---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 12/03/06: 21 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:18 AM - Re: the Dew Knot Arc syndrome (Edward Moody II) 2. 07:01 AM - Re: 601XL - Engine out / Glide Experience (Gary Boothe) 3. 07:33 AM - Re: N601XT flight photos (LarryMcFarland) 4. 07:46 AM - Fw: Too picky? (Bill Naumuk) 5. 07:54 AM - Re: N601XT flight photos (Bill Naumuk) 6. 07:58 AM - Re: N601XT flight photos (Jeff) 7. 08:47 AM - Re: Zenith-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 12/02/06 (John Anderson) 8. 08:53 AM - Fuel systems (MaxNr@aol.com) 9. 09:28 AM - stick switches and fuel selector valve (john butterfield) 10. 09:42 AM - Re: stick switches and fuel selector valve (Craig Payne) 11. 11:28 AM - Re: stick switches and fuel selector valve (LarryMcFarland) 12. 11:34 AM - 801 Cargo Pod (Dave Ruddiman) 13. 11:42 AM - Re: 601XL - Engine out / Glide Experience (Dave Thompson) 14. 11:53 AM - Re: stick switches and fuel selector valve (Edward Moody II) 15. 04:07 PM - Re: stick switches and fuel selector valve (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com) 16. 04:07 PM - Re: stick switches and fuel selector valve (RURUNY@aol.com) 17. 05:35 PM - Re: stick switches and fuel selector valve (Juan Vega) 18. 05:45 PM - Re: Fw: Too picky? (Tim & Diane Shankland) 19. 06:37 PM - Re: N601XT flight photos (Brandon Tucker) 20. 09:49 PM - 701 POH (Tebenkof@aol.com) 21. 10:24 PM - Re: 701 POH (Dave Ruddiman) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:18:57 AM PST US From: "Edward Moody II" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: the Dew Knot Arc syndrome Yep Zed, I agree. We have to hope that the rest of the world does descend into the dementia that consumes the American court system such that everybody who gets his or her feelings hurt or offended is devastated by the experince and requires some restitution. I get ticked off about something almost every day but I haven't asked for or received any compensation for it. Sort the wheat from the chaff and all that. Here's to brotherhood, thick skin (not to mention my thick head), and a hearty Hi Ho Do Not Archive!!!! The lone builder rides again, Ed ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:01:07 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601XL - Engine out / Glide Experience Dave, Ditto....Bill talked me into scratch building after I had purchased tail and wing kits. I am saving thousands of $$ just on the Center Section! The best part though, there is ENORMOUS satisfaction from making every part! Good luck with your project, Gary Boothe Cool, CA 601 HDSTD, WW Conversion 90% done, Tail done, wings done, working on c-section Bill Naumuk wrote: Dave- Scratch build. Ask around the list- sooner or later, you wind up scratch building something anyway, so don't use lack of funds as an excuse. You're not the first! For a couple hundred bucks worth of sheet stock, you can build your stab. At least you're making progress!..... Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa Dave Thompson dave.thompson@verizon.net Westminster, CA 601XL rudder workshop, Corvair engine in parts and no money for a ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:33:55 AM PST US From: LarryMcFarland Subject: Re: Zenith-List: N601XT flight photos Congratulations Brandon, You're going to be an easy one to see with that paint scheme. Nice airplane. Well done. Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com Brandon Tucker wrote: > Gents, > > For those interested, I put some pictures on the net of my flight > this week. The thumbnails go to slightly larger pics. > > http://mcgirt.net/~ars2006/ars2006/Desktop.html > > > VR/ > > Brandon Tucker > > > Do not archive > > * > ================================ > > * ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:46:16 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Zenith-List: Fw: Too picky? > Carlos- > I found that premade flannel bonnets work much better than anything > else with my rotary polisher and the rough grits. Now I'm down to the > final S compound and flannel tucked in under the elastic of a wool bonnet > and there are certain spots that defy a final shine. The flannel loads up > in no time, too. I scrap bonnets/swatches when they load up- Ma won't hear > of putting them in HER washing machine! Contamination? After the C stage, > I wiped the surface down with alcohol and paper towels to remove the > excess. > I'm starting to wonder if my problem is temperature related. My shop is > heated with a ventless propane garage heater, but I'm reluctant to leave > it burning when I'm not working. Maybe the aluminum is still cold-soaked > even though the ambient temperature is comfortable. > Have you noticed anything temperature related? I'll admit that with > hunting season, getting ready for winter, and routine maintenance around > the house I haven't been able to get my 13hrs a week in on the project but > I've been polishing the C section since October! > Bill Naumuk > HDS Fuselage > Townville, Pa > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Carlos Sa" > To: "Bill Naumuk" > Sent: Saturday, December 02, 2006 10:38 PM > Subject: Re: Too picky? > > >> Hello, Bill >> >> >> I