Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:44 AM - Re: 801 (Tom Faulkner)
2. 06:04 AM - Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop (Al Young)
3. 07:03 AM - Re: 801801 (Larry Landucci)
4. 07:22 AM - Re: 801801 (Dave Ruddiman)
5. 07:56 AM - Re: XL Gascolater Location (N5SL)
6. 08:27 AM - Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop (Paul Mulwitz)
7. 08:46 AM - Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop (R.P.)
8. 08:59 AM - Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
9. 09:07 AM - Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop (B Johnson)
10. 09:07 AM - Welding my tanks (John Maselli)
11. 09:16 AM - Rotax Suppoort (Stanley Challgren)
12. 09:27 AM - Re: Welding my tanks (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
13. 09:30 AM - Rotax Support (Stanley Challgren)
14. 09:49 AM - Re: Welding my tanks (John Maselli)
15. 09:55 AM - Re: [aviation] Re: Ready to start project (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com)
16. 10:12 AM - Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com)
17. 10:12 AM - Re: Welding my tanks (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
18. 10:35 AM - Re: Welding my tanks (John Maselli)
19. 11:07 AM - Re: wing tank fuel line connection. (Gary Gower)
20. 11:14 AM - static port(s) location (john butterfield)
21. 11:14 AM - Re: [aviation] Re: Ready to start project (William Dominguez)
22. 11:25 AM - RE : Re: Welding my tanks (Carlos Sa)
23. 11:31 AM - Re: wing tank fuel line connection. (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
24. 11:31 AM - Re: Welding my tanks (ron dewees)
25. 12:06 PM - Re: RE : Re: Welding my tanks (Michel Therrien)
26. 12:07 PM - Re: wing tank fuel line connection. (Michel Therrien)
27. 12:26 PM - Re: RE : Re: Welding my tanks (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
28. 12:26 PM - Re: Aileron stiffness and force - XL (lgingell)
29. 12:46 PM - Re: Re: wing tank fuel line connection. ()
30. 12:52 PM - Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop (Al Young)
31. 01:00 PM - Re: Rotax Support (Al Young)
32. 01:06 PM - Re: Re: wing tank fuel line connection. (Bill Howerton)
33. 02:24 PM - Re: static port(s) location (Paul Mulwitz)
34. 02:25 PM - Re: Re: wing tank fuel line connection. (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
35. 03:39 PM - CH 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts, washers, screws, rod and,....... (Roberto Ap. Rodrigues de Brito)
36. 03:55 PM - Re: CH 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts, washers, screws, rod and,....... (Zodie Rocket)
37. 04:26 PM - Re: CH 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts, washers, screws, rod and,....... (ROBERT SCEPPA)
38. 04:28 PM - Re: Zenith-List Digest: 20 Msgs - 03/21/06 (Roberto Ap. Rodrigues de Brito)
39. 05:27 PM - 601 Training options (Doug Sire)
40. 07:01 PM - fuel sender access covers (Brad Cohen)
41. 07:39 PM - Re: wing tank fuel line connection. (Bob Unternaehrer)
42. 08:45 PM - Re: fuel sender access covers (Paul Mulwitz)
43. 09:05 PM - Mixture Control on the Rotax 912ULS (Grant Corriveau)
44. 09:11 PM - Re: Re: wing tank fuel line connection. (Gary Gower)
45. 09:37 PM - Re: Re: wing tank fuel line connection.. (probably not related) (Gary Gower)
46. 09:50 PM - Re: wing tank fuel line connection. (Gary Gower)
47. 09:59 PM - Engines for the 701 (Chris Harding)
48. 10:05 PM - Re: Mixture Control on the Rotax 912ULS (Craig Payne)
Message 1
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tom Faulkner" <tomtafcor@triton.net>
Dave, and others:
I have an 801 with an Eggenfellner H6 and Quinti 4 blade warp drive in
flight adjustable prop. We have about 50 hrs on it and am very satisfied. I
would highly recommend the Eggenfellner set-up. It seems a little pricey at
first, but once you compare the total firewall forward price of the
Lycoming, it is much cheaper. I have many years flying behind Lycomings,
which were always my favorite up until now. The Subaru is a modern, very
tough, engine. I would be glad to share more info with you. You can reach me
at tom@tafcor.com.
Tom Faulkner
N801TP
do not archive.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Al Young" <armyret@mchsi.com>
Paul- I've less than 200 hrs and I have nothing but good things to say
about my insurance company. Both in price and settling claims. So I'd not
consider a new company if I can avoid it.
Regards,
Al
Do Not Archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Mulwitz" <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Notes from Rudder Workshop
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz
> <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
>
> Wow.
>
> That sounds like a pretty hard requirement to meet. I think there is
> another operation in Arizona or New Mexico that has XL dual offered,
> but there sure aren't many places to get such dual instruction.
>
> I only have two questions for you:
>
> 1. How much flight experience do you have?
> 2. Have you considered changing insurance companies?
>
> Paul
> XL wings
> do not archive
>
>
>>Stanley- You are not a CFI with more than 25 hrs in a 601 are you? (Re
>>using the 701 for training.) I need such a person. My insurance co wants
>>me to get 5 addl hours in a XL with a CFI that has more than 25 hrs in
>>type.
>>Jim Pallien in VA is the only one that qualifies and that too far away for
>>me.
>>Al Young
>>601X
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 3
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry Landucci <lllanducci@tds.net>
I bought a new Lycoming O-360-A4M (and a Firewall-forward kit) from
Zenith for my 801. I have 50 hours on it so far and couldn't be
happier with the engine. It started right off the very first time, and
has lower oil and gas consumption than I thought it would have. Also,
it is quieter than I remember from the test flights in the factory
demo, partially due to the soundproofing foam that I used in the cabin.
The reliability of the Lycoming is reflected in the insurability of the
aircraft and the fact that the FAA requires only 25 hours in Phase 1
testing (with a certified prop that Zenith provides), rather than the
usual 40 hours.
Larry Landucci -- N801LL
Message 4
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting@comcast.net>
How much do you figure you have into everything, firewall forward?
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Landucci" <lllanducci@tds.net>
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 6:57 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 801801
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry Landucci <lllanducci@tds.net>
>
> I bought a new Lycoming O-360-A4M (and a Firewall-forward kit) from
> Zenith for my 801. I have 50 hours on it so far and couldn't be
> happier with the engine. It started right off the very first time, and
> has lower oil and gas consumption than I thought it would have. Also,
> it is quieter than I remember from the test flights in the factory
> demo, partially due to the soundproofing foam that I used in the cabin.
> The reliability of the Lycoming is reflected in the insurability of the
> aircraft and the fact that the FAA requires only 25 hours in Phase 1
> testing (with a certified prop that Zenith provides), rather than the
> usual 40 hours.
