Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:28 AM - FWF for 701 (Mike Hoffman)
2. 05:18 AM - Re: Fuel Sender Sealant (steveadams)
3. 06:49 AM - Bounched (LRM)
4. 06:58 AM - Re: Re: Fuel Sender Sealant (Juan Vega)
5. 06:59 AM - Re: Fuel System Design (Juan Vega)
6. 07:18 AM - Re: Fuel Sender Sealant (DaveG601XL)
7. 07:22 AM - Re: 701 VG's - Put this puppy to rest (Avidmagnum)
8. 08:17 AM - Re: FWF for 701 (Dan)
9. 08:48 AM - RE : Re: 701 VG's - Put this puppy to rest (Jean-Paul Roy)
10. 08:54 AM - Re: Re: Fuel Sender Sealant (NYTerminat@aol.com)
11. 09:35 AM - Re: Re:weight & balance with one scale? (Craig Payne)
12. 11:32 AM - Re: weight & balance with one scale? (Gig Giacona)
13. 11:32 AM - Re: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 30 Msgs - 07/25/07 ()
14. 12:08 PM - Re: Fuel Sender Sealant (steveadams)
15. 02:38 PM - Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount (Craig Payne)
16. 02:51 PM - Re: Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount (Gig Giacona)
17. 02:59 PM - Re: Fuel System Design (Craig Payne)
18. 03:00 PM - Re: Re: Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount (Craig Payne)
19. 03:11 PM - Re: FWF for 701 (Mike Hoffman)
20. 03:13 PM - type IV vw engine (Bill Flick)
21. 03:16 PM - Re: Re: weight & balance with one scale? (Juan Vega)
22. 03:20 PM - Re: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 30 Msgs - 07/25/07 (Juan Vega)
23. 04:04 PM - Slightly off topic: Lost and stolen packages (John Marzulli)
24. 04:04 PM - Re: Re: 701 VG's - Put this puppy to rest (JG)
25. 04:48 PM - Re: type IV vw engine (LarryMcFarland)
26. 05:08 PM - Re: Slightly off topic: Lost and stolen packages (Paul Riedlinger)
27. 05:10 PM - Re: Re: weight & balance with one scale? (Bryan Martin)
28. 05:15 PM - Re: Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount (Tim Juhl)
29. 05:42 PM - Re: Slightly off topic: Lost and stolen packages (Robin Bellach)
30. 05:45 PM - Re: Re: Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount (Craig Payne)
31. 07:30 PM - Re: Fuel System Design (Ron Lendon)
32. 07:44 PM - Re: Re: Fuel System Design (Craig Payne)
33. 08:43 PM - 801 VOR (ZodieRocket)
34. 09:20 PM - Re: 801 VOR (jetboy)
35. 09:26 PM - Choice of engine for the CH 601HDS (Charles McGloughlin)
36. 09:43 PM - Re: Choice of engine for the CH 601HDS (ZodieRocket)
37. 11:32 PM - VGs on 701 (JG)
38. 11:33 PM - VGs to Z.A.C. (JG)
Message 1
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Am I the only person waiting over 3 months for a Rotax FWF (less engine) from Mexico?
Just courious if anyone else is in the same boat as me. If you are getting
close, I would suggest you order early.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130428#130428
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Sender Sealant |
I have side mounted senders in my CH640. I used the supplied gasket with a slathering
of fuel lube. No leaks in 500 hours. I did, however, have a sender fail
and had to replace it. It was fairly straight forward to replace without the
proseal, trying to replace it if it was sealed with proseal would be next to impossible
without openning up the wing to get at it. I wouldn't bother with the
proseal, which is more suited to a permanent installation.
Steve Adams
CH640
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130443#130443
Message 3
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Kevin McClune, you keep asking about PegaStol wings. I respond every
time, but your server keeps bouncing it back to me. Check your end.
Anyway, maybe this will help. Dedalius sold out to Raymond Miller of
Alaska. You can get him at moseus@gmail.com. I have no idea when he is
going to start producing kits. I wish he would, it's one great product.
Take care,
Larry, www.SkyHawg.com, N1345L
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Sender Sealant |
actually i have had to repair a few things with proseal. What is nice about proseal
is that if you pul it, its like superglue, however its properties let it
stay flexible indefinitely. SO to separate two pieces or say the sender from
the tank, you just slip an exacto blade between the two peices and not pry but
slice it off and it comes right off. Proseal that has cured can be cut like
butter..
