---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 08/13/06: 19 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:25 AM - Re: Ah, the hingeless Navaid (Michel Therrien) 2. 07:05 AM - Re: Clecos, again (Bill Naumuk) 3. 07:45 AM - Sport Pilot (Tim Perkins) 4. 07:47 AM - Tack rivets (Bill Naumuk) 5. 08:24 AM - Robert Kube (Rick R) 6. 08:31 AM - Dual sticks question (Jaybannist@cs.com) 7. 09:12 AM - Re: Dual sticks question (Afterfxllc@aol.com) 8. 09:25 AM - Re: Dual sticks question (Bill Naumuk) 9. 10:13 AM - 3 flute drill (Mark Sherman) 10. 10:20 AM - Re: Dual sticks question (Jaybannist@cs.com) 11. 10:37 AM - Paint Schemes (Robert L. Stone) 12. 11:35 AM - Re: Hinge less ailerons / Corvair - resale (Gig Giacona) 13. 04:00 PM - Fuel Filler Cap (Wes or Lurlene Bressler) 14. 05:22 PM - Re: Paint Schemes (Daniel Dempsey) 15. 08:16 PM - How many Zenith Newsletters do I need? (Matt Stecher) 16. 08:33 PM - Re: Paint Schemes (Robert L. Stone) 17. 09:05 PM - Re: Paint Schemes (kevinbonds) 18. 09:52 PM - Re: Paint Schemes (TxDave) 19. 11:27 PM - Re: Re: Paint Schemes (JOHN STARN) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:25:26 AM PST US From: Michel Therrien Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Ah, the hingeless Navaid --> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien I have a Navaid with hingeless ailerons. On the ground, the Navaid Servo is not powerful enough to bring the ailerons to the stop (I believe on the right side). We hear the clutch slipping continuously. However, in flight, as we all know, the plane requires little input on the controls... it works well. Michel ---------------------------- Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601 http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby __________________________________________________ ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:05:16 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Clecos, again All- This is a perfect example of the strange HDS construction manual sequencing. Nothing is said about how to rivet the outboard wings (Which come first), but 1/3 of the way through the manual when you get to the stab, there they are. Start in the middle and work your way outboard, alternating between right and left of the centerline. Bill Naumuk 40%HDS Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Mulwitz To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 11:06 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Clecos, again Hi Jay, I have learned that one source of warping is the order in which you set rivets. If you start at one end and rivet all the way down the line to the other this causes warping. On the other hand, if you skip around and randomly set the rivets the parts stay straight. Go figure! Paul XL fuselage Bill, I aslo wonder if some of the warped wing syndrome could be attributed to using too few clecoes. I nearly always cleco at least every third hole and every other one if it looks like alignment might be a problem. ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:45:11 AM PST US From: "Tim Perkins" Subject: Zenith-List: Sport Pilot --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tim Perkins" > I'm not sure how this thread started but I believe you're right Steven. > If a person is already a PP and lets his/her medical lapse they can fly > any Sport Pilot compliant plane with a valid drivers license. This is correct.....but the thread started in regards to a student pilot. Different situation. The one commonality is that if you go this route (you let your medical lapse) you can ONLY fly aircraft that fall within the LSA definition thereafter. Do not archive Tim Perkins ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:47:04 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Zenith-List: Tack rivets Zodie (and all) Tack rivets will free up a whole lot of clecos. I thought about it, but just had to hear it was acceptable practice from someone who's been there, done that. I never ran into a shortage until I got to the center wing. Bill Naumuk 40%HDS Townville, Pa ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:24:19 AM PST US From: Rick R Subject: Zenith-List: Robert Kube Paging Robert Kube. If your on the list please contact me off line. I need one of your 1" temp sender adapters. Thanks do not archive Rick Sharpsburg, GA. USA http://www.n701rr.com ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:31:51 AM PST US From: Jaybannist@cs.com Subject: Zenith-List: Dual sticks question I'm going to try to make it hard to start another (fill in the blank) thread. Somehow, I got the dual sticks option and no drawings. The photo guide says to locate the stick connector rod bracket uprights a certain distance from the centerline of the wing center spar. It refers to the drawings for that distance. Can anyone tell me what that distance is? Jay in Dallas, working on XL fuselage ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:12:56 AM PST US From: Afterfxllc@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dual sticks question The drawings were not in the book they were in one of the boxes or some where but there is a set of plans. I made the mistake and drilled the holes a little off. You might check in the back of your plans as they may be there. Are you scratch building or using zeniths skins? From what I remember the plans were a little off on the measurements. I will get to the garage today and get them for you if someone doesn't help you first. Jeff ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:25:48 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dual sticks question Jay- Call or e-mail Zenith and have them PDF the missing documents. The page of the prints with installation instructions for my elevator trim tab were missing, and they were good about getting them to me. Bill Naumuk 40%HDS Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaybannist@cs.com To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 11:29 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Dual sticks question I'm going to try to make it hard to start another (fill in the blank) thread. Somehow, I got the dual sticks option and no drawings. The photo guide says to locate the stick connector rod bracket uprights a certain distance from the centerline of the wing center spar. It refers to the drawings for that distance. Can anyone tell me what that distance is? Jay in Dallas, working on XL fuselage ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:13:23 AM PST US From: Mark Sherman Subject: Zenith-List: 3 flute drill --> Zenith-List message posted by: Mark Sherman Tom H. The 3 flute drill sounds like a great idea. Can you tell me who makes them and where I might buy one? And what is the cost as compared to a standered drill? I was told that a 135 degree split point high speed or cobalt drill was best for starting a hole. Mark S. 701/912S Painting in CA __________________________________________________ ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:20:32 AM PST US From: Jaybannist@cs.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dual sticks question Bill, Thanks. I e-mailed them Friday afternoon. That is usually when I need help from ZAC, so it will probably be Wednesday or Thursday before they answer. I wanted to do something before they got back to me if possible. Jay in Dallas Do not archive ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:37:42 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Stone" Subject: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes When I reach the time of painting my ZodiacXL, I am thinking of using a scheme like the one in the attachment. My question to all of you is, does anyone know where I can get plastic strips like the ones shown on the Zodiac from Germany shown in the attachment. It looks like two strips of plastic with alternating red and white squares about 2 inchs by 2 inches. If anyone know where to buy material like I have described please contact me off net. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 11:35:01 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Hinge less ailerons / Corvair - resale From: "Gig Giacona" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Gig Giacona" If a potential buyer doesn't even do enough research to read the zenithair.com while considering the purchase of a 601XL they probably won't notice the hingge or lack of it. [quote="601zv(at)ritternet.com"]On the other0 hand, any potential buyer not familiar with the hingeless system is likely to be0 very skeptical. > --- -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=54578#54578 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 04:00:22 PM PST US From: "Wes or Lurlene Bressler" Subject: Zenith-List: Fuel Filler Cap Thread Listers: We are 601XL kit builders and have encountered problems fitting the 15 gallon fuel tanks in the nose skin. The top of the fuel filler threaded bushing,P/N M142, pg. 6-K-1, is flush with the seam welds on the tank end and back. Cinching the nose skin to final position leaves the bushing surface 2-3 mm below the skin and leaves the filler cap 8-10 mm above the skin. The threaded fuel filler insert that holds the cap is larger than the bushing and is unthreaded for the upper 10 mm; this leaves the cap 7-8 mm above the skin with an unsealed opening. Has anyone else had this problem? What solutions are acceptable to bring the cap down to the skin and or seal the opening? Looking through the quick drain and vent holes in the bottom of the nose skin the tank appears to be sitting on the cork strips. We've called ZAC and talked with Nick. One solution recommended was to bevel the surface of the threaded bushing to allow the insert to drop, but he cautioned that would only work for a 3-4 mm depth, leaving the filler cap about 4 mm above the skin. He also indicated if no satisfactory solution could be achieved, the tanks could be shipped back to the factory for retrofitting. He indicated that the factory was presently welding the threaded bushing slightly lower. Thank you all for your participation on these builder questions. Wes & Lurlene Bressler; bressler@wyoming.com Empenage done; working on the hard wing 601WL in Laramie, WY ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 05:22:48 PM PST US From: Daniel Dempsey Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes Bob, Is it possible that it is just paint? Dan Dempsey (Plans building XL, Central Virginia) ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert L. Stone To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 1:35 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes When I reach the time of painting my ZodiacXL, I am thinking of using a scheme like the one in the attachment. My question to all of you is, does anyone know where I can get plastic strips like the ones shown on the Zodiac from Germany shown in the attachment. It looks like two strips of plastic with alternating red and white squares about 2 inchs by 2 inches. If anyone know where to buy material like I have described please contact me off net. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 08:16:14 PM PST US From: "Matt Stecher" Subject: Zenith-List: How many Zenith Newsletters do I need? --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Matt Stecher" I would like to thank everyone that offered their support and aid in my quest to fly in an XL that I build from scratch. As well I am hoping to narrow down how many of the Zenith Newsletters I have to back order in order to get all the latest data on the aircraft and its associated systems. The newsletter order form suggested I order all of them for like the last 10 years (that may be off as I sent the form off and cant remember the exact figure), but I am hoping to narrow that down to just what I need. Thanks again for all your help and I look forward to communing with the group. Thanks, Matt ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 08:33:59 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Stone" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes Dan, I have no idea because the aircraft is in Germany. I have checked on having it done with paint and it's very expensive that way. Bob Stone ----- Original Message ----- From: Daniel Dempsey To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 7:20 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes Bob, Is it possible that it is just paint? Dan Dempsey (Plans building XL, Central Virginia) ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert L. Stone To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 1:35 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes When I reach the time of painting my ZodiacXL, I am thinking of using a scheme like the one in the attachment. My question to all of you is, does anyone know where I can get plastic strips like the ones shown on the Zodiac from Germany shown in the attachment. It looks like two strips of plastic with alternating red and white squares about 2 inchs by 2 inches. If anyone know where to buy material like I have described please contact me off net. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 09:05:46 PM PST US From: "kevinbonds" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes Seems like you could do this with masking tape pretty easily. I imagine you could even fade it by doing multiple rows and going successively thinner. It would look nice that way. I have thought a lot about paint schemes myself. I would like to play with some techniques I've seen. I saw a guy lay down a base coat, then mask off some stripes, but before he laid down the second coat of some kind of transparent color, he laid lace fabric on top and shot the color through it. It looked really cool. Kevin Bonds Nashville TN 601XL Corvair powered; Plans building. Empennage done; working on wings and engine. http://home.comcast.net/~kevinbonds do not archive DO NOT ARCHIVE _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Stone Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 10:32 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes Dan, I have no idea because the aircraft is in Germany. I have checked on having it done with paint and it's very expensive that way. Bob Stone ----- Original Message ----- From: Daniel Dempsey Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 7:20 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes Bob, Is it possible that it is just paint? Dan Dempsey (Plans building XL, Central Virginia) ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert L. Stone Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 1:35 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Paint Schemes When I reach the time of painting my ZodiacXL, I am thinking of using a scheme like the one in the attachment. My question to all of you is, does anyone know where I can get plastic strips like the ones shown on the Zodiac from Germany shown in the attachment. It looks like two strips of plastic with alternating red and white squares about 2 inchs by 2 inches. If anyone know where to buy material like I have described please contact me off net. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 09:52:46 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Paint Schemes From: "TxDave" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "TxDave" Hey Bob, What you're talking about is pressure sensitive vinyl graphics. There are several sites on the internet that sell them. Check out this site as an example. http://www.lbgraphics.com/ do not archive Dave Clay Temple, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=54652#54652 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 11:27:24 PM PST US From: "JOHN STARN" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Paint Schemes --> Zenith-List message posted by: "JOHN STARN" We did the "stars & bars, USAF", tail shield (561st Ftg Squ.) & pilot lettering in the vinyl stuff. We got ours custom made & sized to fit at our local sign maker shop. Cheap & easy to install. HRII N561FS KABONG Do Not Archive (it's in there) ----- Original Message ----- From: "TxDave" Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 9:50 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Paint Schemes > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "TxDave" > > Hey Bob, > > What you're talking about is pressure sensitive vinyl graphics. There are > several sites on the internet that sell them. Check out this site as an > example. > > http://www.lbgraphics.com/