---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 05/17/06: 24 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:53 AM - Re: link for "new " trim tab drawing (Phil Maxson) 2. 05:13 AM - Ye Olde Spinner (Tommy Walker) 3. 05:57 AM - Spinner (Zed Smith) 4. 08:04 AM - Re: link for "new " trim tab drawing (Jack Russell) 5. 08:07 AM - Access Panel for Outer Tank Filters (Martin Pohl) 6. 08:19 AM - Re: Ye Olde Spinner (JERICKSON03E@aol.com) 7. 09:36 AM - Re: link for "new " trim tab drawing (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com) 8. 09:54 AM - SA article planned on Z601HDS performance (charles.long@gm.com) 9. 10:08 AM - Re: link for "new " trim tab drawing (Robin Bellach) 10. 10:19 AM - Re: Access Panel for Outer Tank Filters (Mike) 11. 10:29 AM - Re: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)) 12. 10:38 AM - Re: link for "new " trim tab drawing (Jack Russell) 13. 10:46 AM - Re: Ye Olde Spinner (j. davis) 14. 11:45 AM - Re: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance (Brad DeMeo) 15. 01:23 PM - Re: Zodiac XL Wheel Pants (lgingell) 16. 01:53 PM - Re: Re: Zodiac XL Wheel Pants (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)) 17. 02:13 PM - Re: Ye Olde Spinner (Allan Barton) 18. 02:25 PM - Re: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance (Paul Mulwitz) 19. 02:33 PM - Re: Re: Zodiac XL Wheel Pants (Randy) 20. 02:52 PM - Re: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)) 21. 02:55 PM - 601xl elevator trim tab (Brad DeMeo) 22. 06:13 PM - Re e mail address (Bob & Kay Stuart) 23. 06:38 PM - Re: link for "new " trim tab drawing (Phil Maxson) 24. 08:37 PM - Re: link for "new " trim tab drawing (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:53:23 AM PST US From: "Phil Maxson" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: link for "new " trim tab drawing --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Phil Maxson" This was my solution for the shorter trim tab, but it is still not effective enough to fully counteract the pitch of the plane when flaps are deployed. This is not a problem in flight, so I don't plan to fix it. It's not ugly, or even noticable. When my plane was parked at the Zenith booth at Sun-n-Fun, none of the 100s of visitors seemed to notice it, or if they did, they didn't mention it. Including the Heinz boys who went over it in detail. Phil Maxson N601MX Corvair/XL Northwest New Jersey > >Interesting the Zac has come up with the longer trim tab but does > >anyone think there would be a problem with just riveting an > >extension plate to the bottom of the exsisting trim tab? Jack ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:13:50 AM PST US From: "Tommy Walker" Subject: Zenith-List: Ye Olde Spinner --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tommy Walker" I'm building a 701 w/Rotax 912/Warp Drive 3-blade prop. Looking for a spinner. Would appreciate any tips, brands, etc. I'm going to the Super Sale at Aircraft Spruce East this Saturday so hopefully I can get one there unless someone knows of a better deal. As always, thanks. Tommy Walker in Alabama Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:57:26 AM PST US From: Zed Smith Subject: Zenith-List: Spinner --> Zenith-List message posted by: Zed Smith Tommy, My spinner came with the kit from ZAC. Since I already had the engine, but a pusher prop, ZAC supplied a three-blade GSC wood prop, with spinner. The spinner was of the correct diameter but the attaching bolt was a bit too long. (In my case at least, the bolt bottomed out in the hub before the spinner was tight) The bolt was threaded about half its length so it was no problem to saw off nearly an inch on the little end. You might want to find a bolt that fits (diameter & thread pitch) and take it with you to the big sale.....save gnashing of teeth later. Also, a phone call to ZAC might get a spinner Make/Model to guide you. Regards, Zed/701/R912/90+%/etc/do not archive ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:04:58 AM PST US From: Jack Russell Subject: Re: Zenith-List: link for "new " trim tab drawing --> Zenith-List message posted by: Jack Russell Thanks phil: I added about a inch to the tab with a slight down bend. Did a short flight today and it made all the difference. I can fly with the indicator in the netural position now. I still need a lot of up with the flaps. I think I can live with that also. I think once it is painted you won't even notice the tab. jack in los osos ca Phil Maxson wrote: --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Phil Maxson" This was my solution for the shorter trim tab, but it is still not effective enough to fully counteract the pitch of the plane when flaps are deployed. This is not a problem in flight, so I don't plan to fix it. It's not ugly, or even noticable. When my plane was parked at the Zenith booth at Sun-n-Fun, none of the 100s of visitors seemed to notice it, or if they did, they didn't mention it. Including the Heinz boys who went over it in detail. Phil Maxson N601MX Corvair/XL Northwest New Jersey > >Interesting the Zac has come up with the longer trim tab but does > >anyone think there would be a problem with just riveting an > >extension plate to the bottom of the exsisting trim tab? Jack ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:07:58 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Access Panel for Outer Tank Filters From: "Martin Pohl" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Martin Pohl" Hi To all the 4-tank-Zodiac XL-builders: Did you install access panels at the tank outlets for the outer tanks (to get access to the connection and the tank filter)? The space between nose rib #5 and #6 is rather limited (1/2 " approx.)