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: steveadams <dr_steve_adams@yahoo.com>
>Sent: Aug 23, 2007 8:16 AM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Fuel Sender Sealant
>
>
>I have side mounted senders in my CH640. I used the supplied gasket with a slathering
of fuel lube. No leaks in 500 hours. I did, however, have a sender fail
and had to replace it. It was fairly straight forward to replace without the
proseal, trying to replace it if it was sealed with proseal would be next to
impossible without openning up the wing to get at it. I wouldn't bother with the
proseal, which is more suited to a permanent installation.
>
>Steve Adams
>CH640
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130443#130443
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel System Design |
just stick to the plans, its a good design.
-----Original Message-----
>From: Ron Lendon <rlendon@comcast.net>
>Sent: Aug 22, 2007 10:08 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Fuel System Design
>
>
>Hey gang, It's time to begin the design of the fuel system. I have little experience
but I have placed a design document at this location:
>
>
>and would like feedback. If I am off base here, let me know.
>
>Basically I'm following the prints but substituting Stainless Braided line and
fittings from Earls. The document is linear in that it starts at the tank and
ends at the line to the carb.
>
>--------
>Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
>Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
>http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130369#130369
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Sender Sealant |
Steve,
I am not familiar with the CH640, but did you get to the fuel sender via a small
access panel like on the 601XL (170mm x 75mm) or you have full access to the
tank? I am wondering since you said it was a pretty straight forward replacement
for you. A sender replacement with just a gasket on it would seem, to me,
to be an impossible task on a 601XL for my not-so-small hands. I envision a
leading edge removal for any fuel tank work past a simple fuel hose replacement.
Thanks,
--------
David Gallagher
601 XL, tail and wings completed,
fueslage almost done, engine next.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130481#130481
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: 701 VG's - Put this puppy to rest |
A lot of good points on the subject of VG's and there is no way we can cover all
of them for everone. Some will love them and some will not. That's OK! We do
not all fly our aircraft the same way.
My 701sp with 912S has floats and there is no way I can rotate like a land plane...the
tails of the floats will drag. I have time in my 701 with and without
slats and like it much better without! But thats on floats!
Tom Schulke
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130482#130482
Message 8
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It took about three months for my order to arrive. I also had to wait
additional time for some small back ordered items.
Dan Wilde
Mike Hoffman wrote:
>
> Am I the only person waiting over 3 months for a Rotax FWF (less engine) from
Mexico? Just courious if anyone else is in the same boat as me. If you are getting
close, I would suggest you order early.
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: 701 VG's - Put this puppy to rest |
Hello Tom. I am actually building a Ch 701SP and it meant to be on floats as I
live on a nice lakeshore. I've following this slats/no slats from the very beginning
and I'm a litlle confused.
I've also went trought all of the Stolspeed aerodynamic web site (the guy who
makes the Feathers VG's) many times and that even put more confusion in my mind.
Of course, I would like the performances the web site says it do. Since i'm going
on floats and skis in the winter, I would like to have the opinion of a real
time user.
Since you've been using your 701 in both configurations, could you tell me the
differences you found both ways.
I'm at the point of putting my wings skelleton together and if the decision is
made to not use the slats, I won't even bother with installing the slat supports.
Thanks ahead of time for any opinion you may give. It is important for me.
Jean-Paul Roy
Angliers, Quebec, Canada
701, building wings
Avidmagnum <classpix@sbcglobal.net> a crit :
A lot of good points on the subject of VG's and there is no way we can cover all
of them for everone. Some will love them and some will not. That's OK! We do
not all fly our aircraft the same way.
My 701sp with 912S has floats and there is no way I can rotate like a land plane...the
tails of the floats will drag. I have time in my 701 with and without
slats and like it much better without! But thats on floats!
Tom Schulke
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130482#130482
Jean-Paul Roy
royjp@yahoo.ca
Tl: (819)949-2216
Cell:(819)629-9360
---------------------------------
Combattez les mchants pourriels... Le filtre SpamGuard vous aide lutter efficacement
contre les pourriels sur le Tout-nouveau Yahoo! Courriel
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Sender Sealant |
Steve,
I have installed mine in the 701 the same way that you did and I also had
one fail in the 1st few hours. I was able to replace it through the inspection
hole that was installed without too much of a problem.