>
> Larry Landucci -- N801LL
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: XL Gascolater Location |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
Chuck:
Not a Jabiru but look on the lower, right side of the
firewall(looking forward)under the battery. It's
gold.
http://www.cooknwithgas.com/3_18_06_EngineMounted.JPG
Scott Laughlin
www.cooknwithgas.com
Plumbing intake piping
"Chuck & Lana > Maggart" <cmaggart@sprintmail.com>
> Where have you all been installing the gascolater?
> Chuck Maggart, XL/Jabiru
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
Hi Al,
Thanks for the reply.
I also have around 200 hours. I think the 5 hour checkout in the
Zodiac seems reasonable if you don't consider the very real fact that
it is nearly impossible to find one for the checkout. It is
certainly impossible at this point to find an instructor with 25 hours in type.
In this case the checkout requirement might as well be a 1000 hour
checkout. The insurance company might just as well say they won't insure you.
I hope you find a way to meet the requirement.
Best regards,
Paul
At 06:02 AM 3/27/2006, you wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Al Young" <armyret@mchsi.com>
>
>Paul- I've less than 200 hrs and I have nothing but good things to say
>about my insurance company. Both in price and settling claims. So I'd not
>consider a new company if I can avoid it.
>Regards,
>Al
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "R.P." <zodie@adelphia.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Al Young" <armyret@mchsi.com>
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 6:02 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Notes from Rudder Workshop
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Al Young" <armyret@mchsi.com>
>
> Paul- I've less than 200 hrs and I have nothing but good things to say
> about my insurance company. Both in price and settling claims. So I'd
> not
> consider a new company if I can avoid it.
> Regards,
> Al
> Do Not Archive
I called around for insurance quotes a couple years ago when I finished
building my Zodiac. They asked me to get some dual time in a Zodiac or
"similar" aircraft. The closest thing I could find locally was a low wing,
fixed gear Cherokee. The insurance company accepted 2 hours dual in the
Cherokeesince there were no other "similar" planes available.
This was with Skysmith Insurance. Maybe your company will do the same if
they want to get your business.
Rick Pitcher
Message 8
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| Subject: | Notes from Rudder Workshop |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Have you tried AOPA?
Also try Skysmith, whoever he went through would not insure me for the
first hour but covered me after that...I stayed above the airport until
one hour was passed...:)
Frank
HDS 394 hours
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul
Mulwitz
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 8:26 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Notes from Rudder Workshop
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz
--> <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
Hi Al,
Thanks for the reply.
I also have around 200 hours. I think the 5 hour checkout in the Zodiac
seems reasonable if you don't consider the very real fact that it is
nearly impossible to find one for the checkout. It is certainly
impossible at this point to find an instructor with 25 hours in type.
In this case the checkout requirement might as well be a 1000 hour
checkout. The insurance company might just as well say they won't
insure you.
I hope you find a way to meet the requirement.
Best regards,
Paul
At 06:02 AM 3/27/2006, you wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Al Young" <armyret@mchsi.com>
>
>Paul- I've less than 200 hrs and I have nothing but good things to say
>about my insurance company. Both in price and settling claims. So
I'd not
>consider a new company if I can avoid it.
>Regards,
>Al
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
Message 9
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| Subject: | Notes from Rudder Workshop |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "B Johnson" <bjohnson@satx.rr.com>
The XL is now being purchased by flight schools in an sLSA version, but it's
the same plane. I know if at least one that you can rent for instruction,
(the guy posts here every now and again)
http://www.maspl.com/flight_school.htm
It's not the cheapest, it's not convenient to everyone, but it "is"
available....
-Bruce
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-
> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Mulwitz
> Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 10:26 AM
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Notes from Rudder Workshop
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz
> <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
>
> Hi Al,
>
> Thanks for the reply.
>
> I also have around 200 hours. I think the 5 hour checkout in the
> Zodiac seems reasonable if you don't consider the very real fact that
> it is nearly impossible to find one for the checkout. It is
> certainly impossible at this point to find an instructor with 25 hours in
> type.
>
> In this case the checkout requirement might as well be a 1000 hour
> checkout. The insurance company might just as well say they won't insure
> you.
>
> I hope you find a way to meet the requirement.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Paul
>
>
> At 06:02 AM 3/27/2006, you wrote:
> >--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Al Young" <armyret@mchsi.com>
> >
> >Paul- I've less than 200 hrs and I have nothing but good things to say
> >about my insurance company. Both in price and settling claims. So I'd
> not
> >consider a new company if I can avoid it.
> >Regards,
> >Al
>
> ---------------------------------------------
> Paul Mulwitz
> 32013 NE Dial Road
> Camas, WA 98607
> ---------------------------------------------
>
--
Message 10
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| Subject: | Welding my tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
I am looking for someone who can weld my tanks. I am using 3031 tank grade
aluminum and have formed all pieces as well as purchased all fittings I need
someone who can take on the welding for my 801. I have fabrication for 4
tanks. Any recommendations?
John Maselli
516-524-0420
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Message 11
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Cc: Stanley Challgren <challgren@mac.com>
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Stanley Challgren <challgren@mac.com>
Fellow builders:
Paul wrote in response to my question on Rotax support:
"You mention concern about cooling on the Jabiru engine while doing
landings. Do you have any information that this is a problem? Or,
is this just a theory that it might be a problem?"
We had a problem with our early Jabiru 3300 that would run hotter
when flying below 100 mph. Essentially we were restricted from doing
so without modifying our air intake to the engine. Since my 701
would always be in that realm, the repeated power changes might
present a challenge to good cooling. There was a learned treatise on
the subject of shock cooling recently that should be in the
archives. I believe it qualifies as scientific evidence and is not
just a theory. It was a reason for my concern. Pete has indicated
very recently that the latest 3300 will again have bigger cooling
fins which should be a fix to the problem.
I am very open to experience that indicates the 3300 is reliable when
operated a significant portion of the time in the landing pattern.
Stan
Message 12
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| Subject: | Welding my tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Yes...Don't weld if you can help it...ZAC's tanks get somewhat distorted
and a better way if you can is to use riveted lap joints and an evil goo
called Proseal (available from Vans aircraft). All Vans tanks are made
very successfully this way. The nick name for Proseal is "The Black
Death"...But it sure does seal!
Welding is OK but I am not the first one to suffer a leaking tank dues
to a cracked weld (I assume from work hardening the little bent flanges
plus heat).
Then you can do it all yourself
Frank
601 HDS 394 hours
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Maselli
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 9:07 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
I am looking for someone who can weld my tanks. I am using 3031 tank
grade aluminum and have formed all pieces as well as purchased all
fittings I need someone who can take on the welding for my 801. I have
fabrication for 4 tanks. Any recommendations?
