Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:19 AM - Aerovee2002 engine (Robilliard)
2. 05:43 AM - Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? (Scott Laughlin)
3. 06:18 AM - solder vs crimp (alex trent)
4. 06:44 AM - Re: New to the group (Tony Bonsell)
5. 07:13 AM - Re: Second guessing my Aluminum choice (Thanks) (Keith Ashcraft)
6. 07:42 AM - Re: New to the group (David Barth)
7. 07:45 AM - Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead... (Bima, Martin)
8. 08:44 AM - Re: solder vs crimp (Bill Cardell)
9. 08:56 AM - Crimp Joint vs Solder (charles.long@gm.com)
10. 08:58 AM - Re: Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead... (Scott Laughlin)
11. 09:09 AM - Re: Dry Soldering Joint (Leo J. Corbalis)
12. 09:32 AM - Re: solder vs crimp (caspainhower@aep.com)
13. 10:03 AM - Re: Crimp Joint vs Solder (caspainhower@aep.com)
14. 10:17 AM - Re: solder vs crimp (Bill Cardell)
15. 10:19 AM - Re: Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead... (Larry McFarland)
16. 11:23 AM - Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? (George Swinford)
17. 12:51 PM - Re:Rotax 912 prices (Johann)
18. 02:50 PM - Re: Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead... (Monty Graves)
19. 03:04 PM - Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? (Monty Graves)
20. 03:18 PM - Re: New 912 prices! (Frank Stutzman)
21. 04:02 PM - Re: Aerovee2002 engine (n282rs)
22. 04:19 PM - Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? (ZSMITH3rd@aol.com)
23. 04:42 PM - Short Pilot in a 601XL? (Lance Gingell)
24. 05:01 PM - Scared of the 8 ' brake... (Jarek M. Walter)
25. 05:06 PM - Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? (Roger Roy)
26. 05:33 PM - Re: Short Pilot in a 601XL? (n282rs)
27. 07:45 PM - dents and scratches (Pwalsh4539@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Aerovee2002 engine |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robilliard" <royrobilliard@iprimus.com.au>
I am building a zodiac CH601HD. Does any one have any input on the use of
the Aerovee 2002 engine as a powerplant?
Roy
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Scott Laughlin" <cookwithgas@hotmail.com>
Hi Joe:
I was asking the same question 9 months ago. I tried a hammered bend a long
part - the stabilizer spar. It came out looking like a banana. I took
some aluminum to a fab shop and paid for the same bend on a 10' brake and it
came out straight and perfect. I then spent three months building an 8'
brake from Larry McFarland's plans and now I don't have to visit the fab
shop any more.
It's a matter of choice. If you would rather stay home and do your bends
when you have the time, or if you would rather not bother with building or
buying an 8' brake and plan to visit a fab shop every time you need a long
bend. One caution - a properly built 8' brake is no easy project. If you
want to see what I went through, visit my bending brake page on my website
at:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/Brake.html
Good luck with whatever decision you make.
Scott Laughlin
601XL / Corvair
www.cooknwithgas.com
----Original Message Follows----
From: "Joe Kerr" <jkerr@pcweb.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Why is 8' bending brake needed?
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Joe Kerr" <jkerr@pcweb.net>
Hello list-
I see a number of scratch builders fabricating their own 8' bending brake.
Is there something about the longer aluminum parts that require these to be
formed with a bending brake rather than fabricating a long form block from
wood and just hammering the metal over? It seems to me that investing in a
4' brake for the 85% of parts that are 4' or less and fabricating long form
blocks to make things like wing spars could be a money or time saver
compared to building an entire 8 foot brake. Am I missing something?
-Joe
601 XL .01% complete
Set yourself up for fun at home! Get tips on home entertainment equipment,
video game reviews, and more here.
http://special.msn.com/home/homeent.armx
Message 3
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: alex trent <atrent7@cogeco.ca>
My expieience in the area of this subject is approx the same time
period, and I am mostly in agreement with this post.
My expierience is that crimped splices need to be supported or they will
fail by breaking. They are also bulky. One should try to avoid splicing
in general. However I do use crimped connectors and usually try to
avoid crimped splices.
alex t.
