---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 06/17/06: 28 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:20 AM - Re: Re: LRI Hook up (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com) 2. 06:35 AM - Re: OOps.. Never make this mistake! (Jon Croke) 3. 06:35 AM - Re: Neutral flap position (Big Gee) 4. 06:37 AM - LRI Question (normskiroo@ukonl) 5. 06:37 AM - Re: OOps.. Never make this mistake! (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)) 6. 06:46 AM - Re: Neutral flap position (Edward Moody II) 7. 06:51 AM - Re: Re: Re: Re: CH601HD/HDS Main Gear (Bill Naumuk) 8. 08:18 AM - Re: XP Problems (Michael Clark) 9. 09:47 AM - Re: XP Problems (Bill Naumuk) 10. 10:30 AM - Re: XP Problems (jsimons2) 11. 10:44 AM - Acetone bottles (rhartwig11@juno.com) 12. 10:52 AM - 601XL Cover (Doug Moellering) 13. 11:12 AM - Re: 601XL Cover (Jeff) 14. 11:44 AM - Five Big Questions - Zodiac 610XL Newbie (Frank Derfler) 15. 12:05 PM - Re: 601XL Cover (Craig Payne) 16. 12:11 PM - Re: Five Big Questions - Zodiac 610XL Newbie (Craig Payne) 17. 03:07 PM - ARLINGTON (Dave Ruddiman) 18. 03:07 PM - Re: Five Big Questions - Zodiac 610XL Newbie (bryanmmartin@comcast.net) 19. 03:29 PM - Re: Neutral flap position (george may) 20. 07:29 PM - Zenith Aircraft at Lockhaven () 21. 07:42 PM - Lost canopy (John Anderson) 22. 07:57 PM - Re: Lost canopy (Steve Hulland) 23. 08:22 PM - Re: Lost canopy (Tommy Walker) 24. 08:24 PM - Re: Lost canopy (Jack Russell) 25. 09:38 PM - Re: Lost canopy (Craig Payne) 26. 09:38 PM - Re: Lost canopy (Craig Payne) 27. 11:15 PM - Re: LRI Question (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com) 28. 11:40 PM - Re: Five Big Questions - Zodiac 610XL Newbie (Thilo Kind) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:20:17 AM PST US From: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: LRI Hook up Randy, thanks, I owe you. Bill do not archive ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:35:26 AM PST US From: "Jon Croke" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: OOps.. Never make this mistake! --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jon Croke" Hi Mike, Boy I wish I had done that..... or at least turned the clip aound! I actually tapped the spar hole for a small 8/32 screw and a little loctite... but then was thinking when I drilled for the rivet for the other side of the clip.... shoulda put it lengthwise like you did! The gasoline melted the lexan door.... the gas got between the wing skin and tank and dribbled out the root end fot eh skin onto the door.... such is life! We'll stay in touch. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, June 16, 2006 5:31 PM > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Mike Sinclair > > Jon > > I really can't comment too much about how to fix the leak. But as for > the location of the door catch, I aligned mine lengthwise with the spar. > To attach, I counter sunk the nylon fairly deep and used A5 rivets with > a flat nosed anvil on the puller. That way the A5's could be used in a > couple of locations instead of A4 that normally hold the lower skins to > the spar. Where the catch overlapped an existing A4 that wouldn't work > with holding the catch, I also put a countersink on the skin side of the > catch to clear the rivet head. This kept all drilling and rivets away > from the wing tank. Good luck on the repair and congrats on getting your > bird back in the air. > > Mike > > Jon Croke wrote: > >> This was a terrible thing to do... (I just can't believe it!). > > > -- > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:35:27 AM PST US From: Big Gee Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Neutral flap position Darryl--- I don't have my plans in front of me, but I believe there is should be a 6mm gap between the top front of the flap and the aft edge of the wing/skin/spar---------- also the top of the flap should be 3mm higher than the wing skin-- Fritz----- Corvair 90/90 Darryl Legg wrote: --> Zenith-List message posted by: Darryl Legg Hi all, Just wondering how to set the neutral flap position, as with flap fully up on my XL and touching wing rear channel the flap surface is not level with aileron. Plans don't seem to be very clear on this point. With flap level with wing and aileron how much of a gap between channel is acceptable? Thanks, Darryl. --------------------------------- Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:37:47 AM PST US From: "normskiroo@ukonl" Subject: Zenith-List: LRI Question --> Zenith-List message posted by: "normskiroo@ukonl" Could someone tell me what the internal diameter of the plastic tubing is that is used to connect the LRI probe to the intrument please? I am converting my XL to duel sticks soon and while I have the wings off would like to install the tubing to save me having to take them off a second time! Can I do all the work required to install the probe and mounting from the wing baggage locker? As I am in the UK I will probably buy a complete system from one of the manufacturers in the U.S. who's website address someone kindly posted on here. Thanks in advance, Norman 601 XL, G-DONT, 41 hours U.K. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=41532#41532 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:37:47 AM PST US From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: OOps.. Never make this mistake! Ya Van's has one ounce proseal kits...Having used a lot of it this is what I would use...Rough up the tank and the large washer I think you need and use a self plugging rivet. This will be a distant memory in no time. Degrease the bonding area thoroughly Frank ________________________________ [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Graham Kirby Sent: Friday, June 16, 2006 12:20 PM Jon Ooh that is nasty! If you can cut or drill a small "inspection hole" through the skin and cork you should be able to use a single rivet to plug the hole in the tank. You can get Cherry Q self plugging rivets up to 1/4 inch in diameter. Clean the wound and splat some proseal around the infected area before riveting. If you can clean the inside of the tank around the puncture a dab of proseal on the inside shouldn't hurt as long as the surface is very clean. For a more elaborate fix, or to bridge a bigger hole you might want to add some large homemade aluminum washers to go on the inside and outside of the repair. I wouldn't bother covering the inspection hole until you know the problem is cured completely. Of course you also want to look out for debris from the hole in the finger strainer and fuel filter. A while back I think Frank H mentioned that Vans had a proseal equivalent that could be bought in tiny amounts. Probably perfect for this kind of job. Graham Kirby 601HD ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:46:27 AM PST US From: "Edward Moody II" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Neutral flap position --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Edward Moody II" For the flap, recall that you had to build it about 3 mm thicker top and bottom than the rear channel of the wing. Therefore if you carefully attach a couple of small extruded angles to the top and bottom surface of the flap, they should be approximately parallel to the upper and lower rear wing skins and produce equal clearance from both skins as well when the flap is retracted fully. The resultant gap in the upper surface is irrelevant since the flap position is the important issue. A similar technique with the ailerons will produce little or no gap to the rear skins at neutral. Ed Moody II Rayne, LA 601XL / wings > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Darryl Legg > > Hi all, > Just wondering how to set the neutral flap position, as with flap fully up > on my XL and touching wing rear channel the flap surface is not level with > aileron. Plans don't seem to be very clear on this point. With flap level > with wing and aileron how much of a gap between channel is acceptable? > Thanks, Darryl. > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:51:37 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: RE: CH601HD/HDS Main Gear --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Naumuk" Brandon- Perfectly understandable. Whoever it was looking for an idea for an aviation publication article ought to do one on the psychological aspects of building. There seems to be a common thread. For 48 hours after a major setback, I get incredibly depressed and flat-out impose on my list friends to pull me out of it. It's worked for me, and sounds like it's working for you. Out of the billions of people in the world, there are only a relative handful that can really empathize with you. I'm going to say it again, even if it is corny- we are truly a band of brothers and I think any of us would give you the shirt off our back to help out. Sounds like you're on the rebound. Hang in there, we're all pulling for you. Bill do not archive ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, June 16, 2006 11:20 PM > > __________________________________________________ > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:18:52 AM PST US From: Michael Clark Subject: Re: Zenith-List: XP Problems --> Zenith-List message posted by: Michael Clark There are several things that you can do that will help protect you from outside threats to your computer. 