John Maselli
516-524-0420
_____
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Message 13
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Cc: Stanley Challgren <challgren@mac.com>
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Stanley Challgren <challgren@mac.com>
Fellow Builders:
Al wrote in response to my question on Rotax support (Which appears
to be abysmal in comparison to Jabiru's if the comments I have
received are an indication):
Stanley- You are not a CFI with more than 25 hrs in a 601 are you? (Re
using the 701 for training.) I need such a person. My insurance co
wants
me to get 5 addl hours in a XL with a CFI that has more than 25 hrs
in type.
Jim Pallien in VA is the only one that qualifies and that too far
away for
me.
Al Young
601XL
Al:
I have just under 150 hours (among 16,000+) in the 601 HDS/Jab 3300
that we recently sold. I do have all the CFI tickets but they are
not current. I live near Denver and don't have a 601 now. Other
than that, I'm available.
Stan
Message 14
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| Subject: | Welding my tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
That's great I actually made the flanges larger to accommodate welding
because I had trouble with my welds in practice I drilled for all the rivets
but then someone told me that I was going to get leaky tanks. If I can rivet
my self then I can do the job myself. But how do I rivet the fittings this
may be a bit more difficult I suppose I could make gaskets and flange rings
to rivet the fittings? But again thanks George I need encouragement to get
this portion done. It has stopped me in my tracks!
John Maselli
A Computer Consulting
516-524-0420
_____
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-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hinde, Frank
George (Corvallis)
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 12:26 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
--> <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Yes...Don't weld if you can help it...ZAC's tanks get somewhat distorted and
a better way if you can is to use riveted lap joints and an evil goo called
Proseal (available from Vans aircraft). All Vans tanks are made very
successfully this way. The nick name for Proseal is "The Black Death"...But
it sure does seal!
Welding is OK but I am not the first one to suffer a leaking tank dues to a
cracked weld (I assume from work hardening the little bent flanges plus
heat).
Then you can do it all yourself
Frank
601 HDS 394 hours
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Maselli
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 9:07 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
I am looking for someone who can weld my tanks. I am using 3031 tank grade
aluminum and have formed all pieces as well as purchased all fittings I need
someone who can take on the welding for my 801. I have fabrication for 4
tanks. Any recommendations?
John Maselli
516-524-0420
_____
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Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Ready to start project |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
William, just a guess, but a couple fellows could do a wing in 20 minutes or
so, maybe. Easy that if they have done it before, longer if they are newbees.
Removing the six main bolts always required me to half stand on my head to get
in there and the rear spar bolt has to have a second helper to install and
remove. I have installed a wing by myself with saw horse help and plenty of
care, (a beast to do and never recommend to anyone), but the rear spar bolt and
wing adjustment requires a second hand to complete. You cannot be under the wing
at the fuselage and at the wing tip at the same time. As you build, maneuver,
hold and move the pieces and they keep getting bigger and heavier you develop
techniques to build alone (though I always welcomed company and maintained a
generous supply of cold adult beverage in the shop refrigerator for
lubrication of guests) because most of the time there just isn't anybody around
when you
need them. I have an annual coming up in May, but I do not plan to remove the
wings. I will remove several main bolts from each side and inspect with magna
stain for stress cracks before retorking all, but I do not plan to remove the
wings again. FWIW, best regards, Bill of Georgia N505WP 601XL-3300w/dc
do not archive
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Al, I had the same problem with the requirement for CFI hours in type. I went
back to the agent, explained it was impossible. He went to the underwriters
who modified the requirement so that I did the hours in an Alarus (sp) with a
CFI. Cost me a couple hundred and the hours. Really was absolutely no help at
all at prep to fly a XL as the plane was a big dog of a beast that would not
climb and was nibble as an anvil. Engine, controls, view, weight and performance
was nothing like my XL. The difference between a Pinto station wagon and a
baby Porsche. Still it satisfied the bean counters and I got my coverage. Maybe
you could request they reconsider and modify to reality, Bill
do not archive
Message 17
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|
| Subject: | Welding my tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Fittings depends on how you do them. Vans uses standard bulkhead
fittings (Aluminium ones from Vans are cheapest or you can get steel
ones from your local hydraulics shop for very cheap at the expese of
more weight). Anyway, make a washer from 1/8th aluminum (hole cutters
make almost instant washers...Just need to make the hole bigger in the
middle.
Put a bead of BD under the washer and under/around the bulkehead fitting
and wrench in place..A nice bead around the flange inside of the fitting
will make it leak proof...roung up the tank walls and degrease where you
want the BD to stick.
I would either use solid rivets or blind rivets that have no hole in the
middle rather than rely on a dab of black death over hole in the rivet.
Rivets on outside flanges (that don't protrude into the tank) can be
normal "pop" rivets.
Works great....Messy but great!
I would get the BD in a can because you can mix up a bit at a time...The
small (less than 6 ounces) are one shot mixing deals and it will set way
to fast to do both tanks in one hit.
The stuff does have a shelf life of a few months so make sure you going
to be close to ready before you order the BD....Tell Vans I sent ya...:)
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Maselli
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 9:48 AM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
That's great I actually made the flanges larger to accommodate welding
because I had trouble with my welds in practice I drilled for all the
rivets but then someone told me that I was going to get leaky tanks. If
I can rivet my self then I can do the job myself. But how do I rivet the
fittings this may be a bit more difficult I suppose I could make gaskets
and flange rings to rivet the fittings? But again thanks George I need
encouragement to get this portion done. It has stopped me in my tracks!
John Maselli
A Computer Consulting
516-524-0420
_____
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-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hinde,
Frank George (Corvallis)
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 12:26 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
--> <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Yes...Don't weld if you can help it...ZAC's tanks get somewhat distorted
and a better way if you can is to use riveted lap joints and an evil goo
called Proseal (available from Vans aircraft). All Vans tanks are made
very successfully this way. The nick name for Proseal is "The Black
Death"...But it sure does seal!
Welding is OK but I am not the first one to suffer a leaking tank dues
to a cracked weld (I assume from work hardening the little bent flanges
plus heat).
Then you can do it all yourself
Frank
601 HDS 394 hours
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Maselli
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 9:07 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
I am looking for someone who can weld my tanks. I am using 3031 tank
grade aluminum and have formed all pieces as well as purchased all
fittings I need someone who can take on the welding for my 801. I have
fabrication for 4 tanks. Any recommendations?
John Maselli
516-524-0420
_____
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Message 18
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| Subject: | Welding my tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
Thanks Frank will tell Vans and the flange washer idea sounds good I already
bought the aluminum fittings from aircraft spruce. I order the quart of
proseal (They have new stuff on vans replaces proseal calls flamemaster) I
will get a few smaller 6oz jars to do the fittings first. I believe this
will work!