>
>Time: 09:38:51 PM PST US
>From: "Thomas F Marson" <tmarson@pressenter.com>
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dry Soldering Joint
>
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Thomas F Marson" <tmarson@pressenter.com>
>
>I have never bought into the (what I call a Myth) that a crimped connection
>is a more reliable connection.
>
>It seem easier to make a crimp with no training, I will give it that. Is it
>more reliable ?----highly questionable and is it less likely to break maybe-
>?---
>the screws that have to be tightened correctly and have to remain so in the
>face of vibration.
>
>
>Learning how to solder is not all that difficult and of course it is
>important to support wires mechanically so that vibration is not transmitted
>to the connection area------ this goes for both crimped or soldered
>connections.
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: New to the group |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Tony Bonsell <tbonsell@luxuria.com>
Hi Jarek, and welcome!
I am not scratch building my 701, but I've had a few, um, incidents with my
Lazair that required a few sheets. Try Dave Drain at Grassroots Aviation in
Oshawa. 905 434 4651.
Good luck!
> Do you have any suggestions about the best place to get 6061-T6? I've been
> to a couple of places, but they didn't have a stuff (telling me that it's
> not very popular - we know it - it's populat to us or wanted two or three
> times more what Spruce Aircraft is charging). I'm under the impression that
> living in Toronto should give me an ability to aviod shipping charges.
> I scanned the archives for this information, but it looks to me that most of
> it belong in archivas for sure.
> Would appreciate any suggestions.
> Regards to everyone, Jarek M. Walter
******************************************************
Tony Bonsell (tbonsell@luxuria.com) CI-FKF
Luxuria + Apparatus Design Communications
535 Cragg Road, RR #3
Uxbridge, Ontario L9P 1R3
Voice: 905.852.3848 Fax: 905.852.0652
http://www.luxuria.com
******************************************************
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Second guessing my Aluminum choice (Thanks) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Keith Ashcraft <keith.ashcraft@itt.com>
Thanks to all. I will just keep plugging away using 6061-T6 for my ribs,
(and most everything else)
Keith
CH701
engine -- unknown (but something Turbo'd)
my 170% just dropped back down to 150% left to go!!
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Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: New to the group |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: David Barth <davids601xl@yahoo.com>
Hey Jarek. I use Golden Triangle Specialty Metals in
Cambridge but if there is a better one in Toronto I
may go there. These guys have no idea how to handle
the .016 and it gets covered with smilies - not good.
They have good prices on the other sheets sizez
though.
David
--- "Jarek M. Walter" <jarek.walter@sympatico.ca>
wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jarek M. Walter"
> <jarek.walter@sympatico.ca>
>
> Hello everyone,
> I've been following the correspondence for number of
> weeks now while waiting
> for the plans for CH701 to arrive. Now I feel that
> having a serial number
> gives me a privilege to ask questions. Therefore
> theri is my first one
> addressed to those who are located in Ontario,
> Canada:
> Do you have any suggestions about the best place to
> get 6061-T6? I've been
> to a couple of places, but they didn't have a stuff
> (telling me that it's
> not very popular - we know it - it's populat to us
> or wanted two or three
> times more what Spruce Aircraft is charging). I'm
> under the impression that
> living in Toronto should give me an ability to aviod
> shipping charges.
> I scanned the archives for this information, but it
> looks to me that most of
> it belong in archivas for sure.
> Would appreciate any suggestions.
> Regards to everyone, Jarek M. Walter
>
>
>
> Click on the
> this
> generous
> _->
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
=====
David Barth
601 XL Plansbuilder
Still making parts. Nose Ribs Done and about half the rear ribs for the wings.
Stab and elevator waiting for skins. Flaps, ailerons and Rudder ready for inspection.
__________________________________
Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now
http://companion.yahoo.com/
Message 7
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| Subject: | Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bima, Martin" <mbima@hydro.mb.ca>
Can you (the collective you) tell me how you made the rolled bead near the
edges of the formed fuel tanks?
Thanks,
Martin Bima
STOL-Vair
Rudder complete
Engine torn down
Wife bribed with favorite perfume
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
<META NAME"Generator" CONTENT"MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2651.75">
Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead...
Can you (the collective you) tell me how you made the rolled bead near the edges
of the formed fuel tanks?
