Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:47 AM - Re: Tech Counselor (N5SL)
2. 06:10 AM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (N5SL)
3. 06:45 AM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (Frank Roskind)
4. 06:48 AM - Re: radiator cowel (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
5. 06:59 AM - Re: radiator cowel (Larry McFarland)
6. 06:59 AM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com)
7. 07:21 AM - Re: Re-setting wing incidence (Jim Frisby)
8. 07:55 AM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (Jeffrey J Paris)
9. 08:34 AM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (Mike H)
10. 09:29 AM - Re: 601XL FWF kit (Pete Krotje)
11. 09:37 AM - Corvair Firewall Forward (N5SL)
12. 09:44 AM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (Pete Krotje)
13. 10:00 AM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (Mike Fortunato)
14. 10:13 AM - Corvair list location (Brandon Tucker)
15. 10:41 AM - Re: Tech Counselor (Richard Hutson)
16. 10:45 AM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (Richard Hutson)
17. 11:05 AM - Re: Re: Re-setting wing incidence (Kent Brown)
18. 11:14 AM - Re: Corvair Firewall Forward (Mike Fortunato)
19. 12:29 PM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (Craig Payne)
20. 12:59 PM - Re: Re: Re-setting wing incidence (Dirk Slabbert)
21. 01:34 PM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit vs Corvair (Mike Fortunato)
22. 01:51 PM - Re: Re: Re-setting wing incidence (Eddie Seve)
23. 02:40 PM - Re: Re: Re-setting wing incidence (Kent Brown)
24. 03:13 PM - Re: Re: Re: Re-setting wing incidence (szewc@direcway.com)
25. 03:36 PM - Re: Tech counselor (Aileron Horn) (Matt & Jo)
26. 04:10 PM - Re: Re: Re: Re-setting wing incidence (David Alberti)
27. 04:44 PM - Carb question (gpjann@juno.com)
28. 05:28 PM - Re: Re: Re-setting wing incidence (Bryan Martin)
29. 05:37 PM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit (Bryan Martin)
30. 06:45 PM - Re: Re: Re: Re-setting wing incidence (Brandon Tucker)
31. 06:50 PM - Re: Jabiru FWF Kit vs Corvair (William Dominguez)
32. 07:33 PM - Re: Carb question (Paul Moore)
33. 07:41 PM - Re: Jabiru US certification (ron dewees)
34. 08:05 PM - Re: Re: Re-setting wing incidence (Leo Gates)
35. 08:07 PM - Jabiru 3300 on CH701 (Hal Rozema)
36. 09:21 PM - Re: Carb question (Craig Payne)
37. 10:17 PM - Prop leading edge options (Dabusmith@aol.com)
38. 10:46 PM - Back country flying trip (Dabusmith@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Tech Counselor |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Good Morning Don:
I didn't realize you were so close. I'm a member of EAA Chapter 80 in Omaha.
We meet the second Monday of each month at Hangar One at the Millard Airport (MLE).
I'm the only 601 builder amongst a lot of RV guys so it would be nice to
have you there for support. You are welcome to come by and see my "90% complete,
90% to go" 601XL project any time. If the wind ever calms down I could
use some help installing my wings for a test fit.
Mike Howard is our EAA Tech. Counselor and can be reached at acepilot59@aol.com.
Mike built an RV-6 a few years ago and might be able to zip over to Red Oak
to visit your project. I can give you his phone number if you would rather call
him.
Scott Laughlin
601XL/Corvair
Waiting on my Prop Hub from William Wynne
DO NOT ARCHIVE
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Don Mountain
Thanks Richard
I live just outside Red Oak, Iowa, in the SouthWest
corner. How would I contact one of these EAA members
for this service.
---------------------------------
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Hi Mike:
Can you share with me the reason for your change of heart. My Corvair engine is
almost done and I'm pretty happy with the installation so far. William Wynne
sells all the parts for a firewall forward kit and is supposed to have several
complete kits ready for Oshkosh in a few weeks.
Thanks,
Scott Laughlin
Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato
I've reluctantly made a recent decision to change
engine choices. I was planning to install a Corvair in
my 601XL, but recent circumstances have changed that
decision. Instead, I'm now looking into the Jabiru
3300 again. I'll have to pry my wallet a little
farther open, but I need to get this plane in the air!
So, does anyone know if there's a complete FWF kit for
the 601XL, and if so, is it provided by ZAC, or by a
US Jabiru dealer?
[Jeff Small, you still out there? You've always had
really good advice relating to that powerplant.]
Thanks,
Mike Fortunato
601XL
---------------------------------
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Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Frank Roskind" <frankroskind@hotmail.com>
Are builders getting different fly-off periods depeding on engine choice?
Is either the rotax or jabiru treated as a certificated engine in
determining fly-off period? Does the choice of propeller make a difference?
do not archive
From: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Jabiru FWF Kit
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Hi Mike:
Can you share with me the reason for your change of heart. My Corvair engine
is almost done and I'm pretty happy with the installation so far. William
Wynne sells all the parts for a firewall forward kit and is supposed to have
several complete kits ready for Oshkosh in a few weeks.
Thanks,
Scott Laughlin
Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato
I've reluctantly made a recent decision to change
engine choices. I was planning to install a Corvair in
my 601XL, but recent circumstances have changed that
decision. Instead, I'm now looking into the Jabiru
3300 again. I'll have to pry my wallet a little
farther open, but I need to get this plane in the air!
So, does anyone know if there's a complete FWF kit for
the 601XL, and if so, is it provided by ZAC, or by a
US Jabiru dealer?
[Jeff Small, you still out there? You've always had
really good advice relating to that powerplant.]
Thanks,
Mike Fortunato
601XL
---------------------------------
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Message 4
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
I believe NSI had a set up they developed (or is that copied) from a
friend of mine's airplane. Worked very well as I remember but it was
spendy.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave &
Doretta New
Subject: Zenith-List: radiator cowel
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave & Doretta New"
--> <ddnew@nebmail.com>
Zenith list
a wile back there was a posting and pictures where someone who had
pictures of his install of a P51 style radiator cowling under the
fuselage of his CH601. Does anybody remember these and where I can find
them.
