Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:38 AM - Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (Scott Laughlin)
2. 06:32 AM - Re: Crosswind: A New Beginning (Craig Moore)
3. 06:54 AM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (Paul Mulwitz)
4. 08:08 AM - Re: Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information (N5SL)
5. 08:34 AM - Scam (Robert L. Stone)
6. 08:49 AM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
7. 08:49 AM - Re: Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information (Gary Boothe)
8. 08:49 AM - Re: Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information (Steve Hulland)
9. 09:01 AM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (Craig Payne)
10. 09:17 AM - Re: Scam (lnk)
11. 09:20 AM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (Craig Payne)
12. 09:32 AM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
13. 09:39 AM - Re: Scam (Craig Payne)
14. 09:48 AM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle ()
15. 10:36 AM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com)
16. 11:04 AM - Re: Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information (Doug Eatman)
17. 11:57 AM - Re: Crosswind: A New Beginning (Gig Giacona)
18. 11:57 AM - Re: Scam (Robert L. Stone)
19. 12:14 PM - Re: Re: Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information (Paul Mulwitz)
20. 12:15 PM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (Craig Payne)
21. 12:30 PM - Re: Scam (lnk)
22. 01:01 PM - Source of 2" flexible duct from NACA vent? (Craig Payne)
23. 01:21 PM - Re: Source of 2" flexible duct from NACA vent? (Beckman, Rick)
24. 01:33 PM - Re: Source of 2" flexible duct from NACA vent? (Craig Payne)
25. 01:46 PM - Flexible duck (Zed Smith)
26. 02:25 PM - Re: Source of 2" flexible duct from NACA vent? ()
27. 04:19 PM - Re: Landing/Taxi Lights & wee bits (Wentz, Don)
28. 07:00 PM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle ()
29. 07:28 PM - Flying Report: 601XL/Corvair (Phil Maxson)
30. 07:47 PM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (cgalley)
31. 08:04 PM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (George Harris)
32. 08:36 PM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (Brandon Tucker)
33. 09:20 PM - Re: Flying Report: 601XL/Corvair (Ron Lendon)
34. 09:53 PM - Re: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle (Bill Cardell)
35. 10:24 PM - Re: Flying Report: 601XL/Corvair (Mike)
36. 11:34 PM - Official Zenith-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
37. 11:40 PM - Official Zenith-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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Cc: zenith-list@matronics.com
| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Scott Laughlin" <cookwithgas@hotmail.com>
Guys and Gals:
Here's William's explanation of his dual ignition setup in the 601XL - I
asked him for help on the subject and he asked me to forward the reply for
the group's benefit. I noticed there are a lot of 601XL builders using the
Corvair, so I'm copying the Zenith-list with this post:
Enjoy,
Scott Laughlin
A lot of people get focused on hardware in the ignition system and loose
sight of the
Two main points: It must work as a complete system and you must recognize
that the pilot is the weakest link in the plane. Here is what we fly, and
why we set it up this way:
On the 601XL's
Installation:
One DPDT switch high on the panel, centered in front of the pilot. Side 'A'
has one ignition on it and the primary fuel pump on it. this pump is wired
through the oil pressure cut off switch. Side 'B' has the same thing but the
fuel pump is not run through an oil pressure switch.
Starter is a button on the panel hit with the index finger of the throttle
hand without lifting it off the throttle. Key switch controls only the
master.
Operation:
Engine is started on the 'B' side because the pump will run without the
engine running. Both systems checked on run up. Take off and landing always
done on 'A,' because in the event of an accident, the fuel pump will stop
automatically.
Logic: Mark Langford inspired this design. The starter location is a Bob
Lester tip. Pilot takes off and the power drops for any reason, Just move
the switch to the other position. This eliminated the pilot having to
diagnose anything. With an alert pilot, the time is much faster than 1
second, and it always will beat any set up where the pilot has to look at a
gauge to know what switch to hit. Even if the pilot is at 100 feet, and he
waits 4 seconds, and restarts, he will loose only 50 feet or so. If you are
frequently clearing anything at your airport by less than 50 feet, or it
takes you more that for seconds to flip a switch and hit a button, you need
a whole new game plan....
This system is simple, proven, takes into account the pilot and the 601's
need for fuel pumps.
Do Not: wire the coils to 2 on off switches. Without fail, at some point you
will have them both in the off position.
Do Not: use Pertronics ignition parts in place of the points. They are
voltage sensitive, and quit working when the voltage drops. Points fly on
long after these stop working. If you are worried about switching ignitions
after one side quits suddenly, you want points because the almost always
fade out slowly. When the pertronics part is starved for voltage it quits
suddenly. and you cannot have a points back up because the pertronics part
covers the points cam.
Do Not: Adjust the points in a WW distributor to the same gap. I set them in
the machine to have the exact same timing. This sometimes causes the to have
slightly different, but in spec., point gaps. If you spot this and "fix" it,
you will have a bigger variation on rpm when switching from 'A' to 'B."
William
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Crosswind: A New Beginning |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Craig Moore <moorecomp@yahoo.com>
Dave,
So glad to see things are going well. Maybe Crosswind
should have another nickname - Lazarus. "He is not
dead, he is only sleeping!" I will continue to pray
for you and your family. All the best.
