Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:09 AM - Rudder Rear Skin Question (rbjjr)
2. 06:19 AM - Re: Rudder Rear Skin Question (Tom Lutz)
3. 06:21 AM - Re: Rudder Rear Skin Question (Tom Lutz)
4. 06:32 AM - Re: Rudder Rear Skin Question (Lee Thomas)
5. 06:55 AM - 6.4mm Reamer? (Stephen R. Look)
6. 07:26 AM - Re: 6.4mm Reamer? (ken smith)
7. 07:29 AM - Re: Rudder Rear Skin Question (Art Gibeaut)
8. 07:34 AM - Re: Rudder Rear Skin Question (AVIIDFLYIER@aol.com)
9. 07:53 AM - Work table (Jerry Hey)
10. 08:42 AM - Re: Work table (Roger Venables)
11. 08:45 AM - Gasse Cappe 701 style (Tommy Walker)
12. 08:47 AM - Sun N Fun BBQ (Gary Burdett)
13. 09:10 AM - extended wing tips (Keystone Engineering LLC)
14. 09:18 AM - Re: Gasse Cappe 701 style (Stanley Challgren)
15. 09:29 AM - Re: Gasse Cappe 701 style (Bryan Martin)
16. 09:41 AM - Re: Work table (dgardea)
17. 09:45 AM - Re: 6.4mm Reamer? (Paul Mulwitz)
18. 11:28 AM - Re: Work table (Ryan Vechinski)
19. 11:46 AM - Re: HF Pnuematic Riveter (Ron Lendon)
20. 12:24 PM - Re: Work table (ernie)
21. 12:55 PM - Leading Edge Flaps on Eagle (ernie)
22. 01:14 PM - Re: Leading Edge Flaps on Eagle ()
23. 01:36 PM - Adding Duct Tape to the Toolbox (601HDS Ribs to Spar) (Mitch Hodges)
24. 01:38 PM - Canopy ideas ()
25. 01:41 PM - Re: Leading Edge Flaps on Eagle (Michael Valentine)
26. 02:02 PM - Re: Adding Duct Tape to the Toolbox (601HDS Ribs to Spar) (David Downey)
27. 02:27 PM - Re: Canopy ideas (Gig Giacona)
28. 03:26 PM - Re: 601 Rudder light fairing fit (Tim Juhl)
29. 04:49 PM - Re: Re: 601 Rudder light fairing fit (Paul Riedlinger)
30. 05:12 PM - Re: Work table (JERICKSON03E@aol.com)
31. 05:20 PM - HF RIVETER SOLUTION (Bill Naumuk)
32. 06:30 PM - Re: Work table (David Downey)
33. 07:35 PM - Re: Work table (raymondj)
34. 07:41 PM - Re: 601 Rudder light fairing fit (Paul Riedlinger)
35. 08:10 PM - Re: Work table (Jerry Hey)
36. 09:56 PM - Re: 6.4mm Reamer? (JohnDRead@aol.com)
37. 10:17 PM - Re: Work table (kevinbonds)
38. 10:21 PM - Re: Work table (kevinbonds)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Rudder Rear Skin Question |
My CH 701 rudder skeleton is nearly done and I'm thinking about the rear skin.
I am following the plans and don't necessarily want to deviate, but it occurred
to me that I might get a cleaner looking and maybe stronger result if I continued
the rear skin all the way down to the bottom of the bottom rib. To me this
would look better than stopping the skin at the top of the bottom rib rather
than taking it down flush with the bottom.
Has anyone done this on the 701? Is it designed this way due to the aluminum sheet
size restriction or for some other reason?
Thanks
Burke Johnson
CH 701
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107242#107242
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Rudder Rear Skin Question |
I'm at the same point you are on my 701 rudder, and as a disclaimer, I am a
complete newbie to building. I didn't think about your suggestion before
trimming the skin, but your idea raises some questions in my mind that I do
not have the answers to. Where would you put the rivet line? Would you put
two rivet lines? If you change the location of the rivet line without
adding a second one, will that let the rudder skin flex more? Will adding a
second rivet line decrease the strength of the bottom rib because of the
extra holes? If you notice similar opportunities to change the original
design, how much accumulated weight will be added to the airframe?
Tom
On 4/16/07, rbjjr <burkeandsusan@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
> My CH 701 rudder skeleton is nearly done and I'm thinking about the rear
> skin.
>
> I am following the plans and don't necessarily want to deviate, but it
> occurred to me that I might get a cleaner looking and maybe stronger result
> if I continued the rear skin all the way down to the bottom of the bottom
> rib. To me this would look better than stopping the skin at the top of the
> bottom rib rather than taking it down flush with the bottom.
