Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:36 AM - Re: Taiwan (Richard McLachlan)
2. 08:43 AM - Re: First Timer Question (David Tellet)
3. 09:28 AM - 701 Oil Cooler Mounting? (ZSMITH3rd@aol.com)
4. 09:54 AM - control stick grip (Ron DeWees)
5. 09:57 AM - 601XL Builders (Mark Townsend)
6. 10:00 AM - Re: Height? (Tim & Diane Shankland)
7. 10:05 AM - Re: control stick grip (Mark Townsend)
8. 10:12 AM - Re: control stick grip (Larry McFarland)
9. 10:13 AM - Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? (LARRY BOHANNON)
10. 10:19 AM - Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? (ZSMITH3rd@aol.com)
11. 10:41 AM - Re: control stick grip (Mark Townsend)
12. 11:52 AM - Re: 701 Oil Cooler Mounting? (Ken Szewc)
13. 02:41 PM - First Timer Question (William Herren)
14. 03:01 PM - Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? (Larry McFarland)
15. 04:52 PM - Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? (Robert Hillebrand)
16. 05:15 PM - Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? (Robert Hillebrand)
17. 06:03 PM - Re: control stick grip (Rick Pitcher)
18. 06:07 PM - Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? (Bill Howerton)
19. 06:31 PM - Re: 601XL Builders (wizard-24@juno.com)
20. 06:34 PM - Zodaic For Sale (PK)
21. 07:12 PM - test (Gary Gower)
22. 07:43 PM - Re: First Timer Question (B K Johnson)
23. 11:40 PM - Re: 701 80 or 100 HP? (Dabusmith@aol.com)
Message 1
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Richard McLachlan" <richard@rodsley.net>
I have a feeling that private flying is strictly off limits. I go there
occasionally, and when I asked my contact there he told me it does not
exist.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Thilo Kind" <thilo.kind@gmx.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Taiwan
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Thilo Kind" <thilo.kind@gmx.net>
>
> Hi folks,
>
> a little bit off-topic, but anybody knows anything about the flying and /
or
> homebuilds in Taiwan? Might have to moved there for a few years...
>
> Thanks
>
> Thilo Kind
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: First Timer Question |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: David Tellet <telletdl@erols.com>
Jack's post covered most of the stuff - especially clecos. My 2 cents:
spend a lot of time on a flat and level table (saves loads of time in
the future if you know your table is okay); get a bench band saw with
metal blade - mine was pretty cheap (less than $100) and it really
saves time when making or finishing attachments etc; also I find one
of those little bench sanders helpful - one with a small vertical belt
and a side disk - makes finishing small parts easy.
Good luck,
David Tellet, 601HD, ~50% done
Message 3
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| Subject: | 701 Oil Cooler Mounting? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: ZSMITH3rd@aol.com
The OIL COOLER attaches to the Oil Cooler Bracket (79-CB in my kit) using M22
Nuts (Rotax Pt. No. 156-088).
There are photographs by ZAC showing two different methods. In one case
there are only two nuts used. In the other case FOUR nuts are used, two above
&
two below the bracket.
Which is considered correct??
My view is that four would be proper in order to NOT put tension on the
coils. However, there does not appear to be quite enough thread length for the
four.
I only have two, I can get two more, they sell for about $9.00 each (that's a
bit steep).
So what's the opinion of the list?
68 degrees and bright sun in North Texas. (Deer grazing on runway)
Zed Smith/701/912/90%/do not archive
Message 4
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| Subject: | control stick grip |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Ron DeWees" <rdewees@mindspring.com>
HI Listers,
I'm a bit away from installing a grip for my control stick but have to look ahead
a bit at this point. I need a control grip with at least 4 way switch for
the Mac servos and a PTT switch for radio. I inherited Mac grips with the top
mounted PTT switch on top but no trim switches. I looked at the CH handle and
like it but it looks like you have to saw off most of the stick and mount the
threaded end of the CH into a custom adapter. Don't want to do that as it
locks you into this stick forever. Anyone have any ideas or reflections on selecting
a grip with trim switches on it? Our 1 1/8 inch sticks on the Zenair 601
seems to rule out some products. Ideas appreciated !
