Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:01 AM - Re: Rivets : (This is how many) (Brad Cohen)
2. 03:36 AM - Re: Fw: CH701 Steering Rod Boots (Rick R)
3. 05:25 AM - 701 quick build kit (Michial Pedri)
4. 05:38 AM - Re: 701 quick build kit (Elwood140@aol.com)
5. 06:14 AM - Re: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? (Aaron Gustafson)
6. 06:14 AM - Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL (John Hines)
7. 06:19 AM - Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) (N5SL)
8. 06:55 AM - Re: Ailerons 601XL (Jim Hoak)
9. 07:08 AM - Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) (Larry)
10. 07:08 AM - Re: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? (Trainnut01@aol.com)
11. 07:50 AM - Re: Re: Ailerons 601XL ()
12. 08:13 AM - Re: Phoenix (James Sagerser)
13. 08:33 AM - Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Gift Horse and Bad Teeth) (N5SL)
14. 09:15 AM - Re: 701 quick build kit (Allen Ricks)
15. 09:30 AM - 0-200 Mount (Aaron Gustafson)
16. 09:58 AM - Re: (Gift Horse and Bad Teeth) (japhillipsga@aol.com)
17. 10:06 AM - Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) (japhillipsga@aol.com)
18. 11:04 AM - Aviation Thoughts (Beckman, Rick)
19. 11:05 AM - Re: Flap Actuator WEIGHT (N5SL)
20. 11:14 AM - Re: Phoenix (James Sagerser)
21. 11:39 AM - Re: Flap Actuator WEIGHT (Allen Ricks)
22. 12:06 PM - Re: Ailerons 601XL (Leo Gates)
23. 12:15 PM - Re: Re: Women Building Zeniths (Larry McFarland)
24. 01:05 PM - Re: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? (nyterminat@aol.com)
25. 01:29 PM - Re: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? (Craig Payne)
26. 01:29 PM - Re: Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL (Craig Payne)
27. 01:35 PM - Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) (Craig Payne)
28. 01:41 PM - Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) (Craig Payne)
29. 01:44 PM - Re: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? (Craig Payne)
30. 02:18 PM - Re: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? (Ron Butterfield)
31. 03:20 PM - Zenith float keel strips (jnbolding1)
32. 03:38 PM - Re: Aviation Thoughts (Bill+Rose)
33. 07:04 PM - 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams (Dave VanLanen)
34. 07:33 PM - Re: Mice and Storage (William Jeffries)
35. 08:00 PM - Re: 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams (cgalley)
36. 08:08 PM - Re: Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL (Brandon Tucker)
37. 08:47 PM - Re: 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams (Robert Schoenberger)
38. 09:43 PM - Re: Phoenix (Gary Gower)
39. 11:23 PM - Re: 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams (Paul Mulwitz)
40. 11:23 PM - Re: Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL (Craig Payne)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Rivets : (This is how many) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Brad Cohen" <bradfnp@msn.com>
I'm only counting the two that matter most; the first and the last!
Brad Cohen
>From: VideoFlyer@aol.com
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Rivets : (This is how many)
>Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2006 23:11:40 EST
>
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: VideoFlyer@aol.com
>
> <<<Has anyone determined the approximate number of A4 and A5 rivets it
>takes
>to build the 601XL? >>>>
>
>
>The kit comes with about 5000 of each.....10,000 total.
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CH701 Steering Rod Boots |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Rick R <rick@n701rr.com>
Thanks Jim...ordering mine now.....
DO NOT ARICHIVE
Jim Fosse <jfosse1@shawneelink.net> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Fosse"
Listers. For what its worth, I have found what I think is a good boot for the steering rods. They are Rack and Pinion boots from J.C. Whitney, P/N CC473495 @ $12.99. The web site is www.jcwhitney.com.
Rick
Orlando, FL. USA
http://www.n701rr.com
Message 3
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| Subject: | 701 quick build kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Michial Pedri <pedfly60@yahoo.com>
Does anyone know if zenith plans to offer the 701 as a quick build kit? Thank
you, Mike Pedri, Beckley, WV
---------------------------------
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: 701 quick build kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Elwood140@aol.com
In a message dated 2/16/2006 7:27:07 AM Central Standard Time,
pedfly60@yahoo.com writes:
Does anyone know if zenith plans to offer the 701 as a quick build kit?
Thank you, Mike Pedri, Beckley, WV
Mike, go to _www.Zenithair.com_ (http://www.Zenithair.com) and ask Nick or
Sebastien that question.
Regards,
Larry Wood
(N701LW this year maybe)
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Aaron Gustafson" <agustafson@chartermi.net>
I used a power seat motor from a Lincoln. One problem w/ these types of
motors is that they use the same motor winding for both directions which
presents an issue when you try to put a limit on the travel. If you put a
cut out switch in the circuit, that switch also prevents reversing the
motor, so won't work. If you rely on a physical stop, it is likely that the
motor will bind and not reverse. Things to think about!
Aaron do not archive
Message 6
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| Subject: | Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "John Hines" <John.Hines@craftontull.com>
Does anyone have the Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL. It looks like a
pretty neat device and relatively inexpensive. I've done some searching
on the net for current installs and all I can find are a couple of
ulta-lights and 1 Sonex. Has anyone seen one in a 601?
John Hines
www.johnsplane.com
John Hines
IT Manager
Crafton, Tull & Associates
901 N. 47th Street, Suite 200
Rogers, AR 72756
Tel: 479-878-2449
Mob: 479-366-4783
Fax: 479-631-6224
John.Hines@craftontull.com
Crafton, Tull & Associates exists to anticipate and understand the needs of our
clients and provide them with successful solutions.
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely
for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.. If you
have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This message
contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual
named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute
or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you
have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system.
If you are not the intended recipient you are notified that disclosing, copying,
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is strictly prohibited.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
William:
First and foremost, my project is not finished and has
not flown. So take this for what it's worth.
There's more to this discussion than money. I've not
heard a lot of talk on the limit switch issue but I
think it deserves a look.
The ZAC supplied, costly actuator has external limit
switches that you must adjust. These are fragile and
have a lot of nuts and bolts, wires etc. exposed. I
looked at doing the same thing with an automobile
window or seat motor, but it brought me right back to
the exposed limit switches since the thing needs to
know to stop at end of travel.
I ended up with a 75 lb. actuator that works very well
and has internal limit switches so the trick is to set
it up to use all of the travel in both directions.
Very simple, really and it's a much cleaner
installation. I read recently on this list where a
factory-built 601XL had a problem with an external
limit switch. Predictable.