Thanks
Dave New
CH601HDS Taildragger
N928DN
130 hrs.
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: radiator cowel |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry McFarland <larrymc@qconline.com>
Dave,
You may have seen the radiator and intake on my 601HDS. Details are
found on my website
at the Subaru engine page and completions page. The standard Zenith
Aircraft Company provided
radiator installation was modified by the addition of the intake,
louvers and lowering the forward
end of the radiator one inch. The air flow through at the intake stays
smooth enough to
allow more air into the intake and the air deflected below and over the
louvers enhances the
negative draft which pulls more air thru the radiator. See attached links.
http://www.macsmachine.com/images/completion/full/601frontqtrwpants.gif
http://www.macsmachine.com/images/completion/full/fairingintake.gif
http://www.macsmachine.com/images/completion/full/radiatorintake.gif
http://www.macsmachine.com/images/wheelfairings/full/wheelptrearqtr.gif
In the original radiator installation, air would bunch up in front of
the radiator and cooling was not
as effective. If you have further questions, just ask.
Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
Dave & Doretta New wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave & Doretta New" <ddnew@nebmail.com>
>
>Zenith list
>a wile back there was a posting and pictures where someone who had pictures of
his install of a P51 style radiator cowling under the fuselage of his CH601.
Does anybody remember these and where I can find them.
>Thanks
>Dave New
>CH601HDS Taildragger
>N928DN
>130 hrs.
>
>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Mike, I ordered my FWF kit from ZAC just prior to the handoff of the whole
FWF to Jab when they were in Wisconsin. Some of the gauges, mount and pieces
came from ZAC and others from Pete. I did receive two engine mounts and two
propellers and maybe a second bag of various bolts. I returned same, but I
recommend going directly to the Jabiru folks for ordering. May save confusion and
lost
time. I recommend also that even if the engine is months away from arrival
get the mount as soon as you can and install to ensure you have the correct
mounting bolt alignment. If you are off one m.m. it will show up there. Also,
there are at least two modifications to the 3300 engine that I know of. A gas
saving kit for the carb and something with the oil system. It might be advisable
to have the Jabiru folks make them before they do the run in and delivery. Save
a lot of work on your part. FWIW, Best regards, Bill of Georgia
Message 7
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| Subject: | RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Frisby" <n801za@hotmail.com>
By my calculations, to change the incidence by "3-4 degrees", you would have
to lower the trailing edge by 3-4 inches, that would be a major deviation
from Zenair design, and sounds like it would mean moving the carry through
spar. Good luck.
Jim Frisby
... They both
concurred that the plane flies nose high and needs to have the wings
adjusted to raise the leading edge and drop the trailing edge about 3-4
degrees.
Now, Help me out here as I wasn't the builder.... Is there a way to adjust
the incidence without removing the wings and drilling a new set of holes? I
hope, I hope! Can't wait to see the replies on this one!
Message 8
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jeffrey J Paris" <jeffrey-j-paris@excite.com>
Hello listers,
I bought one of the first 12 "FWF" kits from Pete at Jabiru and I can tell you
that the result was completely worth the price! The cowls need very little cosemetic
work, the engine mount went on flawlessly, and the whole kit is well supported
by Pete and his crew.
My plansbuilder/mentor 601HDS Bill Foti said it best to me, he said "you have proven
you could build the plane, doing the FWF is just going to add an incredible
amount of time and keep you on the ground longer... It's all about the flying!"
We made the plunge and anted up and the results have been well worth it.
I should be finishing up painting this week and final assembly begins. I should
be flying by mid July. Thanks to everyone on the list, so many questions
get answered just by opening the emails.
Jeff Paris 601 XL Jab3300 N196ZP
--- On Mon 06/27, Mike Fortunato < rsq2424@yahoo.com > wrote:
From: Mike Fortunato [mailto: rsq2424@yahoo.com]
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Jabiru FWF Kit
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com>
JabiruUSA develop and sell the FWF kit now. Zenith will take your order, but the
FWF comes from them. Or you can order from them directly.
Thanks Lance. Any thoughts on whether it's better to buy from ZAC, or from Jabiru
directly? Same level of tech support?
Mike Fortunato
do not archive
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mike H" <mhilderbrand@cox.net>
I'm sure this "crank" discussion is making people change their minds! I am
still going foreward with my conversion!
Mike H
----- Original Message -----
From: "N5SL" <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Jabiru FWF Kit
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
>
> Hi Mike:
>
> Can you share with me the reason for your change of heart. My Corvair
engine is almost done and I'm pretty happy with the installation so far.
William Wynne sells all the parts for a firewall forward kit and is supposed
to have several complete kits ready for Oshkosh in a few weeks.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott Laughlin
>
> Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato
>
> I've reluctantly made a recent decision to change
> engine choices. I was planning to install a Corvair in
> my 601XL, but recent circumstances have changed that
> decision. Instead, I'm now looking into the Jabiru
> 3300 again. I'll have to pry my wallet a little
> farther open, but I need to get this plane in the air!
>
> So, does anyone know if there's a complete FWF kit for
> the 601XL, and if so, is it provided by ZAC, or by a
> US Jabiru dealer?
>
> [Jeff Small, you still out there? You've always had
> really good advice relating to that powerplant.]
>
> Thanks,
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
>
>
Message 10
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Pete Krotje" <pkrotje@athenet.net>
With the new 601 fwf kit there is only one style of airbox and oil cooler.
Earlier kits from Jabiru Australia had different coolers and airboxes that
required some modification. The new kit we have had in production since May
2004 requires no mods and has demonstrated that it provides good oil and
head cooling.
Pete
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike Fortunato
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601XL FWF kit
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com>
>>Make sure you specify the right type air box and oil cooler when you
order.
