Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:36 AM - Re:miss manners strikes again (Kevin W Bonds)
2. 01:08 PM - "freds" last post (Fred Poor)
3. 02:33 PM - attn 701experts (Flydog1966@aol.com)
4. 02:38 PM - "freds" last post (Mark Townsend)
5. 03:31 PM - Fw: deja vu ( Marks letter as written-- mabe a better memory is in order) (Fred Poor)
6. 03:58 PM - Re: "freds" last post (Grant Corriveau)
7. 04:36 PM - Re: attn 701experts (Bill Steer)
8. 04:38 PM - Re: attn 701experts (Bill Steer)
9. 04:50 PM - Re: "freds" last post (Gayla Lemley)
10. 05:35 PM - Re: "freds" last post (Gary Gower)
11. 05:41 PM - Re: attn 701experts (Gary Gower)
12. 05:43 PM - Re: attn 701experts (Gary Gower)
13. 05:59 PM - Re: Re:miss manners strikes again (Dave Pepper)
14. 06:05 PM - Re: attn 701experts (Flydog1966@aol.com)
15. 06:35 PM - Re: Fw: deja vu ( Marks letter as written-- mabe a better memory (Scott Laughlin)
16. 09:08 PM - fly info (Duane Evans)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re:miss manners strikes again |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kevin W Bonds" <kbonds@worldshare.net>
>as I've
> said before, this list has done as much to hurt
> homebuilding as it has to help it-- "fred"
"fred"
Maybe I'm inviting trouble here but, I was puzzled by your disdain for the wonderful
community of builders on this list. Other than research, I have not yet
started my project and am taking the advice of some very helpful people on and
off this list to avoid getting started until I am truly ready--which will be
a lot sooner than had I not joined this list. I should have my plans next month.
I would not even be considering building this thing without the resources available
in this list (available for those who will listen that is).
Also I have been pleasantly surprised--present topic excluded--not to find a lot
of unconstructive name calling and playa' hatin'--yes I am twenty-something
for another five months anyway ;).
Hope this post is not unconstructive or viewed confrontational in tone by anyone.
Just thought it should be said.
Now I'll go listen to Talk radio and just apply some Left rudder ;)
Kevin
Message 2
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| Subject: | "freds" last post |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Fred Poor <fredspoor2002@yahoo.com>
this will be "freds" last post on this list----
I thought this list was to help bennefit the
advancement of homebuilt aircraft, especially
Zenith's. But just the same as before, as some of the
click get their airplanes flying, others on this list
act like they are the "godfathers" and it is their
list. The ones that are constantly breaking the
guidelines get upset when asked to go by the rules---
that is the da ja vu part of this list.
I do not normally forward letters
addressed to me off list--- I am making an exception
to this rule, SEE BELOW, because I feel it is
totally wrong to communicate "off list" with buddies,
to see if you can keep someone pissed off and to make
a game out of the whole situation...... I consider it
a very "small" person" to do this-- and if that is the
caliber of people controlling this list, I want
nothing to do with it. Like I said before, I
stayed on this list, looking for those "important"
post; which are far and few between.
In reply to Mark's
slams--- I built me first airplane from plans, no
computer, no friends that were building,-- no great
info on the amount of resources available-------- just
me, plans and ZAC. I did this in 18 months from start
to flying. My second airplane is well on its way-----
yes it is taking longer--- building the 601 XL from
plans, working my job approx 45 hrs a week, I
expected it to take longer. ( I found the wings to be
a lot more involved than the 701's.) yes, I
will admitt I have been on this computer to much and I
have come to the conclusion that there are more folks
on here: 1) trying to re-invent the wheel,
2) "planning fishing trips" when I thought we were
trying to build a nice flying machine.
To the good-to-honest builder out there I want to
wish my very best and good luck with your
projects!!!!! To the rest of you, please wear a
life jacket on fishing trips and please don't get hurt
in the bull ring.
These past few weeks, make me
wonder if I ever want to go the ZAC's open hanger day,
as so many bullfighters and fishermen will probable be
there--- I told Linda (at ZAC) that I would make it
out, once the XL is done------- but I think it will be
on day that isn't open hanger day. Happy building
and flying, "fred" do not
archive
YES and YES ! Best part is that it is you that looks
the fool to the
list. By the way how is your
plane coming. You have been on and off
this
list to have built a couple by
now! OR are you being hindered in the
amount of time it takes to
complete your project? I'm on my second now
and have been a part of this
list for about the same amount of time
that
you have.
