---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 08/20/06: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:22 AM - Zenith Open Hanger Day (Don Mountain) 2. 12:01 PM - XL Wing Paint Stand (Chuck & Lana Maggart) 3. 12:38 PM - Re: XL Wing Paint Stand (JAPhillipsGA@AOL.COM) 4. 12:38 PM - Re: XL Wing Paint Stand (Robert L. Stone) 5. 12:52 PM - ch 640 (Marco Rispoli) 6. 02:02 PM - Re: ch 640 (George Swinford) 7. 04:57 PM - Need that indicator light link (lwhitlow) 8. 05:12 PM - 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? (Matt Stecher) 9. 06:14 PM - Re: 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? (Tom and Bren Henderson) 10. 06:14 PM - Re: 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? (Zodie Rocket) 11. 06:33 PM - Re: Need that indicator light link (Craig Payne) 12. 08:14 PM - Re: ch 640 (Christian Tremblay) 13. 08:22 PM - Rewarded : Flanges holes dyes (Christian Tremblay) 14. 08:32 PM - Flyin with the CH 640 (Christian Tremblay) 15. 09:22 PM - Re: 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? (Dan Forney) 16. 10:00 PM - Now I really want one! (2thesky) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:22:07 AM PST US From: Don Mountain Subject: Zenith-List: Zenith Open Hanger Day I flew my Piper Cherokee from Iowa down to Mexico, Missouri for the Zenith open hanger day yesterday. It turned out to be a beautiful day and they had a tremendous turnout of people. The city also had a pretty good flight show and aviation displays with antique planes, military vehicles and vendors with lots of food and things. Zeniths hanger was always packed with people and it was interesting to walk through their shop and see the production lines and talk to the workers. I even took a look at their gas tank assembly work as they have moved the welding of the filler connection from the top of the tank to the inside to lower it on the skin (I had some trouble fitting my skin under the cap on my 601 XL kit). And they had several tanks there where they had devised a tool to chamfer the opening so the cap will screw in lower to mate with the skin. Several Zenith kit planes had flown in and were on display. 601 HD's, 601 XL's, 701's and 801's. I talked with several 601 owners about their experiences with their engine installations. The Jab 3300 people seemed to be the most happy with their installations and performance. I wanted to see a Corvair installation, but none showed up. No Corvair people at all? Are their any actually flying? Don Mountain 601 XL, tail done, left wing done, working on right wing --------------------------------- Next-gen email? Have it all with the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:01:05 PM PST US From: "Chuck & Lana Maggart" Subject: Zenith-List: XL Wing Paint Stand Hello readers. I am about ready to paint my XL. One question is how are you all supporting the wing so that you can paint both sides and both edges at one time? I haven't thought of any way to "grab" the tip end since there is little structure and no attach points. Chuck Maggart, XL ready to paint Hazelwood, MO ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:38:03 PM PST US From: JAPhillipsGA@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: XL Wing Paint Stand Chuck, it is a difficult problem. I suspended the in board of the wing at the main spar with a cable from the ceiling. I placed the tip end on a little saw horse and had the tie down loop loose under the wing to the ceiling. After painting the top of the wing, I removed the support and rotated the wing to suspend from main spar and tie down loop. Then I painted the bottom. I practiced the maneuver several times to become delft at it before laying down paint. Good luck, Bill of Georgia ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:38:29 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Stone" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: XL Wing Paint Stand Chuck, I am not sure you could do this with the wing of a Zodiac but I did it with both wings on a KR-2 that I built some years ago. Hang the wing by the wing attach fittings. You may need a ladder to get to the part on top but if you have space to hang the wing as described, you can paint the entire wing this way. Spray a very light coat (if you can see metal through the paint, it's OK) DO NOT TRY TO COVER ON THE FIRST COAT. The next coat can be a little heaver but not too much. Just keep adding layers until you have a nice smooth finish. Too much paint with the first or any pass will produce runs or orange peal. Good luck with your paint job Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx ZodiacXL ----- Original Message ----- From: Chuck & Lana Maggart To: Zenith List Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2006 1:59 PM Subject: Zenith-List: XL Wing Paint Stand Hello readers. I am about ready to paint my XL. One question is how are you all supporting the wing so that you can paint both sides and both edges at one time? I haven't thought of any way to "grab" the tip end since there is little structure and no attach points. Chuck Maggart, XL ready to paint Hazelwood, MO ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 12:52:48 PM PST US From: "Marco Rispoli" Subject: Zenith-List: ch 640 Hello all. I have a question about the CH 640. I have seen many 640s started (both looking