---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 06/28/04: 30 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:16 AM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Beckman, Rick) 2. 05:16 AM - Re: 601XL Build Order (Greg Lamoree) 3. 05:17 AM - Re: Another bird in the air. (Beckman, Rick) 4. 05:18 AM - Re: 601XL Build Order (Greg Lamoree) 5. 05:28 AM - Re: 601XL Build Order (Greg Lamoree) 6. 05:31 AM - Re: Re: Wheel Fairings and L angles (Greg Lamoree) 7. 06:28 AM - Re: Stratus Oil Filter (Larry McFarland) 8. 06:28 AM - Wing filet question again.... (Trevor Page) 9. 06:39 AM - Re: 601HD wing filet question (Scott Laughlin) 10. 06:40 AM - Re: Stratus Oil Filter (Don Walker) 11. 07:00 AM - Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question (charles.long@gm.com) 12. 07:46 AM - Re: Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question (Trampas) 13. 08:23 AM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ () 14. 08:27 AM - Re: [SPAM] - Zenith-List Digest: 28 Msgs - 06/27/04 - Bayesian (Bill Mileski) 15. 08:35 AM - Re: Engine testing, Stratus Subaru (HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)) 16. 12:01 PM - Re: Stratus Oil Filter (Bryan Martin) 17. 01:55 PM - Re: Axel Drilling and mounting (Bill Howerton) 18. 02:29 PM - Re: Axel Drilling and mounting (Bryan Martin) 19. 02:45 PM - Re: Axel Drilling and mounting (HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)) 20. 02:46 PM - Re: Axel Drilling and mounting (Bill Howerton) 21. 04:38 PM - Re: Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question (Chris Boultinghouse) 22. 05:02 PM - Re: Axel Drilling and mounting (cgalley) 23. 06:12 PM - Re: Gotta see this! (Clmelenyzeriv@cs.com) 24. 06:17 PM - Re: Gotta see this! (Joemotis@aol.com) 25. 08:42 PM - Hole Finder (Jim Fosse) 26. 08:58 PM - Re: Hole Finder (Chuck Deiterich) 27. 09:28 PM - Re: Hole Finder (Joemotis@aol.com) 28. 10:21 PM - Re: U.S.A Trip (Kevin W Bonds) 29. 10:47 PM - Re: Engine testing, Stratus Subaru (jennifer) 30. 11:50 PM - Re: Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question (xl) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:16:25 AM PST US From: "Beckman, Rick" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Beckman, Rick" First Flight of N601EZ (and a short one at that) HEEEY, Larry !!! Congratulations!! Quite an accomplishment !! Well done! Been trying to keep up with your building and progress, and now you're done!! Good job!! Rick Do not archive ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:16:29 AM PST US From: "Greg Lamoree" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601XL Build Order --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Greg Lamoree" I have the CD, the photo install guides get vague fast in comparison to the rudder instructions. ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Mike H" >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mike H" > >zenith said that they have a cd -rom with detailed picture instructions that >comes with each xl. Are the instructions improved from before, or are they >still vague in the latter stages? >Michael Hilderbrand >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Al Young" >To: >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601XL Build Order > > >> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Al Young" >> >> Greg- This has been debated before and there is no answer except your own >> preference. The key, at least to me is that the further on you get, the >> less detail is available in the instruction from ZAC. I would suggest >that >> you start with the rudder, stablizer, alierons, flaps, wings and finally >the >> fuselage, in that order. You will develope the skills in the early stages >> to interpret the directions provided in the latter stages, which are not >as >> detailed. Make sense? Good luck, go slow, enjoy the experience. >> >> Al Young >> 601XL- installing the canopy. >> >> > > -- -------------------------- Greg Lamoree Zodiac 601 XL www.GregsPlane.com -------------------------- -- ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:17:55 AM PST US From: "Beckman, Rick" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Another bird in the air. --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Beckman, Rick" Well, friday at 9h15, another plane defied gravity. Aircraft: CH601-HD, TTSN 1h25 This is just awesome!! Two in one weekend!! Congratulations!!! Good job!! I'm assuming, with all I've read and heard, that it is totally worth it!! Keep us posted on performance!! Rick ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:18:56 AM PST US From: "Greg Lamoree" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601XL Build Order --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Greg Lamoree" I just put the top back on the crate ( I may add some addition cross supports later) and then took the one end off (facing my garage door) to be able to slide the larger parts in and out. ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Lance Gingell" >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Lance Gingell" > >My wings/fuse kit finally arrived, and I'm trying to figure out >how/whether to make the 12' crate into my new bench (old one was the >tail kit crate, so its only 9' x 3'). > >Ray, You mentioned storing your wings in the crate "After completing >each wing, I was able to construct a shelf in the original crate and >slide the completed wing back into the crate. They protrude from the >crate at the wing root but for the most part are out of the way...". >This sounds like a great plan for me - do you have a picture of this >somewhere? > >On the workbench, I've seen one builder out there (I forget who - the >guy with the multicoloured bench) who used the 12' crate as a workbench, >but needed to stiffen up the top. I'd like to leave the bench intact (to >store wings/skins etc.) and use the top to build on. Has anyone else >successfully done this? Any pictures/tips? > >Cheers, >..lance >601XL Tail complete, wings/fuse just arrived. > > -- -------------------------- Greg Lamoree Zodiac 601 XL www.GregsPlane.com -------------------------- -- ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:28:43 AM PST US From: "Greg Lamoree" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601XL Build Order --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Greg Lamoree" Ooook, Boy, what a can of worms I opened... heh... Well, thank you all for your input. I like the idea of doing the fuselage last. Based on all the comments (especially on the detail in the instructions as they progress), and my own opinions... I'll probably to the rest of the tail, then the wings and finish with the fuselage. Thank you all for your help. -- -------------------------- Greg Lamoree Zodiac 601 XL www.GregsPlane.com -------------------------- -- ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:31:03 AM PST US From: "Greg Lamoree" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Wheel Fairings and L angles --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Greg Lamoree" I agree with the replies, if I don't mention something, they'll think that the quality of those fairings is ok... I'll mention them when I make my other "missing parts" phone call. In all of the replies I didn't see anyone comment on the number of L angles they received... ...any thoughts on this? -- -------------------------- Greg Lamoree Zodiac 601 XL www.GregsPlane.com -------------------------- -- ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:28:16 AM PST US From: "Larry McFarland" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Stratus Oil Filter --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" Subject: Zenith-List: Stratus Oil Filter > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "j.breit" Does anyone know of an equivalent filter that is the shorter length of the original WIX filter or have another solution to the problem? Mr Breit, I got a suitably short filter from the local Farm and Fleet store under Briggs and Stratton Brand. Don't remember the part number, but they were less expensive and the same dimensions etc. Larry McFarland ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:28:16 AM PST US From: Trevor Page Subject: Zenith-List: Wing filet question again.... --> Zenith-List message posted by: Trevor Page It seems me last post got lost in the mix with cable swaging so here goes again.... I'm at the point of installing the wing filets against the fuselage. The filets extend a bit past the nose skin of the center wing. The manuals doesn't say anything about trimming it. Is this what I should do or leave it alone? Is there going to be an unsightly gap between the nose skin and the side skin? Thanks! Trevor Page ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:39:05 AM PST US From: "Scott Laughlin" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601HD wing filet question --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Scott Laughlin" Bryan: The swaging tool you mentioned on Ebay is not by "Nicopress." You can get the same tool at Lowes for $25 and you don't have to pay shipping. I have one, but have not tried it yet. The quality seems OK, but I'll want to test it out first. Here's the link to the $39 + $13 shipping, Ebay Swaging tool: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2482847663&category=26438 Look for this same tool at Lowes or Home Depot near the spools of cable. Good luck, Scott Laughlin http://www.cooknwithgas.com/ ----Original Message Follows---- From: Bryan Martin I just checked E-Bay and saw at three for sale for $40 which is a real bargain. -- Bryan Martin DO NOT ARCHIVE download! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/ ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:40:17 AM PST US From: "Don Walker" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Stratus Oil Filter Seal-Send-Time: Mon, 28 Jun 2004 08:40:08 -0500 --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Don Walker" There are a number that will work. Hastings LF 503 is a quality filter that fits and is cheaper than WIX. It is the same as a Briggs and Stratton lawn tractor uses, too. If you look at the 18 h.p. and up lawn tractors you will find lots of filters the same size that the Stratus requires. Don Walker HDS TD 332 hours ----- Original Message ----- From: j.breit To: Matronics Sent: Monday, June 28, 2004 1:03 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Stratus Oil Filter --> Zenith-List message posted by: "j.breit" The oil filter provided with my Stratus engine is a WIX # 51065. WIX has supposedly superseded this filter with a longer filter that interferes with the engine mount when mounting. The NAPA part number for this filter (which is also longer and interferes) is 1056. Does anyone know of an equivalent filter that is the shorter length of the original WIX filter or have another solution to the problem? ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:00:21 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question From: charles.long@gm.com 20, 2004) at 06/28/2004 09:59:20 AM, Serialize complete at 06/28/2004 09:59:20 AM --> Zenith-List message posted by: charles.long@gm.com Question for those of you with the Jab 3300 fire wall forward package from ZAC. I have the Engine Information System from Grand Rapids with two CHT & 2 EGT probes. Have any of you measured the variation in temps from front to back cylinders and what cylinders run the hottest. Normally it would be the rear ones, but no substitute for actual data. Thanks in advance for you feedback. Chuck Long getting close! Jab 3300 HDS, N601LE ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:46:51 AM PST US From: "Trampas" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Trampas" My father in law is building a 601 with the 3300 but is not to the point where he is flying. He is installing one of my engine monitors, www.sterntech.com, so he will have information on EGTs and CHTs. I will post a log when he starts flying. Trampas -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of charles.long@gm.com Subject: Zenith-List: Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question --> Zenith-List message posted by: charles.long@gm.com Question for those of you with the Jab 3300 fire wall forward package from ZAC. I have the Engine Information System from Grand Rapids with two CHT & 2 EGT probes. Have any of you measured the variation in temps from front to back cylinders and what cylinders run the hottest. Normally it would be the rear ones, but no substitute for actual data. Thanks in advance for you feedback. Chuck Long getting close! Jab 3300 HDS, N601LE ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 08:23:20 AM PST US Subject: RE: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ From: --> Zenith-List message posted by: Congratulations! Do not archive GGP ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 08:27:33 AM PST US From: Bill Mileski Filter detected spam Subject: Zenith-List: Re: [SPAM] - Zenith-List Digest: 28 Msgs - 06/27/04 - Bayesian Filter detected spam --> Zenith-List message posted by: Bill Mileski Filter detected spam At 11:58 PM 6/27/2004, you wrote: >* > > ================================================== > Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive > ================================================== > >Today's complete Zenith-List Digest can be also be found in either >of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest >formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked >Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII >version of the Zenith-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic >text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. > >HTML Version: > > >http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list/Digest.Zenith-List.2004-06-27.html > >Text Version: > > >http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list/Digest.Zenith-List.2004-06-27.txt > > > ================================================ > EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive > ================================================ > > > Zenith-List Digest Archive > --- > Total Messages Posted Sun 06/27/04: 28 > > >Today's Message Index: >---------------------- > > 1. 06:08 AM - Re: Re: Wheel Fairings and L angles (Larry Martin) > 2. 06:58 AM - 601XL Build Order (Lance Gingell) > 3. 07:25 AM - 701 rear root doubler (RURUNY@aol.com) > 4. 09:25 AM - Re: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order (Joemotis@aol.com) > 5. 10:01 AM - First Flight for N601EZ (Larry McFarland) > 6. 10:30 AM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Bob Simle) > 7. 10:31 AM - Re: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order (Dave & Darlene) > 8. 10:48 AM - Re: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order (Joemotis@aol.com) > 9. 11:35 AM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Larry McFarland) > 10. 11:46 AM - Re: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order (Rick) > 11. 12:27 PM - Re: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order (Joemotis@aol.com) > 12. 02:13 PM - 601HD wing filet question (Trevor Page) > 13. 02:35 PM - Re: 601HD wing filet question (Joemotis@aol.com) > 14. 03:04 PM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (cgalley) > 15. 03:12 PM - Re: 601HD wing filet question (Bryan Martin) > 16. 03:34 PM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Larry McFarland) > 17. 03:50 PM - Re: 601HD wing filet question (wizard-24@juno.com) > 18. 03:56 PM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Al Young) > 19. 04:22 PM - Re: 601HD wing filet question (Bryan Martin) > 20. 05:20 PM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Benford2@aol.com) > 21. 05:25 PM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Larry McFarland) > 22. 05:40 PM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Joemotis@aol.com) > 23. 06:15 PM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Larry McFarland) > 24. 06:45 PM - Re: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order (Rick) > 25. 06:54 PM - Re: First Flight for N601EZ (Larry McFarland) > 26. 07:30 PM - Re: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order (Joemotis@aol.com) > 27. 11:10 PM - Stratus Oil Filter (j.breit) > 28. 11:15 PM - Stratst Oil Filter (j.breit) > > >________________________________ Message >1 _____________________________________ > > >Time: 06:08:26 AM PST US >From: "Larry Martin" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Wheel Fairings and L angles > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry Martin" > >They will all have to be worked where the two halves are seamed together. But >the rest of the pant should be relatively imperfection free. If it's not then >it's just sorry workmanship. Anything less is just plain unacceptable. Send >it back, it you don't then the problem will not get better. They have to know >that we will not accept sorry workmanship. > >Larry N1345L > ----- Original Message ----- > From: nhulin > To: Zenith-List@matronics.com > Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2004 12:07 AM > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Wheel Fairings and L angles > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "nhulin" > > On: Fri Jun 25 - 6:16 PM Greg Lamoree (zenithlist@randomminds.com) wrote: > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Greg Lamoree" > > > > When I unpacked the wheel fairings from my kit, I noticed that > > they seemed VERY rough. In fact, the two halves of each > > don't seem to line up very well, and it will take quite a bit > > of some kind of filler to make a nice looking / smooth > > fairing. > > Greg, > > I sent mine back and got another set that are slightly more acceptable but > still look like they'll need days of work to clean up. I may yet just > return > them and buy some from VANS or Spruce. > > Tailwinds, ...neil > 601XL/Corvair > Fuselage and stuff > > > --- > Email certified virus free when sent from original author. > > > --- > Version: 6.0.705 / Virus Database: 461 - Release Date: 6/12/2004 > > >________________________________ Message >2 _____________________________________ > > >Time: 06:58:07 AM PST US >Subject: Zenith-List: 601XL Build Order >From: "Lance Gingell" > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Lance Gingell" > >My wings/fuse kit finally arrived, and I'm trying to figure out >how/whether to make the 12' crate into my new bench (old one was the >tail kit crate, so its only 9' x 3'). > >Ray, You mentioned storing your wings in the crate "After completing >each wing, I was able to construct a shelf in the original crate and >slide the completed wing back into the crate. They protrude from the >crate at the wing root but for the most part are out of the way...". >This sounds like a great plan for me - do you have a picture of this >somewhere? > >On the workbench, I've seen one builder out there (I forget who - the >guy with the multicoloured bench) who used the 12' crate as a workbench, >but needed to stiffen up the top. I'd like to leave the bench intact (to >store wings/skins etc.) and use the top to build on. Has anyone else >successfully done this? Any pictures/tips? > >Cheers, >..lance >601XL Tail complete, wings/fuse just arrived. > > >________________________________ Message >3 _____________________________________ > > >Time: 07:25:21 AM PST US >From: RURUNY@aol.com >Subject: Zenith-List: 701 rear root doubler > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: RURUNY@aol.com > >I looked over the plan sheets 7-V-4 and 7-V-6 and the completed wing >skeleton on my workbench. >If you look carefully at the plans the 247mm is measured from the center of >rib 1 to the center of the root rib. This is also where the inboardmost set of > > A5 holes is located as shown on 7V4-3 as 58mm from its inboard end. >Now look at the 295mm measurement on 7-V-6. It shows the measurement from >the inboard >side of rib 1 to the end of the heavy channel. If you place the rear root >doubler flush against the 295mm long heavy rear channel the inboard rivets >will > >be 58mm from the inboard end locating the center of the root rib. Now >measure the center of rib 1 to the center of root rib and you will get 247mm. >At first when I was looking at this for you,I was taking both measurements >from the same place and was worried for a second that I had screwed it up. > >Subtract 295-247=48 You think inboard rivets for root rib should be >48mm from end. > leaving that 10 mm overhang of the >doubler. > >Since the rib flanges are aproximately 20 mm the center of the rib would add >another 10 mm to the 295 measurement. 