John Maselli
A Computer Consulting
516-524-0420
_____
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-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hinde, Frank
George (Corvallis)
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 1:11 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
--> <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Fittings depends on how you do them. Vans uses standard bulkhead fittings
(Aluminium ones from Vans are cheapest or you can get steel ones from your
local hydraulics shop for very cheap at the expese of more weight). Anyway,
make a washer from 1/8th aluminum (hole cutters make almost instant
washers...Just need to make the hole bigger in the middle.
Put a bead of BD under the washer and under/around the bulkehead fitting and
wrench in place..A nice bead around the flange inside of the fitting will
make it leak proof...roung up the tank walls and degrease where you want the
BD to stick.
I would either use solid rivets or blind rivets that have no hole in the
middle rather than rely on a dab of black death over hole in the rivet.
Rivets on outside flanges (that don't protrude into the tank) can be normal
"pop" rivets.
Works great....Messy but great!
I would get the BD in a can because you can mix up a bit at a time...The
small (less than 6 ounces) are one shot mixing deals and it will set way to
fast to do both tanks in one hit.
The stuff does have a shelf life of a few months so make sure you going to
be close to ready before you order the BD....Tell Vans I sent ya...:)
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Maselli
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 9:48 AM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
That's great I actually made the flanges larger to accommodate welding
because I had trouble with my welds in practice I drilled for all the rivets
but then someone told me that I was going to get leaky tanks. If I can rivet
my self then I can do the job myself. But how do I rivet the fittings this
may be a bit more difficult I suppose I could make gaskets and flange rings
to rivet the fittings? But again thanks George I need encouragement to get
this portion done. It has stopped me in my tracks!
John Maselli
A Computer Consulting
516-524-0420
_____
I've stopped 1,014 spam messages. You can too!
One month FREE spam protection at www.cloudmark.com Cloudmark SpamNet - Join
the fight against spam!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hinde, Frank
George (Corvallis)
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 12:26 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
--> <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Yes...Don't weld if you can help it...ZAC's tanks get somewhat distorted and
a better way if you can is to use riveted lap joints and an evil goo called
Proseal (available from Vans aircraft). All Vans tanks are made very
successfully this way. The nick name for Proseal is "The Black Death"...But
it sure does seal!
Welding is OK but I am not the first one to suffer a leaking tank dues to a
cracked weld (I assume from work hardening the little bent flanges plus
heat).
Then you can do it all yourself
Frank
601 HDS 394 hours
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Maselli
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 9:07 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
I am looking for someone who can weld my tanks. I am using 3031 tank grade
aluminum and have formed all pieces as well as purchased all fittings I need
someone who can take on the welding for my 801. I have fabrication for 4
tanks. Any recommendations?
John Maselli
516-524-0420
_____
I've stopped 1,014 spam messages. You can too!
One month FREE spam protection at www.cloudmark.com
<http://www.cloudmark.com/spamnet?v1&rc=>
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Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Re: wing tank fuel line connection. |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
The problem thar could hapen with the quick disconectors is that they use a seal
(o ring or something) and in certain ocasions some car gasolines will damage
the seals...
When removing the wing I think is better to complete drain the fuel remaining
in the tanks. then remove the hose with the clamp. I think is a safer way
all around.
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Flying from Chapala, Mexico/.
Edward Moody II <dredmoody@cox.net> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Edward Moody II"
Bruce Bockius
easy wing removal and reattachment but wing tank are safer. Im uneasy to the
idea of a gasoline tank over my feet. You can get wing tanks and do away
with the header tank on any of the 601 models.
William Dominguez wrote: Yes but, having an HD with wing tanks make more
difficult the removal and re-attachment of the wing.
Some of you probably can answer this,
What do FAA types and DARs think about the idea of connecting wing tank fuel
lines to the fuselage lines/valve using quick disconnect couplings? They
have the handy feature of shutting off fuel flow/dripping from both sides of
the coupling when they are disconnected. At $26.00 per set they are pricey
but it's worth it to not have fuel running all over the place during
disassembly or service. I use them on my UL but have never asked if they are
considered safe enough for the more complex experimental aircraft.
Ed Moody II
Rayne LA
601XL working on tail
---------------------------------
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | static port(s) location |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: john butterfield <jdbutterfield@yahoo.com>
hi list
where are people locating their static ports on the
aircraft and how many
thanks in advance
john butterfield
601XL, corvair
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Ready to start project |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com>
Thanks for the info.
William Dominguez
Plansbuilt 601XL
Working on bending brake
do not archive
--- JAPhillipsGA@aol.com wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by:
> JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
>
> William, just a guess, but a couple fellows could do
> a wing in 20 minutes or
> so, maybe. Easy that if they have done it before,
> longer if they are newbees.
> Removing the six main bolts always required me to
> half stand on my head to get
> in there and the rear spar bolt has to have a second
> helper to install and
> remove. I have installed a wing by myself with saw
> horse help and plenty of
> care, (a beast to do and never recommend to anyone),
> but the rear spar bolt and
> wing adjustment requires a second hand to complete.
> You cannot be under the wing
> at the fuselage and at the wing tip at the same
> time. As you build, maneuver,
> hold and move the pieces and they keep getting
> bigger and heavier you develop
> techniques to build alone (though I always welcomed
> company and maintained a
> generous supply of cold adult beverage in the shop
> refrigerator for
> lubrication of guests) because most of the time
> there just isn't anybody around when you
> need them. I have an annual coming up in May, but I
> do not plan to remove the
> wings. I will remove several main bolts from each
> side and inspect with magna
> stain for stress cracks before retorking all, but I
> do not plan to remove the
> wings again. FWIW, best regards, Bill of Georgia
> N505WP 601XL-3300w/dc
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List
>
> Admin.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | Welding my tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Carlos Sa <carlosfsa@yahoo.com>
It does, John
I've made my tanks that way recently - not tested for leaks yet, though...
Graham Kirby lead the way (I referred to his web site a zillion times):
http://www.601hd.com/fueltanks.htm
I suggest you be very methodic about it.
Read all you can on RV web sites, there is good info out there.
Also, don't forget the RV archives (Matronics lists).
And when you see certain advices repeated over and over, you know it is good advice.
Here are some pictures I took during the process:
http://www3.sympatico.ca/c.sa/tank.html
First I installed all the fittings (one at a time, baby steps).
Then, the baffle, back and bottom flanges(one work session), followed by the sides
(another work
session).
And then close it, in yet another work session.
Repeat for the other tank.
I did lots of planning, went through each step a number of times before actually
doing it.
It did work quite well.
Regarding smell: Proseal smells bad (rotten eggs), but the most annoying smell
was produced by
laquer thinner, while cleaning up.
I had a window open with a fan blowing *out*.