... On Zenith's plans are only access panels for the inner tanks. Any advice? Rgds Martin -------- Martin Pohl Zodiac XL QBK 8645 Jona, Switzerland Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=35014#35014 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:19:22 AM PST US From: JERICKSON03E@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Ye Olde Spinner --> Zenith-List message posted by: JERICKSON03E@aol.com In a message dated 5/17/2006 7:14:30 AM Central Daylight Time, twalker@cableone.net writes: Zenith-List message posted by: "Tommy Walker" I'm building a 701 w/Rotax 912/Warp Drive 3-blade prop. Looking for a spinner. Would appreciate any tips, brands, etc. I'm going to the Super Sale at Aircraft Spruce East this Saturday so hopefully I can get one there unless someone knows of a better deal. As always, thanks. Tommy Walker in Alabama Do Not Archive Tom For my 701, 912ULS, Three blade Warp Drive prop, I chose the 5 inch HPL aluminum spinner from Warp Drive. About $85. Main reason was clearance for cooling air flow, the 9 inch spinner greatly blocks the cowl opening, also the 5 inch spinner comes with an aluminum plate needed for the prop inst. other spinners I considered had fiber glass mounting plates. I liked the alum plate. I spoke with Darrell at Warp Drive, (614) 357 6000. Seems that about half of 701 builders buy the 9 inch, half buy the 5 inch. For prop pitch adjustment, the 5 inch spinner does not cover the hub pitch bolts, I like that feature as well. Info as you requested. Jerry ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:36:41 AM PST US From: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: link for "new " trim tab drawing --> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com Jack & Phil, I have not experienced this void in pitch control with flaps down you mentioned. When flying straight and level do you use any trim. Up or down ? Do you neutral the tail trim when setting up to land ? When you say you lose pitch control does that mean you can't pitch the plane enough to land rear wheels first with the flaps down ? Is this with a center yoke or duel sticks ? Power on - power off ? I just have not seen anything like a lack or loss of pitch all the way to stalling with and without flaps. Maybe it is not the trim tab, but the yoke may somehow be restrictived? I am puzzled. Maybe the incident on your stabilizers are wrong. Best regards, Bill of Georgia N505WP 601XL-3300 w/dc 63 hours do not archive ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:54:58 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance Cc: Michael Mossman , info@zenithair.com, SSKROG@aol.com From: charles.long@gm.com --> Zenith-List message posted by: charles.long@gm.com Hello everyone, Mike Mossman and I am planning to write a two-part article for Sport Aviation. The first part will be a discussion of an Aerodynamics Simulator for Homebuilt aircraft. The second part will be a discussion of how well the simulator predicts peformance of six engine combinations in the Zenith 601HDS. There should be a considerable amount of interest in this subject since fuel prices continue to rise and our Zodie Rockets are a pretty economical way to stay in the air. I have previously published two articles in SA on Budget Flight Simulators and I'm optimistic that a well-written article on this subject will publish as well. We are interested in finding pilots with 601HDS's willing to perform a 1-1/2 hour flight test on their aircraft measuring its peformance at 7500 ft. Basically, you will be measuring WOT climb and CT descent rates at various airspeeds. (A GPS is required to accurately measure ground speed in opposite directions). If you are interested, please contact me off line and I can provide you with a test card and instructions. The test results will be compiled and we can share them with this list and the ZAC newsletter upon completion. The six engines we are planning to include are: Jabiru 2200 Jabiru 3300 Rotax 912 Rotax 912s Convair conversions Subaru conversions We might consider other engines as well, but need at least two samples of each type to confirm the numbers are reasonably consistent. This will be a fairly big undertaking but will provide lots of good press for our airplanes and a useful simulator for the general homebuilding community. Thanks Chuck Long, PE/CFI Z601HDS/Jab3300 N601LE 70 hr TT ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:08:41 AM PST US From: "Robin Bellach" <601zv@ritternet.com> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: link for "new " trim tab drawing --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robin Bellach" <601zv@ritternet.com> Weren't they talking about a lack of pitch trim control only, and not lack of pitch control, or did I miss something? ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 11:30 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: link for "new " trim tab drawing > --> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com > > Jack & Phil, I have not experienced this void in pitch control with flaps > down you mentioned. When flying straight and level do you use any trim. Up > or > down ? Do you neutral the tail trim when setting up to land ? When you say > you > lose pitch control does that mean you can't pitch the plane enough to land > rear > wheels first with the flaps down ? Is this with a center yoke or duel > sticks ? > Power on - power off ? I just have not seen anything like a lack or loss > of > pitch all the way to stalling with and without flaps. Maybe it is not the > trim > tab, but the yoke may somehow be restrictived? I am puzzled. Maybe the > incident on your stabilizers are wrong. Best regards, > Bill of Georgia > N505WP 601XL-3300 w/dc 63 hours > do not archive > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:19:11 AM PST US From: Mike Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Access Panel for Outer Tank Filters --> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike > To all the 4-tank-Zodiac XL-builders: Did you install access > panels at the tank outlets for the outer tanks (to get access to > the connection and the tank filter)? The space between nose > rib #5 and #6 is rather limited (1/2 " approx.)... Yes, I did, and you're right, there's not much room between those ribs. I'm hoping there will be just enough space to get a wrench in there if I ever have to pull the screens out, but haven't tried it yet. Mike Fortunato 601XL --------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low PC-to-Phone call rates. ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:29:37 AM PST US Subject: RE: Zenith-List: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" I'm not sure that the data you gather with the flight tests will be indicative of engine performance...I.e fuel economy. I,e 2 100HP engine's run at WOT at the same fuel/air mixture will burn the same amount of fuel. I think the differences you will really measure will be differences in drag between the HDS's. We all know there are differences between the same model and some have done drag reduction mods so these will be the fastest for the same amount of thrust. The only difference between fuel economy in engines would be if they had fuel injection and you could run lean of peak EGT (all carbed engines run Rich of peak EGT) where the efficiency improves quite a bit. Not saying this is a waste of time but there are many variables that you will need to take into account to get any conclusions that are meaningful. For example, a 120HP Jab turning at 3300RPM with a Prince prop and drag reduction mods on a cool day will be a totally different outcome to an HDS with no mods, Rotax 912 with a Warp drive on a warm day. I just doubt the data would be enable you to say anything useful as there too many variables...Exept a 120HP will climb faster than than a 100HP motor...Assuming they are both making rated power. If you look at some of the work the CAF foundation has done you will see they spend some hours instrumenting each aircraft before they can measure performance with any certainty Just a thought. Incidently there are a number of speed measuring conversions on the web that will calculate airspeed based on a three way run...But even that is not as easy to do as you might think...i tired doing this the other evening and the more power I added the slower it went in one direction (clearly wind was changing over the 3 miles I covered getting data). Even holding a course without an autopilot is not trivial. Frank Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of charles.long@gm.com Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 9:52 AM Cc: Michael Mossman; info@zenithair.com; SSKROG@aol.com Subject: Zenith-List: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance --> Zenith-List message posted by: charles.long@gm.com Hello everyone, Mike Mossman and I am planning to write a two-part article for Sport Aviation. The first part will be a discussion of an Aerodynamics Simulator for Homebuilt aircraft. The second part will be a discussion of how well the simulator predicts peformance of six engine combinations in the Zenith 601HDS. There should be a considerable amount of interest in this subject since fuel prices continue to rise and our Zodie Rockets are a pretty economical way to stay in the air. I have previously published two articles in SA on Budget Flight Simulators and I'm optimistic that a well-written article on this subject will publish as well. We are interested in finding pilots with 601HDS's willing to perform a 1-1/2 hour flight test on their aircraft measuring its peformance at 7500 ft. Basically, you will be measuring WOT climb and CT descent rates at various airspeeds. (A GPS is required to accurately measure ground speed in opposite directions). If you are interested, please contact me off line and I can provide you with a test card