---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 01/22/07: 29 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:25 AM - Re: Off topic, kinda on topic (noel anderson) 2. 02:16 AM - Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techniques ? Etc. (Lone00Star@aol.com) 3. 02:37 AM - Re: I give up! (secatur) 4. 04:47 AM - Re: Annual Inspections (steveadams) 5. 07:12 AM - Re: Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techn (Gig Giacona) 6. 07:12 AM - Re: Wing Spar Assembly Drawing 6W3, number of hat stiffeners ? (Maarten Versteeg) 7. 07:20 AM - Re: I'm visiting Toronto (Ron Lalonde) 8. 07:48 AM - Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers (4rcsimmons@comcast.net (Rich Simmons)) 9. 08:05 AM - Re: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers (Gig Giacona) 10. 08:56 AM - Re: Re: Wing Spar Assembly Drawing 6W3, number of hat stiffeners ? (Paul Mulwitz) 11. 08:56 AM - Re: Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techniques (T. Graziano) 12. 08:58 AM - Re: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers (Paul Mulwitz) 13. 09:23 AM - Re: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers (David Austin) 14. 09:28 AM - Re: Re: Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techniques (David Austin) 15. 09:37 AM - Re: Re: Annual Inspections (David Downey) 16. 10:54 AM - Re: More questions (LarryMcFarland) 17. 01:04 PM - Re: More questions (Bryan Martin) 18. 01:13 PM - 701 wing orientation - front-to-back (Harrison-Hutcheson) 19. 02:14 PM - 701 wing mis-information (Zed Smith) 20. 03:30 PM - Re: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers (ALAN BEYER) 21. 03:38 PM - Re: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers (Bill Naumuk) 22. 03:42 PM - Re: Re: I give up! (Bill Naumuk) 23. 05:10 PM - Re: 701 wing mis-information (Robert Schoenberger) 24. 07:25 PM - Re: More questions (JohnDRead@aol.com) 25. 07:54 PM - Re: Re: Re: Electronic Headsets.. (Tim Shankland) 26. 08:27 PM - Re: More decisions about buying the Rotax 912 for my 701 (Dave Ruddiman) 27. 10:50 PM - Re: More questions (JG) 28. 10:56 PM - Re: More decisions about buying the Rotax 912 for my 701 (Gary Gower) 29. 11:11 PM - Handheld GPS? (Lind, Per) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:25:06 AM PST US From: "noel anderson" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Off topic, kinda on topic MessageHi ZodieRocket. You should be able to get the info your looking for at your local highschool,college or university, the engineering and/or art dept. will be happy to help I'm sure...... or you can google foundry/metal casting. If you where living in Kiwiland I would be happy to help you out, I just retired from 50yrs in the Foundry Industry.......... Regards & Fly Safe Noel ----- Original Message ----- From: Noel Loveys To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 10:29 AM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Off topic, kinda on topic There may also be a jeweller in your area that uses casting to make their rings etc. Noel -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Edward Moody II Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:41 PM To: zenith-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Off topic, kinda on topic Mark, do a phone book and web search for a foundry within driving distance. If there isn't one, try dental laboratories. You may get the help you want there. Ed Moody II Do Not Archive ----- Original Message ----- From: ZodieRocket To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 11:41 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Off topic, kinda on topic Hi Folks Yesterday and today I have spent my time cleaning up my shop. I seem to have gathered a vast amount of cut offs and waste aluminum, which tends to happen to scratch builders. While I was putting all those pieces which are too small to do anything with I was wondering Can they be melted down and poured into a mold in which I can make something useful like a statue of my 601 and 701? This requires a knowledge of mold making of which I don't have. I don't want a new career in this venture, I just want to make some use of scrap. All opinions and advice welcome but please respond to my personal E-Mail and not this list. Once and if I have a working model finished I will post the how-to on www.ch601.org and www.ch701.com Please E-Mail me at webmaster@ch601.org href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:16:44 AM PST US From: Lone00Star@aol.com Subject: Zenith-List: Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techniques ? Etc. My Brother and I are picking up an already built aircraft with the Jabiru 3300. We would like to know of any thoughts you expreienced test pilots have on spins from all different flight regimes. Have not seen much on this subject at all. Thanks & Aloha. ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:37:52 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: I give up! From: "secatur" Gee Bill...are you calling my VAST accomplishment half-vast ?? [Twisted Evil] Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=89464#89464 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:47:14 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Annual Inspections From: "steveadams" The CH640 comes with an annual inspection checklist and a step by step CD ROM photo Guide for doing the annual. I'm sure the only reason they have provided this is because the airframe is pretty much the same as the Alarus. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=89467#89467 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:12:13 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techn From: "Gig Giacona" One of the reasons you haven't seen much on the issue is because CH says don't spin it. That said, there is no reason that the 601 would have any unusual spin recovery issues. -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=89495#89495 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:12:13 AM PST US From: Maarten Versteeg Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Wing Spar Assembly Drawing 6W3, number of hat stiffeners ? Thanks Dave, Jay, Paul, Yes, I should have compared the 6W3 drawing with the 6K0 drawing, that shows where the confusion started. I agree that Zenith probably even managed to confuse themselves with the standard and long range options. I am planning to go with the 15 gallon (long range) tanks. This almost seems to be the standard option (unless you want to save money), Zenith seems to be half-way converting to this, as evident from the mixed up drawings. Regards, Maarten ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:20:10 AM PST US From: "Ron Lalonde" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: I'm visiting Toronto Hi Dave Can-Zac would be a must to visit if you have the time. You have to meet Mark Townsend (He is a tranplanted Cape Bretoner(from Nova Scotia)!!! Plus, if you are in the need of Corvair parts, try to look up Corsa Ontario which is the Corvair Association in Ontario. I could not believe the assistance they gave me a few years back to hunt down various parts (especially the heads) Have Fun Ron Lalonde Debert, Nova Scotia, Canada >Boys, > > >I will be visiting Toronto, Canada on Business for three weeks from Jan >29th >to Feb 16th. I'm looking for something to do over the two weekends and was >hoping one or two of you builders live in the area. I don't mind driving an >hour or so on either of the weekends to see someone's project. If there is >someone that is interested in showing off their project, please contact me >off list. > > >Thanks, > > >Dave Thompson > >dave.thompson@verizon.net > >Westminster, CA > >601XL rudder workshop, Corvair in parts, plan to start scratch building in >March or April > >Do not archive > _________________________________________________________________ Free Alerts: Be smart - let your information find you! http://alerts.live.com/Alerts/Default.aspx ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:48:09 AM PST US From: 4rcsimmons@comcast.net (Rich Simmons) Subject: Zenith-List: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers Ok list, Another question! The Dzus clips as we show have nothint to retain them. This will tned to runaway clips. In theory, there is to be no space between the Locker and the I think Dzus rails is how they are labeled. The retention devices I see all take up considerable space and will raise the locker and it will no longer be flush. What are some of you using to retain the Dzus clip that keeps the lid flush to the Top Skin. Don not archive -- Thanks, Rich Simmons
Ok list,
 
Another question!
 
The Dzus clips as we show have nothint to retain them. This will tned to runaway clips.
 
In theory, there is to be no space between the Locker and the I think Dzus rails is how they are labeled.
 
The retention devices I see all take up considerable space and will raise the locker and it will no longer be flush.
 
What are some of you using to retain the Dzus clip that keeps the lid flush to the Top Skin.