Craig Moore
do not archive
--- Dave Zilz <z4t143@hotmail.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave Zilz"
> <z4t143@hotmail.com>
>
> This weekend marked a new beginning in our family's
> 801 project we call =
> "Crosswind" . We picked up our first set of Quick
> Build modules from =
> Zenith Aircraft in Mexico, MO and are back in the
> "build" mode. Check =
> out our website at:
> http://crosswind.myairplane.com/Page323.1.html
>
> Thanks again for all the moral support you've
> provided since Crosswind's =
> last flight on 18 January.=20
>
> Dave Zilz
> St. Peters MO
> z4t143@hotmail.com
> http://crosswind.myairplane.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
This whole diatribe leaves me with two big questions:
1. What is wrong with having both ignitions operating at once as is
commonly done on certified aircraft engines? This allows the pilot
to spend his attention on flying the plane instead of managing the
engine in the (apparently common for William's resurrected Corvair
engines) event of an ignition failure.
2. I find it ironic that a salesman who says the weakest part of his
customer's system is the customer gets such a zealous following.
Paul
XL wings
do not archive
>A lot of people get focused on hardware in the ignition system and loose
>sight of the
>Two main points: It must work as a complete system and you must recognize
>that the pilot is the weakest link in the plane. Here is what we fly, and
>why we set it up this way:
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>
My message was intended to assist those folks who have
made the choice to install a corvair engine in a
601XL, not to start (or re-start) a debate. The
information I posted is important to those builders at
this point in construction.
Comments like the one below have no place here and
provide no service to anyone.
In the spirit of being helpful, I have posted many
pictures of my corvair installation at
www.cooknwithgas.com where you won't find negative
comments or bad words concerning engine or airframe
choices made by hard-working people who desire to
build an airplane.
Have a nice day,
Scott Laughlin
CH601XL/Corvair
90% Complete
DO NOT ARCHIVE
--- Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
...instead of managing the engine in the (apparently
common for William's resurrected Corvair
engines) event of an ignition failure.
I find it ironic that a salesman who says the weakest
part of his customer's system is the customer gets
such a zealous following.
>
> Paul
> XL wings
> do not archive
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
Message 5
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4@hot.rr.com>
Members of the Net.
This message has nothing to do with Zenith aircraft but I think =
it's important so I am posting it here for all to read and heed.
There is an on line scam going on and it works like this: You =
receive a message from someone in England who says they are producing a =
product of some kind and selling to clients in the United States. They =
need an agent here to receive the funds from their client and take 10% =
then forward the ballance on to them in a form different than their =
client would do it and thus avoid income tax in their country. It all =
sounds easy. If you agree, you will receive a check for $10,000.00. =
from their accomplice here. You deposit the check to your checking =
account and write a check for $9,000.00 and send it to the scamer. The =
catch is the original check is no good and you will be notified by your =
bank that the check is bogus and you are out the $9.000.00 If you =
receive such an offer, agree to it accept the check from their US =
accomplice, deposit it to your account and wait until the bank notifies =
you that it is good and has cleared. Chances are it will not clear and =
you will be out nothing.
Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Great...Right up until the switch fails!
All of this comes down to personal preference. On my Stratus I have the
primary ignition on the key switch and the second ignition, pump1 and
pump 2 all on separate on-off switches. The left and right systems are
wired from each independent battery.
For take off I run both fuel pumps and both electronic ignitions all the
time. I have a LOUD audible warning buzzer if I inadvertanty switch off
both pumps
I always have both pumps running for TO and landing. None of this is
wired through an oil pressure relay, not that I think this is a bad idea
necessarily, in fact it does give you a BIG warning your engine is about
to (or just has) seize. I personally couldn't imagine the stress in
waiting for the second pump to partially fill the float bowls,
particularly if you are having to wait for the second pump to prime and
suck form the tank some feet away (hence my pumps are in the wing roots)
....But that's just me
Note I have run both ignitions continuously for 400 hours without ill
effect...I don't know what the Corvair setup is though..
Frank
On the 601XL's
Installation:
One DPDT switch high on the panel, centered in front of the pilot. Side
'A'
has one ignition on it and the primary fuel pump on it. this pump is
wired through the oil pressure cut off switch. Side 'B' has the same
thing but the fuel pump is not run through an oil pressure switch.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com>
Heck, there are guys out there actively looking for Model A engines to put
on their Pietenpols! But I still would not call that "resurrecting" an
engine. All we're trying to do is build an airplane, for a variety of
reasons; cost, nostalgia, design appeal, etc.
As for WW calling the "customer" a weak link - I guess I would have to
agree. The design is tried and tested. The engines and props are tested. The
theory of flight is tested. The only thing untested is each individual's
ability to build something. My guess is that William makes those kinds of
comments to remind us that we need to check and double-check, even
triple-check, everything we do. We need to recognize the fact that we are
the wink link.
Scott, your contributions are numerous and positive. Thank you!
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
601 HDSTD, WW Conversion
Tail done, working on wings....
Do not archive.
