Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:43 AM - Re: slats vs no slats (secatur)
2. 04:59 AM - Re: 701 vs ??? (Big Gee)
3. 05:35 AM - Re: Re: slats vs no slats + insrance problems ?? (Tommy Walker)
4. 05:43 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator (N5SL)
5. 05:52 AM - Re: Re: Stut fairings (NYTerminat@aol.com)
6. 06:24 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator (Jean-Paul Roy)
7. 06:25 AM - Re: Re: Stut fairings (Jean-Paul Roy)
8. 06:56 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator-- thanks (Big Gee)
9. 07:01 AM - Re: 601 copies or vice versa? (Ron DeWees)
10. 07:14 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator (Big Gee)
11. 07:25 AM - Re: Re: Stut fairings (NYTerminat@aol.com)
12. 07:28 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator (NYTerminat@aol.com)
13. 07:31 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator (N5SL)
14. 07:42 AM - Re: Re: Stut fairings (NYTerminat@aol.com)
15. 08:11 AM - Re: XL Wingtip trimming ()
16. 08:25 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator (Hunt Malcolm)
17. 08:33 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator (VideoFlyer@aol.com)
18. 08:34 AM - Re: Re: Stut fairings (Jean-Paul Roy)
19. 09:02 AM - Re: Re :701 Stut fairings (Monty Graves)
20. 09:08 AM - Re: XL Wingtip trimming (DaveG601XL)
21. 09:31 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator (Craig Payne)
22. 10:08 AM - Have You Tried The New Matronics List Forum? (Matt Dralle)
23. 10:08 AM - Free 2D drafting software (lnk@iowatelecom.net)
24. 11:15 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator-- Push switches???? (Big Gee)
25. 11:46 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator-- Push switches???? (Craig Payne)
26. 11:54 AM - Re: Electric flap actuator (Craig Payne)
27. 01:12 PM - Re: Re: Stut fairings (Jean-Paul Roy)
28. 01:40 PM - Re: Re: Stut fairings (PipercubDream@aol.com)
29. 03:06 PM - Re: Re :701 Stut fairings (NYTerminat@aol.com)
30. 03:10 PM - Re: Electric flap actuator (NYTerminat@aol.com)
31. 03:36 PM - Re: Electric flap actuator (Jean-Paul Roy)
32. 04:02 PM - Re: Electric flap actuator (TxDave)
33. 04:10 PM - corvair engines available (Terry Turnquist)
34. 04:26 PM - Re: Re: 601 copies or vice versa? (Juan Vega)
35. 04:37 PM - Re: 701 vs ??? (Juan Vega)
36. 04:42 PM - Re: 701 vs ??? (Juan Vega)
37. 04:50 PM - Re: 701 vs ??? (Dave Ruddiman)
38. 05:20 PM - Re: Historic Zenair Zipper for sale (Peter Chapman)
39. 06:38 PM - Re: Re :701 Stut fairings (n801bh@netzero.com)
40. 06:40 PM - Re: 701 vs ??? (n801bh@netzero.com)
41. 07:36 PM - Re: Re :701 Stut fairings (NYTerminat@aol.com)
42. 07:38 PM - Re: 701 vs ??? (NYTerminat@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: slats vs no slats |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "secatur" <appraise1@bigpond.com>
Oh god! don't u just hate it when u push the wrong button and have to start again?
never as good the second time either lol!
OK newbie (120hrs ga, no UL exp), not sure where to post so don't kill me if I'm
wrong! (Although Doug, I'm now in Australia, but orig from Montreal...so go
easy eh?)
I'm (will be shortly) building 701..Having perused web extensively, I will build
WITHOUT SLATS and use VGs...READ the site (stolspeed.com.au) thoroughly! IF
you don't agree S'ok but good info anyway! I have talked to people associated
and not associated and they have DONE THEIR HOMEWORK! ( Read AvWeb from 2003
if you want!) The kicker for me was ICP Savannah (still not sure I made the right
choice! lol) Tested stolspeed's stuff and look on the site.."""Savannah VG"""
To make matters worse, I will be using Simonini 2st/2cyl/H2O cooled/105hp/ 115lbs
allup....on the basis that 701 was originally designed for 2cyl/2st (Rotax
503/580)( Only changed when Rotax said 300hrs and replace crank as well!) I think
slow speed and stol MUST suffer using heavier engine!
My 2 cents feel free to !$#@!#^^
Best Regards,
Steve
WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=71948#71948
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Message 2
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John-- well said and I agree with you-----I don't understand how some folks
can think slats can be REPLACED by VG's and not see the dangerous situatio
n they are creating. (my opinion)=0A=0AWhen I used the word "design", I me
ant it as: "Chris designed the CH 701 and CH 601 XL" etc. I din't mean he
came up with the idea of stats, high lift wing etc.=0A=0AHappy building=0A
=0AFritz--601XL--90/90----Corvair=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A----- Original M
essage ----=0AFrom: "JohnDRead@aol.com" <JohnDRead@aol.com>=0ATo: zenith-li
st@matronics.com=0ASent: Friday, November 3, 2006 12:26:57 AM=0ASubject: Re
: Zenith-List: 701 vs ???=0A=0A=0AHere is my two cents worth, I think you a
re confusing "design" with "style". STOL aircraft are not new as you have p
ointed out. Never the less Chris Heintz designed, that's all the little bit
s in the detail drawings, which is NOT style. The thread on removing the sl
ats and adding VG's is downright dangerous. If you study the drawings of th
e 701's airfoil you will notice that the profile includes the outline of th
e slats. The slot in the wing is what creates the high lift characteristic
of the airfoil. Check out Abbot & Von Doenhoff for an explanation of how sl
otted airfoils work. Vg's are useful however when added to a "normal" airfo
il and do help with helping the airflow over the wing to stay attached, it
this that helps the airfoil work better. I agree with you that there are ar
eas of any aircraft that COULD be improved check out the 172's changes over
the years. That the 701 has had so few iterations over a 20 year life spea
ks volumes of how good the basic design, not
"style", is. That is my dollars worth, two cents was not enough!=0A =0AReg
========================0A=0A
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: slats vs no slats + insrance problems ?? |
Bob,
I thought they were just flat pieces of sheet bent to an aerodyamic
form. I didn't know they were extruded.