Could you please elaborate on that? What determines which air box & oil
cooler that I should order? Thanks,
Mike Fortunato
Do not archive
Message 11
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| Subject: | Corvair Firewall Forward |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Thanks Mike. It looks like the problems are with engines that deviated from the
Wynne design significantly - with emphasis in the prop extensions. I plan to
use the short, 3" prop hub I ordered from WW.
William has written a lengthy text which clears up much of the confusion here:
http://flycorvair.com/crankissues.html
The fact that he is flying in a 601XL with the Cor vair exactly how I'm building
mine provides a good bit of reassurance.
Scott Laughlin
610XL/Corvair
www.cooknwithgas.com
Mike H <mhilderbrand@cox.net> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mike H"
I'm sure this "crank" discussion is making people change their minds! I am
still going foreward with my conversion!
Mike H
Message 12
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Pete Krotje" <pkrotje@athenet.net>
All Jabiru engines manufactured since December have the updated carb economy
mod and the updates oil pump back plate. There is no modifications to do on
new engines.
Pete
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Jabiru FWF Kit
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Mike, I ordered my FWF kit from ZAC just prior to the handoff of the whole
FWF to Jab when they were in Wisconsin. Some of the gauges, mount and pieces
came from ZAC and others from Pete. I did receive two engine mounts and two
propellers and maybe a second bag of various bolts. I returned same, but I
recommend going directly to the Jabiru folks for ordering. May save
confusion and lost time. I recommend also that even if the engine is months
away from arrival get the mount as soon as you can and install to ensure you
have the correct mounting bolt alignment. If you are off one m.m. it will
show up there. Also, there are at least two modifications to the 3300 engine
that I know of. A gas saving kit for the carb and something with the oil
system. It might be advisable to have the Jabiru folks make them before they
do the run in and delivery. Save a lot of work on your part. FWIW, Best
regards, Bill of Georgia
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com>
Hi Scott,
Back when I first started building, I was sold on
using the Jab 3300, until someone (whom I now consider
to be a friend) convinced me to consider the Corvair.
I agreed, but only because this new friend offered his
labor to build the engine for me! Quite generous.
However, it has been two years with virtually no
progress, mostly because this gentlemen has had things
happen in his life which were unexepected. Being
anxious to transition out of the building phase into
the flying phase, I felt the need to make the change.
Unfortunately, I'm not comfortable in my own skills to
build an engine from scratch.
Also, I'd be lying if I didn't add that I'm a bit
concerned about the breaking crankshaft situation as
of late. My gut feeling is that it will get resolved,
but it is a consideration.
As for WW, I think the world of him and what he's done
for experimental aviation is tremendous. But the one
drawback is that he's so busy, customer service is
pretty much non-existent. I've been trying to ask
questions about his cowl for nearly 6 months, with no
luck. Understandably, he's swamped, but that's just
another source of delays which would add to the time
involved.
So, I'm certainly not thrilled about all the extra
money it's gonna cost me, but I have to make progress
and get in the air. I'm tired of making my own
airplane noises. :)
Mike
--- N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL
> <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
>
> Hi Mike:
>
> Can you share with me the reason for your change of
> heart. My Corvair engine is almost done and I'm
> pretty happy with the installation so far. William
> Wynne sells all the parts for a firewall forward kit
> and is supposed to have several complete kits ready
> for Oshkosh in a few weeks.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott Laughlin
>
> Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato
>
> I've reluctantly made a recent decision to change
> engine choices. I was planning to install a Corvair
> in
> my 601XL, but recent circumstances have changed that
> decision. Instead, I'm now looking into the Jabiru
> 3300 again. I'll have to pry my wallet a little
> farther open, but I need to get this plane in the
> air!
>
> So, does anyone know if there's a complete FWF kit
> for
> the 601XL, and if so, is it provided by ZAC, or by a
> US Jabiru dealer?
>
> [Jeff Small, you still out there? You've always had
> really good advice relating to that powerplant.]
>
> Thanks,
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy
> Football
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Corvair list location |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker <btucke73@yahoo.com>
Gents,
Well, it looks like my mistake was a good
thing... For the four guys that wanted to know where
the Corvair list is, and any others:
www.corvaircraft.com
click on join the e-mail list
-This list is not quite as civil as the Zenith
list, as many aren't, so expect that. There are a few
engineers that think they are experts on all aspects
of anything mechanical or electrical.
Also, if you don't already know about this site:
www.flycorvair.com
Brandon
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Tech Counselor |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Richard Hutson" <rhutson@midsouth.rr.com>
Contact EAA National Headquarters in Oshkosh. Call 1-800-join eaa, tell you
need to locate all of the chapters in your area. They may also have a list
of the Tech Counselors in your area.
From: "Don Mountain" <mountain4don@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Tech Counselor
> Thanks Richard
>
> I live just outside Red Oak, Iowa, in the SouthWest
> corner. How would I contact one of these EAA members
> for this service. I am a mamber of EAA, but not
> really much involved with it. There aren't any local
> EAA chapters in my area that I know of. I did go to
> Oshkosh last year before I bought my 601 XL kit, but
> can't afford to go back again now that I spent all of
> my money.
>
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Richard Hutson" <rhutson@midsouth.rr.com>
The answer is yes and both can supply you the engine with a complete
firewall forward. Try www.usjabiru.com talk with Pete, they are located in
Shelbyville, TN south of Nashville, TN
From: "Mike Fortunato" <rsq2424@yahoo.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Jabiru FWF Kit
> 3300 again. I'll have to pry my wallet a little
> farther open, but I need to get this plane in the air!
>
> So, does anyone know if there's a complete FWF kit for
> the 601XL, and if so, is it provided by ZAC, or by a
> US Jabiru dealer?
>> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
>
>
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kent Brown" <kentbrown@verizon.net>
Is it possible that the real problem is the incidence of the Horizontal
Stabilizer? Just a thought.
