Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:36 AM - XL main Spring gear placement (chris Sinfield)
2. 04:48 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (leinad)
3. 05:08 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (Gary Ray)
4. 05:31 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (Paul Mulwitz)
5. 05:49 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (chris Sinfield)
6. 05:55 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (Bryan Martin)
7. 07:20 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (Tim Juhl)
8. 08:53 AM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (Dan)
9. 08:57 AM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair/ not moral (Big Gee)
10. 09:19 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (robert stone)
11. 09:23 AM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (Afterfxllc@aol.com)
12. 09:23 AM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (Big Gee)
13. 09:34 AM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair/ not moral (Afterfxllc@aol.com)
14. 09:36 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (Craig Payne)
15. 10:24 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (David Downey)
16. 10:29 AM - Compass Errors (Jeffrey A Beachy)
17. 10:55 AM - Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (Robin Bellach)
18. 11:08 AM - Re: Compass Errors (T. Graziano)
19. 11:23 AM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (LHusky@aol.com)
20. 11:26 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (T. Graziano)
21. 11:51 AM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (Big Gee)
22. 12:10 PM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (afterfxllc@aol.com)
23. 12:13 PM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (afterfxllc@aol.com)
24. 12:23 PM - Re: Re: XL main Spring gear placement (afterfxllc@aol.com)
25. 12:27 PM - Re: Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL (Big Gee)
26. 12:52 PM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL (John Bolding)
27. 02:54 PM - Re: Re: Compass Errors (Edward Moody II)
28. 04:02 PM - Re: Re: Compass Errors (Bryan Martin)
29. 04:16 PM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement (Bryan Martin)
30. 05:05 PM - Prop for sale (Randy Stout)
31. 05:56 PM - Re: Prop for sale (Craig Payne)
32. 06:41 PM - Re: Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL (T. Graziano)
33. 07:13 PM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (Dan)
34. 07:24 PM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (afterfxllc@aol.com)
35. 07:41 PM - Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL (Robin Bellach)
36. 07:47 PM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (Dan)
37. 08:34 PM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (Afterfxllc@aol.com)
38. 08:42 PM - Re: Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL (Afterfxllc@aol.com)
39. 08:55 PM - Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair (David Mikesell)
40. 10:08 PM - Re:Re:XL main Spring gear placement/REVERSEAL (MaxNr@aol.com)
41. 11:27 PM - Re: Running electrical cables (Craig Payne)
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| Subject: | XL main Spring gear placement |
OK Gang
Which way does the XL Main spring gear go?? Is it flat side to the raer or to the
FWD side?
My photoguide shows flat side to the rear but the plans on page 6-3-G shows it
with the arrow frwd. Now I have seen other pictures of it in both ways on other
sites. But which is correct. I rang the factory but everyone was away at S&F.
Does it make much difference? Is it better for Cof G to have it one way or the
other?
Just an AUSSIE thought.. is FRWD short for Forward or Flat RearWarDs??
I will have the Jab 3300 hanging on the nose.
Chris..
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=108428#108428
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
Chris,
I'm not sure what version of the plans you have, but my plans show the flat side
aft, and the angle side forward. Same page 6G3. My plans date 12/03. I don't
have tail dragger plans, but I believe they put they put the flat side forward.
Dan
--------
Scratch building XL with Corvair Engine
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=108429#108429
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
Chris
The argument was :
If you reverse the original placement it would move the wheels about 2"
forward making it easier to hold the nose wheel off after a landing during
the roll out and make it easier to lift the front wheel during takeoff.
The Con is that you have to be more carefull during entry so you don't
rock backward onto the tail when somebody uses the boarding steps.
My gear is in the original more rearward position and it is not difficult
however the nosewheel does carry about 100 pounds more weight than either of
the main gear. It is definitely not the strongest part of the gear system.
In a normal landing I am not able to hold the nosewheel off the ground after
the mains touch down.
If I did it again, I would opt for gear placement that is more forward and
consider leaving the step off because I find it easier to mount the wing
from the front anyway. I just sit on the main spar and slide rearward a
little to enter the cabin. Less weight , less drag, less time to construct.
FWIW
Gary Ray
----- Original Message -----
From: "chris Sinfield" <chris_sinfield@yahoo.com.au>
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 7:35 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: XL main Spring gear placement
<chris_sinfield@yahoo.com.au>
>
> OK Gang
> Which way does the XL Main spring gear go?? Is it flat side to the raer or
to the FWD side?
>
> My photoguide shows flat side to the rear but the plans on page 6-3-G
shows it with the arrow frwd. Now I have seen other pictures of it in both
ways on other sites. But which is correct. I rang the factory but everyone
was away at S&F.
>
> Does it make much difference? Is it better for Cof G to have it one way or
the other?
>
> Just an AUSSIE thought.. is FRWD short for Forward or Flat RearWarDs??
>
> I will have the Jab 3300 hanging on the nose.
> Chris..
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=108428#108428
>
>
> --
6:43 PM
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
Hi Chris,
My plans also show the flat side forward. I believe this is the
correct choice. However, I doubt the difference is huge.
I have heard there are some times when the nose tends to hit the
runway rather firmly on landings. Moving the main gear a little
forward by positioning the main gear spring with the flat side
forward may reduce this tendency a little bit. The only risk I can
see with this approach is the possibility that a really aft CG might
make the plane want to sit on its tail instead of the nose
wheel. This seems rather unlikely to be a condition where flight is possible.
I plan to install my gear with the flat side forward (soon, I hope).
Best regards,
Paul
XL Fuselage (nearly done)
At 03:35 AM 4/22/2007, you wrote:
><chris_sinfield@yahoo.com.au>
>
>OK Gang
>Which way does the XL Main spring gear go?? Is it flat side to the
>raer or to the FWD side?
>
>My photoguide shows flat side to the rear but the plans on page
>6-3-G shows it with the arrow frwd. Now I have seen other pictures
>of it in both ways on other sites. But which is correct. I rang the
>factory but everyone was away at S&F.
>
>Does it make much difference? Is it better for Cof G to have it one
>way or the other?
>
>Just an AUSSIE thought.. is FRWD short for Forward or Flat RearWarDs??
>
>I will have the Jab 3300 hanging on the nose.
>Chris..
>
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
Thanks for the replys already
I have the latest set of plans March 06 and its the normal version not Tail wheel.
With a Jab 3300 engine I believe the Cof G is a little aft anyway is this correct?
so it would be worse if the flat was FWD
Chris
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=108439#108439
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
I believe the original plans called for the flat side to the rear.
