---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 03/05/07: 38 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:45 AM - Re: what does it mean (lufthund) 2. 01:37 AM - Y-stick solution ! (secatur) 3. 05:13 AM - Cockpit side panels (Beckman, Rick) 4. 05:47 AM - Re: What does it mean? () 5. 06:02 AM - side panels with ARM RESTS? (Robin Bellach) 6. 06:06 AM - Re: Prop Pitch (Southern Reflections) 7. 06:06 AM - 601XL wing dihedral and notch cut in center spar (Scott Laughlin) 8. 06:11 AM - Re: landing light (Charles Wacker) 9. 06:14 AM - What does it mean? (Robin Bellach) 10. 06:33 AM - Re: landing light (japhillipsga@aol.com) 11. 06:36 AM - Re: 601XL wing dihedral and notch cut in center spar (ashontz) 12. 06:53 AM - Re: Fuel Taxes (ashontz) 13. 07:36 AM - Re: Cockpit side panels/ flame (Big Gee) 14. 08:01 AM - Re: side panels with ARM RESTS? () 15. 08:27 AM - Re: Cockpit side panels/ flame (txpilot) 16. 10:06 AM - Re: 601XL wing dihedral and notch cut in center spar (Ron Lendon) 17. 12:16 PM - Re: side panels with ARM RESTS? (Phil Maxson) 18. 01:19 PM - Re: side panels with ARM RESTS? (ZodieRocket) 19. 02:18 PM - Re: Y-stick solution ! (TxDave) 20. 03:03 PM - Re: Cockpit side panels? (PatrickW) 21. 03:13 PM - New "European XL" from Zenith? (PatrickW) 22. 03:24 PM - Re: New "European XL" from Zenith? (LHusky@aol.com) 23. 03:48 PM - Re: New "European XL" from Zenith? (Tim Juhl) 24. 03:53 PM - Re: New "European XL" from Zenith? (Craig Payne) 25. 04:09 PM - Re: Y-stick solution ! (Southern Reflections) 26. 04:14 PM - Re: landing light (Bill Naumuk) 27. 05:51 PM - Re: Re: New "European XL" from Zenith? (Kurt A. Schumacher) 28. 06:14 PM - Re: Re: What does it mean? () 29. 06:37 PM - Step L angles (Bill Naumuk) 30. 06:50 PM - Standard L-angles (Edward Moody II) 31. 06:59 PM - Re: Standard L-angles (Gary Boothe) 32. 07:01 PM - Re: Y-stick solution ! comfort ? (Big Gee) 33. 07:23 PM - Re: landing light (Ron Lendon) 34. 07:37 PM - Re: Y-stick solution ! comfort ? (Southern Reflections) 35. 07:42 PM - Czech built 701s (Julian Hankinson) 36. 09:00 PM - Re: 7V6-2SP Alignment (JohnDRead@aol.com) 37. 09:58 PM - Re: Standard L-angles (Paul Mulwitz) 38. 10:09 PM - test Do not archive (Gary Gower) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:45:25 AM PST US From: "lufthund" Subject: Zenith-List: Re: what does it mean Perhaps this thread should be called Bullship? Do not archive! Bob Wetzel 601 HD Bath,Pa ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:37:39 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution ! From: "secatur" Cut the Y off ! Put your Stick handle(like my nice Ray's with 1000 functions!) on the stub ! More like a standard control stick ! And less in the way! If you wanna fly right handed you're jake! If you wanna fly left handed, fly (shock horror ! ) from the right seat ! LOL ! Steve Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98794#98794 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:13:46 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Cockpit side panels From: "Beckman, Rick" Would like to hear some ideas on good/interesting materials to use for the side panels in the cockpit Andy, I plan on using the stuff that you see in people's yards that are trying to sell a new weight loss plan, or vote for so and so.... The stuff is plastic and is made like corrugated cardboard...corplast. You can get it at sign companies for around $12.00 for a 4'X 8' sheet. Cut it with a box knife or scissors. I, also, plan on covering it with 1/8" foam to hide the "ribs" of the corplast and cover that with fabric. Make some aluminum angle tabs and rivet them where needed on the side supports and screw the panels to the tabs. Should make for a nice installation and be good looking! Happy building! God Bless! Rick Beckman Midwest Mudworks Zodie Rocket XL 52EB (r) www.sharbo.us/thebird ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:47:51 AM PST US From: Subject: Zenith-List: Re: What does it mean? Boat vs. Ship ?? It means you are wasting everyones time!!!! Please, let's see some good building info instead of each person trying to out-cute the other. Rich H ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:02:11 AM PST US From: "Robin Bellach" <601zv@ritternet.com> Subject: Zenith-List: side panels with ARM RESTS? Seems like sitting in a 601 is like sitting in an armchair with one arm missing. I'm wondering if anyone has designed flip-up armrests, or might know of a KISS/Lightweight hinge suitable for such application, with a "lock in the up position" feature? Robin in AR 601XL Zen-Vair, 601ZV reserved ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:06:04 AM PST US From: "Southern Reflections" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Prop Pitch Call lonnie Prince, tell him what your HP. is ,ENG . RPM is , and what type plane you have. he will tell you what you need. Joe N101HD ----- Original Message ----- From: LRM To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2007 11:09 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Prop Pitch Has anyone got a Prince P-tip 2 blade on a 701 with about 100 hp engine? If so, what length and pitch do you recommend? Thanks Larry, www.SkyHawg.com, N1345L ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:06:05 AM PST US From: "Scott Laughlin" Subject: Zenith-List: 601XL wing dihedral and notch