 
Don not archive
 
--
Thanks,
Rich Simmons
________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:05:09 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers From: "Gig Giacona" Here are the ones I used they are very thin. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/snaprings.php SR5SS It is as flush as it needs to be. 4rcsimmons(at)comcast.net wrote: > Ok list, > > Another question! > > The Dzus clips as we show have nothint to retain them. This will tned to runaway clips. > > In theory, there is to be no space between the Locker and the I think Dzus rails is how they are labeled. > > The retention devices I see all take up considerable space and will raise the locker and it will no longer be flush. > > What are some of you using to retain the Dzus clip that keeps the lid flush to the Top Skin. > > Don not archive > > -- > Thanks, > Rich Simmons > [b] -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=89508#89508 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:56:13 AM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Wing Spar Assembly Drawing 6W3, number of hat stiffeners ? Hi Maarten, I am glad you got the question answered OK. I actually chose the standard fuel configuration rather than the long range tanks. I had several reasons for this choice. First, I normally prefer to have my tanks full when I take off. The only exception to this is when I plan a round trip that is well within the plane's range in one day. Second, the standard tanks provide well over 4 hours of flight time while my body starts going on strike after about 3 hours. I would prefer to limit flight legs to about 3 hours and stop for fuel and a stretch before going on. Third, the 36 pounds difference in fuel weight translates to baggage allowance. This is a significant proportion of the baggage allowed. Good luck, Paul do not archive At 07:10 AM 1/22/2007, you wrote: >Thanks Dave, Jay, Paul, > >Yes, I should have compared the 6W3 drawing with the 6K0 >drawing, that shows where the confusion started. >I agree that Zenith probably even managed to confuse themselves >with the standard and long range options. I am planning to go >with the 15 gallon (long range) tanks. This almost seems to be >the standard option (unless you want to save money), Zenith >seems to be half-way converting to this, as evident from the >mixed up drawings. > >Regards, > Maarten ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:56:13 AM PST US From: "T. Graziano" Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techniques Based on my experience with MY XL, you would have to be really uncoordinated to inadvertently enter into a spin. I have had the airplane shuddering in a stall (with and without power/flaps) and could still go stop-to-stop on the ailerons without the airplane departing (did not hold full aileron in the stall, just held long enough to see that the airplane would start to roll in the direction of the aileron input - not opposite to input). However, on one occasion while I was holding it in a power off stall no flaps to see if I could get it to break, the airplane did depart rather abruptly into a neg G nose straight down attitude (If I did not have my seat belt on, I would have been up and possible through the canopy) - I suspect either an abrupt complete loss of lift or the horiz stab stalled due to a tail wind gust. There was some rolling off of the wing as I recall, but it was slight and rudder brought it level. I had been in the stall shudder mode for about 15 - 20 seconds est. I can also hold the airplane full power, Zero indicated AS, right rudder as required to keep wings level, with no departures - but can only hold so long before my Jab starts to go redline on CHT. That said, Spins are not recommended on the XL by Zenith. Maybe they did not go into a full spin testing program - full aft CG, Gross wt etc. You could probably kick my XL into a spin entry, and probably apply normal spin recovery techniques for recovery, but I am not going to deliberately try it. I would definitely not let my XL spin to see if it stabilized or not - don't know if it would recover by itself, go flat, inverted, flat and inverted, or???, and may not be recoverable without a spin chute. IN my opinion, the XL is easy to fly and if flown normally should not surprise you. If you can fly a C-150 or SE Piper, you can easily fly the XL. Tony Graziano 60lXL/Jab3300; N493TG; 196 hrs. ------ Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techniques From: Lone00Star@aol.com Date: Mon Jan 22 - 2:16 AM My Brother and I are picking up an already built aircraft with the Jabiru 3300. We would like to know of any thoughts you expreienced test pilots have on spins from all different flight regimes. Have not seen much on this subject at all. Thanks & Aloha. ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:58:35 AM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers Hi Rich, I used the little Dzus retaining rings - from Aircraft Spruce. They don't actually cause any problems with seating of the baggage door. They take up space already available in the hole in the strip. Paul XL fuselage At 07:47 AM 1/22/2007, you wrote: >Ok list, > >Another question! > >The Dzus clips as we show have nothint to retain them. This will >tned to runaway clips. > >In theory, there is to be no space between the Locker and the I >think Dzus rails is how they are labeled. > >The retention devices I see all take up considerable space and will >raise the locker and it will no longer be flush. > >What are some of you using to retain the Dzus clip that keeps the >lid flush to the Top Skin. > >Don not archive > >-- >Thanks, >Rich Simmons > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 09:23:30 AM PST US From: "David Austin" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers Try cutting small discs of plastic from thin-walled plastic bottles and punching the appropriate sized hole in them. Worked for me for 14 years. Not too expensive either ;-) Dave Austin 601HDS - 912, Spitfire Mk VIII ----- Original Message ----- From: Rich Simmons To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 10:47 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers Ok list, Another question! The Dzus clips as we show have nothint to retain them. This will tned to runaway clips. In theory, there is to be no space between the Locker and the I think Dzus rails is how they are labeled. The retention devices I see all take up considerable space and will raise the locker and it will no longer be flush. What are some of you using to retain the Dzus clip that keeps the lid flush to the Top Skin. Don not archive -- Thanks, Rich Simmons ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 09:28:56 AM PST US From: "David Austin" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techniques I've recovered from an incipient spin (3/4 of a turn) with no problems. Normal technique. Also done a full power 90 degree bank stall. All it did was flip up level. Dave Austin 601HDS - 912, Spitfire Mk VIII ----- Original Message ----- From: T. Graziano To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 11:54 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techniques Based on my experience with MY XL, you would have to be really uncoordinated to inadvertently enter into a spin. I have had the airplane shuddering in a stall (with and without power/flaps) and could still go stop-to-stop on the ailerons without the airplane departing (did not hold full aileron in the stall, just held long enough to see that the airplane would start to roll in the direction of the aileron input - not opposite to input). However, on one occasion while I was holding it in a power off stall no flaps to see if I could get it to break, the airplane did depart rather abruptly into a neg G nose straight down attitude (If I did not have my seat belt on, I would have been up and possible through the canopy) - I suspect either an abrupt complete loss of lift or the horiz stab stalled due to a tail wind gust. There was some rolling off of the wing as I recall, but it was slight and rudder brought it level. I had been in the stall shudder mode for about 15 - 20 seconds est. I can also hold the airplane full power, Zero indicated AS, right rudder as required to keep wings level, with no departures - but can only hold so long before my Jab starts to go redline on CHT. That said, Spins are not recommended on the XL by Zenith. Maybe they did not go into a full spin testing program - full aft CG, Gross wt etc. You could probably kick my XL into a spin entry, and probably apply normal spin recovery techniques for recovery, but I am not going to deliberately try it. I would definitely not let my XL spin to see if it stabilized or not - don't know if it would recover by itself, go flat, inverted, flat and inverted, or???, and may not be recoverable without a spin chute. IN my opinion, the XL is easy to fly and if flown normally should not surprise you. If you can fly a C-150 or SE Piper, you can easily fly the XL. Tony Graziano 60lXL/Jab3300; N493TG; 196 hrs. ------ Spin 601xl any experience, caveates, unusual recovery techniques From: Lone00Star@aol.com Date: Mon Jan 22 - 2:16 AM My Brother and I are picking up an already built aircraft with the Jabiru 3300. We would like to know of any thoughts you expreienced test pilots have on spins from all different flight regimes. Have not seen much on this subject at all. Thanks & Aloha. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 09:37:11 AM PST US From: David Downey Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Annual Inspections Hi Steve; Do you know if they have a printed checklist that could be adapted to the other CH designs? steveadams wrote: The CH640 comes with an annual inspection checklist and a step by step CD ROM photo Guide for doing the annual. I'm sure the only reason they have provided this is because the airframe is pretty much the same as the Alarus. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=89467#89467 Dave Downey Harleysville (SE) PA Zodiac 601XL/Corvair? --------------------------------- Get your own web address. ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 10:54:52 AM PST US From: LarryMcFarland Subject: Re: Zenith-List: More questions John, I had a nice handling fixture that solved the problem with rotating and moving the wings to and from the storage rack to the paint booth. Ultimately, I found the wings could be taken from the rack to be attached to the plane without any extra set of hands. It's a simple idea, requires right and left plate attachments, but only one stand and a good wing rack that holds the wings on foam on the leading edge. 701 wings would be larger, but the solution is the same. You only need enough distance from the wing-nose to the pivot point to clear the nose in rotating top to bottom. Put extra holes in place for handling at wing cg so you can move the pin from the holes that set the height you need to get it back into the rack. See links, http://www.macsmachine.com/images/tjh/hscentersection/full/wg-remove-to-jig.gif http://www.macsmachine.com/images/tjh/winghandling/full/wingtipsuppt.gif http://www.macsmachine.com/images/tjh/winghandling/full/wingrootjig.gif Good luck, Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com JohnDRead@aol.com wrote: > Hello List: > > I noticed in an old post that there is a neat way to hold 601 > wings for painting. Is there such a device for the 701 wing? > Has anyone ever installed landing lights in the flat part of the > wing tip? > > Thanks all, John Read > CH701 in Colorado under lots of snow! ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 01:04:18 PM PST US From: Bryan Martin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: More questions I found a crimper on Ebay a few years ago for my project. An Ancor brand ratcheting crimper for double crimping PIDG style terminals. I see a few crimpers listed on ebay now that might work for you. Also, B & C has one that they sell. www.bandcspecialty.com JohnDRead@aol.com wrote: > Hello List: > I am at the point of wiring the first wing on my CH701. > I need to get both tooling and crimp on terminals, etc. AS has terminals > but I cannot find crimpers. Any one know where I can find one? > > -- Bryan Martin Zenith 601XL N61BM Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 01:13:47 PM PST US From: "Harrison-Hutcheson" Subject: Zenith-List: 701 wing orientation - front-to-back A dumb question - before I "drill a dumb hole". Am in the process of mounting wings on my 701. I can find documentation about fitting the wings in the up-and-down orientation - stretch a line from wingtip to wingtip along the main wing spar and the distance between the string and the wings at the first rib should be 75 +/- 5 mm. However, I cannot find anything on the alignment of the wings in the front-to-back axis. My first assumption was that the main wing spars would be "lined up" and the string that was stretched from one wingtip to the other would fall directly over(above) the main wing spars for both wings - so that you could look down the string and see all of the main wing spar rivets lined up with the string. Am I missing something in the documentation? Thanks in advance, Sam Hutcheson CH701 kit w/ 912S trying to get it all put together. ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 02:14:05 PM PST US From: Zed Smith Subject: Zenith-List: 701 wing mis-information No, you aren't missing anything.......both wings DO go on the aircraft. Others will probably have a faster, slicker, better, easier, etc, etc, way; here goes: First thing is to make sure the fuselage is LEVEL side-to-side. Tire pressure. Then, consider this a two-part job; wings first, struts second. I suspended both wings at the approximate location where they'd mount. Both were nearly parallel with the floor. You could raise the tips a bit if it makes you feel better. First thing is to slide the front spars into the front fuselage mounts. Do NOT drill yet. Trim as necessary for fitting at the rear. What you trim will be obvious when you get there. What you need to be concerned with is a string from tip-to-tip along the front spar top rivet line. Make sure the two wings are lined up with each other (straight line tip-to-tip). Then mark a spot on top of the rear fuselage as far aft as possible. Measuring from this spot to wing tips (same reference on each wing) will "square" the wings with the fuselage. Re-check top string along rivet line, and continue checking it. Don't worry about the dihedral/75mm just now, that's later with the struts. Once you are absolutely sure you are ready to drill front and rear holes, really sure, just drill a #30 hole in each FRONT and use a long Cleco. Check the top string. Check again the rear fitup. Drill #30 at the rear attachment. At this point you are committed....too late to change. The struts can be a challenge. Mine were the two-piece type; there is some cutting required. Mark, with masking tape and a Sharpie, all the strut pieces. (left, right, front, rear, inboard end, etc.) It is not likely that any of the strut pieces will interchange once you drill them!! You may now need to support the wings from underneath, OUTBOARD of the strut attach points. The 75mm isn't difficult.....but obtaining 75mm at BOTH points can ruin your day. I found that a golf cart has a sloping roof, just fits under the wingtip, that several thicknesses of wood shingles made good wedges, and things progressed much better/faster with some method of shimmimg BOTH wingtips. Two carts would have been great, but ended up building a very tall sawhorse for one side. Bottom line here is that if you get the wings square with the fuselage, the same dihedral in both wings, and manage to stab the struts you will have put in a long day. Regards, Zed/do nor archive ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 03:30:15 PM PST US From: ALAN BEYER Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers Hi Rich,=0A=0AThis same question came up a month or two back. I wrote, wha t I did was make the holes a little larger for easyer alighnment of the Dzu s fasteners. The holes were too large for the standard Dzus Clips, so I us ed small "O" rings that fit the groove of the fastener. It's simple and wo rks great.