>
> Has anyone done this on the 701? Is it designed this way due to the
> aluminum sheet size restriction or for some other reason?
>
> Thanks
>
> Burke Johnson
> CH 701
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107242#107242
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Rudder Rear Skin Question |
Burke,
Did you install your rudder horn yet? I had some problems installing the
horn because the rivets on the very bottom edge of the spar were hitting the
horn rivets. Had to drill out those smaller rivets and install the horn
first.
Tom
On 4/16/07, rbjjr <burkeandsusan@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
> My CH 701 rudder skeleton is nearly done and I'm thinking about the rear
> skin.
>
> I am following the plans and don't necessarily want to deviate, but it
> occurred to me that I might get a cleaner looking and maybe stronger result
> if I continued the rear skin all the way down to the bottom of the bottom
> rib. To me this would look better than stopping the skin at the top of the
> bottom rib rather than taking it down flush with the bottom.
>
> Has anyone done this on the 701? Is it designed this way due to the
> aluminum sheet size restriction or for some other reason?
>
> Thanks
>
> Burke Johnson
> CH 701
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107242#107242
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Rudder Rear Skin Question |
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rbjjr
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 5:08 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Rudder Rear Skin Question
My CH 701 rudder skeleton is nearly done and I'm thinking about the rear
skin.
I did the skin in one piece and it worked out fine.
Lee Thomas
Ch701 (scratch built-plane ready for final inspection)
Message 5
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I started to install the aileron bellcrank yesterday but found that
the bushing doesn't fit. I see the note about reaming the bearing
block to 6.4mm. How do I do that? Do I need to put some kind of lube
on the bushing?
Thanks,
Steve
Steve Look
Monticello, IL
601XL, Corvair
"Dogs have owners, Cats have staff"
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: 6.4mm Reamer? |
You can either buy a reamer the correct size, or spin
the bushing down to fit the existing hole. I measured
my bushings and they were 0.254 inch dia, so I reamed
the holes out with a 0.255 reamer.
regds
Ken
--- "Stephen R. Look" <slook@mchsi.com> wrote:
> <slook@mchsi.com>
>
> I started to install the aileron bellcrank yesterday
> but found that
> the bushing doesn't fit. I see the note about
> reaming the bearing
> block to 6.4mm. How do I do that? Do I need to put
> some kind of lube
> on the bushing?
>
> Thanks,
> Steve
>
> Steve Look
> Monticello, IL
> 601XL, Corvair
> "Dogs have owners, Cats have staff"
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List
>
> Web Forums!
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________________________
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Rudder Rear Skin Question |
I also am a newbie and only a little further along
than you guys are. I'm done with the Rudder, Horiz.
Stab., and the Elevator and here is what I've learned
so far. Build it strictly to the plans. I lurked for
several months here before I decided to build the 701,
and that theme keeps coming back over and over. Even
the most experienced among us will routinely caution
not to deviate. I'm still a rookie at this, so take
this advice for what it is worth. I've had a couple of
instances already where I was tempted to deviate, and
then 5 or 6 steps down the line realized what a
mistake that would have been. This website has a
wealth of advice and encouragement from some great
people, who routinely share the knowledge gained from
their success and their failures. Priceless. Stick to
the plans. I hope you guys are enjoying this as much
as I am.
Do not archive
--- Tom Lutz <tommylutz@gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm at the same point you are on my 701 rudder, and
> as a disclaimer, I am a
> complete newbie to building. I didn't think about
> your suggestion before
> trimming the skin, but your idea raises some
> questions in my mind that I do
> not have the answers to. Where would you put the
> rivet line? Would you put
> two rivet lines? If you change the location of the
> rivet line without
> adding a second one, will that let the rudder skin
> flex more? Will adding a
> second rivet line decrease the strength of the
> bottom rib because of the
> extra holes? If you notice similar opportunities to
> change the original
> design, how much accumulated weight will be added to
> the airframe?
>
> Tom
>
>
> On 4/16/07, rbjjr <burkeandsusan@verizon.net> wrote:
> >
> <burkeandsusan@verizon.net>
> >
> > My CH 701 rudder skeleton is nearly done and I'm
> thinking about the rear
> > skin.
> >
> > I am following the plans and don't necessarily
> want to deviate, but it
> > occurred to me that I might get a cleaner looking
> and maybe stronger result
> > if I continued the rear skin all the way down to
> the bottom of the bottom
> > rib. To me this would look better than stopping
> the skin at the top of the
> > bottom rib rather than taking it down flush with
> the bottom.