Here are a few photos of what I ended up with. There
are more photos on my "fuselage" page:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_21_04_Flaps.JPG
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_17_04_Actuator.JPG
The last one has the part number for the actuator if
you look closely.
I also looked into making a trim servo from an
automobile side-view mirror motor. I got pretty far
with this and it was looking promising until
guess-what? The limit switches just became too
complicated and bulky so I saved up some money and
purchased a RAC (MAC) servo. The first thing I did
was take it apart and void the warranty to see what
was inside. And what do you know it had some baby
limit switches tucked neatly inside. This little
device was worth every penny. Here's a picture in
case you are interested:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/RAC_Innards.JPG
Here's my poor attempt at the same thing:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/TrimMotor3.JPG
Have fun,
Scott Laughlin
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/
Houston, we have a working radio!
--- William Murray <tall_tech_teach@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Being a penny pinching school teacher, I found the
> price and weight for the spec'd flap actuator motor
> to
> be too much. My question is this..... have they
flown
> with
> them yet? 25 lbs seems to be too small a force to
> overcome the wind pressure on both flaps at Vfe or
> below. How are other frugal builders actuating their
> flaps?
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Ailerons 601XL |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jim Hoak" <planejim@bellsouth.net>
FWIW, I have 500 hrs on my 601HD with hingeless ailerons. I too asked Chris
before building about it. He told me about the test they performed. I'm a
A&P with 50 years in aircraft maintenance. From experience I know you will
replace a worn out hinge before the 6061 will crack!
Jim Hoak
----- Original Message -----
From: "Clyde Barcus" <barcusc@comcast.net>
Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2006 7:29 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Ailerons 601XL
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Clyde Barcus" <barcusc@comcast.net>
>
> I was told by Gus at William Wynne's that the controls have a lighter
> touch
> at slow speed, which I prefer, they recently converted their plane to
> hinge
> type. Also, not everyone likes the idea of the unconventional hingeless
> method, someday I will quit flying and I will need to sell my plane and I
> want it to appeal to as many pilots as possible. It is really not a matter
> of which is better, it is just preference, a lot like tri gear versus
> conventional gear. There must be a fair amount of interest or ZAC would
> not
> have added it to the options after so many years.
>
> Clyde Barcus
> 601X
>
> Do Not Archive
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Paul Mulwitz" <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
> To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2006 5:49 PM
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Ailerons 601XL
>
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz
>> <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
>>
>> OK guys. Now you have me curious. Why would you want piano hinge
>> ailerons instead of the cool perfectly sealed ones in the standard
>> design? I tried flying with the hingeless design on the factory
>> demonstrator and found full aileron authority all the way down to
>> stall speed. What more would you hope to gain with piano hinges?
>>
>> Paul
>> XL wings
>>
>>
>>>I converted mine from hingeless to hinge type after discussing it with
>>>Chris
>>>Heinz at Sun-N-Fun. I cut the over lap down from 40mm to 20mm, used 025 L
>>>under the over lap. The hinge goes between the top skin and the L
>>>channel,
>>>it is quick and easy with very little additional weight.
>>>
>>>Clyde Barcus
>>>601XL
>>
>> -
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry" <lrm01@centurytel.net>
In my humble opinion, 75 lbs is massive overkill. Stop and think about it
for a minute. The ZAC system is a leverage system. In other words the
pressure needed at your hand, which is what the actuator load is
duplicating, is far less than would be needed at the actual flap. I have
no idea how much differential it is but would think some where around 5 to
1. In a 701 the flap control is located on the left side of the pilot near
the floor. If anyone thinks they can extend their left hand straight down
and excerpt over 25 lbs of pressure then they are pretty strong. Just for
grins I put my left hand extended on a scale and tried to hold or push and
was having a hard time and shaking at 21.5 lbs. If you put your actuator
as a direct connect to the flaps, then more power will be needed, but that's
not the way to do it. Twenty five lbs is more than sufficient for the 701.
Speed, I've have people tell me that my actuator was too fast. My answer is
to ask this question, "is it as fast as your hand moving the flap lever from
0 to 30 degrees in one swift move?" The answer is NO.
Larry, N1345L, www.skyhawg.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "N5SL" <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 8:18 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches)
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
>
> William:
>
> First and foremost, my project is not finished and has
> not flown. So take this for what it's worth.
>
> There's more to this discussion than money. I've not
> heard a lot of talk on the limit switch issue but I
> think it deserves a look.
>
> The ZAC supplied, costly actuator has external limit
> switches that you must adjust. These are fragile and
> have a lot of nuts and bolts, wires etc. exposed. I
> looked at doing the same thing with an automobile
> window or seat motor, but it brought me right back to
> the exposed limit switches since the thing needs to
> know to stop at end of travel.
>
> I ended up with a 75 lb. actuator that works very well
> and has internal limit switches so the trick is to set
> it up to use all of the travel in both directions.
> Very simple, really and it's a much cleaner
> installation. I read recently on this list where a
> factory-built 601XL had a problem with an external
> limit switch. Predictable.
>
> Here are a few photos of what I ended up with. There
> are more photos on my "fuselage" page:
>
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_21_04_Flaps.JPG
>
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_17_04_Actuator.JPG
>
> The last one has the part number for the actuator if
> you look closely.
>
> I also looked into making a trim servo from an
> automobile side-view mirror motor. I got pretty far
> with this and it was looking promising until
> guess-what? The limit switches just became too
> complicated and bulky so I saved up some money and
> purchased a RAC (MAC) servo. The first thing I did
> was take it apart and void the warranty to see what
> was inside. And what do you know it had some baby
> limit switches tucked neatly inside. This little
> device was worth every penny. Here's a picture in
> case you are interested:
>
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/RAC_Innards.JPG
>
> Here's my poor attempt at the same thing:
>
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/TrimMotor3.JPG
>
> Have fun,
>
> Scott Laughlin
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/
> Houston, we have a working radio!
>
>
> --- William Murray <tall_tech_teach@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Being a penny pinching school teacher, I found the
>> price and weight for the spec'd flap actuator motor
>> to
>> be too much. My question is this..... have they
> flown
>> with
>> them yet? 25 lbs seems to be too small a force to
>> overcome the wind pressure on both flaps at Vfe or
>> below. How are other frugal builders actuating their
>> flaps?
>
>
> --
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Trainnut01@aol.com
Aaron
Adding a couple of diodes to your limit switches will make that seat motor
reversible. I used one to open a skylight in my shop that can not be easily
reached.