Kent
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-
> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Frisby
> Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 7:15 AM
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Frisby" <n801za@hotmail.com>
>
> By my calculations, to change the incidence by "3-4 degrees", you would
> have
> to lower the trailing edge by 3-4 inches, that would be a major deviation
> from Zenair design, and sounds like it would mean moving the carry through
> spar. Good luck.
> Jim Frisby
> ... They both
> concurred that the plane flies nose high and needs to have the wings
> adjusted to raise the leading edge and drop the trailing edge about 3-4
> degrees.
> Now, Help me out here as I wasn't the builder.... Is there a way to adjust
> the incidence without removing the wings and drilling a new set of holes?
> I
> hope, I hope! Can't wait to see the replies on this one!
>
>
>
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair Firewall Forward |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com>
Yup, I agree completely. I was also planning on going
the WW route with no mods. Best of luck!
Mike
--- N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL
> <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
>
> Thanks Mike. It looks like the problems are with
> engines that deviated from the Wynne design
> significantly - with emphasis in the prop
> extensions. I plan to use the short, 3" prop hub I
> ordered from WW.
>
> William has written a lengthy text which clears up
> much of the confusion here:
>
> http://flycorvair.com/crankissues.html
>
> The fact that he is flying in a 601XL with the Cor
> vair exactly how I'm building mine provides a good
> bit of reassurance.
>
> Scott Laughlin
> 610XL/Corvair
> www.cooknwithgas.com
>
>
> Mike H <mhilderbrand@cox.net> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Mike H"
>
> I'm sure this "crank" discussion is making people
> change their minds! I am
> still going foreward with my conversion!
> Mike H
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com>
I find the best way to reach William is to call him.
Where do you live? I live in Utah, shipped all my engine parts to his
hanger in Florida and flew there (commercial). We built my engine and
ran it on their test-stand. They are shipping my engine back to me via
air freight. Given all that expense I am still *way* ahead of the cost
of buying a Jabaru 3300. And I'll save more when it comes time to
overhaul my engine.
-- Craig
Mike Fortunato wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com>
>
> Hi Scott,
>
> Back when I first started building, I was sold on
> using the Jab 3300, until someone (whom I now consider
> to be a friend) convinced me to consider the Corvair.
> I agreed, but only because this new friend offered his
> labor to build the engine for me! Quite generous.
>
> However, it has been two years with virtually no
> progress, mostly because this gentlemen has had things
> happen in his life which were unexepected. Being
> anxious to transition out of the building phase into
> the flying phase, I felt the need to make the change.
> Unfortunately, I'm not comfortable in my own skills to
> build an engine from scratch.
>
> Also, I'd be lying if I didn't add that I'm a bit
> concerned about the breaking crankshaft situation as
> of late. My gut feeling is that it will get resolved,
> but it is a consideration.
>
> As for WW, I think the world of him and what he's done
> for experimental aviation is tremendous. But the one
> drawback is that he's so busy, customer service is
> pretty much non-existent. I've been trying to ask
> questions about his cowl for nearly 6 months, with no
> luck. Understandably, he's swamped, but that's just
> another source of delays which would add to the time
> involved.
>
> So, I'm certainly not thrilled about all the extra
> money it's gonna cost me, but I have to make progress
> and get in the air. I'm tired of making my own
> airplane noises. :)
>
> Mike
>
> --- N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>>--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL
>><nfivesl@yahoo.com>
>>
>>Hi Mike:
>>
>>Can you share with me the reason for your change of
>>heart. My Corvair engine is almost done and I'm
>>pretty happy with the installation so far. William
>>Wynne sells all the parts for a firewall forward kit
>>and is supposed to have several complete kits ready
>>for Oshkosh in a few weeks.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Scott Laughlin
>>
>>Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>--> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato
>>
>>I've reluctantly made a recent decision to change
>>engine choices. I was planning to install a Corvair
>>in
>>my 601XL, but recent circumstances have changed that
>>decision. Instead, I'm now looking into the Jabiru
>>3300 again. I'll have to pry my wallet a little
>>farther open, but I need to get this plane in the
>>air!
>>
>>So, does anyone know if there's a complete FWF kit
>>for
>>the 601XL, and if so, is it provided by ZAC, or by a
>>US Jabiru dealer?
>>
>>[Jeff Small, you still out there? You've always had
>>really good advice relating to that powerplant.]
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Mike Fortunato
>>601XL
>>
>>
>>
>>---------------------------------
>> Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy
>>Football
>>
>>
>>
>>browse
>>Subscriptions page,
>>FAQ,
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Re: RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dirk Slabbert" <dirkslabbert@telkomsa.net>
Kent, I've been watching this, think you got the nail on the head, made mine adjustable
+ and - 5mm on the horizontal, just in case.
You can replace the mounting brackets on the fuse, once you find the perfect setting,
ZAC is rather vague about this.
Dirk.
----- Original Message -----
From: Kent Brown
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: 28 June, 2005 8:05 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kent Brown" <kentbrown@verizon.net>
Is it possible that the real problem is the incidence of the Horizontal
Stabilizer? Just a thought.
Kent
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-
> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Frisby
> Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 7:15 AM
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Frisby" <n801za@hotmail.com>
>
> By my calculations, to change the incidence by "3-4 degrees", you would
> have
> to lower the trailing edge by 3-4 inches, that would be a major deviation
> from Zenair design, and sounds like it would mean moving the carry through
> spar. Good luck.
> Jim Frisby
> ... They both
> concurred that the plane flies nose high and needs to have the wings
> adjusted to raise the leading edge and drop the trailing edge about 3-4
> degrees.
> Now, Help me out here as I wasn't the builder.... Is there a way to adjust
> the incidence without removing the wings and drilling a new set of holes?
> I
> hope, I hope! Can't wait to see the replies on this one!
