Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:09 AM - Re: 801 Fuel Tanks (Paul Mulwitz)
2. 02:22 AM - Re: FWF kit for Jabiru (Dave Johnson)
3. 04:28 AM - Re: 801 Fuel Tanks (Tom)
4. 04:44 AM - Re: the Pledge of Allegiance !!! (Geoff Heap)
5. 04:53 AM - Re: 801 Fuel Tanks (Zodie Rocket)
6. 05:23 AM - Re: "Pledge" (Zed Smith)
7. 06:04 AM - Re: Re: the Pledge of Allegiance !!! (James Ferris)
8. 06:20 AM - Re: Pictures of factory HD/HDS 16 gallon header tank? (LarryMcFarland)
9. 06:26 AM - Re: Removing small dent/crease (LarryMcFarland)
10. 06:36 AM - Re: John McCains Remarks ..... (Bima, Martin)
11. 06:39 AM - 801 Fuel Caps (Dave Ruddiman)
12. 06:46 AM - Re: Removing small dent/crease (Dave Ruddiman)
13. 06:48 AM - to pledge or not to pledge (Carlos Sa)
14. 07:15 AM - Re: FWF kit for Jabiru (Paul Tipton)
15. 07:29 AM - Re: Removing small dent/crease (Debo Cox)
16. 07:48 AM - Re: Removing small dent/crease ()
17. 08:03 AM - Re: FWF kit for Jabiru (T. Graziano)
18. 08:32 AM - Re: Removing small dent/crease (William Jeffries)
19. 09:09 AM - Re: Re: 801 Fuel Tanks (Jay Caldwell)
20. 09:25 AM - Re: Removing small dent/crease (Todd Osborne)
21. 09:31 AM - Re: Re: Grounding Block (rosestar@sonic.net)
22. 09:33 AM - Re: Re: Grounding Block (rosestar@sonic.net)
23. 10:02 AM - Re: Re: 701 Builder manual questions (MacDonald Doug)
24. 10:55 AM - Re: Re: "Pledge" (Noel Loveys)
25. 01:18 PM - Re: Removing small dent/crease (Robert L. Stone)
26. 01:20 PM - Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F3hann_Gestur?=)
27. 01:52 PM - Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru (John Marzulli)
28. 01:59 PM - Re: Re: 801 Fuel Tanks (n801bh@netzero.com)
29. 02:31 PM - Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru (Paul Mulwitz)
30. 03:33 PM - Re: Re: 801 Fuel Tanks (Gary Gower)
31. 04:34 PM - Re: to pledge or not to pledge (Bill Naumuk)
32. 05:03 PM - Tensioning Cable (Matt & Jo)
33. 05:34 PM - Re: FWF kit for Jabiru (nyterminat@aol.com)
34. 05:50 PM - Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru (nyterminat@aol.com)
35. 06:17 PM - Re: Tensioning Cable (Craig Payne)
36. 07:45 PM - Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru (billmileski)
37. 10:40 PM - (Grant Corriveau)
38. 10:40 PM - Now I can sell my plane ;-) (Grant Corriveau)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: 801 Fuel Tanks |
Hi Dave,
I'm not entirely sure, but it seems to me your cap should be sealed
and you should have a different port for venting the tank. That is
the way it is done on the XL.
You will need a significant amount of air pressure going into the
fuel tank to insure good fuel flow to the engine. This is
accomplished on the XL with a 3/8 inch metal tube welded near the
fuel intake cap but on the bottom side of the tank. It extends up to
nearly the top of the tank and is cut at an angle that forces some
air into it when the plane is in flight. It also serves as a fuel
overflow vent so expanded fuel will not burst the tank on a hot
parking space. I have no idea what the 801 has in its tank design,
but I would have thought C. Heintz would use similar design
techniques on all his designs.
The fuel intake cap on the XL is threaded into the tank via a welded
metal ring. I went ahead and sealed this thread with normal plumbing
thread compound. If your tank has the same feature it may be this
thread that is leaking air rather than the gas cap itself.
Good luck,
Paul
XL fuselage
At 08:57 PM 10/3/2006, you wrote:
>Thanks for all the suggestions for leak tests. The only leaks I have
>are around the rubber gloves and rubber bands. I guess the caps are
>vented. I put one on and put a glove over it. I can still blow up
>the glove. How much venting do I need? It is obviously harder to
>blow up the glove through the cap. Is any venting OK or is it
>better to have more?
>
>Dave
>
>
-
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: FWF kit for Jabiru |
Many thanks to all who responded to my original e-mail.
I want to go for the usjabiru kit because it has had such good reports
on this list, I guess that being the 'wrong' side of the Atlantic does
complicate matters a bit and makes it difficult if things go wrong -
hence my caution!