Carroll Jernigan
XL
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Ailerons 601XL |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: <dredmoody@cox.net>
I second the motion. The demo plane had no lack of aileron response and neither
did it have a stiff feel in the least. That plane has just short of 1,000 hours
on it and the paint was not cracked nor was the "hinge" skin. I was dubious
about that feature before but I see no problem with it now. I recommend building
it hingeless.... just my opinion of course,
Ed
> OK guys. Now you have me curious.
I tried flying with the hingeless design on the factory
> demonstrator and found full aileron authority all the way down to
> stall speed. What more would you hope to gain with piano hinges?
>
> Paul
Message 12
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: James Sagerser <alaskajim@cox.net>
On 2/7/06 8:24 AM, "Charles Deiterich" <cfd@thegateway.net> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Charles Deiterich" <cfd@thegateway.net>
>
> Hal had the flu around the first of the year and was in the hospital but
> was supposed to go home. I have not heard anything since then.
> Chuck D.
> N701TX
>
>
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tommy Walker" <twalker@cableone.net>
>>
>> Listers,
>>
>> Has anyone had contact with Hal Rozema of Phoenix, AZ? His 701 web site
>> is
>> down and he hasn't posted anything on this list for some time now.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Tommy Walker in Alabama
>> Do Not Archive
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I have some new information; I spoke with his wife Jackie last night. Hal
has had some serious health challenges including two types of influenzas,
Valley Fever, and other complications. He is still in the hospital but
happy to report, he is recovering (just go out of another 3 weeks in the
ICU). Under the circumstances, he asked Jackie to sell his project, which
she recently did, to a local person who plans to have it flying in 3 months.
He will take Hal flying when hes better. Hal said the most important thing
about building the 701 was not the airplane itself but the friends he met
along the way.
Do Not Archive
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Gift Horse and Bad Teeth) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Larry:
I thought about it for a minute then remembered "Never
look a gift horse in the mouth." For what it's worth,
my actuator was given to me and it would have been
rude (and stupid) to refuse it or complain because it
wasn't the 25lb model. My model number is
S12-17A8-04. The 25lb model is S12-09A4-04. You can
see the spec. sheet on this unit here:
http://www.powerdrives.com/electrak/S12-09A4-04.htm
If you aren't lucky like me, you can purchase one for
under $200 brand new. No extra parts required to make
it stop at the end of travel both ways.
To make it work electrically, all you need is a
reversing toggle switch from steinair.com, Part no.
SA-806 ($14.50) which is momentary with the center off
and it reverses polarity with an up or down flip of
the switch. The actuator stops at the end of travel
or if you let go of the switch.
I can't see a reason why this is not better than the
ZAC supplied material. But then again theirs has flown
and mine just decorates my garage.
Scott Laughlin
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/
Where it's snowing sideways outside
--- Larry <lrm01@centurytel.net> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry"
> <lrm01@centurytel.net>
>
> In my humble opinion, 75 lbs is massive overkill.
> Stop and think about it for a minute.
Message 14
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| Subject: | 701 quick build kit |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Allen Ricks" <allenricks@verizon.net>
Howdy again Mike,
Last I heard they did not have plans for a 701 quick build.
The plan for the 701 was to make an upgraded model with a
higher gross, label it the 750, and sell it as a S-LSA.
Chris stated that he did not plan to sell the 750 in any
kit form. This was as of about a year ago.
I'm not sure if much has been done towards building the 750
or not, as I have seen no updates since I saw the article
mentioning the 750.
Allen Ricks
Beaverton, OR
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
Elwood140@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 5:36 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 quick build kit
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Elwood140@aol.com
In a message dated 2/16/2006 7:27:07 AM Central Standard Time,
pedfly60@yahoo.com writes:
Does anyone know if zenith plans to offer the 701 as a quick build kit?
Thank you, Mike Pedri, Beckley, WV
Mike, go to _www.Zenithair.com_ (http://www.Zenithair.com) and ask Nick or
Sebastien that question.
Regards,
Larry Wood
(N701LW this year maybe)
Message 15
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Aaron Gustafson" <agustafson@chartermi.net>
I'm planning on building a mount for an 0-200 (yes I'm giving up on the Subaru!)
but if anyone happened to have a spare mount for a HD/HDS/0-200, That would
save me time. Or if anyone has modified an existing mount and would have recommendations,
please contact me directly.
Thanks
Aaron do not archive
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: (Gift Horse and Bad Teeth) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: japhillipsga@aol.com
Scott, I flew 1.1 hrs this morning. I put it down as a "Mental Health morning"
for pay purposes. I needed a bit of time above 5000 feet to clear my head and
feed the spirit. Sorry to read it's snowing sideways there. Here in Georgia it
was warm and smooth. Soon, you to can curse the weather (as if that helps).
Regards, Bill 601XL-3300 (55.2 hours)
-----Original Message-----
From: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thu, 16 Feb 2006 08:31:23 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Gift Horse and Bad Teeth)
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Larry:
I thought about it for a minute then remembered "Never
look a gift horse in the mouth." For what it's worth,
my actuator was given to me and it would have been
rude (and stupid) to refuse it or complain because it
wasn't the 25lb model. My model number is
S12-17A8-04. The 25lb model is S12-09A4-04. You can
see the spec. sheet on this unit here:
http://www.powerdrives.com/electrak/S12-09A4-04.htm
If you aren't lucky like me, you can purchase one for
under $200 brand new. No extra parts required to make
it stop at the end of travel both ways.
To make it work electrically, all you need is a
reversing toggle switch from steinair.com, Part no.
SA-806 ($14.50) which is momentary with the center off
and it reverses polarity with an up or down flip of
the switch. The actuator stops at the end of travel
or if you let go of the switch.
I can't see a reason why this is not better than the
ZAC supplied material. But then again theirs has flown
and mine just decorates my garage.
Scott Laughlin
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/
Where it's snowing sideways outside
--- Larry <lrm01@centurytel.net> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry"
> <lrm01@centurytel.net>
>
> In my humble opinion, 75 lbs is massive overkill.
> Stop and think about it for a minute.
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: japhillipsga@aol.com
Scott, I just read the post about a flap motor actuator that weighs 75 pounds.
That's got to be a mis- print, isn't it ?
-----Original Message-----
From: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thu, 16 Feb 2006 06:18:59 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches)
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
William:
First and foremost, my project is not finished and has
not flown. So take this for what it's worth.
There's more to this discussion than money. I've not
heard a lot of talk on the limit switch issue but I
think it deserves a look.