on the web and at the builder's list on the official Zenith site) but I can't find an example (pictures, c omments, feedback) from a real homebuilder about the experience and how hap py he/she is about the end result. So my question is: Did anyone ever complete a 640? I am not talking about a factory built prototype. I would like to know if any homebuilder has ever completed a 640 and he/she is actually flying it right now. Thank you! Marco ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:02:16 PM PST US From: "George Swinford" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: ch 640 Marco: See Sept. '06 Kitplanes, page 68. George Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Marco Rispoli To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2006 12:52 PM Subject: Zenith-List: ch 640 Hello all. I have a question about the CH 640. I have seen many 640s started (both looking on the web and at the builder's list on the official Zenith site) but I can't find an example (pictures, comments, feedback) from a real homebuilder about the experience and how happy he/she is about the end result. So my question is: Did anyone ever complete a 640? I am not talking about a factory built prototype. I would like to know if any homebuilder has ever completed a 640 and he/she is actually flying it right now. Thank you! Marco ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 8/18/2006 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:57:17 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Need that indicator light link From: "lwhitlow" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "lwhitlow" Hi all Someone posted a link a while back to a company that sold panel mount indicator and warning lights with legends that were suited to aviation use Anybody remember seeing that or am I just having a senior moment??? I've searched the archive but I've come up dry. Thanks in Advance Larry Whitlow Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=55964#55964 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:12:48 PM PST US From: "Matt Stecher" Subject: Zenith-List: 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Matt Stecher" I am building my shopping list and sorting through the aluminum cut sheets that I found on CH601.org. These drawings show quite a few parts changed to .020 from the original, plans speced, .016 thickness. The document states that this is a ZAC approved change, but I cant find any proof of this in my documentation or online. Whats up? Thanks, Matt 601XL & Corvair in Katy, TX ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:14:59 PM PST US From: Tom and Bren Henderson Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? I'm builing my Rudder and Horizontal Stab again because I wasn't happy with the way the .016 aluminum lay on the ribs. I've been really happy with the .025 on the rest of the fuselage, and asked Zenith about replaciong the .016 on the tail with it. Caleb at Zenith emailed back that this was no problem, and further, that the production 601's are using .020 and .025 in the tail for the same reason. So. Long story short: It's ok to substitute. If it makes you feel better to hear it from Zenith, they're pretty fast at email responses. Matt Stecher wrote: --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Matt Stecher" I am building my shopping list and sorting through the aluminum cut sheets that I found on CH601.org. These drawings show quite a few parts changed to .020 from the original, plans speced, .016 thickness. The document states that this is a ZAC approved change, but I cant find any proof of this in my documentation or online. Whats up? Thanks, Matt 601XL & Corvair in Katy, TX ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:14:59 PM PST US From: "Zodie Rocket" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Zodie Rocket" Matt, many people do not wish to play with the .016 skins for many reasons, the only place that may not be replaced is the hingless aileron. When those layouts were done the plans had a lot of .016 stated for skins now many of those have been replaced with .025. Go through your plans and match up to the cutting layout. The 601XL has no .020 in it's construction so all changes in the layout are supposed to be .016. The choice is up to you the .020 is a 1/4 thicker then the .016 and makes a nicer skin , not to mention a whole lot easier to work with. I have personally talked with Chris Heintz on this issue and he feels it only adds weight, but that comes from a master who can handle .016 and never put a smilie in it. Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario Zodiac 601XL C-GOXL, CH701 donated to Jon www.ch601.org / www.ch701.com / www.Osprey2.