Good luck
Carlos
CH601-HD, plans
--- John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net> a crit :
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
>
> Thanks Frank will tell Vans and the flange washer idea sounds good I already
> bought the aluminum fittings from aircraft spruce. I order the quart of
> proseal (They have new stuff on vans replaces proseal calls flamemaster) I
> will get a few smaller 6oz jars to do the fittings first. I believe this
> will work!
>
>
> John Maselli
Lche-vitrine ou lche-cran ?
magasinage.yahoo.ca
Message 23
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| Subject: | wing tank fuel line connection. |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Yes and I have to point out that in 6.5 years and 400 hourse I have
never taken my wings off and that includes for when I made new wing
splice plates (per ZAC's AD) and pulled out a leading edge wing fuel
tank.
Frank
HDS 394 hours
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Gower
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 11:05 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: wing tank fuel line connection.
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
The problem thar could hapen with the quick disconectors is that they
use a seal (o ring or something) and in certain ocasions some car
gasolines will damage the seals...
When removing the wing I think is better to complete drain the fuel
remaining in the tanks. then remove the hose with the clamp. I think
is a safer way all around.
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Flying from Chapala, Mexico/.
Edward Moody II <dredmoody@cox.net> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Edward Moody II"
Bruce Bockius
easy wing removal and reattachment but wing tank are safer. Im uneasy to
the idea of a gasoline tank over my feet. You can get wing tanks and do
away with the header tank on any of the 601 models.
William Dominguez wrote: Yes but, having an HD with wing tanks make more
difficult the removal and re-attachment of the wing.
Some of you probably can answer this,
What do FAA types and DARs think about the idea of connecting wing tank
fuel lines to the fuselage lines/valve using quick disconnect couplings?
They have the handy feature of shutting off fuel flow/dripping from both
sides of the coupling when they are disconnected. At $26.00 per set they
are pricey but it's worth it to not have fuel running all over the place
during disassembly or service. I use them on my UL but have never asked
if they are considered safe enough for the more complex experimental
aircraft.
Ed Moody II
Rayne LA
601XL working on tail
---------------------------------
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Re: Welding my tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: ron dewees <rdewees@mindspring.com>
Hi John,
If you go with a sealant, I would suggest that it's as compatible with
as many fuels as possible. Several old sealers weren't compatable with
auto fuel and/or autofuel with alcohol in it. Don't know what motor you
are using but if you even think that the next owner could use autofuel,
look at the best sealer for it and 100LL.
Just a suggestion-- I use 99% auto fuel in my Jab 3300 and it works great.
Ron
John Maselli wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: John Maselli <jfmasell@optonline.net>
>
>That's great I actually made the flanges larger to accommodate welding
>because I had trouble with my welds in practice I drilled for all the rivets
>but then someone told me that I was going to get leaky tanks. If I can rivet
>my self then I can do the job myself. But how do I rivet the fittings this
>may be a bit more difficult I suppose I could make gaskets and flange rings
>to rivet the fittings? But again thanks George I need encouragement to get
>this portion done. It has stopped me in my tracks!
>
>
>John Maselli
>
>A Computer Consulting
>
>516-524-0420
>
>
>
>
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Re: Welding my tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien <mtherr@yahoo.com>
Is ProSeal compatible with automobile fuel?
--- Carlos Sa <carlosfsa@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Carlos Sa
> <carlosfsa@yahoo.com>
>
> It does, John
>
>
> I've made my tanks that way recently - not tested
> for leaks yet, though...
>
> Graham Kirby lead the way (I referred to his web
> site a zillion times):
> http://www.601hd.com/fueltanks.htm
>
> I suggest you be very methodic about it.
> Read all you can on RV web sites, there is good info
> out there.
> Also, don't forget the RV archives (Matronics
> lists).
> And when you see certain advices repeated over and
> over, you know it is good advice.
>
> Here are some pictures I took during the process:
> http://www3.sympatico.ca/c.sa/tank.html
>
> First I installed all the fittings (one at a time,
> baby steps).
> Then, the baffle, back and bottom flanges(one work
> session), followed by the sides (another work
> session).
> And then close it, in yet another work session.
> Repeat for the other tank.
> I did lots of planning, went through each step a
> number of times before actually doing it.
> It did work quite well.
> Regarding smell: Proseal smells bad (rotten eggs),
> but the most annoying smell was produced by
> laquer thinner, while cleaning up.
> I had a window open with a fan blowing *out*.
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | Re: wing tank fuel line connection. |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien <mtherr@yahoo.com>
I don't think quick disconnect is required (I believe
one of my friends had problems with quick disconnect
and auto fuel...). I use a simple AN fitting to
attach the short rubber hose from my tank to the fuel
pump.
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/CH601/images/IMG_0668.JPG
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/CH601/images/Dcp01457.jpg
Not very clear on the picture, but there is a short
section of aluminum tubing that loops under the pump
(fixed to the rib). The tank fuel hose connects with
this tube. It can be detatched within seconds.
Michel
--- Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower
> <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
>
> The problem thar could hapen with the quick
> disconectors is that they use a seal (o ring or
> something) and in certain ocasions some car
> gasolines will damage the seals...
> When removing the wing I think is better to
> complete drain the fuel remaining in the tanks.
> then remove the hose with the clamp. I think is a
> safer way all around.
>
> Saludos
> Gary Gower.
> Flying from Chapala, Mexico/.
>
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
Message 27
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| Subject: | Welding my tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
YUP...At least I hope so or there are going to be some VERY unhappy
Eggenfelner Subaru RV drivers!
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michel
Therrien
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 12:00 PM
Subject: Re: RE : RE: Zenith-List: Welding my tanks
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien <mtherr@yahoo.com>
Is ProSeal compatible with automobile fuel?
--- Carlos Sa <carlosfsa@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Carlos Sa
> <carlosfsa@yahoo.com>
>
> It does, John
>
>
> I've made my tanks that way recently - not tested for leaks yet,
> though...
>
> Graham Kirby lead the way (I referred to his web site a zillion
> times):
> http://www.601hd.com/fueltanks.htm
>
> I suggest you be very methodic about it.
> Read all you can on RV web sites, there is good info out there.
> Also, don't forget the RV archives (Matronics lists).
> And when you see certain advices repeated over and over, you know it
> is good advice.
>
> Here are some pictures I took during the process:
> http://www3.sympatico.ca/c.sa/tank.html
>
> First I installed all the fittings (one at a time, baby steps).
> Then, the baffle, back and bottom flanges(one work session), followed
> by the sides (another work session).
> And then close it, in yet another work session.
> Repeat for the other tank.
> I did lots of planning, went through each step a number of times
> before actually doing it.
> It did work quite well.
> Regarding smell: Proseal smells bad (rotten eggs), but the most
> annoying smell was produced by laquer thinner, while cleaning up.
> I had a window open with a fan blowing *out*.