The ZAC supplied, costly actuator has external limit
switches that you must adjust. These are fragile and
have a lot of nuts and bolts, wires etc. exposed. I
looked at doing the same thing with an automobile
window or seat motor, but it brought me right back to
the exposed limit switches since the thing needs to
know to stop at end of travel.
I ended up with a 75 lb. actuator that works very well
and has internal limit switches so the trick is to set
it up to use all of the travel in both directions.
Very simple, really and it's a much cleaner
installation. I read recently on this list where a
factory-built 601XL had a problem with an external
limit switch. Predictable.
Here are a few photos of what I ended up with. There
are more photos on my "fuselage" page:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_21_04_Flaps.JPG
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_17_04_Actuator.JPG
The last one has the part number for the actuator if
you look closely.
I also looked into making a trim servo from an
automobile side-view mirror motor. I got pretty far
with this and it was looking promising until
guess-what? The limit switches just became too
complicated and bulky so I saved up some money and
purchased a RAC (MAC) servo. The first thing I did
was take it apart and void the warranty to see what
was inside. And what do you know it had some baby
limit switches tucked neatly inside. This little
device was worth every penny. Here's a picture in
case you are interested:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/RAC_Innards.JPG
Here's my poor attempt at the same thing:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/TrimMotor3.JPG
Have fun,
Scott Laughlin
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/
Houston, we have a working radio!
--- William Murray <tall_tech_teach@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Being a penny pinching school teacher, I found the
> price and weight for the spec'd flap actuator motor
> to
> be too much. My question is this..... have they
flown
> with
> them yet? 25 lbs seems to be too small a force to
> overcome the wind pressure on both flaps at Vfe or
> below. How are other frugal builders actuating their
> flaps?
Message 18
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| Subject: | Aviation Thoughts |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Beckman, Rick" <Rick.Beckman@atk.com>
Just thought some humor might be in order....... DO NOT ARCHIVE
Aviation Thoughts
1. No matter what else happens, fly the airplane. Forget all that stuff about
thrust and drag, lift and gravity; an airplane flies because of money.
2.It's better to be down here wishing you were up there, than up there wishing
you were down here.
3. If you're ever faced with a forced landing at night, turn on the landing
lights to see the landing area. If you don't like what you
see, turn' em back off.
4. A check ride ought to be like a skirt, short enough to be interesting but
still be long enough to cover everything.
5. Speed is life, altitude is life insurance. No one has ever collided with
the sky!
6. Always remember you fly an airplane with your head, not your hands.
7. Never let an airplane take you somewhere your brain didn't get to Five minutes
earlier.
8. "Unskilled" pilots are always found in the wreckage with their hand around
the microphone.
9. If you push the stick forward, the houses get bigger; if you pull the stick
back, they get smaller. (Unless you keep pulling the stick
back-then they get bigger again.)
10. Hovering is for pilots who love to fly but have no place to go.
11. The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.
12. Flying is the second greatest thrill known to man. Landing is the first!
13.Everyone already knows the definition of a 'good' landing is one from which
you can walk away. But very few know the definition of a 'great'
landing. It's one after which you can use the airplane another time.
14. The probability of survival is equal to the angle of arrival.
15. IFR: I Follow Roads.
16. Those who hoot with the owls by night should not fly with the eagles by
day.
17.A helicopter is a collection of rotating parts going round and round and
reciprocating parts going up and down - all of them trying to become
random in motion.
18. Helicopters can't really fly - they're just so ugly that the earth immediately
repels them.
19. Pilots believe in clean living. They never drink whiskey from a dirty
glass.
20.Things which do you no good in aviation: Altitude above you. Runway behind
you. Fuel in the truck. Half a second ago. Approach plates in the
car. The airspeed you don't have.
21. If God meant man to fly, He'd have given him more money.
22. Flying is not dangerous; crashing is dangerous.
23. A good simulator check ride is like successful surgery on a corpse.
24. Asking what a pilot thinks about the FAA is like asking a tree what it
thinks about dogs.
25. Trust your captain but keep your seat belt securely fastened.
26. An airplane may disappoint a good pilot, but it won't surprise him.
27.Any pilot who relies on a terminal forecast can be sold the Brooklyn Bridge.
If he relies on winds-aloft reports he can be sold Niagara Falls.
28. The friendliest flight attendants are those on the trip home.
29. Good judgment comes from experience and experience comes from bad judgment.
30. Being an airline pilot would be great if you didn't have to go on all those
trips.
31. Aviation is not so much a profession as it is a disease.
32. The nicer an airplane looks, the better it flies.
33. There are three simple rules for making a smooth landing. Unfortunately,
no one knows what they are.
34. It's a good landing if you can still get the doors open.
35. Passengers prefer old captains and young flight attendants.
36.The only thing worse than a captain who never flew as copilot is a copilot
who once was a captain.
37. It's best to keep the pointed end going forward as much as possible.
38. If an earthquake suddenly opened a fissure in a runway that caused an accident,
the FAA would find a way to blame it on pilot error.
39. Any attempt to stretch fuel is guaranteed to increase headwind.
40. A thunderstorm is never as bad on the inside as it appears on the outside.
It's worse.
41.It's easy to make a small fortune in aviation. You start with a large fortune.
42.A male pilot is a confused soul who talks about women when he's flying,
and about flying when he's with a woman.
43. A fool and his money are soon flying more airplane than he can handle.
44. Try to keep the number of your landings equal to the number of your takeoffs.
45. Takeoffs are optional. Landings are mandatory.
46. You cannot propel yourself forward by patting yourself on the back.
47.The difference between a fighter pilot & a pig? A pig doesn't sit at a bar
until 0300 waiting to pick up on a fighter pilot.
AUTHOR UNKNOWN
DO NOT ARCHIVE DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Actuator WEIGHT |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Bill:
I guess I wasn't very clear on that. I should have
stated the load capacity is 75 lbs. It weighs the
same as the 25 lb unit at 1.35 lbs. I don't know the
weight of the ZAC unit.
Enjoy that warm Georgia weather. I'll enjoy blasting
through the snow on my way home from work.
Scott Laughlin
Still snowing sideways outside.
--- japhillipsga@aol.com wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by:
> japhillipsga@aol.com
>
> Scott, I just read the post about a flap motor
> actuator that weighs 75 pounds. That's got to be a
> mis- print, isn't it ?