With a heavier engine, this puts the main wheels far enough behind
the normal CG that it's a little bit hard to lift the nosewheel for
takeoff or hold it off during landing. With my Subaru, for example, I
have to apply a lot of back pressure to rotate and as soon as the
mains leave the ground, the plane wants to pitch up so I have to be
prepared to release the back pressure right away. On landing, the
reverse applies, the nose wants to drop rapidly as soon as the mains
touch down. It's not a big problem but it's something to get used to.
I think the newer plans call for the flat side forward and I've seen
that the LSAs being built at AMD have the gear this way. The photo
guide probably reflects the older plans. I've done some calculations
and I figure that putting the flat side forward would move the mains
about four inches forward. With my airplane that would still put the
mains far enough back that I could climb in and out without tilting
the plane back on its tail, even with the plane loaded for gross
weight and maximum aft CG. Two people might not be able to climb in
at the same time though. It really wouldn't be a big deal to turn it
around the other way, just pull off the mains, flip the spring
around, re-mount the mains and then re-attach the brake lines the the
spring. I've though about turning my main spring around but just
haven't gotten around to it yet. If I were building it today knowing
what I do now, I would build it with the flat side forward.
> <chris_sinfield@yahoo.com.au>
>
> OK Gang
> Which way does the XL Main spring gear go?? Is it flat side to the
> rear or to the FWD side?
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
The AMD model does have the gear turned flat side forward. Remember that the factory
built aircraft uses the 0-200 which weighs in around 210-220 lbs I believe.
The Jabiru installed weight is 178 lbs. Other differences include whether
you use a wood or metal prop and how heavy you load up the instrument panel.
15 gal vs 12 gal tanks can make a difference too.
Mark Townsend of CanZac told me that aircraft with the gear flat side forward have
more of a tendancy to ground the tail when you climb on the step. Contrast
that to a slightly ground-hugging takeoff roll and I think I'll try my Jab equipped
XL with the gear flat side rearward.
I carefully examine all the comments from those already flying for gems of wisdom
so keep them coming :-)
Tim
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=108448#108448
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
Let me get this straight. This is the same "gentleman" who a while back
was flaming WW on this and other lists because he hadn't received the
parts he had ordered, which he needed to complete a airplane which he
had already sold for comercial gain, and was building another probably
with the same intent. As I recall he got a one piece cowl from William,
and now he has apparently pulled a plug from it and intends to profit
from his illegal copyright infringement. I will either order a cowl from
William, or build my own when I reach that stage of the game. When I
complete and fly my 601 someday, I will be proud of what I have done and
not have to hide my face from William when he looks at my plane. Dan
----- Original Message -----
From: Craig Payne
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2007 7:15 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
> That's because I used his nose bowl to make the the first mold.
Ah, I missed this in your earlier posts.
> I was thinking of renting the molds out so builders that have
bought WW manual and have the right to build their own stuff could save
some money and build their own and I would spray the gel coat and the
release in the mold for you so you would just have to lay it up. I'm not
quite sure yet.
I think you should re-read the "Product Rights Agreement" you signed
when you bought your conversion manual from William:
"6. Buyer will not receive any form of compensation for work related
to information, parts, or products. The sole exception being the resale
of a single engine produced from a single Conversion Manual."
www.flycorvair.com/liability.html
> ... I have the same right to improve on someone's design. I will be
flight testing this Cowl in a few weeks and after it is flight proven I
will either sell the cowling's or rent the mold out.
I don't recall William making a mold from someone else's design. I do
recall him saying he would not reprint information from the Pietenpol
conversion as it belonged to Bernie's heirs. Heck, William won't even
reprint the torque pattern for Corvairs that Richard Finch invented.
Instead he recommends you buy a copy of Finch's book.
Odd that you haven't posted your plans on the Corvaircraft list. Maybe
it is because you are no longer welcome there.
Or maybe this is another April Fools joke?
"If anyone needs the old style prop hub or a nose bowl either a 1
piece or a 2 piece please contact me off list."
www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=2&hit=2
"Ok Guys let me start off saying APRIL FOOLS"
www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=10
William seems to think you had had second thought about this:
<quote from April 7th>
Last week we heard from Jeff who proposed making copies of our parts.
Although Jeff later claimed it was an April Fool's joke, the issue was
really settled when I directly called Jeff and spoke with him on the
telephone. He'd made the original post when he was angry, but in
conversation I pointed out that he'd been our guest at Corvair College
#10, and proposing to make jigs and tooling directly off our parts and
reselling them was really a bad move. Not to mention he'd signed our
standard product rights agreement. It's a plain language agreement that
forbids doing just what Jeff proposed when he was angry. He conceded
this, and after a friendly hour long phone call, he chose to bow out of
the situation by claiming it was an April Fool's joke. Nobody's being
coerced into not making Corvair parts. Reasonable people understand that
it's not ethical to make clones of our products. Even Jeff understood
this. This is a good example of how direct talk and a phone call solved
95% of these issues.
<end quote>
www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=2
I know you will post a rebuttal to all this but I won't bother
replying - your actions speak for themselves.
As you are completely morally blind I know my words will have no
effect on you. I just hope they will influence any potential customers
to avoid you. As a practical matter I don't know why anyone would trust
their life to parts from you.
Give my regards to Rhonda.
-- Craig
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
4/21/2007 11:56 AM
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair/ not moral |
Another sad part of this whole story is: If your workmanship starts to fail,
William W. will get the blame for it.
Fritz
Afterfxllc@aol.com wrote:
Nope no April fools joke
And This list isn't run by Mark either. I don't really care about the corvaircraft
list it is just a WW list and if anyone has an idea that isn't Williams
they are flamed.
I Will sell the cowl and I don't think it is in any way infringing on William.
If you want a 2 piece cowl then go to William and buy your self one.
I never said I was going to make a profit from selling the 1 or 2 piece nose
bowl I said I might rent out the mold and I did say might. Some of us here can't
afford a 400.00 nose bowl or a 600.00 prop hub so this could just be a nice
alternative.
Flame away I can take it but several have emailed me wanting to know about the
cowling and if they want to stay anonymous that is fine with me.
As I said before my # is 502-644-8123 but most just like to flame here but My
cowl is simply an improvement and if some can't deal with that find the delete
key.
Jeff
---------------------------------
See what's free at AOL.com.
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
Members,
I am running a Jabiru 3300 engine in my Zodiac601XL and it does the
same thing, that is requires more that usual back pressure to rotate and
when it does the nose pitches up sharply and requires immediate forward
pressure to prevent stall. I was told this was an easy airplane to fly but
this is not true. Every spam can I ever flew prior to flying the ZodiacXL
was much easer than this one.