As for my buddies that you wish
me to forward your message to. I will,
I
had a reply from one just before
yours asking how far I would have to
dangle the line before you
started to sound like a childish bully in a
school yard.( dam I didn't even
have to bait the line) Don't bother
looking for any more messages
from me directly to you. I have had my
fun
poking at you like a matador. I
wish no ill towards you, in fact you
remind me of a friend I used to
have. IT was rather a game to poke and
prod each other over the years
till his death. Better check your blood
pressure.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
Alma, Ontario
the above letter is Mark's reply to a letter where I
asked him if he was as ego testicle as he sounds or
just f---- arrogent? and to pass it on to his a---
buddies----
Hey Fred , do you just enjoy your aggression? The
group of us just love
to see your replies on the list.
Thanks for the entertainment.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
Alma, Ontario
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
Message 3
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Flydog1966@aol.com
Hi list
After riveting the rear fuselage, horz. tail frames ,and the gussets,
keeping things nice-n-square. I find its not perfectly square. No, the "baggage
back " is not in yet.
I can only force it to a certain point trying to get it perfect. If I
drop a plumb bob from the top skin center line , its off the bottom C.L. by
1/16"- 1/8". Measuring diagonally the difference is ~ 5m.m..
My question is: Is this close enough? (not building an airliner, right?)
Or will it come back to haunt me later when I
try to join it with the front fuselage, or wings, or....?
Zenith did'nt seem to worried, but I thought I would get a second
opinion.
Thanks
Phil
Message 4
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| Subject: | "freds" last post |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mark Townsend" <601xl@sympatico.ca>
To all lister's. I'm sad to see anyone gone from this list with bad
feelings. But if there going to be aggressive to the list and add to a
letter and say it was from me then go with gods peace Fred.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
Alma, Ontario
Do not archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | Fwd: deja vu ( Marks letter as written-- mabe a better |
memory is in order)
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Fred Poor <fredspoor2002@yahoo.com>
said I would not post again--- tied of this crap---
but no one is going to accuse me of adding to "their"
letter. Here is the proof-- you decide-- "fred"
do not archive
--- Mark Townsend <601xl@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> From: "Mark Townsend" <601xl@sympatico.ca>
> To: <fredspoor2002@yahoo.com>
> Subject: deja vu
> Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2003 20:28:38 -0400
>
> Hey Fred , do you just enjoy your aggression? The
> group of us just love
> to see your replies on the list. Thanks for the
> entertainment.
>
> Mark Townsend
> 601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
> Alma, Ontario
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> there are just as many f--king clowns on this list
> as
> before--- same actions only different names- as
> I've
> said before, this list has done as much to hurt
> homebuilding as it has to help it-- "fred" do not
> archive
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: "freds" last post |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Grant Corriveau <grantc@ca.inter.net>
FWIW -- I think "Fred" was on the list before as 'Fritz' or something, with
very similar results and outcome.
--
Grant Corriveau
C-GHTF / HDS / CAM100
> From: "Mark Townsend" <601xl@sympatico.ca>
> Reply-To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2003 17:37:35 -0400
> To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Zenith-List: "freds" last post
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mark Townsend" <601xl@sympatico.ca>
>
> To all lister's. I'm sad to see anyone gone from this list with bad
> feelings. But if there going to be aggressive to the list and add to a
> letter and say it was from me then go with gods peace Fred.
>
> Mark Townsend
> 601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
> Alma, Ontario
> Do not archive
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: attn 701experts |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Steer" <bsteer@gwi.net>
I had the same experience, and ended up rebuilding the aft fuselage. I noticed
it when I first fit the rudder to the fuselage and couldn't get it to be
vertical and still align with the hinges. I also noticed that the horizontal
stabilizer had to be shimmed more on one side than the other when it was
attached to the brackets. The rudder can be adjusted by moving the hinges
sideways slightly on the rudder spar, but there are limits to that movement.
Also, it would affect the rudder limit stops when you install them. 1/16"
doesn't sound like much to me, though.
Hope this helps a bit.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: <Flydog1966@aol.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: attn 701experts
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Flydog1966@aol.com
>
> Hi list
> After riveting the rear fuselage, horz. tail frames ,and the gussets,
> keeping things nice-n-square. I find its not perfectly square. No, the
"baggage
> back " is not in yet.