think I went through that myself, but it was due to my specific working >> conditions and method: >> When I was using aluminum polishing compounds, the compound used on the >> first pass left behind >> deposits of very fine material (much like sand), and when I used the >> compound for finishing, >> since I was working on a flat, horizontal surface, I picked up those >> deposits, and nasty swirls >> ensued. >> >> In another occasion (using the famous Mother's paste), I was using cheap >> paper towels, and those >> were messing my finish. I learned my lesson, and now only use "expensive" >> paper towels. >> >> So, in your case, I would look for (a) contamination or >> (b)imperfections/roughness on the buffer >> material itself (terry cloth bonnets? wool? felt?). You may need to >> experimet with different >> buffer on a test piece... >> >> Of course, there is the remote chance that you are pickier than I am... >> ;-) >> >> Seriously, I hope this gives you some idea where to look for a fix. >> >> Cheers >> >> Carlos >> >> --- Bill Naumuk wrote: >> >>> Carlos- >>> I can't seem to get the finish I want. I'm directly under >>> fluorescent lights and I wonder >>> if I'm not overdoing it. I'm to the point where I'll be polishing right >>> through the skin if I'm >>> not careful, and still can't get rid of the scratches. >>> Thoughts? >>> Bill Naumuk >>> HDS Fuselage >>> Townville, Pa >> >> >> __________________________________________________ >> http://mail.yahoo.com >> > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:54:45 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: N601XT flight photos Brandon- Love the paint job. Do not archive Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Brandon Tucker To: zenith-list@matronics.com ; corvaircraft@mylist.net Sent: Saturday, December 02, 2006 10:54 PM Subject: Zenith-List: N601XT flight photos Gents, For those interested, I put some pictures on the net of my flight this week. The thumbnails go to slightly larger pics. http://mcgirt.net/~ars2006/ars2006/Desktop.html VR/ Brandon Tucker Do not archive ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:58:18 AM PST US From: "Jeff " Subject: RE: Zenith-List: N601XT flight photos Brandon, It takes a special person to paint flames on their airplane! Great looking job! Jeff Davidson do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of LarryMcFarland Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2006 10:32 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: N601XT flight photos Congratulations Brandon, You're going to be an easy one to see with that paint scheme. Nice airplane. Well done. Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com Brandon Tucker wrote: > Gents, > > For those interested, I put some pictures on the net of my flight > this week. The thumbnails go to slightly larger pics. > > http://mcgirt.net/~ars2006/ars2006/Desktop.html > > > VR/ > > Brandon Tucker > > > Do not archive > > * > ================================ > > * ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:47:14 AM PST US From: "John Anderson" Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 12/02/06 Hi Folks, I am compelled to comment on Zed Smith's post on the 12/02 list digest. Mark Twain could not have stated it better! Well done Zed! John Xl w/0235 will fly before year end Do not archive ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:53:38 AM PST US From: MaxNr@aol.com Subject: Zenith-List: Fuel systems Do not archive The following "stream of consciousness" may have a germ of info for those with time to read it. Its sunday. I'm bored. It deals with turbine helicopter systems that I have known: Sikorsky 76 and Bell UH1-212-412-214ST. Type cetification: Sikorsky certified in FAA NE region. Required seperate tanks to isolate possible fuel contamination in any tank. Bell certified in the SW region. FAA SW didnt care about this. Tanks/cells: Sikorsky has two 141.5 gal TANKS, one for each motor. Mechanical fuel valves with cross feed. Bells have one filler into a big common fuel cell that that trickle down to series of 4 to 8 (depending on type,variant) cells under cabin floor. Left cells direct to no.1 engine, right for no.2. An elec. operated valve can be used to open an interconnect in bottom cells when level below 400 lbs. Elec operated on-off valves. Gauges: Sikorsky has one per tank. Capacitance with float type low level warning L/R. Bell has one gauge for the whole mish-mash, capacitance, with float type low level warn. Left and right. Pumps: Sikorsky uses engine driven pumps to start with JET INDUCERS for each engine to supplement the engine driven. Each jet inducer has a branch to the other eng and can feed both if an eng driven pump fails. Jet ind sort of like a venturi. Bell uses submerged boost pumps in lower cells. Both systems lift fuel about 5 feet to the engine driven pumps. If any Bell looses a boost pump, a 6,000 ft ceiling is imposed. You can guess why. A Sikorsky can fly up to its max allow. alt of 15,000 ft. with only jet ind. Fuel flow for both runs 300 to 450 lbs/hour, more with one eng inop. Two very different systems as a result of two FAA regions that type certified them. Parts some time break in Bells and poor lower