Thanks,
Martin Bima
STOL-Vair
Rudder complete
Engine torn down
Wife bribed with favorite perfume
Message 8
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Bill Cardell <bill@flyinmiata.com>
Are you guys using the latest connectors? The ones I use on projects are
heat shrinkable and have goo inside that makes them weathertight when
shrunken. Gives a nice strain relief, too.
Bill Cardell (TurboDog's Dad)
bill@flyinmiata.com
Flyin' Miata
1-800-359-6957 (sales only)
970-242-3800 (tech support)
http://flyinmiata.com
http://flyinprotege.com
-----Original Message-----
From: alex trent [mailto:atrent7@cogeco.ca]
Subject: Zenith-List: solder vs crimp
--> Zenith-List message posted by: alex trent <atrent7@cogeco.ca>
My expieience in the area of this subject is approx the same time
period, and I am mostly in agreement with this post.
My expierience is that crimped splices need to be supported or they will
fail by breaking. They are also bulky. One should try to avoid splicing
in general. However I do use crimped connectors and usually try to
avoid crimped splices.
alex t.
>
>Time: 09:38:51 PM PST US
>From: "Thomas F Marson" <tmarson@pressenter.com>
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dry Soldering Joint
>
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Thomas F Marson"
<tmarson@pressenter.com>
>
>I have never bought into the (what I call a Myth) that a crimped connection
>is a more reliable connection.
>
>It seem easier to make a crimp with no training, I will give it that. Is it
>more reliable ?----highly questionable and is it less likely to break
maybe-
>?---
>the screws that have to be tightened correctly and have to remain so in the
>face of vibration.
>
>
>Learning how to solder is not all that difficult and of course it is
>important to support wires mechanically so that vibration is not
transmitted
>to the connection area------ this goes for both crimped or soldered
>connections.
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Crimp Joint vs Solder |
11/20/2003 11:55:46 AM
--> Zenith-List message posted by: charles.long@gm.com
Electric Bob is big on crimps over solder. I checked with our
electonics techs at work to get a second opinion. We do Automatic
transmissions for commercial vehicles. Trans life is expected to be 10 -
20 years under all sorts of enviromental conditions (thermo shocks,
vibrations, etc.). We have to provide very good reliablity on all onboard
computer stuff. Our techs say that crimps are the way to go, and use a
good quality crimp tool designed for the terminals in use. They commented
that solder joints will fail in fatique due to vibration. If you are going
to use solder, you must strain relief the wires to minimize the
suseptibility to vibration. This is consistent with what Electric Bob
says. I'm using his crimp tools by the way, and they work great for a
reasonable price. In particular, I like the Faston terminals. Pretty much
fool proof to crimp, fast to install and provide great reliability. Many
switches available for these and Bob's got an automotive style fuse block
that uses them as well.
I can see where Missile systems have good success with solder joints
because the operational life is short. They may sit inactive for years,
but I assume in a static condition where vibration is not an issue.
Chuck Long, PE/CFI
Zenith N601LE, 85% complete
Time: 09:38:51 PM PST US
From: "Thomas F Marson" <tmarson@pressenter.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dry Soldering Joint
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Thomas F Marson"
<tmarson@pressenter.com>
I have never bought into the (what I call a Myth) that a crimped connection
is a more reliable connection.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Scott Laughlin" <cookwithgas@hotmail.com>
Martin:
I bought one of these on sale for $99:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=34104
I will try it out next week and let you know how it works.
Scott Laughlin
www.cooknwithgas.com
----Original Message Follows----
From: "Bima, Martin" <mbima@hydro.mb.ca>
Subject: Zenith-List: Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead...
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bima, Martin" <mbima@hydro.mb.ca>
Can you (the collective you) tell me how you made the rolled bead near the
edges of the formed fuel tanks?
Thanks,
Martin Bima
STOL-Vair
Rudder complete
Engine torn down
Wife bribed with favorite perfume
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
<META NAME"Generator" CONTENT"MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2651.75">
Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead...
Can you (the collective you) tell me how you made the rolled bead near the
edges of the formed fuel tanks?
Thanks,
Martin Bima
STOL-Vair
Rudder complete
Engine torn down
Wife bribed with favorite perfume
Need a shot of Hank Williams or Patsy Cline? The classic country stars are
always singing on MSN Radio Plus. Try one month free!