>
>
>
>
>
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit vs Corvair |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com>
Everyone,
Just a note of clarification on my recent posts (some of which were accidentally
sent to the list). I am in no way suggesting that the Corvair application is
inferior to the Jabiru, or vice-versa. For my particular situation (where I wish
to fly sooner than later), I feel compelled to change directions and go with
the Jab. But that doesn't mean the Corvair is not a viable (and much less expensive)
alternative. In fact, it's a sound choice, so long as (IMO) it's built
to WW's specs (pending crankshaft issue notwithstanding). But it should be
noted that the Corvair conversion is not a plug & play option -- there's some
serious work involved in its installation. That may improve in the future, but
not there yet. For some of you talented engine folk out there, it's a no-brainer
to handle that, but for me, it's not.
Thanks to everyone for their terrific replies to my posts, both on & off list.
Mike Fortunato
601XL
do not archive
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Eddie Seve" <eddie.seve@clarity.com>
Hi Dirk,
I have been watching this discussion with great interest, do you have
any pictures of how you made your horizontal stab adjustable?
Eddie
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dirk
Slabbert
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dirk Slabbert"
<dirkslabbert@telkomsa.net>
Kent, I've been watching this, think you got the nail on the head, made
mine adjustable + and - 5mm on the horizontal, just in case.
You can replace the mounting brackets on the fuse, once you find the
perfect setting, ZAC is rather vague about this.
Dirk.
----- Original Message -----
From: Kent Brown
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: 28 June, 2005 8:05 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kent Brown"
<kentbrown@verizon.net>
Is it possible that the real problem is the incidence of the
Horizontal
Stabilizer? Just a thought.
Kent
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-
> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Frisby
> Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 7:15 AM
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Frisby" <n801za@hotmail.com>
>
> By my calculations, to change the incidence by "3-4 degrees", you
would
> have
> to lower the trailing edge by 3-4 inches, that would be a major
deviation
> from Zenair design, and sounds like it would mean moving the carry
through
> spar. Good luck.
> Jim Frisby
> ... They both
> concurred that the plane flies nose high and needs to have the wings
> adjusted to raise the leading edge and drop the trailing edge about
3-4
> degrees.
> Now, Help me out here as I wasn't the builder.... Is there a way to
adjust
> the incidence without removing the wings and drilling a new set of
holes?
> I
> hope, I hope! Can't wait to see the replies on this one!
>
>
>
>
>
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kent Brown" <kentbrown@verizon.net>
Dirk, I would also be interested in the info on making the HS adjustable,
since I am about ready to mount mine.
Thanks, Kent
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-
> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eddie Seve
> Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 1:49 PM
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Eddie Seve" <eddie.seve@clarity.com>
>
> Hi Dirk,
>
> I have been watching this discussion with great interest, do you have
> any pictures of how you made your horizontal stab adjustable?
>
> Eddie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dirk
> Slabbert
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dirk Slabbert"
> <dirkslabbert@telkomsa.net>
>
> Kent, I've been watching this, think you got the nail on the head, made
> mine adjustable + and - 5mm on the horizontal, just in case.
> You can replace the mounting brackets on the fuse, once you find the
> perfect setting, ZAC is rather vague about this.
> Dirk.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Kent Brown
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Sent: 28 June, 2005 8:05 PM
> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
>
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kent Brown"
> <kentbrown@verizon.net>
>
> Is it possible that the real problem is the incidence of the
> Horizontal
> Stabilizer? Just a thought.
>
> Kent
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-
> > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Frisby
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 7:15 AM
> > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> >
> > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Frisby" <n801za@hotmail.com>
> >
> > By my calculations, to change the incidence by "3-4 degrees", you
> would
> > have
> > to lower the trailing edge by 3-4 inches, that would be a major
> deviation
> > from Zenair design, and sounds like it would mean moving the carry
> through
> > spar. Good luck.
> > Jim Frisby
> > ... They both
> > concurred that the plane flies nose high and needs to have the wings
> > adjusted to raise the leading edge and drop the trailing edge about
> 3-4
> > degrees.
> > Now, Help me out here as I wasn't the builder.... Is there a way to
> adjust
> > the incidence without removing the wings and drilling a new set of
> holes?
> > I
> > hope, I hope! Can't wait to see the replies on this one!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Re: RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: szewc@direcway.com
I am no rocket scientist but I believe that changing the incidence of the horizontal
stabilizer will only change the position of the elevator in flight and put
the nose in the same place it was.
Just my two cents.
I lowered the flaperons on my 701 about a 1/4 inch to keep the nose a little lower
at slower speeds and it did not seem to affect cruise at all.
Do not archive
Ken Szewc
N701SZ 113 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: Kent Brown <kentbrown@verizon.net>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kent Brown"
> <kentbrown@verizon.net>
> Dirk, I would also be interested in the info on making the HS
> adjustable,since I am about ready to mount mine.
> Thanks, Kent
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [owner-zenith-list-
> > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eddie Seve
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 1:49 PM
> > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> >
> > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Eddie Seve"
> <eddie.seve@clarity.com>>
> > Hi Dirk,
> >
> > I have been watching this discussion with great interest, do you
> have> any pictures of how you made your horizontal stab adjustable?
> >
> > Eddie
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> > [owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dirk
> > Slabbert
> > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> >
> > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dirk Slabbert"
> > <dirkslabbert@telkomsa.net>
> >
> > Kent, I've been watching this, think you got the nail on the
> head, made
> > mine adjustable + and - 5mm on the horizontal, just in case.
> > You can replace the mounting brackets on the fuse, once you find the
> > perfect setting, ZAC is rather vague about this.
> > Dirk.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Kent Brown
> > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > Sent: 28 June, 2005 8:05 PM
> > Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> >
> >
> > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kent Brown"
> > <kentbrown@verizon.net>
> >
> > Is it possible that the real problem is the incidence of the
> > Horizontal
> > Stabilizer? Just a thought.
> >
> > Kent
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> > [owner-zenith-list-
> > > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Frisby
> > > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 7:15 AM
> > > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > > Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> > >
> > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Frisby"
> <n801za@hotmail.com>> >
> > > By my calculations, to change the incidence by "3-4
> degrees", you
> > would
> > > have
> > > to lower the trailing edge by 3-4 inches, that would be a major
> > deviation
> > > from Zenair design, and sounds like it would mean moving the
> carry> through
> > > spar. Good luck.