> >
> > Has anyone done this on the 701? Is it designed
> this way due to the
> > aluminum sheet size restriction or for some other
> reason?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Burke Johnson
> > CH 701
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> >
>
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107242#107242
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
__________________________________________________
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Rudder Rear Skin Question |
My manual says not to put the rudder horn until later. So I taped it to the
rudder and put away until I am ready to install.
Tom Knox
CH-701 Tail feathers,
Left wing 90%
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 9
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I just ordered the 701 plans this morning. Before they get here I
have time to build the table. Can anyone give me recommendations as
to length and width of the table top. Thanks, Jerry
Message 10
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Jerry
I am building a 701 and I find 12 foot by 4 foot works well
Roger
CH-701, finished building, installing systems
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Hey
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:53 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Work table
I just ordered the 701 plans this morning. Before they get here I
have time to build the table. Can anyone give me recommendations as
to length and width of the table top. Thanks, Jerry
Message 11
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| Subject: | Gasse Cappe 701 style |
Listers,
I noticed the Zenith 701 Demo has vented gas caps with little periscope looking
vent tubes on top. I guess the reason for this is to provide positive pressure
inside the tank during flight. Is anyone else using these type caps, and
if so where did you get them or did you make them?
The ones provided with my tanks have just a smooth dome-shaped cap.
Thanks for all responses.
Tommy Walker in Alabama
Do Archive
--------
Tommy Walker
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107294#107294
Message 12
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Is the 601 BBQ at the camping side of Sun N Fun? That is you don't enter
the gates? I am a potential builder and sure would be interested in
talking with current builders but I don't get in until late Thursday
afternoon.
Message 13
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| Subject: | extended wing tips |
I installed a flat sheet of sheet metal to the flat portion of the wing tip on
my 801. It extends about 3" above the wing in front and about 8" above the trailing
edge. For now I just used 100 mile an hour tape to install it. I installed
one to see if I could detect any change in flight characteristics. I was
hoping for a yawing of the plane indicating less drag. What I got was a rolling
effect. Normally when I fly the plane with just me in the left seat the
left wing is heavy. With the extended wing tip on the left side the plane flew
straight.
What got me started thinking about modifying the wing tip was talking with Bob
Jones who installed "stall fences" on his 701. He said the "Dutch roll" tendency
was greatly reduced. He really like the way it flew. I looked at the latest
thoughts on wing tips and thought can I improve the flight characteristics
a couple of percent.
Has anyone else experimented with this?
Can anyone tell me if I have more lift will you go faster? or slower?
Bill Wilcox
N801BW
Valdez, AK
290 hrs
Spring has finally sprung!
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Gasse Cappe 701 style |
Tommy:
I talked to Roger last year about the gas cap when at the rudder
workshop and he indicated that they could modify the cap to provide
the positive pressure.
Stan
N701VG (Reserved)
On Apr 16, 2007, at 9:45 AM, Tommy Walker wrote:
> <twalker@cableone.net>
>
> Listers,
>
> I noticed the Zenith 701 Demo has vented gas caps with little
> periscope looking vent tubes on top. I guess the reason for this
> is to provide positive pressure inside the tank during flight.
> Is anyone else using these type caps, and if so where did you get
> them or did you make them?
>
> The ones provided with my tanks have just a smooth dome-shaped cap.
> Thanks for all responses.
>
> Tommy Walker in Alabama
> Do Archive
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Gasse Cappe 701 style |
I have similar caps on my 601XL. I have one of the earlier kits
before they went to the flush mounted caps with remote venting. The
vented caps as they came with the kit would siphon small amounts of
fuel out onto the wing during flight when the tanks were full. I had
someone weld the tubing to my caps to put a stop to that.
I don't know if they changed the way the tanks are vented on the
newer 701 kits. If your plane has vent lines installed in the wings
for the tanks leading to external vents like a Cessna, you don't need
vented caps. If the only venting for your tanks are through vented
caps, you can weld the tubes on the caps. I've seen these tubes used
on the gas caps on kit foxes and for the header tank on the Sonex, so
there may be other sources for them.
> <twalker@cableone.net>
>
> I noticed the Zenith 701 Demo has vented gas caps with little
> periscope looking vent tubes on top. I guess the reason for this
> is to provide positive pressure inside the tank during flight.
> Is anyone else using these type caps, and if so where did you get
> them or did you make them?
>
> The ones provided with my tanks have just a smooth dome-shaped cap.
> Thanks for all responses.
>
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
do not archive.
Message 16
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Jerry,
An excellent set of plans for a 4 by 12 table are at http://www.ch601.org/tools.htm
Scroll a bit down the page and look for "table plans". I built this table for my
601XL project.
