---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 03/06/06: 26 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:04 AM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (cgalley) 2. 08:09 AM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (Hunt Malcolm) 3. 08:27 AM - lycoming 235 (Zill Coleman) 4. 09:02 AM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (Brandon Tucker) 5. 09:30 AM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (LarryMcFarland) 6. 09:48 AM - Re: What should the empty CG be for the 601XL? (David X) 7. 10:18 AM - Re: What should the empty CG be for the 601XL? (AndrewC) 8. 10:18 AM - Re: lycoming 235 (shilocom@mcmsys.com) 9. 10:20 AM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts -- Stainless Steel (Paul Mulwitz) 10. 10:26 AM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (shilocom@mcmsys.com) 11. 10:39 AM - Re: 601 Rudder pedal return spring (steveadams) 12. 12:42 PM - Wing Cross section (Blueraven) 13. 12:42 PM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (cgalley) 14. 01:14 PM - Which Swaging Tool? (Gig Giacona) 15. 03:10 PM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (LarryMcFarland) 16. 04:13 PM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (JERICKSON03E@aol.com) 17. 04:13 PM - Re: Which Swaging Tool? (Phil Maxson) 18. 04:24 PM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (Paul Mulwitz) 19. 06:16 PM - tragic accident (Fritz Gurschick) 20. 07:18 PM - Re: Which Swaging Tool? (Brandon Tucker) 21. 07:18 PM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts -- Stainless Steel. (Gary Gower) 22. 07:33 PM - Re: Which Swaging Tool? (Gary Gower) 23. 07:36 PM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (Gary Gower) 24. 07:44 PM - Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts (Larry) 25. 07:51 PM - Re: Re: Which Swaging Tool? (Gary Gower) 26. 08:57 PM - Re: Re: Which Swaging Tool? (Paul Mulwitz) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:04:46 AM PST US From: "cgalley" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" Joe, what would be your take on this? If he is using a grade 8 bolt for the axle itself, I have some real heart burn. It is true that 8's have stronger tensile strength than AN but the are more brittle. I can clearly remember the plane that came into the Repair at Oshkosh because the prop was " a little loose." Took off the spinner on the wood prop and found many problems. 5 of the 6 bolts had broken. They were all grade 8s. The remaining bolt that keep the plane out of Lake Winnebago as the pilot flew over from the East was an old tougher AN. The 8's had all fractured! Cy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brandon Tucker" Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 12:01 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker > > Graham, > > I used standard grade 8 bolts for axles. When > the DAR came around for my mid build inspection, I > told him that I was going to put castle nuts on the > bolts as soon as I found some. He stated that not > only is grade 8 hardware acceptable, but I could > simply tighten the nut properly, and drill a hole > through the nut and bolt and throw in a cotter pin. > It is nice having a common sense DAR in my EAA chapter > who is free! > > R/ > > Brandon > > Got my engine running today! > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 08:09:58 AM PST US Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts From: "Hunt Malcolm" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hunt Malcolm" Dear threads A slightly related topic. I'm building the dual stick version of the CH601XL and have a query on the material for the tie rods. Current drawing show 5/16" stainless threaded rod (no grade given for the stainless), a change from the original drawings which just called up steel. The photo manual gives the information as HT steel. Can anyone advise what is being supplied in the kits and if the stainless is being used (as in the aileron rods) for better thread quality. My proposal is to use 5/16" 4130N rod and thread the ends but I will have to convince my inspector this is satisfactory. Any thoughts? Regards Malcolm Hunt CH601XL Plans Builder in England -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of cgalley Sent: 06 March 2006 12:58 Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" Joe, what would be your take on this? If he is using a grade 8 bolt for the axle itself, I have some real heart burn. It is true that 8's have stronger tensile strength than AN but the are more brittle. I can clearly remember the plane that came into the Repair at Oshkosh because the prop was " a little loose." Took off the spinner on the wood prop and found many problems. 