It seems that the problem was my request for sea freight (serves me
right for being tight-fisted!). I have had an e-mail from Dana, so at
least I now have a second e-mail address to chase if necessary.
Regards,
Dave Johnson
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: ALAN BEYER
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 5:43 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: FWF kit for Jabiru
Hi Dave,
I forwarded your E-Mail to Pete (Jabiru USA). I know how he can be at
times. I hope he will get in touch with you soon. I had a FWF kit from
Pete years back. It was the original one from Jabiru in Australia, and
the cowls looked like crap. When Pete was still in WI we worked out a
deal to make a FWF kit because he was asked to do so thru Zenith Co. We
used my plane to make the molds and most of the pics in mounting
instruction are from my plane. I don't know what FWF system is sold by
the other Jabiru guys. I like the looks of the new cowl, and things as
far as cooling and mounting work out very well. If there is anything I
can do to help, let me know.
Good luck,
AL from Oshkosh
Dave Johnson <david_a_g_johnson@btinternet.com> wrote:
Does anyone know of a FWF kit for the 601XL and Jabiru, other than
the usjabiru kit?
My reason for asking is that I contacted usjabiru about their kit
about a month ago and eventually got a reply and quote saying they would
get back to me with shipping costs. I have heard nothing since and no
reply to several e-mails, which I know they got, as I had the
acknowledgement from Outlook.
If thats the way they deal with prospective customers, what hope is
there for support post-sales?
Dave Johnson
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: 801 Fuel Tanks |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tom" <tomp@cogeco.ca>
The 801 has vented caps and will be different from the xl because of the high wing
versus low wing disign of the wings. The caps will supply enough air venting
to ensure the tanks remain at normal air pressure. If the tanks were locked
off then gas flow would stop after a hour or so of running due to the vacuum
created.
--------
Tom CH801
http://tompizza.webhop.net
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65676#65676
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| Subject: | Re: the Pledge of Allegiance !!! |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Geoff Heap" <stol10@comcast.net>
Nicely said.........Geoff
Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65678#65678
Message 5
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Hi Dave the vented caps on the 801 are the same ones that have been used
on the 701 for the last 20 yrs. That is all you need and they work quite
well. The 601XL being a low wing and is concerned about excess drag has
incorporated a flush fuel cap system but this involves making a vent
tube in the tank. The 701 and 801 are all about drag and simplicity so
the cap hanging in the wing and not having a vent tube wielded in are
par for the course.
Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario
Zodiac 601XL C-GOXL, CH701 just started
HYPERLINK "http://www.ch601.org"www.ch601.org / HYPERLINK
"http://www.ch701.com"www.ch701.com/ HYPERLINK
"http://www.Osprey2.com"www.Osprey2.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul
Mulwitz
Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 5:07 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 801 Fuel Tanks
Hi Dave,
I'm not entirely sure, but it seems to me your cap should be sealed and
you should have a different port for venting the tank. That is the way
it is done on the XL.
You will need a significant amount of air pressure going into the fuel
tank to insure good fuel flow to the engine. This is accomplished on
the XL with a 3/8 inch metal tube welded near the fuel intake cap but on
the bottom side of the tank. It extends up to nearly the top of the
tank and is cut at an angle that forces some air into it when the plane
is in flight. It also serves as a fuel overflow vent so expanded fuel
will not burst the tank on a hot parking space. I have no idea what the
801 has in its tank design, but I would have thought C. Heintz would use
similar design techniques on all his designs.
The fuel intake cap on the XL is threaded into the tank via a welded
metal ring. I went ahead and sealed this thread with normal plumbing
thread compound. If your tank has the same feature it may be this
thread that is leaking air rather than the gas cap itself.
Good luck,
Paul
XL fuselage
At 08:57 PM 10/3/2006, you wrote:
Thanks for all the suggestions for leak tests. The only leaks I have are
around the rubber gloves and rubber bands. I guess the caps are vented.
I put one on and put a glove over it. I can still blow up the glove. How
much venting do I need? It is obviously harder to blow up the glove
through the cap. Is any venting OK or is it better to have more?
Dave
-
"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List"http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?Zenith-List
"http://forums.matronics.com"http://forums.matronics.com
"http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://www.matronics.com/contribu
tion
--
10/2/2006
--
10/2/2006
Message 6
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Zed Smith <zsmith3rd@earthlink.net>
Thank you, Mark!! Well said, timely, to the point, needed.
Zed Smith
do not archive
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| Subject: | Re: the Pledge of Allegiance !!! |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: James Ferris <mijniljj@yahoo.com>
When in Rome, do as the Romans! when in America, do as
the Americans!