Tracy Stone
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bryan Martin" <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 7:55 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: XL main Spring gear placement
>
> I believe the original plans called for the flat side to the rear. With a
> heavier engine, this puts the main wheels far enough behind the normal CG
> that it's a little bit hard to lift the nosewheel for takeoff or hold it
> off during landing. With my Subaru, for example, I have to apply a lot
> of back pressure to rotate and as soon as the mains leave the ground, the
> plane wants to pitch up so I have to be prepared to release the back
> pressure right away. On landing, the reverse applies, the nose wants to
> drop rapidly as soon as the mains touch down. It's not a big problem but
> it's something to get used to.
>
> I think the newer plans call for the flat side forward and I've seen that
> the LSAs being built at AMD have the gear this way. The photo guide
> probably reflects the older plans. I've done some calculations and I
> figure that putting the flat side forward would move the mains about four
> inches forward. With my airplane that would still put the mains far
> enough back that I could climb in and out without tilting the plane back
> on its tail, even with the plane loaded for gross weight and maximum aft
> CG. Two people might not be able to climb in at the same time though. It
> really wouldn't be a big deal to turn it around the other way, just pull
> off the mains, flip the spring around, re-mount the mains and then
> re-attach the brake lines the the spring. I've though about turning my
> main spring around but just haven't gotten around to it yet. If I were
> building it today knowing what I do now, I would build it with the flat
> side forward.
>
>
>> <chris_sinfield@yahoo.com.au>
>>
>> OK Gang
>> Which way does the XL Main spring gear go?? Is it flat side to the rear
>> or to the FWD side?
>
>
> --
> Bryan Martin
> N61BM, CH 601 XL,
> RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
In a message dated 4/22/2007 11:54:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
hillsgun@nwinfo.net writes:
Let me get this straight. This is the same "gentleman" who a while back was
flaming WW on this and other lists because he hadn't received the parts he
had ordered, which he needed to complete an airplane which he had already sold
for commercial gain, and was building another probably with the same intent.
As I recall he got a one piece cowl from William, and now he has apparently
pulled a plug from it and intends to profit from his illegal copyright
infringement. I will either order a cowl from William, or build my own when I
reach
that stage of the game. When I complete and fly my 601 someday, I will be
proud of what I have done and not have to hide my face from William when he
looks at my plane. Dan
You got it sorta right Dan. First of all You have every right to buy your
one piece Nose bowl from William but if you want a 2 piece cowl you will be shit
outa luck. Most if not all Williams products are improvements on others and
this is no different. At first I was gonna build it the way William built his
but I didn't like the way the top hinges leak water all over the engine. If
you own a hanger and will never get caught in the rain than by all means
follow Williams design but this 601 will be kept outside and with my new and
improved cowl it will keep the engine warm and dry.
And yes I had a nearly complete 601 I sold but couldn't afford to finish so
I had to sell it to a very nice man who asked me if I could assist him in
finishing his airplane and I said I would be glad to. So to say I sold it for
gain is not true but I guess you have more money than brains so you will never
understand how you it is impossible for some builder to shell out 600. for a
hub or 450.00 for a nose bowl. I never said I would make a profit from the
nose bowls I said I might rent them out so builders that have bought Williams
manual and have the RIGHT to build their own nosebowl now can. Hell zenith will
rent or loan you the jigs to make you ribs for a scratch build. So get off
your high horse and read.
One other point I need to make is that after an email from a list member and
talking to my neighbor who is an aero space engineer I have yet another
improvement on the Nose bowl and that is I am adding more radius on the inlets
so
in reality Williams nose bowl was the start of making a better nose bowl
which will create less drag and offer more airflow to the engine. But since the
only one that can improve others products I guess you will have to wait until
you can buy one from him but then that would then be my idea huh?
Jeff
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
Very well said Dan, I agree 100%. I have talked to William W. several times
on the phone to help me in my decision making on deciding which engine I will
be installing in my XL.
I look forward to one day to meeting WW in person, being proud of my accomplishments
and telling him "thanks" in person.
Fritz
Dan <hillsgun@nwinfo.net> wrote:
Let me get this straight. This is the same "gentleman" who a while back
was flaming WW on this and other lists because he hadn't received the parts
he had ordered, which he needed to complete a airplane which he had already
sold for comercial gain, and was building another probably with the same intent.
As I recall he got a one piece cowl from William, and now he has apparently
pulled a plug from it and intends to profit from his illegal copyright infringement.
I will either order a cowl from William, or build my own when I reach
that stage of the game. When I complete and fly my 601 someday, I will be proud
of what I have done and not have to hide my face from William when he looks
at my plane. Dan
----- Original Message -----
From: Craig Payne
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2007 7:15 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
> That's because I used his nose bowl to make the the first mold.
Ah, I missed this in your earlier posts.
> I was thinking of renting the molds out so builders that have bought WW manual
and have the right to build their own stuff could save some money and build
their own and I would spray the gel coat and the release in the mold for you
so you would just have to lay it up. I'm not quite sure yet.
I think you should re-read the "Product Rights Agreement" you signed when you
bought your conversion manual from William:
"6. Buyer will not receive any form of compensation for work related to information,
parts, or products. The sole exception being the resale of a single engine
produced from a single Conversion Manual."
www.flycorvair.com/liability.html
> ... I have the same right to improve on someone's design. I will be flight
testing this Cowl in a few weeks and after it is flight proven I will either
sell the cowling's or rent the mold out.
I don't recall William making a mold from someone else's design. I do recall
him saying he would not reprint information from the Pietenpol conversion as it
belonged to Bernie's heirs. Heck, William won't even reprint the torque pattern
for Corvairs that Richard Finch invented. Instead he recommends you buy a
copy of Finch's book.
Odd that you haven't posted your plans on the Corvaircraft list. Maybe it is
because you are no longer welcome there.
Or maybe this is another April Fools joke?
"If anyone needs the old style prop hub or a nose bowl either a 1 piece or a
2 piece please contact me off list."
www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=2&hit=2
"Ok Guys let me start off saying APRIL FOOLS"
www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=10
William seems to think you had had second thought about this:
<quote from April 7th>
Last week we heard from Jeff who proposed making copies of our parts. Although
Jeff later claimed it was an April Fool's joke, the issue was really settled
when I directly called Jeff and spoke with him on the telephone. He'd made the
original post when he was angry, but in conversation I pointed out that he'd
been our guest at Corvair College #10, and proposing to make jigs and tooling
directly off our parts and reselling them was really a bad move. Not to mention
he'd signed our standard product rights agreement. It's a plain language agreement
that forbids doing just what Jeff proposed when he was angry. He conceded
this, and after a friendly hour long phone call, he chose to bow out of the
situation by claiming it was an April Fool's joke. Nobody's being coerced into
not making Corvair parts. Reasonable people understand that it's not ethical
to make clones of our products. Even Jeff understood this. This is a good example
of how direct talk and a phone call solved
95% of these issues.