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron stiffness and force - XL |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "lgingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
Andrew,
My flaps were a little off too. I removed the flap made a new end rib, with a new
hole, re-rivted the bushing on and put it back on. My glide is much better,
and the handling is MUCH better.
AndrewC wrote:
> It looks as though the source of the problem is that my right wing is generating
slightly more lift than the left one. There are two possible cuplrits: one
flap appears to be a couple of millimetres lower than the other
Cheers,
..lance
http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp
--------
Zodiac XL/Jab 3300
http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=24637#24637
Message 29
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|
| Subject: | Re: wing tank fuel line connection. |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: <dredmoody@cox.net>
I have used the quick disconnects available from Aircraft Spruce for over two years
on the ultralight (50:1 87 octane and 2-cycle oil) without any leakage or
detectable deterioration of the O-ring seals. My concern was in regard to the
acceptance of their use by the FAA. In practice, I have found them durable and
dependable.
Ed
The problem thar could hapen with the quick disconectors is that they use a seal
(o ring or something) and in certain ocasions some car gasolines will damage
the seals...
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Flying from Chapala, Mexico/.
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Notes from Rudder Workshop |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Al Young" <armyret@mchsi.com>
Bill- I've done just that. Hoping they will let Roger at the factory be a
safety pilot with me. I already have 5 hrs with him and 1.5hrs in my XL.
This additional hours requirement is not hurting my ego a bit, but they must
see that it's not an easy task to come up with a CFI with 25 hrs in type.
I'll let you know how it plays out. Regards- Al
----- Original Message -----
From: <JAPhillipsGA@aol.com>
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 12:10 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Notes from Rudder Workshop
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
>
> Al, I had the same problem with the requirement for CFI hours in type. I
> went
> back to the agent, explained it was impossible. He went to the
> underwriters
> who modified the requirement so that I did the hours in an Alarus (sp)
> with a
> CFI. Cost me a couple hundred and the hours. Really was absolutely no help
> at
> all at prep to fly a XL as the plane was a big dog of a beast that would
> not
> climb and was nibble as an anvil. Engine, controls, view, weight and
> performance
> was nothing like my XL. The difference between a Pinto station wagon and a
> baby Porsche. Still it satisfied the bean counters and I got my coverage.
> Maybe
> you could request they reconsider and modify to reality, Bill
> do not archive
>
>
>
Message 31
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|
| Subject: | Re: Rotax Support |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Al Young" <armyret@mchsi.com>
Stan- Thanks much for the offer. I hope the ins company will face reality
and modify the requirement. May have to finish my re-build, fly off the 40
hrs without insurance, then fly to Denver, get your CFI current, then have
you take me up for 5 hrs and 5 landings, fly back from Denver, call the
insurance company and be done. Do I sound a little flustered?? Anyway hope
they read this list. Thanks again Stan- Regards Al
Do Not Archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stanley Challgren" <challgren@mac.com>
Cc: "Stanley Challgren" <challgren@mac.com>
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 11:29 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Rotax Support
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Stanley Challgren <challgren@mac.com>
>
> Fellow Builders:
>
> Al wrote in response to my question on Rotax support (Which appears
> to be abysmal in comparison to Jabiru's if the comments I have
> received are an indication):
>
>
> Stanley- You are not a CFI with more than 25 hrs in a 601 are you? (Re
> using the 701 for training.) I need such a person. My insurance co
> wants
> me to get 5 addl hours in a XL with a CFI that has more than 25 hrs
> in type.
> Jim Pallien in VA is the only one that qualifies and that too far
> away for
> me.
> Al Young
> 601XL
>
> Al:
>
> I have just under 150 hours (among 16,000+) in the 601 HDS/Jab 3300
> that we recently sold. I do have all the CFI tickets but they are
> not current. I live near Denver and don't have a 601 now. Other
> than that, I'm available.
>
> Stan
>
>
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: wing tank fuel line connection. |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton" <bill@howerton.com>
The fuel system was one area that I demanded heavy-duty hardware. I
wanted a system that I believed could withstand some abuse.
As a result, I am strictly using only steel-braided lines and -6
fittings. You can even use the standard ZAC fuel system parts - you just
have to use a -6 to 1/4" pipe fitting. While I will admit, they cost
significantly more that standard rubber hoses and screw-type clamps, and
yes, they are much harder to work with, but to quote William Wynne on the
subject "If you ever put your plane down in a field, the last thing you
want to do while you're trying to climb out of the cockpit is to smell
fuel". I can assure you it would take something pretty extraordinary
to rupture these lines.
Message 33
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|
| Subject: | Re: static port(s) location |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
My kit came with a dual function pitot static tube assembly. The
static port is a tube that runs parallel to the pitot tube and has
small holes in the tube sides at 120 degree points.
Paul
XL wings
At 11:11 AM 3/27/2006, you wrote:
>hi list
>where are people locating their static ports on the
>aircraft and how many
>thanks in advance
>john butterfield
>601XL, corvair
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
Message 34
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|
| Subject: | Re: wing tank fuel line connection. |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Hmmm....I think the something extraordinary is having the fuel tanks
punctured as the wings get ripped off!
I don't honestly think the choice of fuel line will make much
difference. Having a firesleeve on the fuel lines under the hood is
probably a good idea though.
Just my humble opinion.
Frank
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Howerton
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 1:08 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Zenith-List: wing tank fuel line connection.
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton" <bill@howerton.com>
The fuel system was one area that I demanded heavy-duty hardware. I
wanted a system that I believed could withstand some abuse.
As a result, I am strictly using only steel-braided lines and -6
fittings. You can even use the standard ZAC fuel system parts - you
just have to use a -6 to 1/4" pipe fitting. While I will admit, they
cost significantly more that standard rubber hoses and screw-type
clamps, and yes, they are much harder to work with, but to quote William
Wynne on the subject "If you ever put your plane down in a field, the
last thing you want to do while you're trying to climb out of the
cockpit is to smell fuel". I can assure you it would take something
pretty extraordinary to rupture these lines.
Message 35
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|
| Subject: | CH 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts, washers, screws, rod and,....... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Roberto Ap. Rodrigues de Brito" <lenabeto@uol.com.br>
Hi all,
Anyone on the list have the complete Ch 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts, washers, screws,
rod end, and other parts list?
I'm looking for information.
Thanks.
Roberto Brito---S=E3o Paulo---Brazil.
Zodiac XL 601, Jabiru 3300 --70%
CH 701 to begin with,
Message 36
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|
| Subject: | CH 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts, washers, screws, rod and,....... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Zodie Rocket" <zodierocket@hsfx.ca>
Roberto try the Complete Bill of Materials list in the builders
resources section of www.ch701.com
Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario
Zodiac 601XL C-GOXL, CH701 just started
www.ch601.org / www.ch701.com / www.Osprey2.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roberto Ap.