Bob Spudis
N701ZX/ CH701/126hrs
I have side mounted senders in my CH640. I used the supplied gasket with a
slathering of fuel lube. No leaks in 500 hours. I did, however, have a sender
fail and had to replace it. It was fairly straight forward to replace without
the proseal, trying to replace it if it was sealed with proseal would be
next to impossible without openning up the wing to get at it. I wouldn't bother
with the proseal, which is more suited to a permanent installation.
Steve Adams
CH640
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re:weight & balance with one scale? |
Don't do what I did - I bought three cheap digital electronic scales at
Costco. Problem is that they are designed to turn on when you step on them
and will turn off after a short period. Hard to do when weighing a plane so
I returned them.
-- Craig
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: weight & balance with one scale? |
Ok her's the plan. Go to Wal-Mart or Home Depot and get 3 of the best analog scales
you can find.
Then go do the weight and balance and then return the scales. Here's the clincher.
Tell them they didn't go high enough for your wife to use.
I'll bet they hand you your money back and not say a word.
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130552#130552
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 30 Msgs - 07/25/07 |
OOOoookaaaaaaayyy. Rich, I've been advocating that sort of thing
since 1967, when I was an exchange student observing the Greater
Southeast Asia Gunpowder Festival. I think it's a great idea, in
general. But how do this relate to building Zeniths?
Paul Rodriguez
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Brantley<mailto:rgbort1938@comcast.net>
To: zenith-list@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2007 10:28 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 30 Msgs - 07/25/07
<rgbort1938@comcast.net<mailto:rgbort1938@comcast.net>>
Let's kill all the bastards and let God sort it out!!! Best use of
nukes for
peace I can think of -- I don't think our kids have the balls for
IT!!
Richard
----- Original Message -----
From: "Zenith-List Digest Server"
<zenith-list@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list@matronics.com>>
To: "Zenith-List Digest List"
<zenith-list-digest@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list-digest@matronics.com
>>
Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 2:58 AM
Subject: Zenith-List Digest: 30 Msgs - 07/25/07
> This message has been processed by Symantec's AntiVirus Technology.
>
> Unknown00000000.data was not scanned for viruses because too many
nested
> levels of files were found.
>
>
> For more information on antivirus tips and technology, visit
> http://ses.symantec.com/<http://ses.symantec.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List<http://www.matronics.com/N
avigator?Zenith-List>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Sender Sealant |
DaveG601XL wrote:
> Steve,
>
> I am not familiar with the CH640, but did you get to the fuel sender via a small
access panel like on the 601XL (170mm x 75mm) or you have full access to the
tank? I am wondering since you said it was a pretty straight forward replacement
for you. A sender replacement with just a gasket on it would seem, to
me, to be an impossible task on a 601XL for my not-so-small hands. I envision
a leading edge removal for any fuel tank work past a simple fuel hose replacement.
>
> Thanks,
Yes, the 640 has a similar small access panel. You have to reach through the access
panel and then through a lightenning hole to get at the sender. Not easy
(or fun), but doable if the sender is not sealed in place. Trying to get a blade
in there to cut through the proseal, even if it cuts like butter, would probably
result in a lot of swearing and a few blood stains. Then you would have
to clean the old proseal off completely, without getting any in the tanks, all
while laying on your back with your twisted arms blocking your view of the work
area. After flying for a while I have grown to appreciate how much easier things
are if you consider future maintenance while building.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130563#130563
Message 15
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| Subject: | Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount |
My motor mount was supplied by Jabiru USA about 8 months ago. After seeing
that the engine's thrust-line didn't match the Zenith plans I took some
measurements of the mount's tubes as requested by Jabiru USA. They said that
the top tubes were about 10 cm too long and that they would exchange the
mount. So if you have such a mount do some checking before you paint your
mount and hang your engine. The easiest way to check the mount is with a
digital level.
-- Craig
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount |
10 cm or mm?
Do Not Archive
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130611#130611
Message 17
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| Subject: | Fuel System Design |
A few comments:
- since you are going with the Corvair I presume you will be following
William's design.
- consider adding a fuel flow sender and gauge. Fuel exhaustion is an all to
common cause of accidents and fuel flow can provide an instantaneous check
on the health of your fuel system and also help you track your fuel more
accurately.