295+10 =305mm >Then 305-247=58mm > >Brian >Long Island > > >________________________________ Message >4 _____________________________________ > > >Time: 09:25:19 AM PST US >From: Joemotis@aol.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > > >In a message dated 6/26/2004 9:53:38 PM Pacific Standard Time, >nhulin@hotmail.com writes: > >About the only thing I thought was missing is the cut out in the >Cable Control Box sides, but that isn't hard to work out for yourself. > > >This is one of my points exactly in you words. >Missing? Did these plans go through plan check? And if the did, who signed >off on them with something missing??? > >"On the "Zodiac XL Photo Assembly >Guides" page, follow the link to "Drawing Updates". You will find in PDF >form, textual summaries of the changes that have been applied to the >drawings" > >This is on a link on my toolbar and I read it at least once a week and the >last 6 mistakes that I have found were not there. > > >"All in all it is very hard to fault the quality of the drawings, photo >manuals, and the supplied parts. Ask around your EAA chapter to get a >sampling of the quality of other vendors documentation." > >I disagree completely here. The quality of the photo guides for the dual >stick mods is is about a 1 on the 10 scale and I have seen better from China >in >directions to assemble your BBQ. I am halfway through the wings for the XL >and have found 5 mistakes on the prints. I am also working from >the latest set > >and the CD for the photo guide. And I dont need a sampling of others >documentation. What I am dealing with is ZAC. > >"Instead of moaning to other builders, help everyone out when you eventually >find a real error by accurately documenting it and drop an email to the >factory." > >Moaning? because the latest information from the factory is wrong and I have >to post to a list to see how others dealt with it? That's frustration, pure >and simple. Also I do contact the factory when I find mistakes. Phone or e >mail. > >Joe Motis >601XL >34 years of reading prints for a living > >Do not archive > > >________________________________ Message >5 _____________________________________ > > >Time: 10:01:58 AM PST US >From: "Larry McFarland" >Subject: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" > > >First Flight of N601EZ >(and a short one at that) > >June 27 My concerned research had been asking, what do EGTs read at and >above 4000-rpms, >when all else goes normal. The visibility was clear, the sky was overcast. >Temps neared 70 and there was no wind, so within 20-minutes I was at the >airport and the plane was moved out on the ramp. I requested a First Flight >Clearance on runway 5 and stated that I would either linger above the >tower and >pattern, or return directly and land dependant upon info from my Engine >Information >System. Tower clearance to 5 was given and I moved out and accelerated >quickly to a lift-off and proceeded to climb at 4500-4900 rpm. Passing >over the >end of the runway at 600-feet, the EIS light came on and EGT temps climbed >to 1550-degrees F at 5000 rpm, which is well above the 1400-EGT limit, so >I reduced >throttle to 3500-rpm and requested an immediate clearance to land on 27. >Tower cleared the approach, so I rolled the plane into a tight right turn and >descended at 2000-rpm to a very good landing and rollout. Ground cleared me at >the intersection to take runway 23 back to the hangars. The answer to my EGT >question was answered. None of the other temps were outside limits but the EGT >temps need attention. The plane is a pure joy to fly. It's so precise and >totally >in-trim. The view is terrific and when the EGT problem sorts out, the 40-hours >are going to go quickly. > >Thanks to you all for providing information that made this construction >experience >possible and for providing answers to my questions along the way. I'm sure >there'll be more. > >Thanks again Kelly for the preflight experience that made this first >flight a safe >one. > >Larry C. McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com > > >________________________________ Message >6 _____________________________________ > > >Time: 10:30:24 AM PST US >From: "Bob Simle" >Subject: RE: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bob Simle" > > >Congrats Larry, >I have been hitting your website daily anticipating your first flight. Your >an inspiration to many of us builders. Hope your able to fly it to Mexico >for open hanger day in August. > >-Bob Simle 801 builder > > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com >[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Larry >McFarland >Subject: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" > > >First Flight of N601EZ >(and a short one at that) > >June 27 My concerned research had been asking, what do EGTs read at and >above 4000-rpms, when all else goes normal. The visibility was clear, the >sky was overcast. Temps neared 70 and there was no wind, so within >20-minutes I was at the airport and the plane was moved out on the ramp. I >requested a First Flight Clearance on runway 5 and stated that I would >either linger above the tower and pattern, or return directly and land >dependant upon info from my Engine Information System. Tower clearance to 5 >was given and I moved out and accelerated quickly to a lift-off and >proceeded to climb at 4500-4900 rpm. Passing over the end of the runway at >600-feet, the EIS light came on and EGT temps climbed to 1550-degrees F at >5000 rpm, which is well above the 1400-EGT limit, so I reduced throttle to >3500-rpm and requested an immediate clearance to land on 27. Tower cleared >the approach, so I rolled the plane into a tight right turn and descended at >2000-rpm to a very good landing and ro! >llout. Ground cleared me at the intersection to take runway 23 back to the >hangars. The answer to my EGT question was answered. None of the other temps >were outside limits but the EGT temps need attention. The plane is a pure >joy to fly. It's so precise and totally in-trim. The view is terrific and >when the EGT problem sorts out, the 40-hours are going to go quickly. > >Thanks to you all for providing information that made this construction >experience possible and for providing answers to my questions along the >way. I'm sure there'll be more. > >Thanks again Kelly for the preflight experience that made this first flight >a safe one. > >Larry C. McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com > > >________________________________ Message >7 _____________________________________ > > >Time: 10:31:44 AM PST US >From: "Dave & Darlene" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave & Darlene" > >Hi Joe >Seems your having a problem with the drawings, photo guides. You are >probably a very confident builder and are having lots of fun with the build. >I myself am scratch building and love the challenge. I realize no one is >perfect and we all make mistakes. Zac I'm sure knows of these issues and is >probably dealing with them as time allows. Chris probably has a lot on his >mind but his commitment to his builders goes way beyond what we see and >hear. I'm sure if you approached him on your issues he would resolve them >for you. As a scratch builder we are bound to run into snags but that is >part of the fun of it all. When we solve them it gives us a feeling of >accomplishment and a really good feeling inside that we did it. The list >offers many advantages over a phone in support as we can draw from other >builders that have run into these issues and have found ways around them and >have solved them. I'm only to happy to use the list as I'm no expert and >need that helping hand once in awhile. Please accept the plans and photo's >as they are and have fun with your build as the long term goal is to get >that plane in the iar one day and enjoy what we've build on our own. You've >probably read of builders first flights. I can only imagine the excitement >that they must be having. I can hardly wait for that day to come for me and >my wife to enjoy the fruits of our labour and love. And to say to fellow >fliers, we built this ourselves. What a way to live. >Dave (Alberta) >601XL >99% to go >----- Original Message ----- >From: >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order > > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > > > > > > In a message dated 6/26/2004 9:53:38 PM Pacific Standard Time, > > nhulin@hotmail.com writes: > > > > About the only thing I thought was missing is the cut out in the > > Cable Control Box sides, but that isn't hard to work out for yourself. > > > > > > This is one of my points exactly in you words. > > Missing? Did these plans go through plan check? And if the did, who signed > > off on them with something missing??? > > > > "On the "Zodiac XL Photo Assembly > > Guides" page, follow the link to "Drawing Updates". You will find in PDF > > form, textual summaries of the changes that have been applied to the > > drawings" > > > > This is on a link on my toolbar and I read it at least once a week and the > > last 6 mistakes that I have found were not there. > > > > > > "All in all it is very hard to fault the quality of the drawings, photo > > manuals, and the supplied parts. Ask around your EAA chapter to get a > > sampling of the quality of other vendors documentation." > > > > I disagree completely here. The quality of the photo guides for the dual > > stick mods is is about a 1 on the 10 scale and I have seen better from >China in > > directions to assemble your BBQ. I am halfway through the wings for the >XL > > and have found 5 mistakes on the prints. I am also working from the >latest set > > and the CD for the photo guide. And I dont need a sampling of others > > documentation. What I am dealing with is ZAC. > > > > "Instead of moaning to other builders, help everyone out when you >eventually > > find a real error by accurately documenting it and drop an email to the > > factory." > > > > Moaning? because the latest information from the factory is wrong and I >have > > to post to a list to see how others dealt with it? That's frustration, >pure > > and simple. Also I do contact the factory when I find mistakes. Phone or e > > mail. > > > > Joe Motis > > 601XL > > 34 years of reading prints for a living > > > > Do not archive > > > > > > >________________________________ Message >8 _____________________________________ > > >Time: 10:48:57 AM PST US >From: Joemotis@aol.