--> N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com> wrote:
My message was intended to assist those folks who have
made the choice to install a corvair engine in a
601XL, not to start (or re-start) a debate. The
information I posted is important to those builders at
this point in construction.
Comments like the one below have no place here and
provide no service to anyone.
In the spirit of being helpful, I have posted many
pictures of my corvair installation at
www.cooknwithgas.com where you won't find negative
comments or bad words concerning engine or airframe
choices made by hard-working people who desire to
build an airplane.
Have a nice day,
Scott Laughlin
CH601XL/Corvair
90% Complete
DO NOT ARCHIVE
--- Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
...instead of managing the engine in the (apparently
common for William's resurrected Corvair
engines) event of an ignition failure.
I find it ironic that a salesman who says the weakest
part of his customer's system is the customer gets
such a zealous following.
>
> Paul
> XL wings
> do not archive
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Steve Hulland" <marinegunner@gmail.com>
Scott,
I understand how you feel. Paul's comments are not really germane in this
forum - yours are and I do not have a corvair engine.
DO NOT ARCHIVE--
Semper Fi,
Steven R. Hulland
CH 701, Amado, AZ
This and all other incoming/outgoing email, attachments and replies scanned
prior to opening/sending and uses an external firewall to help insure virus
free email and attachments.
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
Ignoring the prejudicial tone of your message I'll toss-out some answers. If
you are actually interested in more answers to your first question just
search the Corvair list archives.
1a. MSD (the maker of the coil mixer used in the design) recommends against
using both sides at the same time. There is another coil mixer (from
Mallory??) which is spec'ed for dual operation.
1b. Unlike a dual-plug engine with wide pistons in the dual-coil,
single-plug design there is no appreciable RPM drop when one side is lost.
So if you are cruising on "both" and any of the redundant parts fail you
will have no indication.
1c. "apparently common...ignition failure" - this has no basis in fact.
Every aircraft is design to handle failure modes.
2. The majority of accident investigations end in a conclusion of "pilot
error".
-- Craig
Message 10
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "lnk" <lnk@iowatelecom.net>
Thanks for the heads up on this scam but I would differ in the advice given.
Never, ever respond to the scam e-mail. In doing so you confirm certain
information to the scammer that you would be better off not sharing. If you
do anything other than ignoring the e-mail forward it to someone like the FBI
or the Anti-Phishing Working Group. (http://www.antiphishing.org/)
Larry Kilburg
When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your
eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long
to return.
- Leonardo da Vinci
---------- Original Message -----------
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4@hot.rr.com>
Sent: Mon, 1 May 2006 10:32:40 -0500
Subject: Zenith-List: Scam
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4@hot.rr.com>
>
> Members of the Net.
> This message has nothing to do with Zenith aircraft but I think
> = it's important so I am posting it here for all to read and heed.
>
> There is an on line scam going on and it works like this: You =
> receive a message from someone in England who says they are
> producing a = product of some kind and selling to clients in the
> United States. They = need an agent here to receive the funds from
> their client and take 10% = then forward the ballance on to them in
> a form different than their = client would do it and thus avoid
> income tax in their country. It all = sounds easy. If you agree,
> you will receive a check for $10,000.00. = from their accomplice
> here. You deposit the check to your checking = account and write a
> check for $9,000.00 and send it to the scamer. The = catch is the
> original check is no good and you will be notified by your = bank
> that the check is bogus and you are out the $9.000.00 If you =
> receive such an offer, agree to it accept the check from their US =
> accomplice, deposit it to your account and wait until the bank
> notifies = you that it is good and has cleared. Chances are it will
> not clear and = you will be out nothing.
>
> Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
>> Great...Right up until the switch fails!
And magneto switches don't fail?
-- Craig
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Yes they do...Thats why I have a separate switch feeding each EI system
Frank
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Craig Payne
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 9:21 AM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne"
--> <craig@craigandjean.com>
>> Great...Right up until the switch fails!
And magneto switches don't fail?
-- Craig
Message 13
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
The "Nigerian" scam is famous and predates the Web by at least 80 years.
http://www.snopes.com/crime/fraud/nigeria.asp
http://home.rica.net/alphae/419coal/
In backlash a game has developed around baiting the scammers:
http://www.419eater.com/
-- Craig
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: <CLEONARD52@comcast.net>
NOW, NOW, LETS BE NICE.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Mulwitz" <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz
> <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
>
> This whole diatribe leaves me with two big questions:
>
> 1. What is wrong with having both ignitions operating at once as is
> commonly done on certified aircraft engines? This allows the pilot
> to spend his attention on flying the plane instead of managing the
> engine in the (apparently common for William's resurrected Corvair
> engines) event of an ignition failure.
>
> 2. I find it ironic that a salesman who says the weakest part of his
> customer's system is the customer gets such a zealous following.
>
> Paul
> XL wings
> do not archive
>
>
>>A lot of people get focused on hardware in the ignition system and loose
>>sight of the
>>Two main points: It must work as a complete system and you must recognize
>>that the pilot is the weakest link in the plane. Here is what we fly, and
>>why we set it up this way:
>
> ---------------------------------------------
> Paul Mulwitz
> 32013 NE Dial Road
> Camas, WA 98607
> ---------------------------------------------
>
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Paul, I certainly have seen what your saying. Hard to understand. Course, Jim
Jones got his followers to sip the grape kool-aid. Go figure. Best regards,
Bill
do not archive
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Doug Eatman" <pilotdna@hotmail.com>
Scott,
Thank you for sharing this information.
