Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:12 AM - Re: Panel Design - suggestions welcome (howado)
2. 01:56 AM - Re: Re: Spring gear (Jo & Don Gordon)
3. 04:24 AM - panel design (The Minearts)
4. 04:42 AM - Re: Panel Design - suggestions welcome (Michel Therrien)
5. 04:52 AM - Feeling like a kid (Michel Therrien)
6. 06:08 AM - Re: Re: Spring gear (Larry McFarland)
7. 07:24 AM - Arm Rest 601XL (Scott Laughlin)
8. 09:35 AM - Re: panel design (bryanmmartin@comcast.net)
9. 11:58 AM - Re: panel design (Andrew SanClemente)
10. 12:46 PM - Re: panel design (Alejandro Roca)
11. 04:26 PM - Re: panel design (Lance Gingell)
12. 04:28 PM - Re: panel design (Lance Gingell)
13. 04:40 PM - Re: Panel Design (Jeff Small)
14. 08:53 PM - Re: panel design (Alejandro Roca)
15. 09:19 PM - Re: panel design (Alejandro Roca)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Design - suggestions welcome |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: howado <howado@cwia.com>
Peter,
do you have a cost estimate for your panel instruments?
Does the Power Distribution unit use circuit breakers?
Howard Carter
Peter Mather wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Peter Mather" <peter@mather.com>
>
> I'm just getting some building work done on the house to create space
> before ordering an XL. In the mean time much plotting and planning :-)
>
> I've got some avionics from previous aircraft that I've upgraded and have
> been looking at trying to get a sensible cost/functionality balance on new
> kit to buy.
>
> My current panel design is shown on:
> http://www.airplane.org.uk/zenith_zodiac_601xl.htm
>
> I would welcome any comments on what you like, what you don't and any issues
> with practicality.
>
> Still haven't chosen between the Jabiru and Rotax but leaning towards the
> Jabiru.
>
> Best Regards
>
> Peter
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> __________ NOD32 1.882 (20041002) Information __________
>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> http://www.nod32.com
>
>
>
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jo & Don Gordon" <djgordon@bigpond.net.au>
Hi fellow builder,
it has finally happened after 3 years of tweeking bending filling sanding
3 dec 2004 my CH701 reg 19-4110 flew for the firt time
WHAT A BUZZ FANTASTIC
the plane is so easy to fly and stable on the ground
still getting over the feeling
> >
> >
> > _______________________________
> > Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
> > http://vote.yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 3
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "The Minearts" <smineart@kdsi.net>
glad to see some discussion on panel layout. I have been wondering which switches,
etc. need to be accessible to the Left hand when the Y-stick is used, especially
if the plane is to be used much as a trainer. Any thoughts or experiences
that would be helpful?
Steve Mineart
601XL, wings, tail done, fuse 2/3
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Design - suggestions welcome |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien <mtherr@yahoo.com>
The panel looks "fairly" complete for the purpose.
However, I noticed that some critical components are
missing:
. CD Player
. Satellite telephone system
. Television (Satellite) and in-flight entertainment
system.
. A Radar altimeter is critical and so would be the
TCAS (sure you don't have that on the bench
somewhere?)
. I would never fly in a 601 XL without a weather
radar on board... these storms can come so fast you
know?)
. I believe that there are electronic check list
devices that could be useful as well.
Michel :-)
do not archive
--- Peter Mather <peter@mather.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Peter Mather"
> <peter@mather.com>
>
> I'm just getting some building work done on the
> house to create space
> before ordering an XL. In the mean time much
> plotting and planning :-)
>
> I've got some avionics from previous aircraft that
> I've upgraded and have
> been looking at trying to get a sensible
> cost/functionality balance on new
> kit to buy.
>
> My current panel design is shown on:
> http://www.airplane.org.uk/zenith_zodiac_601xl.htm
>
> I would welcome any comments on what you like, what
> you don't and any issues
> with practicality.
>
> Still haven't chosen between the Jabiru and Rotax
> but leaning towards the
> Jabiru.
>
> Best Regards
>
> Peter
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
__________________________________
Message 5
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| Subject: | Feeling like a kid |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien <mtherr@yahoo.com>
I now realize how much patience is needed for building
aircrafts.
When I ordered my plans in december 1998, I thought
that all would be done by 2001. Well, I got released
of the flight restrictions on September 8th, after
completing the 25 hours of flight testing. OH.. did I
suggest that "I" completed the test flights?
NO... for all summer, I looked at my aircraft from the
ground as my friend was doing the test flights... I am
not a pilot. My only hands-on enjoyment was to make
corrections and improvements to the plane between
flights. Of course, I was proud of seeing the plane
in the air.