Ron DeWees
601 HDS/TD -Jab 3300 in progress
Message 5
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mark Townsend" <601xl@sympatico.ca>
XL Builders, how did you run all of your wires from the battery/elevator
trim/rudder light up to the control panel? I didn't want to run the
wires along the side of the fuselage by the passenger seat and I don't
dare cut a hole in the center section of the spar.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
Alma, Ontario
Message 6
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank@megsinet.net>
Joe,
I'm 6'3" and with my headset on there is still several inches of
clearance. If you build make sure to put the seat pan at the bottom, you
can always raise the height with cushions.
Tim Shankland
Joe Hutcheson wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Joe Hutcheson" <jchutcheson@comcast.net>
>
>I am starting the process of looking for kit possibilities. Apologies if I
>missed this from obvious sources, but what is the space from seat to canopy
>top? I am fairly tall (6 ft 1 in) and am somewhat longer in torso than most
>others my height. For example, I found it was really tight when I "tried
>on" a Sonex (very nice plane, nonetheless) and I have trouble fitting in
>some mid size cars with sun roofs. Anybody have this figure handy?
>
>Thanks.
>
>Joe Hutcheson
>Needham, MA
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | control stick grip |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mark Townsend" <601xl@sympatico.ca>
HI Ron
You have the G101 Stick Grip from the Ray Allen company. I would suggest
using it for the passenger side and drop a G205 on the pilot side. But
if I were to do it again I would have bought the G207 for the pilot
side. The extra 2 switches for avionics control would eliminate the
cross arm reach to get to the radio just to flop from one channel to
another.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
Alma, Ontario
-----Original Message-----
HI Listers,
I'm a bit away from installing a grip for my control stick but have to
look ahead a bit at this point. I need a control grip with at least 4
way switch for the Mac servos and a PTT switch for radio. I inherited
Mac grips with the top mounted PTT switch on top but no trim switches.
I looked at the CH handle and like it but it looks like you have to saw
off most of the stick and mount the threaded end of the CH into a custom
adapter. Don't want to do that as it locks you into this stick forever.
Anyone have any ideas or reflections on selecting a grip with trim
switches on it? Our 1 1/8 inch sticks on the Zenair 601 seems to rule
out some products. Ideas appreciated !
Ron DeWees
601 HDS/TD -Jab 3300 in progress
==
==
==
==
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: control stick grip |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" <larrymc@qconline.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: control stick grip
> HI Listers,
> I'm a bit away from installing a grip for my control stick but have to
look ahead a bit at this point. I inherited Mac grips with the top
mounted PTT switch on top but no trim switches. > Ron DeWees
> 601 HDS/TD -Jab 3300 in progress
>
Ron,
I too used the Mac grips and have wired them for PTT, but placed two trim
rocker switches with
indicators on the panel, just above the throttle. I've read that some found
the trim switches located on
the grips a bit troublesome in rough air and also with conversation with the
tower. I'd just recommend
putting the trim switches away from the stick where the other hand can do
the occasional trim and
have only the PTT on the grips.
Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
Message 9
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| Subject: | Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? |
Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 13:12:58 -0500
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "LARRY BOHANNON" <lbohannon1@msn.com>
Hi List,
With all this talk about engines and a recent article in Experimenter magazine
I've started rethinking whether or not to use the 100 hp 912 or the 80 hp
912 in my 701. In the Experimenter article the author stated that he thought
the 100 hp was too much for the plane and recommended the 80 hp. unless you were
going to fly on floats or high altitude areas. Even before this article, I
read on the ZAC web site that they also recommended the 80 with the same exceptions
given. Then, a few days ago, I read the article on flying the 701 by the
Australian guy that someone posted a link to on this board. I think he was flying
the 701 with an 80 and he even thought that was too much and he was guessing
that a rotax 612 ?? would be about right. I don't know what the Hp on a 612
is but it must be less than 80. I want to go with a 912 but now I can't decide
between the 80 or 100hp. I had just figured for an extra $1500 that I would
go with the 100hp but now I don't know. My background is in hang gliders during
the 1970's and ultralights in the early 1980's so if it were possible I would
really like to forget about hassling with an engine at all I want to go
low and very slow and I'm not concerned with a fast speed so it would seem the
80 hp would be right for me, but we get awfully hot and humid days here in Georgia
and with a starting MSL of 1000 ft. those hot days would really increase
the density altitude and also I'm installing a BRS chute so I might weigh in
a little heavy, so.... then I think I should go with the 100Hp!! So, what does
everybody think? What are your opinions and reasons for either choice?