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > >Hi Dave >I am not having a problem per se, just venting a little frustration over >things that I feel should have been taken care of before the prints or photo >guides were released. I like ZAC and believe in the product and can work >around > >the errors and omissisons, my point is that they (for the most part) could >have been taken care of with a better plans check before release. > >And Shirley is one of the best customer service reps that I have ever dealt >with. It just seems to me, considering the high quality of the kit they should > > strive to do a liitle better in the documentation arena. > >Cheers >Joe Motis >601XL >Still waiting for the repacement bottom wing skins >after they sent me the top replacement wing skins > >Do not archive > > >________________________________ Message >9 _____________________________________ > > >Time: 11:35:37 AM PST US >From: "Larry McFarland" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" > >Bob, >I'd be pleased to be able to fly there this year as well, but that might >be cutting it a little close. I intend to be there in any case. >Thanks, >Larry >Do Not Archive > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Bob Simle" >Subject: RE: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bob Simle" > > > > > > Congrats Larry, > > I have been hitting your website daily anticipating your first flight. >Your > > an inspiration to many of us builders. Hope your able to fly it to Mexico > > for open hanger day in August. > > > > -Bob Simle 801 builder > > > > > > >________________________________ Message >10 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 11:46:06 AM PST US >From: Rick >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Rick > > >Joe, I've been building airplanes for 35 years and haven't found one yet >that didn't have a few discrepancies in the drawings. At Lockheed and >Northrop there's a huge staff that does nothing but drawing updates and >changes. They spend millions of dollars keeping up with changes and >fixing past mistakes, but there's STILL discrepancies here and there. >Sometimes you just have to look at the big picture and make adjustments >accordingly. > >Rick P. >CH601HD > > >Joemotis@aol.com wrote: > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > > > > > > In a message dated 6/26/2004 9:53:38 PM Pacific Standard Time, > > nhulin@hotmail.com writes: > > > > About the only thing I thought was missing is the cut out in the > > Cable Control Box sides, but that isn't hard to work out for yourself. > > > > > > This is one of my points exactly in you words. > > Missing? Did these plans go through plan check? And if the did, who > signed > > off on them with something missing??? > > > > "On the "Zodiac XL Photo Assembly > > Guides" page, follow the link to "Drawing Updates". You will find in PDF > > form, textual summaries of the changes that have been applied to the > > drawings" > > > > This is on a link on my toolbar and I read it at least once a week and > the > > last 6 mistakes that I have found were not there. > > > > > > "All in all it is very hard to fault the quality of the drawings, photo > > manuals, and the supplied parts. Ask around your EAA chapter to get a > > sampling of the quality of other vendors documentation." > > > > I disagree completely here. The quality of the photo guides for the dual > > stick mods is is about a 1 on the 10 scale and I have seen better > from China >in > > directions to assemble your BBQ. I am halfway through the wings for > the XL > > and have found 5 mistakes on the prints. I am also working from > the latest set > > > and the CD for the photo guide. And I dont need a sampling of others > > documentation. What I am dealing with is ZAC. > > > > "Instead of moaning to other builders, help everyone out when > you eventually > > find a real error by accurately documenting it and drop an email to the > > factory." > > > > Moaning? because the latest information from the factory is wrong and > I have > > > to post to a list to see how others dealt with it? That's frustration, > pure > > > and simple. Also I do contact the factory when I find mistakes. Phone > or e > > mail. > > > > Joe Motis > > 601XL > > 34 years of reading prints for a living > > > > Do not archive > > > > > > >________________________________ Message >11 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 12:27:41 PM PST US >From: Joemotis@aol.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > >Hi Rick > >How is this for coincidence, My Dad graduated from Northrop, taught at >Northrop and retired from Lockheed with 35 years of sevice. And, in the early > >years of his career, was a draftsman. He also taught mechanical >drawing at at >De >Anza College for a few years before his retirement from Lockheed. And >finally, in his last ten years before his retirement he was a mainstay in the > >Lockheed Zero Defects program. So this probably has something to do >with my view > >of the errors etc. in the prints and photo guides that cause me frustration. >Certainly, nothing we cannot work through though. And especially with all the > >great feedback that comes from you and the other contributors to this great >list. > >Cheers > >Joe Motis > > >________________________________ Message >12 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 02:13:20 PM PST US >From: Trevor Page >Subject: Zenith-List: 601HD wing filet question > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Trevor Page > >Seem to be making some decent progress on my 601 project. Today I made >up and installed all the control cables since those would be a pain to >install after I do the turtledeck, which is next on my list. > >SO, my question today is that the wing filet seems a bit long to me. It >overlaps the center wing nose skin by 1.5 inches. In the manual is >doesn't say anything about trimming it. Should I trim it or leave it >alone? That would leave a noticeable gap between it and the nose skin. > >I've looked a lot of pictures but I can't see anything close enough... > >Thanks! > >Trevor Page > > >________________________________ Message >13 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 02:35:26 PM PST US >From: Joemotis@aol.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601HD wing filet question > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > >Hi Trevor, >I am sorry that I do not know the answer to the fillet question. But >hopefully, you could answer a question for me. What did you use to crimp >the cables > >with? Also, are you going to tension them with, perhaps, one of those $100 >tensionmeters? > >Thanks >Joe Motis >601XL > >Do not archive > > >________________________________ Message >14 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 03:04:35 PM PST US >From: "cgalley" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" > >Congratulations > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Larry McFarland" >Subject: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" > > > > > > > First Flight of N601EZ > > (and a short one at that) > > > > June 27 My concerned research had been asking, what do EGTs read at and >above 4000-rpms, when all else goes normal. The visibility was clear, the >sky was overcast. Temps neared 70 and there was no wind, so within >20-minutes I was at the airport and the plane was moved out on the ramp. I >requested a First Flight Clearance on runway 5 and stated that I would >either linger above the tower and pattern, or return directly and land >dependant upon info from my Engine Information System. Tower clearance to 5 >was given and I moved out and accelerated quickly to a lift-off and >proceeded to climb at 4500-4900 rpm. Passing over the end of the runway at >600-feet, the EIS light came on and EGT temps climbed to 1550-degrees F at >5000 rpm, which is well above the 1400-EGT limit, so I reduced throttle to >3500-rpm and requested an immediate clearance to land on 27. Tower cleared >the approach, so I rolled the plane into a tight right turn and descended at >2000-rpm to a very good landing and ro! > > llout. Ground cleared me at the intersection to take runway 23 back to the >hangars. The answer to my EGT question was answered. None of the other temps >were outside limits but the EGT temps need attention. The plane is a pure >joy to fly. It's so precise and totally in-trim. The view is terrific and >when the EGT problem sorts out, the 40-hours are going to go quickly. > > > > Thanks to you all for providing information that made this construction >experience possible and for providing answers to my questions along the >way. I'm sure there'll be more. > > > > Thanks again Kelly for the preflight experience that made this first >flight a safe one. > > > > Larry C. McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com > > > > > > >________________________________ Message >15 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 03:12:18 PM PST US >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601HD