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Dry Soldering Joint |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Leo J. Corbalis" <leocorbalis@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Dry Soldering Joint
The worm in the apple is that the solder wicks up the strands away from the
joint forming a piece of single strand solid wire, which will crack if given
a chance. Cut away the insulation from a joint and examine it with a
magnifying glass while you flex it. NASA developed a procedure which works
if the solder tab is long enough, solder the wire in the wrong way, bend it
180 degrees, one bend is OK, then use shrink tubing to cover the joint and
bend. All the bending is now done by the stranded wire. If you are paranoid,
maybe the solder tab will crack!
Leo Corbalis
leocorbalis@sbcglobal.net
Message 12
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11/20/2003 12:31:50 PM
--> Zenith-List message posted by: caspainhower@aep.com
>Are you guys using the latest connectors? The ones I use on projects are
heat shrinkable and have goo inside that makes them weathertight when
shrunken. Gives a nice strain relief, too.
Bill,
For critical splices I am used to using non-insulated butt splices
with heat shrink. Where do you get the connectors you referred to that use
heat shrink insulation? Does that include terminal connectors? They sound
ideal.
Craig S.
601 XL
This e-mail message and all attachments transmitted with it from the
Nuclear Generation Group of American Electric Power are for the sole
use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and
privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or
distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please
contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original
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Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Crimp Joint vs Solder |
11/20/2003 01:02:32 PM
--> Zenith-List message posted by: caspainhower@aep.com
> Electric Bob is big on crimps over solder. If you are going
to use solder, you must strain relief the wires to minimize the
suseptibility to vibration. This is consistent with what Electric Bob
says.
>I have never bought into the (what I call a Myth) that a crimped
connection
is a more reliable connection.
Bottom line is, it's a lot easier to screw up a solder joint than a crimp
using a good crimping tool. A properly soldered joint covered with heat
shrink or similar product is as reliable as a crimp. Dependability is
strictly a funtion of the quality of the work.
Do not archive
This e-mail message and all attachments transmitted with it from the
Nuclear Generation Group of American Electric Power are for the sole
use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and
privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or
distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please
contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original
message.
Message 14
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Bill Cardell <bill@flyinmiata.com>
Del City has them. www.delcity.net They have all kinds, butt, terminals,
etc.
Bill Cardell (TurboDog's Dad)
bill@flyinmiata.com
Flyin' Miata
1-800-359-6957 (sales only)
970-242-3800 (tech support)
http://flyinmiata.com
http://flyinprotege.com
-----Original Message-----
From: caspainhower@aep.com [mailto:caspainhower@aep.com]
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: solder vs crimp
--> Zenith-List message posted by: caspainhower@aep.com
>Are you guys using the latest connectors? The ones I use on projects are
heat shrinkable and have goo inside that makes them weathertight when
shrunken. Gives a nice strain relief, too.
Bill,
For critical splices I am used to using non-insulated butt splices
with heat shrink. Where do you get the connectors you referred to that use
heat shrink insulation? Does that include terminal connectors? They sound
ideal.
Craig S.
601 XL
This e-mail message and all attachments transmitted with it from the
Nuclear Generation Group of American Electric Power are for the sole
use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and
privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or
distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please
contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original
message.
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" <larrymc@qconline.com>
>
> Can you (the collective you) tell me how you made the rolled bead near the
> edges of the formed fuel tanks?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Martin Bima
Martin,
Assuming you're speaking of welding, the TIG process normally can be used
to bead the edges when a tank is assembled like an oil drum. It's quicker,
but
not as strong as one with the ends turned inward and a bead laid on a lap
weld.
Bengilis's book recommends this alternative, because edge welds are the most
likely to give way and push out in a fuel surge. Also leaks are easier to
control
and repair with the lap weld.
Larry McFarland - 601hds @ www.macsmachine.com
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "George Swinford" <grs-pms@comcast.net>
Joe:
I have hammered some angles about 3 feet long over a form block. They seem
to end up with a slight curvature. I would find a brake or make one for the
8 foot spar parts. Or just buy the parts you can't bend from Zenith.
George
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Kerr" <jkerr@pcweb.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Why is 8' bending brake needed?
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Joe Kerr" <jkerr@pcweb.net>
>
> Hello list-
> I see a number of scratch builders fabricating their own 8' bending brake.