- I'm paranoid enough about vapor-lock that I went with the Andair
extensions so I can mount my valve on the floor and the knob on the center
console.
-- Craig
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount |
mm - what's an order of magnitude among friends? ;-)
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gig Giacona
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 3:51 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount
--> <wr.giacona@suddenlink.net>
10 cm or mm?
Do Not Archive
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130611#130611
Message 19
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Dan Wilde,
Thanks for the reply. Good to know I'm not the only one, even though it doesn't
make it any better. Just thought it would be a "heads up" for those that might
be at the same point as me and a reminder to order at least 3 months in advance.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130616#130616
Message 20
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| Subject: | type IV vw engine |
has or is anyone useing a type iv vw engine on the zenair or any other
plane? i am thinking of one with a redrive and would like any info you
may have. thanks bill
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: weight & balance with one scale? |
Gig,
i am in the process of getting ready for weight and bal as well. when you do the
three scals, do you take the average of the three? hows that work? I have the
work sheets with the arms but the weight things i am needing of some pip slapping
to understand.
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: Gig Giacona <wr.giacona@suddenlink.net>
>Sent: Aug 23, 2007 2:31 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Re: weight & balance with one scale?
>
>
>Ok her's the plan. Go to Wal-Mart or Home Depot and get 3 of the best analog scales
you can find.
>
>Then go do the weight and balance and then return the scales. Here's the clincher.
Tell them they didn't go high enough for your wife to use.
>
>I'll bet they hand you your money back and not say a word.
>
>--------
>W.R. "Gig" Giacona
>601XL Under Construction
>See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130552#130552
>
>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 30 Msgs - 07/25/07 |
all,
on this subject, below, did someone just have a war induced flash back while typing
on the computer.?
-----Original Message-----
>From: paulrod36@msn.com
>Sent: Aug 23, 2007 2:27 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 30 Msgs - 07/25/07
>
>OOOoookaaaaaaayyy. Rich, I've been advocating that sort of thing since 1967,
when I was an exchange student observing the Greater Southeast Asia Gunpowder
Festival. I think it's a great idea, in general. But how do this relate to
building Zeniths?
>
>Paul Rodriguez
>do not archive
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Richard Brantley<mailto:rgbort1938@comcast.net>
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2007 10:28 PM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 30 Msgs - 07/25/07
>
>
>
> Let's kill all the bastards and let God sort it out!!! Best use of nukes for
> peace I can think of -- I don't think our kids have the balls for IT!!
>
> Richard
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Zenith-List Digest Server" <zenith-list@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list@matronics.com>>
> To: "Zenith-List Digest List" <zenith-list-digest@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list-digest@matronics.com>>
> Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 2:58 AM
> Subject: Zenith-List Digest: 30 Msgs - 07/25/07
>
>
> > This message has been processed by Symantec's AntiVirus Technology.
> >
> > Unknown00000000.data was not scanned for viruses because too many nested
> > levels of files were found.
> >
> >
> > For more information on antivirus tips and technology, visit
> > http://ses.symantec.com/<http://ses.symantec.com/>
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List>
>
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Slightly off topic: Lost and stolen packages |
We all get packages delivered to us full of clecos, Homebuilt Help DVDs or
other parts, and normally nothing goes wrong.
This week UPS left a package on my doorstep without taking a signature. It
turns out that this step is discretionary to the driver. As a result the
package was stolen.
Anyway, I was able to recover my package with the help of the Police.
It's a long story, and I have it recounted here:
http://701builder.livejournal.com/
In other news my fuselage kit is being delivered tomorrow. Let's see them
try to steal that!
Happy building!
--
John Marzulli
http://701Builder.blogspot.com/
"Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot
harder to put baseball cards in the spokes.
-Airplane The Movie
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: 701 VG's - Put this puppy to rest |
Yes, you certainly can make your own VGs. One set of instructions on
how to make them is at
http://www.thirdshift.com/jack/firefly/firefly19.html . (He's another
dedicated experimenter when you read the rest of his website.) In the
beginning I made these and they worked OK, just look a bit crude and
don't fit the contour of the wing skin very well. For the 701 wing,
mount them with the front tips 140mm in front of the rivet line on the
top of the spar, about 100-150mm apart.