I am not going to get into the systems layout debate, or scrutinize the
possibility of a switch failing, but I am going to caution listers against
one major sin: insulting individuals, by name, that they have never met or
spoken to in person.
William Wynne is not a salesman. He has contributed far, far more to my
motivation and progress in building an airplane than I have come close to
compensating him for financially. He has given me hours of one-on-one
advising in his own hangar, welded a few small parts for me for free that
the university machine shop wouldn't touch due to liability, given me engine
parts for free to replace what my core engine was missing, allowed me to use
his tools for my own project when I lacked what was needed, took me flying
in his airplane, and even laughed it off when I damaged his wrist pin
fixture by not paying attention and crushing it too far in his hydraulic
press. My total payment to him: $59 for his conversion manual. He is an
honest, well meaning, experienced mechanic. He is not a salesman.
If you have other proven methods of making airworthy systems, go ahead and
explain your ideas. Question other peoples' ideas if you like. That is the
purpose of the list, and that is how new ideas are shared. We all
appreciate input.
Do not attack the credibility of individuals, especially those that you do
not know. That is rude and it is not the purpose of the list.
I do not want any personal emails on this matter. I am in the middle of
final exams for my aerospace/mechanical engineering degree program and have
spent too much time on this list already.
-Douglas Eatman
do not archive
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Crosswind: A New Beginning |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Gig Giacona" <wr.giacona@cox.net>
When they say quick build they mean it that thing is more finished than my 601XL
that I've been working on for 3 years.
[quote="z4t143(at)hotmail.com"]This weekend marked a new beginning in our family's
801 project we call =
"Crosswind" . We picked up our first set of Quick Build modules from =
Zenith Aircraft in Mexico, MO and are back in the "build" mode. Check =
out our website at: http://crosswind.myairplane.com/Page323.1.html
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=32089#32089
Message 18
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4@hot.rr.com>
Larry,
You are probably right with your advice to ignore the scammer or notify
the FBI, but what about the legitimate messages from people overseas who are
just desires of doing honest business????
Bob Stone
----- Original Message -----
From: "lnk" <lnk@iowatelecom.net>
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 12:15 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Scam
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "lnk" <lnk@iowatelecom.net>
>
> Thanks for the heads up on this scam but I would differ in the advice
> given.
> Never, ever respond to the scam e-mail. In doing so you confirm certain
> information to the scammer that you would be better off not sharing. If
> you
> do anything other than ignoring the e-mail forward it to someone like the
> FBI
> or the Anti-Phishing Working Group. (http://www.antiphishing.org/)
>
> Larry Kilburg
>
> When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with
> your
> eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always
> long
> to return.
>
> - Leonardo da Vinci
>
>
> ---------- Original Message -----------
> From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4@hot.rr.com>
> To: "Zodiac CH601XL List" <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Mon, 1 May 2006 10:32:40 -0500
> Subject: Zenith-List: Scam
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4@hot.rr.com>
>>
>> Members of the Net.
>> This message has nothing to do with Zenith aircraft but I think
>> = it's important so I am posting it here for all to read and heed.
>>
>> There is an on line scam going on and it works like this: You =
>> receive a message from someone in England who says they are
>> producing a = product of some kind and selling to clients in the
>> United States. They = need an agent here to receive the funds from
>> their client and take 10% = then forward the ballance on to them in
>> a form different than their = client would do it and thus avoid
>> income tax in their country. It all = sounds easy. If you agree,
>> you will receive a check for $10,000.00. = from their accomplice
>> here. You deposit the check to your checking = account and write a
>> check for $9,000.00 and send it to the scamer. The = catch is the
>> original check is no good and you will be notified by your = bank
>> that the check is bogus and you are out the $9.000.00 If you =
>> receive such an offer, agree to it accept the check from their US =
>> accomplice, deposit it to your account and wait until the bank
>> notifies = you that it is good and has cleared. Chances are it will
>> not clear and = you will be out nothing.
>>
>> Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx
>
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Re: Corvair Dual Ignition toggle Information |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
Let me start by expressing my continuing amazement at the logic of
some of the posters to this list.
In this one, a lister directs heavy personal criticism against me in
the name of not using the list to criticize individuals. I guess his
real message is it is ok to criticize anyone but the great William.
I am also amazed at the people who pointed out this list is an
inappropriate place for my comments and questions about engine
reliability while happily accepting the incredibly long post that was
announced as a duplicate of information posted on the Corvair
list. In the future I hope that any William Worshipers who want to
tell others that there is new information on the Corvair list will do
so with a link rather than a long winded copy of the information.
To those who I offended I offer my apology. To those who think this
list is not an appropriate place to question the value of Corvair
engines, I suggest you grow a thicker skin.