cut in center spar Andy: I was trying to figure out what problem you were having when I came across my original VISIO drawing that I used to drill my spar holes. I changed the "order" on the bottom drawing to show the center spar cap on top. I posted it here: http://www.cooknwithgas.com/Spar_Attach.jpg It sounds like you have solved your problem. In any case, your question helped me with a problem I was having. I didn't have much time when I attached my right wing for a test fit and never could get the bolts to line up. Since then I've wondered why it didn't fit right away. After looking for a solution to your problem I solved mine. The cutout in my fuselage only comes to the top of the center spar. Looking at the VISIO drawing it is clear that the cutout must be at least 7mm above the center spar for the wing to fit. DOH! I'm going to go home this evening and make the cutout right away. Thanks for bringing this to my attention if only by accident! Scott Laughlin Omaha, Nebraska CH601XL/Corvair Waiting for the big Meltdown http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dyreKXznW4 Time: 06:32:06 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: 601XL wing dihedral and notch cut in center spar From: "ashontz" I'm setting my wing dihedral right now. Did anyone run into a problem where the center bolt of the wing spar doesn't actually fall on the center line of the center spar per the measurements? I'm thinking the notch in the center spar should actually be cut back far enough to expose the channel the wing spar floats in rather than only be cut back to the first center spar cap. First off, that tab that's left after the cut is doing nothing, secondly, without that flap it's possible to slide the wing spar up a few mm to intersect the centerline exactly, and third, in other areas of the plans it actually shows that tab cut all they way back, exposing the channel and allowing more up and down for the wing spar in the center channel. Thanks -------- CH601XL - Corvair www.mykitlog.com/ashontz _________________________________________________________________ Dont miss your chance to WIN 10 hours of private jet travel from Microsoft ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:11:01 AM PST US From: "Charles Wacker" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: landing light You will need to cut the lens. Zenith doesn't tell you about that but it is the only way to get it in. Chuck Wacker 601XL Quick Build >From: "Skip Perry" >To: >Subject: Zenith-List: landing light >Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2007 18:43:02 -0500 > >I have made the cut out in the leading edge and also have the landing light >assembly clecoed in place but I still can't get the lens into the cut out. >I >am afraid to force it for fear it will crack. I have checked and re-checked >the cut out and it seems to be in the correct place and the measurements >all >seem correct. Does anyone have any tips for getting the lens to fit in the >cut out hole? The assembly photos mention cutting a pie shaped piece but no >measurements are given. > >Skip Perry >601 quick build > _________________________________________________________________ Rates near 39yr lows! $430K Loan for $1,399/mo - Paying Too Much? Calculate new payment ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:14:24 AM PST US From: "Robin Bellach" <601zv@ritternet.com> Subject: Zenith-List: What does it mean? Yea, I'm beginning to feel like the Ancient Mariner. And how about DO NOT ARCHIVE ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 7:47 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: What does it mean? > > Boat vs. Ship ?? It means you are wasting everyones time!!!! Please, > let's see some good building info instead of each person trying to > out-cute the other. > Rich H > >> ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:33:55 AM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: landing light From: japhillipsga@aol.com Skip, that lens can be a real bear. I screwed mine up a bit, but learned from a fellow at Sun n Fun last year a method to get it right. He said to make a wood form the shape of the wing nose. Make a thin cardboard template that will fit in the hole in the wing edge. Make the Lexan the size of the cardboard. Now here's the tricky part. The fellow said that Lexan does not become soft and malleable until it gets to something like 300 degrees ?? His method was to put the form sanding nose up into the oven with the Lexan on top and heat it until the plastic bends down to the shape of the nose skin form. Sounded like a neat way to size and bend the material. I have not tried it myself, but it might work. The fellow may be on this thread. Perhaps you could find him for more details. Best regards, Bill of Georgia -----Original Message----- From: ccwacker@HOTMAIL.COM Sent: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 9:10 AM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: landing light You will need to cut the lens. Zenith doesn't tell you about that but it is the only way to get it in. Chuck Wacker 601XL Quick Build >From: "Skip Perry" >To: >Subject: Zenith-List: landing light >Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2007 18:43:02 -0500 > >I have made the cut out in the leading edge and also have the landing light >assembly clecoed in place but I still can't