> I can only force it to a certain point trying to get it perfect. If I
> drop a plumb bob from the top skin center line , its off the bottom C.L. by
> 1/16"- 1/8". Measuring diagonally the difference is ~ 5m.m..
> My question is: Is this close enough? (not building an airliner, right?)
> Or will it come back to haunt me later when I
> try to join it with the front fuselage, or wings, or....?
> Zenith did'nt seem to worried, but I thought I would get a second
> opinion.
> Thanks
> Phil
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: attn 701experts |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Steer" <bsteer@gwi.net>
Oops, I just noticed that you're talking about a 701 here. My plane is a 601,
so my previous comments may not apply. Sorry for any confusion I caused.
Bill
Do not archive
> After riveting the rear fuselage, horz. tail frames ,and the gussets,
> keeping things nice-n-square. I find its not perfectly square. No, the
"baggage
> back " is not in yet.
> I can only force it to a certain point trying to get it perfect. If I
> drop a plumb bob from the top skin center line , its off the bottom C.L. by
> 1/16"- 1/8". Measuring diagonally the difference is ~ 5m.m..
> My question is: Is this close enough? (not building an airliner, right?)
> Or will it come back to haunt me later when I
> try to join it with the front fuselage, or wings, or....?
> Zenith did'nt seem to worried, but I thought I would get a second
> opinion.
> Thanks
> Phil
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: "freds" last post |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Gayla Lemley" <GaylaLemley@peoplepc.com>
> FWIW -- I think "Fred" was on the list before as 'Fritz' or
something, with
> very similar results and outcome.
> --
> Grant Corriveau
Actually I think it was "Joe Mock" as in "He is mocking you."
Below is the last parting letter from the archives. See any
similarities?
Unfortunately, this knucklehead will probably show up again.
Sam
do not archive
>I tried to send this out earlier today, but I had some
problems, so will try again. If it shows up
twice-SORRY!!----- After last nights mail, "Joe"
has decided to leave this site as there are so many
people out there who suffer from "CLINTONitis" (that
is- "the rules don't apply to me"). Matt Dralle has
gone through a lot of hard work and spends many hours
maintaining his site, only to have it abused, even
though he prints the rules about once a month. "Joe"
knows there are a lot of sincere builders out there
who are looking for some good constructive
information--to those, "Joe" wants to wish you the
best of luck and "happy building". Also "Joe realizes
that the few individuals who abuse this site have done
as much to hurt homebuilding as this site has to help
it out. Just check around and see how many people
have dropped off. I can't help but wonder if ZAC
would recommend this site on their 'zenithair' web
page if they monitored this site to see all that goes
on. I did try to leave the site a week ago, but I hit
the wrong key (I guess). I will leave the site no
later than 1 Feb 01. Again, to the sincere folks
out there, I wish you the best of luck!! Happy
Building- goodbye-- "Joe"
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: "freds" last post |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Poor Fred,
I dont know why he got so ungry... There are aviation list 100 times
more garbage, politics, bad words, fights, of listpostings and all.
In fact I am in 5 list and the too better ones are this one and the
Pietenpol (once they got the "fisherman" out).
I know is impossible to keep a list clean and perfect, but we can keep
our postings as Zenith as possible.
Enough said, lets have patience betwen us, we are like a big family
(with argues {sp?} and all).
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Do not archive.
--- Mark Townsend <601xl@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mark Townsend"
> <601xl@sympatico.ca>
>
> To all lister's. I'm sad to see anyone gone from this list with bad
> feelings. But if there going to be aggressive to the list and add to
> a
> letter and say it was from me then go with gods peace Fred.
>
> Mark Townsend
> 601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
> Alma, Ontario
> Do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: attn 701experts |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
The more critical part to align is the square where the rudder hindges
go, there is a limit so you can align the rudder vertical.
The front fuselage connection with the rear is a piece of cake, just
try to be as perfect as possible.
Saludos
Gary Gower
Do not archive.
--- Flydog1966@aol.com wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Flydog1966@aol.com
>
> Hi list
> After riveting the rear fuselage, horz. tail frames ,and the
> gussets,
> keeping things nice-n-square. I find its not perfectly square. No,
> the "baggage
> back " is not in yet.
> I can only force it to a certain point trying to get it perfect.
> If I
> drop a plumb bob from the top skin center line , its off the bottom
> C.L. by
> 1/16"- 1/8". Measuring diagonally the difference is ~ 5m.m..