and instructions. The test results will be compiled and we can share them with this list and the ZAC newsletter upon completion. The six engines we are planning to include are: Jabiru 2200 Jabiru 3300 Rotax 912 Rotax 912s Convair conversions Subaru conversions We might consider other engines as well, but need at least two samples of each type to confirm the numbers are reasonably consistent. This will be a fairly big undertaking but will provide lots of good press for our airplanes and a useful simulator for the general homebuilding community. Thanks Chuck Long, PE/CFI Z601HDS/Jab3300 N601LE 70 hr TT ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:38:04 AM PST US From: Jack Russell Subject: Re: Zenith-List: link for "new " trim tab drawing --> Zenith-List message posted by: Jack Russell Bill: When I had only 10 deg of flaps in I had to have full up trim and I still had to hold quite a bit of back pressure on the yoke. I thought about changing the angle of the horz stabilizer but I did install it according to plan. The brackets rest on the longeron. I thought about rasing the back backet a bit but the extra trim tab seems to work. It might be creating a bit more drag so I still might change the tail. Things are still working out on each test flight. Jack JAPhillipsGA@aol.com wrote: --> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com Jack & Phil, I have not experienced this void in pitch control with flaps down you mentioned. When flying straight and level do you use any trim. Up or down ? Do you neutral the tail trim when setting up to land ? When you say you lose pitch control does that mean you can't pitch the plane enough to land rear wheels first with the flaps down ? Is this with a center yoke or duel sticks ? Power on - power off ? I just have not seen anything like a lack or loss of pitch all the way to stalling with and without flaps. Maybe it is not the trim tab, but the yoke may somehow be restrictived? I am puzzled. Maybe the incident on your stabilizers are wrong. Best regards, Bill of Georgia N505WP 601XL-3300 w/dc 63 hours do not archive ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:46:19 AM PST US From: "j. davis" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Ye Olde Spinner --> Zenith-List message posted by: "j. davis" Tommy Walker wrote: > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tommy Walker" > > I'm building a 701 w/Rotax 912/Warp Drive 3-blade prop. Looking for a > spinner. Would appreciate any tips, brands, etc. I'm using a 9" UHS spinner with a 3-blade WarpDrive/912UL on C-IGGY, and am very happy with it. See http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/uhs.php and pics of mine at: http://cleco.ca/gallery2/v/CH701/construction_gallery/Spring2006/ > > Tommy Walker in Alabama dd> Do Not Archive > -- Regards, J. flying: Zenith STOL CH701/912 C-IGGY, 300 hrs. building: Sonex #325, Jabiru 3300/6, 85% completed +-------------------------------------------------------+ | J. Davis, M.Sc. | (computer science) | | *NIX consulting, SysAdmin | jd at lawsonimaging.ca | | c/o Brandywine Aviation | voice: 519.289.1527 | | Appin, ON, CA | http://www.cleco.ca | | N42 47.33 W081 36.50 31/13 | 2000+ x 60', elev: 740' | +-------------------------------------------------------+ To most people the sky is the limit. To those who love aviation, the sky is home. A teacher once said to me, "We all bring joy to others...sometimes when we enter a room, sometimes when we leave...". I wonder what he was trying to tell me... ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:45:06 AM PST US From: Brad DeMeo Subject: Re: Zenith-List: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance --> Zenith-List message posted by: Brad DeMeo Lance Gingell in California has a Jabiru in his Zodiac XL. I think he's in the web ring. charles.long@gm.com wrote: >--> Zenith-List message posted by: charles.long@gm.com > > >Hello everyone, > >Mike Mossman and I am planning to write a two-part article for Sport >Aviation. The first part will be a discussion of an Aerodynamics Simulator >for Homebuilt aircraft. The second part will be a discussion of how well >the simulator predicts peformance of six engine combinations in the Zenith >601HDS. There should be a considerable amount of interest in this subject >since fuel prices continue to rise and our Zodie Rockets are a pretty >economical way to stay in the air. I have previously published two articles >in SA on Budget Flight Simulators and I'm optimistic that a well-written >article on this subject will publish as well. > >We are interested in finding pilots with 601HDS's willing to perform a >1-1/2 hour flight test on their aircraft measuring its peformance at 7500 >ft. Basically, you will be measuring WOT climb and CT descent rates at >various airspeeds. (A GPS is required to accurately measure ground speed in >opposite directions). If you are interested, please contact me off line and >I can provide you with a test card and instructions. > >The test results will be compiled and we can share them with this list and >the ZAC newsletter upon completion. The six engines we are planning to >include are: > > Jabiru 2200 > Jabiru 3300 > Rotax 912 > Rotax 912s > Convair conversions > Subaru conversions > >We might consider other engines as well, but need at least two samples of >each type to confirm the numbers are reasonably consistent. This will be a >fairly big undertaking but will provide lots of good press for our >airplanes and a useful simulator for the general homebuilding community. > >Thanks >Chuck Long, PE/CFI >Z601HDS/Jab3300 >N601LE 70 hr TT > > > > > > > > > -- The information contained in this transmission is attorney-client privileged and/or confidential information intended for the use of the individual or entity named-above as recipient. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. IRS circular 230 Disclosure: As required by U.S. Treasury Regulations governing tax practice, you are hereby advised that any written tax advice contatined herein was not written or intended to be used (and cannot be used) by any taxpayer for the purpose of avoiding penalties that may be imposed under the U.S. Internal Revenue Code. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:23:22 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Zodiac XL Wheel Pants From: "lgingell" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "lgingell" I just put my main wheel pants on yesterday. They are old RV4 pants. They work well, and look much better than the factory ones. I still need to get my nose wheel pant finished (moulded off of the mains, but not on the airplane yet). ..lance http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=35075#35075 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 01:53:50 PM PST US Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Zodiac XL Wheel Pants From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" Ya...One day I might remove the top skin off the 601 to retrofit for C/S screws...Before I give back the dimpler to its owner of course...:) Nice paint job Lance, did you do that yourself? Frank 601HDS 396 hours RV 7a almost painting. Do not archive I just put my main wheel pants on yesterday. They are old RV4 pants. They work well, and look much better than the factory ones. I still need to get my nose wheel pant finished (moulded off of the mains, but not on the airplane yet). ..lance http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=35075#35075 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:13:21 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Ye Olde Spinner From: "Allan Barton" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Allan Barton" Hi This is a link to a spinner company in Australia might be of some help www.cumminsspinners.com Fly safe -------- Allan 601 XL Corvair 50 % done 200% to go Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=35082#35082 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 02:25:06 PM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz I anxiously await hearing your results. I don't have a flying plane yet, but I still need to finalize my choice of engines. Since I want the most performance I can get, you test results will be of great interest to me. Do you have a plan for when your numbers will be available? Are you considering dribbling them on the list as they are developed? Paul XL wings do not archive >We are interested in finding pilots with 601HDS's willing to perform a >1-1/2 hour flight test on their aircraft measuring its peformance at 7500 >ft. Basically, you will be measuring WOT climb and CT descent rates at >various airspeeds. (A GPS is required to accurately measure ground speed in >opposite directions). If you are interested, please contact me off line and >I can provide you with a test card and instructions. > >The test results will be compiled and we can share them with this list and >the ZAC newsletter upon completion. The six engines we are planning to >include are: > > Jabiru 2200 > Jabiru 3300 > Rotax 912 > Rotax 912s > Convair conversions > Subaru conversions > > - ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 02:33:22 PM PST US From: "Randy" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Zodiac XL Wheel Pants --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Randy" Lance, Beautiful plane! Any pictures of the wheel pants?? Randy Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "lgingell" Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 3:17 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Zodiac XL Wheel Pants > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "lgingell" > > I just put my main wheel pants on yesterday. They are old RV4 pants. They > work well, and look much better than the factory ones. > > I still need to get my nose wheel pant finished (moulded off of the mains, > but not on the airplane yet). > > ..lance > http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=35075#35075 > > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 02:52:04 PM PST US Subject: RE: Zenith-List: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" I would suggest that if you want utmost performance for an XL then the Jab 3300 is the clear winner for two reasons. 1) It is the highest horsepower engine. 