--- Geoff Heap <stol10@comcast.net> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Geoff Heap"
> <stol10@comcast.net>
>
> Nicely said.........Geoff
>
>
>
>
> Do not archive
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
>
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65678#65678
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List
>
> Web Forums!
>
>
> Admin.
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________________________
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Pictures of factory HD/HDS 16 gallon header tank? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: LarryMcFarland <larry@macsmachine.com>
Craig,
My header tank is basically a 9-1/2 gallon tank because the lead edge
tanks are about the same.
The shape was limited to control depth for standard T& B and ICom radio
plus wires, etc.
Not to factory dimensional spec, but better welding and .040 - 5052-H32.
Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
do not archive
Craig Payne wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
>
>Does anyone have pictures of one of these tanks: installed or uninstalled? I
>know about Larry McFarland's site but he scratch-built his tank and I'm not
>certain how closely it matches the factory part.
>
>-- Craig
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Removing small dent/crease |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: LarryMcFarland <larry@macsmachine.com>
Todd,
I did the same thing to my leading edge left wing and would have
scrapped the piece right there, but decided to put the dent on a flat
block of steel and bump it a little.
Within a couple of minutes, the dent was 90% removed. I stopped there
and sprayed a primer filler on it and sanded the surface smooth again.
.016 is going to be considerably more sensitive, but I'd recommend you
bump it out against something hard with a smooth round hammer face, but
not all the way because you've stretched the metal in denting it. Then
fill it. Go gently at it.......
Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
Todd Osborne wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Todd Osborne <todd@toddtown.com>
>
> While handling the skin for my horizontal stabilizer tonight I
> managed to put a very small dent in the leading edge. Luckily, it is
> in the center and will probably be covered up and not visible anyway.
> I tried (gently) tapping on the dent with a mallet but that did
> nothing. I don't want to hit it too hard. Is there a good way to
> remove a shallow dent from .016? Thanks,
>
> Todd Osborne
> EMail: todd@toddtown.com
> Web: www.toddtown.com
> Yahoo Messenger: toddmosborne@yahoo.com
> MSN Messenger: todd@toddtown.com
> Skype: toddmosborne
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | RE: John McCains Remarks ..... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bima, Martin" <mbima@hydro.mb.ca>
Wow,
Thirteen years without shoes.
Do not archive
P.S. Is the latest edition of the 701 builder's manual good for putting
the rear fuselage together, or are builders using different and more
successful strategies?
Message 11
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I appreciate the input regarding the 801 caps, vents etc. I new the caps
were vented, but wasn't sure how much was needed. I have never seen ram
air tubes on the caps in any pictures, but who knows better than those
that have seen it, done it, been there, talked about it, heard about it,
thought about it, etc., etc.
Thanks for the suggestions,
Dave
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Removing small dent/crease |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting@comcast.net>
Todd,
I use Super Fil. It's a blue, 2 to1 epoxy filler that you can get from
Aircraft Spruce. It works on aluminum, steel, composites and wood. It is
really light weight.
Dave in Salem
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "LarryMcFarland" <larry@macsmachine.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 6:25 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Removing small dent/crease
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: LarryMcFarland <larry@macsmachine.com>
>
> Todd,
> I did the same thing to my leading edge left wing and would have scrapped
> the piece right there, but decided to put the dent on a flat block of
> steel and bump it a little.
> Within a couple of minutes, the dent was 90% removed. I stopped there and
> sprayed a primer filler on it and sanded the surface smooth again. .016 is
> going to be considerably more sensitive, but I'd recommend you bump it out
> against something hard with a smooth round hammer face, but not all the
> way because you've stretched the metal in denting it. Then fill it. Go
> gently at it.......
>
> Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
>
> Todd Osborne wrote:
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Todd Osborne <todd@toddtown.com>
>>
>> While handling the skin for my horizontal stabilizer tonight I managed
>> to put a very small dent in the leading edge. Luckily, it is in the
>> center and will probably be covered up and not visible anyway. I tried
>> (gently) tapping on the dent with a mallet but that did nothing. I don't
>> want to hit it too hard. Is there a good way to remove a shallow dent
>> from .016? Thanks,
>>
>> Todd Osborne
>> EMail: todd@toddtown.com
>> Web: www.toddtown.com
>> Yahoo Messenger: toddmosborne@yahoo.com
>> MSN Messenger: todd@toddtown.com
>> Skype: toddmosborne
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | to pledge or not to pledge |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Carlos Sa <carlosfsa@yahoo.com>
If you mean US, not all of us are there.
How would you like people from around the world posting their respective Allegiance
equivalents
here?