Only after I got the special certificate of
airworthiness for amateur-built aircrafts could I
board the plane as a passenger... for a few rides.
Then, my pilot introduced my instructor to the 601 so
I could take flying lessons on my own plane. Again, I
was on the ground waiting for this to be done and
hoping that weather would allow them to do this as
fast as possible... due to the availability
restrictions of both men, it took them three weeks to
do 5 hours of flights. BUT IT IS DONE!
Yesterday, my instructor being nervous because only I
have brake controls, made me do some taxiing,
accelerating and braking exercises yesterday for 45
minutes.
And TODAY, if weather permits, I will take control my
own plane for my first official practical training
session. (I had a familiarization flight with the
flight school owner a few weeks ago).
I feel like a little kid to who we give a long-awaited
for present.
Michel
do not archive
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
__________________________________
Message 6
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" <larrymc@qconline.com>
Congratulations on your first flight
It's got to be a real high for you
Fly safe
Larry McFarland
Do not archive
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jo & Don Gordon"
> <djgordon@bigpond.net.au>
> Hi fellow builder,
> it has finally happened after 3 years of tweeking bending filling sanding
> 3 dec 2004 my CH701 reg 19-4110 flew for the firt time
> WHAT A BUZZ FANTASTIC
> the plane is so easy to fly and stable on the ground
> still getting over the feeling
>
Message 7
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Scott Laughlin" <cookwithgas@hotmail.com>
Fellow XL builders:
This weekend I had plans to fabricate and install the arm rest and move on
to some other fuselage construction. I found out the arm rest is a fairly
difficult installation and took most of my weekend work time. The plans and
assembly manual are very brief on this item. I saw no way to make sure the
thing was true and square if I just installed the parts according to the
manual.
I used my table saw to make a true and square jig and built the armrest
around this. I drilled right into the wood and installed the clecos into
the wood jig. The jig is made from scrap pressboard shelving. MDF would
have worked, but I used what I had. My table saw allowed me to make sure the
top was square with the bottom and the width was the same for the top and
bottom. The rear angle was "tweaked" for an exact fit in my airplane.
Here's a photo of the jig:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/10_2_04_CenterJig.jpg
And a day later, here it is with everything cleco'd in place:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/10_3_04_CenterJig.jpg
Another advantage to having the jig is that you can drill the first few
holes in the "L" angles, then lift the whole thing out, lay it on the
workbench and drill the remaining holes nice and straight. The first few
have to be angled to fit in tight areas. Same with the holes down into the
fuselage -just lift out the jig and leave the L-angles in place and drill
straight down.
I am making this post in hopes that it will help someone trying to decide
how to install this part. I lost at least an hour trying to decide if I
needed a jig or not. The manual just shows photos of the L-angles being
installed, then attaching the armrest. Easier said than done.
The scary thing is that I only have three or four fuselage drawings to
de-cipher for my project.
Good luck and happy building,
Scott Laughlin
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: panel design |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: bryanmmartin@comcast.net
I have my trim and flap controls on the stick. If I didn't have the flap switch
on the stick I would put it within easy reach of my left hand. You don't want
to be reaching around for the flap switch on short final. I have my master switch,
ignition selector switch and fuel pump selector switch on the left end of
an aluminum channel mounted under the standard panel.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
In phase I testing.
do not archive
-------------- Original message --------------
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "The Minearts"
>
> glad to see some discussion on panel layout. I have been wondering which
> switches, etc. need to be accessible to the Left hand when the Y-stick is used,
> especially if the plane is to be used much as a trainer. Any thoughts or
> experiences that would be helpful?
> Steve Mineart
> 601XL, wings, tail done, fuse 2/3
I have my trim and flap controls on the stick. If I didn't have the flap switch
on the stick I would put it within easy reach of my left hand. You don't want
to be reaching around for the flap switch on short final. I have my master switch,
ignition selector switch and fuel pump selector switch on the left end of
an aluminum channel mounted under the standard panel.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
In phase I testing.
do not archive
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Zenith-List message posted by: "The Minearts" <SMINEART@KDSI.NET>
glad to see some discussion on panel layout. I have been wondering which
switches, etc. need to be accessible to the Left hand when the Y-stick is used,
especially if the plane is to be used much as a trainer. Any thoughts or
experiences that would be helpful?
Steve Mineart
601XL, wings, tail done, fuse 2/3
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: panel design |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Andrew SanClemente <ansancle@townisp.com>
For switches, you might want to think about putting the following on
the left :
Fuel Pumps
Ignition toggles (for backup ignition if installed)
Radios/Nav equipment (don't want to be switching hands to change a
freq or squawk)
Landing Lights
Im sure others can think of more.