--------
Dave Gardea
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107312#107312
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/p5270257_163.jpg
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: 6.4mm Reamer? |
Hi Steve,
You need to buy a reamer. You drill the hole to a little bit (.010
or .020 inches) smaller than the reamer size then run the reamer
through the hole to get the final size. I would recommend a hand
reamer, but you can also use a chucking reamer and a drill press or
other drilling machine.
There are many sources of reamers in any size you want. Travers Tool
is a good one for folks near the east coast. On the West coast, MSC
is a good choice.
Lubrication should not be necessary for a slow moving part like the
bell crank, but you might want to apply a little from time to
time. The lube will go between the inside of the bushing and the bolt.
Paul
XL fuselage
At 05:52 AM 4/16/2007, you wrote:
>
>I started to install the aileron bellcrank yesterday but found that
>the bushing doesn't fit. I see the note about reaming the bearing
>block to 6.4mm. How do I do that? Do I need to put some kind of
>lube on the bushing?
>
Message 18
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Jerry, I built mine ~13ft x 4ft, and that is plenty big. I used 2x6's for the
top frame, but if I had to do it again, I would use engineered I-beams. The reason
is they are straight. I thought the 2x6's I used were straight, but when
you start measuring your table top, you see all of the variations in the board.
I used 3/4" BC plywood for the top, but I would use MDF instead. MDF is
extremely flat, and hard.
I went though a lot of extra shimming on my table to get it flat, and it still
is not perfectly flat. If you want to see a picture of my table you can go to
users.tznet.com/~brothapig
I'll send you more pictures off list if you would like them. Happy building.
Ryan
----------------------------------------
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> From: jerryhey@earthlink.net
> Subject: Zenith-List: Work table
> Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 10:52:39 -0400
>
>
> I just ordered the 701 plans this morning. Before they get here I
> have time to build the table. Can anyone give me recommendations as
> to length and width of the table top. Thanks, Jerry
>
>
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: HF Pnuematic Riveter |
I used a couple drops of air tool oil right down the nosepiece and it started grabbing
the shanks again. I think the teeth built up with metal particles and
the oil helped loosen them.
--------
Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107354#107354
Message 20
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Hi,
I used the engineered I-beams. The ones I used had 1x3 top and bottom. I
would use the 2x4 version if I had to do it over again. They were not
perfectly flat, but straight. My Neighbor told me that the ones he has used
in the past were better quality. I think the version with 2x4 top and bottom
would have been the better quality.
http://docs.google.com/View?docid=dhdvd8qv_8gzwkqk&revision=_latest
E.
Do not Archive
On 4/16/07, Ryan Vechinski <brothapig@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Jerry, I built mine ~13ft x 4ft, and that is plenty big. I used 2x6's for
> the top frame, but if I had to do it again, I would use engineered
> I-beams. The reason is they are straight. I thought the 2x6's I used were
> straight, but when you start measuring your table top, you see all of the
> variations in the board. I used 3/4" BC plywood for the top, but I would
> use MDF instead. MDF is extremely flat, and hard.
> I went though a lot of extra shimming on my table to get it flat, and it
> still is not perfectly flat. If you want to see a picture of my table you
> can go to users.tznet.com/~brothapig
> I'll send you more pictures off list if you would like them. Happy
> building.
>
> Ryan
>
>
> ----------------------------------------
> > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> > From: jerryhey@earthlink.net
> > Subject: Zenith-List: Work table
> > Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 10:52:39 -0400
> >
> >
> > I just ordered the 701 plans this morning. Before they get here I
> > have time to build the table. Can anyone give me recommendations as
> > to length and width of the table top. Thanks, Jerry
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Leading Edge Flaps on Eagle |
Not directly related to zenith but interesting I hope.
http://www.eng.cam.ac.uk/photocomp/2006/noelly42_1.shtml
The image shows the potential importance of the leading edge flap seen
deployed from the wing in the upper frame as the eagle comes in to land. It
has been hypothesized that this flap acts as a high lift device, increasing
the lifting force of the wing at low speeds and high angles of attack, in
order to delay stall and afford the bird increased control during landings
and manoeuvres. Recent wind tunnel experiments taking place in the Aerolab
have shown that the flap is able to almost double the lift in a certain
range of Reynolds number and angles of attack. In the flight test portrayed
by the lower frame, the flap failed to deploy, and the bird missed his
targeted landing by several inches. The photograph is comprised of images
from two separate video clips taken in Denmark on a research trip to study a
Steppe Eagle.
Do Not Archive
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Leading Edge Flaps on Eagle |
I'll bet a dollar that someone is out there at this very minute removing the leading
edge flaps form his or her Steppe Eagle to reduce drag / increase cruise
speed.