Regards,
Larry Bohannon
701 SP
tail , wings ,flaps,rear and fwd. fuse done
now mounting fwd fuse to rear fuse and installing BRS chute
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: ZSMITH3rd@aol.com
Larry,
Somewhere I read of a 701 with a 2-cycle of something on the order of 40 hp.
The 40 may not be accurate....it may have been 46 or 52 or thereabouts, but
it was far less that 80. It seems to me that the first 701's used the Rotax
582 (?) and got around quite well.
At any rate, 80 is plenty.
Zed Smith
do not archive
Message 11
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| Subject: | RE: control stick grip |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mark Townsend" <601xl@sympatico.ca>
I too used the Mac grips and have wired them for PTT, but placed two
trim
rocker switches with
indicators on the panel, just above the throttle.
A set of switches on the panel is not a bad idea. But with flap control
and throttle I would prefer to keep my left arm as free as possible to
perform all other functions. Switches on the panel is just another duty
for your whole arm to perform as opposed to a thumb movement on the
right hand.
I've read that some found
the trim switches located on
the grips a bit troublesome in rough air and also with conversation with
the
tower.
This can be true if one tends to fly with there thumb on top of the
stick. And accidentally trip the trim switches. The old style of PPT
switch didn't have gold contacts and was prone to bad connections but I
was told that, that was taken care of many years ago.
I'd just recommend
putting the trim switches away from the stick where the other hand can
do
the occasional trim and
have only the PTT on the grips.
Both ways will work equally well, personal preference is the deciding
factor. I prefer the convince and simplicity of the grip mounted
controls, Larry prefers the panel mount. My suggestion is to sit in your
seat make propeller noises and see which hand is more comfortable to
move for the desired task. One note while your in your seat ! Plant your
back firmly against your backrest as if you have the shoulder harness
done up real tight and make sure that your left hand can reach ALL
controls on the panel/fuel selector/shutoff as well as the placement of
your fire extinguisher. This may not be as important in the U.S. but if
your building a homebuilt in Canada it will be part of your final
inspection! IF you can't reach and operate all controls to your plane
without releasing the stick then you can't fly either.
No intention to criticize your preference Larry, I just wanted to offer
more options.
Mark Townsend
601XL EJ-2.2L
Alma, Ontario
Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Oil Cooler Mounting? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Ken Szewc <szewc@direcway.com>
Zed,
I used four nuts on the oil cooler for the same reason that you have
surmized (coil stress). There is enough room for them. I only received two
with my kit also. I emailed ZAC and pointed out that the assembly manual
showed four nuts and that I was concerned about the correct assembly and
they sent me two more.
Ken Szewc
701SP 912S nearly done
----- Original Message -----
From: <ZSMITH3rd@aol.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: 701 Oil Cooler Mounting?
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: ZSMITH3rd@aol.com
>
> The OIL COOLER attaches to the Oil Cooler Bracket (79-CB in my kit) using
M22
> Nuts (Rotax Pt. No. 156-088).
> There are photographs by ZAC showing two different methods. In one case
> there are only two nuts used. In the other case FOUR nuts are used, two
above &
> two below the bracket.
> Which is considered correct??
> My view is that four would be proper in order to NOT put tension on the
> coils. However, there does not appear to be quite enough thread length
for the
> four.
> I only have two, I can get two more, they sell for about $9.00 each
(that's a
> bit steep).
>
> So what's the opinion of the list?