get the lens into the cut out. >I >am afraid to force it for fear it will crack. I have checked and re-checked >the cut out and it seems to be in the correct place and the measurements >all >seem correct. Does anyone have any tips for getting the lens to fit in the >cut out hole? The assembly photos mention cutting a pie shaped piece but no >measurements are given. > >Skip Perry >601 quick build > _________________________________________________________________ Rates near 39yr lows! $430K Loan for $1,399/mo - Paying Too Much? Calculate new payment ________________________________________________________________________ AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:36:10 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 601XL wing dihedral and notch cut in center spar From: "ashontz" No problem. This probably the most significant problem with the plans I've seen to date. Pretty serious if you ask me. They're some of the most important bolts in the whole plane. I wanted to make sure I had them layed out exactly as specified. I couldn't find a reference in the FAA A&P manual about minimum edge distance for bolts. It did have it for rivets, but not bolts. Considering the cap is 38mm wide and half of that is 19mm, the bolt is about 3.75mm radius, and then the end holes are offset 3mm, when things are right, that leaves about 12mm, a little less than 2 bolt diameters to the edge. When I first lined everything up it was off by 5mm, so that would have skewed it even more, down to roughly 7mm, that's a little less than a bolt diameter. I wasn't comfortable with that. Me and a friend stood there for about 3 hours thinking and remeasuring everything and I figured the center spar flange would have to be cut all the way back exposing the channel 45mm to get it to line up perfectly. Next morning I started checking everyone's sites for pix and saw Dave Clay's had the cutout. He probably has newer plans that account for that. Once I cut it back all the way it fit fine. cookwithgas(at)HOTMAIL.CO wrote: > Andy: > > I was trying to figure out what problem you were having when I came across > my original VISIO drawing that I used to drill my spar holes. I changed the > "order" on the bottom drawing to show the center spar cap on top. > I posted it here: > > http://www.cooknwithgas.com/Spar_Attach.jpg > > It sounds like you have solved your problem. In any case, your question > helped me with a problem I was having. > > I didn't have much time when I attached my right wing for a test fit and > never could get the bolts to line up. Since then I've wondered why it > didn't fit right away. After looking for a solution to your problem I > solved mine. The cutout in my fuselage only comes to the top of the center > spar. > > Looking at the VISIO drawing it is clear that the cutout must be at least > 7mm above the center spar for the wing to fit. DOH! I'm going to go home > this evening and make the cutout right away. > > Thanks for bringing this to my attention if only by accident! > > Scott Laughlin > Omaha, Nebraska > CH601XL/Corvair > Waiting for the big Meltdown > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dyreKXznW4 > > > > > > Time: 06:32:06 AM PST US > Subject: 601XL wing dihedral and notch cut in center spar > From: "ashontz" > > > I'm setting my wing dihedral right now. Did anyone run into a problem where > the > center bolt of the wing spar doesn't actually fall on the center line of the > center spar per the measurements? I'm thinking the notch in the center spar > should > actually be cut back far enough to expose the channel the wing spar floats > in rather than only be cut back to the first center spar cap. First off, > that > tab that's left after the cut is doing nothing, secondly, without that flap > it's possible to slide the wing spar up a few mm to intersect the centerline > exactly, > and third, in other areas of the plans it actually shows that tab cut > all they way back, exposing the channel and allowing more up and down for > the > wing spar in the center channel. > > Thanks > > -------- > CH601XL - Corvair > www.mykitlog.com/ashontz > > _________________________________________________________________ > Don?t miss your chance to WIN 10 hours of private jet travel from Microsoft? -------- CH601XL - Corvair www.mykitlog.com/ashontz Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98834#98834 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:53:03 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Fuel Taxes From: "ashontz" [quote="p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att"]Wow, this is getting way off topic - but I can't resist a few comments on the politics and economics of FAA funding. First, I disagree that the FAA will change their position if they learn we are putting mogas into our little putt-putt airplanes. We just don't use that much gas. I think the target of the gas tax increase is the jet operators - both current biz-jets and the expected hoard of new very light jets. Those aircraft burn so much more fuel than our little recreational aircraft that they are the ones facing real money cost with the gas (and Jet fuel) tax increase. Second, I think the real motive behind the FAA proposal is to divorce the FAA managers from congressional oversight. They don't like the idea that mere congressmen and senators can tell the ALMIGHTY FAA what