Tommy Walker in Alabama
Do Not Archive
....I have good news and bad news. One of the strut fairings that I
received
from Streamline had a slight crack in the extrusion. I spoke with
Streamline and
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator |
Hi Fritz:=0A=0AI'd go with the model number and source Craig Payne posted.
(Item# 5-1577-2 has 2 inches of travel while 5-1577-4 has 4. =0AThe compan
ion controller can memorize intermediate stops: 5-1577-C. Each of =0Athese
are well under $100. www.surpluscenter.com)=0A=0AHe has a great talent for
finding stuff! Thanks Craig - I'll save the information if I need another
one later. =0A=0AJust to elaborate on what Craig said - you need to make t
he linkage so it uses up all of the travel (I used a 4" actuator) in both d
irections. Make the linkage adjustable so you can tweak it once it is inst
alled. It's not that hard to do and I'm really happy with the way mine wo
rks. =0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Big Gee <taffy0687@yahoo.co
m>=0A=0AScott--- Could you please give more information on you electric fl
ap actuator. Price? where you pruchased it etc ?=0A=0A =0A=0AThank you=0A
=0A =0A=0AFritz 601 XL, 90/90-- Corvair=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Stut fairings |
The ones that a lot of people are using are extruded from plastic, very
lightweight and less than $200.00. They slip over your strut tube.
Bob
In a message dated 11/3/2006 8:36:21 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
twalker@cableone.net writes:
Bob,
I thought they were just flat pieces of sheet bent to an aerodyamic form. I
didn't know they were extruded.
Tommy Walker in Alabama
Do Not Archive
....I have good news and bad news. One of the strut fairings that I received
from Streamline had a slight crack in the extrusion. I spoke with Streamline
and
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator |
I'm just thinking out loud here. Would two small limit swithes could
control the travel lenght?
Jean-Paul
CH701 wings
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: N5SL
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 8:43 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Electric flap actuator
Hi Fritz:
I'd go with the model number and source Craig Payne posted. (Item#
5-1577-2 has 2 inches of travel while 5-1577-4 has 4. The companion
controller can memorize intermediate stops: 5-1577-C. Each of these are
well under $100. www.surpluscenter.com)
He has a great talent for finding stuff! Thanks Craig - I'll save the
information if I need another one later.
Just to elaborate on what Craig said - you need to make the linkage so
it uses up all of the travel (I used a 4" actuator) in both directions.
Make the linkage adjustable so you can tweak it once it is installed.
It's not that hard to do and I'm really happy with the way mine works.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Stut fairings |
Any link to these plastic struts fairing?
Thanks
Jean-Paul
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: NYTerminat@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Stut fairings
The ones that a lot of people are using are extruded from plastic,
very lightweight and less than $200.00. They slip over your strut tube.
Bob
In a message dated 11/3/2006 8:36:21 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
twalker@cableone.net writes:
Bob,
I thought they were just flat pieces of sheet bent to an aerodyamic
form. I didn't know they were extruded.
Tommy Walker in Alabama
Do Not Archive
....I have good news and bad news. One of the strut fairings that I
received
from Streamline had a slight crack in the extrusion. I spoke
with Streamline and
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator-- thanks |
Scott and Craig------- thanks so much for the flap actuator info------ will
do as you advise with the linkage set-up.=0AYou guys have saved me a bunch
of bucks ( I believe about $350 saved). Your timing could not have been a
ny better, as it it time for be ordering the flap actuator.=0A=0AThanks aga
in=0AFritz --- 601XL---90/90-- Corvair=0Ado not archive=0A=0A----- Original
Message ----=0AFrom: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>=0ATo: zenith-list@matronics.
com=0ASent: Friday, November 3, 2006 8:43:30 AM=0ASubject: Re: Zenith-List:
Electric flap actuator=0A=0A=0AHi Fritz:=0A=0AI'd go with the model number
and source Craig Payne posted. (Item# 5-1577-2 has 2 inches of travel whi
le 5-1577-4 has 4. The companion controller can memorize intermediate stops
: 5-1577-C. Each of these are well under $100. www.surpluscenter.com)=0A=0A
He has a great talent for finding stuff! Thanks Craig - I'll save the info
rmation if I need another one later. =0A=0AJust to elaborate on what Craig
said - you need to make the linkage so it uses up all of the travel (I use
d a 4" actuator) in both directions. Make the linkage adjustable so you ca
n tweak it once it is installed. It's not that hard to do and I'm really
happy with the way mine works. =0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom
: Big Gee <taffy0687@yahoo.com>=0A=0A=0AScott--- Could you please give mor
e information on you electric flap actuator. Price? where you pruchased it
etc ?=0A =0AThank you=0A =0AFritz 601 XL, 90/90-- Corvair=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
==========0A=0A
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: 601 copies or vice versa? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Ron DeWees <rdewees@mindspring.com>
Ron DeWees wrote:
> Hi Listers,
> I don't want to jump on the bandwagon for or against Chris with who
> took whose design, and I sure agree that the Savannah looks a LOT like
> a 701. I would like to point out something that I don't think I have
> seen mentioned in the past. I am sure I will be corrected if I am wrong.
> Chris worked for Robbins Aircraft in France at some point in his
> early career. One of the planes designed by Robbins was a popular
> homebuilt called the Bebe Jodel. It was and is a great plane and
> looks more than a little like the early Heintz CH 100/200, etc
> planes. Biggest difference is that they were wood and not metal. Even
> CH's airfoil is from the same NACA family as the Jodel. I have flown a
> CH 100 that looked almost exactly like the Robbins D9. Take a look
> at http://www.jodel.com/index.asp?p=d9&themodels. Look at the
> horizontal and vertical elevator placement, the wing dihedral, and the
> three view drawings. All quite similar and not common to a lot of
> other planes. I never heard Robbins talk about infringements of
> their design. Was Jodel the face that launched a thousand (Heintz)
> ships? Maybe it's a case of what goes around comes around?
Before I get jumped and flamed I will point out that I fly a "stock"
601HDS taildragger that I love and have no interest in modifying for
pleasure or profit but it's sure not a black and white issue when you
talk about improvements and change to a design. I guess that's why we
have so many lawyers.