1. Install and keep up to date a antivirus software package. My personal favorite is Panda Software's Platinum Internet Security. It is my antivirus, firewall, and anti-spyware software. http://www.pandasoftware.com . A good free antivirus software package is Grisoft's AVG antivirus free. http://www.free.grisoft.com 2. Install and keep up to date a firewall software package. The firewall that comes with XP is a ok firewall, and is most definitely better than nothing. A good free fire wall package is Zone Alarm Free. (you kind have to dig through their site to find it). http://www.zonelabs.com 3. Install and keep up to date a couple of anti-spyware software packages. Two good ones are Spy Bot, and Ad-Aware. http://www.safer-networking.org -- Spy Bot http://www.lavasoftusa.com/software/adaware/ -- Ad-Aware 4. Turn on automatic update in XP and use it. 5. Use your head, if some thing doesn't look right it probably isn't. Later Michael Your lurking computer geek. Bill Naumuk wrote: > All- > Ever since I went to XP around the first of the year I've had > problems. You think you're talking to a lister 1on1 and you wind up on > the site (And vice versa). You click on a link and the computer > crashes. Etc., etc. > Turned on my computer tonight and went to delete the obvious junk > mail. Crash. Lost everyone's posts for 2 days. > Called my ISP and talked to someone who (Hopefully)knew what > they're doing. > He said to burn out Outlook Express and reinstall. To make a long > story shorter, the only way of getting rid of OE/XP is to use the > install disc. I burned out the old version (Backup your .wab files > first) and reinstalled. > So far, at least I'm back on the site. > Hope this is the end of it, and hope this helps anyone > experiencing similar problems. > Bill > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:47:37 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: XP Problems --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Naumuk" Mike- I can't say I've solved the problem yet, but I'm getting close. Outside interference through the web isn't the problem, and neither is XP. Both are coincidences. I DID catch a virus late last year during the transition period from one ISP to another that trashed two hard drives and corrupted my Win 2000 Pro OS. (My old ISP had a server firewall, while my new one doesn't) I replaced the hard drives and OS and installed NAV. What I DIDN'T do was uninstall my old 56K modem that had a sort of CallWave capability. Through trial and error, I found that the old modem was responsible for at least part of the problem. I removed it a couple of nights ago- no problems yet, but only time will tell. Thanks for your input. Bill ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Saturday, June 17, 2006 11:14 AM > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:30:50 AM PST US From: "jsimons2" Subject: Zenith-List: Re: XP Problems --> Zenith-List message posted by: "jsimons2" Bill, I build my own computers and use Microsoft XP. The fire wall included with XP is okay. I use McAffe Virus Scan (really good) and AdAware. I also use a broadban router simply for the purpose of having a hardware firewall on all the computers in my house. I have the anti virus program checking every thing. This has saved me numerous times in the past while surfing the net. By useing the software firewall and a hardware firewall, it is extremely hard for a hacker to get to my system. Hardware compatability issues however are a whole different ball game. Good luck. Jerome Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=41534#41534 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:44:39 AM PST US From: rhartwig11@juno.com Subject: Zenith-List: Acetone bottles --> Zenith-List message posted by: rhartwig11@juno.com I could not find wash bottles locally(like they use for acetone at the ZAC factory workbenches), so I had to order one from Consolidated Plastics, but their minimum order was six bottles. I have five bottles that I will sell for $7 including postage. They hold about a pint and are labeled for acetone. If you want one e-mail me off list by clicking on this link or cut and paste: rhartwig11@juno.com Rich Hartwig Waunakee, WI ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:52:03 AM PST US From: "Doug Moellering" Subject: Zenith-List: 601XL Cover --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Doug Moellering" I am traveling to look at a completed 601XL this afternoon. If this deal goes through, I will need to park it outside until some more hangar space gets built in my Austin, TX area. Since we have a "little" hail problem here, I need to find a cover. What is looking for is one of those covers that are sold for autos