Tailwinds always,
JG
----- Original Message -----
From: Matt Ronics
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 6:38 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 701 VG's - Put this puppy to rest
As a side point, I think it petty that these people should charge
money for such simple things as VGs. Why not just share the idea and
give instructions for other builders (ie in the spirit of the movement).
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130308#130308
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: type IV vw engine |
Hi Bill,
It'd be good to state what aircraft are you considering for this VW.
For the 701, it might be a real good choice, for the 601 a questionable
choice.
Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
do not archive
Bill Flick wrote:
> has or is anyone useing a type iv vw engine on the zenair or any other
> plane? i am thinking of one with a redrive and would like any info
> you may have. thanks bill
Message 26
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| Subject: | Slightly off topic: Lost and stolen packages |
I just love the "discretion" clause. I had a very expensive network storage
device delivered to my house yesterday and found it behind the planters on
the front porch. It is always fun to find a two terabyte device in your
ferns! Someone was home all day so I guess the UPS driver just decided to
drop it and run. The funny thing was it had stickers all over it saying
"signature required".
Paul Riedlinger
paulried@rogers.com
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Marzulli
Sent: August-23-07 7:03 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Slightly off topic: Lost and stolen packages
We all get packages delivered to us full of clecos, Homebuilt Help DVDs or
other parts, and normally nothing goes wrong.
This week UPS left a package on my doorstep without taking a signature. It
turns out that this step is discretionary to the driver. As a result the
package was stolen.
Anyway, I was able to recover my package with the help of the Police.
It's a long story, and I have it recounted here:
http://701builder.livejournal.com/
In other news my fuselage kit is being delivered tomorrow. Let's see them
try to steal that!
Happy building!
--
John Marzulli
http://701Builder.blogspot.com/ <http://701Builder.blogspot.com/>
"Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot
harder to put baseball cards in the spokes.
-Airplane The Movie
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: weight & balance with one scale? |
1. Add the three weights to get the total empty weight.
2. Multiply each individual weight by its distance behind the datum.
4. Add the three products.
5. Divide this sum by the empty weight to get the distance behind the
datum of the CG.
Juan Vega wrote:
>
> Gig,
> i am in the process of getting ready for weight and bal as well. when you do
the three scals, do you take the average of the three? hows that work? I have
the work sheets with the arms but the weight things i am needing of some pip
slapping to understand.
>
> Juan
>
> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Gig Giacona <wr.giacona@suddenlink.net>
>> Sent: Aug 23, 2007 2:31 PM
>> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: weight & balance with one scale?
>>
>>
>> Ok her's the plan. Go to Wal-Mart or Home Depot and get 3 of the best analog
scales you can find.
>>
>> Then go do the weight and balance and then return the scales. Here's the clincher.
Tell them they didn't go high enough for your wife to use.
>>
>> I'll bet they hand you your money back and not say a word.
>>
>> --------
>> W.R. "Gig" Giacona
>> 601XL Under Construction
>> See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
--
Bryan Martin
Zenith 601XL N61BM
Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount |
Would you be so kind as to share the measurements Jabiru sent you? I have an engine
mount that I received from them in May but who knows when it was made......
Thanks!
Tim
--------
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130631#130631
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Slightly off topic: Lost and stolen packages |
Those stickers don't mean a thing when the shipper does not pay for
signature service.
Do not archive.
----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Riedlinger
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 7:06 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Slightly off topic: Lost and stolen packages
I just love the "discretion" clause. I had a very expensive network
storage device delivered to my house yesterday and found it behind the
planters on the front porch. It is always fun to find a two terabyte
device in your ferns! Someone was home all day so I guess the UPS
driver just decided to drop it and run. The funny thing was it had
stickers all over it saying "signature required".
Paul Riedlinger
paulried@rogers.com
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Marzulli
Sent: August-23-07 7:03 PM
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Subject: Zenith-List: Slightly off topic: Lost and stolen packages
We all get packages delivered to us full of clecos, Homebuilt Help
DVDs or other parts, and normally nothing goes wrong.
This week UPS left a package on my doorstep without taking a
signature. It turns out that this step is discretionary to the driver.
As a result the package was stolen.
Anyway, I was able to recover my package with the help of the Police.
It's a long story, and I have it recounted here:
http://701builder.livejournal.com/
In other news my fuselage kit is being delivered tomorrow. Let's see
them try to steal that!
Happy building!
