1/4" 6061 t6 flat stock. I would like
to make new ones "as per drawing" of 3/16 with 3/16 doublers. The major
problem is how do you cut this material when you don't have a power hack
saw or band saw. I am not really keen on the hand hack saw route.
alex t.
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: accurate drawings (not 6-w-2) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Steve Shuck" <stshuck@attbi.com>
So how again did you decide that their was a problem?
----- Original Message -----
From: <CLOJAN@aol.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: accurate drawings (not 6-w-2)
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: CLOJAN@aol.com
>
> Mark: I want to give you a heads up on the aileron drawing 6-w-2 because I
> know you are approaching that step but someone else on the list may also
> benefit so it's to the list.
> Look at the drawing above (3-aileron skin) and you will see two
measurements
> (295mm and 45mm). I laid the entire aileron by measuring back 45mm. Don't.
> Use the 295mm measurement. 295 + 45=340. My top skin measures 348mm. That
> difference of 8 mm will screw up all of the darn top rivet lines. Things
> worked out much nicer once I understood this. Would have meant new skins
if I
> had predrilled the 20mm flange with my original layout. The way it is I
have
> 10mm spacing on the first rivets now instead of 15. Also get all of the
> aileron info from the builders page before you start. The instructions
from
> the web site are easier to understand than from the manual.(yes they are
> different). This was a tuff one! Jack Russell
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: cutting alum bar |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Randall Stout" <r5t0ut@earthlink.net>
You have to schedule these kinds of situations around birthdays,
anniversaries, Christmas, etc. You just missed Valentines day. Make sure you
leave lots of hints for your wife, girlfriend, kids, parents or ?? I usually
get my point across if I leave the Sunday Sears circular opened up on the
kitchen table with things that I need (want) circled.
Or you could borrow a Saws All from someone. If you can't find a Saws All,
then maybe you can rent one. Check the phone book for places that rent
tools. Be prepared to do lots of filing afterwards. Considering all the
effort involved it, might be better off to just find a machine shop that has
the capability of sheering the metal. You might also have them bend it while
you are there.
Randy Stout - San Antonio TX
CH601HD N282RS n-number assigned! I getting closer.
r5t0ut@earthlink.net
http://www.geocities.com/r5t0ut21
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "alex trent" <atrent7@cogeco.ca>
Subject: Zenith-List: cutting alum bar
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: alex trent <atrent7@cogeco.ca>
>
> My 601 wheel forks are built of 1/4" 6061 t6 flat stock. I would
like
> to make new ones "as per drawing" of 3/16 with 3/16 doublers. The major
> problem is how do you cut this material when you don't have a power hack
> saw or band saw. I am not really keen on the hand hack saw route.
> alex t.
Message 8
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| Subject: | cutting alum bar |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra@mindspring.com>
Even if you get the kit, you have to cut these suckers. I did it by hand
which was a real pain. Nobody says you have to do it all at once though. I
didn't rivet my entire center wing section at once. I did it in several
sessions (over 5 hours total time).
For the L's that need to be cut down for the gear slides, I used a router.
Just shaved it down a little at a time. It worked great.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of alex trent
Subject: Zenith-List: cutting alum bar
--> Zenith-List message posted by: alex trent <atrent7@cogeco.ca>
My 601 wheel forks are built of 1/4" 6061 t6 flat stock. I would
like
to make new ones "as per drawing" of 3/16 with 3/16 doublers. The major
problem is how do you cut this material when you don't have a power hack
saw or band saw. I am not really keen on the hand hack saw route.
alex t.
---
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
---
Message 9
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| Subject: | Keep It Simple Fred |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry Bohannon" <lbohannon1@mindspring.com>
---- Chris has done so well to keep it simple----- I
think some of you folks, are building without getting
the plans etc from Zenair/ Zenith---- Chris explains
so much of what some of you folks ask of this site to
explain-- "fred" do no archive
I just picked up my complete kit at the factory 2 weeks ago which included the
latest plans and photo manual.I also bought from Zenith all the tools they recommend.
Thought I was all set and ready to start building.Now 2 weeks into the
project I get to the trailing edge soft rivets of the elevator.The only mention
in the plans is for AD470-A3-3 in trailing edge at pitch 40 and only mention
in the photo manual is "Note: The trailing edge will only be drilled to number
40 for AD470-A-3-3 soft rivets" No mention of any special tool to set them
or anything.No mention in Zenith's tool list either or I would have bought one
from them along with the other tools.Also, I see a few pages ahead that I will
need to stop work on the plane and build a "elevator horn cable holes positioning
template" out of .090 aluminum which I don't have and will have to go hunting
for where I can buy some aluminum around here. It's just kind of aggravating
to stop work on the plane and build tools or templates.Seems it would be
a good idea and could bring in a little more income for Zenith if they would offer
to sell all these things along with the other tools they sell.Seems that
would make it easier and faster to build the plane and would be "keeping it simple".
Nothing against Zenith. They are a great bunch of guys and have good product support
and a great product.
Larry Bohannon
701 #5040 just started
Winder, Georgia
Do not archive
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Keep It Simple Fred |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Larry:
The templates can be built from any scrap piece of tin metal, just thin
enough to cut with the aviation sesers (sp?) and not to bend by itself.
Even of 3mm plywood can be used, all the templates (even the curved box
to build the 701 slats) are very simple to build and are only a few.
There are other airplane projects that are really complicated to build
the "jigs" and templates... you are lucky to chose a Zenith to build,
dont desparate, you will love to build it.
Saludos
Gary Gower
701 912S
Guadalajara, Mexico.
PS. Working on the carboard templates for the front cabin sides (betwen
the cabin and the firewall) and the seats. We also built carboard
templates for the wing tips, saved the skins from trashing. Results
were on the "almost perfect" side.
--- Larry Bohannon <lbohannon1@mindspring.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry Bohannon"
> <lbohannon1@mindspring.com>
>
> ---- Chris has done so well to keep it simple----- I
> think some of you folks, are building without getting
> the plans etc from Zenair/ Zenith---- Chris explains
> so much of what some of you folks ask of this site to
> explain-- "fred" do no archive
>
> I just picked up my complete kit at the factory 2 weeks ago which
> included the latest plans and photo manual.I also bought from Zenith
> all the tools they recommend. Thought I was all set and ready to
> start building.Now 2 weeks into the project I get to the trailing
> edge soft rivets of the elevator.The only mention in the plans is for
> AD470-A3-3 in trailing edge at pitch 40 and only mention in the photo
> manual is "Note: The trailing edge will only be drilled to number 40
> for AD470-A-3-3 soft rivets" No mention of any special tool to set
> them or anything.No mention in Zenith's tool list either or I would
> have bought one from them along with the other tools.Also, I see a
> few pages ahead that I will need to stop work on the plane and build
> a "elevator horn cable holes positioning template" out of .090
> aluminum which I don't have and will have to go hunting for where I
> can buy some aluminum around here. It's just kind of aggravating to
> stop work on the plane and build tools or te!
> mplates.Seems it would be a good idea and could bring in a little
> more income for Zenith if they would offer to sell all these things
> along with the other tools they sell.Seems that would make it easier
> and faster to build the plane and would be "keeping it simple".
> Nothing against Zenith. They are a great bunch of guys and have good
> product support and a great product.
>
> Larry Bohannon
> 701 #5040 just started
> Winder, Georgia
>
> Do not archive
>
>
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