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Stecher Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2006 8:12 PM Subject: Zenith-List: 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Matt Stecher" I am building my shopping list and sorting through the aluminum cut sheets that I found on CH601.org. These drawings show quite a few parts changed to .020 from the original, plans speced, .016 thickness. The document states that this is a ZAC approved change, but I cant find any proof of this in my documentation or online. Whats up? Thanks, Matt 601XL & Corvair in Katy, TX -- 8/18/2006 -- 8/18/2006 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:33:05 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Need that indicator light link --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" There are these at AS&S: http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/legendlights.php -- Craig ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:14:06 PM PST US From: Christian Tremblay Subject: RE: Zenith-List: ch 640 Hello Marco Jeff Paden have completed and fly his own CH640. Jeff had produced a detailed Web Site at the following adress : http://www.madbbs.com/~jpaden/ Adam Smith had completed and fly, since a couple of month, a CH640. But he had no web site. He buy a fast quick built kit. But he post last week or 2 week ago, a long note on the forum describing his experience in flying the CH640. Sound good. The last kitplane magazine (September 06) publish his completion (11 month later). You can see some other project at the following web site : http://www.frappr.com/zenithch640 For my part, you can see my advancement on my own detailed Web site, I am working on wings, rudder and tail are completed. I think, 5 to 10 CH640, may be more, have been completed and flying for now. I buy the number 0059 plans in September 2005. I think I am alone in the building process from plan and raw materials. But the CH640 is very similar to the Alarus 2000, a 2 place certified IFR plane. If you wish to build the plane from plan, let me know, I can help you many ways. Go on the Zenith Web site for reference : http://www.newplane.com/ I think the plane is one of the rare 4 places all metal that you can build from scratch material, with low wings. If it=92s not the only one. Tell me if I am wrong someone. All others are high wings or the detailed plan (not only the assembly plans) are not available for scratch building. The flying characteristic are excellent, and from Adams Smith experience, the plane meet the announcement speed with only the 160hp engine. Jeff Paden install an 260 HP. This plane is easy to build, simple conception for new homebuilders. But the choice of a plane is an equation between the type and profile of the pilot (bush vs touring, high or low wings, kit or from scratch and finally money vs time). The choice is yours. Good luck, and enjoy with your project. Christian Tremblay The guy who build a CH640 from plan http://www.zodiac640.com/ _____ De : owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] De la part de Marco Rispoli Envoy=E9 : Sunday, August 20, 2006 3:52 PM =C0 : zenith-list@matronics.com Objet : Zenith-List: ch 640 Hello all. I have a question about the CH 640. I have seen many 640s started (both looking on the web and at the builder's list on the official Zenith site) but I can't find an example (pictures, comments, feedback) from a real homebuilder about the experience and how happy he/she is about the end result. So my question is: Did anyone ever complete a 640? I am not talking about a factory built prototype. I would like to know if any homebuilder has ever completed a 640 and he/she is actually flying it right now. Thank you! Marco ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 08:22:27 PM PST US From: Christian Tremblay Subject: Zenith-List: Rewarded : Flanges holes dyes Hello builders, I know it is not the first time the question will go on the forum, I got all information to build those dyes, but I want to know if someone will be willing to sold me or rent me, not matters, the 3 following size of dies : 65, 95 and 115 male/female flanges holes dies (I want to take short cut.) If yes, give me your conditions. Thanks in your legendary indefectible support. Christian Tremblay The guy who build a CH640 from plan http://www.zodiac640.com/ ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 08:32:06 PM PST US From: Christian Tremblay Subject: Zenith-List: Flyin with the CH 640 Hi Marco, There is the Steve Adams forum note on his experience with the CH640 Christian Tremblay Match: #3 Message: #40664 Subject: Re: Steve Adams'Zenair Zodiac CH640 From: "steveadams" Aug 11, 2006 Thanks. There is about a 10-11 month delay between submission and when you see your completion in the magazine. I have been flying the heck out of the plane, and now have about 235 hours in just over a year. My next milestone will be flying it for more hours than it took me to build. I just finished my first condition inspection and found no problems. My kit was #0052, ordered in May 2004. I think mine was the 3rd owner built 640 to fly. I believe there are 2 others that have since been completed and a number making serious progress toward finishing. The numbers are relatively small, but the 640 is a nice plane. If I was just now looking at buying a kit, I would make the same choice. Just a few thoughts from the perpective of flying your creation for a while. The process of building is a process of learning, with a series of milestones along the way. Each part you complete and each skill that you learn is a step toward the ultimate milestone; the first flight. We hear a lot about the building process, and of course we celebrate each first flight in anticipation of our own. We hear about the problems encountered after the first flight, and sadly we discuss the accidents that occur. But we rarely hear much more of what happens after that first flight. It