Is there something about the longer aluminum parts that require these to be
formed with a bending brake rather than fabricating a long form block from
wood and just hammering the metal over? It seems to me that investing in a
4' brake for the 85% of parts that are 4' or less and fabricating long form
blocks to make things like wing spars could be a money or time saver
compared to building an entire 8 foot brake. Am I missing something?
> -Joe
> 601 XL .01% complete
>
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re:Rotax 912 prices |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Johann" <johann@gi.is>
Hello list members.
I do agree that the price for a Rotax 912 is high in the USA.
If you would like to know what I have to couch up for a Rotax 912 UL up
here
in Iceland with our high salestaxes, the price is $13.500 with shipping
and
24,5% sales tax. I guess you are not doing so bad after all in your neck
of
the woods?
Just my humble input. I enjoy the list info and opinions.
Best regards,
Johann G.
Iceland.
http://www.gi.is/fis
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank scratch building - rolled bead... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Monty Graves <mgraves@usmo.com>
At 09:45 AM 11/20/03 -0600, you wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bima, Martin" <mbima@hydro.mb.ca>
>
>Can you (the collective you) tell me how you made the rolled bead near the
>edges of the formed fuel tanks?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Martin Bima
>STOL-Vair
>Rudder complete
>Engine torn down
>Wife bribed with favorite perfume
>
I wondered how I was going to do that too when I built my 701 wing tanks.
Thankfully B.J. Schwaller already had some dies made. And I borrowed his.
He made 2, one 2 x 2.75 inches long, and the other2 x 6 inches. (2 pieces
each like a form block) They are a couple of pieces of hard wood block
with a 5/32 steel rod running the long length of the block. I believe he
said the rod was a welding rod. The blocks are made putting them in a
vice, and drilling down the sandwich crack with a 5/32 bit. Or what ever
size rod size you want the bead to be. Then the steel rod is glued to
piece of block making the male half. The other is left open and makes the
female half. Bolts or aligning pins are drilled at the correct distance
you want the edge of the alum beaded. They serve 2 purposes. First to make
sure the blocks align to form the bead, and as an edge guide so that as you
move it along you always have the bead the same distance to the edge.
When the bolts are tighented or just put it in a vice and tighten the bead
is formed. Make a small bead section, the slide the blocks and clamp
again, along all the edges.
Clear as mud correct?
Basically you are making another set of small form blocks with a piece of
steel rod "half way" in laid in one side of one form block. When placing
the alum fuel sheet between the form blocks and squezzed, the steel rod
presses the bead into the mating block.
Its simple to make, and accurately makes the bead Zenith shows in the 701
tank plans. Small block is used for the ends and the larger block is slid
along 6 inchs at a time.
If you need a picture, I probably can take one.
Monty
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Monty Graves <mgraves@usmo.com>
Larry Mc makes a great set of plans for his design of an 8 ft brake.
But on the 701 the longest piece is only about 6.5 ft. Better check that
for yourself. Not sure on the 601 I THINK Those pieces are the longerons,
which can be made from extrusions ( heavier but is required for the tail
wheel option or farmed out at a machine shop that has a press brake) BIG
radius on those longerons and I believe the Elevator spars and flapperon
spars. Which can be purchased. Or get someone that has made Larry Mc's
brake to make them for you. Larry Mc, may even be .......:-)
I think All the other pieces can be made on a 4 ft brake. Zenith offers
plans for their 4 ft brake, But there are free plans all over the internet
for 4 ft brakes that are just as good. HF and Grizzly has them too.
I made a 6 1/2 ft brake based on a Sonex builders design, but I have since
found out it won't bend the longerons to my satisfaction, so it hardly
seems worth wile to recommend it any longer, for a couple three pieces
when the 4 footer works...
Monty
>
>Joe:
>I have hammered some angles about 3 feet long over a form block. They seem
>to end up with a slight curvature. I would find a brake or make one for the
>8 foot spar parts. Or just buy the parts you can't bend from Zenith.
>George
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Joe Kerr" <jkerr@pcweb.net>
>To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Zenith-List: Why is 8' bending brake needed?
>
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Joe Kerr" <jkerr@pcweb.net>
>>
>> Hello list-
>> I see a number of scratch builders fabricating their own 8' bending brake.