The only other suggestion I would have is to think about the type of
flying you plan on doing and only install what you need. Every piece
of equipment adds complexity to your panel in terms of installation
and wiring. It also adds to the total draw, make sure your
alternator/generator/etc... can power all of your instruments and
still have enough juice left to charge your battery.
I installed a moderately full panel and actually removed equipment
during final installation as I felt it was unnecessary and just added
weight. Im a good weather only VFR pilot and didn't need a bunch of
the stuff I had originally planned for.
That all being said to each his own, and if you want all that stuff
put it in! It sure looks very cool!
- Andy
601 HDS Stratus Subaru
For switches, you might want to think about putting the following on the left
:
Fuel Pumps
Ignition toggles (for backup ignition if installed)
Radios/Nav equipment (don't want to be switching hands to change a freq or squawk)
Landing Lights
Im sure others can think of more.
The only other suggestion I would have is to think about the type of flying you
plan on doing and only install what you need. Every piece of equipment adds
complexity to your panel in terms of installation and wiring. It also adds to
the total draw, make sure your alternator/generator/etc... can power all of your
instruments and still have enough juice left to charge your battery.
I installed a moderately full panel and actually removed equipment during final
installation as I felt it was unnecessary and just added weight. Im a good weather
only VFR pilot and didn't need a bunch of the stuff I had originally planned
for.
That all being said to each his own, and if you want all that stuff put it in!
It sure looks very cool!
- Andy
601 HDS Stratus Subaru
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: panel design |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Alejandro Roca <alex_roca@mac.com>
Steve
One thing you might want to consider is building a couple of sub-panels. I had
planned in the early stages to use up all the instrument panel space, but then
realized that things were not logistically in the right place. This forced
me to build a couple of sub-panels. If you are not too big in size you will appreciate
the extra panel space. I ended putting the air vents, throttle, cabin
heat and flap switch on these panels. See pics at:
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/pm.cgi?login=Alex_Roca&action=display&private=&
If you can't get to it through this hyperlink, go to Zenith's builders database
(Texas) and look for me
Alex Roca
601 XL - Jabiru 3300
90% complete and 90% to go !
On Monday, October 04, 2004, at 06:32AM, The Minearts <smineart@kdsi.net> wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "The Minearts" <smineart@kdsi.net>
>
>glad to see some discussion on panel layout. I have been wondering which switches,
etc. need to be accessible to the Left hand when the Y-stick is used, especially
if the plane is to be used much as a trainer. Any thoughts or experiences
that would be helpful?
>Steve Mineart
>601XL, wings, tail done, fuse 2/3
>
Message 11
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Lance Gingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
Alex,
Is that the Grand Rapids EFIS in your panel? How do you like it (on the
ground I guess) so far? I've been wondering whether to go Grand
Rapids/Blue Mountain (lite) /Dynon. Did you get the internal GPS option?
All: These panel picture postings in this thread are great. The more the
merrier!
..lance
Tail complete, wings 99% complete. About to start on Fuselage ...and of
course, the panel!
http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Alejandro
Roca
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: panel design
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Alejandro Roca <alex_roca@mac.com>
Steve
One thing you might want to consider is building a couple of
sub-panels. I had planned in the early stages to use up all the
instrument panel space, but then realized that things were not
logistically in the right place. This forced me to build a couple of
sub-panels. If you are not too big in size you will appreciate the extra
panel space. I ended putting the air vents, throttle, cabin heat and
flap switch on these panels. See pics at:
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/pm.cgi?login=Alex_Roca&action=display&
private=&
If you can't get to it through this hyperlink, go to Zenith's builders
database (Texas) and look for me
Alex Roca
601 XL - Jabiru 3300
90% complete and 90% to go !
Message 12
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Lance Gingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
More questions for you Alex...
Is that the Jabiru FWF kit you have? Or the older Zenith one?
I see a throttle on the left, is that a vernier? And is the one on the
right a throttle too?
Cheers,
..lance
http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Alejandro
Roca
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: panel design
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Alejandro Roca <alex_roca@mac.com>
Steve
One thing you might want to consider is building a couple of
sub-panels. I had planned in the early stages to use up all the
instrument panel space, but then realized that things were not
logistically in the right place. This forced me to build a couple of
sub-panels. If you are not too big in size you will appreciate the extra
panel space. I ended putting the air vents, throttle, cabin heat and
flap switch on these panels. See pics at:
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/pm.cgi?login=Alex_Roca&action=display&
private=&
If you can't get to it through this hyperlink, go to Zenith's builders
database (Texas) and look for me
Alex Roca
601 XL - Jabiru 3300
90% complete and 90% to go !