<end quote>
www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=2
I know you will post a rebuttal to all this but I won't bother replying - your
actions speak for themselves.
As you are completely morally blind I know my words will have no effect on you.
I just hope they will influence any potential customers to avoid you. As a
practical matter I don't know why anyone would trust their life to parts from
you.
Give my regards to Rhonda.
-- Craig
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
---------------------------------
Date: 4/21/2007 11:56 AM
---------------------------------
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair/ not moral |
In a message dated 4/22/2007 11:59:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
taffy0687@yahoo.com writes:
Another sad part of this whole story is: If your workmanship starts to
fail, William W. will get the blame for it.
Fritz
With all do respect who do you think makes Williams parts now? He out
sources most of them. he doesn't make his nose bowl. I will make mine so I would
think the quality would be better. And if I send you the mold to make your own
the quality is as good as you make. Now that I am changing the inlets it
isn't Williams nose bowl anymore it is mine and I have the right to sell it if
I
choose to. I am also in the process of securing a huge hanger with an engine
shop in it to start a builder assist program here in KY where you can come
make your own parts (If you own the manual) and build your engine. I am also
working on a FWF package for the 601 that uses a starter from a totally
different application that is about 2 lb. lighter. And will be a rear starter.
Along with a rear alt. and the reason for this is to move the weight aft and
create better airflow for cooling.
Jeff
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
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| Subject: | XL main Spring gear placement |
> I am running a Jabiru 3300 engine in my Zodiac601XL and it does the same
thing
Which way does your gear face, Tracy?
-- Craig
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
So if a person is building from scratch, would there be any sense in making the
spring symmetrical? That way the effects would be half as severe for either condition.
I do know that I do not want the plane to be difficult to unstick -
or for it to zoom climb the instant of breaking ground...
I believe the original plans called for the flat side to the rear.
With a heavier engine, this puts the main wheels far enough behind
the normal CG that it's a little bit hard to lift the nosewheel for
takeoff or hold it off during landing. With my Subaru, for example, I
have to apply a lot of back pressure to rotate and as soon as the
mains leave the ground, the plane wants to pitch up so I have to be
prepared to release the back pressure right away. On landing, the
reverse applies, the nose wants to drop rapidly as soon as the mains
touch down. It's not a big problem but it's something to get used to.
I think the newer plans call for the flat side forward and I've seen
that the LSAs being built at AMD have the gear this way. The photo
guide probably reflects the older plans. I've done some calculations
and I figure that putting the flat side forward would move the mains
about four inches forward. With my airplane that would still put the
mains far enough back that I could climb in and out without tilting
the plane back on its tail, even with the plane loaded for gross
weight and maximum aft CG. Two people might not be able to climb in
at the same time though. It really wouldn't be a big deal to turn it
around the other way, just pull off the mains, flip the spring
around, re-mount the mains and then re-attach the brake lines the the
spring. I've though about turning my main spring around but just
haven't gotten around to it yet. If I were building it today knowing
what I do now, I would build it with the flat side forward.
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
Zodiac 601XL/Corvair?
---------------------------------
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I am working on my panel and find that my vertical card compass, which
will be mounted on top of the glare shield on my CH701, is very
inaccurate when placed there. Outside the plane it is okay. I understand
from the archives that I will need to degauss my cabin. My question is,
which instruments will be affected by the degaussing such that I should
remove them from the panel prior to degaussing? I presume that the air
powered flight instruments would be okay to leave in place but to remove
all the engine gauges, radio and transponder? Any help on this question
and on the process of degaussing by those who have done this would be
greatly appreciated.
Jeff Beachy
CH701, 90%
Message 17
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| Subject: | Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
Such a blatant lie seems like a poor way to drum up business. It is well
known that WW designed and offered the two-piece nosebowl some time back
and still currently offers it. I have a WW one-piece, but for a long
time, since it's not yet installed, I've been considering changing to
the 2-piece, but if so, I will certainly wait for one from WW.
Robin in AR
601XL Zen-Vair, N601ZV reserved
----- Original Message -----
From: Afterfxllc@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
... You have every right to buy your one piece Nose bowl from William
but if you want a 2 piece cowl you will be shit outa luck....
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Compass Errors |
Jeff
I had the same problem with my vertical card compass. I placed two
small bar magnets (removed from my GPS antenna) one each side of the
compass. Seems to have worked. If I recall, this was recommended by
the compass install info. I also seem to recall that the Zenith demo I
flew for a demo ride about 3 1/2 years ago, had a panel mounted
"regular" compass with some gross errors.
(Does anyone use a mag compass anymore, considering the easy use of GPS
for mag course?)
Tony Graziano
601XL/Jab3300; N493TG; 234 hrs.
Compass Errors
From: Jeffrey A Beachy (beachyjeff@juno.com)
Date: Sun Apr 22 - 10:29 AM
I am working on my panel and find that my vertical card compass, which
will be mounted on top of the glare shield on my CH701, is very
inaccurate when placed there. Outside the plane it is okay. I understand
from the archives that I will need to degauss my cabin. My question is,
which instruments will be affected by the degaussing such that I should
remove them from the panel prior to degaussing? I presume that the air
powered flight instruments would be okay to leave in place but to remove
all the engine gauges, radio and transponder? Any help on this question
and on the process of degaussing by those who have done this would be
greatly appreciated.
Jeff Beachy
CH701, 90%
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
I went to the FWF Corvair class held in Cloverdale, CA last fall and WW was
there and had brought a 2 piece cowl to put on the plane we were working on.
Looked like a very fine piece of work. WW has had these 2 piece cowls for
some time now.
Larry
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
I agree. One of the things I wish I had know about was the gear
reversal, before I installed my gear.
I have this caution in my POH. Found this out in flight test when I set
it up for a high speed (about 65 kt) landing with full flaps and rotated
nose high but did not stop sink rate. Not a problem landing slow with
full flaps or low or"high" speed with no flaps with sink rate arrested,
but more forgiving at high speed with no flaps.
CAUTION
WATCH SINK RATE AND AIR SPEED: with the landing gear geometry of
493TG, a High sink rate combined with High air speed at touch down will
result in the nose gear hitting the runway HARD. and bouncing the
airplane airborne in a nose high attitude. IF THIS HAPPENS - GO AROUND
or initiate a BOUNCE RECOVERY! Pilot Induced Oscillation (PIO) can
result under this condition if landing is attempted.
Tony Graziano
601XL/Jab3300; N493TG 234 hrs.
----------------------
Subject: Re: XL main Spring gear placement
From: Bryan Martin (bryanmmartin@comcast.net)
Date: Sun Apr 22 - 5:55 AM
I believe the original plans called for the flat side to the rear.