It certainly would be interesting, but this is not the place:
This is a Zenith forum. Nothing else.
Respectfuly
Carlos Sa
Montreal, Canada
do not archive
--- James Ferris <mijniljj@yahoo.com> a crit :
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: James Ferris <mijniljj@yahoo.com>
>
> When in Rome, do as the Romans! when in America, do as
> the Americans!
>
> --- Geoff Heap <stol10@comcast.net> wrote:
__________________________________________________________
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: FWF kit for Jabiru |
Stan:
The combination they are referring to is the 701/912ULS. It gets a
higher cruise with a combination of the airbox to get the full 100HP and
a more aerodynamic cowl. Danny at Skyshop would be more than willing to
tell you about it.
PS - I have not been able to get 105 MPH cruise. I might be able to
get that if I change the prop pitch, but I am more than happy with the
combination I have. A good combination of get off the ground and slower
cruise... I'm not usually in a hurry to go anywhere.
321PT
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Removing small dent/crease |
Another trick I read is to press it out gently from the back with the curved back
of a spoon. This takes a little practice, but I was able to get out a small
"smile" in some .016 I used on my horizontal stabilizer.
Debo
LarryMcFarland <larry@macsmachine.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: LarryMcFarland
Todd,
I did the same thing to my leading edge left wing and would have
scrapped the piece right there, but decided to put the dent on a flat
block of steel and bump it a little.
Within a couple of minutes, the dent was 90% removed. I stopped there
and sprayed a primer filler on it and sanded the surface smooth again.
.016 is going to be considerably more sensitive, but I'd recommend you
bump it out against something hard with a smooth round hammer face, but
not all the way because you've stretched the metal in denting it. Then
fill it. Go gently at it.......
Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
Todd Osborne wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Todd Osborne
>
> While handling the skin for my horizontal stabilizer tonight I
> managed to put a very small dent in the leading edge. Luckily, it is
> in the center and will probably be covered up and not visible anyway.
> I tried (gently) tapping on the dent with a mallet but that did
> nothing. I don't want to hit it too hard. Is there a good way to
> remove a shallow dent from .016? Thanks,
>
> Todd Osborne
> EMail: todd@toddtown.com
> Web: www.toddtown.com
> Yahoo Messenger: toddmosborne@yahoo.com
> MSN Messenger: todd@toddtown.com
> Skype: toddmosborne
>
>
---------------------------------
Get your email and more, right on the new Yahoo.com
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Removing small dent/crease |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: <dredmoody@cox.net>
If you are addicted to cool tools like many of us, Harbor Freight has a set of
body and fender hammers and dollys that are reasonably priced. The round dolly
works well as the "spoon" in the technique you described, Debo.
Like others have said, "Don't ask me how I know this".
Ed Moody II
---- Debo Cox <sky_ranger161@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Another trick I read is to press it out gently from the back with the curved
back of a spoon. This takes a little practice, but I was able to get out a small
"smile" in some .016 I used on my horizontal stabilizer.
>
> Debo
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: FWF kit for Jabiru |
I ordered and received my Jab 3300 and FWF kit for my 601XL about 2
years ago (just as Jab USA was locating from Wisconsin to Tennessee) and
first flew it in July of last year.
I had great support from Pete during my installation and have had had
exceptional support from Jabiru USA.since.
If you call Dana for any parts, she usually has them "in the mail" the
same day.
An example of post procurement support from Pete is that during my first
annual conditional inspection I found a crack in my muffler where the
exhaust "pipe" enters the "can" (probably a MIG weld vice the current
TIG welds). I called Pete to see if it was under warranty and he said
to just sent it to him. Even though Jab USA was busy getting ready to
go to OSH, I received my repaired muffler (both pipe welds re-welded)
back in a timely manner.
NOTE: I have found that it is a whole lot easier to mount the engine to
the mount, then mount the engine/mount package to the firewall. I did
this during original installation and again during my annual inspection
when I installed Jab shims underneath the lower vibration isolators to
correct a little sag.
Tony Graziano
Zodiac 601XL/Jab3300; N493TG; 152 hrs.
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Removing small dent/crease |
Todd and all,
I have a solution for your dents, dings and other imperfections. This will take
a bit of explanation but be patient and I'll try. The only question is do you
have access to the inside of your leading edge. If so I recommend that you
purchase a spherical magnet and a polished piece of mild steel. What you simply
do is place the sphere magnet on the inside of your leading edge and run it
around using the block of steel.
The magnet is attracted the the steel through the aluminum and will roll out any
imperfection that it encounters. It's sort of like having a portable english
wheel.