>
> 68 degrees and bright sun in North Texas. (Deer grazing on runway)
>
> Zed Smith/701/912/90%/do not archive
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | First Timer Question |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "William Herren" <wmdherren@hotmail.com>
From: "Mick" mickrobertss@yahoo.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Subject: Zenith-List: First Timer Question
-- Zenith-List message posted by: Mick <A
s@yahoo.commsg=MSG1075017598.3start=1664539len=39183src=type=x" target=_top>mickrobertss@yahoo.com
I'm about to start ordering sections and tools to start building an
XL.
Any tips before I start?
Several have mentioned Harbor Freight on the list. I'd likesome comment on some
of their recent sale items. Air hydraulic riveter item # 00167-1RAH is this the
one that has worked out OK?current sale price $34.99 They have another that
weighs a pound more for $99.99.
Titanium nitride drill bits 1/8" 39803-0BHA 10 for $1.99 And they are double ended.
3/8" Angel drill attachment Has a Jacobs chuck I thought I might drill and tap
the spindle so I could use the screw in drills in very tight places. It's item
#43623-0RZH $19.99
I'd say I don't work for Harbor freight but my list is getting so long maybe I
do.
Bill in Lousyana XL Rudder kit not started.
Do Not Archive
Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed experience.
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" <larrymc@qconline.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ????
then I think I should go with the 100Hp!! So, what does everybody think?
What are your opinions and reasons for either choice?
> Larry Bohannon
Larry,
Do consider the Jabaru 80 hp engine. It is light for the output and may
offset the extra weight you anticipate.
Larry McFarland - 601HDS
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Robert Hillebrand <masterbogun@yahoo.com>
When I bought my plans for my 701 I asked Chris H at the oshgosh flyin about with
a man of my size(6'2" and 285 lbs)should I go with the biggest Hp engine. He
said"I would not be happy with the additional weight.The 701 was designed for
65Hp.The only reason to go bigger would be if I want to add floats. Other than
that 65 or 80hp would be fine.
He said I wouldn"t notice any difference.
Larry McFarland <larrymc@qconline.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland"
Subject: Zenith-List: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ????
then I think I should go with the 100Hp!! So, what does everybody think?
What are your opinions and reasons for either choice?
> Larry Bohannon
Larry,
Do consider the Jabaru 80 hp engine. It is light for the output and may
offset the extra weight you anticipate.
Larry McFarland - 601HDS
---------------------------------
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Robert Hillebrand <masterbogun@yahoo.com>
80Hp is plenty unless you are flying with floats or you have to worry about density
altitude
Larry McFarland <larrymc@qconline.com> wrote:--> Zenith-List message posted by:
"Larry McFarland"
Subject: Zenith-List: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ????
then I think I should go with the 100Hp!! So, what does everybody think?
What are your opinions and reasons for either choice?
> Larry Bohannon
Larry,
Do consider the Jabaru 80 hp engine. It is light for the output and may
offset the extra weight you anticipate.
Larry McFarland - 601HDS
---------------------------------
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: control stick grip |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Rick Pitcher <rick.pitcher@verizon.net>
Ron DeWees wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Ron DeWees" <rdewees@mindspring.com>
>
> HI Listers,
> I'm a bit away from installing a grip for my control stick but have to look ahead
a bit at this point. I need a control grip with at least 4 way switch for
the Mac servos and a PTT switch for radio. I inherited Mac grips with the
top mounted PTT switch on top but no trim switches. I looked at the CH handle
and like it but it looks like you have to saw off most of the stick and mount
the threaded end of the CH into a custom adapter. Don't want to do that as it
locks you into this stick forever. Anyone have any ideas or reflections on
selecting a grip with trim switches on it? Our 1 1/8 inch sticks on the Zenair
601 seems to rule out some products. Ideas appreciated !
>
> Ron DeWees
> 601 HDS/TD -Jab 3300 in progress
I looked at a few different ways to put the 4-way trim switch, a PTT,
and a radio frequency toggle switch on the grip. I ended up using a
gearshift handle from Pep Boy's. It has 2 plastic half-shells that can
be removed allowing access to install the switches. The OD of the handle
press-fit snugly inside the ID of the 1-1/8", but I did have to cut a
few inches off the end of the Y handle so it didn't end up way too long.