> Ron DeWees
do not archive
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Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator |
I'll let someone else answer about the limit switches ( I believe they wou
ld work). But, the reason I like the way Scott did his ( build linkage so
full travel is used) is because there are less things that can go wrong (
limit switch coming out of adjustment) or breaking etc. =0A=0AFritz=0Ado
not archive=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Jean-Paul Roy <jean
-paul.roy4@tlb.sympatico.ca>=0ATo: zenith-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Friday
, November 3, 2006 9:14:35 AM=0ASubject: Re: Zenith-List: Electric flap act
uator=0A=0A=0AI'm just thinking out loud here. Would two small limit swithe
s could control the travel lenght?=0A =0AJean-Paul=0ACH701 wings=0Ado not a
rchive=0A----- Original Message ----- =0AFrom: N5SL =0ATo: zenith-list@matr
onics.com =0ASent: Friday, November 03, 2006 8:43 AM=0ASubject: Re: Zenith-
List: Electric flap actuator=0A=0A=0AHi Fritz:=0A=0AI'd go with the model n
umber and source Craig Payne posted. (Item# 5-1577-2 has 2 inches of trave
l while 5-1577-4 has 4. The companion controller can memorize intermediate
stops: 5-1577-C. Each of these are well under $100. www.surpluscenter.com)
=0A=0AHe has a great talent for finding stuff! Thanks Craig - I'll save th
e information if I need another one later. =0A=0AJust to elaborate on what
Craig said - you need to make the linkage so it uses up all of the travel
(I used a 4" actuator) in both directions. Make the linkage adjustable so
you can tweak it once it is installed. It's not that hard to do and I'm r
=0A=0A
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Stut fairings |
Jean- Paul
Just found it....
http://www.ultralightnews.ca/ultralightstore/streamlinedstruts.htm
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 9:27:50 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
jean-paul.roy4@tlb.sympatico.ca writes:
Any link to these plastic struts fairing?
Thanks
Jean-Paul
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: _NYTerminat@aol.com_ (mailto:NYTerminat@aol.com)
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Stut fairings
The ones that a lot of people are using are extruded from plastic, very
lightweight and less than $200.00. They slip over your strut tube.
Bob
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator |
I used a similar actuator and if you open up the housing, you are able to
move the location of he existing micro switches. They are already in place ,
just need to be relocated.
Bob Spudis
N701ZX CH701/912S
In a message dated 11/3/2006 10:15:59 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
taffy0687@yahoo.com writes:
I'll let someone else answer about the limit switches ( I believe they would
work). But, the reason I like the way Scott did his ( build linkage so
full travel is used) is because there are less things that can go wrong (
limit switch coming out of adjustment) or breaking etc.
Fritz
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator |
Jean-Paul:=0A=0AIf you look into this completely I think you will come to t
he same conclusion I did. The unit has internal limit switches. It stops
when reaching the end of travel in both directions. This is perfect since
the limit switches are out of site and never need adjusting. Adding limit
switches just adds complexity and another failure mode. =0A=0AAll you have
to do is design the linkage so that when the actuator extends fully, you ha
ve a fully extended flap. Likewise when the actuator travels the other way
and reaches the limit, the flap is fully retracted. This was very easy to
do and the result is a light, maintenance-free unit. I'm not sure why ZAC
uses the heavy, complex actuator but I spoke to Nick about this some time
ago and he said my system was fine. He indicated that ZAC gets all of thei
r stuff from aircraft suppliers such as Aircraft Spruce and the actuator I'
m using is not in the ACS catalog. =0A=0AI'm not knocking the ZAC system -
it works fine, but if you are plans-building, there are other ways to do i
t.=0A=0AScott Laughlin=0Awww.cooknwithgas.com=0Aworking on BRS final instal
lation details=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Jean-Paul Roy <j
ean-paul.roy4@tlb.sympatico.ca>=0A=0A=0A=0A =0ADIV {=0AMARGIN:0px;}=0A=0A
=0A=0AI'm just thinking out loud here. Would two small =0Alimit swithes cou
ld control the travel lenght?=0A=0A =0A=0AJean-Paul=0A=0A=0A ----- Origina
l Message ----- =0A=0A From: =0A N5SL =0A=0A=0A Hi =0A Fritz:=0A=0AI'd
go with the model number and source Craig Payne =0A posted. (Item# 5-1577
-2 has 2 inches of travel while 5-1577-4 has 4. The =0A companion controll
er can memorize intermediate stops: 5-1577-C. Each of these =0A are well u
nder $100. www.surpluscenter.com)=0A=0AHe has a great talent for finding st
uff! =0A Thanks Craig - I'll save the information if I need another one l
ater. =0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Stut fairings |
You can also get them through Skyshops, I think that these are aluminum, not
sure if they are in stock.
www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm
_http://www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm_
(http://www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm)
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 10:27:14 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
NYTerminat@aol.com writes:
Jean- Paul
Just found it....
http://www.ultralightnews.ca/ultralightstore/streamlinedstruts.htm
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 9:27:50 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
jean-paul.roy4@tlb.sympatico.ca writes:
Any link to these plastic struts fairing?
Thanks
Jean-Paul
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: XL Wingtip trimming |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: <dredmoody@cox.net>
I don't recall having that problem Tim.
Ed Moody II
Do Not Archive
---- Tim Juhl <juhl@avci.net> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Tim Juhl" <juhl@avci.net>
>
> I'm installing the top skin on my right wing and looking ahead at the drawings
I've come up with a couple of questions. 6-W-8 says the top wing skin should
be 3658 mm long while the pre-drilled one that came from ZAC is only 3640.
In addition, when laying out the points used to establish the top cut on the
wing tip 6-W-9 calls for measurements that go up to 580 mm out from the rivet
line on rib 9. Well, the skin only measures 575 mm past the rivet line so I'm
coming up short.... My plans are the most recent and the kit came in May.
Anybody else run into this and what did you do?
>
> Tim
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> ______________
> CFII
> Champ L16A flying
> Zodiac XL - Working on wings
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=71900#71900
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Message 16
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| Subject: | Electric flap actuator |
For those plans builders who wish to retain the Zenith arrangement the
flap actuator is manufactured by Commercial Aircraft Products in Wichita
part no D145-00-36-3 and comes complete with micro switches. I have
just received one which cost $499.90 plus shipping.