wing filet question >From: Bryan Martin > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin > >on 6/27/04 5:34 PM, Joemotis@aol.com at Joemotis@aol.com wrote: > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > > > > Hi Trevor, > > I am sorry that I do not know the answer to the fillet question. But > > hopefully, you could answer a question for me. What did you use > to crimp the > > cables > > with? Also, are you going to tension them with, perhaps, one of those $100 > > tensionmeters? > > > > Thanks > > Joe Motis > > 601XL > >You must use a Nicopress swaging tool for crimping the control cables. >Improperly crimped cable fasteners can kill you. Many EAA chapters have >these tools to loan out for the job. They are also available from Aircraft >Spruce, but they are expensive. These fittings are also used on sail boats, >so most places that do work on them may have a set you can use. I just >checked E-Bay and saw at three for sale for $40 which is a real bargain. > > >-- >Bryan Martin >N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. >Construction complete. >Getting the paperwork in order. >do not archive. > > >________________________________ Message >16 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 03:34:43 PM PST US >From: "Larry McFarland" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" > >Thank you Cy. >The EGT temps are an issue I can work thru, so in a few days >we'll have a go at it again. Had to fly tho, perfect weather. > >Must say thanks for your considerable help in getting me out to the >airport. If you need welding or machining or just help with >anything to get you airborne again, please let me know. > >Would like to see your plane back in the air. > >Larry >Do not archive > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "cgalley" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > > > Congratulations > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Larry McFarland" > > To: > > Subject: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > > > > > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" > > > > > > > > > > > First Flight of N601EZ > > > (and a short one at that) > > > > > > June 27 My concerned research had been asking, what do EGTs read at and > > above 4000-rpms, when all else goes normal. The visibility was clear, the > > sky was overcast. Temps neared 70 and there was no wind, so within > > 20-minutes I was at the airport and the plane was moved out on the ramp. I > > requested a First Flight Clearance on runway 5 and stated that I would > > either linger above the tower and pattern, or return directly and land > > dependant upon info from my Engine Information System. Tower clearance to >5 > > was given and I moved out and accelerated quickly to a lift-off and > > proceeded to climb at 4500-4900 rpm. Passing over the end of the runway at > > 600-feet, the EIS light came on and EGT temps climbed to 1550-degrees F at > > 5000 rpm, which is well above the 1400-EGT limit, so I reduced throttle to > > 3500-rpm and requested an immediate clearance to land on 27. Tower cleared > > the approach, so I rolled the plane into a tight right turn and descended >at > > 2000-rpm to a very good landing and ro! > > > llout. Ground cleared me at the intersection to take runway 23 back to >the > > hangars. The answer to my EGT question was answered. None of the other >temps > > were outside limits but the EGT temps need attention. The plane is a pure > > joy to fly. It's so precise and totally in-trim. The view is terrific and > > when the EGT problem sorts out, the 40-hours are going to go quickly. > > > > > > Thanks to you all for providing information that made this construction > > experience possible and for providing answers to my questions along the > > way. I'm sure there'll be more. > > > > > > Thanks again Kelly for the preflight experience that made this first > > flight a safe one. > > > > > > Larry C. McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com > > > > > > > >________________________________ Message >17 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 03:50:16 PM PST US >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601HD wing filet question >From: wizard-24@juno.com > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: wizard-24@juno.com > > > > What did you use to crimp the cables with? > >Joe, there's an inexpensive nicropress swaging tool (I think all the >suppliers sell them) which you can use. It's slower than some of the >bigger (more expensive) tools, but it does the job just fine. Here's the >link to the Aircraft Spruce web site: > >http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/topages/swagingtool.php > >The one for 17 bucks works great. > > > Also, are you going to tension them with, perhaps, one of those $100 > > tensionmeters? > >Not necessary, in my opinion. Just hand check for the proper deflection, >and you're good to go. I plan to just be sure to check them regularly. > >Mike Fortunato >601XL > > >________________________________ Message >18 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 03:56:13 PM PST US >From: "Al Young" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Al Young" > >Larry- Great work!! Congrats. I've been following your progress for the >past several years, and am very happy you have reached your goal. > >Al Young >601XL- 80% > >Do not archive > > >________________________________ Message >19 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 04:22:13 PM PST US >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601HD wing filet question >From: Bryan Martin > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin > >on 6/27/04 6:51 PM, wizard-24@juno.com at wizard-24@juno.com wrote: > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: wizard-24@juno.com > > > > > >> What did you use to crimp the cables with? > > > > Joe, there's an inexpensive nicropress swaging tool (I think all the > > suppliers sell them) which you can use. It's slower than some of the > > bigger (more expensive) tools, but it does the job just fine. Here's the > > link to the Aircraft Spruce web site: > > > > http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/topages/swagingtool.php > > > > The one for 17 bucks works great. > > > >> Also, are you going to tension them with, perhaps, one of those $100 > >> tensionmeters? > > > > Not necessary, in my opinion. Just hand check for the proper deflection, > > and you're good to go. I plan to just be sure to check them regularly. > > > > Mike Fortunato > > 601XL > >I forgot about those swagers. They should work fine too. > > >-- >Bryan Martin >N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. >Construction complete. >Getting the paperwork in order. >do not archive. > > >________________________________ Message >20 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 05:20:44 PM PST US >From: Benford2@aol.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Benford2@aol.com > >In a message dated 6/27/2004 11:02:27 AM Mountain Daylight Time, >larrymc@qconline.com writes: > > > > accelerated quickly to a lift-off and proceeded to climb at 4500-4900 rpm. > > Passing over the end of the runway at 600-feet, the EIS light came on > and EGT > > > temps climbed to 1550-degrees F at 5000 rpm, which is well above the > > 1400-EGT limit, so I reduced throttle to 3500-rpm and requested an > immediate > > > clearance to land on 27. Tower cleared the approach, so I rolled the > plane into >a > > tight right turn and descended at 2000-rpm to a very good landing and ro! > > > >Tell us what engine you are running. If it is a computer controlled fuel >system then it needs to be able to richen the mixture automatically, if ya got >a >manual fuel control that should make it simple. Just feed the motor a little >more gas. I know this probably not have a direct bearing on your motor setup >but, on my 801 I am running a V-8 all aluminum Ford 347 cu .in. stroker water > >cooled motor. I have a Holley 500 cfm with a McNeilly mixture block on it to >regulate the fuel flow. I am running a single EGT probe 3" past where the four > >pipes merge onto the collector, which happens to the the absolute hottest >location in the exhaust system. On climb out I get 1600 f and in cruise it >runs > >1525f. I have been involved with racing engine R&D for years and this >scared me > >the first time. I have done several plug cuts, which is a way of reading the >color of the plugs accurately. It loves to run there and the plugs and piston >tops look great. The fuel burn in my 801 is really hard for even me to >believe. > >In cruise at 10,000 msl and 80 % power I am using 5.7 gph. I have been triple >checking this number on each fuel fill up and it appears to be fairly >correct. I know, I don't fully believe the numbers either. Let us know >your whole > >fuel and motor combo and maybe we can help ya. Oh yeah, Isn't that first >flight > >the most amazing feeling in the world????????? > >Ben Haas N801BH Jackson Hole Wy. > > >________________________________ Message >21 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 05:25:58 PM PST US >From: "Larry McFarland" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" > > > > > > Larry- Great work!! Congrats. I've been following your progress for the > > past several years, and am very happy you have reached your goal. > > > > Al Young > > 601XL- 80% > > > > Do not archive > >Thank you Al, >I'm still in a buz at having flown. The 601s a great little plane to fly. >It's good manners and handling make one feel really safe. >Hang in there and your turn will come .......and it's worth it. > >Larry > > >________________________________ Message >22 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 05:40:37 PM PST US >From: Joemotis@aol.