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Design |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jeff Small" <zodiacjeff@msn.com>
>> I would welcome any comments on what you like, what you don't and
>> any issues with practicality.
>Other than the panel probably costing as much as the whole airframe,
>looks good to me. :)
Mike, I'd bet it come$ in at almost twice the airframe, and ju$t how practical
i$ money?
While it's fun to plan when you're in the preliminary stages, this is a 601 for
cripes sakes! If you want a panel like this and have the coin for it, then build
an RV.
The panel is an intensely personal connection to your a/c, and I repeat, INTENSELY!
Don't take anyone else's advice but rather spend hours and hours sitting
in your partially completed fuse and run through all the routine movements that
bring about interaction with the equipment you are certain, certain you need.
Move from there to cut 'n paste with pictures of instruments (the SkySports
catalogue is a good source) on the blank panel bulkhead.
I'll resist the urge to tell you to keep it simple (whoops!)
tailwinds jeff
do not archive
Message 14
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Alejandro Roca <alex_roca@mac.com>
Lance
Yes. I have the FWF kit from Jabiru (the new and upgraded). I must say that I am
very happy with it. I went with the Vernier throttle option on the left sub-panel
and I put the cabin heat in the right sub-panel.
On Monday, October 04, 2004, at 06:38PM, Lance Gingell <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Lance Gingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
>
>More questions for you Alex...
>
>Is that the Jabiru FWF kit you have? Or the older Zenith one?
>
>I see a throttle on the left, is that a vernier? And is the one on the
>right a throttle too?
>
>Cheers,
>..lance
>http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Alejandro
>Roca
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: panel design
>
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: Alejandro Roca <alex_roca@mac.com>
>
>Steve
>
> One thing you might want to consider is building a couple of
>sub-panels. I had planned in the early stages to use up all the
>instrument panel space, but then realized that things were not
>logistically in the right place. This forced me to build a couple of
>sub-panels. If you are not too big in size you will appreciate the extra
>panel space. I ended putting the air vents, throttle, cabin heat and
>flap switch on these panels. See pics at:
>
>http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/pm.cgi?login=Alex_Roca&action=display&
>private=&
>
>If you can't get to it through this hyperlink, go to Zenith's builders
>database (Texas) and look for me
>
>
>Alex Roca
>601 XL - Jabiru 3300
>90% complete and 90% to go !
>
>
Message 15
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Alejandro Roca <alex_roca@mac.com>
Lance
Yes. That is the Grand Rapids EFIS. I had originally planned to only have
a GPS mounted on the instrument panel (Garmin 196). After buying it and actually
building a panel mount, I decided it was just too small (way too much information
for such a small screen). Don't get me wrong, it's a great product but
I feel that it forces you to focus all your attention onto a very small area (you
need to have it either on your lap or hold it close enough to read) taking
away from your primary function, so mounting it on the instrument panel itself
was not a very practical ideas. Then I decided to get the multifunctional display
from Grand rapids (engine monitoring and moving map). I have connected the
196 with it and it works great. I plan to purchase the AHRS computer next year.
I really enjoy the size and simplicity of the screen layouts. Even though it's
a fairly new product, Grand Rapids has made many improvements and upgrades.
I am not IFR certified and I don't fully understand it's full functionality
but I figured it's something I will need in the future. Grand rapids is already
adding the capability of displaying traffic and also plans to add weather too.
Alex Roca
601 XL - Jabiru 3300
On Monday, October 04, 2004, at 06:38PM, Lance Gingell <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Lance Gingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
>
>Alex,
>
>Is that the Grand Rapids EFIS in your panel? How do you like it (on the
>ground I guess) so far? I've been wondering whether to go Grand
>Rapids/Blue Mountain (lite) /Dynon. Did you get the internal GPS option?
>
>All: These panel picture postings in this thread are great. The more the
>merrier!
>
>..lance
>Tail complete, wings 99% complete. About to start on Fuselage ...and of
>course, the panel!
>http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Alejandro
>Roca
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: panel design
>
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: Alejandro Roca <alex_roca@mac.com>
>
>Steve
>
> One thing you might want to consider is building a couple of
>sub-panels. I had planned in the early stages to use up all the
>instrument panel space, but then realized that things were not
>logistically in the right place. This forced me to build a couple of
>sub-panels. If you are not too big in size you will appreciate the extra
>panel space. I ended putting the air vents, throttle, cabin heat and
>flap switch on these panels. See pics at:
>
>http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/pm.cgi?login=Alex_Roca&action=display&
>private=&
>
>If you can't get to it through this hyperlink, go to Zenith's builders
>database (Texas) and look for me
>
>
>Alex Roca
>601 XL - Jabiru 3300
>90% complete and 90% to go !
>
>
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