Best regards
Malcolm Hunt
CH601XL Plans Builder in England
________________________________
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Big Gee
Sent: 03 November 2006 15:14
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Electric flap actuator
I'll let someone else answer about the limit switches ( I believe they
would work). But, the reason I like the way Scott did his ( build
linkage so full travel is used) is because there are less things that
can go wrong ( limit switch coming out of adjustment) or breaking etc.
Fritz
do not archive
----- Original Message ----
From: Jean-Paul Roy <jean-paul.roy4@tlb.sympatico.ca>
Sent: Friday, November 3, 2006 9:14:35 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Electric flap actuator
I'm just thinking out loud here. Would two small limit swithes could
control the travel lenght?
Jean-Paul
CH701 wings
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: N5SL <mailto:nfivesl@yahoo.com>
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 8:43 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Electric flap actuator
Hi Fritz:
I'd go with the model number and source Craig Payne posted.
(Item# 5-1577-2 has 2 inches of travel while 5-1577-4 has 4. The
companion controller can memorize intermediate stops: 5-1577-C. Each of
these are well under $100. www.surpluscenter.com
<http://www.surpluscenter.com/> )
He has a great talent for finding stuff! Thanks Craig - I'll
save the information if I need another one later.
Just to elaborate on what Craig said - you need to make the
linkage so it uses up all of the travel (I used a 4" actuator) in both
directions. Make the linkage adjustable so you can tweak it once it is
installed. It's not that hard to do and I'm really happy with the way
mine works.
ht==
Your attention is drawn to the fact that this email originated from a
source external to Network Rail.
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Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator |
Actually, there ARE limit switches inside the actuator. They are not meant
to be adjustable, but they are....IF you don't mind doing a little soldering.
They are mounted on a plastic rail and are almost infinitely adjustable. You
may need to lengthen (or shorten) a wire, but the limit switch will just snap
into a new position on the rail. It's actually a very simple operation...but
it will probably void any warranty that comes with the unit.
I am using an actuator similar, if not identical to the one Scott used. It
has a 200 lb force stroke....and moves at about 1/3 inch per second...perfect
for flap control. I used a 9 inch actuator because it was the right length to
fit between the two pivot points. That way I didn't have to fabricate an
extension. Then I adjusted the limit switches so that I am using about the
middle 3 inches of travel.
http://www.firgelliauto.com/product_info.php?cPath=75&products_id=2
(I see they're on sale!)
Dave Harms
videoflyer@aol.com
601XL/Corvair
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Stut fairings |
Thank you kindly Bob.
Jean-Paul
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: NYTerminat@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Stut fairings
You can also get them through Skyshops, I think that these are
aluminum, not sure if they are in stock.
www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm
http://www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 10:27:14 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
NYTerminat@aol.com writes:
Jean- Paul
Just found it....
http://www.ultralightnews.ca/ultralightstore/streamlinedstruts.htm
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 9:27:50 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
jean-paul.roy4@tlb.sympatico.ca writes:
Any link to these plastic struts fairing?
Thanks
Jean-Paul
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Re :701 Stut fairings |
Does any sell the fiberglass fairing that covers the steel gear leg
attachment bracket and the lower end of the struts....... Someone had a
picture of some awhile back of some fiberglass ones. but I have lost the
picture or the link....
That looks like a place that can really save some drag as well......
Monty Graves
At 10:41 AM 11/3/2006 -0500, you wrote:
>
>You can also get them through Skyshops, I think that these are aluminum,
>not sure if they are in stock.
>
>www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm
>
><http://www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm>http://www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm
>
>
>Bob Spudis
>
>
>In a message dated 11/3/2006 10:27:14 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
>NYTerminat@aol.com writes:
>Jean- Paul
>
>Just found it....
>http://www.ultralightnews.ca/ultralightstore/streamlinedstruts.htm
>Bob Spudis
>
>
>In a message dated 11/3/2006 9:27:50 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
>jean-paul.roy4@tlb.sympatico.ca writes:
>Any link to these plastic struts fairing?
>
>Thanks
>
>Jean-Paul
>
>
>
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: XL Wingtip trimming |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "DaveG601XL" <david.m.gallagher@ge.com>
Tim,
I just did my first wingtip trimming and don't remember having any big problems
other than my own skill level not being as good as I would have liked. Is your
skin long enough to reach the ends of the spar tip and rear channel? If they
line up there and you are only 5mm off in the middle I wouldn't see a huge
problem with using your 575mm as the longest point and adjusting the other measurements
slightly to keep as close to the original shape as possible. You make
the tip sheet and angles 6W9-4, -6 and -7 to match anyway.
If your skin is shorter than the sheet metal spar tip and rear channel then you
could either cut them back flush and proportion the skin measurements to match
the longest point or call ZAC for a different solution.
Dave G.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72018#72018
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Message 21
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| Subject: | Electric flap actuator |
One downside to moving the internal limit switches on these units is that
you will no longer have full travel on the internal position sensor. So if
you connect the sensor to a Ray Allen position indicator (or something like
it) you won't be able to drive the indicator across its full range.
Clearly this is a matter of degree. If you use 3 inches of travel of a 4
inch actuator you should get indication across 3/4 of the display. But if
you use 3 inches of a 9 inch actuator you won't get much range at all. Also
the internal position sensor is not present in all models so if you want it
make sure it is called out in the model you order.
-- Craig
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | Have You Tried The New Matronics List Forum? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Hello Listers,
One of the major new additions to the Matronics Email Lists this year was the addition
of a new and full function Forum Web Site at:
http://forums.matronics.com
The best part of these new Forums is that they are tied directly to the Classic
email distribution Lists! That also means that posts go in both directions.
If you post a message on the Forum web site, it will be cross posted to the respective
Email List. And, if you post a message to a particular Email List,
it will be cross posted to the same respective forum on the Forum site!
So, no matter what your content viewing pleasure is - either direct email distribution
or web-based GUI interface, you can have it at the Matronics Email Lists!
Won't you make a Contribution to support these Lists? It is your SOLE Contributions
that make their continued operation and upgrade possible!
The Contribution site is Fast, Easy, and Secure. Please surf over and make your
Contribution today:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Thank you!!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
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Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Free 2D drafting software |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: lnk@iowatelecom.net
I tried to post this sometime back but it seems it never got through for
some reason.