Rodrigues de Brito
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 6:34 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: CH 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts, washers, screws,
rod and,.......
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Roberto Ap. Rodrigues de Brito"
<lenabeto@uol.com.br>
Hi all,
Anyone on the list have the complete Ch 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts,
washers, screws, rod end, and other parts list?
I'm looking for information.
Thanks.
Roberto Brito---S=E3o Paulo---Brazil.
Zodiac XL 601, Jabiru 3300 --70%
CH 701 to begin with,
--
--
Message 37
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|
| Subject: | Re: CH 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts, washers, screws, rod and,....... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: ROBERT SCEPPA <rjscep@yahoo.com>
> If you got the plans they should be noted on each
> page, if not your building without a registered
> number
--- "Roberto Ap. Rodrigues de Brito"
<lenabeto@uol.com.br> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Roberto Ap.
> Rodrigues de Brito" <lenabeto@uol.com.br>
>
> Hi all,
> Anyone on the list have the complete Ch 701 bolts,
> nuts, s.l. nuts, washers, screws, rod end, and other
> parts list?
> I'm looking for information.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Roberto Brito---S=E3o Paulo---Brazil.
>
> Zodiac XL 601, Jabiru 3300 --70%
> CH 701 to begin with,
>
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List
>
> Admin.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 38
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|
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 20 Msgs - 03/21/06 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Roberto Ap. Rodrigues de Brito" <lenabeto@uol.com.br>
Hi all,
Anyone on the list have the complete Ch 701 bolts, nuts, s.l. nuts,
washers, screws, rod end, and other parts list?
I'm looking for information.
Thanks.
Roberto Brito---So Paulo---Brazil.
Zodiac XL 601, Jabiru 3300 --70%
CH 701 to begin with,
Message 39
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|
| Subject: | 601 Training options |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Doug Sire" <dsire@imt.net>
Here is a link to an AMD web page that lists spots where you could get
Sport Pilot or transition training in a 601XL:
http://www.qualitysportplanes.com/qsp-2006_034.htm
And here is a link to an AOPA site that outlines what training and rental
options are available with an ELSA or an SLSA:
http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/regulatory/sport_faq.html#aircraft
Doug Sire
601XL (preparing workspace, kit here)
Message 40
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|
| Subject: | fuel sender access covers |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Brad Cohen" <bradfnp@msn.com>
Hello all
awhile back there was a discussion regarding the fabrication of access plates to
cover the fuel senders on the 601xl wings.
>From what I can recall, most of you suggested filing down the threads on the contact
screw to allow clearance from the upper skin. I do recall one person saying
that he scratch built a domed cover for his senders.
I have the new senders with the bayonette connector (not the old style with a nut
that can be filed down) and now have a similar problem, the connector now protrudes
from the upper surface of the wing skin.
is the person who made those access plates still involved witht eh listserv? is he or she willing to contact me off line at bradfnp@msn.com<mailto:bradfnp@msn.com> to tell me how he or she made the domed covers or where I can find similar plates? does anyone have any suggestions?
brad cohen
601xl
working on the wings....
Message 41
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| Subject: | Re: wing tank fuel line connection. |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bob Unternaehrer" <shilocom@mcmsys.com>
Just replace the o rings with VITRON or VITON, how ever you spell it.
Bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Gower" <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 1:04 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: wing tank fuel line connection.
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
>
> The problem thar could hapen with the quick disconectors is that they use
a seal (o ring or something) and in certain ocasions some car gasolines
will damage the seals...
> When removing the wing I think is better to complete drain the fuel
remaining in the tanks. then remove the hose with the clamp. I think is
a safer way all around.
>
> Saludos
> Gary Gower.
> Flying from Chapala, Mexico/.
>
>
> Edward Moody II <dredmoody@cox.net> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Edward Moody II"
>
> Bruce Bockius
> easy wing removal and reattachment but wing tank are safer. Im uneasy to
the
> idea of a gasoline tank over my feet. You can get wing tanks and do away
> with the header tank on any of the 601 models.
>
> William Dominguez wrote: Yes but, having an HD with wing tanks make more
> difficult the removal and re-attachment of the wing.
>
> Some of you probably can answer this,
>
> What do FAA types and DARs think about the idea of connecting wing tank
fuel
> lines to the fuselage lines/valve using quick disconnect couplings? They
> have the handy feature of shutting off fuel flow/dripping from both sides
of
> the coupling when they are disconnected. At $26.00 per set they are pricey
> but it's worth it to not have fuel running all over the place during
> disassembly or service. I use them on my UL but have never asked if they
are
> considered safe enough for the more complex experimental aircraft.
>
> Ed Moody II
> Rayne LA
> 601XL working on tail
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
>
Message 42
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|
| Subject: | Re: fuel sender access covers |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
The fuel tank design makes more room available for the sender wiring
near the spar than farther forward. You might have better luck if
you place the sender in the area that has more space. You can
connect a female spade connector to the one on the new sender. These
can be found with built in insulators.
Good luck,
Paul
XL wings
>I have the new senders with the bayonette connector (not the old
>style with a nut that can be filed down) and now have a similar
>problem, the connector now protrudes from the upper surface of the wing skin.
Message 43
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|
| Subject: | Mixture Control on the Rotax 912ULS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Grant Corriveau <grantc@ca.inter.net>
FWIW,
I installed a mixture monitor gauge on my CAM100 just to make me 'feel
better' that the automatic mixture compensation in my autocarb was working.
It's interesting to see that at 5,000 rpm the mixture is running richer than
at 4900 -- I don't have enough data to prove anything yet, but from another
operator, I suspect that there is a significant fuel economy over a tank of
fuel, buy reducing to this setting and accepting 5mph less speed.
Also, any variance in this instrument should alert me to problems before
they lead to running out of gas or having a carb/engine failure.
Unhappily, the heavy lead content of AVGAS limits this sensor to auto gas
only.
--
Grant Corriveau
C-GHTF / HDS / CAM100
> From: Zenith-List Digest Server <zenith-list-digest@matronics.com>
> Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2006 23:58:39 -0800
> To: Zenith-List Digest List <zenith-list-digest@matronics.com>
> Subject: Zenith-List Digest: 15 Msgs - 03/19/06
>
> Time: 08:19:06 AM PST US
> From: Leo Gates <leogates@allvantage.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: There is Mixture Control on the Rotax 912ULS
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Leo Gates <leogates@allvantage.com>
>
> My 912UL (Uncertified) bought in 1997 has altitude compensating Bing carbs.
>
> Leo Gates
> N601Z
Message 44
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|
| Subject: | Re: wing tank fuel line connection. |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Thanks a lot Ed,
This first hands on comments and experience is what we all need to hear when
talking about something we are going to use for flying.
I have several bad experience with hoses and some "O" rings in my vehicles (cars,
motorcycles and ultralights) that I first have to be sure they work with
the gasoline available here before using them...