vents slow refueling. Both very dependable. Both are certified in transport catagory FAR part 29. I've taken too much of your time. My XL will have single elec pump ahead of the gascolator and 3 position valve. do not archive Bob Dingley XL- rudder- Lyc ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:28:42 AM PST US From: john butterfield Subject: Zenith-List: stick switches and fuel selector valve hi list i am trying to decide what switches are really useful on the stick. i am going to use a radio transmit switch and perhaps an elevator trim. are they hard to wire, ect helpful hints are requested also, after looking at my fuel selector valve, it comes with loose screws and there is a reference to greasing the o-ring inside. i tried to pull the nozzle pieces out, but they are in very tight and i don't want to force them if no grease is necessary. the valve is the one supplied with the kit as for our English friend, remember the level of acrimony is inversely related to the level of intelligence of the poster. john butterfield 601XL, corvair torrance, ca ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:42:02 AM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: stick switches and fuel selector valve Some have an "Ident" button for their transponder on the stick. I assume they fly in controlled airspace a lot. -- Craig ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:28:02 AM PST US From: LarryMcFarland Subject: Re: Zenith-List: stick switches and fuel selector valve Hi John, There's a tendency to put switches at the fingertips, but I'd resist more than the transmit switch for the control stick. Trim is a once or twice issue during flight and would place second to transmit activities. The prospect of chasing a broken wire in the control stick after the airworthiness is also a much larger problem if an when it happens. The idea of mixing wires to multifunction switches in the stick are best left to the computer joystick where you can set at a table to fix the errant connection. Being upside down in a 601 isn't a pretty picture. Recommendation is to keep it simple and put your trim switches on the panel near the throttle and the remaining switches in an order that can be memorized easily. I used colored shrink tubing to differentiate pumps from aux battery, the EIS and so forth. The o-ring is fuel proof, was probably greased before assembly and likely will not leak the first 10 years. Being in an aircraft probably suggested long term maintenance. I'd not try to get to it unless it becomes a problem or at least call the manufacturer for tech support. Best regards, Larry McFarland at www.macsmachine.com john butterfield wrote: > > hi list > i am trying to decide what switches are really useful > on the stick. i am going to use a radio transmit > switch and perhaps an elevator trim. are they hard to > wire, ect helpful hints are requested > > also, after looking at my fuel selector valve, it > comes with loose screws and there is a reference to > greasing the o-ring inside. i tried to pull the > nozzle pieces out, but they are in very tight and i > don't want to force them if no grease is necessary. > the valve is the one supplied with the kit > > as for our English friend, remember the level of > acrimony is inversely related to the level of > intelligence of the poster. > > john butterfield > 601XL, corvair > torrance, ca > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 11:34:29 AM PST US From: "Dave Ruddiman" Subject: Zenith-List: 801 Cargo Pod Hello Fellow 801 Builders, (you other guys too) Is the cargo pod I've seen pictures of a custom made installation or are there plans somewhere. I'm not sure if I would need one but there is probably mounting reinforcements that need to be installed in case I decided to. Dave in Salem ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 11:42:48 AM PST US From: "Dave Thompson" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601XL - Engine out / Glide Experience Steven & list, At the time I did not understand his methodology. Now, as an adult, I admire it. Someone mentioned spin training. We also got out of the C150 and performed some spins in a Citabria, also for some tail dragger time. His idea of unusual attitude training was almost inverted, almost in a stall. Another note is that he stressed "aircraft management", such as fuel and flaps. He would not allow me to use the "Both" position on the fuel selector. His reasoning was to make SURE that I was always aware of all my "assets" switching back and forth between the tanks to maintain trim. Everything he did was at the extreme edge. Every flight was task intensive so I would become comfortable with multi-tasking. I truly hope that I will remember my training when I get current again after my 25-years of not flying. I hope to find another "crusty old marine" when I start to become current again. I was never in military service (bad knees) but I do salute all our men & women in uniform, both now and in the past. P. S. Buck, rest his soul, was a WWII Corsair driver in the Pacific, later an F86 & F4 instructor. Boy, did he have some stories! Steven wrote: Being a retired Marine, I know about your training - especially if that Marine was a pilot