Because of the small surface area of contact a sphere the pressure is concentrated
and will roll out any damage. These magnets can be obtained in varying sizes
to accommodate whatever radius trying to be repaired. As for the block of
steel, a 3x3x0.5 should be adequate, just be sure that there are no sharp edges
that could scratch the surface of the aluminum. I recommend using a polished
piece of steel however this can be protected by using masking tape as long
as you butt the edges of your tape rather than overlap the seams. It doesn't
take long at all to repair the damage just take your time in the prep work to
prevent any further damage. This method works equally well on painted surfaces.
The only reasonable source that I have found for the magnets is on the web at HTTP://www.unitednuclear.com. The 1.5" sphere goes for $48 plus shipping.
Good luck on whatever route you choose,
Bill Jeffries, AP
---------------------------------
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Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: 801 Fuel Tanks |
I have a question extending this discussion. I have an 801 with both main and
aux tanks. I am installing a Crossflow Subaru Turbochared engine. I have a header
tank installed on the Firewall for the wing tanks to "drain" into. The
wing tanks are vented and the header tank is not. The header tank feed the Gascolator
which will feed the fuel pumps which pressurize the MPI fuel rail which
ends in a regulator that connects back to the header tank. The header tank
is NOT vented except for a schrader valve to bleed off air. I don't have this
hooked up yet.
Comments?
Tom <tomp@cogeco.ca> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tom"
The 801 has vented caps and will be different from the xl because of the high wing
versus low wing disign of the wings. The caps will supply enough air venting
to ensure the tanks remain at normal air pressure. If the tanks were locked
off then gas flow would stop after a hour or so of running due to the vacuum
created.
--------
Tom CH801
http://tompizza.webhop.net
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65676#65676
Jay F. Caldwell
Owner, Caldwell Systems Engineering (CSE), LLC
4181 Tamilynn Court
San Diego, CA 92122
Voice 858.453.4594
Facsimile 858.452.1560
Work 619.562.0885
Mobile 858.336.0394
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Removing small dent/crease |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Todd Osborne <todd@toddtown.com>
Thanks for your response, and all the others. I do have access to the
inside of the skin right now, but when I pulled top skin down to
rivet it, the dent almost completely disappears under the stress of
the skin. So, I think I got lucky here, the damage is real slight and
barely noticeable when the skin is tight, and will be under the
rudder fairing, so in this case I think the best thing to do is
nothing at all.
Todd Osborne
EMail: todd@toddtown.com
Web: www.toddtown.com
Yahoo Messenger: toddmosborne@yahoo.com
MSN Messenger: todd@toddtown.com
Skype: toddmosborne
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | Re: Grounding Block |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: rosestar@sonic.net
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: fred sanford <sonar1@cox.net>
>
> Brad:
> I bought a spade grounding block from AeroElectric. It worked really
> well, and looks nice too. Also in the picture is my handiest tool of the
> whole build. I put nylon webbing around the jaws of 6 inch vise-grip
> pliers with zip ties. We used them on almost every step.
>
> Fred Sanford N9701 912UL 73 hours
>
> http://www.sonar100.com/ground%20block.jpg
>
> do not archive
>
>
Thank you to everyone who responded. The links to the suppliers are
great. You pointed me to exactly what I need. Thanks.
Brad
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Grounding Block |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: rosestar@sonic.net
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: fred sanford <sonar1@cox.net>
>
> Brad:
> I bought a spade grounding block from AeroElectric. It worked really
> well, and looks nice too. Also in the picture is my handiest tool of the
> whole build. I put nylon webbing around the jaws of 6 inch vise-grip
> pliers with zip ties. We used them on almost every step.
>
> Fred Sanford N9701 912UL 73 hours
>
> http://www.sonar100.com/ground%20block.jpg
>
> do not archive
>
>
Fred,
Very nice work on the wiring. Very neat and clean. I also have that tool
and a dremel which has been a real handing tool as well.
Brad
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Re: RE: 701 Builder manual questions |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: MacDonald Doug <dougsnash@yahoo.com>
I am in the process of putting the baggage compartment
and seat back in place so this the rear fuselage is
pretty fresh in my mind. And, I am scratch building
my 701 if it makes any difference to how you view this
advice. Bellow are some of the changes I made after
consulting with CAN-ZAC.
1. I flush riveted the "L"s to the fuse sides (for
looks only) using the dimpleing and back riveting
method shown to me by a fellow 701 builder who had
previously built an early RV-6 kit. I went with
AN426AD-3-3 rivets at 30mm pitch if I remember
correctly. It turned out great.
2. I placed 0.016 "L"s diagnally between the upright
to prevent oil canning. These I riveted at 40 pitch.