My special thanks to Craig for actually answering my question about
the manual ignition change/over switch. He pointed out that the
Corvair (like other auto conversion engines) only has one spark plug
per cylinder. That was new information to me and, I believe, very
important information. It points out that these engines don't really
have dual isolated ignition systems. Indeed, a single spark plug
fouling will put a cylinder out of commission until it is cleaned.
Paul
XL wings
Do not archive
At 11:02 AM 5/1/2006, you wrote:
>I am going to caution listers against
>one major sin: insulting individuals, by name, that they have never met or
>spoken to in person.
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
The manufacture of the aircraft you are building respects the work William
has done with Corvair engines and routinely has a Corvair-powered 601XL in
their display at air shows, most recently Sun-N-Fun.
-- Craig
Message 21
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "lnk" <lnk@iowatelecom.net>
If they are legitimate you will probably know the sender, the return address
and the sending address are likely to be the same, etc. They also will not be
asking you to do things that are obviously illegal. Refer to me previous post
for web sites that give other clues to recognize scams.
Larry Kilburg
When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your
eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long
to return.
- Leonardo da Vinci
---------- Original Message -----------
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4@hot.rr.com>
Sent: Mon, 1 May 2006 13:53:56 -0500
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Scam
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4@hot.rr.com>
>
> Larry,
> You are probably right with your advice to ignore the scammer
> or notify the FBI, but what about the legitimate messages from
> people overseas who are just desires of doing honest business????
>
> Bob Stone
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "lnk" <lnk@iowatelecom.net>
> To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 12:15 PM
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Scam
>
> > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "lnk" <lnk@iowatelecom.net>
> >
> > Thanks for the heads up on this scam but I would differ in the advice
> > given.
> > Never, ever respond to the scam e-mail. In doing so you confirm certain
> > information to the scammer that you would be better off not sharing. If
> > you
> > do anything other than ignoring the e-mail forward it to someone like the
> > FBI
> > or the Anti-Phishing Working Group. (http://www.antiphishing.org/)
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | Source of 2" flexible duct from NACA vent? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
Does anyone know of a source? All I can find is SCAT tube and that is
over-kill. All that is really needed is a 2" version of plastic dryer vent
tubing.
-- Craig
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Source of 2" flexible duct from NACA vent? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Beckman, Rick" <Rick.Beckman@atk.com>
Does anyone know of a source? All I can find is SCAT tube and that is
over-kill. All that is really needed is a 2" version of plastic dryer
vent tubing.
-- Craig
Craig------ Try O'Reilly's. That's where I'm going for it.
Rick
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Source of 2" flexible duct from NACA vent? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
O'Reilly's? More detail please - are they a local chain, national (US or
Canadian), Internet?
I'm in Utah.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Beckman, Rick
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 2:19 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Source of 2" flexible duct from NACA vent?
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Beckman, Rick"
--> <Rick.Beckman@atk.com>
Does anyone know of a source? All I can find is SCAT tube and that is
over-kill. All that is really needed is a 2" version of plastic dryer vent
tubing.
-- Craig
Craig------ Try O'Reilly's. That's where I'm going for it.
Rick
Message 25
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Zed Smith <zsmith3rd@earthlink.net>
Craig,
Plain old Shop Vac has about the size you need.
Zed/do not archive/etc
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | Source of 2" flexible duct from NACA vent? |
Cc: Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com>
--> Zenith-List message posted by: <dredmoody@cox.net>
Check them out at
http://www.oreillyauto.com/EW3/
Ed Moody II
Rayan, LA
601XL / wings
---- Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
>
> O'Reilly's? More detail please - are they a local chain, national (US or
> Canadian), Internet?
>
> I'm in Utah.
Message 27
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|
| Subject: | Landing/Taxi Lights & wee bits |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Wentz, Don" <don.wentz@intel.com>
As the manufacturer of the LL kits for Van's Aircraft, I thought I would
throw in a few comments and reasons that I have found.
1 - Placing the leading-edge lights further outboard
- Eliminates glare from the light hitting the prop disc,
surprisingly visible on a dark night
- Helps illuminate the edges of the run/taxi ways
- Does not 'violate' the "D-Section" of the wing leading edge at
an inboard location, where stresses are higher and 'could' be a
structural issue
2 - I usually recommend a single light be mounted in the left or pilot's
wing on side by side RVs, especially the taildraggers, as visibility
over the nose on the ground can be limited on the right side. Not
likely an issue on the Zenith as the cowl is lower/narrower, most are
tricycle gear, so in the right wing makes some sense, except for the
possible benefit of the pilot being able to see the closest edge of a
dark taxiway on his left.
3 - We keep the opening in the top of the wing as small as possible -
you don't need or want light spreading up as it can be a
distraction/visibility issue in mist/haze/rain, especially if you try to
scan the horizon.
4 - Moving inboard 1 bay is not likely to cause an issue.
5 - Switching a 2 light setup with 2 switches is a good idea, more
flexibility.
6 - I ground everything to the airframe in my RV-6, 12 years and 925hrs
with no issues.
7 - Consider buying a $15 flasher from Galls Inc, flashing lights are
more visible.
Hope this helps.