from the WWII-mid Viet Nam era. We Marines understand how important it is to accomplish the mission with skill, knowledge, decisiveness, morality and ethics. Failure to teach new pilots how to fly the airplane above all else will deny them all of these things - putting their lives in more jeopardy than necessary. Glad you got the Marine ride. Dave Thompson dave.thompson@verizon.net Westminster, CA Do not archive ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:53:43 AM PST US From: "Edward Moody II" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: stick switches and fuel selector valve I've had a five button Ray Allen grip on the front stick in an ultralight for 3.5 years without any trouble. I will use a seven buttom version on my left stick and a one button grip on the right stick in my 601XL. The PTT at the 'trigger" position is not one that is easily accidentally activated unless you tend to be a bit clutzy. The elevator and aileron trim button are easy to access and completely intutitve to use. During the progress of a flight I change the trim as the fuel burn changes the CG and as speed changes as well. I expect the same to be true in the 601XL. In addition, I expect to use aileron trim to counter fuel use from the wing tanks. Since the Zodiac is a lot faster and more comfy than the UL, I expect to fly farther and longer on X-C flights. Because of that, I will have the transceiver frequency toggle function and the x-ponder Ident function wired to buttons on the left stick too. These grips are not terribly difficult to wire, they don't screw up in my experience, and the convenience is something I want to have. If you have room on the panel for trim switches and don't mind reaching there for those functions, keep your stick grip simple..... you can even put your ptt buttom there. If you like convenience, get the button-infested type of grip. I like the convenience. Ed Moody II Rayne, LA 601XL/Jabiru/baggage area ----- Original Message ----- From: john butterfield To: Zenith-List Digest Server Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2006 11:28 AM Subject: Zenith-List: stick switches and fuel selector valve hi list i am trying to decide what switches are really useful on the stick. i am going to use a radio transmit switch and perhaps an elevator trim. are they hard to wire, ect helpful hints are requested also, after looking at my fuel selector valve, it comes with loose screws and there is a reference to greasing the o-ring inside. i tried to pull the nozzle pieces out, but they are in very tight and i don't want to force them if no grease is necessary. the valve is the one supplied with the kit as for our English friend, remember the level of acrimony is inversely related to the level of intelligence of the poster. john butterfield 601XL, corvair torrance, ca ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 04:07:08 PM PST US From: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: stick switches and fuel selector valve I also have the Allen 5 button handle grip on the CIP (left) side with only a PTT button on the right side grip. Dual sticks. The wires are all very fine size and need a protective sleve especialy at the bottom of the sticks. The only recomendation I can make is that I wish I had installed a connector at the bottom of each stick to make removing the sticks easier. Anytime you have to do anything behind the pannel or down at the brakes the stick has to come out to gain access. I did not install a connector when I built and it has been an issue getting "down under." I really like having the four trim buttons on the stick because I don't have to look away from flying or changes my hands to tune the flight. Best regards, Bill of Georgia 601xl - 3300 100 hours ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 04:07:33 PM PST US From: RURUNY@aol.com Subject: Zenith-List: Re: stick switches and fuel selector valve I have a PTT Elevator trim up trim down Radio Memory select on right Freq flip from stby to active on left The radio buttons on stick can be changed to an aileron trim easily if I add it later. The right part of the Y stick just gets a PTT. Brian 701 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 05:35:29 PM PST US From: Juan Vega Subject: Re: Zenith-List: stick switches and fuel selector valve PTT and trim if desired. Pain with all the wiring, I am just doing PTT on stick and trim buttons by the throttle. Juan -----Original Message----- >From: john butterfield >Sent: Dec 3, 2006 12:28 PM >To: Zenith-List Digest Server >Subject: Zenith-List: stick switches and fuel selector valve > > >hi list >i am trying to decide what switches are really useful >on the stick. i am going to use a radio transmit >switch and perhaps an elevator trim. are they hard to >wire, ect helpful hints are requested > >also, after looking at my fuel selector valve, it >comes with loose screws and there is a reference to >greasing the o-ring inside. i tried to pull the >nozzle pieces out, but they are in very tight and i >don't want to force them if no grease is necessary. >the valve is the one supplied with the kit > >as for our English friend, remember the level of >acrimony is inversely related to the level of >intelligence of the poster. > >john butterfield >601XL, corvair >torrance, ca > > > > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 05:45:35 PM PST US From: Tim & Diane Shankland Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Fw: Too picky? Bill, I don't think you have a temperature problem I did my wings in the unheated attic of my garage in February. They were on the floor and I worked around them with pads on my knees. It was below freezing during part of that time. Tim Shankland Bill Naumuk wrote: > > >> Carlos- >> I found that premade flannel bonnets work much better than >> anything else with my rotary polisher and the rough grits. Now I'm >> down to the final S compound and flannel tucked in under the elastic >> of a wool bonnet and there are certain spots that defy a final shine. >> The flannel loads up in no time, too. I scrap bonnets/swatches when >> they load up- Ma won't hear of putting them in HER washing machine! >> Contamination? After the C stage, I wiped the surface down with >> alcohol and paper towels to remove the excess. >> I'm starting to wonder if my problem is temperature related. My >> shop is heated with a ventless propane garage heater, but I'm >> reluctant to leave it burning when I'm not working. Maybe the >> aluminum is still cold-soaked even though the ambient temperature is >> comfortable. >> Have you noticed anything temperature related? I'll admit that >> with hunting season, getting ready for winter, and routine >> maintenance around the house I haven't been able to get my 13hrs a >> week in on the project but I've been polishing the C section since >> October! >> Bill Naumuk >> HDS Fuselage >> Townville, Pa >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carlos Sa" >> To: "Bill Naumuk" >> Sent: Saturday, December 02, 2006 10:38 PM >> Subject: Re: Too picky? >> >> >>> Hello, Bill >>> >>> >>> I think I went through that myself, but it was due to my specific >>> working conditions and method: >>> When I was using aluminum polishing compounds, the compound used on >>> the first pass left behind >>> deposits of very fine material (much like sand), and when I used the >>> compound for finishing, >>> since I was working on a flat, horizontal surface, I picked up those >>> deposits, and nasty swirls >>> ensued. >>> >>> In another occasion (using the famous Mother's paste), I was using >>> cheap paper towels, and those >>> were messing my finish. I learned my lesson, and now only use >>> "expensive" paper towels. >>> >>> So, in your case, I would look for (a) contamination or >>> (b)imperfections/roughness on the buffer >>> material itself (terry cloth bonnets? wool? felt?). You may need to >>> experimet with different >>> buffer on a test piece... >>> >>> Of course, there is the remote chance that you are pickier than I >>> am... ;-) >>> >>> Seriously, I hope this gives you some idea where to look for a fix. >>> >>> Cheers >>> >>> Carlos >>> >>> --- Bill Naumuk wrote: >>> >>>> Carlos- >>>> I can't seem to get the finish I want. I'm directly under >>>> fluorescent lights and I wonder >>>> if I'm not overdoing it. I'm to the point where I'll be polishing >>>> right through the skin if I'm >>>> not careful, and still can't get rid of the scratches. >>>> Thoughts? >>>> Bill Naumuk >>>> HDS Fuselage >>>> Townville, Pa >>> >>> >>> >>> __________________________________________________ >>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>> >> > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 06:37:32 PM PST US From: Brandon Tucker Subject: Zenith-List: RE: N601XT flight photos If only the plane was as fast as it looks! The guys around here tease me about the flames, but hell, my 4 year old is impressed... I put a couple of hours on the plane today after tinkering with the carburetor and swapping out the temperature sender. The oil temp never broke 200 on climb out, and was between 180 and 190 the whole flight. CHT's were actually a little cool at cruise, until I leaned out the carburetor a bit. I have to adjust it for tomorrow's flight. It is flying very well so far. I'll get some better performance numbers after I wear-in the engine. R/ Brandon --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 09:49:59 PM PST US From: Tebenkof@aol.com Subject: Zenith-List: 701 POH Any kind soul out there who can steer me to an appropriate model for the POH for my 701? The building work is just about done. I just woke up the fact that the paper work is not. Jim Greenough 701 / 99.5321% complete in Portland OR ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 10:24:36 PM PST US From: "Dave Ruddiman" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 POH Hi Jim, I don't have a POH for a 701 since I'm building an 801. Just curious, where in Portland are you? I'm in Salem. Dave DO NOT ARCHIVE ----- Original Message ----- From: Tebenkof@aol.com To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2006 9:48 PM Subject: Zenith-List: 701 POH Any kind soul out there who can steer me to an appropriate model for the POH for my 701? The building work is just about done. I just woke up the fact that the paper work is not. Jim Greenough 701 / 99.5321% complete in Portland OR ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.