The diagnals were also riveted the same as the
uprights
3. I used driven AN470AD Rivets on the longerons. I
think pulled rivets would have been better in these
locations though. I found the driven rivet didn't
pull the skin as tightly to the longeron as a pulled
rivet would have. Admittedly, the more rivets I
installed, the better they looked.
4. When it comes to the part where you attach the
rear wing mounts, don't follow the steps in the manual
rather follow the instructions listed on the plans
(top of 7F11 I think). It would be better to cleco
the side uprights and doublers in place before
installing the wing brackets. Otherwise it may be
possible to intstall them in less that optimal
position. I found that until I attached the uprights
at the front, I could change the angle at the top by
3-5 degrees.
Other than these items, the builder manual and plans
work pretty well. Even with the slower going for the
driven rivets, it went together fairly quickly. I am
amazed at how strong and light the rear fuselage is
once it is put together.
Doug MacDonald
NW ONtario, Canada
CH-701 Scratch builder
Finishing up the rear fuse
>P.S. Is the latest edition of the 701 builder's
>manual good for putting
>the rear fuselage together, or are builders using
>different and more
>successful strategies?
__________________________________________________
Message 24
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
American friends:
Having your Pledge of Allegiance said in your schools, hospitals, churches
and any where else in your great country is admirable. We, outside the U.S.
can probably learn from you on this matter.
But
To everything there is a time and a place...
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Zed Smith
> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 9:53 AM
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: re: "Pledge"
>
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Zed Smith <zsmith3rd@earthlink.net>
>
> Thank you, Mark!! Well said, timely, to the point, needed.
>
> Zed Smith
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Re: Removing small dent/crease |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4@hot.rr.com>
This comes under the heading of:
IF IT AINT BROKE, DON'T FIX IT
DO NOT ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: "Todd Osborne" <todd@toddtown.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 11:22 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Removing small dent/crease
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Todd Osborne <todd@toddtown.com>
>
> Thanks for your response, and all the others. I do have access to the
> inside of the skin right now, but when I pulled top skin down to
> rivet it, the dent almost completely disappears under the stress of
> the skin. So, I think I got lucky here, the damage is real slight and
> barely noticeable when the skin is tight, and will be under the
> rudder fairing, so in this case I think the best thing to do is
> nothing at all.
>
> Todd Osborne
> EMail: todd@toddtown.com
> Web: www.toddtown.com
> Yahoo Messenger: toddmosborne@yahoo.com
> MSN Messenger: todd@toddtown.com
> Skype: toddmosborne
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F3hann_Gestur?= <joeing701@internet.is>
Hello list members.
I thought the VNE for Zenith 701 is 90mph. Has this changed with the new
kits? If not, what is the purpose of getting a higher speed than the
never exceed speed? Is that safe?
Just curious.
Regards,
Johann G.
Z701
do not archive
Message 27
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|
| Subject: | Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru |
Zenith's site lists 110MPH as VNE
Realistically I think 90MPH is VNWE... aka Never Will Exceed.
On 10/4/06, J=F3hann Gestur <joeing701@internet.is> wrote:
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F3hann_Gestur?=
<
> joeing701@internet.is>
>
> Hello list members.
>
> I thought the VNE for Zenith 701 is 90mph. Has this changed with the new
> kits? If not, what is the purpose of getting a higher speed than the
> never exceed speed? Is that safe?
>
> Just curious.
>
> Regards,
> Johann G.
> Z701
> do not archive
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
--
John Marzulli
CH701 in Seattle
Wings and tanks on order!
http://701Builder.blogspot.com/
"Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot
harder to put baseball cards in the spokes.
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | Re: 801 Fuel Tanks |
My first impression is that you will be ok. If your header tank was ven
ted the vent would have to be higher then the wing tanks or the fuel wou
ld siphon out. Since it is next to impossible to run a vent up higher th
en the wing tanks my feeling is that your set up "should" work. Just rem
ember the 801 is a strange beast in that the wings work soooo good the l
ow pressure area on top of the wings plays tricks on the entire fuel sys
tem and venting. There was a 801 down in Texas that crashed because of
venting issues... After we spend all this time building our toys we sure
ly don't want to trash it over something that is documented... Just me o
pinion..
do not archive
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
-- Jay Caldwell <caldwelljf@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
I have a question extending this discussion. I have an 801 with both ma
in and aux tanks. I am installing a Crossflow Subaru Turbochared engine
. I have a header tank installed on the Firewall for the wing tanks to
"drain" into. The wing tanks are vented and the header tank is not. Th
e header tank feed the Gascolator which will feed the fuel pumps which p
ressurize the MPI fuel rail which ends in a regulator that connects back
to the header tank. The header tank is NOT vented except for a schrade
r valve to bleed off air. I don't have this hooked up yet. Comments?