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > >Thanks for the enjoyment that your site has given me through the years!! And >was definitely part of the decision process for committing to Zenith >Aircraft and the 601. > >Congratulations for a job seen through >And a job well done > >Joe Motis > >Do not archive > > >________________________________ Message >23 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 06:15:02 PM PST US >From: "Larry McFarland" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" > > >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Benford2@aol.com > > > > In a message dated 6/27/2004 11:02:27 AM Mountain Daylight Time, > > larrymc@qconline.com writes: > > > > > > > accelerated quickly to a lift-off and proceeded to climb at 4500-4900 >rpm. > > > Passing over the end of the runway at 600-feet, the EIS light came on >and EGT > > > temps climbed to 1550-degrees F at 5000 rpm, which is well above the > > > 1400-EGT limit, so I reduced throttle to 3500-rpm and requested an >immediate > > > clearance to land on 27. Tower cleared the approach, so I rolled the >plane into a > > > tight right turn and descended at 2000-rpm to a very good landing and >ro! > > > > > > > Tell us what engine you are running. If it is a computer controlled fuel > > system then it needs to be able to richen the mixture automatically, if ya >got a > > manual fuel control that should make it simple. Just feed the motor a >little > > more gas. Let us know your whole > > fuel and motor combo and maybe we can help ya. Oh yeah, Isn't that first >flight > > the most amazing feeling in the world????????? > > > > Ben Haas N801BH Jackson Hole Wy. > > > Ben, > This is an EA-81 Stratus with RAM Performance heads, electronic ignition, >Bing 64-3 CV type carburators and a warp drive prop set to 13 degrees. Ron >at Ram suggests the clips should be moved to >enrich the mixture. Within archives Frank suggested that he was going to >change jet sizes. Jim Weston suggested the timing should be adjusted to >enrich and even the rpm difference between ignition A and B. >This engine is an aluminum 4-cylinder Subaru with shaved heads, larger >pistons and develops 110 hp at 5400 per Stratus advertising. I've got to >order the Bing manual and study each of these elements because I'm not a >great engine-guy, just a retired designer. Oh, the EGT probes are 3-1/2" >downstream of the exhaust ports and 1400-degrees F is a max point where >1250-deg F is supposed to be optimum. > >Yes, this 601HDS is a great experience. The feel is much better than the >commercial planes I've been >flying and I really feel safe in this one. It's handling seems like an >extension of my mind. >(No wonder its a slow plane). > >Thanks again Ben, > >Larry McFarland - 601HDS pictures at www.macsmachine.com > > >________________________________ Message >24 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 06:45:39 PM PST US >From: Rick >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Rick > > >Ahhh... the Zero Defect program, I remember it well. I was on the ZD >committee myself quite a few years ago (time goes so fast). Next time >you see your Dad ask him if a plane was ever actually built with Zero >Defects. Then ask him how many dollars were spent trying to achieve it ;) > >Rick P. > > >Joemotis@aol.com wrote: > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > > > > Hi Rick > > > > How is this for coincidence, My Dad graduated from Northrop, taught at > > Northrop and retired from Lockheed with 35 years of sevice. And, in the > early > > > years of his career, was a draftsman. He also taught mechanical > drawing at >at De > > Anza College for a few years before his retirement from Lockheed. And > > finally, in his last ten years before his retirement he was a > mainstay in the > > > Lockheed Zero Defects program. So this probably has something to do > with my >view > > of the errors etc. in the prints and photo guides that cause > me frustration. > > > Certainly, nothing we cannot work through though. And especially with > all the > > > great feedback that comes from you and the other contributors to this > great > > > list. > > > > Cheers > > > > Joe Motis > > > > > > >________________________________ Message >25 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 06:54:13 PM PST US >From: "Larry McFarland" >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: First Flight for N601EZ > > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > > > > Thanks for the enjoyment that your site has given me through the years!! >And > > was definitely part of the decision process for committing to Zenith > > Aircraft and the 601. > > > > Congratulations for a job seen through > > And a job well done > > > > Joe Motis > > > > Do not archive > >Thank you Joe, >This site isn't going anywhere for a few years, but I'm pleased you've found >it useful. The 601's a great little plane and it's going to see some real >time >when the EGTs are resolved. > >Thanks again, > >Larry > > >________________________________ Message >26 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 07:30:26 PM PST US >From: Joemotis@aol.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: 601XL Build Order > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com > >"Ahhh... the Zero Defect program, I remember it well." You've got it! I >guess my whole point on this lengthy,and sometimes humourus post is attention > >to detail. >Nothing more, >nothing less. > >And remember the next time that you are sittihg on the pot; > >" the job is not finished until the paperwork is done" > >Joe Motis >601XL > >Do not archive > > >________________________________ Message >27 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 11:10:17 PM PST US >From: "j.breit" >Subject: Zenith-List: Stratus Oil Filter > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "j.breit" > >The oil filter provided with my Stratus engine is a WIX # 51065. WIX has >supposedly >superseded this filter with a longer filter that interferes with the engine >mount when mounting. The NAPA part number for this filter (which is also >longer >and interferes) is 1056. Does anyone know of an equivalent filter that is >the shorter length of the original WIX filter or have another solution to the >problem? > > >________________________________ Message >28 ____________________________________ > > >Time: 11:15:14 PM PST US >From: "j.breit" >Subject: Zenith-List: Stratst Oil Filter > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "j.breit" > >BlankThe oil filter provided with my Stratus engine is a WIX # 51065. The only >replacements I can find (e.g. NAPA # 1056) are longer and interfere with >the engine >mount when being installed. The WIX filter has supposedly been superseded >by this longer filter. I talked to Stratus and their recommendation was a >remote >filter mount. Are other Stratus owners having this problem and if so how >are they solving? > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 08:35:58 AM PST US From: "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Engine testing, Stratus Subaru --> Zenith-List message posted by: "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" Firstly I would check your primary coil resistance...It should be aroung 1.1 ohms. A number of coils have dropped to 0.5 ohms and this doubles the current the chip has to switch...This will instantly blow a ND ignitor chip...At $287 a pop that's an expensive path. Your ickup coil is probably just fine so you can go get a NAPA TP 45 (about $50) ignition module, hook it up to the PU coil and you will have an almost bullet proof ignition system. In fact I put both my primary and secondary system inside the distributor when the Stratus crank fired kit died. I strongly recommend you send your cylinder heads to Ram Performance for instalation of stepped inlet valve guides. My 601 HDS empty weight is 683lb. Frank -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Martin Subject: Zenith-List: Engine testing, Stratus Subaru --> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin --> I took a couple of weeks off recently to finish the construction of my 601XL. I=B9ve got it all assembled now and just about ready for inspection. When I started testing the engine, I discovered that the primary ignition system wouldn=B9t work. I isolated the problem to the units inside the distributor, this is the Nippon Denso pickup and control module. I had a heck of a time finding a replacement, the most of the auto parts stores said they couldn=B9t get it any more. I checked the local junkyards with no luck. I started searching on-line and finally found two part numbers by referencing a 1982 Subaru 1800 standard engine =B3module and pick-up=B2 or =B3pick-up/stator=B2 (searching for an =B3ignition control module=B2 failed to find the right part). The parts listed were Borg/Warner ME579 and Beck/Arnley 100258. The picture of the Borg/Warner part looked exactly like the unit from my engine but I found out that it was no longer available. There was no picture of the Beck/Arnley unit but I ordered one and it worked. If anybody is interested, I found these parts at partsamerica.com (Action Auto) and autoparts.com. I have the Warp drive 73=B2 three blade prop. Mykal recommended 17 1/2 degrees of pitch and 5000 RPM on take-off. With 17 degrees, I could only get 4500 RPM static. When I re-pitch the prop for 15 degrees I could still only get 4600 static. Re-reading Mykal=B9s message I realize he didn=B9t say static RPM but said 5000 on take-off. For those using the Subaru with this prop, does 4500 to 4600 static RPM sound right or should I have 5000 static? I=B9m also wondering how heavy your airplanes were with this engine. Zenith claims an empty weight under 700 pounds with the Jabiru or Rotax with minimal panel. My preliminary weight was around 820. I expected it to be on the heavy side with the heavier engine, full panel and interior, but I was surprised at the numbers I=B9m getting. I=B9m getting very close to launching this sucker, just have a bunch of paperwork to finish and a little more testing. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. Construction complete. Getting the paperwork in order. do not archive. advertising on the Matronics Forums. ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 12:01:41 PM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Stratus Oil Filter From: Bryan Martin --> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin on 6/28/04 2:03 AM, j.breit at j.breit@comcast.net wrote: > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "j.breit" > > The oil filter provided with my Stratus engine is a WIX # 51065. WIX has > supposedly superseded this filter with a longer filter that interferes with > the engine mount when mounting. The NAPA part number for this filter (which is > also longer and interferes) is 1056. Does anyone know of an equivalent filter > that is the shorter length of the original WIX filter or have another solution > to the problem? > I just ordered 10 of the Wix 51065 filters from www.autopart.com for $6.29 each plus $9.98 shipping. WWW.partsamerica.com also had them in stock for $9.28. The Briggs and Stratton filters are $9.99 at Tractor Supply. I've seen them for as low as $6.66 plus shipping if you buy 12. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. Construction complete. Getting the paperwork in order. do not archive. ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 01:55:44 PM PST US From: "Bill Howerton" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Axel Drilling and mounting --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton" Based upon this discussion,l drilled and installed my main-gear axels and main gear this weekend. As Bryan mentioned, it seems to work best if you drill the holes such that base of the axel is flush with the bottom of the leg - it does require that you file a little bit of the corner of the leg away to get the brake assembly on, but not too much. Now that my plane is finally sitting on its gear, I feel like I've hit a major milestone. I've removed the worktable (temporarily) from the garage, and will complete my fuselage work while it's on it's gear. I also finally got around to posting the many photos that had been backlogged in my camera. If your interested, go to my website at http://bill.howerton.com/zodiac/zodiac_main.htm Bill ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 02:29:35 PM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Axel Drilling and mounting From: Bryan Martin --> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin on 6/28/04 4:54 PM, Bill Howerton at Bill@Howerton.com wrote: > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton" > > Based upon this discussion,l drilled and installed my main-gear axels and > main gear this weekend. As Bryan mentioned, it seems to work best if you > drill the holes such that base of the axel is flush with the bottom of the > leg - it does require that you file a little bit of the corner of the leg > away to get the brake assembly on, but not too much. > > http://bill.howerton.com/zodiac/zodiac_main.htm Looks like you've got your brake calipers mounted upside down. The bleeder valve should be on the bottom and the brake line fitting coming in the top. No big deal to fix though, just swap them left side to right side and vice versa. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. Construction complete. Getting the paperwork in order. do not archive. ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 02:45:47 PM PST US From: "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Axel Drilling and mounting --> Zenith-List message posted by: "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" Eh what? Really? So how does one bleed the air out if the bleeder is on the bottom? I'm sure mine are on the top in my HDS? Frank -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Martin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Axel Drilling and mounting --> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin --> on 6/28/04 4:54 PM, Bill Howerton at Bill@Howerton.com wrote: > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton" > > Based upon this discussion,l drilled and installed my main-gear axels > and main gear this weekend. As Bryan mentioned, it seems to work best > if you drill the holes such that base of the axel is flush with the > bottom of the leg - it does require that you file a little bit of the > corner of the leg away to get the brake assembly on, but not too much. > > http://bill.howerton.com/zodiac/zodiac_main.htm Looks like you've got your brake calipers mounted upside down. The bleeder valve should be on the bottom and the brake line fitting coming in the top. No big deal to fix though, just swap them left side to right side and vice versa. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. Construction complete. Getting the paperwork in order. do not archive. advertising on the Matronics Forums. ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 02:46:49 PM PST US From: "Bill Howerton" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Axel Drilling and mounting --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton" oops -- I thought that the blue plastic cover was the bleeder valve and the small fitting was the brake line fitting -- oh well.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bryan Martin" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Axel Drilling and mounting > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin > > on 6/28/04 4:54 PM, Bill Howerton at Bill@Howerton.com wrote: > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton" > > > > Based upon this discussion,l drilled and installed my main-gear axels and > > main gear this weekend. As Bryan mentioned, it seems to work best if you > > drill the holes such that base of the axel is flush with the bottom of the > > leg - it does require that you file a little bit of the corner of the leg > > away to get the brake assembly on, but not too much. > > > > http://bill.howerton.com/zodiac/zodiac_main.htm > > Looks like you've got your brake calipers mounted upside down. The bleeder > valve should be on the bottom and the brake line fitting coming in the top. > No big deal to fix though, just swap them left side to right side and vice > versa. > > > -- > Bryan Martin > N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. > Construction complete. > Getting the paperwork in order. > do not archive. > > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 04:38:22 PM PST US From: "Chris Boultinghouse" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Chris Boultinghouse" Chuck, The Jabiru reps recommend that you monitor *all* of the CHT's, as there is no way to know which will be the hottest. No two installations are the same in regards to cooling, so it's pure luck of the draw. If you end up monitoring a "cool" one, you could fry a head without even knowing it. As such, I purchased the EIS 6000 for my Jabiru 3300. Regards, Chris Boultinghouse Austin, TX Sonex N260SX (reserved) http://sonex260.wheelsup.org > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of > charles.long@gm.com > Sent: Monday, June 28, 2004 8:59 AM > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Subject: Zenith-List: Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: charles.long@gm.com > > Question for those of you with the Jab 3300 fire wall forward > package from ZAC. I have the Engine Information System from Grand Rapids > with two CHT & 2 EGT probes. Have any of you measured the variation in > temps from front to back cylinders and what cylinders run the hottest. > Normally it would be the rear ones, but no substitute for actual data. > Thanks in advance for you feedback. > > Chuck Long > getting close! > Jab 3300 HDS, N601LE ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 05:02:20 PM PST US From: "cgalley" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Axel Drilling and mounting --> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" You don't. Standard aircraft bleeding is done by pumping fluid in the bottom due to the generally large vertical difference between brake cylinder and master. This pushes all the air to the top. Cy Galley - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair Safety Programs Editor - TC EAA Sport Pilot ----- Original Message ----- From: "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Axel Drilling and mounting > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" > > Eh what? Really? > > So how does one bleed the air out if the bleeder is on the bottom? > > I'm sure mine are on the top in my HDS? > > Frank > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Martin > To: Zenith List > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Axel Drilling and mounting > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin > --> > > on 6/28/04 4:54 PM, Bill Howerton at Bill@Howerton.com wrote: > > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton" > > > > Based upon this discussion,l drilled and installed my main-gear axels > > and main gear this weekend. As Bryan mentioned, it seems to work best > > if you drill the holes such that base of the axel is flush with the > > bottom of the leg - it does require that you file a little bit of the > > corner of the leg away to get the brake assembly on, but not too much. > > > > http://bill.howerton.com/zodiac/zodiac_main.htm > > Looks like you've got your brake calipers mounted upside down. The bleeder > valve should be on the bottom and the brake line fitting coming in the top. > No big deal to fix though, just swap them left side to right side and vice > versa. > > > -- > Bryan Martin > N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. > Construction complete. > Getting the paperwork in order. > do not archive. > > > advertising on the Matronics Forums. > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 06:12:47 PM PST US From: Clmelenyzeriv@cs.