> > > Jim Frisby
> > > ... They both
> > > concurred that the plane flies nose high and needs to have
> the wings
> > > adjusted to raise the leading edge and drop the trailing
> edge about
> > 3-4
> > > degrees.
> > > Now, Help me out here as I wasn't the builder.... Is there a
> way to
> > adjust
> > > the incidence without removing the wings and drilling a new
> set of
> > holes?
> > > I
> > > hope, I hope! Can't wait to see the replies on this one!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Re: Tech counselor (Aileron Horn) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Matt & Jo" <archermj@swbell.net>
> Call Nick and talk to him before making such a material change
Good suggestion. I emailed ZAC and they replied;
In general, there is no problem replacing parts of the same material
thickness with 4130
instead of 6061-T6
Probably not necessary but not much trouble to mod. Side note, I have
always appreciated how responsive ZAC has been to questions. Always get a
reply within a day.
Cheers
Matt
www.zodiacxl.com
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "David Alberti" <daberti@sbcglobal.net>
I think if this were true, why would you need an elevator? Granted if the
wings are made wrong all this achieves is a high drag band-aid to the nose
high pitch.
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
szewc@direcway.com
Subject: Re: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
--> Zenith-List message posted by: szewc@direcway.com
I am no rocket scientist but I believe that changing the incidence of the
horizontal stabilizer will only change the position of the elevator in
flight and put the nose in the same place it was.
Just my two cents.
I lowered the flaperons on my 701 about a 1/4 inch to keep the nose a little
lower at slower speeds and it did not seem to affect cruise at all.
Do not archive
Ken Szewc
N701SZ 113 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: Kent Brown <kentbrown@verizon.net>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kent Brown"
> <kentbrown@verizon.net>
> Dirk, I would also be interested in the info on making the HS
> adjustable,since I am about ready to mount mine.
> Thanks, Kent
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [owner-zenith-list-
> > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eddie Seve
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 1:49 PM
> > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> >
> > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Eddie Seve"
> <eddie.seve@clarity.com>>
> > Hi Dirk,
> >
> > I have been watching this discussion with great interest, do you
> have> any pictures of how you made your horizontal stab adjustable?
> >
> > Eddie
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> > [owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dirk
> > Slabbert
> > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> >
> > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dirk Slabbert"
> > <dirkslabbert@telkomsa.net>
> >
> > Kent, I've been watching this, think you got the nail on the
> head, made
> > mine adjustable + and - 5mm on the horizontal, just in case.
> > You can replace the mounting brackets on the fuse, once you find the
> > perfect setting, ZAC is rather vague about this.
> > Dirk.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Kent Brown
> > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > Sent: 28 June, 2005 8:05 PM
> > Subject: RE: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> >
> >
> > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Kent Brown"
> > <kentbrown@verizon.net>
> >
> > Is it possible that the real problem is the incidence of the
> > Horizontal
> > Stabilizer? Just a thought.
> >
> > Kent
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> > [owner-zenith-list-
> > > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Frisby
> > > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 7:15 AM
> > > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > > Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Re-setting wing incidence
> > >
> > > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Frisby"
> <n801za@hotmail.com>> >
> > > By my calculations, to change the incidence by "3-4
> degrees", you
> > would
> > > have
> > > to lower the trailing edge by 3-4 inches, that would be a major
> > deviation
> > > from Zenair design, and sounds like it would mean moving the
> carry> through
> > > spar. Good luck.
> > > Jim Frisby
> > > ... They both
> > > concurred that the plane flies nose high and needs to have
> the wings
> > > adjusted to raise the leading edge and drop the trailing
> edge about
> > 3-4
> > > degrees.
> > > Now, Help me out here as I wasn't the builder.... Is there a
> way to
> > adjust
> > > the incidence without removing the wings and drilling a new
> set of
> > holes?
> > > I
> > > hope, I hope! Can't wait to see the replies on this one!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 27
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|
--> Zenith-List message posted by: gpjann@juno.com
Ref:
Zodiac 601HDS
Corvair 100HP
MA-3-SPA Carb
I'm in the process of replacing my Aerocarb with the MA-3-SPA and am
looking for information on the following:
Intake Manifold
Heat Box
Is fuel pump needed?
Also am looking to buy a heat box.
Thanks,
GPJ
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
Changing the angle of incidence of the horizontal stabilizer will change the
trim forces needed to maintain level flight at any particular airspeed, it
will not change the pitch attitude of the fuselage at that airspeed. To
change the pitch attitude of the fuselage in level flight at a particular
airspeed, you need to change the angle of incidence of the main wing. The
wing will generate a certain amount of lift at a certain angle of attack and
a certain airspeed. No amount of twiddling with the horizontal stabilizer is
going to change the lift characteristics of the main wing.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
do not archive.
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
If your engine and propeller are both certified AND the combination of the
two is certified for use together, you will be granted a 25 hour Phase I
test period; otherwise, you will get a 40 hour test period. Some Rotaxes and
Jabirus are certified, but you also have to use one of the propellers that
they were certified for use with to get the shorter test period.
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Frank Roskind" <frankroskind@hotmail.com>
>
> Are builders getting different fly-off periods depeding on engine choice?
> Is either the rotax or jabiru treated as a certificated engine in
> determining fly-off period? Does the choice of propeller make a difference?
>
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
do not archive.
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: RE: RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker <btucke73@yahoo.com>
Gents,
Ken is correct. By changing the mounting angle
of the horizontal stabilizer, you are simply changing
the force on the moment arm of the elevator / stab
assembly. This will not change the angle of attack
required of the wing to produce the required lift.
Lowering the trailing edge of the wing panel slightly
will affect a change in the amount of lift produced,
and would lower the nose slightly for a given
airspeed. This has been discussed in detail before,
and information can be found in the archives. It has
also been done on the left side to counter the heavy
left wing that some builders have experienced. They
have reported significant change with very small
adjustments.