With a heavier engine, this puts the main wheels far enough behind
the normal CG that it's a little bit hard to lift the nosewheel for
takeoff or hold it off during landing. With my Subaru, for example, I
have to apply a lot of back pressure to rotate and as soon as the
mains leave the ground, the plane wants to pitch up so I have to be
prepared to release the back pressure right away. On landing, the
reverse applies, the nose wants to drop rapidly as soon as the mains
touch down. It's not a big problem but it's something to get used to.
I think the newer plans call for the flat side forward and I've seen
that the LSAs being built at AMD have the gear this way. The photo
guide probably reflects the older plans. I've done some calculations
and I figure that putting the flat side forward would move the mains
about four inches forward. With my airplane that would still put the
mains far enough back that I could climb in and out without tilting
the plane back on its tail, even with the plane loaded for gross
weight and maximum aft CG. Two people might not be able to climb in
at the same time though. It really wouldn't be a big deal to turn it
around the other way, just pull off the mains, flip the spring
around, re-mount the mains and then re-attach the brake lines the the
spring. I've though about turning my main spring around but just
haven't gotten around to it yet. If I were building it today knowing
what I do now, I would build it with the flat side forward.
> <chris_sinfield@yahoo.com.au>
>
> OK Gang
> Which way does the XL Main spring gear go?? Is it flat side to the
> rear or to the FWD side?
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
my thoughts only--- I am building from plans -- I thought the same as Dave, splitting
the difference. But, I decided to go "straight (flat) part of bar forward.
MY reasoning, all else being ok--- keep as much weight as possible off
from the nose gear assembly (and stay within the design). Why? nose gear strut
has direct linkage to rudder pedals- crosswind landings.
Fritz
David Downey <planecrazydld@yahoo.com> wrote:
So if a person is building from scratch, would there be any sense in making the
spring symmetrical? That way the effects would be half as severe for either
condition. I do know that I do not want the plane to be difficult to unstick
- or for it to zoom climb the instant of breaking ground...
I believe the original plans called for the flat side to the rear.
With a heavier engine, this puts the main wheels far enough behind
the normal CG that it's a little bit hard to lift the nosewheel for
takeoff or hold it off during landing. With my Subaru, for example, I
have to apply a lot of back pressure to rotate and as soon as the
mains leave the ground, the plane wants to pitch up so I have to be
prepared to release the back pressure right away. On landing, the
reverse applies, the nose wants to drop rapidly as soon as the mains
touch down. It's not a big problem but it's something to get used to.
I think the newer plans call for the flat side forward and I've seen
that the LSAs being built at AMD have the gear this way. The photo
guide probably reflects the older plans. I've done some calculations
and I figure that putting the flat side forward would move the mains
about four inches forward. With my airplane that would still put the
mains far enough back that I could climb in and out without tilting
the plane back on its tail, even with the plane loaded for gross
weight and maximum aft CG. Two people might not be able to climb in
at the same time though. It really wouldn't be a big deal to turn it
around the other way, just pull off the mains, flip the spring
around, re-mount the mains and then re-attach the brake lines the the
spring. I've though about turning my main spring around but just
haven't gotten around to it yet. If I were building it today knowing
what I do now, I would build it with the flat side forward.
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
Zodiac 601XL/Corvair?
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
Once again I have to ask you to read. I am not selling the 1 or the 2 piece nose
bowl of WW and the key word is nose bowl. What I am making is the complete
2 piece Cowling and william doesn't make that. And if you would have read my previous
posts you would find that even chris from zenith says the radius of the
inlets should be bigger and that the smaller radius inlets reduce air flow to
the engine and increase drag. So I am going to make another mold from scratch
with a 1 inch radius on the inlets and also make a oval design nose bowl for
the lycoming and the cont.
-----Original Message-----
From: 601zv@ritternet.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 1:48 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
Such a blatant lie seems like a poor way to drum up business. It is well known
that WW designed and offered the two-piece nosebowl some time back and still
currently offers it. I have a WW one-piece, but for a long time, since it's not
yet installed, I've been considering changing to the 2-piece, but if so, I
will certainly wait for one from WW. Robin in AR 601XL Zen-Vair, N601ZV reserved
----- Original Message ----- From: Afterfxllc@aol.com To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 11:20 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List:
Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair ... You have every right to buy
your one piece Nose bowl from William but if you want a 2 piece cowl you will
be shit outa luck....
________________________________________________________________________
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
You guys are so quick to jump on someone you are confusing a nose bowl for a COWLING.
-----Original Message-----
From: LHusky@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
I went to the FWF Corvair class held in Cloverdale, CA last fall and WW was
there and had brought a 2 piece cowl to put on the plane we were working on. Looked
like a very fine piece of work. WW has had these 2 piece cowls for some
time now. Larry
See what's free at AOL.com.
________________________________________________________________________
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
At our hanger we have 3 601's 1 has a Rotax and 1 has a O-235 125HP convers
ion and 1 has the corvair and all have the flat of the mains aft. and they a
ll fly fine. The plans show the flat aft also.
-----Original Message-----
From: tonyplane@bellsouth.net
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 2:25 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: XL main Spring gear placement
I agree. One of the things I wish I had know about was the gear reversal,
before I installed my gear. I have this caution in my POH. Found this out i
n flight test when I set it up for a high speed (about 65 kt) landing with f
ull flaps and rotated nose high but did not stop sink rate. Not a problem la
nding slow with full flaps or low or"high" speed with no flaps with sink rat
e arrested, but more forgiving at high speed with no flaps. CAUTION WAT
CH SINK RATE AND AIR SPEED: with the landing gear geometry of 493TG, a High
sink rate combined with High air speed at touch down will result in the nose
gear hitting the runway HARD and bouncing the airplane airborne in
a nose high attitude. IF THIS HAPPENS =93 GO AROUND or initiate a BOU
NCE RECOVERY! Pilot Induced Oscillation (PIO) can result under this conditi
on if landing is attempted. Tony Graziano 601XL/Jab3300; N493TG 234 hrs.
---------------------- Subject: Re: XL main Spring gear placement
From: Bryan Martin (bryanmmartin@comcast.net)
Date: Sun Apr 22 - 5:55 AM
I believe the original plans called for the flat side to the rear.
With a heavier engine, this puts the main wheels far enough behind
the normal CG that it's a little bit hard to lift the nosewheel for
takeoff or hold it off during landing. With my Subaru, for example, I
have to apply a lot of back pressure to rotate and as soon as the
mains leave the ground, the plane wants to pitch up so I have to be
prepared to release the back pressure right away. On landing, the
reverse applies, the nose wants to drop rapidly as soon as the mains
touch down. It's not a big problem but it's something to get used to.