Don Wentz
DuckworksAviation.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin
Bellach
Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2006 4:51 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Landing/Taxi Lights & wee bits
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robin Bellach" <601zv@ritternet.com>
Re: Landing light placement. I think the light location was chosen to
allow for the long range tank installation. I have the two tanks per
wing which prevents moving them inward. So, I'm betting that if you have
the single inboard tanks, moving them inward is the most practical thing
to do. It would move the weight a wee bit closer to CG, eliminate a we
bit of wire, and probably make the lights a wee bit more effective, and
perhaps some wee bits I'm overlooking. Are there any wee bits to favor
the more outboard location?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randy Bryant" <randy@shadycreekoutlaws.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2006 6:05 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Landing/Taxi Lights
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Randy Bryant"
> <randy@shadycreekoutlaws.com>
>
> I haven't gotten as far as cutting out for these lights yet, but I
have
> thought of putting them one rib closer to center as well... Has anyone
> that
> has done this encountered any problems doing it this way?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Randy
> N344RB
> do not archive
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <Jaybannist@cs.com>
> To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2006 5:07 PM
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Landing/Taxi Lights
>
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Jaybannist@cs.com
>>
>> Ed, Thanks for the explanation. Makes sense. I plan to switch the
>> lights
>> separately, but I might find that using both is more effective. By
the
>> way, I
>> have located my lights one rib closer to the fuselage.
>>
>> Jay
>>
>
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: <paulrod36@msn.com>
Re your questions---------Certified engines , Lycoming, Continental, et =
al, have very big bores, which means the flame front won't go all the =
way across at higher rpm in time to do any good. Ergo, a plug on either =
side, so the flame front only has to go halfway. Yes, they are redundant =
systems, but come home on one mag, and you WILL know it. WW's redundant =
ignition systems give you a pretty good safety factor, in that if one =
craps out, the other will give you equal quality ingition. Yes, there's =
only one spark plug, but really, when was the last time a spark plug =
axctually DIED on you? Even fouled plugs still have something left, and =
load up slowly. As far as the coil-and-points setup, the new electronic =
systems are way more efficient, pull less juice, and do all sorts of =
good things, better than the old systems. And they rarely fail. But when =
they do, they give no warning. Points frazzle, wear, and run poorly long =
before they die. Those of us old enough to remember when coil and points =
was all there was, still remember when a screwdriver was the operative =
tool, and a matchbook cover was the points gauge to get you running =
better. It's not that ignition systems fail often---It's that you =
always want the deck stacked in your favor. As to point two, name one =
thing that is absolutely consistent, that has a human element involved. =
We only think we're good, and aviation makes humbling us its secondary =
hobby.
Paul Rodriguez
601XL/Corvair --inventing a flap actuator
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Paul Mulwitz<mailto:p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>=20
To: zenith-list@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list@matronics.com>=20
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 8:50 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz =
<p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net<mailto:p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>>
This whole diatribe leaves me with two big questions:
1. What is wrong with having both ignitions operating at once as is=20
commonly done on certified aircraft engines? This allows the pilot=20
to spend his attention on flying the plane instead of managing the=20
engine in the (apparently common for William's resurrected Corvair=20
engines) event of an ignition failure.
2. I find it ironic that a salesman who says the weakest part of his=20
customer's system is the customer gets such a zealous following.
Paul
XL wings
do not archive
>A lot of people get focused on hardware in the ignition system and =
loose
>sight of the
>Two main points: It must work as a complete system and you must =
recognize
>that the pilot is the weakest link in the plane. Here is what we fly, =
and
>why we set it up this way:
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List<http://www.matronics.com/N=
avigator?Zenith-List>
=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
http://www.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/contributi=
on>
=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=20
=20
=20
Message 29
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|
| Subject: | Flying Report: 601XL/Corvair |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Phil Maxson" <pmaxpmax@hotmail.com>
This weekend, Gus Warren, flew my 601XL/Corvair from Edgewater, FL to my
home airport in Hackettstown, NJ. As many of you know, I completed my
engine in William's Hangar, and then took my plane back to them to finish
the cowling, paint and electrical system. Well, this weekend was the
culmination of my dream to build and fly my own airplane. Gus and I flew
around for a few days and he showed me how things work. And DOES IT EVER
WORK! Even with my limited experience in the plane I was making the
shortest take offs at my home field of all the planes out there. My plane
was able to make it to pattern altitude faster than I could have expected.
I don't have a vertical speed indicator so I can't give details, but it
climbs beautifully. This was worth waiting 6 years for!
Best of all, when anyone sees it for the first time, they ask what kind of
plane it is and they are impressed, but when the find out it is Corvair
powered, they are really interested.
I can't thank William Wynne and his gang at flycorvair.com enough. They
finished my plane, made it look beautiful, and then DELIVERED IT to me and
helped me become familiar with it. You don't find nice people like them
every day.
There is a video of my plane on the flycorvair.com web site:
http://flycorvair.com/601mxvid.wmv
Phil Maxson
N601MX
601XL/Corvair
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
2700 is NOT a high rpm. Think of all the cars that run 5000 to 8000 rpm
with only one plug. The speed of the flame front is very fast, especially at
2700 rpm. Plug redundancy may help flame front speed but tell that to a
Ferrari that is turning 12 grand on one plug per cylinder. I don't think it
is a factor to even consider with our relatively slow speed aviation
engines.