You can see it in this pic, the 4-way trim switch is in the middle with
the black radio freq toggle switch on the top and the red PTT on the
left side.
http://www.lightflyers.com/zpanel.jpg
Rick P.
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Engines: 701 80hp or 100hp ???? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton" <Bill@Howerton.com>
While I'm building a 601XL, I think the engine choice options for the two
planes are similar.
I'm looking for more horsepower primarily because of where I live. I live
in a high-altitude area, Colorado Springs, and typically fly when density
altitudes exceed 10,000 feet. Furthermore, if I want to fly west over the
mountains, I need to have an engine that can get my plane above those
14,000+ feet peaks.
I think all of these issues are things to consider
Bill Howerton - N714BH
601XL Corvair
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: 601XL Builders |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: wizard-24@juno.com
> XL Builders, how did you run all of your wires from the
battery/elevator
> trim/rudder light up to the control panel? I didn't want to run the
> wires along the side of the fuselage by the passenger seat and I
> don't dare cut a hole in the center section of the spar.
This is a tough one. Most of my wiring is run through the cable tunnel
area through the center of the cabin. However, there's not a whole lot of
room, so I doubt you'd be able to fit the battery cable in there as well.
I'm still not sure where my battery will be with a Corvair engine, so I'm
holding off running that particular cable. I've managed to squeeze the
wiring for the rudder position light, all the wires for the flap
controls, and the elevator trim all through that tunnel. I housed the
wires in some flex conduit to protect them against any rubbing against
the control stick. So, if I have to locate the battery in the rear, I'll
probably run that cable along the inside of the fuselage on one side, and
the antenna cables on the other, for lack of a better plan.
Mike Fortunato
601XL
Message 20
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "PK" <pfergus2@tampabay.rr.com>
It's been a very sad year
This decision has taken many months - I need to sell - I have to sell.
Zodiac 601 HDS Tail Dragger.
Fuselage: on gear / Wings Built / Tail Built / 8 gal. header / two 7 gal. wing
tanks / Strobes only / gasolator / Axu Pump
All basic flight instruments: Airspeed / Altimeter / VSI / Compass / Ball
Engine Monitor: ESI unit set up for a Jab 3300 / with fuel sender option
Radio: 2 1/4 Becker Comm. and Transponder / America -king encoder / 403 intercom
with jacks installed
It has the forward tilt canopy and was set up for the Jabiru engine ( sold sorry
) All the big stuff is built all that needs to be done is install the engine
and FWF ( bolt pattern is in the stock position for Rotax or Jab installation
). This aircraft was three weeks away from flying.....I cannot ship - The wings
and tail are off, you will need a trailer or moving van
$15,000.00
plus any tools you want in my shop....
Peter Ferguson
Largo Florida
727-798-5024
Message 21
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
test
__________________________________
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: First Timer Question |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: B K Johnson <wa7dvd@comcast.net>
Hi,
I use the lower price Harbor Freight riveter and it works great. If you don't
want to make your own heads, the ones from ZAC fit it just fine. The expensive
riveter will pull larger rivets, but you won't need that capacity for 99.5%
of the plane. I like cobalt drill
bits and find they stay sharp longer the the TiN. A step drill bit is also worth
its every penny they cost. They drill large holes without grabbing. Aircraft
Tool Supply has been a good supplier for me. The have great prices on clecos,
drill bits and other special
tools. They are at www.aircraft-tool.com.
Bruce Johnson
601XL
N601BK (reserved)
William Herren wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "William Herren" <wmdherren@hotmail.com>
>
> I'm about to start ordering sections and tools to start building an
> XL.
>
> Any tips before I start?
>
> Several have mentioned Harbor Freight on the list. I'd likesome comment on some
of their recent sale items. Air hydraulic riveter item # 00167-1RAH is this
the one that has worked out OK?current sale price $34.99 They have another that
weighs a pound more for $99.99.
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: 701 80 or 100 HP? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Dabusmith@aol.com
>we get awfully hot and humid days here in Georgia and with a starting MSL of
1000 ft.
Larry
I flew in a 701with the 80HP in Georgia during the summer. It was great!
Dave Smith
N701XL
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