For anyone looking for a CAD tool to help them with building a Zenith the
folks at Unigraphics has recently released their 2D version of Solid Edge
for free download. The package previously sold for $999 USD and includes
some neat features like parametric sketching. Basically this allows you
to sketch a shape and then add and adjust the dimensions later. (Just be
careful to not over constrain the sketched object.)
If interested go to www.solidedge.com/free2d. You will have to give up
contact information to them and you can expect a follow up call.
Full Disclosure: I have not actually loaded the software but someone in
the office where I work has it. My employer also uses the 3D version of
Solid Edge exclusively. I do use a similar product that has an ancestral
link to this product.
Larry K. 601XL
--
When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with
your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will
always long to return.
- Leonardo da Vinci
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Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator-- Push switches???? |
Scott or Craig---- I am getting ready to order the actuator 5-1577-4 and co
ntroller 5-1577-C as recommended below.=0AQuestion: Should I order 3 each o
f the: 11-3064 momentary switches for later installation or is controller a
ll that I'll need for operating the unit.=0A=0AThanks in advance.=0A=0AFri
tz---- 601XL scratch builder--- Corvair-=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A----- Ori
ginal Message ----=0AFrom: N5SL <nfivesl@yahoo.com>=0ATo: zenith-list@matro
nics.com=0ASent: Friday, November 3, 2006 8:43:30 AM=0ASubject: Re: Zenith-
List: Electric flap actuator=0A=0A=0AHi Fritz:=0A=0AI'd go with the model n
umber and source Craig Payne posted. (Item# 5-1577-2 has 2 inches of trave
l while 5-1577-4 has 4. The companion controller can memorize intermediate
stops: 5-1577-C. Each of these are well under $100. www.surpluscenter.com)
=0A=0AHe has a great talent for finding stuff! Thanks Craig - I'll save th
e information if I need another one later. =0A=0AJust to elaborate on what
Craig said - you need to make the linkage so it uses up all of the travel
(I used a 4" actuator) in both directions. Make the linkage adjustable so
you can tweak it once it is installed. It's not that hard to do and I'm r
eally happy with the way mine works. =0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----
=0AFrom: Big Gee <taffy0687@yahoo.com>=0A=0A=0AScott--- Could you please g
ive more information on you electric flap actuator. Price? where you prucha
sed it etc ?=0A =0AThank you=0A =0AFritz 601 XL, 90/90-- Corvair=0A=0A=0A
=============0A=0A
Message 25
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| Subject: | Electric flap actuator-- Push switches???? |
The controller is all you need. You can use external buttons if you can't
fit (or for some reason don't like) the buttons on the controller. The spec
for the controller is at
www.spal-usa.com/actuators/automated/tech_sheets/LA-CONTROLLER.pdf
-- Craig
Message 26
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| Subject: | Electric flap actuator |
>> He has a great talent for finding stuff! Thanks Craig - I'll save the
information if I need another one later.
I think Doug Eatman found Surplus Center and the linear actuators first. I
just saved the link.
-- Craig
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Stut fairings |
I would rather go the aluminum route since the temps here up north
sometime go to -40C and I believe that sort of temps would make the
plastic ones very brittle.
Just a tought
Jean-Paul
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: NYTerminat@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Stut fairings
You can also get them through Skyshops, I think that these are
aluminum, not sure if they are in stock.
www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm
http://www.skyshops.org/Accessories.htm
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 10:27:14 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
NYTerminat@aol.com writes:
Jean- Paul
Just found it....
http://www.ultralightnews.ca/ultralightstore/streamlinedstruts.htm
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 9:27:50 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
jean-paul.roy4@tlb.sympatico.ca writes:
Any link to these plastic struts fairing?
Thanks
Jean-Paul
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Stut fairings |
Hi,
While on the subject of accessories, are there any other companies that offer
products for the 701 other than skyshops?
Thanks,
Ben
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Re :701 Stut fairings |
Monty,
If you find them, please post it. Doesn't the 801 use them??
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 12:04:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
mgraves@usmo.com writes:
Does any sell the fiberglass fairing that covers the steel gear leg
attachment bracket and the lower end of the struts....... Someone had a picture
of
some awhile back of some fiberglass ones. but I have lost the picture or
the link....
That looks like a place that can really save some drag as well......
Monty Graves
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator |
Or use an external position sensor like I did from Ray Allen.
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 12:32:34 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
craig@craigandjean.com writes:
One downside to moving the internal limit switches on these units is that
you will no longer have full travel on the internal position sensor. So if you
connect the sensor to a Ray Allen position indicator (or something like it)
you won't be able to drive the indicator across its full range.
Clearly this is a matter of degree. If you use 3 inches of travel of a 4
inch actuator you should get indication across 3/4 of the display. But if you
use 3 inches of a 9 inch actuator you won't get much range at all. Also the
internal position sensor is not present in all models so if you want it make
sure it is called out in the model you order.
-- Craig
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator |
That makes good sense. Thank Scott
Jean-Paul
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: N5SL
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 10:31 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Electric flap actuator
Jean-Paul:
If you look into this completely I think you will come to the same
conclusion I did. The unit has internal limit switches. It stops when
reaching the end of travel in both directions. This is perfect since
the limit switches are out of site and never need adjusting. Adding
limit switches just adds complexity and another failure mode.
All you have to do is design the linkage so that when the actuator
extends fully, you have a fully extended flap. Likewise when the
actuator travels the other way and reaches the limit, the flap is fully
retracted. This was very easy to do and the result is a light,
maintenance-free unit. I'm not sure why ZAC uses the heavy, complex
actuator but I spoke to Nick about this some time ago and he said my
system was fine. He indicated that ZAC gets all of their stuff from
aircraft suppliers such as Aircraft Spruce and the actuator I'm using is
not in the ACS catalog.
I'm not knocking the ZAC system - it works fine, but if you are
plans-building, there are other ways to do it.
Scott Laughlin
www.cooknwithgas.com
working on BRS final installation details
----- Original Message ----
From: Jean-Paul Roy <jean-paul.roy4@tlb.sympatico.ca>
I'm just thinking out loud here. Would two small limit swithes could
control the travel lenght?
Jean-Paul
----- Original Message -----
From: N5SL
Hi Fritz:
I'd go with the model number and source Craig Payne posted. (Item#
5-1577-2 has 2 inches of travel while 5-1577-4 has 4. The companion
controller can memorize intermediate stops: 5-1577-C. Each of these are
well under $100. www.surpluscenter.com)
He has a great talent for finding stuff! Thanks Craig - I'll save
the information if I need another one later.