that breathe. Some are weather (including hail) protecting. Does anyone know if one of these sources (or anyplace else, for that matter) has one available for an XL? Help is always appreciated. Thanks, Doug ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 11:12:12 AM PST US From: "Jeff " Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601XL Cover --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jeff " Does anyone know if one of these sources (or anyplace else, for that matter) has one available for an XL? Try Bruce's Custom Covers at http://www.aircraftcovers.com/ They have been recommended in the past on this list. If you search the archives, you should find some testimonials. They should have the patterns for the XL covers already. You will have to ask about hail protection. Jeff ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:44:28 AM PST US From: "Frank Derfler" Subject: Zenith-List: Five Big Questions - Zodiac 610XL Newbie Hello everyone. I'm "transitioning" from a much-loved Grumman Cheetah to a Zodiac 601XL. (Yet to be purchased.) I'm painfully uninformed about some issues that are probably as familiar to you all as your beloved "bolt torque". (That's okay, you should see the Grumman folk talk for days on their forum about the color of glue used in bonding the fuselage! Same deal.) Would anyone / everyone on this thread be so kind as to answer these questions either on the forum or directly to me? ( fderfler@gmail.com_ ) 1. Rotax versus Continental 1. I'm in the Florida Keys where dealers for Rotax-powered SeadDoos are like fleas on a dog, but aviation service is like sex and old age. (Infrequent or a distant memory) Does using Rotax power make sense in my quasi-rural environment? Can the SeaDoo mechanics help in any way with an engine in an experimental aircraft? (I told you I was uninformed!) 2. Are there any operational considerations between the similarly rated Rotax and Continental engines (heating during climb, noise level, fuel consumption at cruise, etc.) 3. Every Rotax I hear flying overhead sounds loud. Are they necessarily noisy? 2. Zodiac 601XL Operations 1. I won't be able to hangar it. Do they survive being tied down on the ramp in hot sun? (Any common high wind, delaminating, bonding, etc. issues?) 2. Do the pilots survive under the bubble in a mile-long taxi out in 99+ ramp temps? Thanks for your help! I look forward to hearing from you. Long live Bolt Torque! -- Frank Derfler See my views and reviews at www.derfler.biz See my information for pilots at www.flyinflorida.com ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 12:05:18 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601XL Cover --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" Bruce's has a template for the XL canopy. I have a cover made by them and it fits well. -- Craig -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Sent: Saturday, June 17, 2006 12:11 PM --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Jeff " --> Does anyone know if one of these sources (or anyplace else, for that matter) has one available for an XL? Try Bruce's Custom Covers at http://www.aircraftcovers.com/ They have been recommended in the past on this list. If you search the archives, you should find some testimonials. They should have the patterns for the XL covers already. You will have to ask about hail protection. Jeff ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 12:11:11 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Five Big Questions - Zodiac 610XL Newbie I would choose Jabiru over Rotax, that is what Zenith has on their factory demo. Simple air-cooling over air/water, no redrive. Service in Tampa, Florida from: http://www.suncoastjabiru.com/servicecenter.htm#engine Or if you are inclined to build and service your own motor the expert on Corvair conversions is based in Florida near Daytona Beach: www.flycorvair.com -- Craig _____ [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Frank Derfler Sent: Friday, June 16, 2006 7:08 PM Hello everyone. I'm "transitioning" from a much-loved Grumman Cheetah to a Zodiac 601XL. (Yet to be purchased.) I'm painfully uninformed about some issues that are probably as familiar to you all as your beloved "bolt torque". (That's okay, you should see the Grumman folk talk for days on their forum about the color of glue used in bonding the fuselage! Same deal.) Would anyone / everyone on this thread be so kind as to answer these questions either on the forum or directly to me? ( fderfler@gmail.com_ ) 1. Rotax versus Continental a. I'm in the Florida Keys where dealers for Rotax-powered SeadDoos are like fleas on a dog, but aviation service is like sex and old age. (Infrequent or a distant memory) Does using Rotax power make sense in my quasi-rural environment? Can the SeaDoo mechanics help in any way with an engine in an experimental aircraft? (I told you I was uninformed!) b. Are there any operational considerations between the similarly rated Rotax and Continental engines (heating during climb, noise level, fuel consumption at cruise, etc.) c. Every Rotax I hear flying overhead sounds loud. Are they necessarily noisy? 