Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 08:53 AM - Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com)
2. 09:19 AM - Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
3. 09:39 AM - Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 (jnbolding1)
4. 10:41 AM - Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 (Paul Mulwitz)
5. 11:07 AM - Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
6. 11:36 AM - Corvair Users news group (Efraim Otero)
7. 11:49 AM - Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 (Paul Moore)
8. 11:53 AM - Why to build a plane . . . (Paul Mulwitz)
9. 12:02 PM - Re: Corvair Users news group (Cory Emberson)
10. 12:21 PM - Re: Why to build a plane . . . (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
11. 12:53 PM - Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 (JERICKSON03E@aol.com)
12. 07:33 PM - Re: Corvair Users news group (Daniel Dempsey)
13. 07:33 PM - 601XL engine selection (Brian Briggerman)
14. 09:03 PM - Re: 601XL engine selection (Craig Payne)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Paul, on your Cont. 200 there may be even another advantage. Does it rate as
a certified engine ? If so your Phase I hours should only be 25 as opposed to
the 40 hours restriction for Jab and Sub. Frank, correct me if I'm wrong, Best
regards, Bill of Georgia 601XL-3300wDC
Message 2
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| Subject: | Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Indeed that is correct as far as an experimental with a certified
engine.
However you are only allowed to do minor maintenance as the owner (and
I'm not sure exactly ehat that means). Bottom line if you strip down the
engine and reassemble it is no longer a certified engine and must
therefore have a 40 hour fly off.
I think to be certied it must come with the appropriate log book
entries.
Regards
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Paul, on your Cont. 200 there may be even another advantage. Does it
rate as a certified engine ? If so your Phase I hours should only be 25
as opposed to the 40 hours restriction for Jab and Sub. Frank, correct
me if I'm wrong, Best
regards, Bill of Georgia 601XL-3300wDC
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "jnbolding1" <jnbolding1@mail.ev1.net>
>Paul, on your Cont. 200 there may be even another advantage. Does
it rate as
>a certified engine ? If so your Phase I hours should only be 25
as opposed to
>the 40 hours restriction for Jab and Sub. Frank, correct me if
I'm wrong, Best
>regards, Bill of Georgia 601XL-3300wDC
IF the prop is certified AND they (engine and prop) are certified
as a combination. I've heard of some DARs not getting too
stressed out about a wood non-certified prop but that's the rule
LOW&SLOW John
Sent via the EV1 webmail system at mail.ev1.net
Message 4
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| Subject: | Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
>However you are only allowed to do minor maintenance as the owner (and
>I'm not sure exactly ehat that means). Bottom line if you strip down the
>engine and reassemble it is no longer a certified engine and must
>therefore have a 40 hour fly off.
Sorry Frank, I am afraid you got this point all wrong.
According to the FAA stuff I have been reading, any certified
equipment you put in an experimental plane immediately loses its
certified status. The good news is that means you can do just as
much maintenance on certified engines as any other kind. I guess the
bad news is you can't sell your used engine as certified - probably
not a big issue.
I don't know how this all plays into the 25/40 hour initial flight
test requirement, but the DAR who inspects your plane does. For my
money a 40 hour restriction is merely a requirement that I hone my
flying skills along with tuning the airplane a bit more before
venturing off into cross country flights and carrying pasengers.
Paul
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
Message 5
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| Subject: | Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Yes it does but I don't "think" the actual wording is quite clear...Yes
I agree the moment its installed its not certified, but it is eligible
for the 25 hour fly off.
Where it got hazy (and I admit this was while back) to me was I you
rebuilt the engine prior to installation, thereby the motor was
"experimental" BEFORE it went into the plane. Then in theory it was no
longer eligible for the 25 hour fly off.
I remember having a few debates back when I built mine buts that's where
the collective wisdom fell.
Bottom line it probably makes little difference and is probably more
down to the DAR than anything else.
I know of at least on RV that got a 25hour flyoff with an experimental
Lycoming clone...I.e an engine built of non certified parts...But all
the others get 40 hour flyoffs.
But your right Paul once its in the airplane you can do whatever you
want with it as it is no longer certified...Thats the whole idea after
all right?
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul
Mulwitz
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz
--> <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
>However you are only allowed to do minor maintenance as the owner (and
>I'm not sure exactly ehat that means). Bottom line if you strip down
>the engine and reassemble it is no longer a certified engine and must
>therefore have a 40 hour fly off.
Sorry Frank, I am afraid you got this point all wrong.
According to the FAA stuff I have been reading, any certified equipment
you put in an experimental plane immediately loses its certified status.
The good news is that means you can do just as much maintenance on
certified engines as any other kind. I guess the bad news is you can't
sell your used engine as certified - probably not a big issue.
I don't know how this all plays into the 25/40 hour initial flight test
requirement, but the DAR who inspects your plane does. For my money a
40 hour restriction is merely a requirement that I hone my flying skills
along with tuning the airplane a bit more before venturing off into
cross country flights and carrying pasengers.