R/
Brandon
601 hds
airframe pretty much complete
building motor this weekend
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Jabiru FWF Kit vs Corvair |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com>
Have you considered buying the Corvair engine already
converted from WW. The price is $6,750 hand built and
tested by William Wynne. You can also buy from him
some of the FW forward components like engine mount,
cowl etc. and replicate his installation.
William Dominguez
Miami, Florida
601XL, Hopefully a Corvair if not, a Jabiru 3300
.001% done, bending stabilizer ribs
--- Mike Fortunato <rsq2424@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Fortunato
> <rsq2424@yahoo.com>
>
>
> Everyone,
>
> Just a note of clarification on my recent posts
> (some of which were accidentally sent to the list).
> I am in no way suggesting that the Corvair
> application is inferior to the Jabiru, or
> vice-versa. For my particular situation (where I
> wish to fly sooner than later), I feel compelled to
> change directions and go with the Jab. But that
> doesn't mean the Corvair is not a viable (and much
> less expensive) alternative. In fact, it's a sound
> choice, so long as (IMO) it's built to WW's specs
> (pending crankshaft issue notwithstanding). But it
> should be noted that the Corvair conversion is not a
> plug & play option -- there's some serious work
> involved in its installation. That may improve in
> the future, but not there yet. For some of you
> talented engine folk out there, it's a no-brainer to
> handle that, but for me, it's not.
>
> Thanks to everyone for their terrific replies to my
> posts, both on & off list.
>
> Mike Fortunato
>
> 601XL
>
> do not archive
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail
Message 32
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Paul Moore" <pmoore505@msn.com>
Just curious - what did you find wrong with the Aerocarb? I've been
considering swapping my MA-3-SPA out for an Aerocarb......I'd be very
interested in hearing your experiences.
Paul Moore
XL - O-200
-----Original Message-----
I'm in the process of replacing my Aerocarb with the MA-3-SPA and am looking
for information on the following:
Intake Manifold
Heat Box
Is fuel pump needed?
Also am looking to buy a heat box.
Thanks,
GPJ
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Jabiru US certification |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: ron dewees <rdewees@mindspring.com>
I don't know about the Rotax, but the Jabiru is certified in europe, not
here. Pete tells me it was a very grueling torture test and I'm glad it
was done, but that certification doesn't make any difference to the
FAA. Certification would probably make parts cost a lot more for US
builders. The flyoff period is 40 hours regardless of prop and motor
combination. I've been told that if you take a certified engine and
hang it on an experimental plane, the motor is now experimental, too.
Otherwise the builder with the Repairman's Certificate couldn't work on
his own motor. If you take the formerly certified motor off the
experimental plane you can't hang it on a certified plane and get it
approved again. I think we contaminate them or something?
I haven't found the 40 hours to be any problem at all. I have 80
hours on my Jab and am still doing a lot of tweeking adjustments and
changes. I have learned a lot and am making progress toward dependable,
cool, and clean motor operation.
Good luck
Ron N601TD Jab 3300 80 hours
do not archive
Bryan Martin wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
>
>If your engine and propeller are both certified AND the combination of the
>two is certified for use together, you will be granted a 25 hour Phase I
>test period; otherwise, you will get a 40 hour test period. Some Rotaxes and
>Jabirus are certified, but you also have to use one of the propellers that
>they were certified for use with to get the shorter test period.
>
>
>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Re-setting wing incidence |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Leo Gates" <leogates@allvantage.com>
By your calculations Jim you are correct. However, drooping the ailerons
is an attempt to increase the lift of the airfoil at any given angle of
attack while, hopefully, inducing a minimum of drag.
I decided to experiment with my experimental airplane:
Weight: 930 Lbs., Alt. 3,500' MSL, Rotax 912
Max. cruise: Full throttle, 5,500 RPM, CAS: 120 Mph, Fuselage: Level.
75% Pwr: 27.2", 5,000 RPM, CAS: 102 Mph, Fuselage: 1degree nose high.
65% Pwr: 26.5", 4,800 RPM, CAS: 92 Mph, Fuselage: 2 degrees nose high.
55% Pwr: 26.3", 4,300 RPM, CAS: 84 Mph, Fuselage: 3 degrees nose high.
Two turns in on each aileron outer push rod end. Same weight, altitude,
engine
Max. cruise: Full throttle, 5,500 RPM, CAS:115 Mph, Fuselage: 2 degrees
nose down.
75% Pwr: 27.2", 5,000 RPM, CAS: 102 Mph, Fuselage: 1degree nose down.
65% Pwr: 26.5", 4,800 RPM, CAS: 89 Mph, Fuselage: 1 degree nose high.
55% Pwr: 26.3", 4,300 RPM, CAS: 78 Mph, Fuselage: 3 degrees nose high.
After very careful evaluation of the above data, I'm going to turn the
aileron push rod ends back out two turns.
Leo Gates
N601Z, CH601HDS, Taildragger
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Frisby" <n801za@hotmail.com>
By my calculations, to change the incidence by "3-4 degrees", you would have
to lower the trailing edge by 3-4 inches, that would be a major deviation
from Zenair design, and sounds like it would mean moving the carry through
spar. Good luck.
Jim Frisby
...
Message 35
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|
Gary Eisert <garyeisert@hallandales.com>,
James Berdick <sjberd@aol.com>, James Sagerser <alaskajim@cox.net>,
JIM JABARU PACIFIC <info@jabirupacific.com>,
Graham Clark II <cgraham978@aol.com>,
Zenith list <zenith-list@matronics.com>
| Subject: | Jabiru 3300 on CH701 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Hal Rozema <hartist1@cox.net>
I thought you'd like to see the latest on our project.
The attached photo shows the 3300 engine which we just installed last
week-end.