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Electric flap actuator |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "TxDave" <dclaytx2@hotmail.com>
Hey Malcolm,
I was lucky and found the exact flap actuator ZAC shows in the plans on ebay. Brand
new, in the box for $45. ZAC has now changed to a linear actuator similar
to the one Scott used. They said the one in the plans was just too expensive.
Dave Clay
Temple, TX
http://www.daves601xl.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72158#72158
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Message 33
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| Subject: | corvair engines available |
Hi List,
I have two dismantled and cleaned up 1965 110 HP vair engines and the latest
WW conversion manual for sale reasonable. Please contact off list or call if you're
interested in one or both. Thanks.
Terry Turnquist
601XL-Plans
St. Peters, MO
314-397-5559
---------------------------------
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: 601 copies or vice versa? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Juan Vega <amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
Just an interesting thought on copying but remember the story of Avid versus KItfox,
the parts were interchangable. When it went before a judge the Judge ruled
in favor of the defendant stating while it is a copy it is not elegal to do
so.
Its a bummer someone took the easy way and copied a good design, but the laws of
economics will ultimately saturate the market for that type of copied product,
and my guess is Zenith will ultimately modify their 701 as a bigger and better
design to sell, rejuvenating the Zenith Product life cycle. Happens will
all successful products out there. Look at the A 320 versus 737 stretch, competition
going on. Mark my words, Zenith will show an updateed "New and Improved"
version if the new copy cats eat into their market share.
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: Ron DeWees <rdewees@mindspring.com>
>Sent: Nov 3, 2006 9:59 AM
>To: zenair <zenith-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 601 copies or vice versa?
>
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: Ron DeWees <rdewees@mindspring.com>
>
>Ron DeWees wrote:
>> Hi Listers,
>> I don't want to jump on the bandwagon for or against Chris with who
>> took whose design, and I sure agree that the Savannah looks a LOT like
>> a 701. I would like to point out something that I don't think I have
>> seen mentioned in the past. I am sure I will be corrected if I am wrong.
>> Chris worked for Robbins Aircraft in France at some point in his
>> early career. One of the planes designed by Robbins was a popular
>> homebuilt called the Bebe Jodel. It was and is a great plane and
>> looks more than a little like the early Heintz CH 100/200, etc
>> planes. Biggest difference is that they were wood and not metal. Even
>> CH's airfoil is from the same NACA family as the Jodel. I have flown a
>> CH 100 that looked almost exactly like the Robbins D9. Take a look
>> at http://www.jodel.com/index.asp?p=d9&themodels. Look at the
>> horizontal and vertical elevator placement, the wing dihedral, and the
>> three view drawings. All quite similar and not common to a lot of
>> other planes. I never heard Robbins talk about infringements of
>> their design. Was Jodel the face that launched a thousand (Heintz)
>> ships? Maybe it's a case of what goes around comes around?
> Before I get jumped and flamed I will point out that I fly a "stock"
>601HDS taildragger that I love and have no interest in modifying for
>pleasure or profit but it's sure not a black and white issue when you
>talk about improvements and change to a design. I guess that's why we
>have so many lawyers.
>> Ron DeWees
>do not archive
>
>
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Message 35
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Juan Vega <amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
You are right. Slats and VGs do two different things. that is why the big jets
have both. Big jets act under diffent sets of aerodynamics than a plane designed
to fly under 18,000 ft.
The slats allow for a more extreme pitch along with the 701's reverse foil tail.
The slat pushes the air over the main foil to create lift at an angle past
normal wing stall, typicaly 15 degrees of pitch past line of air flow. Well past
what a VG can do. VGs work to slow the bufet of the air over the wing, reducing
stall, but hits a limit that a slat alows the wing to go well past.
That is why they call it experimental. My only hope is that they use sound research
instead of the cut and chop and tape and lets see if it works. My guess
is they will have to modify the Horiz, stab to avoid extrem overpitch. The VGs
won't work in the realm of the LE Slat, and could induce a stall at take off,
unless the nose is pitched forward after Vr.
What do I know, enough to be dangerous as my wife says.
Juan Vega
-----Original Message-----
>From: Big Gee <taffy0687@yahoo.com>
>Sent: Nov 3, 2006 7:58 AM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 vs ???
>
>John-- well said and I agree with you-----I don't understand how some folks can
think slats can be REPLACED by VG's and not see the dangerous situation they
are creating. (my opinion)
>
>When I used the word "design", I meant it as: "Chris designed the CH 701 and
CH 601 XL" etc. I din't mean he came up with the idea of stats, high lift wing
etc.
>
>Happy building
>
>Fritz--601XL--90/90----Corvair
>do not archive
>
>
>----- Original Message ----
>From: "JohnDRead@aol.com" <JohnDRead@aol.com>
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Sent: Friday, November 3, 2006 12:26:57 AM
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 vs ???
>
>
>Here is my two cents worth, I think you are confusing "design" with "style". STOL
aircraft are not new as you have pointed out. Never the less Chris Heintz
designed, that's all the little bits in the detail drawings, which is NOT style.
The thread on removing the slats and adding VG's is downright dangerous. If
you study the drawings of the 701's airfoil you will notice that the profile
includes the outline of the slats. The slot in the wing is what creates the high
lift characteristic of the airfoil. Check out Abbot & Von Doenhoff for an explanation
of how slotted airfoils work. Vg's are useful however when added to
a "normal" airfoil and do help with helping the airflow over the wing to stay
attached, it this that helps the airfoil work better. I agree with you that there
are areas of any aircraft that COULD be improved check out the 172's changes
over the years. That the 701 has had so few iterations over a 20 year life
speaks volumes of how good the basic design, not
> "style", is. That is my dollars worth, two cents was not enough!
>
>Reg======================
>
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Message 36
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Juan Vega <amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
the Slat does not create the high lift, the foil shape of the main wingdoes look
at the cord design. the slat force the air over the wing at extreme angles
then is just the leading edge of the foil after that. If you want to create higher
speed on the 701 slat design , look at a book on the pricipals of STOL.
One thing that can be does is a negative (positive degree) flap. Maule has done
a fine job on their Positve flap for cruise design. Would probably add the
10 mph you are looking for.
