---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 12/16/06: 36 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:46 AM - The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel (Frank Derfler) 2. 05:30 AM - Re: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? (Clyde Barcus) 3. 05:42 AM - Re: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? (Terry Turnquist) 4. 06:30 AM - Re: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? (Juan Vega) 5. 06:32 AM - Re: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel (Juan Vega) 6. 06:37 AM - Re: Landing Lights (Paul Mulwitz) 7. 06:39 AM - Re: Re:Storage of components (Juan Vega) 8. 06:41 AM - Re: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? (Robin Bellach) 9. 06:45 AM - Re: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? (Edward Moody II) 10. 06:48 AM - Re: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel (Edward Moody II) 11. 06:49 AM - Re: propellors (Paul Mulwitz) 12. 07:05 AM - Re: Re: vg's (Noel Loveys) 13. 07:10 AM - FAR quesion on major mod (PHFD400@aol.com) 14. 07:10 AM - Re: Landing Lights (Bryan Martin) 15. 07:27 AM - Re: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? (PatrickW) 16. 08:28 AM - 701 slats needed (ricklach) 17. 08:34 AM - 701 tooling (ricklach) 18. 08:38 AM - Re: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? (Tim Juhl) 19. 09:13 AM - Re: Storage of components (Bill Naumuk) 20. 09:16 AM - Re: Tools (Bill Naumuk) 21. 10:34 AM - Re: FAR quesion on major mod (n282rs@earthlink.net) 22. 10:59 AM - Re: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel (JOHN STARN) 23. 11:04 AM - Re: propellors () 24. 11:59 AM - () 25. 11:59 AM - Re: Re:Storage of components (Juan Vega) 26. 01:05 PM - Re: Storage of components (Dave Ruddiman) 27. 01:58 PM - Fw: Shipping (Bill Naumuk) 28. 02:45 PM - Re: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel (xl) 29. 03:12 PM - Corrosion Protection (Ryan Vechinski) 30. 03:51 PM - Re: Corrosion Protection (Bruno) 31. 04:24 PM - tail dragger (Carlos Sa) 32. 04:52 PM - Re: Landing Lights (billmileski) 33. 05:49 PM - Re: Corrosion Protection (Dave Ruddiman) 34. 06:11 PM - Re: Taildragger (Brandon Tucker) 35. 07:29 PM - Re: Re: Landing Lights (Bryan Martin) 36. 08:24 PM - Re: Re: Taildragger (Carlos Sa) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:46:37 AM PST US From: "Frank Derfler" Subject: Zenith-List: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel Here is the mystery. This is a brand new airplane. AMD-manufacturerd CH601XL with all new everything and 20 hours on the Hobbs. It has never been fed anything other than blue 100LL. The fuel samples from each wing tank are always blue and have never shown any water or strange stuff. But, the fuel samples from the Gasloator are always unmistakably Yellow. Oh, and the engine always roars sweetly. Does anyone know definitively what's going on? My theory is that the brass/copper alloy gasolator, being new, is giving some color to the fuel sitting in it. (Yes, as I'm writing this I realize that I should check the sample color right after flying... thus the value of public confession. Although... I have pulled as many as 5 sample tubes of fuel from the Gasolator during pre-flight and they were all yellow.) Has anyone else experienced the yellow tinge? Frank Derfler N183AM See my views and reviews at www.derfler.biz See my information for pilots at www.flyinflorida.com ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:30:01 AM PST US From: "Clyde Barcus" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? I bought a good hand riveter at the auto parts store and the domed nose piece that came with the riveter I bought from ZAC are interchangeable. Clyde 601XL ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 8:23 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? > > Patrick, I also found the stainless steel rivets hard to pull. However, I > bought a puller at Ace Hardware with a swiveling head ("Ace" brand) that I > have used a lot more than the puller from ZAC. It was still a tough > squeeze, but it worked. You will have to grind the nose pieces to make > the domed heads on the rivets, but that is not a major job. Just heat > them cherry red and when they are cooled, shape them with a Dremel tool. > > Jay in Dallas > Do not archive > > "PatrickW" wrote: > >> >>What are you guys using to pull the Stainless Steel rivets...? >> >>The pneumatic riveter that comes with the tool kit says to not use it on >>Stainless Steel rivets. The instructions even show a picture of a broken >>rivet gun. >> >>The hand riveter doesn't have enough "bite" to grip and pull on them >>beyond setting them (it works fine on regular A4 & A5 rivets, so I know >>it's not broken). >> >>What *really* works on these things...? What have others actually done >>here...? >> >>Right now I've got an elevator horn attached with a couple of stainless >>steel "nails" sticking out of it... :( >> >>Thanks, >> >>- PatrickW >> >> >> >> >>Read this topic online here: >> >>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=81826#81826 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:42:31 AM PST US From: Terry Turnquist Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? I'm using 601 XL Plans that are three years old. I haven't seen a call for SS rivets yet. Tail feathers, wings almost done. Please list areas that designate SS rivets besides firewall. Thanks. Terry Turnquist 601XL-Plans St. Peters, MO xl wrote: I literally had to stand on my hand riveter to pull the A5's. It did keep working for awhile. I wore out 2 hand riveters. I did pull all my rivets by hand. Joe E N633Z @ BFI CH601XL, 410 hours Jabiru 3300, Sensenich 64x49 wood prop On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, PatrickW wrote: > What are you guys using to pull the Stainless Steel rivets...? > .........snip > Thanks, - PatrickW do not archive __________________________________________________ ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:30:23 AM PST US From: Juan Vega Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? in the newletter, one gent used and hand riveter with a clamp attached to handles. he turned the clamp screw, squeezing the rivet . I used handle riveter. just take it slow. Juan -----Original Message----- >From: Terry Turnquist >Sent: Dec 16, 2006 8:42 AM >To: zenith-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? > >I'm using 601 XL Plans that are three years old. I haven't seen a call for SS rivets yet. Tail feathers, wings almost done. Please list areas that designate SS rivets besides firewall. Thanks. > > Terry Turnquist > 601XL-Plans > St. Peters, MO > >xl wrote: > > >I literally had to stand on my hand riveter to pull the A5's. >It did keep working for awhile. I wore out 2 hand riveters. >I did pull all my rivets by hand. > >Joe E >N633Z @ BFI >CH601XL, 410 hours >Jabiru 3300, Sensenich 64x49 wood prop > > >On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, PatrickW wrote: > >> What are you guys using to pull the Stainless Steel rivets...? >> .........snip >> Thanks, - PatrickW >do not archive > > > __________________________________________________ ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:32:28 AM