Tom <tomp@cogeco.ca> wrote:--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tom"
The 801 has vented caps and will be different from the xl because of the
========================
========================
========================
========================
========================
========================
========================
========================
====
<html><P> My first impression is that you will be ok. If your heade
r tank was vented the vent would have to be higher then the wing tanks o
r the fuel would siphon out. Since it is next to impossible to run a ven
t up higher then the wing tanks my feeling is that your set up "should"
work. Just remember the 801 is a strange beast in that the wings work so
ooo good the low pressure area on top of the wings plays tricks on the e
ntire fuel system and venting. There was a 801 down in Texas that crashe
d because of venting issues... After we spend all this time buildi
ng our toys we surely don't want to trash it over something that is docu
mented... Just me opinion..</P>
<P>do not archive<BR><BR><BR>Ben Haas<BR>N801BH<BR>www.haaspowerair
.com<BR><BR>-- Jay Caldwell <caldwelljf@sbcglobal.net&
gt; wrote:<BR></P>
<DIV>I have a question extending this discussion. I have an 801 wi
th both main and aux tanks. I am installing a Crossflow Subaru Tur
bochared engine. I have a header tank installed on the Firewall fo
r the wing tanks to "drain" into. The wing tanks are vented and th
e header tank is not. The header tank feed the Gascolator which wi
ll feed the fuel pumps which pressurize the MPI fuel rail which ends in
a regulator that connects back to the header tank. The header tank
is NOT vented except for a schrader valve to bleed off air. I don
't have this hooked up yet.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Comments?<BR><BR><B><I>Tom <tomp@cogeco.ca></I></B> wrote:</D
IV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px;
BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">--> Zenith-List message posted by: "
Tom" <TOMP@COGECO.CA><BR><BR>The 801 has vented caps and will be differe
nt from the xl because of the high wing versus low wing disign of the <P
RE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color=#000000 size=2>
========================
===========
">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List</A>
========================
===========
tronics.com</A>
========================
===========
ics.com</A>
========================
===========
www.matronics.com/contribution</A>
========================
===========
</B></FONT></PRE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
Message 29
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|
| Subject: | Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz@worldnet.att.net>
Hi Johann,
The ZAC web site shows a Vne of 110 mph for the 701. Perhaps this
has changed over time.
Paul
XL fuselage
do not archive
At 01:20 PM 10/4/2006, you wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F3hann_Gestur?=
><joeing701@internet.is>
>
>Hello list members.
>
>I thought the VNE for Zenith 701 is 90mph. Has this changed with the
>new kits? If not, what is the purpose of getting a higher speed than
>the never exceed speed? Is that safe?
>
>Just curious.
>
>Regards,
>Johann G.
>Z701
>do not archive
>
>
---------------------------------------------
Paul Mulwitz
32013 NE Dial Road
Camas, WA 98607
---------------------------------------------
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Re: 801 Fuel Tanks |
Hello Jay,
Just one fast comment, (no 801 builder or owner) No time to think about it now
myself, sorry..
But the number 1 case (Kitplanes article) of accidents were fuel related and most
of them in the first hours... Just be very carefull and look for all the
potential problems in any design.
You will get enough advise from the list, but keep your mind open to the best system
YOU can choose and build.
Good luck and keep us posted.
Saludos
Gary Gower
Flying from Chapala, Mexico.
do not archive
Jay Caldwell <caldwelljf@sbcglobal.net> wrote: I have a question extending this
discussion. I have an 801 with both main and aux tanks. I am installing a Crossflow
Subaru Turbochared engine. I have a header tank installed on the Firewall
for the wing tanks to "drain" into. The wing tanks are vented and the header
tank is not. The header tank feed the Gascolator which will feed the fuel
pumps which pressurize the MPI fuel rail which ends in a regulator that connects
back to the header tank. The header tank is NOT vented except for a schrader
valve to bleed off air. I don't have this hooked up yet.
Comments?
Tom <tomp@cogeco.ca> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tom"
The 801 has vented caps and will be different from the xl because of the high wing
versus low wing disign of the
---------------------------------
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: to pledge or not to pledge |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk@alltel.net>
All-
As much as I agree with the original post, I have to agree with Carlos.
Let's all leave geopolitics to our respective elected representatives. I
don't know who elects them because I sure didn't vote for them,
but..........
Bill Naumuk
HDS Fuselage
Townville, Pa
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carlos Sa" <carlosfsa@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 9:47 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: to pledge or not to pledge
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Carlos Sa <carlosfsa@yahoo.com>
>
> If you mean US, not all of us are there.