Dred
---- ernie <ernieth@gmail.com> wrote:
> Not directly related to zenith but interesting I hope.
>
> http://www.eng.cam.ac.uk/photocomp/2006/noelly42_1.shtml
Do Not Archive
Message 23
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| Subject: | Adding Duct Tape to the Toolbox (601HDS Ribs to Spar) |
Isn't always amazing how the second of two subsystems never takes as long as the
first? With experience come knowledge, and a little luck.
One thing I have to share, since I haven't seen this "method" in the archives,
is the method I used to attach and hold the nose and rear ribs yesterday while
I drilled the pilot holes through the spar.
On the right wing, I used the system outlined in the builder sequence manual with
the clamps, etc. It worked but took me a long full day to do by myself.
As I was looking at the next wing yesterday, it occurred to me, why not just tape
them on! I grabbed my handy-dandy roll of bright yellow duct tape, lined each
rib up along their rivet lines, checked with a square and taped them down
by running a piece of tape along the rib flange to the spar.
I taped all the nose ribs first, drilled the holes, removed them, taped the rear
ribs in place, drilled them, and finished the whole process in well less than
an hour! Duct tape held like a champ, and came right off with no residue (although
I cleaned it just to be sure).
You do have to watch and make sure they don't slip off their lines, but none of
mine moved as long as I used a backup block held behind while drilling and I
made sure the tape was securely attached.
I think I've found a new builder's friend!
Mitch Hodges
--------
N601MH (Zenith 601HDS)
Wings Under Construction
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107391#107391
Message 24
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Hi Guys,
I'm about 80% done with the canopy on my 601XL and I have a thought to share
with the list. I recall lots of references to cutting a little oval slot in the
inside flashing of the canopy frame to allow us to release the latch with a
small screwdriver if the cable release linkage fails. I don't however recall
anyone saying anything about access to release the latch form outside the plane
in such a case.
Of course, one could unscrew all the self tapping screws and remove the bubble
from the canopy frame but I would like something simpler if the need arises.
So, I've decided to drill a 1/4" hole through the steel plate between the rear
bow tube socket and the latch mechanism and tap it for 5/16" x 18 threads to
accept an allen socket set screw (to serve as a plug in the hole). The hole
will be in line with the latch release lever to allow me to reach through with
a small screwdriver to release the latch from outside the airplane. The set screw
will seal the hole (with removable Loctite) until that access is needed,
if ever. Since the set screw is only about 1/4" long, it will not protrude significantly
from the side of the airplane, nor will it interfere with the movement
of the latch release lever. The outside flashing will be back-drilled at 5/16"
to align over the hole. The entire project adds no significant weight and
costs about 70 cents. It could save a lot of grief someday if the cable linkage
fails (like away from home base, for instance).
I am also planning to make riveted (or screw retained) access hatches over the
cable end adjustment fittings in the inside flashing on both sides for future
cable slack adjustment. Why have the adjustment devices if we have no access
to them, right?
While I'm fairly certain that I'm not the first builder to do these little innovations,
I don't remember anyone mentioning it for the list to consider. Anybody
got other wonderful suggestions to consider before I rivet the canopy frame
together in a week or so?
Dred
PS: After I woke up at 3AM a few nights in a row, I finally got the mental picture
of what I needed to do to properly adjust the side frames, the rear bow tube
sockets and the rear bow itself. After that I didn't feel like cussing every
time I looked at the canopy frame. It was sort of like a twelve step program
for amature aircraft builders. I feel much better now, thanks.
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Leading Edge Flaps on Eagle |
Yeah, but apparently at the cost of reducing the landing accuracy of said
Eagle! Maybe you get both benefits with vertex generators, but I bet the
Eagles hate the duct tape needed to stick them on.
Michael in NH
do not archive
On 4/16/07, dredmoody@cox.net <dredmoody@cox.net> wrote:
>
>
> I'll bet a dollar that someone is out there at this very minute removing
> the leading edge flaps form his or her Steppe Eagle to reduce drag /
> increase cruise speed.
>
> Dred
>
> ---- ernie <ernieth@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Not directly related to zenith but interesting I hope.
> >
> > http://www.eng.cam.ac.uk/photocomp/2006/noelly42_1.shtml
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Adding Duct Tape to the Toolbox (601HDS Ribs to Spar) |
Hi Mitch;
Any chance that you have a couple of photos to demonstrate the specifics of what
you did?
Do not archive.
Mitch Hodges <n601mh@HODGES.INFO> wrote:
Isn't always amazing how the second of two subsystems never takes as long as the
first? With experience come knowledge, and a little luck.
