---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 06/09/07: 14 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:50 AM - Re: Bending 6-B-21-1 & 2 (LarryMcFarland) 2. 07:32 AM - Re: Zenith Builders Chat Room () 3. 08:50 AM - Re: 701 Dynon pitot (Joe and Joan Kimbell) 4. 09:54 AM - Re: Zenith Builders Chat Room (leinad) 5. 12:13 PM - Re: Re: Fuel Fittings (Jaybannist@cs.com) 6. 12:57 PM - Locating fuel tank holes in skins? (Dr. Andrew Elliott) 7. 12:57 PM - Locating fuel tank holes in skins? (Dr. Andrew Elliott) 8. 01:19 PM - Re: Re: Fuel Fittings (Craig Payne) 9. 01:35 PM - Re: Locating fuel tank holes in skins? (Craig Payne) 10. 02:01 PM - Re: Locating fuel tank holes in skins? (Edward Moody II) 11. 02:19 PM - Re: Re: Fuel Fittings (Robin Bellach) 12. 03:05 PM - Re: 701 Dynon pitot (Gordon) 13. 04:39 PM - Bending 6-B-21- 1 & 2 (wade jones) 14. 04:39 PM - Re: Locating fuel tank holes in skins? (JohnDRead@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:50:44 AM PST US From: LarryMcFarland Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Bending 6-B-21-1 & 2 Hi Wade, You want to pack the tubes with sand because it will prevent the tube from kinking as you go. The forms will get you half way, but you should try the 3-point bend setup using casters, block tubes and c-clamps to get it exactly right. You only have to bend just a little at a time and lay it over the form outline to get it extremely close. This arrangement will permit you to also unbend a little here and there as necessary. No need for excess material if you take your time. http://www.macsmachine.com/images/fuselage/full/tubebender.gif Larry McFarland wade jones wrote: > Hello group ,I asked for some advice about a week ago on bending these > tubes .I received some good ideas from several of you good people > .Today I received my material from AS .I made the forms from 3/4" MDF > today .My plan is to mount the forms to my table and try to bend to > shape around the forms .May have to pack with sand as Larry suggested > .Anyone see any problems in doing it this way, maybe I should > have ordered additional material for screw ups. Thanks DO NOT > ARCHIVE > Wade Jones South Texas > 601XL plans building > Cont. 0200 > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:32:22 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Zenith Builders Chat Room What time?? > We are hoping to start a Zenith Builder's chat this > coming Monday (June 11, 2007) at the following link. > http://chat.iahu.ca/ Samm Munn CH-601XL, Corvair (Plans) ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:50:16 AM PST US From: "Joe and Joan Kimbell" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 701 Dynon pitot Greg, I installed the Dynon AOA pitot tube the same place the regular pitot tube would be placed. The Dynon AOA does not read slow enough to give a stall warning on the 701 during the normal landing config. Works OK on power on stalls. By the way I use VG's not slats. Joe >From: "Greg Alonso" >To: >Subject: Zenith-List: 701 Dynon pitot >Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 21:53:33 -0400 > >Has anybody installed a Dynon pitot on a 701? I am trying to determine the >best location. > >Greg Alonso >Building 701 from kit. >Michigan ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:54:46 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith Builders Chat Room From: "leinad" 8:00 PM EDT is the plan, but if someone else prefers a different time we could adjust. heliav8r(at)swbell.net wrote: > What time?? > > > > > We are hoping to start a Zenith Builder's chat this > > coming Monday (June 11, 2007) at the following link. > > http://chat.iahu.ca/ > > > > > > > Samm Munn > CH-601XL, Corvair (Plans) -------- Scratch building XL with Corvair Engine Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=117480#117480 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 12:13:01 PM PST US From: Jaybannist@cs.com Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Fuel Fittings Gig, I didn't get any really satisfactory answers to the question of orientation of the 90 degree fittings on the fuel selector valve. I have decided to try using a 1/4" NPT Male to -6 AN Male fitting in the valve body (SUM-220647); and attaching to that a short-coupled 90 degree swivel fitting: EAR-809006ERL (-6 AN female to -6 AN hose end), from Summit Racing. I don't think this arrangement will fit in the console as I have it presently drilled. I will probably have to make a sub-panel for the selector valve on the center console and orient the two inlet openings upward at 45 degree angles to get it to fit. That will make the faceplate not "square with the world", but I think I can live with that. I probably won't get the fittings until late next week, but I'll let you know how it goes. Jay "Gig Giacona" wrote: > >Jay, let me know what you come up with because I'm about a month away from the exact same problem. > > >Jaybannist(at)cs.com wrote: >> I am working with the kit-supplied fuel selector valve (601XL, dual sticks). It is located on my center console, about the middle. It has three 1/4"NPT ports (female threads), one on the side(input), one on top and one on the back face (output). Because of the width of the console and other constraints, I must use 90 degree fittings on the side and top ports. When I screw the fittings in, finger tight, they are facing the wrong way. Swivel-type fittings would require first installing a 1/4"NPT to -6AN adapter fitting, then the swivel fittings. The console is not