>
> How would you like people from around the world posting their respective
> Allegiance equivalents
> here?
>
> It certainly would be interesting, but this is not the place:
> This is a Zenith forum. Nothing else.
>
> Respectfuly
>
> Carlos Sa
> Montreal, Canada
> do not archive
>
> --- James Ferris <mijniljj@yahoo.com> a crit :
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: James Ferris <mijniljj@yahoo.com>
>>
>> When in Rome, do as the Romans! when in America, do as
>> the Americans!
>>
>> --- Geoff Heap <stol10@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
> __________________________________________________________
>
>
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Tensioning Cable |
Question for the group. How did you determine and set the cable tension
in the flight control cables?
Cheers
Matt
www.zodiacxl.com
Message 33
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|
| Subject: | Re: FWF kit for Jabiru |
Stan,
Same with me, it is a very nice firewall forward package but I do not see anywhere
near the 105 mph that was advertised. I have ordered strut fairings to try
to squeak a little more out of it. I also enjoy the scenery below as I tour the
countryside.
Bob Spudis
N701ZX
-----Original Message-----
From: PTIPTON@swmail.sw.org
Sent: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 9:14 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: FWF kit for Jabiru
Stan:
The combination they are referring to is the 701/912ULS. It gets a higher cruise
with a combination of the airbox to get the full 100HP and a more aerodynamic
cowl. Danny at Skyshop would be more than willing to tell you about it.
PS - I have not been able to get 105 MPH cruise. I might be able to get that if
I change the prop pitch, but I am more than happy with the combination I have.
A good combination of get off the ground and slower cruise... I'm not usually
in a hurry to go anywhere.
321PT
________________________________________________________________________
Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools,
free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL
Mail and more.
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru |
I concur, 90mph is about the best except when you push that stick forward.
Bob Spudis
-----Original Message-----
From: john.marzulli@gmail.com
Sent: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 3:48 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru
Zenith's site lists 110MPH as VNE
Realistically I think 90MPH is VNWE... aka Never Will Exceed.
On 10/4/06, J=C3=B3hann Gestur < joeing701@internet.is> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F3hann_Gestur?= <
joeing701@internet.is>
Hello list members.
I thought the VNE for Zenith 701 is 90mph. Has this changed with the new
kits? If not, what is the purpose of getting a higher speed than the
never exceed speed? Is that safe?
Just curious.
Regards,http://forum==================
== ; -Matt Dralle, Lisntribution">
--
John Marzulli
CH701 in Seattle
Wings and tanks on order!
http://701Builder.blogspot.com/
"Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot har
der to put baseball cards in the spokes.
________________________________________________________________________
Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security t
ools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, fr
ee AOL Mail and more.
Message 35
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| Subject: | Tensioning Cable |
The commercial tension gauges cost hundreds of dollars..As usual Larry
McFarland had a nice solution:
www.macsmachine.com/images/tjh/cabletools/full/tension0.gif
www.macsmachine.com/images/tjh/cabletools/full/tension3.gif
www.macsmachine.com/images/tjh/cabletools/full/tension4.gif
www.macsmachine.com/images/tjh/cabletools/full/tenscalbrate.gif
-- Craig
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: FWF kit for JabiruFWF kit for Jabiru |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "billmileski" <mileski@sonalysts.com>
Actually, believe it or not, I can obtain 110mph in level flight with a 912S and
a Woodcomp fixed pitch propeller. I don't think this is a safe regime in which
to operate, but what's nice, is an easy cruise of 80-85mph at 4800rpm or so.
I have heard that this propeller is the main reason, but I have no experience
with other setups, so who knows. Maybe I have "reflex" in my flaperon position
relative to others or something. And I haven't rigorously verified with
a GPS and triangular course, but have "loosely" verified using opposing courses
several times, so that I'm likely within 5mph of reality. Again, I did this
just during test phase and don't recommend operating there. And this is IAS at
less than 3500' msl.
Bill Mileski
>
> I concur, 90mph is about the best except when you push that stick forward.
>
> Bob Spudis
>
>
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65902#65902
Message 37
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http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7239242995971908820
this time with the link!! sorry,
-------------------------------
grant.corriveau@telus.net
---------------------------------------
The Wings Stayed On!
http://aluwings.blogspirit.com
---------------------------------------
Message 38
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|
| Subject: | Now I can sell my plane ;-) |
Check this out... no need to even leave the ground! Fuel is really
cheap, no flight planning to bother with, and you can fly just about
anywhere - and no one's the wiser.... hmmmm
-------------------------------
grant.corriveau@telus.net
---------------------------------------
The Wings Stayed On!
http://aluwings.blogspirit.com
---------------------------------------
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