Paul
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
Message 6
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| Subject: | Corvair Users news group |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Efraim Otero" <eotero@bcfcolombia.com>
Hi listers.
Anyone know if there is a corvair users group in yahoo or msn?? Specifically one
for Zenith Airplanes??
Please let me know.
Efraim Otero-Leong=F3mez
Brackley Consulting & Finance Services Ltd - Sucursal Colombia
Aerospace Technology - Air Power Doctrine Consultant
Aerospace Business Unit Manager
PBX +57-1-601-8833
FAX +57-1-640-5770
Mobile +57-310-330-1617
E-mail: eotero@bcfcolombia.com
Carrera 13 No. 93-68 of. 406
Message 7
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| Subject: | Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Paul Moore" <pmoore505@msn.com>
I'm not exactly sure either.
I know that it has to be a certified engine and prop combination (ie - is a
certified set on a production aircraft). For example, a Cont. O-200A and
Sensenich 69CKS12-0-50L is a certified combination on a C150L so if I use
that combo on my XL, I'm only required to perform a 25 hour fly off. I
don't think my uncertified rebuild has any impact on that because I'm
allowed to do that type of maintenance on my experimental/homebuilt.
At least, that's my understanding.
Paul
XL - O200
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hinde, Frank
George (Corvallis)
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
--> <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Indeed that is correct as far as an experimental with a certified engine.
However you are only allowed to do minor maintenance as the owner (and I'm
not sure exactly ehat that means). Bottom line if you strip down the engine
and reassemble it is no longer a certified engine and must therefore have a
40 hour fly off.
I think to be certied it must come with the appropriate log book entries.
Regards
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Paul, on your Cont. 200 there may be even another advantage. Does it rate as
a certified engine ? If so your Phase I hours should only be 25 as opposed
to the 40 hours restriction for Jab and Sub. Frank, correct me if I'm wrong,
Best
regards, Bill of Georgia 601XL-3300wDC
Message 8
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| Subject: | Why to build a plane . . . |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
>But your right Paul once its in the airplane you can do whatever you
>want with it as it is no longer certified...Thats the whole idea after
>all right?
Oddly enough, I am still not sure about all the implications of
building an experimental plane.
For me, the kit building part is the primary focus. I have always
wanted to have my own airplane, and I could never bring myself to pay
the price for a new factory built one. Even with the advent of SLSA
planes the stripped factory price is still North of $60,000 and with
some radios and other stuff it would be a bit more than that.
I really needed the project to keep me busy in my retirement without
spending too much time playing poker (I played nearly every day for
several years with mixed results - good financially and bad
psychologically). Take the significant effort required to build the
plane and add in the bonus of having my own plane at the end of the
project and it is a win-win situation.
I guess I like the idea of being able to put anything I want in my
plane without approval from Uncle Sam. I have mixed feelings on
doing my own maintenance. I may opt for paying somebody else to do
some of that - particularly engine related stuff since I am not
really well versed in that anyway. I guess building the airframe
will make me expert enough to do any required maintenance and
inspection in that area.
The freedom to choose any combination of instruments, paint, engine,
propeller, seat cushions, and a mountain of other options is a mixed
blessing. The effort required to make good decisions on all of that
seems like a lot of work to me.
In any case, I am having a ball building my plane. When that is
done, I expect to have just as much fun flying it.
Paul
XL barely started
do not archive
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
Message 9
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| Subject: | Corvair Users news group |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Cory Emberson" <bootless@earthlink.net>
Hi Efraim,
Here are a couple of web addresses - I think there are builder forums in
them...
www.flycorvair.com
The Corvair Engine Builders List is on:
www.corvaircraft.com
and CORSA is: www.corvair.org
There is also a good article inthe September 05 Kitplanes magazine
specifically about Corvair egines, with some reference to Zeniths.
best, Cory
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Efraim Otero
Subject: Zenith-List: Corvair Users news group
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Efraim Otero" <eotero@bcfcolombia.com>
Hi listers.
Anyone know if there is a corvair users group in yahoo or msn?? Specifically
one for Zenith Airplanes??
Please let me know.
Efraim Otero-Leong=F3mez
Brackley Consulting & Finance Services Ltd - Sucursal Colombia
Aerospace Technology - Air Power Doctrine Consultant
Aerospace Business Unit Manager
PBX +57-1-601-8833
FAX +57-1-640-5770
Mobile +57-310-330-1617
E-mail: eotero@bcfcolombia.com
Carrera 13 No. 93-68 of. 406
Message 10
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| Subject: | Why to build a plane . . . |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Interesting perspective paul,
One thing I realised is that airplanes are surprisingly maintenance
intensive...Seems I'm always doing something to it.