5 of the 6 bolts had broken. They were all grade 8s. The remaining bolt that keep the plane out of Lake Winnebago as the pilot flew over from the East was an old tougher AN. The 8's had all fractured! Cy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brandon Tucker" Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 12:01 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker > > Graham, > > I used standard grade 8 bolts for axles. When > the DAR came around for my mid build inspection, I > told him that I was going to put castle nuts on the > bolts as soon as I found some. He stated that not > only is grade 8 hardware acceptable, but I could > simply tighten the nut properly, and drill a hole > through the nut and bolt and throw in a cotter pin. > It is nice having a common sense DAR in my EAA chapter > who is free! > > R/ > > Brandon > > Got my engine running today! > > > Your attention is drawn to the fact that this email originated from a source external to Network Rail. *************************************************************************************************************** The content of this email (and any attachment) is confidential. It may also be legally privileged or otherwise protected from disclosure. This email should not be used by anyone who is not an original intended recipient, nor may it be copied or disclosed to anyone who is not an original intended recipient. If you have received this email by mistake please notify us by emailing the sender, and then delete the email and any copies from your system. Liability cannot be accepted for statements made which are clearly the senders own and not made on behalf of Network Rail. *************************************************************************************************************** ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:27:30 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: lycoming 235 From: "Zill Coleman" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Zill Coleman" Does anyone have a Lycoming 235 for sale? ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:02:11 AM PST US From: Brandon Tucker Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker Cy, I would not use grade 8 on the prop for exactly the reasons you mentioned. Initially, I ordered some "Axles" from Great Plains, and they promptly sent me grade 5 bolts (undrilled) with a castle nut, in the wrong size... R/ Brandon do not archive ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:30:58 AM PST US From: LarryMcFarland Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: LarryMcFarland Hunt Malcolm wrote: >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hunt Malcolm" > >Dear threads > >A slightly related topic. > >I'm building the dual stick version of the CH601XL and have a query on >the material for the tie rods. Current drawing show 5/16" stainless >threaded rod (no grade given for the stainless), a change from the >original drawings which just called up steel. The photo manual gives >the information as HT steel. > >Can anyone advise what is being supplied in the kits and if the >stainless is being used (as in the aileron rods) for better thread >quality. > >My proposal is to use 5/16" 4130N rod and thread the ends but I will >have to convince my inspector this is satisfactory. > >Any thoughts? > >Regards > >Malcolm Hunt >CH601XL Plans Builder in England > > > Malcolm, Your use of 5/16-inch 4130 rod for threaded connectors should be more than ample strength wise. You're not using the rod for anything as tough as required for prop bolts and It should hold up rather well. I'd not use regular hot rolled or heat treated rod because you would not know just how well the heat treat went without extensively testing it. Stainless is tougher and would also work well in threaded connections if you don't have to weld or rivet it at the other end. Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:48:54 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: What should the empty CG be for the 601XL? From: "David X" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "David X" I find it incredible that your aircraft is 45 lbs (20kg) lighter than the same aircraft built for the US market by the same company. Although with lighter landing gear, I don't see how the gear alone can make up the 45 lb difference. The amazing empty weight (313kg/690lbs) makes your CG configuration acceptable even in the US market were the rear CG limit is 450mm. Combined with the extended rearward CG of 500mm (or more) in the UK ... this makes the configuration quite acceptable, indeed. How do you account for the amazing difference in empty weight? -------- Zodiac 601 XL - CZAW Built - Rotax 912S DO NOT ARCHIVE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19931#19931 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:18:53 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: What should the empty CG be for the 601XL? From: "AndrewC" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "AndrewC" I've no idea as I'm not sure what differences there are between the US and European kits. I don't have any gyro instruments though, seats are nothing special, no upholstery up the sides or in the baggage bays, simple fixed pitch composite prop, but it may be that the explanation - aside from the gear - lies in the fact that my plane is partly painted. The wings and rudder are finished but the rest of the fuselage and the cowl need one more coat to be complete. I suppose all the little bits add up. Once her paint job is finished she'll be weighed again and I'll be able to see just how much fat she's picked up. I'm expecting her to pick up another 5-10kg as a result of that and most of it aft of the c of g. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19932#19932 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:18:53 AM PST US From: shilocom@mcmsys.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: lycoming 235 --> Zenith-List message posted by: shilocom@mcmsys.com I've got a O-290 Ground power that's probably to heavey, but myabe not. Bob U. >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Zill Coleman" > >Does anyone have a Lycoming 235 for sale? > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:20:21 AM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts -- Stainless Steel --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz I suspect you will find forming threads on 4130 to be huge challenge. The drawings should always rule. If the drawing calls for stainless steel rod and you want to use something else, I would suggest asking for approval of the design change from Zenith. Paul XL wings I'm building the dual stick version of the CH601XL and have a query on >the material for the tie rods. Current drawing show 5/16" stainless >threaded rod (no grade given for the stainless), a change from the >original drawings which just called up steel. > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:26:33 AM PST US From: shilocom@mcmsys.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: shilocom@mcmsys.com Remember most stainless has considerably less tensil strengh than 4130 or Grade 8. I quite often use grade 8 bolts in structural applications, but I purchase longe enough bolts where the threaded area is NOT load bearing and cut off the excess threads. Take this advise for the value you paid for it. Bob U. >--> Zenith-List message posted by: LarryMcFarland > >Hunt Malcolm wrote: > >>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hunt Malcolm" >> >>Dear threads >> >>A slightly related topic. >> >>I'm building the dual stick version of the CH601XL and have a query on >>the material for the tie rods. Current drawing show 5/16" stainless >>threaded rod (no grade given for the stainless), a change from the >>original drawings which just called up steel. The photo manual gives >>the information as HT steel. >> >>Can anyone advise what is being supplied in the kits and if the >>stainless is being used (as in the aileron rods) for better thread >>quality. >> >>My proposal is to use 5/16" 4130N rod and thread the ends but I will >>have to convince my inspector this is satisfactory. >> >>Any thoughts? >> >>Regards >> >>Malcolm Hunt >>CH601XL Plans Builder in England >> >> >> > Malcolm, > > Your use of 5/16-inch 4130 rod for threaded connectors should be more >than ample >strength wise. You're not using the rod for anything as tough as >required for prop bolts and >It should hold up rather well. I'd not use regular hot rolled or heat >treated rod because you would >not know just how well the heat treat went without extensively testing >it. Stainless is tougher and would also >work well in threaded connections if you don't have to weld or rivet it >at the other end. > >Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:39:21 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 601 Rudder pedal return spring From: "steveadams" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "steveadams" I have read of an accident, I am not sure of the aircraft type, where the builder had some springs attached to the rudder petals to hold them forward. One of the springs broke, and the springs were so strong it pulled the opposite rudder petal full forward with full deflection of the rudder. Not something you would want to happen at the wrong time. For this reason, I would go with one of the other suggestions, or go with a spring that would only hold it up in a neutral position if the opposite spring was to break. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19939#19939 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:42:38 PM PST US From: Blueraven Subject: Zenith-List: Wing Cross section --> Zenith-List message posted by: Blueraven All, I am trying to get the cross-section of the 801 wing for comparisions to some others. Does anyone have that in a cad dxf or cad dwg format or even an accurate pic file format they cld send me? Wld look something like: thanks RH ============== ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 12:42:38 PM PST US From: "cgalley" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" One of the problems that Malcolm has to endure is every change has to be approved by the PFA. He is in England where the plans have to be approved. No deviations permitted without their approval. Even have to hire their test pilot to fly off the test hours. Cy Galley EAA Safety Programs Editor Always looking for ideas and articles for EAA Sport Pilot ----- Original Message ----- From: "LarryMcFarland" Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 11:28 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts > --> Zenith-List message posted by: LarryMcFarland > > Hunt Malcolm wrote: > >>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hunt Malcolm" >> >> >>Dear threads >> >>A slightly related topic. >> >>I'm building the dual stick version of the CH601XL and have a query on >>the material for the tie rods. Current drawing show 5/16" stainless >>threaded rod (no grade given for the stainless), a change from the >>original drawings which just called up steel. The photo manual gives >>the information as HT steel. >> >>Can anyone advise what is being supplied in the kits and if the >>stainless is being used (as in the aileron rods) for better thread >>quality. >> >>My proposal is to use 5/16" 4130N rod and thread the ends but I will >>have to convince my inspector this is satisfactory. >> >>Any thoughts? >> >>Regards >> >>Malcolm Hunt >>CH601XL Plans Builder in England >> >> >> > Malcolm, > > Your use of 5/16-inch 4130 rod for threaded connectors should be more > than ample > strength wise. You're not using the rod for anything as tough as > required for prop bolts and > It should hold up rather well. I'd not use regular hot rolled or heat > treated rod because you would > not know just how well the heat treat went without extensively testing > it. Stainless is tougher and would also > work well in threaded connections if you don't have to weld or rivet it > at the other end. > > Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com > > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:14:50 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Which Swaging Tool? From: "Gig Giacona" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Gig Giacona" Which tool are you guys using? Anyone use this one from Aircraft Spruce? -------- W.R. Gig Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19969#19969 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 03:10:44 PM PST US From: LarryMcFarland Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: LarryMcFarland And, as with previous experiences, with our other friend, Richard Mc in the U.K., Zenith will not answer technical questions put to them, even on a Zenith aircraft. Not sure what the problem is here.................. Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com do not archive cgalley wrote: >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" > >One of the problems that Malcolm has to endure is every change has to be >approved by the PFA. He is in England where the plans have to be approved. >No deviations permitted without their approval. Even have to hire their test >pilot to fly off the test hours. > >Cy Galley >EAA Safety Programs Editor >Always looking for ideas and articles for EAA Sport Pilot > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "LarryMcFarland" >To: >Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 11:28 AM >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts > > > > >>--> Zenith-List message posted by: LarryMcFarland >> >>Hunt Malcolm wrote: >> >> >> >>>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hunt Malcolm" >>> >>> >>>Dear threads >>> >>>A slightly related topic. >>> >>>I'm building the dual stick version of the CH601XL and have a query on >>>the material for the tie rods. Current drawing show 5/16" stainless >>>threaded rod (no grade given for the stainless), a change from the >>>original drawings which just called up steel. The photo manual gives >>>the information as HT steel. >>> >>>Can anyone advise what is being supplied in the kits and if the >>>stainless is being used (as in the aileron rods) for better thread >>>quality. >>> >>>My proposal is to use 5/16" 4130N rod and thread the ends but I will >>>have to convince my inspector this is satisfactory. >>> >>>Any thoughts? >>> >>>Regards >>> >>>Malcolm Hunt >>>CH601XL Plans Builder in England >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>Malcolm, >> >> Your use of 5/16-inch 4130 rod for threaded connectors should be more >>than ample >>strength wise. You're not using the rod for anything as tough as >>required for prop bolts and >>It should hold up rather well. I'd not use regular hot rolled or heat >>treated rod because you would >>not know just how well the heat treat went without extensively testing >>it. Stainless is tougher and would also >>work well in threaded connections if you don't have to weld or rivet it >>at the other end. >> >>Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com >> >> >> ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 04:13:42 PM PST US From: JERICKSON03E@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: JERICKSON03E@aol.com Has anyone had a problem with the metric bolts used for the Warp Drive prop on the 912 or 912S? ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 04:13:42 PM PST US From: "Phil Maxson" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Which Swaging Tool? --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Phil Maxson" I used the budget one from Aircraft Spruce for all my cables in the XL. It takes a little longer than a better tool, but it worked just fine. There aren't that many swages to do anyway. Phil Maxson 601XL/Corvair Northwest New Jersey DAR arrives Thursday or Friday for the inspection! >From: "Gig Giacona" >To: zenith-list@matronics.com >Subject: Zenith-List: Which Swaging Tool? >Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2006 13:12:41 -0800 > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Gig Giacona" > >Which tool are you guys using? Anyone use this one from Aircraft Spruce? > > >-------- >W.R. Gig Giacona >601XL Under Construction >See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19969#19969 > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 04:24:24 PM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz I am really surprised by your problem with Zenith. They have always been very responsive to me. Perhaps you need to include your serial number with your inquiry? Paul Xl wings >And, as with previous experiences, with our other friend, Richard Mc in >the U.K., Zenith >will not answer technical questions put to them, even on a Zenith >aircraft. Not sure what the >problem is here.................. > >Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com >do not archive ----- ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 06:16:46 PM PST US From: Fritz Gurschick Subject: Zenith-List: tragic accident --> Zenith-List message posted by: Fritz Gurschick Has anyone heard as to what went wrong to cause this tragic accident?-------- Fritz NTSB Identification: LAX06LA105 14 CFR Part 91: General Aviation Accident occurred Wednesday, February 08, 2006 in Oakdale, CA Aircraft: Zenith Aircraft Company Zodiac 601XL, registration: N105RH Injuries: 2 Fatal. This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed. On February 8, 2006, at 1518 Pacific standard time, an experimental Zenith Aircraft Company Zodiac 601XL, broke up in flight and impacted flat open terrain in a nose down attitude near Oakdale Airport (O27), Oakdale, California. The pilot/owner operated the airplane under the provisions of 14 CFR Part 91. The airplane was destroyed. The private pilot/owner and the certified flight instructor (CFI) were fatally injured. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed for the local area flight that departed Modesto City-County Airport-Harry Sham Field (MOD), Modesto, California, about 1500. No flight plan had been filed. Witnesses, who saw them boarding at Modesto, indicated that the CFI was seated in the left seat, and the pilot/owner was seated in the right seat. According to witnesses in the area, the airplane entered the pattern for landing at Oakdale about 1515. The left wing bent up (perpendicular to the fuselage) and folded back and the airplane started to spin to the right. Other witnesses reported that the airplane completed one full revolution before the right wing bent up (perpendicular to the fuselage) and folded back. The airplane's nose pitched down between 60-70 degrees, and impacted the ground. No unusual noises were heard coming from the engine. According to a Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) airworthiness inspector, the airplane was purchased in Hemet, California. The airplane was delivered to Modesto on December 15, 2005, where it sat in its hangar until the day of the accident. ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 07:18:35 PM PST US From: Brandon Tucker Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Which Swaging Tool? --> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker Gig, I bought one exactly like this on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Nicopress-Swage-Tool-20-inch-swaging-swager_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ26440QQitemZ4617475412QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW This is good quality at a reasonable price. I even loaned it to the A&P at work. He liked it... R/ Brandon ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 07:18:35 PM PST US From: Gary Gower Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts -- Stainless Steel. --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower I have been working (my everyday job) with stainless steel for 15 years, for that aplication go as the plans. You will be safe. Saludos Gary Gower. Paul Mulwitz wrote: --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz I suspect you will find forming threads on 4130 to be huge challenge. The drawings should always rule. If the drawing calls for stainless steel rod and you want to use something else, I would suggest asking for approval of the design change from Zenith. Paul XL wings I'm building the dual stick version of the CH601XL and have a query on >the material for the tie rods. Current drawing show 5/16" stainless >threaded rod (no grade given for the stainless), a change from the >original drawings which just called up steel. > --------------------------------- Bring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze. ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 07:33:50 PM PST US From: Gary Gower Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Which Swaging Tool? --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower I am using the big professional one, also from Spruce, is like a chain cutter pliers but with the swages calibrated. part number: 12-12400 SWAGING TOOL 1-SC WITH CUTTER Also got the Go- noGo tool inexpensive but necesary: 13-03814 GA-1P GO NO-GO SLEEVE GAUGE Bought them about 8 years ago, is the only one (we know) in the city and I have done all the swages myself in the homebuilts here (to keep track of the tool and quality of the process), I also am a Builder Adviser for the local EAA equivalent. So no problem to visit the project at the same time... Saludos Gary Gower Gig Giacona wrote: --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Gig Giacona" Which tool are you guys using? Anyone use this one from Aircraft Spruce? -------- W.R. Gig Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19969#19969 --------------------------------- Bring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze. ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 07:36:54 PM PST US From: Gary Gower Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower No, not at all. What problem do you had? Saludos Gary Gower JERICKSON03E@aol.com wrote: --> Zenith-List message posted by: JERICKSON03E@aol.com Has anyone had a problem with the metric bolts used for the Warp Drive prop on the 912 or 912S? --------------------------------- Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments. ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 07:44:36 PM PST US From: "Larry" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Larry" There is another under laying cause for the "breaking" of the grade 8 bolts. It's not the fact that they are grade 8 alone. Probably not the right size, not torqued properly, over torqued, no locking nuts, pins, etc, or a combination of the aforementioned. Somebody forgot to do something. Six properly install 3/8" grade 8 bolts would not be the problem. Larry, N1345L, www.skyhawg.com .. ----- Original Message ----- From: "cgalley" Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 6:57 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" > > Joe, what would be your take on this? If he is using a grade 8 bolt for > the > axle itself, I have some real heart burn. It is true that 8's have > stronger > tensile strength than AN but the are more brittle. > > I can clearly remember the plane that came into the Repair at Oshkosh > because the prop was " a little loose." Took off the spinner on the wood > prop and found many problems. 5 of the 6 bolts had broken. They were all > grade 8s. The remaining bolt that keep the plane out of Lake Winnebago as > the pilot flew over from the East was an old tougher AN. The 8's had all > fractured! > > Cy > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Brandon Tucker" > To: > Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 12:01 AM > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Grades of Nuts & Bolts > > >> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker >> >> Graham, >> >> I used standard grade 8 bolts for axles. When >> the DAR came around for my mid build inspection, I >> told him that I was going to put castle nuts on the >> bolts as soon as I found some. He stated that not >> only is grade 8 hardware acceptable, but I could >> simply tighten the nut properly, and drill a hole >> through the nut and bolt and throw in a cotter pin. >> It is nice having a common sense DAR in my EAA chapter >> who is free! >> >> R/ >> >> Brandon >> >> Got my engine running today! >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > -- > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 07:51:29 PM PST US From: Gary Gower Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Which Swaging Tool? --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower That one will do, but its limited in the size of the nicos. The one in Spruce has for about 11 sizes of nicos and is about 2 or 3 times longer and well built... Has been of lots of help to all the local builders. Expensive to buy for one project. But what good tool is expensive when used in our lifetime? Yes, I thought of buying it for several minutes... but at the last moment I added to my order, was good I did. One time I went to a Sears in Houston, Saw a great tool box, left it for another trip, still thinking and angry about it 5 years later... Saludos Gary Gower Flying from Chapala, Mexico. Brandon Tucker wrote: --> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker Gig, I bought one exactly like this on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Nicopress-Swage-Tool-20-inch-swaging-swager_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ26440QQitemZ4617475412QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW This is good quality at a reasonable price. I even loaned it to the A&P at work. He liked it... R/ Brandon --------------------------------- Brings words and photos together (easily) with ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 08:57:12 PM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Which Swaging Tool? --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz Always yield to temptation -- it may not pass your way again! Do not archive. Paul At 07:50 PM 3/6/2006, you wrote: >One time I went to a Sears in Houston, Saw a great tool box, left >it for another trip, still thinking and angry about it 5 years later... --------------------------------------------- Paul Mulwitz 32013 NE Dial Road Camas, WA 98607 ---------------------------------------------