--
John Marzulli
http://701Builder.blogspot.com/
"Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a
lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes.
-Airplane The Movie
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Out-of-spec 601XL/Jabiru 3300 motor mount |
I only have the measurements I made and the "top tubes 10 mm too long"
comment from Jabiru USA. Below are my measurements. Since the tubes are cut
on a diagonal these measurements are on the longest, outside edges of the
tubes from the plates at the firewall to the disks at the rear of the engine
mount "pins". Take these measurements as approximate as it was hard to make
some of them with a steel tape with the mount and engine on the plane:
top tube, pilot side: 445 mm
top tube, copilot side: 465-470 mm
bottom, pilot side: 380 mm
bottom, copilot side: 400-405 mm
What is actually critical is the angle of the engine (horizontal and
vertical) to the firewall. So it is best to measure these directly and
compare them to 6-JE-1 in the Zenith plans.
-- Craig
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel System Design |
Craig,
I have allowed for the pressure gage but hadn't thought about the flow. And yes
it is a Corvair the WW way. I have been waiting for him to publish the 601
book but have gotten to the point I need to move forward.
Got any pictures of the Andair Valve mounted?
Thanks for the ideas.
--------
Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130646#130646
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel System Design |
> Got any pictures of the Andair Valve mounted?
Mine is still mounted in its box. But I've attached pictures of somebody
else's installation. Unfortunately I've lost track of whose plane it is.
-- Craig
Message 33
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Does anyone have a suggestion on a VOR antenna location for an 801. I
just got a request to install one.
Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario
Zodiac 601XL C-GOXL, CH701 just started
www.ch601.org / www.ch701.com / www.Osprey2.com
8/22/2007 6:51 PM
Message 34
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Mark,
Best antenna would be the towel rail type ( D&M N48-3 ) due to low twisting
loads on the mount area. Best position on rear empenage sides - lower edge below
the fwd horiz stab brackets.
Ralph
--------
Ralph - CH701 / 2200a
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130668#130668
Message 35
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| Subject: | Choice of engine for the CH 601HDS |
Having acquired a partially complete 601 HDS kit, which I intend to
complete as an E-LSA, I would like to hear comments on the broad
question below!
How do the Subaru and Corvair engines stack up against Rotax & Jabiru
when you take cost, installation, available technical support, weight
and final performance into account? And are there any 601 builders
reasonably close to Sacramento, CA?
Sincerely
--
Charles McGloughlin Email - charlesmcg@citlink.net
8654 Bluefield Way Phones - Cell (916)832-0654
Sacramento, CA 95823 Home (916)689-7701
Message 36
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| Subject: | Choice of engine for the CH 601HDS |
If you want it to be an ELSA, I believe that you will need it flying by
December of this year. However I may be wrong as I am a Canadian and not
fully up on the U.S. LSA. IF it is true and to meet the ELSA category by
December, you will have to order a Rotax or Jabiru in the next week in
order to have a chance to make the deadline. IF you go auto conversion,
typically add another year to your construction. Also a missed deadline.
Mark Townsend
Can-Zac Aviation Ltd.
president@can-zacaviation.com
www.can-zacaviation.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charles
McGloughlin
Sent: Friday, August 24, 2007 12:17 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Choice of engine for the CH 601HDS
Having acquired a partially complete 601 HDS kit, which I intend to
complete as an E-LSA, I would like to hear comments on the broad
question below!
How do the Subaru and Corvair engines stack up against Rotax & Jabiru
when you take cost, installation, available technical support, weight
and final performance into account? And are there any 601 builders
reasonably close to Sacramento, CA?
Sincerely
--
Charles McGloughlin Email - charlesmcg@citlink.net
8654 Bluefield Way Phones - Cell (916)832-0654
Sacramento, CA 95823 Home (916)689-7701
8/22/2007 6:51 PM
8/22/2007 6:51 PM
Message 37
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Boy, the mention of VGs sure does stir up a storm........
That's really mystifying to me, because I'm just trying to share some
really significant discoveries that we've found by experience..........
I've been in love with the CH701 for about 18 years, but intrigued by
the possibility of removing the slats for most of that time, so always
watching and studying for evidence in that direction. I certainly
didn't start this as a manufacturer of VGs looking for a market for them
on the 701. I was a doubting sceptic before I actually tried them - and
you wouldn't think they'd do much on a wing like the 701, anyhow eh. I
was just going to remove the slats, as the Columbians had done,
expecting to get better cruise efficiency, and prepared to lose some
STOL capability which had lots to spare. I expected maybe 10%
improvement in fuel burn, but was amazed to find 23%! STOL performance
was less of course, but still adequate for most all practical use.