2. Zodiac 601XL Operations a. I won't be able to hangar it. Do they survive being tied down on the ramp in hot sun? (Any common high wind, delaminating, bonding, etc. issues?) b. Do the pilots survive under the bubble in a mile-long taxi out in 99+ ramp temps? Thanks for your help! I look forward to hearing from you. Long live Bolt Torque! -- Frank Derfler See my views and reviews at www.derfler.biz See my information for pilots at www.flyinflorida.com ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:07:56 PM PST US From: "Dave Ruddiman" Subject: Zenith-List: ARLINGTON I just re-confirmed my space at Arlington. Space BG14, which is on the main walkway through the camping area. I will be in a Columbus motor home. Sort of dirty white color with blue stripes. I will be there on Thursday in the early afternoon. If anyone wants to stop by, please do. I hope it doesn't matter, but I'm building an 801. Dave in Salem ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:07:56 PM PST US From: bryanmmartin@comcast.net Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Five Big Questions - Zodiac 610XL Newbie -------------- Original message ---------------------- > Hello everyone. I'm "transitioning" from a much-loved Grumman Cheetah to a > > > > > 3. Every Rotax I hear flying overhead sounds loud. Are they > necessarily noisy? Those noisy Rotaxes you've heard are probably two-stroke models. The four-stroke 912 series engines used in the Zodiacs tend to be much quieter. The ones I've encountered don't seem to be any noisier than the Continentals or Lycomings, they just make a higher pitched note due to the higher RPM. > 2. Zodiac 601XL Operations > 1. I won't be able to hangar it. Do they survive being tied > down on the ramp in hot sun? (Any common high wind, > delaminating, bonding, etc. issues?) Being all aluminum, they should hold up as well as a Cessna or Piper. Get a good canopy cover to keep some of the heat out. > 2. Do the pilots survive under the bubble in a mile-long taxi > out in 99+ ramp temps? > I usually prop the canopy partially open on the ground with a stick I made for that purpose. It keeps the temps within a tolerable range. > Thanks for your help! I look forward to hearing from you. Long live Bolt > Torque! > > -- > Frank Derfler > See my views and reviews at www.derfler.biz > See my information for pilots at www.flyinflorida.com -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru. do not archive Content-Type: Multipart/alternative; boundary="NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_14847_1150581550_1" --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_14847_1150581550_1 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline

Hello everyone.  I'm "transitioning" from a much-loved Grumman Cheetah to a Zodiac 601XL.   (Yet to be purchased.)   I'm painfully uninformed about some issues that are probably as familiar to you all as your beloved "bolt torque".  (That's okay, you should see the Grumman folk talk for days on their forum about the color of glue used in bonding the fuselage!  Same deal.)    

 

Would anyone / everyone on this thread be so kind as to answer these questions either on the forum or directly to me?   ( fderfler@gmail.com_ ) 

 

  1. Rotax versus Continental 
    1.  I'm in the Florida Keys where dealers for Rotax-powered SeadDoos are like fleas on a dog, but aviation service is like sex and old age.   (Infrequent or a distant memory)  Does using Rotax power make sense in my quasi-rural environment?  Can the SeaDoo mechanics help in any way with an engine in an experimental aircraft?   (I told you I was uninformed!)
    2. Are there any operational considerations between the similarly rated Rotax and Continental engines (heating during climb,   noise level, fuel consumption at cruise, etc.)
    3. Every Rotax I hear flying overhead sounds loud.  Are they necessarily noisy?  
  2. Zodiac 601XL Operations
    1. I won't be able to hangar it.  Do they survive being tied down on the ramp in hot sun?   (Any common high wind, delaminating, bonding, etc. issues?)
    2. Do the pilots survive under the bubble in a mile-long taxi out in 99+   ramp temps?

Thanks for your help! I look forward to hearing from you.   Long live Bolt Torque! 