One thing I have to share, since I haven't seen this "method" in the archives,
is the method I used to attach and hold the nose and rear ribs yesterday while
I drilled the pilot holes through the spar.
On the right wing, I used the system outlined in the builder sequence manual with
the clamps, etc. It worked but took me a long full day to do by myself.
As I was looking at the next wing yesterday, it occurred to me, why not just tape
them on! I grabbed my handy-dandy roll of bright yellow duct tape, lined each
rib up along their rivet lines, checked with a square and taped them down by
running a piece of tape along the rib flange to the spar.
I taped all the nose ribs first, drilled the holes, removed them, taped the rear
ribs in place, drilled them, and finished the whole process in well less than
an hour! Duct tape held like a champ, and came right off with no residue (although
I cleaned it just to be sure).
You do have to watch and make sure they don't slip off their lines, but none of
mine moved as long as I used a backup block held behind while drilling and I
made sure the tape was securely attached.
I think I've found a new builder's friend!
Mitch Hodges
--------
N601MH (Zenith 601HDS)
Wings Under Construction
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107391#107391
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
Zodiac 601XL/Corvair?
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Canopy ideas |
Well Dred since you got yours fignured out you want to come up here and work on
mine? The construction manual is about || this close to useless on canopy installation.
DO NOT ARCHIVE
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107401#107401
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: 601 Rudder light fairing fit |
I would use the heat and a flat piece of aluminum to push the edges down that attach
to the rudder. As to where the light attaches..... rough up the gel coat
and apply a little superfil between the fiberglass and the metal piece. Cover
the bottom of the metal piece with duct tape as the superfil will not adhere
to that. After it sets up you can sand it conform with the rest of the piece.
You will probably use superfil or a mix of resin and microballoons in other places
to fix the fiberglass pieces. DO NOT use polyester resins..... epoxy resin
such as the west system works best. Polyester resins will shrink with time.
Tim
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=107413#107413
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: 601 Rudder light fairing fit |
Thanks for the suggestions Tim.
Paul Riedlinger
paulried@rogers.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Juhl
Sent: April-16-07 6:25 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 601 Rudder light fairing fit
I would use the heat and a flat piece of aluminum to push the edges down
that attach to the rudder. As to where the light attaches..... rough up
the gel coat and apply a little superfil between the fiberglass and the
metal piece. Cover the bottom of the metal piece with duct tape as the
superfil will not adhere to that. After it sets up you can sand it conform
with the rest of the piece.
You will probably use superfil or a mix of resin and microballoons in other
places to fix the fiberglass pieces. DO NOT use polyester resins.....
epoxy resin such as the west system works best. Polyester resins will
shrink with time.
Tim
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on wings
Message 30
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In a message dated 4/16/2007 9:54:16 AM Central Daylight Time,
jerryhey@earthlink.net writes:
I just ordered the 701 plans this morning. Before they get here I
have time to build the table. Can anyone give me recommendations as
to length and width of the table top. Thanks, Jerry
------
Jerry,
For a FLAT and moveable work table I used the two sections of a new, Home
Depot, extension ladder.
Sixteen foot ladder, remove the fittings from the ends, space out plywood top
surface down on the floor & lay out ladder sections with about 3 in
clearance all around to clamp to during construction.
Drill clearance holes through the rails for # ten sheet metal screws, about
3/4 in long, pan head PHILIPS head. Screw through ladder rails at about ten in
spacing or so. Use good quality plywood that is flat to start with, Home Depot
again.
Layout is with both ladder sections laying next to ea. other. Screws through
each of the four rails. Pilot holes only into the plywood.
Then screw two boards across the four ladder rails, cross wise to form kind
of a box beam. Place them where you think the legs should be ~~~~~. Box beam
makes it strong & keeps it flat too.
Use whatever legs you like, I used two small folding leg tables, sawhorses
are used by others. That allows the height of the work table to be lowered later
with shorter legs, or other supports. Just clamp it as needed.
The ladder I used was 16 foot extension, and resulted in a 10 1/2 foot long
by 4 foot wide work table. It fits in my work shop, just right for my 701
construction. Use the length you need for your length table. Measure the ladder
extensions before you buy it, to satisfy yourself they are the same width, yes
they are made to slide into each other, not a factor here though.
The result is a FLAT & light weight work table, that goes together quickly.
Cost is a wash, and the aluminum ladder rails are straight to start with and
have stayed straight. I studied wood beam work tables & the tables at ZAC. Most
were heavy and less than flat when I saw them.
Be aware that the FLAT plywood table top is the tooling here. It gets
screws, holes, slots, and whatever is needed to serve to make the aircraft parts
along the way. It is the way the designer helps us build correctly, no twist that
is. Flat is Flat. Level is another condition, useful now and then, as in
joining the fuselage sections.