Then, being a curious experimenter, decided to try VGs, and was totally
amazed that most all of the STOL capability came back! The more I tried
VGs the more I liked the effect that they gave, but I didn't like the
sharp points and the fit to the wing of the ones on the market. And so
designed and tested the 'Feathers', and so it went from there.......
I certainly didn't start manufacturing VGs to make a lot of money.
Homebuilt aircraft is not a mass market and so many of those builders
are complete sceptics, some are even from Missouri..... And only need
one set of VGs for an aircraft, then never hear from that one again. If
I wanted to make lots of cash flow I'd go for something like lawn mowing
- get paid to do it all over again in a couple of weeks. Or for more
excitement, get a mobile dog-washing franchise.... I'm semi-retired,
and not inspired to make any big business of this, just enough to keep
tinkering and experimenting with light STOL aircraft. There'll be more
to come, stay tuned.
Some of us are born experimenters and innovators, and are always
interested in trying to make things go better. (I even felt the need to
modify my Buck pocket knife....) Others just want to follow the
straight and narrow, especially with aircraft - so let it be for them.
Surely we can all share this forum without animosity, and encourage the
diversity rather than trying to shoot it down...... It's almost as if
it's considered heresy to even explore alternatives...... This
homebuilt aircraft game attracts some really clever and capable minds,
and I for one really enjoy sharing constructive ideas and experiences
with them. I've already met many really interesting and innovative
builders online, and it's just great to have this medium to hear from
more of them all over the world. The nay-sayers always seem to shout
the loudest, but I know of many builder/flyers out there with heaps of
good experience, who speak seldom, and quietly when they do, but are
really worth listening to..... It's heartening to note that the first
to be attracted to, and try these changes, were very experienced flyers,
who now love their 701s even more since they've cut their slats off -
surely that says something worth paying attention to.....
I pay most attention to real life experience and evidence, rather than
theory or pre-conceived opinions. And I'm ready to change my opinions
when I see new evidence. That 'big wind tunnel in the sky' is the real
test. That's why I've flown 400 hrs in the last two years, always
observing and testing these changes we've made. And I certainly don't
fly like a Cessna - more like a hawk on a mouse! Always looking for
some new challenging spot to practice STOL landings. Just got back from
38hrs of flying into outback Australia, actually using my STOL aircraft
to land in very rough and remote places - how many of you really do land
your STOL aircraft off-field.... Everything in that website is derived
from such experience.
Lastly, there seems to be some misconception of the results I've claimed
for replacing slats with VGs:
I'm not saying that VGs make for shorter landings than slats, just
pretty close to equal STOL performance, with lots of improvement in
climb, cruise and glide. The common experience that most flyers notice
is an gentler transition from hold-off to touch-down, thus making slower
landings easier for the average flyer.
And I certainly don't encourage anyone to go near Vne, but it sure is
good to be able to cruise at 80 kts while burning less fuel than used to
at 75, and still have pretty much the same STOL performance. That's
really significant for those of us who actually go cross-country in our
aircraft......
I've written pretty much all I have to say in the www.stolspeed.com
website, and written it as carefully and as completely as I can. I
won't get into a shouting match here, as happens on so many forums.
But if there are serious questions that I haven't covered in the
website, I'll discuss them.
Tailwinds always,
JG
Message 38
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I've just sent a set of FeathersVGs to Zenith Aircraft Company for
testing on their CH701. Also a copy of the following open letter:
Zenith Aircraft Corporation
Mexico, Missouri, USA
Dear Sirs,
As you will have heard, our experience here in Australia, of removing
the slats from a CH701 and replacing them with VGs, demonstrates a
considerable improvement in climb and cruise and glide performance, with
little or no real loss in STOL capability. Hundreds of hours of
intensive STOL flying on several aircraft has shown no down-side of the
conversion. Multiple testimonials from other 701 owners in the USA and
elsewhere have confirmed these results. It's heartening that many of
those to try this mod are high-time pilots with considerable experience
in different aircraft, and they now like their 701s better without the
slats..... Now we hear that fellas in Brazil have also been flying
without slats for years. There's no doubt that the improvement is real.