We (Jabiru and the Rozema's) have had a few growing pains. The engine
came complete with engine mount, all accessories, and nose bowl. The
problems started with our first engine install. The first engine mount
(I think) was built to fit an Ausy 701 tail dragger. There was no room
for the carb (or the nose gear, take your choice).
The second EM fit OK. The engine hung OK, but it just didn't look
right. After measuring about ten times, trying different ways of
measuring, my engineering background finally paid off and the problem
became obvious.. With the airframe blocked so the horizontal reference
was perfectly horizontal and some reference to the best available
drawings of the similar arrangements with the Rotax, it was obvious that
the back Engine Mounting Plate was about 3" (76mm) low. Further checking
determined that the engine itself from the center of the Engine Mounting
Plate was another 3". This caused a horrible looking nose condition
which was exaggerated further by the oil cooler mounted in front of and
below the oil sump. We projected the centerline forward extending the
cabin floor line and the engine "chin" was going to be some 7 or 8"
(200mm) lower than the cabin floor. I didn't know how I would make a
nose cowling that could handle that exaggerated appearance.
I reported those finding to Jabiru, through there west coast dealer,
Jim McCormick. He has been a great help through all this. We spent
about an hour one Sunday on a conference call with Jab in AU (their
Monday).
The third EM arrived and didn't fit the bolt pattern on the firewall.
The right mount (pilots view) missed the bolt hole by 1.25" (32mm).
Before we refit the engine and we made an Engine Mounting Plate and went
through our measuring process again. This EM had the EMP raised into
the correct position, 3" higher than EM #1 or #2, but still had the
upper EMP tube plates 3/8 forward of the lower ones. We photographed
the mock up showing the 3/8 to 1/2 " error and e-mailed the whole works
to Jim at Jabiru Pacific for relay to AU.
EM No 4 arrived two week ago. We got it attached to the firewall and
last week end re installed the engine.. Beautiful.
With a couple washers on the lower mounts to compensate for structural
sag and compression of the rubber vibration mounts, we now have the
following:
There will be about 1/4 to 3/8 clearance between the cowling and the top
of the starter case.
There is about one degree down slope to the engine axis.
There is about 2 to 3 degree right angle per Chris' directions.
I hope that the other 701 builders who have or are considering the 3300
Jabiru will make sure they get the "Rozema" engine mount.
While this was going on, Jabiru made two major changes that affect this
set up. They have a new much more streamlined nose bowl which splits
along the prop center line and has larger ram air openings for cylinder
cooling. The oil cooler has been moved back to just forward of the
muffler and mounts to the bottom cowling.. This has a NACA scoop below
the prop hub and an aluminum or glass duct back to the oil cooler.
With this package comes new Ram Air Cylinder Shrouds which are larger
and fully enclose the plugs and plug wires. Factory tests are showing a
20% drop in cylinder head temps.
Regards to all at the plant
Hal and Jackie
ThePlaneFolks.Net
Phoenix
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: Carb question |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com>
If you are flying an XL then you can't gravity-feed from the wing tanks.
I remember a post that contained a quote from the Aerocarb manual
stating that it can only be used in a gravity-fed system. I've search
for the message but can't find it. I did find the messages quoted below.
The message from Mark Jones on 1/14/04 does contradict my memory.
Certainly a number of people have had a great deal of trouble getting
the Aerocarb to work in a pressurized fuel system. After researching all
this I sprung for an Ellison for my XL/Corvair.
Unfortunately The Aerocarb manuals are not on their web site.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: corvaircraft-bounces+william_wright=wlbeng.com@mylist.net
[mailto:corvaircraft-bounces+william_wright=wlbeng.com@mylist.net]On
Behalf Of Mark Jones
Subject: Re: CorvAircraft> carbs
Pat,
My Aerocarb was the 32MM. The Aerocarb ran the Vair flawlessly as a
gravity feed carb. However, I decided I wanted wing tanks and no header
tank and I could not, after many tries, get the Aerocarb to operate
using a fuel pump, even with a fuel regulator. And I did try many
different set ups to try and achieve a good running engine with the
Aerocarb and fuel pump set up. Therefore, I traded the Aerocarb for an
Ellison EFS-2. The Ellison EFS-2 is a 35MM and operates the Vair
flawlessly with fuel pumps. I have never regretted making the swap.
...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Jones" <flykr2s@wi.rr.com>
Subject: CorvAircraft>Aerocarb
Yesterday, I stopped by Sonex/Aeroconversions at Oshkosh and talked with
Jeremy Monnett concerning operating the Aerocarb under pressure. He
stated the Aerocarb will function properly using a fuel pump and a
pressure regulator. The pressure to start adjusting at is 2 pi.
...
-- Craig
Paul Moore wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Paul Moore" <pmoore505@msn.com>
>
> Just curious - what did you find wrong with the Aerocarb? I've been
> considering swapping my MA-3-SPA out for an Aerocarb......I'd be very
> interested in hearing your experiences.
>
> Paul Moore
> XL - O-200
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> I'm in the process of replacing my Aerocarb with the MA-3-SPA and am looking
> for information on the following:
> Intake Manifold
> Heat Box
> Is fuel pump needed?
>
> Also am looking to buy a heat box.
>
> Thanks,
> GPJ
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 37
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| Subject: | Prop leading edge options |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Dabusmith@aol.com
I have tried many different prop leading edge protection materials. I do a
fair amount of flying in light rain. I plan to have the nickel leading edges
installed eventually. Are they heavy? Does anyone have opinions on other
leading edge protection options?
Dave Smith
N701XL 453Hr.
Message 38
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| Subject: | Back country flying trip |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Dabusmith@aol.com
I have a couple weeks off in the middle of August. I am thinking about
flying my 701 from the Seattle area to Wyoming and back. I will have camping gear.
I would love to visit with builders or anyone else that has a place for me
to land. If you know of a neat place or would be willing to share tips and
pointers about back country flying I would welcome the info. Are there other
701's or Cubs interested in a trip? Suggestions?
Dave Smith
Graham WA.
> Do not archive <
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