I think the newer plans call for the flat side forward and I've seen
that the LSAs being built at AMD have the gear this way. The photo
guide probably reflects the older plans. I've done some calculations
and I figure that putting the flat side forward would move the mains
about four inches forward. With my airplane that would still put the
mains far enough back that I could climb in and out without tilting
the plane back on its tail, even with the plane loaded for gross
weight and maximum aft CG. Two people might not be able to climb in
at the same time though. It really wouldn't be a big deal to turn it
around the other way, just pull off the mains, flip the spring
around, re-mount the mains and then re-attach the brake lines the the
spring. I've though about turning my main spring around but just
haven't gotten around to it yet. If I were building it today knowing
what I do now, I would build it with the flat side forward.
> <chris_sinfield@yahoo.com.au>
>
> OK Gang
> Which way does the XL Main spring gear go?? Is it flat side to the
> rear or to the FWD side?
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
________________________________________________________________________
AOL at AOL.com.
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL |
Tony--- wouldn't it be "relatively easy" to reverse your gear ? If it is 6061 T
6 ?
1) remove gear, 2) weld notches closed, 3) REVERSE GEAR and make new notches,
4) reinstall gear, 5) extend brake lines (if needed).
Fritz
"T. Graziano" <tonyplane@bellsouth.net> wrote:
I agree. One of the things I wish I had know about was the gear reversal,
before I installed my gear.
I have this caution in my POH. Found this out in flight test when I set it up
for a high speed (about 65 kt) landing with full flaps and rotated nose high
but did not stop sink rate. Not a problem landing slow with full flaps or low
or"high" speed with no flaps with sink rate arrested, but more forgiving at
high speed with no flaps.
CAUTION
WATCH SINK RATE AND AIR SPEED: with the landing gear geometry of 493TG, a High
sink rate combined with High air speed at touch down will result in the nose
gear hitting the runway HARD and bouncing the airplane airborne in a nose high
attitude. IF THIS HAPPENS GO AROUND or initiate a BOUNCE RECOVERY! Pilot
Induced Oscillation (PIO) can result under this condition if landing is attempted.
Tony Graziano
601XL/Jab3300; N493TG 234 hrs.
----------------------
Subject: Re: XL main Spring gear placement From: Bryan
Martin (bryanmmartin@comcast.net) Date: Sun Apr 22 - 5:55 AM
I believe the original plans called for the flat side to the rear. With a heavier
engine, this puts the main wheels far enough behind the normal CG that
it's a little bit hard to lift the nosewheel for takeoff or hold it off during
landing. With my Subaru, for example, I have to apply a lot of back
pressure to rotate and as soon as the mains leave the ground, the plane wants
to pitch up so I have to be prepared to release the back pressure right
away. On landing, the reverse applies, the nose wants to drop rapidly as soon
as the mains touch down. It's not a big problem but it's something to get
used to. I think the newer plans call for the flat side forward and I've
seen that the LSAs being built at AMD have the gear this way. The photo
guide probably reflects the older plans. I've done some calculations and I
figure that putting the flat side forward would move the mains about four inches
forward. With my airplane that would still
put the mains far enough back that I could climb in and out without tilting
the plane back on its tail, even with the plane loaded for gross weight
and maximum aft CG. Two people might not be able to climb in at the same time
though. It really wouldn't be a big deal to turn it around the other way,
just pull off the mains, flip the spring around, re-mount the mains and
then re-attach the brake lines the the spring. I've though about turning my
main spring around but just haven't gotten around to it yet. If I were building
it today knowing what I do now, I would build it with the flat side forward.
> <chris_sinfield@yahoo.com.au> > > OK Gang > Which way does the
XL Main spring gear go?? Is it flat side to the > rear or to the FWD side?
-- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL |
Oops, don't think you need to be welding on a heat treated piece of
6061 unless you plan on having it heat treated back to the T651
condition. John
----- Original Message -----
From: Big Gee
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 2:26 PM
Subject: xxx Re: Zenith-List: Re: XL main Spring gear placement/
REVERSEAL
Tony--- wouldn't it be "relatively easy" to reverse your gear ? If it
is 6061 T 6 ?
2) weld notches closed,
Fritz
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Compass Errors |
I will have a wiskey compass as a backup for the glass panel and gps.
Like all insurance policies, I hope I don't get to use it but it will be
there. I bought one of those Navigator compasses out of AS. This one has
a mount that can be glued to the inside of the canopy bubble. I'm hoping
that locating it that far from the electonics and power wires in the
panel will allow it to operate accurately. If you can wait a few months
for an answer........
Dred
----- Original Message -----
From: T. Graziano
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 1:05 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Compass Errors
Jeff
I had the same problem with my vertical card compass. I placed two
small bar magnets (removed from my GPS antenna) one each side of the
compass. Seems to have worked. If I recall, this was recommended by
the compass install info. I also seem to recall that the Zenith demo I
flew for a demo ride about 3 1/2 years ago, had a panel mounted
"regular" compass with some gross errors.
(Does anyone use a mag compass anymore, considering the easy use of
GPS for mag course?)
Tony Graziano
601XL/Jab3300; N493TG; 234 hrs.
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Compass Errors |
I had a vertical card compass installed in my Zodiac. I tried it in
the panel and on the glare shield, It read accurately East or West
but there was no way it would zero in North or South. A few months
ago, I bought a $10 Airguide compass from Walmart for my Jeep. I was
able to calibrate it very well in the Jeep. Then I decided, what the
hell, I'll try it in the Zodiac. I stuck it to the canopy with the
suction cups and took the plane out to see if I could get it to
calibrate. Well what do you know, it works great. It even has
aircraft style markings. The $10 Walmart compass has now permanently
replaced the $250 aircraft compass in my Zodiac.
On Apr 22, 2007, at 2:05 PM, T. Graziano wrote:
>
> Jeff
> I had the same problem with my vertical card compass. I placed two
> small bar magnets (removed from my GPS antenna) one each side of
> the compass. Seems to have worked. If I recall, this was
> recommended by the compass install info. I also seem to recall
> that the Zenith demo I flew for a demo ride about 3 1/2 years ago,
> had a panel mounted "regular" compass with some gross errors.
>
> (Does anyone use a mag compass anymore, considering the easy use of
> GPS for mag course?)
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
do not archive.
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement |
I think the plane was originally designed for the Rotax, which is a
fairly light engine. With any other engine, I don't think there will
be any problem with just building the gear to plans and mounting it
flat side forward. In any case, with the flat side aft, it isn't a
serious problem, just different. I got used to it fairly quickly.