----- Original Message -----
From: <paulrod36@msn.com>
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 8:54 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: <paulrod36@msn.com>
>
> Re your questions---------Certified engines , Lycoming, Continental, et =
> al, have very big bores, which means the flame front won't go all the =
> way across at higher rpm in time to do any good. Ergo, a plug on either =
> side, so the flame front only has to go halfway. Yes, they are redundant =
> systems, but come home on one mag, and you WILL know it. WW's redundant =
> ignition systems give you a pretty good safety factor, in that if one =
> craps out, the other will give you equal quality ingition. Yes, there's =
> only one spark plug, but really, when was the last time a spark plug =
> axctually DIED on you? Even fouled plugs still have something left, and =
> load up slowly. As far as the coil-and-points setup, the new electronic =
> systems are way more efficient, pull less juice, and do all sorts of =
> good things, better than the old systems. And they rarely fail. But when =
> they do, they give no warning. Points frazzle, wear, and run poorly long =
> before they die. Those of us old enough to remember when coil and points =
> was all there was, still remember when a screwdriver was the operative =
> tool, and a matchbook cover was the points gauge to get you running =
> better. It's not that ignition systems fail often---It's that you =
> always want the deck stacked in your favor. As to point two, name one =
> thing that is absolutely consistent, that has a human element involved. =
> We only think we're good, and aviation makes humbling us its secondary =
> hobby.
>
> Paul Rodriguez
> 601XL/Corvair --inventing a flap actuator
> ----- Original Message -----=20
> From: Paul Mulwitz<mailto:p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>=20
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list@matronics.com>=20
> Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 8:50 AM
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle
>
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz =
> <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net<mailto:p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>>
>
> This whole diatribe leaves me with two big questions:
>
> 1. What is wrong with having both ignitions operating at once as is=20
> commonly done on certified aircraft engines? This allows the pilot=20
> to spend his attention on flying the plane instead of managing the=20
> engine in the (apparently common for William's resurrected Corvair=20
> engines) event of an ignition failure.
>
> 2. I find it ironic that a salesman who says the weakest part of his=20
> customer's system is the customer gets such a zealous following.
>
> Paul
> XL wings
> do not archive
>
>
> >A lot of people get focused on hardware in the ignition system and =
> loose
> >sight of the
> >Two main points: It must work as a complete system and you must =
> recognize
> >that the pilot is the weakest link in the plane. Here is what we fly, =
> and
> >why we set it up this way:
>
> ---------------------------------------------
> Paul Mulwitz
> 32013 NE Dial Road
> Camas, WA 98607
> ---------------------------------------------
>
>
> =
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List<http://www.matronics.com/N=
> avigator?Zenith-List>
> =
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> =
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> on>
> =
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
>
> =20
> =20
> =20
>
>
>
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "George Harris" <george@customcals.com>
That's pretty unkind.
----- Original Message -----
From: <JAPhillipsGA@aol.com>
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 10:32 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
>
> Paul, I certainly have seen what your saying. Hard to understand. Course,
Jim
> Jones got his followers to sip the grape kool-aid. Go figure. Best
regards,
> Bill
> do not archive
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.5.1/327 - Release Date: 4/28/2006
>
>
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.5.1/327 - Release Date: 4/28/2006
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Brandon Tucker <btucke73@yahoo.com>
Paul,
You are correct that if one spark plug fouls,
neither ignition would fire the plug, and the plug
must be cleaned. To my knowledge, it has never
happened, but it is a possibility. This is where the
extra 2 cylinders would be a good thing.
The piston area of the lycos is so large that
running both spark plugs will produce a much more
complete fuel burn, as proven by the RPM drop on mag
checks. The same results would likely not be realized
in the corvair with such a small diameter piston, even
with two spark plugs, so running both ignitions does
not help there. Only in the case of seamless failure
is it beneficial to run both. If there were not an
efficiency benefit of running both ignitions in
aviation engines, would we still always run both? The
answer is yes, because it is convention and how
everyone was taught, but would it be convention? I
learned in a turbo prop and am fairly new to piston
engine aircraft with only 300 hours in pistons, so I
feel unbiased here.
There are arguments that if you run both
ignitions all the time, you would have no indication
of a single ignition failure. Sure, you do a mag
check on the ground, but what happens if it fails at
takeoff? You continue on the other ignition unaware
that one failed, just for the second to fail after
climb out. If you run one at a time, you simply
switch to the other ignition on failure, and if on
climb out, can turn downwind, and land immediately.
This, in my opinion, is valid argument.
Having separate switches for the ignition systems
is a good concept as well, but it can be argued that
one could accidently shut them both off. Not likely,
but possible.
With a single switch controlling both ignitions
(like my system), switch failure can cause a forced
landing. It happened in an RV recently.
What is the best way to go? Who the hell knows.