Have you found an A&P who will work on a homebuilt plane?...Seems most
A&P's should be OK with it but some of them have a slightly different
perspective...:)
Frank
I have mixed feelings on doing my own maintenance. I may opt for
paying somebody else to do some of that - particularly engine related
stuff since I am not really well versed in that anyway. I guess
building the airframe will make me expert enough to do any required
maintenance and inspection in that area.
The freedom to choose any combination of instruments, paint, engine,
propeller, seat cushions, and a mountain of other options is a mixed
blessing. The effort required to make good decisions on all of that
seems like a lot of work to me.
In any case, I am having a ball building my plane. When that is done, I
expect to have just as much fun flying it.
Paul
XL barely started
do not archive
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Comparison: 601XL: Continental O-200 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JERICKSON03E@aol.com
In a message dated 8/11/2005 1:50:45 PM Central Daylight Time,
pmoore505@msn.com writes:
I know that it has to be a certified engine and prop combination (ie - is a
certified set on a production aircraft). For example, a Cont. O-200A and
Sensenich 69CKS12-0-50L is a certified combination on a C150L so if I use
that combo on my XL, I'm only required to perform a 25 hour fly off. I
don't think my uncertified rebuild has any impact on that because I'm
allowed to do that type of maintenance on my experimental/homebuilt.
At least, that's my understanding.
This is a good area to ask EAA HQ about. To get it right, up front.
My recollection is that a "certified engine/prop" used in an experimental
amateur built AC,, needs to be maintained by FAA authorized persons,, Powerplant
Mechanic,, Maintenance shop,, IA annual condition inspection.
That goes for the overhaul of the engine/prop As well.
When using such a "certified" combo, ADs, Mfg.'s notices and such apply, not
withstanding that it is installed in an Experimental aircraft.
This is a cost of the decision to use such a "certified" combo.
Somewhere it has been written that the engine data plate is to be sent to the
FAA, surrendered, when the engine used will not be continued in a
"certified''' condition. Someone on the list may help with this info? Rule?
If not an A&P, it is useful to look at FAR part 43, appendix A, Preventative
Maintenance,
For the list of maintenance allowed on "certified" AC.
As Experimental builder/Repairmen for our own AC, we are allowed do the
annual condition inspection. FAR part 43, appendix D.
Again, best to ask EAA HQ for help to clarify & convince yourself of your
understanding of this area.
Regards,
Jerry, 701 SP/ 912 ULS / WARP DRIVE
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair Users news group |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Daniel Dempsey <leinad@direcway.com>
Efraim,
I'm on a corvair mailing list. The combination of corvair and CH601 XL is
becoming a popular one. It's a good group. Someone else mentioned
flycorvair.com, William Wynne's web sight. It's an important source.
Information below...
Dan Dempsey
Send CorvAircraft mailing list submissions to
corvaircraft@mylist.net
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://mylist.net/listinfo/corvaircraft
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
corvaircraft-request@mylist.net
You can reach the person managing the list at
corvaircraft-owner@mylist.net
----- Original Message -----
From: "Efraim Otero" <eotero@bcfcolombia.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Corvair Users news group
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Efraim Otero" <eotero@bcfcolombia.com>
>
> Hi listers.
>
> Anyone know if there is a corvair users group in yahoo or msn??
> Specifically one for Zenith Airplanes??
> Please let me know.
>
> Efraim Otero-Leong=F3mez
> Brackley Consulting & Finance Services Ltd - Sucursal Colombia
> Aerospace Technology - Air Power Doctrine Consultant
> Aerospace Business Unit Manager
> PBX +57-1-601-8833
> FAX +57-1-640-5770
> Mobile +57-310-330-1617
> E-mail: eotero@bcfcolombia.com
> Carrera 13 No. 93-68 of. 406
>
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | 601XL engine selection |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Brian Briggerman" <blb7037@cox.net>
I am trying to decide on what engine to put in my 601XL. I live in the Phoenix,
AZ area and am concerned about engine cooling. We see 115 degrees in June. I
would like to know anyone's experiences operating in temperatures like I experience
here in Arizona and how the cooling was handled. I am interested in one
of the following engines: the Jabiru 3300, Continental O-200 or the Lycoming O-235.
Brian Briggerman
Tail kit and wings completed and starting the fuselage!
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: 601XL engine selection |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com>
Have you looked through the builders database on the Zenith site? It can
be search/sorted by state and often list the builder's engine choice.
-- Craig
Brian Briggerman wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Brian Briggerman" <blb7037@cox.net>
>
> I am trying to decide on what engine to put in my 601XL. I live in the Phoenix,
AZ area and am concerned about engine cooling. We see 115 degrees in June.
I would like to know anyone's experiences operating in temperatures like I experience
here in Arizona and how the cooling was handled. I am interested in one
of the following engines: the Jabiru 3300, Continental O-200 or the Lycoming
O-235.
>
> Brian Briggerman
>
> Tail kit and wings completed and starting the fuselage!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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