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 20
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|
--> Zenith-List message posted by: James Sagerser <alaskajim@cox.net>
On 2/7/06 8:24 AM, "Charles Deiterich" <cfd@thegateway.net> wrote:
I have some new information; I spoke with his wife Jackie last night. Hal
has had some serious health challenges including two types of influenzas,
Valley Fever, and other complications. He is still in the hospital but
happy to report, he is recovering (just go out of another 3 weeks in the
ICU). Under the circumstances, he asked Jackie to sell his project, which
she recently did, to a local person who plans to have it flying in 3 months.
He will take Hal flying when he's better. Hal said the most important thing
about building the 701 was not the airplane itself but the friends he met
along the way.
Do Not Archive
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Charles Deiterich" <cfd@thegateway.net>
>
> Hal had the flu around the first of the year and was in the hospital but
> was supposed to go home. I have not heard anything since then.
> Chuck D.
> N701TX
>
>
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tommy Walker" <twalker@cableone.net>
>>
>> Listers,
>>
>> Has anyone had contact with Hal Rozema of Phoenix, AZ? His 701 web site
>> is
>> down and he hasn't posted anything on this list for some time now.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Tommy Walker in Alabama
>> Do Not Archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Flap Actuator WEIGHT |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Allen Ricks" <allenricks@verizon.net>
The Zenith unit weighs 4.45 lbs. Just went out to the garage
and weighed it. Heavy bugger.
Allen Ricks
Beaverton, OR
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of N5SL
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 11:05 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator WEIGHT
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Bill:
I guess I wasn't very clear on that. I should have
stated the load capacity is 75 lbs. It weighs the
same as the 25 lb unit at 1.35 lbs. I don't know the
weight of the ZAC unit.
Enjoy that warm Georgia weather. I'll enjoy blasting
through the snow on my way home from work.
Scott Laughlin
Still snowing sideways outside.
--- japhillipsga@aol.com wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by:
> japhillipsga@aol.com
>
> Scott, I just read the post about a flap motor
> actuator that weighs 75 pounds. That's got to be a
> mis- print, isn't it ?
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Ailerons 601XL |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Leo Gates <leogates@allvantage.com>
I have the "hingless ailerons" and see no reason anyone would want piano
hinges.
Just in the interest of accuracy - From Chris Hines' article: "...and
the deflection of the aileron a maximum of +/- 15 degrees...in a
relatively short period, the cycles from the statistics could be applied
to the deflection of the aileron for an aircraft utilization of 10,000
flying hours. No crack (not even chipped paint) was noticed....After
that, and just to know if by any bad luck it did crack, do I have to
repair it in the field, or can I fly safely home and fix it in the shop?
I cut a 1/8" notch at both inboard and outboard ends of the flex area
with snips and restarted running the tests.
After the equivalent of another 3 hours, the notch had developed into a
crack reaching on one end the first rivet, and on the other end the
second rivet through the wing skin and rear channel. The test was then
continued for the equivalent of another 10,000 flying hours with no
further deterioration."
Leo Gates
N601Z
Jeffrey J Paris wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jeffrey J Paris" <jeffrey-j-paris@excite.com>
>
>
>Mr. CoJo,
>
>Chris Heintz's hingeless/aileron gap seal design for the ailerons is ingenious
to say the least. The simplicity of design and very thorough testing, ie. 300,000
plus 180 degree deflections of the aluminium "hinge" with a 2 inch cut into
the material yielded no fatigue in the cut. I was told this by my building
mentor who scratch built his 601 and has built 3 other planes before this last
one. He is a retired machinist and sheet metal expert at Xerox during his
working years and he has had this very talk with Chris Heintz.
>
>I have been flying my CH601XL for 50 hours and the design as it stands makes for
a simple, affordable, easily maintained and sound aircraft. Remember the KISS
acronym "keep it simple stu..." and Chris does, Hingeless is where it is at!
For what it is worth... just adding my 2 cents worth.
>
>Jeff Paris
>N196ZP Jabiru 3300 CH601XL
>
>
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Women Building Zeniths |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry McFarland <larrymc@qconline.com>
Jennifer,
Pleased to have you among the builders here. There's lots of knowledge
within the archives and responses here are unusually civil for this medium.
I'd mention that it is also really useful to join an EAA chapter if you
have one locally. Our Chapter 75 has one young lady
building a 4-place Cozy (similar to a wide Rutan VariEazy). The 601XL
is a nice design that lends itself to a really good build experience and
it's a great
aircraft to fly. Zenith will sell you just the pieces you find too
tooling-intensive if you ask. The rest are generally easily made per
print from scratch if
your budget's tight. I'm a scratch builder and thoroughly enjoyed the
5-1/2-year process of building per plans. Zenith was very responsive
despite the fact that
I only purchased a few items like canopy-bubble, wheels, brakes and a
radiator kit for a Subaru. Good people! My advise is that the project is
only one piece at a time, go slowly and enjoy the process. Good luck
and if you goof up a part, consider remaking that part from the
drawings. If
you have difficulty with a process or method here, visit my site and
consider the images or journal presented there that might help you get
the job done.
Good luck and do ask questions as they occur, we're going to be hoping
to hear more of your progress.
Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
do not archive
Jennifer Moorhouse wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: Jennifer Moorhouse <finesse152@yahoo.com>
>
>In reply to Robert Sceppa's question of women building Zeniths, I don't know how
many of us there are, but I'm another woman who just started building a 601
XL.
> I've been kind of lurking the list for a little while since finding out about
it from a fellow builder and list member. I built my rudder in my living room
a couple of years ago and was postponed building more until moving to a new
area of the state, getting married, buying a house, and having a baby. I started
trying to scratch build more of the empennage while I was pregnant, but, even
with help, couldn't get long pieces of metal, spars and doublers, bent on my
home-made brake without them coming out bowed. I decided to save a bit of money
up and just placed an order for the tail kit. It's a relief really, knowing
the parts will be made correctly and having the skins pre-drilled. I wish I
had enough cash to buy the whole kit or even someone else's partially built kit,
but I don't.
> My husband is a pilot as well, so I'm not totally alone building our plane,
but I work fewer hours and have more time for the project. I hope to have it completed
and flying before our daughter is old enough for her license. Until then,
we'll stay current in a rented 152, 172, or Diamond Katana.
>
> Jennifer Moorhouse
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: nyterminat@aol.com
Surplus supply has seat moters with acme screw actuators, some have suggested
an automotive one from an outfit in California. It starts with an Fand ends in
an I, I,m sorry I just traveled to Ghana so I don,t have my records with me.