also is a learning process every bit as challenging and rewarding as the actual building. The learning curve is steepest during those first few hours as you explore the characteristics of your new plane. To me that first power on full stall was almost as nerve wracking as the first flight, until it just mushed straight over and started flying again. With each characteristic and phase of flight you explore, you gain confidence and respect for the airplane you created. Later you start to refine things as you discover how to best fly the pattern and land, how it handles x-winds and different loadings. In essence you begin to know your airplane in flight every bit as well as you knew every bolt, rivet and wire as you were building. Then as you put in a few hours, your role changes from builder and test pilot to mechanic and aircraft owner, and there is a whole new set of skills to learn and tools to buy. You quickly learn that what was an easy thing to do during the build, turns you into a contortionist when you have to get back in to inspect, change or repair. You discover things that maybe you should have done a little differently, or some other addition that you would like to make to the airplane. I guess what I am saying is that what you started by drilling that first hole in the rudder spar, doesn't end with pulling the last rivet or the first flight. It's a continual challenge and source of enjoyment. Happy building and flying. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=54076#54076 _____ De : owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] De la part de Marco Rispoli Envoy=E9 : Sunday, August 20, 2006 3:52 PM =C0 : zenith-list@matronics.com Objet : Zenith-List: ch 640 Hello all. I have a question about the CH 640. I have seen many 640s started (both looking on the web and at the builder's list on the official Zenith site) but I can't find an example (pictures, comments, feedback) from a real homebuilder about the experience and how happy he/she is about the end result. So my question is: Did anyone ever complete a 640? I am not talking about a factory built prototype. I would like to know if any homebuilder has ever completed a 640 and he/she is actually flying it right now. Thank you! Marco ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 09:22:03 PM PST US From: "Dan Forney" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? Tom, I was wondering how my parts are coming along. Was the rudder that I saw at your house when I visited .016 or .025? Are you making my rudder skin out of the .025 thickness as well? Thanks, Dan _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom and Bren Henderson Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2006 6:14 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601XL AL Sheet Thickness changed from .016 to .020 ?? I'm builing my Rudder and Horizontal Stab again because I wasn't happy with the way the .016 aluminum lay on the ribs. I've been really happy with the .025 on the rest of the fuselage, and asked Zenith about replaciong the .016 on the tail with it. Caleb at Zenith emailed back that this was no problem, and further, that the production 601's are using .020 and .025 in the tail for the same reason. So. Long story short: It's ok to substitute. If it makes you feel better to hear it from Zenith, they're pretty fast at email responses. Matt Stecher wrote: --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Matt Stecher" I am building my shopping list and sorting through the aluminum cut sheets that I found on ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 10:00:53 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Now I really want one! From: "2thesky" --> Zenith-List message posted by: "2thesky" After driving to the six and a half hours to the open hangar day, I am now completely hooked on Zenith airplanes. It was the first time I saw an XL in person, and I loved it. Soon I will return, with my wife, for a demo flight. There weren't many XL's there, but the ones that were were gorgeous! Jim Pensinger and Fred Hulen's airplanes were there and looked better than any kit-planes I had ever seen before. Better than production airplanes for sure. I apologize for any drool puddles I left on them. I am not at all worried about the structural integrity of the blind rivets, because if those two guys were unable to polish the heads off, they will stand up to anything! [Laughing] Those airplanes were shiny and spotless! Mr. Pensinger answered all of the questions I asked him, many of the same questions for other people, and gave new builders tips that he learned during building. I didn't get to meet Mr. Hulen. I looked up and the nice little HDS was gone. I wanted to ask about his prop. There were many builders there, one man who said that he was 81 and brought pictures of his yellow HD, and many people that were just interested, like me. I also got to speak to Nick and Caleb from Zenith, sit in the planes, and take lots of pictures. Was it worth leaving my house at midnight and returning the following midnight? You bet! I think I will go to all of them. Hopefully, one of these days, I will get to fly an XL that I built to Mexico! Nate in OK do not archive -------- Every takeoff is optional, but every landing is mandatory! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56014#56014