Happy Building
Jerry Erickson, EAA TC & 701 builder.
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 31
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| Subject: | HF RIVETER SOLUTION |
All-
Tore my riveter apart and found that the collar that holds the
nosepiece rivet grippers against the spring had worked loose so there
was no spring tension. The grippers were flopping around with no purpose
in life.
I hand tightened the collar and pulled 3 A5s "In the air" so I could
watch the action. No problems. At 17 cents apiece, I figured this was
all the proof of concept testing I could afford.
I'll wait until I've pulled a few "Real" rivets to find out if
everything is OK, then wrench tighten the collar.
Sketch attached.
Good building!
Bill Naumuk
HDS Fuse/Corvair
Townville, Pa
Message 32
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Here is another place where a couple of images would really be nice. Please post
them if available. Thank you.
do not archive
JERICKSON03E@aol.com wrote: ...Jerry,
For a FLAT and moveable work table I used the two sections of a new, Home Depot,
extension ladder.
Sixteen foot ladder, remove the fittings from the ends, space out plywood top
surface down on the floor & lay out ladder sections with about 3 in clearance
all around to clamp to during construction.....
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
Zodiac 601XL/Corvair?
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Message 33
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Greetings,
Some engineered lumber beams use LVL (looks like thick plywood) for the
flanges. I think they might be straighter than the ones with regular lumber
for the flanges.
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of ernie
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 2:14 PM
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Work table
Hi,
I used the engineered I-beams. The ones I used had 1x3 top and bottom. I
would use the 2x4 version if I had to do it over again. They were not
perfectly flat, but straight. My Neighbor told me that the ones he has used
in the past were better quality. I think the version with 2x4 top and bottom
would have been the better quality.
http://docs.google.com/View?docid=dhdvd8qv_8gzwkqk&revision=_latest
E.
Do not Archive
On 4/16/07, Ryan Vechinski <brothapig@hotmail.com> wrote:
<brothapig@hotmail.com>
Jerry, I built mine ~13ft x 4ft, and that is plenty big. I used 2x6's
for the top frame, but if I had to do it again, I would use engineered
I-beams. The reason is they are straight. I thought the 2x6's I used were
straight, but when you start measuring your table top, you see all of the
variations in the board. I used 3/4" BC plywood for the top, but I would
use MDF instead. MDF is extremely flat, and hard.
I went though a lot of extra shimming on my table to get it flat, and it
still is not perfectly flat. If you want to see a picture of my table you
can go to users.tznet.com/~brothapig
I'll send you more pictures off list if you would like them. Happy
building.
Ryan
----------------------------------------
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> From: jerryhey@earthlink.net
> Subject: Zenith-List: Work table
> Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 10:52:39 -0400
>
>
> I just ordered the 701 plans this morning. Before they get here I
> have time to build the table. Can anyone give me recommendations as
> to length and width of the table top. Thanks, Jerry
Message 34
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| Subject: | 601 Rudder light fairing fit |
Just to finish this thread up, thanks to all of the people who replied.
I used an old heat gun I had from my model airplane days (used to shrink
Monocote) and it took me all of 5 minutes to fix the problem. I left the
fairing clecoed to the rudder, and in heating the part up, it just naturally
fell down to the rudder surface! Nice. It is not perfect, but a whole lot
better than before. The rest can be handled with superfil
Cheers
Paul Riedlinger
paulried@rogers.com
_____
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David Downey
Sent: April 15, 2007 6:33 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601 Rudder light fairing fit
I have seen this come by several times and this is just a thought:
The tail is not mass balanced but the plane flies slowly so the idea of
flutter is not very alarming. Notching the rudder trailing edge to achieve a
cosmetic effect is not something to do lightly as any "loosening" of the
control surface will reduce whatever flutter margin there is to some degree.
A nicely faired external fitting is also quite possible.
Jeff <jeffrey_davidson@earthlink.net> wrote:
Well Paul, your fiberglass fairing looks better than mine! I'm just about
to install it too. For mine, I will heat it up and try to get a little
better shape out of the fiberglass. The fit as it came really is not
acceptable. It is too late for me, but if this fairing is installed as the
rudder is built, the fairing can be installed with the fiberglass flange on
the inside giving a much cleaner installation.
Jeff Davidson
_____
I have fitted the supplied fiberglass fairing for the rudder nav light but
it is so poorly made that the surface where the aluminum mounting bracket
sits is not flat (about 1/8" height difference on the mold line where the
two halves are joined). Also and likely more importantly, the edges of the
fairing curl up away from the rudder skin when it is clecoed in place. How
do you get the fairing to lay flush with the rudder skin?