2) It is air cooled. Air cooled engine use less air to cool than do water cooled engines because the cylinder heads run at a higher temp than do the radiators on a water cooled motor. The XL being a little faster than the HDS will make this effect more pronounced because drag is proportional to the square of the speed...This is good for max speed and cruise. For climb you want power. Here is another suggestion...how about a 150HP Ram Subaru conversion?....Now that will really climb but maybe slightly slower in top end speed. Frank -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Mulwitz Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 2:21 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: SA article planned on Z601HDS performance --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz --> I anxiously await hearing your results. I don't have a flying plane yet, but I still need to finalize my choice of engines. Since I want the most performance I can get, you test results will be of great interest to me. Do you have a plan for when your numbers will be available? Are you considering dribbling them on the list as they are developed? Paul XL wings do not archive ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 02:55:02 PM PST US From: Brad DeMeo Subject: Zenith-List: 601xl elevator trim tab --> Zenith-List message posted by: Brad DeMeo I have QBK (In know...I'm a cheater; but I want to fly sooner). The 08/05 plans 6-T-6 call for a 40 degree down travel of the elevator trim tab and 20 degree up. With the trim tab installed at the factory and all else lined up perfectly I am only getting 30 degrees down travel before the leading edge of the trim tab stops against the elevator cutout channel (rear spar on elevator in trim tab cutout area). To complicate matters, an earlier 06/05 revision of the plans 6-T-6 call for 30 degrees down and 30 degrees up. I would rather use the latest specs of 40 and 20 as I understand there have been elevator trim tab issues with full flaps deployed. Has anyone run into this issue and resolved it? Zenith is mystified as well. Knowing I am not perfect I have checked and rechecked, measured and remeasured the assembly several times, but remain confounded. BradD ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 06:13:17 PM PST US From: "Bob & Kay Stuart" Subject: Zenith-List: Re e mail address --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bob & Kay Stuart" Hi Matt My e mail address has changed from bkstuart@nrtco to bkstuart@storm.ca Thanks Bob Stuart 701 ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 06:38:14 PM PST US From: "Phil Maxson" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: link for "new " trim tab drawing --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Phil Maxson" I wasn't describing a loss of pitch control with the flaps deployed, I was saying that the old style rudder (not full span of the elevator) doesn't have enough authority to fly hands off with full trim. This has been the experience of several builders with early plans/kits. The plane handles beautifully, it just requires more nose up pressure than the smaller trim tab can supply. This is not a problem at all, it's just something to get used to. I have plenty of elevator left to flare and land it on the tail if I wish. While flying straight and level the trim tab is neutral, and I reset it to neutral before each take-off. My plane has the standard center stick. Phil Maxson 601XL/Corvair Northwest New Jersey >From: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: link for "new " trim tab drawing >Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 12:30:27 EDT > >--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com > >Jack & Phil, I have not experienced this void in pitch control with flaps >down you mentioned. When flying straight and level do you use any trim. Up >or >down ? Do you neutral the tail trim when setting up to land ? When you say >you >lose pitch control does that mean you can't pitch the plane enough to land >rear >wheels first with the flaps down ? Is this with a center yoke or duel >sticks ? >Power on - power off ? I just have not seen anything like a lack or loss of >pitch all the way to stalling with and without flaps. Maybe it is not the >trim >tab, but the yoke may somehow be restrictived? I am puzzled. Maybe the >incident on your stabilizers are wrong. Best regards, >Bill of Georgia >N505WP 601XL-3300 w/dc 63 hours ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 08:37:55 PM PST US From: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: link for "new " trim tab drawing --> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com Jack, my knowledge of what makes "it" go up and down is very limited, especially when "it" doesn't seem to be doing what "it" should. Have you called Nick and Roger at ZAC with this ? When flying I have a touch of down trim when near max load and even less when flying alone. I neutral both aileron and elevator trims just prior to base and land without or with full flaps and pitch control all the way to stall on it's tail. I think I even scraped the rear tie down loop last summer and recovered to set it on the mains with gentle pitch control. I wish I had an answer, maybe calling the "brain trust" at ZAC can offer a solution. Best regards, Bill of Georgia