PST US From: Juan Vega Subject: Re: Zenith-List: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel the yellow may be water collecting in the gascolator. the engine will run because the screen will not allow the water to go to the engine. the little doohiccy is doing its job. Juan -----Original Message----- >From: Frank Derfler >Sent: Dec 16, 2006 7:45 AM >To: zenith-list@matronics.com >Subject: Zenith-List: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel > >Here is the mystery. > >This is a brand new airplane. AMD-manufacturerd CH601XL with all new >everything and 20 hours on the Hobbs. It has never been fed anything other >than blue 100LL. The fuel samples from each wing tank are always blue and >have never shown any water or strange stuff. But, the fuel samples from the >Gasloator are always unmistakably Yellow. Oh, and the engine always roars >sweetly. > >Does anyone know definitively what's going on? My theory is that the >brass/copper alloy gasolator, being new, is giving some color to the fuel >sitting in it. (Yes, as I'm writing this I realize that I should check the >sample color right after flying... thus the value of public confession. >Although... I have pulled as many as 5 sample tubes of fuel from the >Gasolator during pre-flight and they were all yellow.) > >Has anyone else experienced the yellow tinge? > >Frank Derfler N183AM >See my views and reviews at www.derfler.biz >See my information for pilots at www.flyinflorida.com ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:37:29 AM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Landing Lights Hi Bill, I opted for navigation lights and strobes but no landing lights for my XL even though I cannot legally fly at night. I hold a private license and have had adequate night flying training and experience, but plan to operate under Sport Pilot limitations so I don't have to fight for a "Special Issuance" medical certificate. I believe the landing light is not required by any regulation for night operations. It may have value - primarily in daylight flight - for collision avoidance, but in my humble experience is mostly worthless for use in the dark. My personal thinking is that while I will not plan for night operation I might get caught with a late landing and want the minimum lighting for legal flight at night. I think that is the navigation lights, and the strobes just make sense even if they are not actually required. If I get caught making a night landing with my Sport Pilot restrictions, then I guess I will face the music. Best regards, Paul XL fuselage do not archive At 04:24 PM 12/12/2006, you wrote: >Brad- > Good tip. > I don't fly at night much but figured, as many other builders > have, that having my project night capable would increase the > resale value. Custom built the installation in my HDS (Following > Jeff Small's recommendation to try and counteract the left turning > tendancy) by putting as much dead weight in the RIGHT wing. I'm not > the first to do this. > Just dug out the receipts for my bulbs. $12.54 each at Car Care. > Add the hardware and everything else and I might have $50.00 in my > installation. 'Course you could buy a C-152 for what it cost if you > count my time (Even at minimum wage) but the personal satisfaction > is priceless!!! > Do not archive >Bill Naumuk >HDS Fuselage >Townville, Pa --------------------------------------------- Paul Mulwitz 32013 NE Dial Road Camas, WA 98607 --------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:39:40 AM PST US From: Juan Vega Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re:Storage of components what i rad is that planes have various metals touching at any given point, (screws, bolts, chrome molly, aluminum, etc. protecting the skin from water is not so much an issue as protecting from electrolysis. that is why we paint zince between pieces, and use cadmium washeers with screws and bolts. In st. petersburg FLA where we live, we have salt water on the air field. we primed the entire plane in and out. we alos painted light grey the entire interior. Aluminum 6061 has good anti corrosion properties and under normal weqar and tear wilkl protect itself, we at the waters edge need a little help. Juan -----Original Message----- >From: Edward Moody II >Sent: Dec 15, 2006 7:12 PM >To: zenith-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re:Storage of components > >It depends on location. Some of us live close to salt water and/or have average 75% relative humidity. With that much moisture availabe in the air and the aluminum changing temperature repeatedly, there is plenty of opportunity for the bare aluminum to frequently have a wet surface. Other locales are more fortunate, I'm sure. > >Ed Moody II >Rayne, LA > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Aaron Gustafson > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 3:21 PM > Subject: Zenith-List: Re:Storage of components > > > I just took the tail parts of my 601 out of storage in my garage attic after 8 years with no protection at all and except for needing to wash off the dust and mouse /flying squirrel crap they are just fine. If they don't get wet why should they need other protection? > > Aaron Gustafson do not archive ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:41:46 AM PST US From: "Robin Bellach" <601zv@ritternet.com> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? For one, 14 AS5 required for attachment of SS Piano Hinge to Toe Brake Pedals and Rudder Pedals (per 601XL 6-B-9 Revision 04/04). Robin in AR N601ZV ----- Original Message ----- From: Terry Turnquist To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2006 7:42 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? I'm using 601 XL Plans that are three years old. I haven't seen a call for SS rivets yet. Tail feathers, wings almost done. Please list areas that designate SS rivets besides firewall. Thanks. Terry Turnquist 601XL-Plans St. Peters, MO ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:45:46 AM PST US From: "Edward Moody II" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? Better check that.... I have two hand pullers and two pneumatic pullers and none of them interchange. Ed Moody II ----- Original Message ----- From: L. Kilburg To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 10:28 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? You should not have to heat the mandrels before grinding with a Dremel (or any other grinding tool). Heat is only required if you machine them. But better yet, just unscrew the mandrels from the air riveter and screw them into the hand riveter, most are interchangeable. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:48:28 AM PST US From: "Edward Moody II" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel Someone's probably peeing in your gascolator. The good news is apparently the engine loves it. Sorry, I couldn't resist, Ed Do Not Archive nor Eat The Yellow Snow ----- Original Message ----- From: Frank Derfler To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2006 6:45 AM Subject: Zenith-List: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel Here is the mystery. This is a brand new airplane. AMD-manufacturerd CH601XL with all new everything and 20 hours on the Hobbs. It has never been fed anything other than blue 100LL. The fuel samples from each wing tank are always blue and have never shown any water or strange stuff. But, the fuel samples from the Gasloator are always unmistakably Yellow. Oh, and the engine always roars sweetly. Does anyone know definitively what's going on? My theory is that the brass/copper alloy gasolator, being new, is giving some color to the fuel sitting in it. (Yes, as I'm writing this I realize that I should check the sample color right after flying... thus the value of public confession. Although... I have pulled as many as 5 sample tubes of fuel from the Gasolator during pre-flight and they were all yellow.) Has anyone else experienced the yellow tinge? ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:49:48 AM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: propellors One factor with prop length doesn't seem to have surfaced in the latest discussion. That is the fact that the propeller is mounted in front of the fuselage. The airflow from the central portion of the propeller is blocked by the front of the fuselage, so this is mostly wasted energy. A longer propeller has less of its rotation disk blocked by the fuselage, so more of the energy spent by the engine is converted to thrust. An extreme case of adding shorter blades would have all the airflow generated by the propeller disrupted by the fuselage and a plane that could barely taxi. Paul XL fuselage do not archive At 10:59 AM 12/14/2006, you wrote: >Bill, my original thinking was as follows: There are some neat >engines out there, but they run at high RPM. High RPM could push the >prop tip speed close to Mach 1, thereby reducing efficiency a great >deal. A shorter blade lets the tip move slower, keeping it in the >efficiency range, but you lose lift (thrust) with smaller wing >(blade) area. To compensate, then, why not have more blades, with >wider chord, sort of the reason some very mean acro ships are >biplanes, with tremendous lift. (The AN-2 springs to mind.) However, >more blades mean more weight, so you would have to compensate by >making them very light, possibly hollow. I suggest it could be done, >but it likely isn't coming out of someone's garage. A high-tech prop >manufacturer might have the answer. I don't. But it makes my brain itch. > >Paul Rodriguez >601XL/Corvair >(and probably with WW's two-bladed prop) - ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:05:40 AM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: vg's No doubt about the fact that any change to the aerodynamics of an aircraft is reason to have to fly off the test phase again and probably trigger another inspection. The main problem may well be legal, as you said the original builder is responsible for the airworthiness of the plane...... even after it is sold.... possibly sold several times. Gary Wolf, president of the RAA (Recreational Aircraft Association) asked the question, "How would you feel if a plane you built were used for training purposes after being sold?"? Remember you would have no control over how the plane is used or maintained. You do however still have the responsibility of the original builder. Noel -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of R.D.(Ron) Leclerc Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 7:28 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: vg's Noel I agree... this is for the Canadain guys wanting to remove there slats only! This is a direct quote below from... COPA's -- "COPA Guide to Amature-Built Aircraft"... in Canada Under - Reviewing The Rules - CAR STD 507 Appendix C .... The only thing is if Transport Canada's final inspection and approval was with the Slats on then it looks like they should be informed otherwise you would be flying illegal and if something should happen... that's where insurance companies will get a little excited about! Design Changes Many builders of amateur-built aircraft incorporate changes in the aircraft they are building, whether the aircraft is being built from kits or plans. One of the great advantages of the amateur-built category is that this is allowed. It is up to builder to decide whether the changes are warranted and how they will be carried out. Both the CARs and the courts have been clear that when the aircraft is completed it is the builder who is responsible for the airworthiness of the aircraft, not the original designer or the manufacturer of the kit from which it was constructed. This is a good thing as it allows the builder to make changes, but it carries with it the responsibility to do a good job in making changes to a design. Ensure you know what you are doing as you will be solely and legally responsible for the outcome! If you are not confident in your abilities as a designer then get professional help from the original designer or an aeronautical engineer. Otherwise don't make the changes to the design, especially when they involve changes to the structure. There should be no confusion where the responsibilities are before the build and after the build after reading the above... the key word's are "Ensure you know what you are doing" Ron Leclerc Winnipeg,MB On Tue, 12 Dec 2006 21:58:29 -0330, Noel Loveys wrote: > Mark: > I don't' think you would have problems removing the slats to get > the plane passed the MD-RA I've seen greater design changes made > to aircraft that passed. Remember the paper work on W&B needs to > reflect the airplane without the slats. The configuration is > almost considered normal in other countries with no known problems > and some of those countries have a relatively similar level of > legislation controlling aircraft authority for flight. Now if the > 701's with the slats off were falling like flies in the Raid > factory you would no doubt have problems. > You are dead right on one point and that has to do with anyone > wanting to register their plane AULA. No changes from the letter > of conformity are allowed. If the plans call for a placard against > chewing gum it better be there. I'll bet you are right on the > insurance issue of calling it a CH701 too but there wouldn't be > anything wrong with a JD701 (John Doe 701) > On the use of VGs These little devices are used on all kinds of > certified aircraft. Their placement is usually determined by wind > tunnel testing. Their effectiveness when properly installed is > proven. The operative words are, "properly installed". > Considering that no one here will be hitting mach 1 I would think > that if someone installed the VGs and did the appropriate envelope > testing at altitude their use should be safe. A word of caution, > the handy man's secret weapon will probably shoot down your plane. > My question still stands: the CH701 is noted for poor glide ratio. > does removing the slats improve the glide ratio. > Noel > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com >> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of >> ZodieRocket Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 10:07 AM To: zenith- >> list@matronics.com Subject: Zenith-List: Re: vg's >> >> >> >> >> >> OK, will do! It doesn't matter if the plane fly's better with the >> slats >> or