they can and can't do. They hope by generating their own income in a business-like fashion with the higher fuel taxes and service fees they can become independent of all interference in their UNLIMITED POWER. That is always what politics is about - exercise of power. While we feel threatened by the FAA move, I am confident the business aviation folks and members of congress will feel even more threatened. I don't expect this whole proposal to be adopted by congress. Still, I encourage everyone to write and call their representatives to express their horror over this rogue agency trying to take over the world and eliminate our freedom to fly. I actually wrote my representatives before the push by AOPA and EAA. I'm afraid the only hope we all (all citizens) have for free and open use of America's skies is a brutal house cleaning of the FAA management. If I were Emperor of the Earth I would fire them all and start over from scratch. They never recovered any humility after Ronald Reagan fired the ATC controllers some 20 years ago. (End of Rant and Rage) Paul XL fuselage do not archive or tell the Gestapo about my opinions. At 02:21 PM 2/28/2007, you wrote: > Once the FAA realizes that some people are using mo gas and flying without paying aviation fuel taxes they will be back before congress wanted to get the funds some other way. At the current time I can buy gas for my tractor without paying tax on it, but if I put it in my car I am required to report how much I used and send in the bucks. I have also been hearing rumors for the last several years that 100LL is on its way out. Should it be discontinued even the FAA will realize we're burning something else and what ever it is needs to be taxed. I think that if the FAA gets their fuel tax, we mo gas burners are only safe for a short time. > I am a member of both the EAA and AOPA and like others I will write letters and make phone calls as these two groups suggest. I don't have a problem with paying my fair share, I just don't like the ATA deciding what my fair share is. > > CJ > > do not archive > > > > - > [b] THe airlines are the ones using the ATC system the most too. How many people here really plan to file IFR flight plans on a regular basis and fly from JFK in New York to Dulles. Probably not too many. Besides, how the hell would they ever know where you got the mogas from. Be nice of the EAA helped setup mogas stations at small airports. I remember back in about 1994 regular unleaded was about $1.10, but 100LL was over $2/gallon. And at the time I heard that the nearly 100% difference in price was really due to taxes that went to run ATC facilities. So now that regular unleaded is $2.30, by those numbers 100L should be about $5.00/gal. I have no idea what it is now though. -------- Andy Shontz CH601XL - Corvair www.mykitlog.com/ashontz Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98840#98840 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:36:24 AM PST US From: Big Gee Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Cockpit side panels/ flame Shouldn't some thought be given to wheather or not the material will suppo rt a flame ?=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: "Beckman, Rick" =0ATo: zenith-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Monday, March 5, 2007 8:08:40 AM=0ASubject: Zenith-List: Cockpit side panels=0A=0A=0A =0A Would like to hear some ideas on good/interesting materials to use for the side panels in the cockpit=0A =0A Andy, I plan on usin g the stuff that you see in people=92s yards that are trying to sell a new weight loss plan, or vote for so and so=85. The stuff is plastic and is ma de like corrugated cardboard=85corplast. You can get it at sign companies f or around $12.00 for a 4=92X 8=92 sheet. Cut it with a box knife or scissor s. I, also, plan on covering it with 1/8=94 foam to hide the =93ribs=94 of the corplast and cover that with fabric. Make some aluminum angle tabs and rivet them where needed on the side supports and screw the panels to the ta bs. Should make for a nice installation and be good looking!=0A Happy building!=0A God Bless!=0A Rick Beckman=0A Midwest Mudworks=0A Zodie Rocket XL 52EB =AE=0A www.sharbo.us/thebird=0A =0A=0A =0A=0A=0A =0A______________________________________________________________ ______________________=0ACheap talk?=0ACheck out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC- ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 08:01:22 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: Zenith-List: side panels with ARM RESTS? If you go with dual sticks, the outboard arm does not need a rest. It rests on your outboard thigh while operating the control stick. The inboard arm rests on the center console as needed. There isn't a lot of extra room width-wise in the 601XL cockpit but that being said, I'm sure you could rig something salvaged from the front seats of a wrecked SUV if you feel motivated to do that. It would probably be more necessary with the single center stick. Dred ---- Robin Bellach <601zv@ritternet.com> wrote: > Seems like sitting in a 601 is like sitting in an armchair with one arm missing. I'm wondering if anyone has designed flip-up armrests, or might know of a KISS/Lightweight hinge suitable for such application, with a "lock in the up position" feature? > > Robin in AR > 601XL Zen-Vair, 601ZV reserved ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 08:27:45 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Cockpit side panels/ flame From: "txpilot" Aircraft Spruce sells a fire retardent penetrant that can be applied to most interior materials. I have not used it personally, but my EAA technical counselor swears by it. Dan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98863#98863 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 10:06:49 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 601XL wing dihedral and notch cut in center spar From: "Ron Lendon" Yeah I remember that now. Reading through my notes it is on position now or at worst 2.5mm off on centers. I had the EAA tech guy over yesterday and showed him all the problems on the first wing. His reply was they were not problems. Only squawk was the spar bolt did not have enough threads showing. His write up was a real motivator. I will post it on my kit log later tonight. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98885#98885 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 12:16:00 PM PST US From: Phil Maxson Subject: RE: Zenith-List: side panels with ARM RESTS? In the 80 or so hours I've spent in my plane I've never noticed this phenom enon. 16 of those hours were in two 8-hour days. I suspect this is someth ing you notice on the ground, but not while flying. There's plenty to do w ith those arms when you're flying.Phil Maxson 601XL/Corvair Northwest New Jersey From: 601zv@ritternet.comSubject: Zenith-List: side panels with ARM RESTS?D ate: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 08:00:45 -0600 Seems like sitting in a 601 is like sitting in an armchair with one arm mis sing. I'm wondering if anyone has designed flip-up armrests, or might know of a KISS/Lightweight hinge suitable for such application, with a "lock in the up position" feature? Robin in AR 601XL Zen-Vair, 601ZV reserved _________________________________________________________________ Discover the new Windows Vista E ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 01:19:52 PM PST US From: "ZodieRocket" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: side panels with ARM RESTS? Robin, before you go ahead and make your armrests, sit in your UPHOLSTERED seat and read a very large book( I read Da-Vinci Code). You will find two answers, your seats are, or are not comfortable and secondly you will never use armrests, thirdly you have no way of peeing into a cup or bottle :-). I understand your thought process, but it is spawned from not having spent time in the seat. Sorry Guys , I had to add the pee thinnggy again!!! Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario Zodiac 601XL C-GOXL, CH701 on wheels HYPERLINK "http://www.ch601.org"www.ch601.org / HYPERLINK "http://www.ch701.com"www.ch701.com/ HYPERLINK "http://www.Osprey2.com"www.Osprey2.com _____ From: 601zv@ritternet.com Subject: Zenith-List: side panels with ARM RESTS? Seems like sitting in a 601 is like sitting in an armchair with one arm missing. I'm wondering if anyone has designed flip-up armrests, or might know of a KISS/Lightweight hinge suitable for such application, with a "lock in the up position" feature? Robin in AR 601XL Zen-Vair, 601ZV reserved _____ Discover the new Windows Vista HYPERLINK Learn more! "http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List"http://www.matronics.com /Navigator?Zenith-List "http://forums.matronics.com"http://forums.matronics.com -- 8:12 AM -- 8:12 AM ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 02:18:00 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Y-stick solution ! From: "TxDave" Hmmmm. Interesting idea, Steve. do not archive Dave Clay Temple, TX http://www.daves601xl.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98924#98924 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 03:03:15 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Cockpit side panels? From: "PatrickW" I'm considering just spraying Zinc Chromate everywhere, and then doing a thin wood veneer on the panel. Patrick XL/Corvair do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98931#98931 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 03:13:05 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: New "European XL" from Zenith? From: "PatrickW" Anybody know anything about this? http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/6-photo104.html http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/607/xl-eu3.jpg >From the Zenith website: "March 1, 2007. The new European ZODIAC XL, now manufactured and supported by Zenair, introduces some new (and lighter) features for the European market." Patrick XL/Corvair Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98933#98933 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 03:24:31 PM PST US From: LHusky@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: New "European XL" from Zenith? Anyone know what the "Lighter" parts are? Are the flaps fiberglass? Larry