>Is there something about the longer aluminum parts that require these to be
>formed with a bending brake rather than fabricating a long form block from
>wood and just hammering the metal over? It seems to me that investing in a
>4' brake for the 85% of parts that are 4' or less and fabricating long form
>blocks to make things like wing spars could be a money or time saver
>compared to building an entire 8 foot brake. Am I missing something?
>> -Joe
>> 601 XL .01% complete
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: New 912 prices! |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Frank Stutzman <stutzman@stutzman.com>
On Mon, 17 Nov 2003, Dave Pepper wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave Pepper" <rockinrimranch@earthlink.net>
> And we all know the military
> overpays for everything because the taxpayer gets to foot the bill for every
> little toy the military wants, so this is gold mine for Bombardier. The 912
> is the smaller brother of the 914, so why not keep homebuilt market wrapped
> up along with the military.
Maybe because Bombardier doesn't get sued when the military crashes a
drone? It wouldn't take too many multi million dollar suits wipe out any
profit they might make in the homebuilt market.
> > Bought a new engine from Lycoming or Continental lately? An O-200 new
> > from Continental is $19K. Kinda makes Rotax look like a piker.
>
> True, but Continental is a real aircraft engine, whereas Rotax is a
> snowmobile engine maker.
Uhh, tell that to the owners of Katana's and other FAA certified aircaft.
Frank Stutzman
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Aerovee2002 engine |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "n282rs" <n282rs@sbcglobal.net>
FW: Zenith-List: Aerovee2002 engineRoy
Since I'm probably the only one on this list flying a HD with a VW conversion,
so I probably should answer this. The Aerovee is pretty much the same as a GPAS
2180. I think the Aerovee is a type 3 case, where the GPAS
2180 is a type 1 case. I'm not real sure what the differences in the case are,
but other than some pretty billet aluminum parts, they are the same engine.
I have a GPAS 2180 with a redrive on my HD. The redrive is made by Valley Engineering.
I don't believe it will bolt on to a type 3 case so you wouldn't be able
to use it on a Aerovee. With the redrive, I can get off the ground in around
500 ft and clear a 50ft obstacle by the time I'm 1500 ft down the runway. So
far my max level speed has been 105 mph. My problem is in keeping the heads cool.
If I take the pitch out of the prop, I can keep reasonable CHT's. The down
side is that I can only fly about 90 mph like that. I have pretty much convinced
myself that the VW is too small for a HD. If the HD were more aerodynamic,
it would probably work fine.
Randy Stout
VW powered (looking for a new engine) CH 601 HD
n282rs@sbcglobal.net
http://www.geocities.com/r5t0ut21/index.html
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robilliard"
<royrobilliard@iprimus.com.au>
>
> I am building a zodiac CH601HD. Does any one have any input on the use of
> the Aerovee 2002 engine as a powerplant?
>
> Roy
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: ZSMITH3rd@aol.com
There are several reasons why you need an 8-foot brake:
1. Lots of people who already have one need somebody to buy theirs.
2. Bragging rights. How many in your circle have one?
3. It is easier to screw up more metal faster with a brake.
4. It's TWICE as long as a 4-footer.
5. That long handle with the counterweight always hangs out in the way.
6. There is nowhere in a shop to store one. Get a FOR SALE sign now.
7. You are not fully initiated onto this list until you build something
upsidedown,
backwards, warped, one too many, or admit that you have an 8-foot brake.
Welcome to sheetmetal hell, all of us will do our best to confuse you.
Oh, the 400 hours mentioned in the ZAC literature for building a kit only
refers to the 400 hours spent on this list. That's certainly encouraging.
Zed Smith/701/R912/90%
And, as always, include DO NOT ARCHIVE in your rebuttals.
Message 23
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| Subject: | Short Pilot in a 601XL? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Lance Gingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
I'm thinking of building a 601 XL. I'm a tad short at 5' 2" (5'3" after
a long sleep ;-). Will I fit!?
Are there any short pilots out there that have tried this?
I guess I can 'make things fit' - that being the beauty of a homebuilt,
but I don't want to end up with something that a tall person couldn't
fly.
Any thoughts?