Check the archives. I used them, it was on sale for $99.00, used a 3 inch stroke
but only need about 2 inch. I moved the limit switches to what stroke I needed.
I have used it in my 701 and am quite pleased with it. They have 175 lb force
and only takes a few seconds for full travel.
Bob Spudis
N701ZX 912S
-----Original Message-----
From: Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com>
Sent: Wed, 15 Feb 2006 22:48:10 -0700
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives?
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
Some have used electric windows motors. But I can't point to any specifics.
Certainly these day when many cars come equipped with electric windows you
stand a good chance of finding a bargain at a wrecking yard.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Murray
Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2006 9:40 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives?
--> Zenith-List message posted by: William Murray
--> <tall_tech_teach@yahoo.com>
Being a penny pinching school teacher, I found the price and weight for the
spec'd flap actuator motor to be too much. I scanned the archives and saw
that a #25 linear actuator motor was being proposed by a few members. My
question is this..... have they flown with them yet? 25 lbs seems to be too
small a force to overcome the wind pressure on both flaps at Vfe or below.
How are other frugal builders actuating their flaps? I have thought about
using a "manual actuator"
(a lever with detents for 0-30 degrees), but I'm building a dual stick
version so it won't look like the prototype that Zenith Air built in which
the lever was between the pilot's legs. I would love it to be near the
center arm rest, but I also need a console and doubt that there will be
space for both.
HELP!!!
Warmest Wishes in Olalla, WA
William Murray
tall_tech_teach@yahoo.com
Message 25
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| Subject: | Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
The Zenith factory motor would have the same problem. See page 6-B-20 of the
plans ("Air Scoop Cabin FRESH AIR VENT FLAP CIRCUIT") for the wiring that
solves this problem.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Gustafson
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 7:11 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives?
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Aaron Gustafson"
--> <agustafson@chartermi.net>
I used a power seat motor from a Lincoln. One problem w/ these types of
motors is that they use the same motor winding for both directions which
presents an issue when you try to put a limit on the travel. If you put a
cut out switch in the circuit, that switch also prevents reversing the
motor, so won't work. If you rely on a physical stop, it is likely that the
motor will bind and not reverse. Things to think about!
Aaron do not archive
Message 26
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| Subject: | Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
I have its immediate predecessor but have only bench-flown it yet.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hines
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 7:18 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "John Hines"
--> <John.Hines@craftontull.com>
Does anyone have the Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL. It looks like a pretty
neat device and relatively inexpensive. I've done some searching on the net
for current installs and all I can find are a couple of ulta-lights and 1
Sonex. Has anyone seen one in a 601?
John Hines
www.johnsplane.com
John Hines
IT Manager
Crafton, Tull & Associates
901 N. 47th Street, Suite 200
Rogers, AR 72756
Tel: 479-878-2449
Mob: 479-366-4783
Fax: 479-631-6224
John.Hines@craftontull.com
Crafton, Tull & Associates exists to anticipate and understand the needs of
our clients and provide them with successful solutions.
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed..
If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the
individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not
disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender
immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete
this e-mail from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you are
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Message 27
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| Subject: | Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
Another alternative is to use a "Super" radio controlled aircraft servo.
Some of these put out many pounds of thrust as they (like the MAC servos)
take a small high speed motor and gear it way down. They are rated in many
pounds of pounds of thrust. Control then it with this "Extremely General
Purpose Non-MAC SERVO CONTROLLER" from Perihelion Design:
http://periheliondesign.com/moreproductsfiles/ServoController.pdf
This general approach can be used to move "things" from the control panel in
many other situations.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N5SL
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 7:19 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches)
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
William:
First and foremost, my project is not finished and has not flown. So take
this for what it's worth.
There's more to this discussion than money. I've not heard a lot of talk on
the limit switch issue but I think it deserves a look.
The ZAC supplied, costly actuator has external limit switches that you must
adjust. These are fragile and have a lot of nuts and bolts, wires etc.
exposed. I looked at doing the same thing with an automobile window or seat
motor, but it brought me right back to the exposed limit switches since the
thing needs to know to stop at end of travel.
I ended up with a 75 lb. actuator that works very well and has internal
limit switches so the trick is to set it up to use all of the travel in both
directions.
Very simple, really and it's a much cleaner installation. I read recently
on this list where a factory-built 601XL had a problem with an external
limit switch. Predictable.
Here are a few photos of what I ended up with. There are more photos on my
"fuselage" page:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_21_04_Flaps.JPG
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_17_04_Actuator.JPG
The last one has the part number for the actuator if you look closely.
I also looked into making a trim servo from an
automobile side-view mirror motor. I got pretty far
with this and it was looking promising until guess-what? The limit switches
just became too complicated and bulky so I saved up some money and purchased
a RAC (MAC) servo. The first thing I did was take it apart and void the
warranty to see what was inside. And what do you know it had some baby
limit switches tucked neatly inside. This little device was worth every
penny. Here's a picture in case you are interested:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/RAC_Innards.JPG
Here's my poor attempt at the same thing:
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/TrimMotor3.JPG
Have fun,
Scott Laughlin
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/
Houston, we have a working radio!
--- William Murray <tall_tech_teach@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Being a penny pinching school teacher, I found the price and weight
> for the spec'd flap actuator motor to be too much. My question is
> this..... have they
flown
> with
> them yet? 25 lbs seems to be too small a force to overcome the wind
> pressure on both flaps at Vfe or below. How are other frugal builders
> actuating their flaps?
Message 28
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| Subject: | Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
Actuation speed is not a problem unless the motor coasts in which case the
motor over-shoots. There is a way to wire diodes into the switch circuit
such that they "short" the windings which acts as a break. "All" I have to
do is find the schematic for this.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches)
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry" <lrm01@centurytel.net>
In my humble opinion, 75 lbs is massive overkill. Stop and think about it
for a minute. The ZAC system is a leverage system. In other words the
pressure needed at your hand, which is what the actuator load is
duplicating, is far less than would be needed at the actual flap. I have
no idea how much differential it is but would think some where around 5 to
1. In a 701 the flap control is located on the left side of the pilot near
the floor. If anyone thinks they can extend their left hand straight down
and excerpt over 25 lbs of pressure then they are pretty strong. Just for
grins I put my left hand extended on a scale and tried to hold or push and
was having a hard time and shaking at 21.5 lbs. If you put your actuator
as a direct connect to the flaps, then more power will be needed, but that's
not the way to do it. Twenty five lbs is more than sufficient for the 701.