without. But in America and Canada lets just see how fast the >> insurance companies bail on your ass for removing a flying >> surface that >> the designer says should be there. Regardless of any situation >> that may >> involve the NTSB removal of the slats called forth by the >> designer would >> be written in as a contributing factor( likely even if you ran >> out of gas), in which the builder removed before flight and once >> again have fun >> with AVEMCO or any other insurance dealer. Also since you have >> experimented and removed the slats the designer called for then >> you have >> made a structural change and can no longer call it a 701, once >> again enjoy your insurance company when you tell them this is a >> one off. If you're Canadian, I doubt your 701 would pass an >> inspection for the MD-RA >> to get it's flight authority and if you register as an AULA you >> are not allowed to remove anything from the plans. >> >> I can't comment on the pro's of VG's, I know a lot of people have >> made money selling them. I also know that until the designer >> states that the >> design requires VG's they will never see my plane. >> >> As for reported testing having been done. I don't dispute there >> figures >> but I do caution most to consider this. I have a 701 close to me >> that cruises at 85mph, and another with the same engine that >> cruises at 105 at the same power setting. Difference is that the >> builder of the second >> 701 streamlined the struts, cleaned up the cowling, adjusted so >> that the >> stabilizer is on correctly with flight checks. There were no >> major modifications just common sense clean up and he is cruising >> his 701 at 5 >> MPH below the Vne! The Recreational Flyer magazine article that >> shows this comparison is on the Zenith website. >> >> Personal outlook only. You can add whatever you want to your 701, >> remove >> what you want from your 701, and believe in anything you want! >> But I will not be removing my slats! I do not plan on cruising >> ANY plane at or >> near Vne. I'm quite happy with a 701 that can cruise at 95mph >> with a Rotax 912S I believe that this is well within reach of >> anyone who has built a straight 701 and will now spend the time >> to clean it up. You want an instant 5mph in your 701? Call Zenith >> and order the new FWF. As >> a bonus your fuselage will be quieter from the less vibration >> passed on >> by the new engine mount. Another 5mph can be gained by taking a >> piece of >> .016 and wrapping your struts into a streamline airfoil. I'm not >> going to risk an insurance company telling me that I don't have >> coverage after >> I hit a deer on the runway when the NTSB states that I have >> removed a portion of flying surface! >> >> You folks that have gone through all the hassle of removing the >> slats and adding Vg's good for you, your courage deserves >> applause. But when it comes to the 701 if the owner is not >> getting over 75mph cruise with a >> 912, then they need to spend time fixing what they have wrong, >> not throw >> parts away! ( well maybe the prop) For those who have a 701 >> flying at 100mph cruise or higher, why would you want to be that >> close to Vne all the time? >> >> Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario >> Zodiac 601XL C-GOXL, CH701 just started >> www.ch601.org / www.ch701.com / www.Osprey2.com -----Original >> Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com >> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of >> secatur Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 6:09 AM To: zenith- >> list@matronics.com Subject: Zenith-List: Re: vg's >> >> >> >> Well, I guess I'll just have to change my mind and build the >> slats and throw these VG's away ! >> 1700+ hours of independant, documented testing WITHOUT 1 negative >> report ain't gonna convince me! >> And when my 701 is finished I will park it right next to my >> Wright Flyer, and my Model T ford (Black of course!) right under >> the big sign that says "EXPERIMENTAL..do not change or alter >> ever...or else!!" >> >> ps: Can somebody please post some BAD results with VG's instead >> of Slats .... so I can feel justified?? >> >> Wowie Zowie ! >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p961#80961 >> >> >> -- >> 12/11/2006 >> >> >> -- >> 12/11/2006 >> >> >> -- >> 12/11/2006 >> >> >> ========== >> >> This Month -- >> Get Some AWESOME FREE Gifts!) >> >> on >> about >> provided >> >> HREF="file://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com >> HREF="file://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com >> HREF="file://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com >> HREF="file://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com >> >> >> HREF="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/ >> contribution >> >> >> bsp; -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >> >> ========== >> Zenith-List Email Forum - the Matronics List Features Navigator >> to browse many List utilities such as the Subscriptions page, >> Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, >> and much much more: >> HREF="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith- >> List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List >> ========== >> >> >> Fund Raiser. style="font-size:9pt;"> >> Builder's style="font-size:9pt;"> >> -> http://www.matronics.com/contr />>> your generous style="font-size:9pt;"> >> ===== />>> The style="font-size:9pt;"> >> Features Navigator to browse />>> the style="font-size:9pt;"> >> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List _- >> ========= ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:10:28 AM PST US From: PHFD400@aol.com Subject: Zenith-List: FAR quesion on major mod Does anyone know what FAR reg deals with major modifications to an Experimental? I sure could use some help. I have several feelers out, but thought I would contact the list for your input. I have finished my 601HDS Spring Gear conversion. As some of you may remember, I had a weld failure on the left main at the bottom plate that attached to the 2 inch tube. I decided rather than reinstall the same type gear, I went with the spring gear from Grove aircraft. I have completed the project and have done my new weight and balance, and completed several high speed taxis along with lifting if off the runway and back down several times, and so far so good. So my question is: what paperwork do I need to complete, do I need to have a DAR reinspect it, or can I make the notations in the logs, is there another Phase I flight testing and for how long? Anyway, if anybody knows what FAR reg deals with that, please let me know, cause I'm getting many different opinions. Thanks for your help Jim Olson Murphy, NC CH01HDS, N56BJ 288 hrs ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:10:32 AM PST US From: Bryan Martin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Landing Lights According to the FARs: Anti-collision lights (strobes) are required on all aircraft, day or night. Nav lights are only required from sunset to sunrise. A landing light is only required on aircraft operated for hire. A landing light is not really required for landing on a lighted runway. I've landed without a landing light several times, mostly because the cowl mounted landing lights tended to have a short service life and would often quit unexpectedly. Landing lights are good for alerting you to deer on the runway though, they're very hard to see otherwise. On Dec 16, 2006, at 9:37 AM, Paul Mulwitz wrote: > > I opted for navigation lights and strobes but no landing lights for > my XL even though I cannot legally fly at night. > > I believe the landing light is not required by any regulation for > night operations. It may have value - primarily in daylight flight > - for collision avoidance, but in my humble experience is mostly > worthless for use in the dark. > > I think that is the navigation lights, and the strobes just make > sense even if they are not actually required. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive. do not archive. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:27:21 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? From: "PatrickW" OK Guys - I got it. Here's the solution. Short Version: Unscrew the nose piece "a little bit". This allows the hand riveter to "bite" onto a different section of the shaft. This worked for me. Long Version: I carefully measured the length of the rivet shaft that was still sticking out. I then pumped the hand riveter 300 (three hundred!) times. It felt like I was getting just a hair's worth of "bite" at the end of each stroke, so I kept going - thinking that I was getting it very slowly. Then I measured the length of the protruding shaft. No change! But I did notice some small metal "filings" in the area. Something was wearing down someplace. I twisted the hand riveter around to "get a different angle" on the rivet, and the very firt pull "felt different". But then all the subsequent pulls felt the same as before. I realized at that point I might as well have been trying to squeeze a watermelon seed. But I knew what the problem was at that point. I took the nosepiece out of the riveter and looked inside to see how it worked. I needed to be able to "bite" onto a different section of the rivet shaft each time. I simply unscrewed the nosepiece a little bit and gave it a try. What do you know - it worked! 2 pulls later I heard a resounding BANG and the Stainless Steel rivets were installed. :D Tail section done. On to the Wings... Thanks everyone, - PatrickW Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=81910#81910 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 08:28:15 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: 701 slats needed From: "ricklach" For all you guys out there taking off your slats and going to VG's thats great. I am rebuilding a crashed 701 and I'm in need of a set of good slats. I would like to try things out with the slats first. After that I might take them off and see how it works. So please e-mail me or call me if you have a set you would like to sell. Rick 661-345-7755 or rick@ravengear.us Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=81922#81922 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 08:34:47 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: 701 tooling From: "ricklach" I am rebuilding a crashed 701 and I'm looking for tooling to get the job done. Anyone done with thier 701 and has any jig's and/or tooling that are now collecting dust in the corner I need your help. If you have any tooling you can now live without please contact me. Rick 661-345-7755 or rick@ravengear.us Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=81924#81924 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 08:38:56 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Pulling Stainless Steel Rivets? From: "Tim Juhl" Hmmm..... not knowing any better, I just used the pneumatic puller that I bought from Mark and David at CAN-ZAC when I took their rudder workshop. It came from a Canadian outfit called Princess Auto. It didn't break and I've pulled a lot of rivets since. Maybe I just got lucky. BTW - The first place you use SS rivets is on a strap that is associated with the elevator horn. Tim -------- DO NOT ARCHIVE ______________ CFII Champ L16A flying Zodiac XL - Working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=81927#81927 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 09:13:30 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Storage of components Dave- I didn't have problems with completed assemblies- they're stored in a rollaway crade I made out of an old entertainment center. Where I did have problems was with sheet stock stored against an outside wall. Even though my basement is heated and has a dehumidifier, I wound up with significant corrosion by the time I got around to using those components. My advice is to "Rotate your stock". Move your large sheet components every so often to prevent corrosion. Good building! Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave Ruddiman To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 5:39 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Storage of components Hi Ben, I don't know about anyone else, but I am planning on painting my components with epoxy primer tinted to the approximate finish color. It will give my an idea of what the plane will look like when it's done and if I don't paint it right away it will last for quite awhile until I do. Plus it will be primed between all the parts. Using epoxy means it will take a little sanding and scuffing to apply the top coat, but it's all dooable. Some will not agree, some will, but I don't care because it's my plane and that's the beauty of it. I can do what ever I want. I already know the pros and cons of doing this. I have been around painting for 30+ years. I don't know everything, but I do know a lot about this. Plus I have done a little research. Good Luck Dave in Salem - where the wind finally died down. 801 ----- Original Message ----- From: PipercubDream@aol.com To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 10:08 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Storage of components I'm sure this has been touched on before but I was curious about the storage of completed components. After I finish my tail kit and I'm working on the other pieces and parts should I apply some kind of protective coating to the exposed aluminum? I have a dry basement/storage/winter workshop area and I can see a couple of years ahead of building and assembly. I plan of painting my ch 701 and had thought of simply applying primer after each completed part. Thanks.....Ben do not archive href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 09:16:38 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Tools Dennis- I'll be surprised if you get a positive response. Do a good job of on-line shopping. I've seen used tools advertised on E-Bay that were listed for more than you could buy them form new. Many times! Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Wieck" Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 8:20 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Tools > > I am just getting ready to start building my 601XL. Anybody that has > finished theirs interested in selling their tools? > Do not archive > > Dennis > dwieck@bellsouth.net > > > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 10:34:51 AM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: FAR quesion on major mod From: n282rs@earthlink.net I don't know which FAR, but you can usually find the requirement listed on your operating limitations. When I changed engine types, I filled out a new Airworthiness Application and sent it along with a letter explaining what I was doing to the local FSDO. In the letter tell them a little about the mod, and explain what you plan on doing for testing. Leave your contact information so they can call if they need more information. One thing that I wish I had done was send the letter "return receipt" as I have no record of them receiving it. Randy Stout >>Does anyone know what FAR reg deals with major modifications to an Experimental? ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 10:59:30 AM PST US From: "JOHN STARN" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel I couldn't resist either..... Ed, some may rate your humor as a ten others only as a 2 or 3 BUT "Your an 8". Do Not Archive... KABONG 8*0 ----- Original Message ----- From: Edward Moody II To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2006 6:48 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel Someone's probably peeing in your gascolator. The good news is apparently the engine loves it. Sorry, I couldn't resist, Ed Do Not Archive nor Eat The Yellow Snow ----- Original Message ----- From: Frank Derfler To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2006 6:45 AM Subject: Zenith-List: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel Here is the mystery. This is a brand new airplane. AMD-manufacturerd CH601XL with all new yellow.) Has anyone else experienced the yellow tinge? ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 11:04:08 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: Zenith-List: propellors Neat explanation, Bryan. I guess I'll stick with WW's prop on my corva ir. (unless I borrow my friend's dragster engine, modify the cowling, mount and firewall, get bigger landing gear, carve eight humongous hol es in the top of the cowling, .....hhmmmm)=0A=0APaul Rodriguez =0ADO NOT ARCHIVE=0A ----- Original Message ----- =0A From: Bryan Martin =0A To: zenith-list @matronics.com =0A Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 1:09 AM=0A Subject: Re: Zenith-List: propellors =0A=0A=0A The more blades you have the less the overall effi ciency of the prop becomes. Each blade sees a bit of flow disruption f rom the blade leading it. The biggest reason for going with more blade s is to allow the allow more power to be converted to thrust by the pr op. That's why you often see high powered turbofans turning props with as many as seven blades. With all that power available, the lower eff iciency is acceptable. If you don't have a lot of power available, the loss of efficiency of multiple bladed props can become a big deal. =0A=0A=0A The most efficient propellor is one with a single blade with a mass counter balance. There are a few motor gliders that use this configuration to squeeze every bit of thrust they can from a small, light-weight engine.=0A=0A=0A Another reason to go wi th more blades is that the more blades you have the higher the frequen cy of the noise generated by the propellor. Higher frequencies tend to dissipate more quickly over distance, resulting in a quieter airplane =0A=0A=0A If you are running a direct drive engine at a rel atively high RPM, you have to use a small diameter prop to avoid exces sively tip speeds and you may need more blades to get acceptable thru st, but you will pay a penalty in propellor efficiency. =0A=0A =0A=0A=0A=0A On Dec 14, 2006, at 1:59 PM, > > wrote:=0A=0A=0A Bill, my original thinking was as f ollows: There are some neat engines out there, but they run at high R PM. High RPM could push the prop tip speed close to Mach 1, thereby re ducing efficiency a great deal. A shorter blade lets the tip move slow er, keeping it in the efficiency range, but you lose lift (thrust) wit h smaller wing (blade) area. To compensate, then, why not have more bl ades, with wider chord, sort of the reason some ...=0A=0A=0A_ -======================= ======================= e Builder's Bookstore www.buildersbooks.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re:Storage of components quite true, the paint does not stick where corrosion X has been sprayed in the past. Juan -----Original Message----- >From: MaxNr@aol.com >Sent: Dec 15, 2006 2:26 PM >To: Zenith-List@matronics.com >Subject: Zenith-List: Re:Storage of components > >Do not archive >If you you prime with ZINC PHOSPHATE, you must apply top coat within four >hours. according to label. I've got some Cortec on the way to (hopefully) get >around this. Just wondering: Would a semi-annual coat of WD-40 and bubble wrap >work? I've been told by another sadder but wiser builder that if you ever apply >a corrosion blocker (ACF-50,Corrosion-X etc) to any surface, forget about >painting it latter. I have no personal info on this item and I am only rumor- >mongering. > >Bob D. >XL-lyc-rudd&eng mt ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 01:05:39 PM PST US From: "Dave Ruddiman" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Storage of components I had a similar problem by leaving my wing parts in the box outside and covered up. Enough moisture got in so that any metal sheets touching were corroded. I sanded it off and primed it, but I have been more careful since then. Dave ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Naumuk To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2006 9:12 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Storage of components Dave- I didn't have problems with completed assemblies- they're stored in a rollaway crade I made out of an old entertainment center. Where I did have problems was with sheet stock stored against an outside wall. Even though my basement is heated and has a dehumidifier, I wound up with significant corrosion by the time I got around to using those components. My advice is to "Rotate your stock". Move your large sheet components every so often to prevent corrosion. Good building! Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave Ruddiman To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 5:39 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Storage of components Hi Ben, I don't know about anyone else, but I am planning on painting my components with epoxy primer tinted to the approximate finish color. It will give my an idea of what the plane will look like when it's done and if I don't paint it right away it will last for quite awhile until I do. Plus it will be primed between all the parts. Using epoxy means it will take a little sanding and scuffing to apply the top coat, but it's all dooable. Some will not agree, some will, but I don't care because it's my plane and that's the beauty of it. I can do what ever I want. I already know the pros and cons of doing this. I have been around painting for 30+ years. I don't know everything, but I do know a lot about this. Plus I have done a little research. Good Luck Dave in Salem - where the wind finally died down. 801 ----- Original Message ----- From: PipercubDream@aol.com To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 10:08 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Storage of components I'm sure this has been touched on before but I was curious about the storage of completed components. After I finish my tail kit and I'm working on the other pieces and parts should I apply some kind of protective coating to the exposed aluminum? I have a dry basement/storage/winter workshop area and I can see a couple of years ahead of building and assembly. I plan of painting my ch 701 and had thought of simply applying primer after each completed part. Thanks.....Ben do not archive href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 01:58:59 PM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Zenith-List: Fw: Shipping Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Naumuk Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2006 4:55 PM Subject: Re: Shipping Ron- Finally received my package FedEx today- 9 days after I ordered it!!! For this service, you charge me $11.32 for a 2lb package. My suggestion is that in the future you find out how many deadbeats are aircraft owner/builders. I'd hazard a guess at none. Hopefully this posting will encourage your company to make an exception for homebuilders. I for one am so disgusted that given a chance, I'd never order from your company again. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Naumuk To: ronblackink@earthlink.net Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 6:30 PM Subject: Re: Shipping Ron- In my case there's an easy solution. UPS bends over backwards to accomodate their customers in this area but FedEx seems to consider us a PIA. I've never had a problem with UPS but get screwed by FedEx 75% of the time. My suggestion is to modify your website to allow customers to choose their shipper. I vote for UPS. Thanks for following up. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Ronald Black To: Bill Naumuk Cc: Bob McHugh ; Clifford Lester Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2006 6:34 PM Subject: RE: Shipping Bill, I checked with Brooklyn about your shipment. Unfortunately, we have lately had a fairly serious problem with folks claiming that "...never received the shipment of polish, materials, (or whatever,) so could we please send them again?" Fed Ex UPS et. al. say they have delivered. so we have no recourse except to replace it ($$) and pay for the shipping, too. We're looking for a better answer, but this signature requirement is all we have to use right now. Do you have another address, -a friend in a business, or a neighbor who is home, who would receive shipments for you when you are not available? -Ron ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Naumuk To: ronblackink@earthlink.net Sent: 12/13/2006 2:48:11 PM Subject: Shipping Ron- Since I never did receive a response from the request I made to the factory, I figured you were the best recourse. Why in the heck did Nuvite ship FedEx with a requirement for signed receipt from an adult?? I only ordered a couple of bonnets! I don't get home from work until 5:30, and the tag on the front door said FedEx had tried to deliver twice- at 11:30 AM. I called FedEx, and they said that I could request Saturday delivery- no specified time. Two weeks from Christmas and I have to hang around the house all day Saturday to get a couple of bonnets I should have had left at my front door yesterday?? If I'm not around when they deliver Saturday, they're returning the bonnets to you!! Needless to say, my frustration is reaching the breaking point. I've been pissing around since October trying to get 1 panel polished via the Nuvite system, and am still sitting on my hands. Any help with the brass is appreciated. Thanks. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 02:45:39 PM PST US From: xl Subject: Re: Zenith-List: The Puzzle of the Yellow Fuel The fuel pulled from my gasolator was discolored for awhile after I started flying 633Z. I didn't note when the yellow to dark yellow color went away, I haven't seen it for 1++ years. I attributed the color to leaching of the rubber fuel lines. Easy to test - put some fuel in a new line, plug the ends, and check for color in a week or two. If you don't have rubber lines check for other sources that could leach. Joe E N633Z @ BFI CH601XL, 412 hours Jabiru 3300, Sensenich 64x49 wood prop On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Frank Derfler wrote: > This is a brand new airplane. AMD-manufacturerd CH601XL with all new > everything and 20 hours on the Hobbs. It has never been fed anything other > than blue 100LL. The fuel samples from each wing tank are always blue and > have never shown any water or strange stuff. But, the fuel samples from the > Gasloator are always unmistakably Yellow. Oh, and the engine always roars > sweetly. > .................snip > Has anyone else experienced the yellow tinge? > Frank Derfler N183AM ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 03:12:39 PM PST US From: Ryan Vechinski Subject: Zenith-List: Corrosion Protection I see from reading some of the other subjects (i.e. storage of components) that there might be some problems with paint sticking where there is corros ion protection. I am using zinc chromate to protect my plane. Am I going to have problems with paint sticking to these parts? If so I'll be more careful where my zinc chromate ends up (i.e. nothing on outside surfaces) Ryan ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 03:51:25 PM PST US From: "Bruno" Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Corrosion Protection Here there are a lot of useful articles: http://www.eaa1000.av.org/technicl/corrosion/corridx.htm Bruno ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 04:24:17 PM PST US From: "Carlos Sa" Subject: Zenith-List: tail dragger Hello, all I am presently assembling the outboard panels of my 601-HD, which I have always thought would have tricycle gear. But, for some reason (food poisoning, alignment of planets, subliminal messages, global warming, God knows) I have been thinking about a tail dragger configuration. I know this is a good topic to start a 3-week long thread, but the issue is too old for this. All I'd like to know is what are the changes/pitfalls in the construction? I know it gets some simplification by deleting the nose gear - but then you add a tail wheel. If I recall well, the main gear is installed between nose ribs, so that's probably the only pieces that go to waste: 4 nose ribs. My spar is already built, but I am guessing it requires no changes. Anyway, I'll order the TD plans on Monday. Even if I decide against it, it's only $25. And, btw, how many TD owners/builders subscribe to this list? Please respond to this particular question directly to me: carlossa51@gmail.com Cheers Carlos Montreal, Canada ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 04:52:30 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Landing Lights From: "billmileski" 91.209 Aircraft lights. No person may: (a) During the period from sunset to sunrise (or, in Alaska, during the period a prominent unlighted object cannot be seen from a distance of 3 statute miles or the sun is more than 6 degrees below