On Apr 22, 2007, at 1:23 PM, David Downey wrote:
> So if a person is building from scratch, would there be any sense
> in making the spring symmetrical? That way the effects would be
> half as severe for either condition. I do know that I do not want
> the plane to be difficult to unstick - or for it to zoom climb the
> instant of breaking ground...
>
> Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net> wrote: --> Zenith-List
> message posted by: Bryan Martin
>
> I believe the original plans called for the flat side to the rear.
> With a heavier engine, this puts the main wheels far enough behind
> the normal CG that it's a little bit hard to lift the nosewheel for
> ...
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
do not archive.
Message 30
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I have a 62x42 wooden prop for sale. It's made by Tennessee Props and it's
configured for a WW Corvair. It started out as a 62x46 which was way too
much pitch. I sent it back to be re-pitched to 42. I still can't get the rpm
above 2750. The guy at Tn-Props didn't sound too positive about re-pitching
it any more, so I'm going to try to sell it. I wonder if it would make a
good climb prop for a HDS or XL. My speeds at 2750 rpm was around 125 mph.
Remember that this is on a 601 HD. I did not confirm that with the GPS, but
it was definitely faster than my Warp Drive. It just seemed to be lugging
down the Vair too much.
It's listed on Barnstormers for $475. Hopefully this link will take you to
it
http://www.barnstormers.com/cat.php?PHPSESSID=7ded35bbc275d26890342bc030e8af
dd .
Otherwise, go to Barnstormers.com and search for Tennessee Prop.
Randy Stout
San Antonio TX
www.geocities.com/r5t0ut21
n282rs at satx.rr.com
Message 31
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These links may work better:
www.barnstormers.com/listing.php?id=163181
or
http://tinyurl.com/23pwzs
-- Craig
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL |
Fritz,
Actually all I would have to do is do is "dolly" the airplane after
jacking it up, remove the brake line fairings, disconnect the brake
lines, remove the gear channel and reverse it. Reinstall the brake lines
and purge out the air, and fab new brake line fairings. I probably
would have to replace the brake lines with longer ones though.
I have considered doing it, but --- Having more fun flying.
Tony
Re: Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL
From: Big Gee (taffy0687@yahoo.com)
Date: Sun Apr 22 - 12:27 PM
Tony--- wouldn't it be "relatively easy" to reverse your gear ? If it is
6061 T
6 ?
1) remove gear, 2) weld notches closed, 3) REVERSE GEAR and make new
notches,
4) reinstall gear, 5) extend brake lines (if needed).
Fritz
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
I don't think we are quick to jump on someone at all, or confusing
anything. You uploaded pictures of a mold you made from a part you
purchased from William and admitted to doing so. You also state that you
intend to rent the mold, or sell the cowlings. No matter what you are
now claiming the fact of the matter is that you have stollen Williams
design, with the intent to profit from it. If you had decided to build a
plug of your own design from scratch and market it as such there would
have been no problem, but that is not the route you have taken.You are
trying to pass off your illegal activities by saying you are offering
improvements, such as 2 piece cowlings instead of 1 piece(William offers
the 2 piece as has been stated by another poster), and improved airflow
by increasing radius. You also state that you are trying to start a
builder assist program. I assume that you are planning on making a
profit in this endevor and wonder what other designs you are going to
steal from William to help line your pockets? And do you plan on
displaying the same honesty and integrity that you have shown to us in
your dealings with potential customers? I for one think I will keep my
money in my pocket. Dan.
----- Original Message -----
From: afterfxllc@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 12:12 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
You guys are so quick to jump on someone you are confusing a nose bowl
for a COWLING.
-----Original Message-----
From: LHusky@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
I went to the FWF Corvair class held in Cloverdale, CA last fall and
WW was there and had brought a 2 piece cowl to put on the plane we were
working on. Looked like a very fine piece of work. WW has had these 2
piece cowls for some time now.
Larry
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4/21/2007 11:56 AM
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
William does not have a 2 piece cowling. And since I am making new molds from
scratch to increase the radiuses I guess by your post you wont have a problem
with that? And I always said I might rent them out
and if you own the manual you have the right to use them don't you?
-----Original Message-----
From: hillsgun@nwinfo.net
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 10:12 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
I don't think we are quick to jump on someone at all, or confusing anything.
You uploaded pictures of a mold you made from a part you purchased from William
and admitted to doing so. You also state that you intend to rent the mold, or
sell the cowlings. No matter what you are now claiming the fact of the matter
is that you have stollen Williams design, with the intent to profit from it.
If you had decided to build a plug of your own design from scratch and market
it as such there would have been no problem, but that is not the route you have
taken.You are trying to pass off your illegal activities by saying you are
offering improvements, such as 2 piece cowlings instead of 1 piece(William offers
the 2 piece as has been stated by another poster), and improved airflow by
increasing radius. You also state that you are trying to start a builder assist
program. I assume that you are planning on making a profit in this endevor
and wonder what other designs you are going to steal
from William to help line your pockets? And do you plan on displaying the same
honesty and integrity that you have shown to us in your dealings with potential
customers? I for one think I will keep my money in my pocket. Dan. ----- Original
Message ----- From: afterfxllc@aol.com To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 12:12 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl
for the 601 with corvair
You guys are so quick to jump on someone you are confusing a nose bowl for a
COWLING.
-----Original Message-----
From: LHusky@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
I went to the FWF Corvair class held in Cloverdale, CA last fall and WW was there
and had brought a 2 piece cowl to put on the plane we were working on. Looked
like a very fine piece of work. WW has had these 2 piece cowls for some time
now. Larry
See what's free at AOL.com.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
Date: 4/21/2007 11:56 AM
________________________________________________________________________
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL |
Am I the only one to whom removing and/or reversing the gear channel
while ignoring the fitting problem of the notches makes no sense in this
seeming over-simplification of gear reversal?
----- Original Message -----
From: T. Graziano
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 8:40 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL
Fritz,
Actually all I would have to do is do is "dolly" the airplane after
jacking it up, remove the brake line fairings, disconnect the brake
lines, remove the gear channel and reverse it. Reinstall the brake lines
and purge out the air, and fab new brake line fairings. I probably
would have to replace the brake lines with longer ones though.
I have considered doing it, but --- Having more fun flying.
Tony
Re: Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL
From: Big Gee (taffy0687@yahoo.com)
Date: Sun Apr 22 - 12:27 PM
Tony--- wouldn't it be "relatively easy" to reverse your gear ? If it is
6061 T
6 ?
1) remove gear, 2) weld notches closed, 3) REVERSE GEAR and make new
notches,
4) reinstall gear, 5) extend brake lines (if needed).