Speed, I've have people tell me that my actuator was too fast. My answer is
to ask this question, "is it as fast as your hand moving the flap lever from
0 to 30 degrees in one swift move?" The answer is NO.
Larry, N1345L, www.skyhawg.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "N5SL" <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 8:18 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Alternatives? (Limit Switches)
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
>
> William:
>
> First and foremost, my project is not finished and has
> not flown. So take this for what it's worth.
>
> There's more to this discussion than money. I've not
> heard a lot of talk on the limit switch issue but I
> think it deserves a look.
>
> The ZAC supplied, costly actuator has external limit
> switches that you must adjust. These are fragile and
> have a lot of nuts and bolts, wires etc. exposed. I
> looked at doing the same thing with an automobile
> window or seat motor, but it brought me right back to
> the exposed limit switches since the thing needs to
> know to stop at end of travel.
>
> I ended up with a 75 lb. actuator that works very well
> and has internal limit switches so the trick is to set
> it up to use all of the travel in both directions.
> Very simple, really and it's a much cleaner
> installation. I read recently on this list where a
> factory-built 601XL had a problem with an external
> limit switch. Predictable.
>
> Here are a few photos of what I ended up with. There
> are more photos on my "fuselage" page:
>
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_21_04_Flaps.JPG
>
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_17_04_Actuator.JPG
>
> The last one has the part number for the actuator if
> you look closely.
>
> I also looked into making a trim servo from an
> automobile side-view mirror motor. I got pretty far
> with this and it was looking promising until
> guess-what? The limit switches just became too
> complicated and bulky so I saved up some money and
> purchased a RAC (MAC) servo. The first thing I did
> was take it apart and void the warranty to see what
> was inside. And what do you know it had some baby
> limit switches tucked neatly inside. This little
> device was worth every penny. Here's a picture in
> case you are interested:
>
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/RAC_Innards.JPG
>
> Here's my poor attempt at the same thing:
>
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/TrimMotor3.JPG
>
> Have fun,
>
> Scott Laughlin
> http://www.cooknwithgas.com/
> Houston, we have a working radio!
>
>
> --- William Murray <tall_tech_teach@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Being a penny pinching school teacher, I found the
>> price and weight for the spec'd flap actuator motor
>> to
>> be too much. My question is this..... have they
> flown
>> with
>> them yet? 25 lbs seems to be too small a force to
>> overcome the wind pressure on both flaps at Vfe or
>> below. How are other frugal builders actuating their
>> flaps?
>
>
> --
>
>
Message 29
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| Subject: | Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
Actually the circuit in the 601XL plans (6-B-20) does this with no diodes.
But it is not something I can describe in an e-mail. All that is needed is
the two SPST limit switches and a DPDT, (momentary-off-momentary) toggle
switch and some wire.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Trainnut01@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives?
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Trainnut01@aol.com
Aaron
Adding a couple of diodes to your limit switches will make that seat motor
reversible. I used one to open a skylight in my shop that can not be easily
reached.
Carroll Jernigan
XL
Message 30
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| Subject: | Flap Actuator Motor Alternatives? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Ron Butterfield <rbutterfield@mebtel.net>
At 04:43 PM 2/16/06, you wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
>
>Actually the circuit in the 601XL plans (6-B-20) does this with no diodes.
>But it is not something I can describe in an e-mail. All that is needed is
>the two SPST limit switches and a DPDT, (momentary-off-momentary) toggle
>switch and some wire.
Let me try to describe it (without looking at the drawings ;-) )
The DPDT switch will connect separate wires for travel in either
direction. The limit switch for that end of travel is put in the wire
that is switched for travel in that direction.
So, when it reaches the end of it's travel in one way, the wires for
driving the motor that direction are disconnected, but it can still
be driven the other way.
>
Regards,
RonB
Message 31
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| Subject: | Zenith float keel strips |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "jnbolding1" <jnbolding1@mail.ev1.net>
Group, There are several of you that are either building or planning to build
Zenith alum floats for your 601/701. The ONLY part that is hard to acquire is
the extruded keel and it is a special extrusion that Zenith had made and now Czech
Aircraft/Skyshops has it. Danny , the gentleman that he is, has agreed to
provide a shipment of keel strip material for us scratch builders if we can
get together a large enough order to make it worthwhile.
He hasn't given me a price yet as I assume that is contigent on quantity so let's
just get a count of how many would be interested if the price/shipping were
right so we can give him a rough number to work on, I'm gonna get enough for
2 sets in case repair is needed down the road er river.
I'll keep score and report to Danny and we'll go from there. LOW&SLOW John Bolding
Message 32
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|
| Subject: | Re: Aviation Thoughts |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill+Rose" <naumuk@alltel.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Beckman, Rick" <Rick.Beckman@atk.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 2:00 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Aviation Thoughts
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Beckman, Rick" <Rick.Beckman@atk.com>
>
> Just thought some humor might be in order....... DO NOT
> ARCHIVE
Rick-
Better proofread your jokes better- someone snuck in a profound
statement!
Bill
> 29. Good judgment comes from experience and experience comes from bad
> judgment.
>
>
> DO NOT ARCHIVE DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
>
Message 33
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| Subject: | 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave VanLanen" <davevanlanen@sbcglobal.net>
I have a question regarding the steel support beams for building the 601 XL.
I purchased two 4' X 2" X 2" steel beams like we used in the workshop for
the rudder, thinking that was all I would need. But when I looked ahead in
the photo assembly guide, I noticed that they specify six 5' X 2" X 2" beams
for building the wings. I can get these at a sheet metal shop, but it would
cost me at least $70. For those of you who are building or have completed a
601 XL - should I just suck it up and spend the money to get them? Are they
necessary for properly jigging the components? Or are there other cheaper
options I can use? I have not been able to find anything at the local
hardware or lumber outlets. I thought about using wood, but it is not
dimensionally stable.
Thanks in advance,
Dave Van Lanen
601 XL - stabilizer
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Mice and Storage |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: William Jeffries <vair601@yahoo.com>
Roland,
Cats would sound like a good idea however I'd recommend hanging the wings by
straps from the rafters. Still cover any openings with metal or even aluminum
foil tape. Good luck.
Bill Jeffries
---------------------------------
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
Many airplanes have been built on wood beams and tables. Wood is fairly
stable if you don't take several heating and cooling seasons to build. But
even then I don't think it will make much difference.