> My question is: Is this close enough? (not building an
> airliner, right?)
> Or will it come back to haunt me later
> when I
> try to join it with the front fuselage, or wings, or....?
> Zenith did'nt seem to worried, but I thought I would get a
> second
> opinion.
> Thanks
> Phil
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: attn 701experts |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
"Same cat, diferent color", construction methods are similar.
Saludos
Gary Gower.
--- Bill Steer <bsteer@gwi.net> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Steer" <bsteer@gwi.net>
>
> Oops, I just noticed that you're talking about a 701 here. My plane
> is a 601,
> so my previous comments may not apply. Sorry for any confusion I
> caused.
>
> Bill
>
> Do not archive
>
> > After riveting the rear fuselage, horz. tail frames ,and the
> gussets,
> > keeping things nice-n-square. I find its not perfectly square. No,
> the
> "baggage
> > back " is not in yet.
> > I can only force it to a certain point trying to get it
> perfect. If I
> > drop a plumb bob from the top skin center line , its off the bottom
> C.L. by
> > 1/16"- 1/8". Measuring diagonally the difference is ~ 5m.m..
> > My question is: Is this close enough? (not building an
> airliner, right?)
> > Or will it come back to haunt me
> later when I
> > try to join it with the front fuselage, or wings, or....?
> > Zenith did'nt seem to worried, but I thought I would get a
> second
> > opinion.
> > Thanks
> > Phil
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://search.yahoo.com
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re:miss manners strikes again |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave Pepper" <rockinrimranch@earthlink.net>
Hey Fred,
This is a great list for building tips and sharing information. If you don't
like it, no one is forcing you to stay here. Maybe the Rush Limbaugh Show is
more your speed, and you could take out your frustrations with that right
wing loser.
Dave
>
> >as I've
> > said before, this list has done as much to hurt
> > homebuilding as it has to help it-- "fred"
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: attn 701experts |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Flydog1966@aol.com
In a message dated 8/13/03 7:37:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time, bsteer@gwi.net
writes:
<< After riveting the rear fuselage, horz. tail frames ,and the gussets,
> keeping things nice-n-square. I find its not perfectly square. >>
Thanks to all who replied.
Phil
do not archive
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Fwd: deja vu ( Marks letter as written-- mabe a better |
memory
is in order)
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Scott Laughlin" <cookwithgas@hotmail.com>
To all:
I just selected:
"Delete the selected message and block future messages from
fredspoor2002@yahoo.com."
Maybe this will take care of this foolishness.
Thanks for all of the serious, helpful people on this list.
Scott.
----Original Message Follows----
From: Fred Poor <fredspoor2002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Fwd: deja vu ( Marks letter as written-- mabe a
better memory is in order)
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Fred Poor <fredspoor2002@yahoo.com>
said I would not post again--- tied of this crap---
but no one is going to accuse me of adding to "their"
letter. Here is the proof-- you decide-- "fred"
do not archive
--- Mark Townsend <601xl@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> From: "Mark Townsend" <601xl@sympatico.ca>
> To: <fredspoor2002@yahoo.com>
> Subject: deja vu
> Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2003 20:28:38 -0400
>
> Hey Fred , do you just enjoy your aggression? The
> group of us just love
> to see your replies on the list. Thanks for the
> entertainment.
>
> Mark Townsend
> 601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
> Alma, Ontario
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> there are just as many f--king clowns on this list
> as
> before--- same actions only different names- as
> I've
> said before, this list has done as much to hurt
> homebuilding as it has to help it-- "fred" do not
> archive
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
Message 16
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Duane Evans" <duanee10@pacn.com>
I have been off the list for about a year. and have recently come back. I made
my first flight on october 3 2003 I have 601 HDS-TD with a PZL-Franklin 235 engine
the first flight was uneventful except oil temp exceeded upper limit. after
putting wheel pants on and fairing around the bungge box I get a top speed
of 142mph . cruse of speed of 123 mph . climb with density altitude 3500-4000
ft. 1000 -1200 fpm. I have a IVOPROP Magmun prop set for cruse. fuel burn
is about 6gph . I did not fly in the winter so now only have 85 . hrs. After puttng
a oil cooler in ,this has a really been trouble free airplane. I put XL
canope on it. and getting sealed I should be ready to fly this winter.
Duane Evans
601HDS-TD #3904 N6402X
Deer Park, WA
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