=0A=0AAl from Oshkosh=0A601 HDS=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message -- --=0AFrom: Rich Simmons <4rcsimmons@comcast.net>=0ATo: zenith-list@matronic s.com=0ASent: Monday, January 22, 2007 9:47:22 AM=0ASubject: Zenith-List: D zus Clips in Wing Lockers=0A=0A=0AOk list,=0A =0AAnother question!=0A =0ATh e Dzus clips as we show have nothint to retain them. This will tned to runa way clips.=0A =0AIn theory, there is to be no space between the Locker and the I think Dzus rails is how they are labeled.=0A =0AThe retention devices I see all take up considerable space and will raise the locker and it will no longer be flush.=0A =0AWhat are some of you using to retain the Dzus cl ip that keeps the lid flush to the Top Skin.=0A =0ADon not archive=0A =0A-- =========== ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 03:38:38 PM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers Al- Good tip on the O rings. I have the ACS retainers and they keep coming off. No matter what, the main secret to installing Dzus is to have plenty of clearance for the major diameter. Rather than wrench the springs up and down to fit different heights, I went with different length Dzus. They're cheap enough. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: ALAN BEYER To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 6:29 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers Hi Rich, This same question came up a month or two back. I wrote, what I did was make the holes a little larger for easyer alighnment of the Dzus fasteners. The holes were too large for the standard Dzus Clips, so I used small "O" rings that fit the groove of the fastener. It's simple and works great. Al from Oshkosh 601 HDS ----- Original Message ---- From: Rich Simmons <4rcsimmons@comcast.net> To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 9:47:22 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Dzus Clips in Wing Lockers Ok list, Another question! The Dzus clips as we show have nothint to retain them. This will tned to runaway clips. In theory, there is to be no space between the Locker and the I think Dzus rails is how they are labeled. The retention devices I see all take up considerable space and will raise the locker and it will no longer be flush. What are some of you using to retain the Dzus clip that keeps the lid flush to the Top Skin. Don not archive -- Thanks, Rich Simmons ist" target=_blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zeni======= ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 03:42:15 PM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: I give up! Nope, warning you. Just when you think everything is peachy keen and dandy you get bit in the vast. do not archive Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: "secatur" Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 5:37 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: I give up! > > Gee Bill...are you calling my VAST accomplishment half-vast ?? [Twisted > Evil] > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=89464#89464 > > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 05:10:41 PM PST US From: Robert Schoenberger Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 wing mis-information Zed . . . I'm not there yet, but thank you in advance for such clear, concise instructions of what can be a very difficult point of constuctopm/ Robert Schoenberger 701 do not archive. Zed Smith wrote: > > No, you aren't missing anything.......both wings DO go on the aircraft. > > Others will probably have a faster, slicker, better, easier, etc, etc, way; here goes: > > First thing is to make sure the fuselage is LEVEL side-to-side. Tire pressure. > > Then, consider this a two-part job; wings first, struts second. > > I suspended both wings at the approximate location where they'd mount. Both were nearly parallel with the floor. > You could raise the tips a bit if it makes you feel better. > > First thing is to slide the front spars into the front fuselage mounts. Do NOT drill yet. > Trim as necessary for fitting at the rear. What you trim will be obvious when you get there. > > What you need to be concerned with is a string from tip-to-tip along the front spar top rivet line. Make sure the two wings are lined up with each other (straight line tip-to-tip). > > Then mark a spot on top of the rear fuselage as far aft as possible. > Measuring from this spot to wing tips (same reference on each wing) will "square" the wings with the fuselage. > Re-check top string along rivet line, and continue checking it. > > Don't worry about the dihedral/75mm just now, that's later with the struts. > > Once you are absolutely sure you are ready to drill front and rear holes, really sure, just drill a #30 hole in each FRONT and use a long Cleco. Check the top string. > > Check again the