Thanks
..lance
Message 24
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| Subject: | Scared of the 8 ' brake... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jarek M. Walter" <jarek.walter@sympatico.ca>
following all the latest messages flying on the board and looking for other
solution. It seems to me that only rear fuselege longerons (CH701) need a
long brake to form a corner. Do you guys think that's ok to use extruded
6061 corner (maybe a little bit thicker) insead of the specified formed 1/8"
radius one? With this approach it would be possible to have only one piece
longeron instead of two reveted parts (as on 7-F-7). Please, comment.
Jarek
(CH701 - getting close to ordering aluminium to build from plans)
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Why is 8' bending brake needed? |
Seal-Send-Time: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 20:06:00 -0500
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Roger Roy" <Savannah174@msn.com>
Please allow me to chime in, for those builders who just might be fortunate enough
to be located near a Technical High School who has a sheet metal shop will
probably have all the equipment you might need, in fact if approached properly
you might just be in luck and the Instructor/Student will make the parts to
your plans spec, you supply the materials, that goes for welding as well
Roger J. Roy
----- Original Message -----
From: George Swinford
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Why is 8' bending brake needed?
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "George Swinford" <grs-pms@comcast.net>
Joe:
I have hammered some angles about 3 feet long over a form block. They seem
to end up with a slight curvature. I would find a brake or make one for the
8 foot spar parts. Or just buy the parts you can't bend from Zenith.
George
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Kerr" <jkerr@pcweb.net>
To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Why is 8' bending brake needed?
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Joe Kerr" <jkerr@pcweb.net>
>
> Hello list-
> I see a number of scratch builders fabricating their own 8' bending brake.
Is there something about the longer aluminum parts that require these to be
formed with a bending brake rather than fabricating a long form block from
wood and just hammering the metal over? It seems to me that investing in a
4' brake for the 85% of parts that are 4' or less and fabricating long form
blocks to make things like wing spars could be a money or time saver
compared to building an entire 8 foot brake. Am I missing something?
> -Joe
> 601 XL .01% complete
>
>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Short Pilot in a 601XL? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "n282rs" <n282rs@sbcglobal.net>
Lance
My wife is 5' and she fit's ok in my HD. You decide how high to make the
seat pan and you could put in extra cushions. That would make those hard
landings a bit more comfortable :o) The only real modification you should
have to do is to move the pedals closer to the seat. If you decide to build
the kit, I would ask ZAC if they could make the nose wheel pushrods a bit
longer for your kit.
Randy Stout
VW powered CH 601 HD
n282rs@sbcglobal.net
http://www.geocities.com/r5t0ut21/index.html
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lance Gingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Short Pilot in a 601XL?
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Lance Gingell"
<lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
>
> I'm thinking of building a 601 XL. I'm a tad short at 5' 2" (5'3" after
> a long sleep ;-). Will I fit!?
Message 27
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| Subject: | dents and scratches |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Pwalsh4539@aol.com
Darn!!!!...I was moving my 601 HD back to the airport by trailer and was
VERY careful...(so I thought). Somehow, I managed to scratch and dent the top
of the right wing between the ribs just outside of the wing locker area. The
dents are long scrapes...perhaps 1/8 inch wide and zig-zagging back and forth
about 2 feet long, somewhat deeper at the corners. There is little damage, if
any to the paint, but I am a little concerned about structural fatigue in this
area as well as cosmetic....it really looks bad. Anyone have any ideas on how
to repair such damage, at least from an appearance standpoint? (the structural
part should not be difficult).
On a little more positive note, for those who are interested, I took bi
biennial flight review last week in a Cessna 172...I have not been flying much
for
the last few months...and that 172 felt like a freight train.(yes, I was a
little rusty)...not knocking it at all, but boy, when I got mine to the airport
and got the wings on, etc....I took her up for a short hop (gross
weight)....and it just LEPT off the runway....such great feel...and SO easy to
fly...just
a great little airplane! Where did that "rustyness" go???!! I was
considering selling it, but I think I will keep it after all. I have been busy
with a
lot of other things as of late and have kind of been out of flying "mode"...but
I just re-sold myself on it earlier today!
The point??...you people out there building a 601 (and 701 also, as far as
I have heard)...keep it up...they are great little airplanes.
Patrick Walsh
601 HD...back at the "big" airport
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