Juan Vega
-----Original Message-----
>From: JohnDRead@aol.com
>Sent: Nov 3, 2006 12:26 AM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 vs ???
>
>Here is my two cents worth, I think you are confusing "design" with "style".
>STOL aircraft are not new as you have pointed out. Never the less Chris
>Heintz designed, that's all the little bits in the detail drawings, which is NOT
>style. The thread on removing the slats and adding VG's is downright
>dangerous. If you study the drawings of the 701's airfoil you will notice that
the
>profile includes the outline of the slats. The slot in the wing is what creates
>the high lift characteristic of the airfoil. Check out Abbot & Von Doenhoff
>for an explanation of how slotted airfoils work. Vg's are useful however when
>added to a "normal" airfoil and do help with helping the airflow over the
>wing to stay attached, it this that helps the airfoil work better. I agree with
>you that there are areas of any aircraft that COULD be improved check out the
>172's changes over the years. That the 701 has had so few iterations over a
>20 year life speaks volumes of how good the basic design, not "style", is.
>That is my dollars worth, two cents was not enough!
>
>Regards, John Read - working on a CH701
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Message 37
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting@comcast.net>
I don't want to add fuel to the fire, but has anyone put VG's on the main
wing and left the slats on? I don't know if this would even make any
difference. This doesn't really pertain to me since I am building an 801
according to plans. I'm just curious. Maybe someone has asked this before.
do not archive
Dave in Salem
801 with slats
----- Original Message -----
From: "Juan Vega" <amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 vs ???
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Juan Vega <amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
>
> You are right. Slats and VGs do two different things. that is why the big
> jets have both. Big jets act under diffent sets of aerodynamics than a
> plane designed to fly under 18,000 ft.
> The slats allow for a more extreme pitch along with the 701's reverse foil
> tail. The slat pushes the air over the main foil to create lift at an
> angle past normal wing stall, typicaly 15 degrees of pitch past line of
> air flow. Well past what a VG can do. VGs work to slow the bufet of the
> air over the wing, reducing stall, but hits a limit that a slat alows the
> wing to go well past.
>
> That is why they call it experimental. My only hope is that they use
> sound research instead of the cut and chop and tape and lets see if it
> works. My guess is they will have to modify the Horiz, stab to avoid
> extrem overpitch. The VGs won't work in the realm of the LE Slat, and
> could induce a stall at take off, unless the nose is pitched forward after
> Vr.
>
> What do I know, enough to be dangerous as my wife says.
>
> Juan Vega
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Big Gee <taffy0687@yahoo.com>
>>Sent: Nov 3, 2006 7:58 AM
>>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 vs ???
>>
>>John-- well said and I agree with you-----I don't understand how some
>>folks can think slats can be REPLACED by VG's and not see the dangerous
>>situation they are creating. (my opinion)
>>
>>When I used the word "design", I meant it as: "Chris designed the CH 701
>>and CH 601 XL" etc. I din't mean he came up with the idea of stats, high
>>lift wing etc.
>>
>>Happy building
>>
>>Fritz--601XL--90/90----Corvair
>>do not archive
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message ----
>>From: "JohnDRead@aol.com" <JohnDRead@aol.com>
>>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>>Sent: Friday, November 3, 2006 12:26:57 AM
>>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 vs ???
>>
>>
>>Here is my two cents worth, I think you are confusing "design" with
>>"style". STOL aircraft are not new as you have pointed out. Never the less
>>Chris Heintz designed, that's all the little bits in the detail drawings,
>>which is NOT style. The thread on removing the slats and adding VG's is
>>downright dangerous. If you study the drawings of the 701's airfoil you
>>will notice that the profile includes the outline of the slats. The slot
>>in the wing is what creates the high lift characteristic of the airfoil.
>>Check out Abbot & Von Doenhoff for an explanation of how slotted airfoils
>>work. Vg's are useful however when added to a "normal" airfoil and do help
>>with helping the airflow over the wing to stay attached, it this that
>>helps the airfoil work better. I agree with you that there are areas of
>>any aircraft that COULD be improved check out the 172's changes over the
>>years. That the 701 has had so few iterations over a 20 year life speaks
>>volumes of how good the basic design, not
>> "style", is. That is my dollars worth, two cents was not enough!
>>
>>Reg======================
>>
>
>
>
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Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Historic Zenair Zipper for sale |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Peter Chapman <pchapman@ionsys.com>
At 22:56 02-11-06, you wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: MacDonald Doug <dougsnash@yahoo.com>
>
>Isn't the Zipper supposed to have two engines?
I've read there were both one and two engined versions. Not sure if
they corresponded to 1 and 2 seat models or not.
That was all back in the day when Zenair's basic product brochure was
a two sided photocopied sheet with all the different aircraft models,
and the text was full of typos. I sure hoped the planes were less
crude than the marketing. Not sure if they actually were any less
crude (although they were clever in some ways), but at least they
were easily buildable and flyable.
do not archive
Peter Chapman
Toronto, ON
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Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Re :701 Stut fairings |
I don't have some on my 801. I do believe ZAC sells them as an option. I
thought about installing some but I usually have someone helping me pus
h the toy back into the hangar and I am not sure they could stand any ki
nd of abuse. Comments ???
do not archive
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
-- NYTerminat@aol.com wrote:
Monty,If you find them, please post it. Doesn't the 801 use them?? Bob S
pudis In a message dated 11/3/2006 12:04:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
mgraves@usmo.com writes:Does any sell the fiberglass fairing that cover
s the steel gear leg attachment bracket and the lower end of the struts.
...... Someone had a picture of some awhile back of some fiberglass on
es. but I have lost the picture or the link....
That looks like a place that can really save some drag as well......
Monty Graves
========================
========================
========================
========================
======================
<html><P>I don't have some on my 801. I do believe ZAC sells them as an
option. I thought about installing some but I usually have someone helpi
ng me push the toy back into the hangar and I am not sure they could sta
nd any kind of abuse. Comments ???</P>
<P>do not archive<BR><BR><BR>Ben Haas<BR>N801BH<BR>www.haaspowerair
.com<BR><BR>-- NYTerminat@aol.com wrote:<BR></P><FONT id=rol
e_document face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>
<DIV>
<DIV>Monty,</DIV>
<DIV>If you find them, please post it. Doesn't the 801 use them??</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Bob Spudis</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>In a message dated 11/3/2006 12:04:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, m
graves@usmo.com writes:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: b
lue 2px solid"><FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" face=Aria
l color=#000000 size=2>Does any sell the fiberglass fairing that cov
ers the steel gear leg attachment bracket and the lower end of the strut
s....... Someone had a picture of some awhile back of some f
iberglass ones. but I have lost the picture or the link....<
BR><BR>That looks like a place that can really save some drag as well...