Cy Galley - Chair,
AirVenture Emergency Aircraft Repair
A Service Project of Chapter 75
EAA Safety Programs Editor - TC
EAA Sport Pilot----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave VanLanen" <davevanlanen@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 8:58 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave VanLanen"
> <davevanlanen@sbcglobal.net>
>
> I have a question regarding the steel support beams for building the 601
> XL.
> I purchased two 4' X 2" X 2" steel beams like we used in the workshop for
> the rudder, thinking that was all I would need. But when I looked ahead
> in
> the photo assembly guide, I noticed that they specify six 5' X 2" X 2"
> beams
> for building the wings. I can get these at a sheet metal shop, but it
> would
> cost me at least $70. For those of you who are building or have completed
> a
> 601 XL - should I just suck it up and spend the money to get them? Are
> they
> necessary for properly jigging the components? Or are there other cheaper
> options I can use? I have not been able to find anything at the local
> hardware or lumber outlets. I thought about using wood, but it is not
> dimensionally stable.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Dave Van Lanen
> 601 XL - stabilizer
>
>
>
Message 36
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| Subject: | RE: Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker <btucke73@yahoo.com>
John,
I have a Stratomaster Ultra XL installed. I am
not flying yet, but getting close. The unit is easy
to install, using the RDAC unit for all wiring fwd of
the firewall. I will send some pictures of my
installation to your personal address. I am currently
building a website, and will post there in the next
couple of weeks for everyone to see. You may hold out
for the color unit they have been working on for a
while. It will have moving map GPS. Check out
sportflyingshop.com. Matt is good at answering e-mail
questions. I flew up to El Monte, Ca. to inspect the
unit before buying, and he is quite helpful.
R/
Brandon
Fuselage painted
Working on flames!
Waiting on nitrited crank
Do not archive
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert Schoenberger" <hrs1@frontiernet.net>
I got 3" x 3" square steel tubes from a metal surplus warehouse (local).
The cost was nominal, and they were cut from longer lengths. However, they
are extremely heavy and not pleasant to move around. Check the archives on
this - I think that some have used PVC pipe. Robert Schoenberger 701 55%
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave VanLanen" <davevanlanen@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 9:58 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave VanLanen"
> <davevanlanen@sbcglobal.net>
>
> I have a question regarding the steel support beams for building the 601
> XL.
> I purchased two 4' X 2" X 2" steel beams like we used in the workshop for
> the rudder, thinking that was all I would need. But when I looked ahead
> in
> the photo assembly guide, I noticed that they specify six 5' X 2" X 2"
> beams
> for building the wings. I can get these at a sheet metal shop, but it
> would
> cost me at least $70. For those of you who are building or have completed
> a
> 601 XL - should I just suck it up and spend the money to get them? Are
> they
> necessary for properly jigging the components? Or are there other cheaper
> options I can use? I have not been able to find anything at the local
> hardware or lumber outlets. I thought about using wood, but it is not
> dimensionally stable.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Dave Van Lanen
> 601 XL - stabilizer
>
>
>
Message 38
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Is good news to hear Hal is recovering, hope we can see a post of him once in
a while, once he has the strenth to seat in front the computer...
I bet Hal smiled when he knew we miss him.
Also, How about inviting the new owner to the list?
Saludos
Gary Gower
701 912S
Flying from Chapala, Mexico.
James Sagerser <alaskajim@cox.net> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: James Sagerser
On 2/7/06 8:24 AM, "Charles Deiterich" wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Charles Deiterich"
>
> Hal had the flu around the first of the year and was in the hospital but
> was supposed to go home. I have not heard anything since then.
> Chuck D.
> N701TX
>
>
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tommy Walker"
>>
>> Listers,
>>
>> Has anyone had contact with Hal Rozema of Phoenix, AZ? His 701 web site
>> is
>> down and he hasn't posted anything on this list for some time now.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Tommy Walker in Alabama
>> Do Not Archive
>
I have some new information; I spoke with his wife Jackie last night. Hal
has had some serious health challenges including two types of influenzas,
Valley Fever, and other complications. He is still in the hospital but
happy to report, he is recovering (just go out of another 3 weeks in the
ICU). Under the circumstances, he asked Jackie to sell his project, which
she recently did, to a local person who plans to have it flying in 3 months.
He will take Hal flying when hes better. Hal said the most important thing
about building the 701 was not the airplane itself but the friends he met
along the way.
Do Not Archive
---------------------------------
Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: 601 XL - 2 X 2 Steel Beams |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
Hi Dave,
I use ordinary 2x4 lumber instead of the steel beams. I think they
are a vast improvement since it is easy to drive screws into them to
attach them to the wood bench or to attach blocks for keeping your
work in place instead of depending on a balancing act.
My bench has a wood top, and I mounted around 5 2x4s across it. They
are leveled and shimmed to form a nice flat top surface. I often
lay 1x2s or 2x2s across these 2x4's to support things like wings and
keep them from rolling around.
Good luck,
Paul
XL wings
>I have a question regarding the steel support beams for building the 601 XL.
>I purchased two 4' X 2" X 2" steel beams like we used in the workshop for
>the rudder, thinking that was all I would need. But when I looked ahead in
>the photo assembly guide, I noticed that they specify six 5' X 2" X 2" beams
>for building the wings. I can get these at a sheet metal shop, but it would
>cost me at least $70. For those of you who are building or have completed a
>601 XL - should I just suck it up and spend the money to get them? Are they
>necessary for properly jigging the components? Or are there other cheaper
>options I can use? I have not been able to find anything at the local
>hardware or lumber outlets. I thought about using wood, but it is not
>dimensionally stable.
>
>Thanks in advance,
>Dave Van Lanen
>601 XL - stabilizer
>
>
-
Message 40
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| Subject: | Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
I should mention that I am considering upgrading to the Ultra Horizon XL
from my Stratomaster Ultra H for one reason: the H model only has one fuel
level sender input while the XL has two. Very useful in a plane like the XL
with wing tanks.
So if anyone needs a unit for a single tank plane I can offer you a great
deal }O)
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hines
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 7:18 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "John Hines"
--> <John.Hines@craftontull.com>
Does anyone have the Stratomaster Ultra Horizon XL. It looks like a pretty
neat device and relatively inexpensive. I've done some searching on the net
for current installs and all I can find are a couple of ulta-lights and 1
Sonex. Has anyone seen one in a 601?
John Hines
www.johnsplane.com
John Hines
IT Manager
Crafton, Tull & Associates
901 N. 47th Street, Suite 200
Rogers, AR 72756
Tel: 479-878-2449
Mob: 479-366-4783
Fax: 479-631-6224
John.Hines@craftontull.com
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