If we keep it civil, we will all make more informed
decisions. Since the accident in the RV, I have
become aware that my automotive key switch could be a
weak link in my system, through civil textual
conversation on the corvair list. I have a 3 position
switch that allows me to run ignition 1, 2 or none. I
am considering a separate emergency ignition switch
run independently from the rest of my electrical
system feeding both ignitions, just in case the key
switch or ignition switch breaks. I have a header
tank, so all I need in an emergency is an ignition.
R/
Brandon Tucker
One wing painted, one to go
http://home.sandiego.edu/~btucker-03/
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
Message 33
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|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Report: 601XL/Corvair |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon@comcast.net>
Congratulations Phil, I think your plane inspired me also.
The trip to SnF this year was just to help me decide if I was going to Corvair
or not. Seeing and hearing your plane put me over the edge.
I think I have a core in the works.
--------
Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=32222#32222
Message 34
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|
| Subject: | Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Cardell" <Bill@flyinmiata.com>
As others have pointed out, aircooled aircraft engines typically have
huge bores compared to any high revving car engines, some of which *are*
dual plugged. 911 Porsche for example, from IIRC, 1984 on.
Do not archive
TurboDog's Dad
Bill Cardell
www.flyinmiata.com
1-800-FLY-MX5S
970-242-3800
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of cgalley
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "cgalley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
2700 is NOT a high rpm. Think of all the cars that run 5000 to 8000 rpm
with only one plug. The speed of the flame front is very fast,
especially at 2700 rpm. Plug redundancy may help flame front speed but
tell that to a Ferrari that is turning 12 grand on one plug per
cylinder. I don't think it is a factor to even consider with our
relatively slow speed aviation engines.
----- Original Message -----
From: <paulrod36@msn.com>
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 8:54 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: <paulrod36@msn.com>
>
> Re your questions---------Certified engines , Lycoming, Continental,
et =
> al, have very big bores, which means the flame front won't go all the
=
> way across at higher rpm in time to do any good. Ergo, a plug on
either =
> side, so the flame front only has to go halfway. Yes, they are
redundant =
> systems, but come home on one mag, and you WILL know it. WW's
redundant =
> ignition systems give you a pretty good safety factor, in that if one
=
> craps out, the other will give you equal quality ingition. Yes,
there's =
> only one spark plug, but really, when was the last time a spark plug =
> axctually DIED on you? Even fouled plugs still have something left,
and =
> load up slowly. As far as the coil-and-points setup, the new
electronic =
> systems are way more efficient, pull less juice, and do all sorts of =
> good things, better than the old systems. And they rarely fail. But
when =
> they do, they give no warning. Points frazzle, wear, and run poorly
long =
> before they die. Those of us old enough to remember when coil and
points =
> was all there was, still remember when a screwdriver was the operative
=
> tool, and a matchbook cover was the points gauge to get you running =
> better. It's not that ignition systems fail often---It's that you =
> always want the deck stacked in your favor. As to point two, name
one =
> thing that is absolutely consistent, that has a human element
involved. =
> We only think we're good, and aviation makes humbling us its secondary
=
> hobby.
>
> Paul Rodriguez
> 601XL/Corvair --inventing a flap actuator
> ----- Original Message -----=20
> From: Paul Mulwitz<mailto:p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>=20
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list@matronics.com>=20
> Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 8:50 AM
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition toggle
>
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz =
> <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net<mailto:p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>>
>
> This whole diatribe leaves me with two big questions:
>
> 1. What is wrong with having both ignitions operating at once as
is=20
> commonly done on certified aircraft engines? This allows the
pilot=20
> to spend his attention on flying the plane instead of managing the=20
> engine in the (apparently common for William's resurrected Corvair=20
> engines) event of an ignition failure.
>
> 2. I find it ironic that a salesman who says the weakest part of
his=20
> customer's system is the customer gets such a zealous following.
>
> Paul
> XL wings
> do not archive
>
>
> >A lot of people get focused on hardware in the ignition system and =
> loose
> >sight of the
> >Two main points: It must work as a complete system and you must =
> recognize
> >that the pilot is the weakest link in the plane. Here is what we
fly, =
> and
> >why we set it up this way:
>
> ---------------------------------------------
> Paul Mulwitz
> 32013 NE Dial Road
> Camas, WA 98607
> ---------------------------------------------
>
>
> =
>
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List<http://www.matronics.com/
N=
> avigator?Zenith-List>
> =
>
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> =
>
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> on>
> =
>
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
>
> =20
> =20
> =20
>
>
>
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Flying Report: 601XL/Corvair |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike <rsq2424@yahoo.com>
Mega congrats Phil!
Mike Fortunato
do not archive
Phil Maxson <pmaxpmax@hotmail.com> wrote:
this weekend was the culmination of my dream to build and fly my own airplane.
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Mail goes everywhere you do. Get it on your phone.
Message 36
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| Subject: | Official Zenith-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Dear Listers,
Please read over the Zenith-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below. The
complete Zenith-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the
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Matt Dralle
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among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
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quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
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- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
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- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
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will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occassional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularyly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
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| Subject: | Official Zenith-List Usage Guidelines |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Dear Listers,
Please read over the Zenith-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
Zenith-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Zenith-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
Zenith-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the Zenith-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the Zenith-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
Zenith-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the Zenith-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occassional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularyly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
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