...<BR><BR>Monty Graves<BR></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></FONT><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color
=#000000 size=2>
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">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List</A>
========================
===========
</B></FONT></PRE>
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Message 40
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I tried adding reflex [ that is raising the flaps past their normal atti
tude]. The plane flies nose up and you actually lose some speed. At leas
t my 801 does..
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
-- Juan Vega <amyvega2005@earthlink.net> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Juan Vega <amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
the Slat does not create the high lift, the foil shape of the main wingd
oes look at the cord design. the slat force the air over the wing at ex
treme angles then is just the leading edge of the foil after that. If yo
u want to create higher speed on the 701 slat design , look at a book on
the pricipals of STOL. One thing that can be does is a negative (posit
ive degree) flap. Maule has done a fine job on their Positve flap for cr
uise design. Would probably add the 10 mph you are looking for.
Juan Vega
-----Original Message-----
>From: JohnDRead@aol.com
>Sent: Nov 3, 2006 12:26 AM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 vs ???
>
>Here is my two cents worth, I think you are confusing "design" with "s
tyle".
>STOL aircraft are not new as you have pointed out. Never the less Chris
>Heintz designed, that's all the little bits in the detail drawings, whi
ch is NOT
>style. The thread on removing the slats and adding VG's is downright
>dangerous. If you study the drawings of the 701's airfoil you will not
ice that the
>profile includes the outline of the slats. The slot in the wing is wha
t creates
>the high lift characteristic of the airfoil. Check out Abbot & Von Doe
nhoff
>for an explanation of how slotted airfoils work. Vg's are useful howev
er when
>added to a "normal" airfoil and do help with helping the airflow over
the
>wing to stay attached, it this that helps the airfoil work better. I a
gree with
>you that there are areas of any aircraft that COULD be improved check
out the
>172's changes over the years. That the 701 has had so few iterations o
ver a
>20 year life speaks volumes of how good the basic design, not "style",
is.
>That is my dollars worth, two cents was not enough!
>
>Regards, John Read - working on a CH701
========================
===========
========================
===========
========================
===========
<html>I tried adding reflex [ that is raising the flaps past their norma
l attitude]. The plane flies nose up and you actually lose some speed. A
t least my 801 does..<BR><BR><BR>Ben Haas<BR>N801BH<BR>www.haaspowe
rair.com<BR><BR>-- Juan Vega <amyvega2005@earthlink.ne
t> wrote:<BR>--> Zenith-List message posted&nb
sp;by: Juan Vega <amyvega2005@earthlink.net><BR><BR
>the Slat does not create the high li
ft, the foil shape of the main wingdo
es look at the cord design. the 
;slat force the air over the wing at&
nbsp;extreme angles then is just the leadi
ng edge of the foil after that. If&nb
sp;you want to create higher speed on 
;the 701 slat design , look at a 
;book on the pricipals of STOL. One&
nbsp;thing that can be does is a nega
tive (positive degree) flap. Maule has don
e a fine job on their Positve flap&nb
sp;for cruise design. Would probably add&
nbsp;the 10 mph you are looking for.
<BR><BR>Juan Vega<BR><BR>-----Original Message----
-<BR>>From: JohnDRead@aol.com<BR>>Sent: Nov 3, 
;2006 12:26 AM<BR>>To: zenith-list@matronics.com<BR>&g
t;Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 vs ???<BR>><
BR>>Here is my two cents worth, I
think you are confusing "design" with &nbs
p;"style". <BR>>STOL aircraft are not new&nb
sp;as you have pointed out. Never the 
;less Chris <BR>>Heintz designed, that's&nb
sp;all the little bits in the detail
drawings, which is NOT <BR>>style. The
thread on removing the slats and add
ing VG's is downright <BR>>dangerous.
If you study the drawings of the 701'
s airfoil you will notice that the <B
R>>profile includes the outline of the
slats. The slot in the wing is
what creates <BR>>the high lift charac
teristic of the airfoil. Check out Abbot&n
bsp;& Von Doenhoff <BR>>for an exp
lanation of how slotted airfoils work. Vg'
s are useful however when <BR>>added to
a "normal" airfoil and do help 
;with helping the airflow over the <BR>>
;wing to stay attached, it this that
helps the airfoil work better. I agr
ee with <BR>>you that there are a
reas of any aircraft that COULD be im
proved check out the <BR>>172's change
s over the years. That the 701 has&nb
sp;had so few iterations over a <BR>>20
year life speaks volumes of how&nbs
p;good the basic design, not "style", is.&
nbsp;<BR>>That is my dollars worth, tw
o cents was not enough!<BR>> <BR>>Regards
, John Read - working on a CH701<BR><
========================
sp; -- Please Support Your&n
nbsp; (And Get Some AW
is the Annual List Fund Raiser. &nbs
sp; this year's Terrific Free Incentive&n
p; * AeroElectric www.aeroelectric.com,
nbsp; * Aeroware Enterprises www.kitlog.
sp; http://www.matronics.
p; &nbs
p; &nbs
========================
========================
- The Zenith-List Email&nbs
nbsp;List utilities such as the Subscriptions&n
========================
========================
======<BR>
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Message 41
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| Subject: | Re: Re :701 Stut fairings |
Tow bar
In a message dated 11/3/2006 9:39:48 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
n801bh@netzero.com writes:
I don't have some on my 801. I do believe ZAC sells them as an option. I
thought about installing some but I usually have someone helping me push the toy
back into the hangar and I am not sure they could stand any kind of abuse.
Comments ???
do not archive
Message 42
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Ben,
What kind of speed do you get??
How many HP do you have strapped in there?
Bob Spudis
In a message dated 11/3/2006 9:41:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
n801bh@netzero.com writes:
I tried adding reflex [ that is raising the flaps past their normal
attitude]. The plane flies nose up and you actually lose some speed. At least
my 801
does..
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
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