the horizon) (1) Operate an aircraft unless it has lighted position lights; (2) Park or move an aircraft in, or in dangerous proximity to, a night flight operations area of an airport unless the aircraft (i) Is clearly illuminated; (ii) Has lighted position lights; or (iii) is in an area that is marked by obstruction lights; (3) Anchor an aircraft unless the aircraft (i) Has lighted anchor lights; or (ii) Is in an area where anchor lights are not required on vessels; or (b) Operate an aircraft that is equipped with an anticollision light system, unless it has lighted anticollision lights. However, the anticollision lights need not be lighted when the pilot-in-command determines that, because of operating conditions, it would be in the interest of safety to turn the lights off. > According to the FARs: Anti-collision lights (strobes) are required > on all aircraft, day or night. Per (b) above it looks like anticollision lights must be on if the aircraft has them. But not all aircraft are required to have them. Certainly this would keep the no-electrical-system crowd in their hangars even during the day. Bill Mileski Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=82007#82007 ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 05:49:42 PM PST US From: "Dave Ruddiman" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Corrosion Protection Ryan, I'm using Zinc Chromate on the interior parts. I don't worry about overspray to the outside. In fact, I sometimes lay one skin on top of another to prime the inside of the skins. I'll just scotchbrite it off or use lacquer thinner to remove it. I think what everyone is talking about is Corrosion X or similar corrosion proofing for interior parts. I used some on some parts that got on a few exterior pieces. I just cleaned it off before priming and have had no problems. After all the **** that goes on on this list I will deny any of this information and suggest you don't use it without advise from legal counsel. Dave in Salem Please DO NOT ARCHIVE for any reason. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ryan Vechinski To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2006 3:11 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Corrosion Protection I see from reading some of the other subjects (i.e. storage of components) that there might be some problems with paint sticking where there is corrosion protection. I am using zinc chromate to protect my plane. Am I going to have problems with paint sticking to these parts? If so I'll be more careful where my zinc chromate ends up (i.e. nothing on outside surfaces) Ryan ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 06:11:36 PM PST US From: Brandon Tucker Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Taildragger Carlos, I tried e-mailing this to your address, but it returned. So here it is for all to read... Carlos, I recently finished my HDS taildragger. I did not, however, use the standard bungee cord gear. I fabricated and installed an aluminum spring gear. I don't believe that the main gear installation would be any more difficult to install forward of the spard rather than aft. Due to the curvature of the nose ribs and LE skin, this area is much stronger than aft of the spar, and lends well to gear installation. The tailwheel installation is pretty straightforward. Once you receive the plans from ZAC, you will see that there are basically 2 4130 components to fabricate / purchase from ZAC. I have a plasma cutter and welder, so building the pieces was very easy, probably less than a day of fabrication. If you did not read my post a couple of weeks ago regarding the Matco tailwheel and leaf spring, look into the archives. The price is right, and makes installation a snap. I chose conventional gear because I fly tailwheel aircraft comercially, and simply have an affinity for them. The Zodiac behaves reasonably well, as far as taildraggers go, with the rudder effective enough to handle significant crosswinds. My first high speed taxis and short flights down the runway were in a 15 knot crosswind, and while it was a bit squirley, it was not a problem. Make sure that if you do not have a good amount of tailwheel time, you get some under your belt before test flying your aircraft. Bottom line - taildraggers just look cooler. :) (Opinion - don't start flaming!) http://mcgirt.net/~ars2006/ars2006/Desktop.html R/ Brandon __________________________________________________ ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 07:29:54 PM PST US From: Bryan Martin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Landing Lights According to the EAA, the minimum equipment rule (91.205) applies to standard category aircraft but not experimental category, so homebuilts aren't required to have strobes for day VFR. However, the homebuilt Operating Limitations require you to comply with this rule for night flight. So if you have strobes they generally have to be on, but if you won't be flying your homebuilt after sunset, you don't need to install strobes, but if your homebuilt was built recently. On Dec 16, 2006, at 7:51 PM, billmileski wrote: > > > 91.209 Aircraft lights. > No person may: > > > (b) Operate an aircraft that is equipped with an anticollision > light system, unless it has lighted anticollision lights. However, > the anticollision lights need not be lighted when the pilot-in- > command determines that, because of operating conditions, it would > be in the interest of safety to turn the lights off. > > >> According to the FARs: Anti-collision lights (strobes) are required >> on all aircraft, day or night. > > > Per (b) above it looks like anticollision lights must be on if the > aircraft has them. But not all aircraft are required to have them. > Certainly this would keep the no-electrical-system crowd in their > hangars even during the day. > > Bill Mileski > -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive. do not archive. ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 08:24:37 PM PST US From: "Carlos Sa" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Taildragger Hi, Brandon Obviously I can't type worth a rat's tail... My address is carlossa52@gmail.com (not "51").* * It seems that the actual construction of the TD option is not a problem. What may end up being a show stopper is (1) insurance, given I have no TD time at this point and (2) getting TD time: the two airports within 30 min driving have no TDs for rental/instruction... Bummer Thanks for your comments Carlos CH601-HD, plans Assembling wings. * * On 16/12/06, Brandon Tucker wrote: > > Carlos, > > I tried e-mailing this to your address, but it returned. So here it > is for all to read... > > Carlos, > > I recently finished my HDS taildragger. I did not, however, use > the standard bungee cord gear. I fabricated and installed an aluminum > spring gear. I don't believe that the main gear installation would be > any more difficult to install forward of the spard rather than aft. > Due to the curvature of the nose ribs and LE skin, this area is much > stronger than aft of the spar, and lends well to gear installation. The > tailwheel installation is pretty straightforward... > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.