--
Frank Derfler
See my views and reviews at www.derfler.biz
See my information for pilots at www.flyinflorida.com

--NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_14847_1150581550_1-- ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:29:26 PM PST US From: "george may" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Neutral flap position --> Zenith-List message posted by: "george may" The flap stop which would be the neutral position is placed such that the gap beween wing and flap is 6mm. The flap actually sticks up above the wing by 3mm with the gap at 6mm George May 601XL 912s _________________________________________________________________ FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 07:29:33 PM PST US From: Subject: Zenith-List: Zenith Aircraft at Lockhaven --> Zenith-List message posted by: Awhile back there was some talk asking if anyone was going to the get together at Lockhaven,Pa.I haven't heard any more about it.Anyone going? Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 07:42:03 PM PST US From: "John Anderson" Subject: Zenith-List: Lost canopy Hi, I fly a 601HD. Yesterday at about 7:45AM I was at 5500 ft at cruise speed in smooth air, everything was fine. The next thing I was aware of I was in a dive at red line. My headphones and cap left along with the canopy. I always wondered how I would react in an emergencey. I am proud to say I was cool and did all the right things. Leveled the wings, power back to idle and leveled off at eighty. I did not feel that I could go any slower because the rudder was much less effective than normal. I thought maybe it was damaged. I had to hold back pressure even after applying full up trim. Control response was poor. Turbulence inside the cockpit was moving my eyelids making it difficult to see. The flight back to the airport (twenty minutes) seemed to take forever. Suprisingly I did not bend anything on landing. I stopped at the maintenance hanger to asses the damage. Found my headset hanging on the step. Flight bag was gone as was a GPS 3 that was lying on the seat. Zero damage to the plane. Not a scratch. In the past I had heard of canopies coming off but was not very concerned. I have many hours in open cockpits. THIS IS NOT THE SAME!!!! The plane is unstable without the canopy! I ordered the front opening canopy kit the same day. I will not fly in a side opening canopy without saftey latches again. CUL, John Flying 601HD Lycoming 62Hrs ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 07:57:42 PM PST US From: "Steve Hulland" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Lost canopy John, My 600 has a modified canopy with two gull wing doors that open seperatly. There is a windshield and rear window. Frame firmly attached all round with roll bar and center bar from rear of canapy frame to front windshield frame. I will be able to fly without one or either door with no problem except a very slight decrease in climb and cruise. No adverse wind in cockpit, etc. Love open cockpit flying and will be able to do with the modified CH 600. Real sorry you had the problem that you did - but real happy that you did so well returning to field and landing. Hope that your airplane is ready to fly again real soon. -- Semper Fi, Steven R. Hulland CH 600, Amado, AZ This and all other incoming/outgoing email, attachments and replies scanned prior to opening/sending and uses an external firewall to help insure virus free email and attachments. ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 08:22:05 PM PST US From: "Tommy Walker" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Lost canopy John, I am sorry you had the problem, but awfully glad you had the skill to get the plane down in one piece. If I can help in anyway, let me know. I guess it was Plexiglas overcast over Sylacauga. Tommy Walker in Alabama Do Not Archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Anderson Sent: Saturday, June 17, 2006 9:40 PM To: zenith-list@roxy.matronics.com Subject: Zenith-List: Lost canopy Hi, I fly a 601HD. Yesterday at about 7:45AM I was at 5500 ft at cruise speed in smooth air, everything was fine. The next thing I was aware of I was in a dive at red line. My headphones and cap left along with the canopy. I always wondered how I would react in an emergencey. I am proud to say I was cool and did all the right things. Leveled the wings, power back to idle and leveled off at eighty. I did not feel that I could go any slower because the rudder was much less effective than normal. I thought maybe it was damaged. I had to hold back pressure even after applying full up trim. Control response was poor. Turbulence inside the cockpit was moving my eyelids making it difficult to see. The flight back to the airport (twenty minutes) seemed to take forever. Suprisingly I did not bend anything on landing. I stopped at the maintenance hanger to asses the damage. Found my headset hanging on the step. Flight bag was gone as was a GPS 3 that was lying on the seat. Zero damage to the plane. Not a scratch. In the past I had heard of canopies coming off but was not very concerned. I have many hours in open cockpits. THIS IS NOT THE SAME!!!! The plane is unstable without the canopy! I ordered the front opening canopy kit the same day. I will not fly in a side opening canopy without saftey latches again. CUL, John Flying 601HD Lycoming 62Hrs ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 08:24:26 PM PST US From: Jack Russell Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Lost canopy