Fritz
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
Funny that when I visit his website he has a picture of the 2 piece
nosebowl, and describes it in detail. If you were making a newly
designed nosebowl it would be fine, but you are apparently just
reworking his design and trying to hide your dishonesty by saying you
are improving it. I think that most of us on this list see you for what
you are so I won't waste any more of my breath on you and will get back
to airplanes and real airplane builders. Dan.
----- Original Message -----
From: afterfxllc@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 7:23 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
William does not have a 2 piece cowling. And since I am making new
molds from scratch to increase the radiuses I guess by your post you
wont have a problem with that? And I always said I might rent them out
and if you own the manual you have the right to use them don't you?
-----Original Message-----
From: hillsgun@nwinfo.net
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 10:12 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
I don't think we are quick to jump on someone at all, or confusing
anything. You uploaded pictures of a mold you made from a part you
purchased from William and admitted to doing so. You also state that you
intend to rent the mold, or sell the cowlings. No matter what you are
now claiming the fact of the matter is that you have stollen Williams
design, with the intent to profit from it. If you had decided to build a
plug of your own design from scratch and market it as such there would
have been no problem, but that is not the route you have taken.You are
trying to pass off your illegal activities by saying you are offering
improvements, such as 2 piece cowlings instead of 1 piece(William offers
the 2 piece as has been stated by another poster), and improved airflow
by increasing radius. You also state that you are trying to start a
builder assist program. I assume that you are planning on making a
profit in this endevor and wonder what other designs you are going to
steal from William to help line your pockets? And do you plan on
displaying the same honesty and integrity that you have shown to us in
your dealings with potential customers? I for one think I will keep my
money in my pocket. Dan.
----- Original Message -----
From: afterfxllc@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 12:12 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
You guys are so quick to jump on someone you are confusing a nose
bowl for a COWLING.
-----Original Message-----
From: LHusky@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
I went to the FWF Corvair class held in Cloverdale, CA last fall and
WW was there and had brought a 2 piece cowl to put on the plane we were
working on. Looked like a very fine piece of work. WW has had these 2
piece cowls for some time now.
Larry
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See what's free at AOL.com.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
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Date: 4/21/2007 11:56 AM
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4/21/2007 11:56 AM
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
Dan
Do you even know the difference between a nose bowl and a cowling?
let me fill you in
A nose bowl only covers the nose of the airplane and WW has one of those on
his website for sale. I am not selling that one. I am making a 2 piece
complete cowl that covers the entire engine so it isn't anything william sells.
and as for the radius improvement that will have to be built from a scratch
built mold so it wouldn't be a copy and I am thinking of doing oval intake holes
because a number of ppl have stated they like them better.
Funny that when I visit his website he has a picture of the 2 piece
nosebowl, and describes it in detail. If you were making a newly designed nosebowl
it
would be fine, but you are apparently just reworking his design and trying
to hide your dishonesty by saying you are improving it. I think that most of
us on this list see you for what you are so I won't waste any more of my
breath on you and will get back to airplanes and real airplane builders. Dan.
----- Original Message -----
From: _afterfxllc@aol.com_ (mailto:afterfxllc@aol.com)
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 7:23 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
William does not have a 2 piece cowling. And since I am making new molds
from scratch to increase the radiuses I guess by your post you wont have a
problem with that? And I always said I might rent them out
and if you own the manual you have the right to use them don't you?
-----Original Message-----
From: _hillsgun@nwinfo.net_ (mailto:hillsgun@nwinfo.net)
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 10:12 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
I don't think we are quick to jump on someone at all, or confusing anything.
You uploaded pictures of a mold you made from a part you purchased from
William and admitted to doing so. You also state that you intend to rent the
mold, or sell the cowlings. No matter what you are now claiming the fact of the
matter is that you have stolen Williams design, with the intent to profit from
it. If you had decided to build a plug of your own design from scratch and
market it as such there would have been no problem, but that is not the route
you have taken.You are trying to pass off your illegal activities by saying
you are offering improvements, such as 2 piece cowlings instead of 1
piece(William offers the 2 piece as has been stated by another poster), and improved
airflow by increasing radius. You also state that you are trying to start a
builder assist program. I assume that you are planning on making a profit in
this endevor and wonder what other designs you are going to steal from William
to help line your pockets? And do you plan on displaying the same honesty and
integrity that you have shown to us in your dealings with potential
customers? I for one think I will keep my money in my pocket. Dan.
----- Original Message -----
From: _afterfxllc@aol.com_ (mailto:afterfxllc@aol.com)
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 12:12 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
You guys are so quick to jump on someone you are confusing a nose bowl for a
COWLING.
-----Original Message-----
From: _LHusky@aol.com_ (mailto:LHusky@aol.com)
Sent: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair
I went to the FWF Corvair class held in Cloverdale, CA last fall and WW was
there and had brought a 2 piece cowl to put on the plane we were working on.
Looked like a very fine piece of work. WW has had these 2 piece cowls for
some time now.
Larry
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: XL main Spring gear placement/ REVERSEAL |
I can see it now ... your getting ready to leave for osh gosh and youv'e
just finished your gear reversal and you throw all your stuf in the baggage
compartment and then wham your tail hits the ground. And there you are thinking
all I need now is a tail wheel.
Do not archive
Am I the only one to whom removing and/or reversing the gear channel while
ignoring the fitting problem of the notches makes no sense in this seeming
over-simplification of gear reversal?
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Two piece cowl for the 601 with corvair |
OK OK OK OK OK OK OK OK OK OK OK we all get the picture can we please
quit this endless discussion.
I see everyones point and I am sure that others on here are in agreement
one way or the other.
The point is, enough......................
Lets get back to building.
David Mikesell
23597 N. Hwy 99
Acampo, CA 95220
209-224-4485
skyguynca@skyguynca.com
www.skyguynca.com
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re:Re:XL main Spring gear placement/REVERSEAL |
Flat side fwd or aft? Another step to complete after reversing the spring and
before weighing the aircraft is to actually measure the distance from the
datum to where ever the axle winds up. The sample W&B worksheet that ZAC provides
would be in error if the MLG axle is moved plus or minus four inches. Four
inches error in computing the empty CG would be huge on a plane this small.
Bob from Pace,FL
XL/Lyc
**************************************
See what's free at
http://www.aol.com.
Message 41
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| Subject: | Running electrical cables |
OK, so you run wires to the rear under the canopy rails. What do you do when
you reach the rear of the cockpit and hit 6B5-6, the upright channel? Have
others just drilled a hole it? And if you do that leaves you above the
luggage shelf. Do you route the wires back or up from that point?
Or do you route the wires from the rail down to pass through 6B6-5 below the
shelf?
Does anyone have any pictures?
-- Craig
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