wide enough for that. I have searched Summit Racing Equipment's extensive fittings catalog and have not found anything that would work. At this point, I can't mount the selector valve remotely. >> >> I am at a loss, or maybe just stuck on stupid. Any suggestions? >> >> Jay in Dallas ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 12:57:39 PM PST US From: "Dr. Andrew Elliott" Subject: Zenith-List: Locating fuel tank holes in skins? Folks: I received by quick-built wings with the top skins and top of leading edges fully riveted and the bottom skins and bottom of leading edges tacked. (Yes, this seemed backward to me when I got them, but that's how they are.) There are no pre-machined holes in the skins for the fuel tank inlets, drains and vents, so I will need to locate and make the holes, before installing the tanks and closing the wings. The method in the photo guides assumes that the *top* leading skin is loose. Anyone have an especially good idea or method for doing this with the wings like I have them? Thanks, Andy Elliott, Mesa, AZ N601GE (reserved) 601XL/TD/QB, Corvair, building... ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:57:39 PM PST US From: "Dr. Andrew Elliott" Subject: Zenith-List: Locating fuel tank holes in skins? Folks: I received by quick-built wings with the top skins and top of leading edges fully riveted and the bottom skins and bottom of leading edges tacked. (Yes, this seemed backward to me when I got them, but that's how they are.) There are no pre-machined holes in the skins for the fuel tank inlets, drains and vents, so I will need to locate and make the holes, before installing the tanks and closing the wings. The method in the photo guides assumes that the *top* leading skin is loose. Anyone have an especially good idea or method for doing this with the wings like I have them? Thanks, Andy Elliott, Mesa, AZ N601GE (reserved) 601XL/TD/QB, Corvair, building... ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 01:19:08 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Fuel Fittings You probably don't want to spend this much money. But you can by an Andair valve direct from them with either the right-angle banjo bolt or AN6 fittings. Pictures attached. The BF250 (NPT-Banjo-AN6.jpg) might fit your existing valve - they are "only" $37 each: "This Banjo fitting can be rotated through 360 degrees and then locked off by tightening the Stainless Steel shaft. Viton bonded washers compress down to seal the fitting. The Fitting is machined with a 1/4" NPT thread on the grey part, and an AN-6 with 37.5 degree flare on the blue part." www.andair.co.uk -- Craig ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 01:35:40 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Locating fuel tank holes in skins? For the items that penetrate the lower skin you should be able to use the same template approach that Zenith uses for locating the fuel cap in the top skin (although the template wouldn't have to be transparent): See page three here: www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6k1.pdf 1. use a piece of template material that reaches from the vent or drain to a rivet line on the rib or spar 2. fit the tank into the wing with all the cork in place. 3. make a hole in the template to align with the vent or drain 4. back-drill or use a rivet-hole copier/duplicator top make the rivet holes in the template 5. remove the tank 6. temporarily close the bottom skin and drill the skin-to-rib rivet lines 7. Cleco the template in place and transfer the vent or drain hole position. You will have to change the order a bit if the rib rivet holes weren't drilled at the factory. -- Craig ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 02:01:30 PM PST US From: "Edward Moody II" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Locating fuel tank holes in skins? Andy, this is going to sound overly complicated but I think it will get you out of the corner that the factory painted you into. First, take the tank out onto the workbench and use a hole saw (of whatever size works) to produce a round plug of 3/4" pine or spruce wood a bit larger than the threaded filler neck female that is welded into the tank top skin. Then work the plug into a bevel along its sides (ue a belt sander) until it fits almost flush with the top of the threaded female but is still too tight to get pushed clear into the tank. If you think you have sanded too much and the plug might push into the tank wrap it with paper until it is too tight to fall into the tank. If it does fall in, the world is not lost; you can retrieve it through the fuel level sensor hole on the inboard end later. Okay so now you have a round wooden plug that fits tight in the filler hole, right? And since you made it with a hole saw it has a 1/4" hole in its center. Now you take a 1/4" bolt, with two washers and two nuts. Get on a bench lather (grinder) and sharpen one end of the bolt so that it has a point like a punch or an awl. Set the bolt through the hole in the wood with the pointed end facing out. Set the plug in the tank, set the tank in the leading edge, wrap the skin down snug and with a piece of plywood on the top LE skin, tap on the plywood with a hammer until the sharpened bolt marks the center of your hole for you. Happy now? Dred ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr. Andrew Elliott To: Zenith-List Digest Server Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2007 2:44 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Locating fuel tank holes in skins? Folks: I received by quick-built wings with the top skins and top of leading edges fully riveted and the bottom skins and bottom of leading edges tacked. (Yes, this seemed backward to me when I got them, but that's how they are.) There are no pre-machined holes in the skins for the fuel tank inlets, drains and vents, so I will need to locate and make the holes, before installing the tanks and closing the wings. The method in the photo guides assumes that the *top* leading skin is loose. Anyone have an especially good idea or method for doing this with the wings like I have them? Thanks, Andy Elliott, Mesa, AZ N601GE (reserved) 601XL/TD/QB, Corvair, building... ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 6/8/2007 3:15 PM ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 02:19:35 PM PST US From: "Robin Bellach" <601zv@ritternet.com> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Fuel Fittings Andair has 90-degree fittings that replace the straight fittings that come on the valve. I was considering those until I decided to order their extension parts to move the valve body down on the floor. ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2007 2:11 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Fuel Fittings > > Gig, > > I didn't get any really satisfactory answers to the question of > orientation of the 90 degree fittings on the fuel selector valve. I have > decided to try using a 1/4" NPT Male to -6 AN Male fitting in the valve > body (SUM-220647); and attaching to that a short-coupled 90 degree swivel > fitting: EAR-809006ERL (-6 AN female to -6 AN hose end), from Summit > Racing. > > I don't think this arrangement will fit in the console as I have it > presently drilled. I will probably have to make a sub-panel for the > selector valve on the center console and orient the two inlet openings > upward at 45 degree angles to get it to fit. That will make the faceplate > not "square with the world", but I think I can live with that. > > I probably won't get the fittings until late next week, but I'll let you > know how it goes. > > Jay > > > "Gig Giacona" wrote: > >> >> >>Jay, let me know what you come up with because I'm about a month away from >>the exact same problem. >> >> >> >>Jaybannist(at)cs.com wrote: >>> I am working with the kit-supplied fuel selector valve (601XL, dual >>> sticks). It is located on my center console, about the middle. It has >>> three 1/4"NPT ports (female threads), one on the side(input), one on top >>> and one on the back face (output). Because of the width of the console >>> and other constraints, I must use 90 degree fittings on the side and top >>> ports. When I screw the fittings in, finger tight, they are facing the >>> wrong way. Swivel-type fittings would require first installing a >>> 1/4"NPT to -6AN adapter fitting, then the swivel fittings. The console >>> is not wide enough for that. I have searched Summit Racing Equipment's >>> extensive fittings catalog and have not found anything that would work. >>> At this point, I can't mount the selector valve remotely. >>> >>> I am at a loss, or maybe just stuck on stupid. Any suggestions? >>> >>> Jay in Dallas > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 03:05:31 PM PST US From: "Gordon" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 Dynon pitot Dynon has made several changes to their EFIS one of them is: " Lower Airspeed Threshold - to better accommodate light sport and STOL aircraft, airspeed now comes alive at 20 knots on the way up, and stays alive until 15 knots on the way down." Gordon ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe and Joan Kimbell" Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2007 11:46 AM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 701 Dynon pitot > > > Greg, I installed the Dynon AOA pitot tube the same place the regular > pitot tube would be placed. The Dynon AOA does not read slow enough to > give a stall warning on the 701 during the normal landing config. Works OK > on power on stalls. By the way I use VG's not slats. Joe > > >>From: "Greg Alonso" >>To: >>Subject: Zenith-List: 701 Dynon pitot >>Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 21:53:33 -0400 >> >>Has anybody installed a Dynon pitot on a 701? I am trying to determine the >>best location. >> >>Greg Alonso >>Building 701 from kit. >>Michigan > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 04:39:48 PM PST US From: "wade jones" Subject: Zenith-List: Bending 6-B-21- 1 & 2 Thanks to Larry and Craig the duty is performed .Finished bending the tubes today .Packing with sand helped a lot & starting from the center and working outward also worked well .I used Larry's C clamp method .Took most of the day however I think that another set could be made in a couple hours . Note wrecked wheel in photo . Thanks to a great group of people on this site . Wade HP Photo Essential - Smart. Simple. Fast! Unleash the Photo Power of your Printer. Download your copy in less than a minute at: http://www.hp.com/go/pse/email ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 04:39:48 PM PST US From: JohnDRead@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Locating fuel tank holes in skins? Andy, Dr Ed's advice is good. I would check one other thing. I am not familiar with the fast build kit so I do not know if all of the tank locating brackets etc are in place, also the cork needs to be in place so the tank is firmly located in the wing. John Read ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.