You did good John! Someone might get a good gps and flight bag for free. I have wondered what would happen if the front hinged canopy would unlatch. Does anyone know if the curve of the canopy would cause it to lift and if so how far? jack- brought the zodie home to San luis CA today. John Anderson wrote: Hi, I fly a 601HD. Yesterday at about 7:45AM I was at 5500 ft at cruise speed in smooth air, everything was fine. The next thing I was aware of I was in a dive at red line. My headphones and cap left along with the canopy. I always wondered how I would react in an emergencey. I am proud to say I was cool and did all the right things. Leveled the wings, power back to idle and leveled off at eighty. I did not feel that I could go any slower because the rudder was much less effective than normal. I thought maybe it was damaged. I had to hold back pressure even after applying full up trim. Control response was poor. Turbulence inside the cockpit was moving my eyelids making it difficult to see. The flight back to the airport (twenty minutes) seemed to take forever. Suprisingly I did not bend anything on landing. I stopped at the maintenance hanger to asses the damage. Found my headset hanging on the step. Flight bag was gone as was a GPS 3 that was lying on the seat. Zero damage to the plane. Not a scratch. In the past I had heard of canopies coming off but was not very concerned. I have many hours in open cockpits. THIS IS NOT THE SAME!!!! The plane is unstable without the canopy! I ordered the front opening canopy kit the same day. I will not fly in a side opening canopy without saftey latches again. CUL, John Flying 601HD Lycoming 62Hrs ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 09:38:32 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Lost canopy So have you determined what failed in the canopy attachment? -- Craig ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 09:38:32 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Lost canopy I was flying in the pattern with an instructor in an Evektor Sportstar when the canopy popped. It has a front-hinged bubble canopy much like the 601XL. One difference is that the rear quarter of the canopy is fixed. Anyway the instructor took the controls while I tried to close the canopy. Even with all my weight and both arms wrapped around the canopy's horizontal stiffener I could not pull it closed. So I just held it as closed as I could until we landed. My guess is that the curve generated a lot of lift. www.evektoramerica.com/sportstar.html -- Craig ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 11:15:09 PM PST US From: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: LRI Question Norman, I tubing I purchased is 3/16th. By the way, you can route the tubing with the wing on. Did it this morning. Cut a 1 &1/8th hole 120 mm back from the spar, 100mm up from the fuselage floor and used heavy gage electrical wire to fish 42 inches to the hole I cut under the wing. Then I pulled the tubing back through to the cockpit. Got it done on the second try. Best regards, Bill of Georgia ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 11:40:53 PM PST US From: "Thilo Kind" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Five Big Questions - Zodiac 610XL Newbie Hi Frank, can only answer a few questions. I have the Ch 601 HDS with a Rotax 912. Quite happy with the engine. It is definetely not loud. However, the sound is high pitched due to the higher RPMs. In the direct sunlight - even with the tinted canopy - it will get quite hot in the cockpit when taxiing. The XL has the forward tiliting canopy, so you can leave it open a few inches during taxiing, which will improve the situation quite a lot. Thilo ----- Original Message ----- From: Frank Derfler To: zenith-list@roxy.matronics.com Sent: Saturday, June 17, 2006 3:07 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Five Big Questions - Zodiac 610XL Newbie Hello everyone. I'm "transitioning" from a much-loved Grumman Cheetah to a Zodiac 601XL. (Yet to be purchased.) I'm painfully uninformed about some issues that are probably as familiar to you all as your beloved "bolt torque". (That's okay, you should see the Grumman folk talk for days on their forum about the color of glue used in bonding the fuselage! Same deal.) Would anyone / everyone on this thread be so kind as to answer these questions either on the forum or directly to me? ( fderfler@gmail.com_ ) 1.. Rotax versus Continental 1.. I'm in the Florida Keys where dealers for Rotax-powered SeadDoos are like fleas on a dog, but aviation service is like sex and old age. (Infrequent or a distant memory) Does using Rotax power make sense in my quasi-rural environment? Can the SeaDoo mechanics help in any way with an engine in an experimental aircraft? (I told you I was uninformed!) 2.. Are there any operational considerations between the similarly rated Rotax and Continental engines (heating during climb, noise level, fuel consumption at cruise, etc.) 3.. Every Rotax I hear flying overhead sounds loud. Are they necessarily noisy? 2.. Zodiac 601XL Operations 1.. I won't be able to hangar it. Do they survive being tied down on the ramp in hot sun? (Any common high wind, delaminating, bonding, etc. issues?) 2.. Do the pilots survive under the bubble in a mile-long taxi out in 99+ ramp temps? Thanks for your help! I look forward to hearing from you. Long live Bolt Torque! -- Frank Derfler See my views and reviews at www.derfler.biz See my information for pilots at www.flyinflorida.com