Saludos
Gary Gower.
dredmoody@cox.net wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by:
I have used the quick disconnects available from Aircraft Spruce for over two years
on the ultralight (50:1 87 octane and 2-cycle oil) without any leakage or
detectable deterioration of the O-ring seals. My concern was in regard to the
acceptance of their use by the FAA. In practice, I have found them durable and
dependable.
Ed
The problem thar could hapen with the quick disconectors is that they use a seal
(o ring or something) and in certain ocasions some car gasolines will damage
the seals...
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Flying from Chapala, Mexico/.
---------------------------------
Message 45
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|
| Subject: | Re: wing tank fuel line connection.. (probably not related) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
I dont want to be negative thinking, but remember that the chain breaks in the
weakest link... and the tanks are not "heavy duty". a branch or a fence pole
will make a good hole in them...
I always try to think positive and have the idea firm in my mind, of flying the
plane all the way down as a normal glide/landing to the most open land in
front of me, in case of an engine failure.
Another thing I have from all my years in hang gliding: I never fly over any
place I dont like to land in... Those few times I do... I realy sweat, even
if the engine dont miss a beat.
Spot landing practice without engine, is the best training you can do to save
your life (and if possible the airplane). Here we have a "dedicated" flyin
2 times a year for this emergency training.in the dry lake.
Great fun, The one that lands worse, (farther from the mark) pays a case of
bear in the next barbacue... They come from several clubs around. "Newbies"
even if they have 1,000's of hours flying, practice with engine first, then they
"try" without engine.
The dry lake is 5 miles wide and 30 miles long, almost all unobstructed, so
is dificult to miss it :-) But the "Mark" is dificult to touch.
We made this training contest in our Club, because we lost two good pilot friends
in one low altitude stall spin accident, in an off airport landing...
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Do not archive.
"Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
Hmmm....I think the something extraordinary is having the fuel tanks
punctured as the wings get ripped off!
I don't honestly think the choice of fuel line will make much
difference. Having a firesleeve on the fuel lines under the hood is
probably a good idea though.
Just my humble opinion.
Frank
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Howerton
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 1:08 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Zenith-List: wing tank fuel line connection.
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Howerton"
The fuel system was one area that I demanded heavy-duty hardware. I
wanted a system that I believed could withstand some abuse.
As a result, I am strictly using only steel-braided lines and -6
fittings. You can even use the standard ZAC fuel system parts - you
just have to use a -6 to 1/4" pipe fitting. While I will admit, they
cost significantly more that standard rubber hoses and screw-type
clamps, and yes, they are much harder to work with, but to quote William
Wynne on the subject "If you ever put your plane down in a field, the
last thing you want to do while you're trying to climb out of the
cockpit is to smell fuel". I can assure you it would take something
pretty extraordinary to rupture these lines.
---------------------------------
Message 46
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|
| Subject: | Re: wing tank fuel line connection. |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Yes Bob,
I always use Viton type of O rings, but some probably are not "pure and virgin"
and they fail, at least get bigger and wont fit once they spend some time
in the fuel...
Now we know the Quick Disconects work, next time I order something from Spruce,
will buy 2 or 3 sets, just in case I find some use for them. :-)
Saludos
Gary Gower
Do not archive.
Bob Unternaehrer <shilocom@mcmsys.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bob Unternaehrer"
Just replace the o rings with VITRON or VITON, how ever you spell it.
Bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Gower"
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 1:04 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: wing tank fuel line connection.
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower
>
> The problem thar could hapen with the quick disconectors is that they use
a seal (o ring or something) and in certain ocasions some car gasolines
will damage the seals...
> When removing the wing I think is better to complete drain the fuel
remaining in the tanks. then remove the hose with the clamp. I think is
a safer way all around.
>
> Saludos
> Gary Gower.
> Flying from Chapala, Mexico/.
>
>
> Edward Moody II wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Edward Moody II"
>
> Bruce Bockius
> easy wing removal and reattachment but wing tank are safer. Im uneasy to
the
> idea of a gasoline tank over my feet. You can get wing tanks and do away
> with the header tank on any of the 601 models.
>
> William Dominguez wrote: Yes but, having an HD with wing tanks make more
> difficult the removal and re-attachment of the wing.
>
> Some of you probably can answer this,
>
> What do FAA types and DARs think about the idea of connecting wing tank
fuel
> lines to the fuselage lines/valve using quick disconnect couplings? They
> have the handy feature of shutting off fuel flow/dripping from both sides
of
> the coupling when they are disconnected. At $26.00 per set they are pricey
> but it's worth it to not have fuel running all over the place during
> disassembly or service. I use them on my UL but have never asked if they
are
> considered safe enough for the more complex experimental aircraft.
>
> Ed Moody II
> Rayne LA
> 601XL working on tail
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
>
---------------------------------
Message 47
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|
| Subject: | Engines for the 701 |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Chris Harding" <charding@houston.rr.com>
Can anyone comment on the pros and cons of the 80 h.p. Rotax 912 versus the 100
h.p. 912S for the 701?
Thanks in advance,
Chris Harding
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=24735#24735
Message 48
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|
| Subject: | Mixture Control on the Rotax 912ULS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
Actually others are successfully using mixture sensors with leaded fuel.
Yes, it does shorten the life of the sensor but you are talking tens of
hours, not minutes. Plenty of time to characterize a new engine.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Grant Corriveau
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 10:04 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Mixture Control on the Rotax 912ULS
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Grant Corriveau <grantc@ca.inter.net>
FWIW,
I installed a mixture monitor gauge on my CAM100 just to make me 'feel
better' that the automatic mixture compensation in my autocarb was working.
It's interesting to see that at 5,000 rpm the mixture is running richer than
at 4900 -- I don't have enough data to prove anything yet, but from another
operator, I suspect that there is a significant fuel economy over a tank of
fuel, buy reducing to this setting and accepting 5mph less speed.
Also, any variance in this instrument should alert me to problems before
they lead to running out of gas or having a carb/engine failure.
Unhappily, the heavy lead content of AVGAS limits this sensor to auto gas
only.
--
Grant Corriveau
C-GHTF / HDS / CAM100
> From: Zenith-List Digest Server <zenith-list-digest@matronics.com>
> Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2006 23:58:39 -0800
> To: Zenith-List Digest List <zenith-list-digest@matronics.com>
> Subject: Zenith-List Digest: 15 Msgs - 03/19/06
>
> Time: 08:19:06 AM PST US
> From: Leo Gates <leogates@allvantage.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: There is Mixture Control on the Rotax
> 912ULS
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Leo Gates <leogates@allvantage.com>
>
> My 912UL (Uncertified) bought in 1997 has altitude compensating Bing
carbs.
>
> Leo Gates
> N601Z
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