Seems to me these discoveries involving VGs instead of slats should be
seen not as a threat to the CH701, but an opportunity to broaden the
range of an already excellent and popular aircraft. It doesn't need any
major change in the aircraft construction to implement this alternative.
I reckon customers should be offered the choice of slats or VGs......
At the time that Chris Heintz designed the CH701, VGs were not as well
tested as today, and even so, no one would have predicted that they
could actually replace the effect of leading edge slats so effectively
on this wing. It was a real surprise, but now we know from experience
they can be a real advantage. So why not take that information on board
and exploit it??? I realize that those slats were the best innovation
at that time, and a great marketing feature, but the facts are now clear
that many of us, from experience, prefer the aircraft with VGs rather
than with slats.
So I'm sending you a set of 'Feathers' VGs, free of charge, for testing
on your CH701.
Another major improvement we have tested on the 701 is to extend the
wings by 400mm (16") each side. This has dramatically improved the slow
speed performance and considerably lowered the landing speed. Glide
ratio at very low speed is much improved, making for easier, gentler,
slower landings. Now we learn that those same fellas in Brazil have
also been building longer wings for years, and already know the
benefits.... See 'Long Wing' page for more details.
Yet another improvement we have tested is to apply VGs to the leading
edge of the elevator - not to the horizontal stabilizer, but to the
elevator itself. This way the VGs are hidden at cruise in the slot
between the horiz stab and the elevator, but are exposed in the very
best position to catch the airflow when they are most needed at flare.
This has sure helped to increase elevator authority at very slow
touch-down speeds, making for much improved landing control. See 'Tail
Feathers' page for more details.
The owner of the 701 with all these modifications is absolutely thrilled
with the improvements - no way would he go back to the original
configuration! The two other 701 owners at our airfield have long since
replaced their slats with VGs and added VGs to their elevators, and now
want to lengthen their wings as well. Who wouldn't, after having
compared their aircraft's slow speed performance to the modified
one......
Your competitor, I.C.P. Savannah, had already realized the benefits of
the longer wing when they copied your design. And as soon as I
demonstrated the benefit of VGs instead of slats they jumped on the
opportunity with their 'VG' model, and now are very successful with it.
Yes, they copied your basic CH701 design but made some significant
improvements that weren't and still aren't available on the CH701
(longer cleaner wing and more powerful horizontal stabilizer/elevator),
then they exactly copied the VGs that I was importing at the time, which
is ironic in that I wasn't satisfied with those VGs so felt the need to
design and manufacture some better ones, i.e.- Feathers VGs.
Zenith could easily do the same and even better with the CH701, so why
not do it???? We're happy to have done the amateur experimenting that
discovered some of these significant improvements, but I would hope that
now that the results are revealed, Z.A.C. would incorporate them, with
proper qualified engineering, for all CH701 owners. It's just not
right that other amateurs without engineering backing should have to
make these changes for themselves. We would rather have the benefit of
your engineering experience and stay with Zenith rather than go to some
copier. You have a large and loyal following so please give us the
best performing aircraft that you can.
All of these changes would be really easy to incorporate - no need to
engineer a completely new aircraft. The original wing profile without
the slats is already proven to be an ideal airfoil with VGs. I've heard
(but can't confirm) that the longer wing has already been produced for
the French market to comply with their regulations, so Z.A.C. must
already have some experience with it. If us amateurs in remote parts of
the world can do it so successfully, then surely Z.A.C. can do it for
the benefit of all.
There's an old adage in business, "....If you just stand still, the pace
of progress will leave you behind.....". I sure hope this doesn't
happen to the 701, 'cause it's been standing still for a long time now ,
while others are exploiting every improvement.... I still love the 701,
and I admire all that Chris Heintz and Zenith have done for the
homebuilders. The CH701 is still one of the only designs that the
homebuilder can realistically build from plans and scratch materials. I
sure hope that can continue, what with all the move to factory-built,
high cost (and I assume higher profit) machines.
If you want to experience any of these improvements that we're now
enjoying then please come to Australia for a holiday/business trip, and
fly Hans's modified 701 and my Savannah - you really do need to know
what is possible......
Thanking you for your attention.
Fair skies and tailwinds always,
John Gilpin
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