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AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 03:48:57 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: New "European XL" from Zenith? From: "Tim Juhl" Flaps fiberglass? Maybe. Look at the main gear. I suspect they shaved a few pounds there. Tim -------- DO NOT ARCHIVE ______________ CFII Champ L16A flying Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A Working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98939#98939 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 03:53:50 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: New "European XL" from Zenith? The curved landing gear could be composite: www.zenithair.com/zodiac/607/xl-eu7.jpg. -- Craig do not archive ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 04:09:02 PM PST US From: "Southern Reflections" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution ! Steve I've thinking about doing that for over 2 years ... I've got my hack saw out..... ---How about putting a twist throttle on the stick--,jost like on a bike. It works ver well belive it or not..Joe N101HD Original Message ----- From: "secatur" Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 4:37 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution ! > > Cut the Y off ! > > Put your Stick handle(like my nice Ray's with 1000 functions!) on the stub > ! > More like a standard control stick ! And less in the way! > > If you wanna fly right handed you're jake! > > If you wanna fly left handed, fly (shock horror ! ) from the right seat ! > > LOL ! > Steve > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98794#98794 > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 04:14:37 PM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: landing light Skip- Jeff Small passed the procedure on to me. I don't know if he originated it, but I've seen his plane and can tell you that it works for an HDS, with it's thick wing. Probably work for an XL, too, with a little extra juggling and swearing. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuse/Corvair Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: japhillipsga@aol.com To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 9:33 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: landing light Skip, that lens can be a real bear. I screwed mine up a bit, but learned from a fellow at Sun n Fun last year a method to get it right. He said to make a wood form the shape of the wing nose. Make a thin cardboard template that will fit in the hole in the wing edge. Make the Lexan the size of the cardboard. Now here's the tricky part. The fellow said that Lexan does not become soft and malleable until it gets to something like 300 degrees ?? His method was to put the form sanding nose up into the oven with the Lexan on top and heat it until the plastic bends down to the shape of the nose skin form. Sounded like a neat way to size and bend the material. I have not tried it myself, but it might work. The fellow may be on this thread. Perhaps you could find him for more details. Best regards, Bill of Georgia -----Original Message----- From: ccwacker@HOTMAIL.COM To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 9:10 AM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: landing light You will need to cut the lens. Zenith doesn't tell you about that but it is the only way to get it in. Chuck Wacker 601XL Quick Build >From: "Skip Perry" >To: >Subject: Zenith-List: landing light >Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2007 18:43:02 -0500 > >I have made the cut out in the leading edge and also have the landing light >assembly clecoed in place but I still can't get the lens into the cut out. >I >am afraid to force it for fear it will crack. I have checked and re-checked >the cut out and it seems to be in the correct place and the measurements >all >seem correct. Does anyone have any tips for getting the lens to fit in the >cut out hole? The assembly photos mention cutting a pie shaped piece but no >measurements are given. > >Skip Perry >601 quick build > _________________________________________________________________ Rates near 39yr lows! $430K Loan for $1,399/mo - Paying Too Much? Calculate new payment ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 05:51:32 PM PST US From: "Kurt A. Schumacher" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: New "European XL" from Zenith? In general, the limitation for European Ultralight is 450 kg plus a 22.5 kg allowance for the rescue system if installed. On pilot with fuel - or two crewmembers and virtually no fuel.... Stay happy with the LSA regulations over there in the US. One day we might see a EASA Recreational Aircraft class - in some hundred years when the Brits, the French, the Portuguese, the Spanish and the German can agree. Amazed they manage Airbus - aside some lay-offs these days. Suspect lightweight fiberglass or carbon cowling (was an option from CZAW) Landing gear bows like the CZAW introduced glass gear legs (engineered to 550 kg MTOM AFAIK) By the way, there are some pics more to see in the Zenith web - check http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/607/xl-eu2.jpg to xl-eu7.jpg Have Fun! -Kurt. SportAviation of Switzerland http://www.sportaviation.ch/ -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Juhl Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2007 12:48 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: New "European XL" from Zenith? Flaps fiberglass? Maybe. Look at the main gear. I suspect they shaved a few pounds there. Tim -------- DO NOT ARCHIVE ______________ CFII Champ L16A flying Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A Working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98939#98939 ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 06:14:42 PM PST US From: Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: What does it mean? "Dad, they are called boats not ships". NO SHIP? Sorry, I couldn't resist Do not archive ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 06:37:13 PM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Zenith-List: Step L angles All- Have conflicting information. On the old hand-drawn plans for HD/HDSs, there are two L angles riveted to the bottom rear fuse skin that are in turn bolted to the center of the tube that goes spanwise between the steps. No additional internal bracing, just L angles riveted with A5s to the .016 bottom skin. Doesn't seen very sturdy. On the HD/HDS Cad drawings, there's no mention of the L angles at all! Input greatly appreciated. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuse/Corvair Townville, Pa ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 06:50:36 PM PST US From: "Edward Moody II" Subject: Zenith-List: Standard L-angles Has anyone on the list had to order some additional lightweight L-angles like the ones that are supplied with the kit? I just ordered some and the price came out to about $7 for a 4 foot piece of 20mm by 20mm angle .020" thick (6061-T6 bare) plus shipping. Can that be right? The cost of the aluminum is about $1.67each. Can there really be $5.33 of labor and profit in such a generic piece of stock that is kept on hand to be included in every Zenith kit? Had I suspected that the price was so high, I would have simply manufactured them myself at home. I expected maybe $3 per piece and felt that it would be worth having them bent to exactly the same radius as the pieces that came with the kit. I guess the stupid tax strikes again! Dred 601XL/Jabiru/ middle top skin Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 06:59:26 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Standard L-angles I built Dave's Cheap Sheet Metal Bending Brake. I'll never have to buy another L-angle again. Sorry, that really doesn't answer your question. Gary Boothe Cool, CA 601 HDSTD, WW Conversion 90% done, Tail done, wings done, working on c-section _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Edward Moody II Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 6:51 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Standard L-angles Has anyone on the list had to order some additional lightweight L-angles like the ones that are supplied with the kit? I just ordered some and the price came out to about $7 for a 4 foot piece of 20mm by 20mm angle .020" thick (6061-T6 bare) plus shipping. Can that be right? The cost of the aluminum is about $1.67each. Can there really be $5.33 of labor and profit in such a generic piece of stock that is kept on hand to be included in every Zenith kit? Had I suspected that the price was so high, I would have simply manufactured them myself at home. I expected maybe $3 per piece and felt that it would be worth having them bent to exactly the same radius as the pieces that came with the kit. I guess the stupid tax strikes again! Dred 601XL/Jabiru/ middle top skin Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 07:01:34 PM PST US From: Big Gee Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution ! comfort ? I'd hold off with the hack saw until after you see how comfortable the "Y" stick is.=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Southern Reflections =0ATo: zenith-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Monday , March 5, 2007 7:07:53 PM=0ASubject: Re: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution ! oon99@bellsouth.net>=0A=0ASteve I've thinking about doing that for over 2 y ears ... I've got my hack =0Asaw out.....=0A---How about putting a twist throttle on the stick--,jost like on a bike. =0AIt works ver well belive i t or not..Joe N101HD Original Message ----- =0AFrom: "secatur" =0ATo: =0ASent: Monday, March 05, 200 7 4:37 AM=0ASubject: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution !=0A=0A=0A> --> Zenith-L ist message posted by: "secatur" =0A>=0A> Cut the Y off !=0A>=0A> Put your Stick handle(like my nice Ray's with 1000 functions! ) on the stub =0A> !=0A> More like a standard control stick ! And less in t he way!=0A>=0A> If you wanna fly right handed you're jake!=0A>=0A> If you w anna fly left handed, fly (shock horror ! ) from the right seat !=0A>=0A> L OL !=0A> Steve=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A> Read this topic online here:=0A>=0A> htt p://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98794#98794=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A> =============0A=0A=0A =0A__________________________ __________________________________________________________=0ATV dinner stil l cooling? =0ACheck out "Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV.=0Ahttp://tv.yahoo.c om/ ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 07:23:15 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: landing light From: "Ron Lendon" I wouldn't recommend heating plastic in a oven you plan on using to prepare food in. Just not a good idea. Fitting is just part of the process of making it right. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98988#98988 ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 07:37:32 PM PST US From: "Southern Reflections" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution ! comfort ? Is it un- comfortable?Tell me about it JoeN101HD ----- Original Message ----- From: Big Gee To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 10:00 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution ! comfort ? I'd hold off with the hack saw until after you see how comfortable the "Y" stick is. ----- Original Message ---- From: Southern Reflections To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 5, 2007 7:07:53 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution ! Steve I've thinking about doing that for over 2 years ... I've got my hack saw out..... ---How about putting a twist throttle on the stick--,jost like on a bike. It works ver well belive it or not..Joe N101HD Original Message ----- From: "secatur" To: Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 4:37 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Y-stick solution ! > > Cut the Y off ! > > Put your Stick handle(like my nice Ray's with 1000 functions!) on the stub > ! > More like a standard control stick ! And less in the way! > > If you wanna fly right handed you're jake! > > If you wanna fly left handed, fly (shock horror ! ) from the right seat ! > > LOL ! > Steve > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98794#98794 > > > > > > > > > > > sp; - The Zenith-List Email Forum - _r?Zenith-List" - NEW MATRONICS WEB FORUMS = --> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Finding fabulous fares is fun. Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains. ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 07:42:03 PM PST US From: Julian Hankinson Subject: Zenith-List: Czech built 701s Hello All- I have a friend who has been watching my slow 701 assembly progress and decided he is going to buy a used one instead of building. What is the quality of the Czech built 701s?- I have never seen one up close. Julian H 701 tail complete hoping to finish the rest before petroleum gives out. ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 09:00:47 PM PST US From: JohnDRead@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 7V6-2SP Alignment Hi Mark: I had a similar problem regarding the height of 7V6-2SP when I built my first wing. The positioning template needs to be made very accurately to locate the rear channel. When I was making mine I first made the 715mm dimension from the spar face to the small end, this could cause the problem you are having. The 715 dimn. is not important to the location of the rear spar. I eventually noticed that the dimension should be 696mm. BTW when a dimension is placed in a box it means (Basic) and that extreme accuracy should be used to comply with such dimensions. The 696, 67 and 209 mm dimensions are critical to the location of the rear spar. I also noticed that there was no dimension for the width of the small end of the fixture it should be 45 mm Basic for a snug fit into 7V6-2SP. Fortunately making the fixture long allowed me to correct the initial error. Take a look at the photo guide for the wings Section 2A page 8 of 12, you will notice that the rear channel protrudes above the rib. You can see it in all of the pictures on that page. When the top skin is assembled it pushes the top flange down. My skins were pre-punched and fitted fine. Hope this helps. John Read CH701 in Colorado


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AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 09:58:42 PM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Standard L-angles Hi Ed, It sounds like you are ahead of me again. I am working on the rear top skin. I am a little confused about the angle you mentioned. Is the one you got extruded or bent? The extruded ones they include in the kit are a special size that are not available normally in the USA. I think Zenair has them extruded as a special order with a $1000 minimum or some such thing. That is why they are more expensive than the kind that are made in high volume for distribution to many outlets. If it is a bent piece, then the labor is probably more than the cost of the aluminum. Best regards, Paul XL fuselage do not archive At 06:50 PM 3/5/2007, you wrote: >Has anyone on the list had to order some additional lightweight >L-angles like the ones that are supplied with the kit? I just >ordered some and the price came out to about $7 for a 4 foot piece >of 20mm by 20mm angle .020" thick (6061-T6 bare) plus shipping. Can >that be right? The cost of the aluminum is about $1.67each. Can >there really be $5.33 of labor and profit in such a generic piece of >stock that is kept on hand to be included in every Zenith kit? Had I >suspected that the price was so high, I would have simply >manufactured them myself at home. I expected maybe $3 per piece and >felt that it would be worth having them bent to exactly the same >radius as the pieces that came with the kit. I guess the stupid tax >strikes again! > >Dred >601XL/Jabiru/ middle top skin > >Do Not Archive --------------------------------------------- Paul Mulwitz 32013 NE Dial Road Camas, WA 98607 --------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 10:09:29 PM PST US From: Gary Gower Subject: Zenith-List: test Do not archive Test do not archive. --------------------------------- Don't pick lemons. See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.