I
_____
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check out
new cars at Yahoo! Autos.
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc
=X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM->
Message 35
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I like this surprising table construction. Simple, inexpensive and
accurate. I will be checking the ladders at Home Depot next time I
am in town. Thanks, Jerry
On Apr 16, 2007, at 8:12 PM, JERICKSON03E@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 4/16/2007 9:54:16 AM Central Daylight Time,
> jerryhey@earthlink.net writes:
>
> I just ordered the 701 plans this morning. Before they get here I
> have time to build the table. Can anyone give me recommendations as
> to length and width of the table top. Thanks, Jerry
> ------
>
> Jerry,
> For a FLAT and moveable work table I used the two sections of a
> new, Home Depot, extension ladder.
> Sixteen foot ladder, remove the fittings from the ends, space out
> plywood top surface down on the floor & lay out ladder sections
> with about 3 in clearance all around to clamp to during construction.
>
> Drill clearance holes through the rails for # ten sheet metal
> screws, about 3/4 in long, pan head PHILIPS head. Screw through
> ladder rails at about ten in spacing or so. Use good quality
> plywood that is flat to start with, Home Depot again.
>
> Layout is with both ladder sections laying next to ea. other.
> Screws through each of the four rails. Pilot holes only into the
> plywood.
>
> Then screw two boards across the four ladder rails, cross wise to
> form kind of a box beam. Place them where you think the legs should
> be ~~~~~. Box beam makes it strong & keeps it flat too.
>
> Use whatever legs you like, I used two small folding leg tables,
> sawhorses are used by others. That allows the height of the work
> table to be lowered later with shorter legs, or other supports.
> Just clamp it as needed.
>
> The ladder I used was 16 foot extension, and resulted in a 10 1/2
> foot long by 4 foot wide work table. It fits in my work shop, just
> right for my 701 construction. Use the length you need for your
> length table. Measure the ladder extensions before you buy it, to
> satisfy yourself they are the same width, yes they are made to
> slide into each other, not a factor here though.
>
> The result is a FLAT & light weight work table, that goes together
> quickly. Cost is a wash, and the aluminum ladder rails are straight
> to start with and have stayed straight. I studied wood beam work
> tables & the tables at ZAC. Most were heavy and less than flat when
> I saw them.
>
> Be aware that the FLAT plywood table top is the tooling here. It
> gets screws, holes, slots, and whatever is needed to serve to make
> the aircraft parts along the way. It is the way the designer helps
> us build correctly, no twist that is. Flat is Flat. Level is
> another condition, useful now and then, as in joining the fuselage
> sections.
>
> Happy Building
>
> Jerry Erickson, EAA TC & 701 builder.
>
>
> See what's free at AOL.com.
>
>
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: 6.4mm Reamer? |
A letter "F" drill is 0.254 diameter and works just fine.
John
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 37
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Take a look at my worktable construction page here
http://home.comcast.net/~kevinbonds/Worktable.htm
Kevin Bonds
Nashville TN
601XL Plans building.
http://home.comcast.net/~kevinbonds
do not archive DO NOT ARCHIVE
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Hey
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 9:53 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Work table
I just ordered the 701 plans this morning. Before they get here I
have time to build the table. Can anyone give me recommendations as
to length and width of the table top. Thanks, Jerry
Message 38
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Engineered I-beams aren't perfectly straight either. My table is
unbelievably flat. No shimming required.
http://home.comcast.net/~kevinbonds/Worktable.htm
Kevin Bonds
Nashville TN
601XL Plans building.
http://home.comcast.net/~kevinbonds
do not archive DO NOT ARCHIVE
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ryan Vechinski
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 1:27 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Work table
Jerry, I built mine ~13ft x 4ft, and that is plenty big. I used 2x6's for
the top frame, but if I had to do it again, I would use engineered I-beams.
The reason is they are straight. I thought the 2x6's I used were straight,
but when you start measuring your table top, you see all of the variations
in the board. I used 3/4" BC plywood for the top, but I would use MDF
instead. MDF is extremely flat, and hard.
I went though a lot of extra shimming on my table to get it flat, and it
still is not perfectly flat. If you want to see a picture of my table you
can go to users.tznet.com/~brothapig
I'll send you more pictures off list if you would like them. Happy
building.
Ryan
----------------------------------------
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> From: jerryhey@earthlink.net
> Subject: Zenith-List: Work table
> Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 10:52:39 -0400
>
>
> I just ordered the 701 plans this morning. Before they get here I
> have time to build the table. Can anyone give me recommendations as
> to length and width of the table top. Thanks, Jerry
>
>
>
>
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