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Gotta see this! --> Zenith-List message posted by: Clmelenyzeriv@cs.com Where is the school and is there a contact at the school? C. L. Melenyzer IV 601XL 15% Do not archive ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 06:17:35 PM PST US From: Joemotis@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Gotta see this! --> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com Here you go! _http://www.zenithair.com/misc/SCH-EAA406-3.html_ (http://www.zenithair.com/misc/SCH-EAA406-3.html) Joe Motis Do not archive ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 08:42:16 PM PST US From: "Jim Fosse" Subject: Zenith-List: Hole Finder --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Fosse" I've been around tools for over 60 years and thought I knew a bit about the various ones. However, ZAC has thrown me a curve telling me I will need a "hole finder" to finish the wings on the 701. Can anyone give me a source for a hole finder? Or, alternatively, plans for making one. For anyone starting a project, I would suggest adding extended length drill bits, numbers 20, 30 and 40. They sure come in handy. Jim Fosse CH701, Rudder, horizontal stab, elevator and firewall finished, left wing skeleton finished and ribs installed on the right wing spar. Still trying to decide on an engine. ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 08:58:52 PM PST US From: "Chuck Deiterich" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Hole Finder --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Chuck Deiterich" Jim, I made my own hole finder and used it a lot. I'll take a photo tomorrow and send it to you. By the way Tony Bingelis said to use a # 21 for 5/32 rivets, which I did and the rivets fit very snug. Chuck D. N701TX Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Fosse" Subject: Zenith-List: Hole Finder > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Fosse" > > I've been around tools for over 60 years and thought I knew a bit about the various ones. However, ZAC has thrown me a curve telling me I will need a "hole finder" to finish the wings on the 701. Can anyone give me a source for a hole finder? Or, alternatively, plans for making one. > > For anyone starting a project, I would suggest adding extended length drill bits, numbers 20, 30 and 40. They sure come in handy. ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 09:28:55 PM PST US From: Joemotis@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Hole Finder --> Zenith-List message posted by: Joemotis@aol.com Hi Jim I found these while browsing one day, does not look like it would be hard to duplicate. _http://yardstore.com/tools/strap.htm_ (http://yardstore.com/tools/strap.htm) Joe Motis 601XL Do not archive ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 10:21:14 PM PST US From: "Kevin W Bonds" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: U.S.A Trip --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kevin W Bonds" Dave Dave did you use the CAD drawings I sent you to make your blocks? I never heard anything from you about them. Did you get them? I made a comment in an earlier message that you owed me one, and you didn't seem to know what I was talking about. I meant to email you again to explain but didn't. Kevin Bonds Nashville Tn Zenithair Zodiac 601XL plansbuilder; rudder complete; almost done with forming blocks; making parts for elevator ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave & Darlene" Subject: Zenith-List: U.S.A Trip > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave & Darlene" > > The wife and I decided it was time for a bit of a break and we're heading south. We'll be heading into the USA at the bottom end of Alberta, head down towards Vegas for a couple days, then head back up the coast towards Vancouver. This is are intended route but may change. The reason I'm posting this is because I'll be in the market for picking up some metal if I can find out where I can grab it in short notice as we're leaving monday night. It's going to be a quick trip as time is limited. I would consider buying off one of you builders. E-mail me off line if you have a suggestion. > > Dave (Alberta) > dnimigon@telusplanet.net > XL Plans Only > Rudder & Stab parts almost made > Wing forms done > Waiting on more metal > 99% to go > > ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 10:47:04 PM PST US From: "jennifer" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Engine testing, Stratus Subaru --> Zenith-List message posted by: "jennifer" Please unsubscribe anything that ends with @hdip.org It is urgent. Thanks. -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1) Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Engine testing, Stratus Subaru --> Zenith-List message posted by: "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" --> Firstly I would check your primary coil resistance...It should be aroung 1.1 ohms. A number of coils have dropped to 0.5 ohms and this doubles the current the chip has to switch...This will instantly blow a ND ignitor chip...At $287 a pop that's an expensive path. Your ickup coil is probably just fine so you can go get a NAPA TP 45 (about $50) ignition module, hook it up to the PU coil and you will have an almost bullet proof ignition system. In fact I put both my primary and secondary system inside the distributor when the Stratus crank fired kit died. I strongly recommend you send your cylinder heads to Ram Performance for instalation of stepped inlet valve guides. My 601 HDS empty weight is 683lb. Frank -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Martin Subject: Zenith-List: Engine testing, Stratus Subaru --> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin --> I took a couple of weeks off recently to finish the construction of my 601XL. I=B9ve got it all assembled now and just about ready for inspection. When I started testing the engine, I discovered that the primary ignition system wouldn=B9t work. I isolated the problem to the units inside the distributor, this is the Nippon Denso pickup and control module. I had a heck of a time finding a replacement, the most of the auto parts stores said they couldn=B9t get it any more. I checked the local junkyards with no luck. I started searching on-line and finally found two part numbers by referencing a 1982 Subaru 1800 standard engine =B3module and pick-up=B2 or =B3pick-up/stator=B2 (searching for an =B3ignition control module=B2 failed to find the right part). The parts listed were Borg/Warner ME579 and Beck/Arnley 100258. The picture of the Borg/Warner part looked exactly like the unit from my engine but I found out that it was no longer available. There was no picture of the Beck/Arnley unit but I ordered one and it worked. If anybody is interested, I found these parts at partsamerica.com (Action Auto) and autoparts.com. I have the Warp drive 73=B2 three blade prop. Mykal recommended 17 1/2 degrees of pitch and 5000 RPM on take-off. With 17 degrees, I could only get 4500 RPM static. When I re-pitch the prop for 15 degrees I could still only get 4600 static. Re-reading Mykal=B9s message I realize he didn=B9t say static RPM but said 5000 on take-off. For those using the Subaru with this prop, does 4500 to 4600 static RPM sound right or should I have 5000 static? I=B9m also wondering how heavy your airplanes were with this engine. Zenith claims an empty weight under 700 pounds with the Jabiru or Rotax with minimal panel. My preliminary weight was around 820. I expected it to be on the heavy side with the heavier engine, full panel and interior, but I was surprised at the numbers I=B9m getting. I=B9m getting very close to launching this sucker, just have a bunch of paperwork to finish and a little more testing. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. Construction complete. Getting the paperwork in order. do not archive. advertising on the Matronics Forums. == direct advertising on the Matronics Forums. == == == ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 11:50:28 PM PST US From: xl Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Jab 3300 in HDS, CHT & EGT question --> Zenith-List message posted by: xl Well, I'm probably dumb.... but I used the 2 CHT probes supplied in the FWF kit. Yeah, it'd be nice to have 6 but I don't. I put one on number 1 and one on #6. There is definitely a difference. Number 1 is cooler than #6. This matters when you are descending. During my flight testing sometimes I'd climb like a bat out of hell for 8000+ feet and then glide for thousands and thousands of feet. You're not supposed to go full throttle below 212F. So I'd pull up before I had to start climbing and heat up #1 to 212F. It's worked so far - check back in awhile to see if my engine is still running. I read the RV list and those guys go through a lot to get all cylinders within +- 10F. I haven't tried. I know that if I go full throttle at <212F or run at >350F my engine may be damaged. So I watch a cooler and a warmer cylinder. My oil temp tends to get high before my CHT does - except on the ground (Maybe different now - see next paragraph). On that subject - check out the Jabiru site for info about the size of (http://www.usjabiru.com/Tech%20Tips.htm#Head Cooling) oil cooler hole (no dimensions are called out in the plans). I cut mine based on the photo guide picture (~3.5" x 5"). I have since made the hole smaller and my oil temp and CHTs are lower. The hole is now about 3 x 3.5 inches. Closer to the 1" x 4" Jabiru recommends - but still >2x. I plan to mask a bit more off and see what happens (I was feeling my way through this - what did I know??). Turns out the larger hole increases the pressure in the lower cowling and restricts air flow and hence cooling - it was counter intuitive to me until I understood. Joe N633Z @ BFI 60 hours On Mon, 28 Jun 2004 charles.long@gm.com wrote: > --> Zenith-List message posted by: charles.long@gm.com > Question for those of you with the Jab 3300 fire wall forward > package from ZAC. I have the Engine Information System from Grand Rapids > with two CHT & 2 EGT probes. Have any of you measured the variation in > temps from front to back cylinders and what cylinders run the hottest. > Normally it would be the rear ones, but no substitute for actual data. > Thanks in advance for you feedback. > Chuck Long > getting close! > Jab 3300 HDS, N601LE >