rear fitup. Drill #30 at the rear attachment. > > At this point you are committed....too late to change. > > The struts can be a challenge. Mine were the two-piece type; there is some cutting required. > Mark, with masking tape and a Sharpie, all the strut pieces. (left, right, front, rear, inboard end, etc.) > It is not likely that any of the strut pieces will interchange once you drill them!! > > You may now need to support the wings from underneath, OUTBOARD of the strut attach points. > > The 75mm isn't difficult.....but obtaining 75mm at BOTH points can ruin your day. > I found that a golf cart has a sloping roof, just fits under the wingtip, that several thicknesses of wood shingles made good wedges, and things progressed much better/faster with some method of shimmimg BOTH wingtips. Two carts would have been great, but ended up building a very tall sawhorse for one side. > > Bottom line here is that if you get the wings square with the fuselage, the same dihedral in both wings, and manage to stab the struts you will have put in a long day. > > Regards, > > Zed/do nor archive > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 07:25:09 PM PST US From: JohnDRead@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: More questions In a message dated 1/22/2007 11:56:40 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, larry@macsmachine.com writes: www.macsmachine.com/images/tjh/hscentersection/full/wg-remove-to-jig.gif Hi Larry: Thanks for the wing support pics. I am building a 701 which cannot be suspended by the spar root. I think I will have to dream up something that attaches to the slat brackets. Regards, John do not archive. ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 07:54:38 PM PST US From: Tim Shankland Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Re: Electronic Headsets.. Steve, I too have been flying for over 40 years, and I also didn't use headsets during those first 10 or 15 years, but then nobody I flew with did. Fortunately due to lack of funds I was not able to fly enough during that time to effect my hearing. I have been wearing headsets for the last twenty years when I became an aircraft owner. This whole topic for me is circuitry that has become commodities that is still sold to the aviation community like a deep dark secret (expensive) ingredient is used that can only be obtained through the few REAL aircraft equipment companies. I am glad to see that active noise reduction add on's are available at a lessor price, but there is still lots of room for improvement. Don't get me started on GPS equipment. Tim Shankland Steve Hulland wrote: > Tim, > Headsets serve two very important functions: > First - they protect your hearing. I wear hearing aids and wish I had > protected my hearing during the first 25 years of my 50 years worth of > aviation involvement.\ > Second - They provide for much better communications with ATC, etc. As > a result, safety is enhanced for everyone. Less miscommunication, less > stress due to lower volumn and much more. > My advise is to always use headsets - good ones. > > > -- > Semper Fi, > Steven R. Hulland > CH 600 Taildragger > Amado, AZ > > This and all other incoming/outgoing email, attachments and replies > scanned prior to opening/sending and uses an external firewall to help > insure virus free email and attachments. > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 08:27:02 PM PST US From: "Dave Ruddiman" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: More decisions about buying the Rotax 912 for my 701 Hey Gary, Where's Chapala compared to someplace I would know? Like Puerto Vallarta. Dave do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Gower To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 6:44 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: More decisions about buying the Rotax 912 for my 701 In my personal experience, the 701S is a must in airport altitudes over 5,000 ft ASL. With the clutch, there is no shaking... Also, remember the aviation saying, when need to climg over trees, all the extra power you have is welcome... Our last X country about a month ago was to Atizapan, 8,120 ft ASL... Saludos Gary Gower 701 912S 98 hrs Flying from Chapala, Mexico 5,029 ft ASL george.mueller@aurora.org wrote: I received some very helpful feedback from the list on experiences with Rotax vendors, as it is time for me to buy the 912S for my 701. However one response has stopped my in my tracks for now. It was from a 701 flyer that had a 912S who wished he had the 80 HP 912. The advantages of the 80HP were: easier starting, doesn't shake the tail apart (although I have redone all the HS mounts, both on the fuselage and HS in .063), the 100hp only needed if flying floats, the only benefit without floats is you get a bit of a boost on take off (I thought I might add floats down the road, but it is not for sure, I might never get around to it and shortening take off distance in a 701, well how short does it need to be?), the 912 S needs a gearbox clutch and the prop alternatives are slightly more limited, the 80hp has a lower price, slightly less fuel usage, less vibration and somewhat higher reliability. My whole life I have always considered more horsepower to be better, but now I am wondering.....I have the Skyshops FWF so I am committed to the Rotax 912 ( I assume the FWF fits the 912 or the 912s both, I ordered about a year ago and I can't remember if I had to specify which engine, but I think both engines are identical on the outside). ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Be a PS3 game guru. Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at Yahoo! Games. ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 10:50:05 PM PST US From: "JG" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: More questions If your workshop is big enough and you can put hanging points in the ceiling then this works really well. For a 701 use two 6' long boards across under each wing, one out near the tip and the other a couple of feet out from the root, tied up to hangers in the ceiling. It works really well in that you can adjust each rope to get all the 'angles of dangle' just right, and it's really secure so you can measure, re-measure and measure yet again before drilling. By pulling them up above head height it's also a good place to store the wings out of the way. Cheers, JG ---- Original Message ----- From: JohnDRead@aol.com To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:23 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: More questions In a message dated 1/22/2007 11:56:40 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, larry@macsmachine.com writes: www.macsmachine.com/images/tjh/hscentersection/full/wg-remove-to-jig.gif Hi Larry: Thanks for the wing support pics. I am building a 701 which cannot be suspended by the spar root. I think I will have to dream up something that attaches to the slat brackets. Regards, John do not archive. ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 10:56:58 PM PST US From: Gary Gower Subject: Re: Zenith-List: More decisions about buying the Rotax 912 for my 701 Hello Dave, Very easy, PV is in the Pacific Coast, make an almost horizontal line to Mexico City, Just about 1/3rd of the distance from PV to Mex is Guadalajara, South of Guadalajara (about 30 miles) is Chapala Lake, the biggest natural lake in Mexico. Attached is a pdf file from Google Earth. If you have Google Earth our club is in: 2018'35"N 10309'36"W In the 701 I am about 1:20 hrs from PV depends on wind direction and speed. Saludos Gary Gower Do not archive. Dave Ruddiman wrote: Hey Gary, Where's Chapala compared to someplace I would know? Like Puerto Vallarta. Dave do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Gower To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 6:44 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: More decisions about buying the Rotax 912 for my 701 In my personal experience, the 701S is a must in airport altitudes over 5,000 ft ASL. With the clutch, there is no shaking... Also, remember the aviation saying, when need to climg over trees, all the extra power you have is welcome... Our last X country about a month ago was to Atizapan, 8,120 ft ASL... Saludos Gary Gower 701 912S 98 hrs Flying from Chapala, Mexico 5,029 ft ASL george.mueller@aurora.org wrote: I received some very helpful feedback from the list on experiences with Rotax vendors, as it is time for me to buy the 912S for my 701. However one response has stopped my in my tracks for now. It was from a 701 flyer that had a 912S who wished he had the 80 HP 912. The advantages of the 80HP were: easier starting, doesn't shake the tail apart (although I have redone all the HS mounts, both on the fuselage and HS in .063), the 100hp only needed if flying floats, the only benefit without floats is you get a bit of a boost on take off (I thought I might add floats down the road, but it is not for sure, I might never get around to it and shortening take off distance in a 701, well how short does it need to be?), the 912 S needs a gearbox clutch and the prop alternatives are slightly more limited, the 80hp has a lower price, slightly less fuel usage, less vibration and somewhat higher reliability. My whole life I have always considered more horsepower to be better, but now I am wondering.....I have the Skyshops FWF so I am committed to the Rotax 912 ( I assume the FWF fits the 912 or the 912s both, I ordered about a year ago and I can't remember if I had to specify which engine, but I think both engines are identical on the outside). --------------------------------- Be a PS3 game guru. Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at Yahoo! Games. href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com --------------------------------- Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your question on Yahoo! Answers. ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 11:11:22 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Handheld GPS? From: "Lind, Per" Hi all of you I live in the North of Norway and I'm building a CH601UL, a 49% kit from Czeck Aircraft with a Rotax 912ULS. I have traditional, analogue instruments, Garmin SL40 transceiver, and Garmin GTX127 transponder. My plan is to lift her in the air in May and just now I need an advice what type of GPS it is best to buy. I can see that the Lowrance Airmap 2000C is much cheaper than Garmin 296 and AvMap IV, but now I need an advice. Best regards Per Lind Norway ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.